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Numbers Paint Positive Picture for Trump Campaign; Key Sanders Supporter Sen. Jeff Merkley Talks Path Ahead; Clinton Supporter Sen. Bob Casey Talks Clinton Chances in Winning Key State Pennsylvania; RNC Meets in Florida on Convention Rules. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired April 20, 2016 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:01] WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: The numbers paint a positive picture right now for the Trump campaign. They have a big delegate lead and they have several friendly states coming up next Tuesday and they have a new campaign structure coming at the same time.

Let's bring in Katrina Pierson, national spokeswoman for the Donald Trump campaign, joining us live from Dallas.

Katrina, thank you very much for joining us.

Mathematically, John Kasich is out. He can't reach that 1237 magic number. Ted Cruz apparently can't reach it either, nearly impossible for him to get to that 1237 number. But their goal is to prevent Donald Trump from doing so. Do you believe they have that chance? Because they think if they can prevent him from getting the delegates on the first round, they will get it on the second or third round.

KATRINA PIERSON, NATIONAL SPOKESPERSON, DONALD TRUMP PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: No, I don't think that's going to happen. As I said from the beginning, and the campaign has said, that Mr. Trump is going to reach 1237 prior to the convention. Even when we're talking about delegates, Wolf, the math is there.

Donald Trump is the campaign that has won the most contests, has the most votes, and will have the most delegates going into the convention. And then it becomes a question of electability moving forward. Donald Trump is a first-time candidate who won 60 percent in his home state, which happened to be the state of New York. Then you have a sitting Senator and a sitting governor who couldn't even break 50 percent in their home state. Donald Trump is the only candidate that has proven success in the northeast, going out west, and even in the south. He is the only viable candidate and delegates are going to take notice.

BLITZER: We noticed last night in his victory speech -- and it was a brief one. Only eight minutes Donald Trump spoke. He usually speaks longer than that, as you know. And he was pretty polite. He referred to Senator Ted Cruz. He didn't call him Lying Ted as he usually does. Are we about to see a, quote, "more presidential" Donald Trump?

PIERSON: Well, sure. And we've seen speeches like this from Mr. Trump before. We are proud of Mr. Trump and his success in the state of New York. And just like you've seen, after the Florida election, he stopped referring to Marco Rubio by his nickname.

Moving forward, Mr. Trump will be focused on locking up this nomination and continuing to grow and build this campaign team so that we can be successful in November against Hillary Clinton. And by that time, we will see a united party and a presidential Donald Trump that's willing to take that fight to the American public.

BLITZER: He's in Indiana today. We just have that report from Chris Frates, in Indianapolis. That's a week from coming Tuesday. How do you think he's going to do there?

PIERSON: Quite well. The delegate selection process has already been taking place. Mr. Trump is going to be there because there is an election. And we want voters to get out there and vote. We want to show a good margin to show the Republican Party and the country where the people are. And the people are for the outsiders in this election cycle. Donald Trump is the only outsider in this race. And we want to be successful. So of course, he's going to be in Indiana. We're looking really good with Pennsylvania and those that are coming up and heading into California. We are leading in all the polls and we're just really excited.

BLITZER: Let's say, Katrina, Donald Trump doesn't get 1237 on the first round. Let's say he gets close to 1200 or 1150, a lot more than Cruz and certainly more than Kasich, but it goes to a second round and then half of the pledge delegates on the Republican side. They're free to vote whatever they want. And that's the argument that Cruz and Kasich make, saying if he doesn't get it on the first round, it's over for him. Your reaction to that?

PIERSON: I don't think that's the case. It's because we looking at an electability issue. Senator Cruz has not won a single state that's going to affect the map electorally in November. And when we look at 2012, Mitt Romney lost by 334,000 votes in just four states, New Hampshire, Florida, Virginia, and Ohio. Mr. Trump won Florida and New Hampshire by double digits. He won Virginia and came in second to the sitting governor. Donald Trump is the only candidate with a viable path in November.

BLITZER: Katrina Pierson, thank you very much for joining us.

PIERSON: Great, thanks. Great to be here.

BLITZER: Just ahead, Bernie Sanders' winning streak in the Democratic Party comes to a dramatic halt yesterday. Does he have a path to victory? We'll talk to a key Bernie Sanders supporter about the road ahead after a huge loss in New York. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:38:50] BLITZER: Senator Bernie Sanders insists he has a path to victory despite the resounding loss to Hillary Clinton in New York. Sanders congratulated Clinton on her win, but if you think he's ready to throw in the towel, think again.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, (I), VERMONT & DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Next week, we will be competing in Pennsylvania, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Maryland, and Delaware. And we look forward to winning a number of those states. Over the last 11 and a half months, this campaign has come a very, very long way. We started off 60 percent to 65 percent points behind in the polls. A few recent polls had us in the lead. We believe we have a momentum and a path toward victory.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Joining us now is Democratic Senator, Jeff Merkley, of Oregon. He was the first U.S. Senator to endorse Senator Bernie Sanders.

And I think you're the only U.S. Senator that's endorsed Bernie Sanders. You agree with him, but realistically, be honest, he has a path to victory?

[13:40:57] SEN. JEFF MERKLEY, (D), OREGON: He absolutely has a path. Let's look back eight years ago and realize that Barack Obama lost New York by a larger margin than Bernie Sanders did. Even though this is her home state and second time around and she was a sitting Senator there, and then as we look ahead, the margin right now that Secretary Clinton has is equal to only half of the votes or delegates selected in California. Put some perspective on it. Uphill climb, certainly. Would love to be ahead but this is not an impossible path.

BLITZER: Next Tuesday, five contests. The biggest one is Pennsylvania. A new poll came out. And this is the Monmouth University poll. Look at this one. Put it up on the screen. Hillary Clinton at 52 percent, Bernie Sanders at 39 percent. That would be another significant loss if it stayed like that.

MERKLEY: And not just very long ago in New York, Bernie was behind by 30 percent and he closed that down. That was her home state. I think there's a tremendous grassroots effort going on in Pennsylvania. Bernie's message that we have to change the paradigm in which workers get the short end of the stick is resonating. People understand we need something a little outside of the ordinary, a little more passion about restructuring our economy in a way in which workers share in the wealth to create. A big industrial state in Pennsylvania and a lot of workers lost jobs, shipped overseas, and so I think his message is going to be resonating there.

BLITZER: We look at the exit polls and you know the exit polls in New York, show the Secretary Clinton won among women and non-whites and Democrats looking for experienced candidate. She won 75 percent of the African-American vote in New York. And among the Democrats, she captured 67 percent of the Latino votes. These other states that are coming up, like Pennsylvania and Maryland, similar demographics as well. It could be another potentially brutal night next Tuesday.

MERKLEY: It could be. But what we saw eight years ago as we saw President Obama rebound from a bigger loss than Bernie had in New York in states where --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: You think you could win Pennsylvania, Maryland, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Delaware? These are the five states.

MERKLEY: I think we have seen a lot of surprises in which Bernie has been underestimated. And the enthusiasm of his team members, a willingness to turn out and election circumstances, rain or shine. And to basically say, look, there has been one super passionate voice about changing the economy so workers share in the wealth create and that's been Bernie Sanders. He is not willing to put our workers into a direct competition with people who earn less than a dollar an hour. He understands how it's devastated manufacturing in our country is. And I can tell you, I come from a working class neighborhood. I live in a working class neighborhood. People recognize that they have been squeeze for four decades, since 1975. We saw our parents go through the process of doing far better than their parents did and people anticipated as our wealth in the nation increased, workers continue to share in that. They haven't. We have to change that.

BLITZER: She's ahead of pledge delegates, significantly ahead, but really ahead when it comes to the super delegates that the Democratic Party authorizes. 15 percent of all the delegates who gather in Philadelphia, the Democratic convention would be those super delegates. She's ahead by 400-plus to 40 or so for him. Is it your hope that he can convince those super delegates to flip and leave Hillary Clinton for Bernie Sanders?

MERKLEY: This points out something interesting. Almost every analysis shows if you set the super delegates aside, neither Bernie Sanders or Secretary Clinton are going to have the majority that they need.

BLITZER: But the rules say the super delegates are equal. Their vote is just as significant as the pledge delegates.

MERKLEY: Absolutely --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: You're a super delegate?

MERKLEY: Yes, I'm a super delegate. The rules also say the super delegates are not locked in --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: They could change their mind up until they vote.

MERKLEY: You could see this proceeds, as it stays on the course, as anticipated in which neither candidates a majority of the delegates without the super delegates, you're going to see a lot of campaigning for those super delegates, a lot of effort to get them to come to one camp or another. I think the electives are unlikely to switch positions. They've taken a public position and people are reluctant to change. Those who are not elected are in a better position to sit back and say, hey, I'm looking at this race and I'm looking at two highly qualified -- by the way, that's important to emphasize. We are so blessed to have two really capable candidates, and unlike the circus on the Republican side.

BLITZER: Jeff Merkley, the United States Senator from Oregon, thank you very much.

MERKLEY: You're very welcome. Thank you.

BLITZER: Appreciate it.

Up next, Hillary Clinton says victory is now in sight when it comes to her clinching the Democratic nomination. Will that include Pennsylvania? A Pennsylvania Senator will join us after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:48:50] BLITZER: Hillary Clinton's campaigning in Pennsylvania later today, one of five states holding primaries next Tuesday.

Joining us now is the Pennsylvania Senator Bob Casey, a Hillary Clinton supporter.

Senator Casey, thank you very much for coming.

SEN. BOB CASEY (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Good to be with you, Wolf. Thank you.

BLITZER: She did well yesterday in New York. Were you surprised at how well she did?

CASEY: No. Some of the polling seemed to indicate she was strong. I hope we can get a big win in Pennsylvania. It seems like she's ahead but we'll work to the last minute to get the vote.

BLITZER: The Monmouth University poll in Pennsylvania today has her at 52 percent, Bernie Sanders at 39 percent. You know Pennsylvania well. You know the Democratic voters there. It's a closed primary, only registered Democrats.

CASEY: Right.

BLITZER: Can actually show up. Does that sound realistic to you?

CASEY: She's got a lead. I think we have to assume as we go into all of these races it will tighten up. But she has a base there. She's always run strong in Pennsylvania. She has personal roots there. President Clinton, of course, has spent a lot of time there. I think the main thing that she's talked about that a lot of our voters are worried about, Wolf, and it's a problem that's been around a while, which is the lack of wage growth over the last couple of decades --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: Bernie Sanders talks about that, too. They both talk about that. [13:50:03] CASEY: And I think she's got the best plan to deal with

that, to deal with investing in infrastructure, science and research. We're a big beneficiary of medical research in Pennsylvania.

BLITZER: Why does he do better in all the exit polls among younger voters who show up, the 18 to 44?

CASEY: Well, I think in Pennsylvania we've got a lot of college students who will be voting in this primary, so we'll see --

(CROSSTALK)

BLITZER: He had a huge crowd at Penn State yesterday.

CASEY: Right. Look, I think Hillary can turn that around in a state like Pennsylvania. If not on primary day, I think by the general election. She is the only candidate that I've seen that has a plan I think that can work to make sure that we can help young people get through college with a -- a much less of a debt burden and to get through it without burdening their future.

BLITZER: Do you believe that Senator Sanders still has a path to the nomination?

CASEY: I don't see it. And I hope that we can unify as soon as we can. I don't know what that means or --

BLITZER: His only hope -- we just heard it from your colleague Senator Merkley of Oregon -- is that neither gets that absolute majority of pledged delegates and that if the super delegates decide he would be better -- you're a super delegate like all U.S. Senators, that they decide when they actually have to raise their hand and vote at the convention in Philadelphia that they will vote for him.

CASEY: Well, I think Hillary is going to be very strong at the convention no matter the kind of delegate. She's demonstrated that. She has more votes than Senator Sanders. But I also believe this prepares her well for a general election. We expect a tough general election in Pennsylvania. But her focus on the middle class, on raising wages, focusing on young people and their college burdens, I think all of that combines to make her strong, general election, in Pennsylvania.

BLITZER: Were you surprised how nasty it's gotten in recent weeks between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton?

CASEY: Well, Democrats have that propensity. I've been in four contested primaries in my state and I know what it's like. We're also good at unifying and people will be together starting in Pennsylvania after Tuesday. I think Hillary will win but then we've got to get ready for a general election.

BLITZER: You think he should pull out and throw his support to her so she can gear up for a general election?

CASEY: It's up to him, you know, when he makes a decision like that, but the sooner that we can come together and unify the better.

BLITZER: You know Pennsylvania. You know Republicans in Pennsylvania. It's a closed primary there as well.

CASEY: Right.

BLITZER: How is Trump going to do against Cruz and Kasich next Tuesday in Pennsylvania?

CASEY: I don't know enough about their side. I try to focus on our side only. It seems like Trump is ahead, but -- but I've been very impressed by the reaction that I've gotten when I'm going around the state campaigning for Hillary. People understand the degree of experience she has. You know, when I was on the Foreign Relations Committee, I worked closely with her on very tough issues dealing with IED issues, components coming in from Afghanistan that were really hurting our troops. She worked on that when I worked with her on that. And she's been someone focused on the middle class, raising wages, focusing on knocking down barriers to people that are trying to get into the middle class.

BLITZER: Good news for Pennsylvania right now. A lot of ad money is going to be spent in the next few days getting those political commercials.

CASEY: We appreciate that.

BLITZER: I'm sure your state could use the funds.

CASEY: It always helps.

BLITZER: Thanks, Senator Casey. Thanks very much for coming on.

CASEY: Wolf, thank you.

BLITZER: New today, confirmation Harriet Tubman, an African-American, who helped rescue thousands of slaves in the late 1800s, will be the first woman to appear on paper currency in more than 100 years in the United States. The U.S. Department of Treasury official tells CNN a portrait of Harriet Tubman will appear on the $20. The back of the $10 is being redesigned as well. It will feature a montage of the women's suffrage movement. The $10 bill will begin circulating in 2020. No word yet on when the now $20 bill will be released. There you have it.

Up next, a highly anticipated party meeting in Florida right now that could have a major effect on the Republican race for president. We're going to tell you what's going on in Hollywood, Florida. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:57:56] BLITZER: There's a new battleground for the Republican presidential candidates, and in a state that already voted last month.

Let's bring in our Phil Mattingly, from Hollywood, Florida, where the Republican National Committee is holding a rules meeting.

Phil, the chairman, Reince Priebus, says he doesn't want any rule changes made this week but is taking suggestions. Is there some way that all three of these Republican campaigns will have a presence there? I understand they are all involved.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. Not only will they have a presence, John Kasich will be here in person and a Ted Cruz adviser just confirmed he's making a surprise visit down here at 4:00 p.m. Both will have private discussions with the RNC members here.

And there's two real reasons why, Wolf. All 168 RNC members are delegates. That means they will have a vote on the convention floor. Some of them will not be bound by however their state decided to vote. That means they are free agents that these candidates want to talk to.

As you mentioned, too, Wolf, one of the other crucial areas are the rules. This week, they won't be deciding the rules of the convention, but they will be making recommendations as to what those rules will entail. We've seen a series of battles break out between the members on the direction of those rules. Some concern that they allow the opportunity for a, quote, unquote, "white knight to come in," some worried they would block Donald Trump entirely. It's a lot of the same fight we're seeing playing out on the campaign trail, playing out behind the scenes here in Florida.

One thing that's very important to note, Wolf, each of the campaigns giving intensive presentations. Jeff Rowe, Ted Cruz's campaign manager, just finished a closed-door presentation where a person who was in the room told me his pitch was entirely about the general election strategy, trying to convince these delegates here that their candidate can't just win the primary but is the best pick for the general. That might make all the difference should you get to a second or third ballot on that convention floor in Cleveland -- Wolf?

BLITZER: No indication that Donald Trump himself will make an appearance, is that right?

MATTINGLY: Not yet. A lot of chatter about the possibility, but he's certainly sending the new top tier of his team down here. Paul Manafort and a new troupe of Trump representatives will all be here -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Phil Mattingly, thanks very much. We'll stay in close touch with you.

That's very much to all of our viewers. I'll be back at 5:00 p.m. eastern in the "The Situation Room."

The news continues next on CNN.

[14:00:10] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, here we go. You're watching CNN.