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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Trump and Ryan Meeting; Trump Meets with Senate Leadership; Ryan Withholds Endorsement; Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired May 12, 2016 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[12:00:00] ANNOUNCER: Breaking news.

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: And hello everyone. I'm Ashleigh Banfield. Welcome to LEGAL VIEW.

He got where he is on feverish rallies and bare-knuckle debates, but now Donald Trump has reached what may be the single most critical day of his political career. And it's taking place totally in private, behind closed doors on Capitol Hill. Any minute now the Republican presidential nominee in waiting will meet with the Republican leadership of the Senate, having already met this morning with the Republican leadership in the House. And before that, with the chairman of the GOP and the speaker of the House, Paul Ryan.

It was one week ago today you will recall that the top elected Republican in the United States declared right here on CNN, surprising everybody, that he was not yet, quote, "ready to endorse" the leader of his own party, Donald Trump, for president. That was a Jake Tapper interview where jaws dropped and the ramifications from Speaker Ryan remained not ready or, oh my God, openly opposed, you could only imagine would be seismic. So today is huge, right? Today we might have an answer to that, right? Is the man on the left ready to endorse the man on the right?

After their conversation, which was only the second time the two men have spoken in person, they decided to issue some writing, a joint communique saying in part, quote, "while we were honest about our few differences, we recognize that there are also many important areas of common ground. We will be having additional discussions, but remain confident that there is a great opportunity to unify our party and win this fall. And we are totally committed to working together to achieve that goal."

Speaker Ryan spoke to reporters live just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. PAUL RYAN (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: Let me say this. I think we had a very encouraging meeting. Look, it's no secret that Donald Trump and I have had our differences. We talked about those differences today. That's common knowledge. The question is, what is it that we need to do to unify the Republican Party and all strains of conservative wings in the party. We had a very good and encouraging, productive conversation on just how to do that. It was important that we discussed our differences that we have, but

it was also important that we discussed the core principles that tie us all together. Principles like the Constitution, the separation of powers, the fact that we have an executive that is going way beyond the boundaries of the Constitution and how it's important to us that we restore Article I of the Constitution. You know, it's the principle of self-government. We talked about life and how strongly we feel about this core principle. We talked about the Supreme Court and things like this.

I was very encouraged with what I heard from Donald Trump today. I do believe that we are now planting the seeds to get ourselves unified to bridge the gaps and differences. And so from here we're going to go deeper into the policy areas to see where that common ground is and how we can make sure that we are operating off these same core principles. And so, yes, I am - this is our first meeting. I was very encouraged with this meeting. But this is a process. It takes a little time. You don't put it together in 45 minutes. So that is why we had, like I said, a very good start to a process and how we unify.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: I'm joined now by a reporting team like none other, CNN's senior political reporter Manu Raju, chief political correspondent Dana Bash, and senior White House correspondent Jim Acosta, here with me in New York, chief political analyst Gloria Borger.

Let's get this party started because there's unity in this party right here.

Dana Bash, I'm going to start with you. You did your famous technique of drive by sound bite and you caught the man of the hour, other than Speaker Ryan and Donald Trump, and it was Reince Priebus. And I think your question was so spot on, does he feel like a marriage counselor? Take me to what he said and what you felt in what he said, because this is really a lot about feelings.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Down the street from where we are right now, which is the Capitol, was at the RNC where these morning meetings took place. And the very first meeting, Ashleigh, was just three men. It was the House speaker, it was Donald Trump and it was the Republican National Committee chair, Reince Priebus. So he, of course, was somebody who we wanted to ask about what happened in that initial meeting between the two of them. He was very cautious, but here's what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REINCE PRIEBUS, RNC CHAIRMAN: I think the headline is, positive first step towards unifying our party. It was a great meeting and that's the only way it can be described.

BASH: That doesn't tell us a lot.

PRIEBUS: It doesn't, but that's because, you know, it was a private meeting in my office and I'm not going to talk about the specifics, other than to say, things were discussed that were specific. It was a cooperative meeting. It was mutually, I think, cooperative and positive and that's the only way you can describe it.

[12:05:05] BASH: My understanding is that you have spent a lot of time over the past week on the phone with Donald Trump, talking to him almost every day, sometimes multiple times a day. You talked a lot to your old friend Paul Ryan, you guys have known each other since way back from Wisconsin Republican politics, to be the bridge builder here. Is that how you feel?

PRIEBUS: Well, I think it's an important role for the party. I mean unifying the party should be no surprise to anyone that that's one of the jobs of being chairman of the Republican Party. And it's important to be unified. So important to remember that, you know -

BASH: But it's not usually this hard?

PRIEBUS: Well, you know what, this was not a usual election. I mean it was a very contentious, tough primary. And, obviously, no one can deny that. It's something that a lot of us haven't been through.

BASH: Do you feel like a couple's therapist?

PRIEBUS: No. You know what, you wouldn't say that if you were in the room. It was very - it was - it was great. And I think the - it had very good chemistry between the two of them.

BASH: You expect an endorsement soon from Paul Ryan now?

PRIEBUS: You know, look, like I said, it was a great first step toward unifying the party and I think if you read both of the statements that came out of speaker's office and Donald Trump's campaign, they echo the same feeling.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASH: And they sure do. That statement, as you read it, Ashleigh, couldn't have been more of an attempt to be on the same page.

And one other thing I just want to say. We were talking mostly about that first meeting this morning with just those three men. Following that, other members of the House Republican leadership were brought in. They kind of expanded the circle a little bit. And my understanding from a source familiar with that discussion is that Trump did a lot of listening. It was not contentious at all, but that Paul Ryan did kind of stand his ground according to the source I'm talking to in, you know, making clear that, yes, a lot of people voted for Donald Trump, but also people voted against him in the Republican primary process and that he needs to unify. And we also talked about policy issues, including one that's near and dear to Ryan's heart, which is the budget and the need to reform entitlements like Medicare and Social Security, in order to balance the budget. But that's not going to happen unless those big programs, which are in big trouble, are dealt with.

Ashleigh. BANFIELD: I'm going to - I'm going to deal with that - that series of meetings again in a moment. But there's yet another critical meeting, as well, Dana Bash. And for that, I want to turn to Jim Acosta, because, Jim, I understand that the Senate leadership meeting is now underway. We went from the three, the critical meeting of the three, Priebus and Trump and Paul Ryan, to the larger House leadership meeting and now over to the Senate leadership meeting. It's a bigger group. I don't hear any noise in the background. We heard a lot of noise in the background before.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right.

BANFIELD: But maybe walk me through what we're expecting out of this meeting.

ACOSTA: That's right, Ashleigh. You know, they say the Senate is the cooling saucer of democracy. So things are a little cooler here on the Senate side of the equation for Donald Trump. Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader, has already endorsed Donald Trump. Although it was a bit of a soft, muted endorsement, he is backing the presumptive GOP nominee, unlike Paul Ryan. And there are other top Senate Republican leaders in there right now, John Thune, who occasionally gets mentioned in this VP talk.

And so, you know, So this is something that we'll see unfold over the next 45 minutes. And then Donald Trump will come out and he'll either come to the microphones and talk to us, which I doubt. He'll probably get back in his motorcade and held off.

But I will tell you from talking to people about this Ryan endorsement today or, you know, what were the prospects of a Ryan endorsement today, you know, I talked to a top Trump campaign official earlier today, Ashleigh, who said they had no expectations at all, quote/unquote, no expectations at all of an endorsement for Paul Ryan for Donald Trump. They knew that this was sort of the beginning of this process. The opening conversation as one aide put it.

And they know inside the Trump campaign that this was a hard fought primary battle. It was political combat. You know, Donald Trump, it was take no prisoners for the real estate tycoon through all of this and so they - they did not expect Paul Ryan to come out today and say what he - to give an endorsement. But if you go by what Paul Ryan said in that press conference, Ashleigh, I mean those are some pretty strong words that Paul Ryan just issued a few moments ago, that he really wants to get this party united around Donald Trump. There are obviously some big differences having been out on the campaign trail, you know, dozens of times with Donald Trump, you know, this is a very different Republican Party that Donald Trump is trying to lead right now. He is very much in favor of keeping Social Security and Medicare the way it is. That is not what Paul Ryan thinks about entitlement programs. So there's a big divide when it comes to that particular side of the policy discussion.

But listen to what Paul Ryan said a few moments ago. It sounds like this party is moving in that direction of unity. Will they ever have the Bushs on board? Will they ever have Mitt Romney on board? It doesn't sound like it. But, you know, if you judge by the fact that Donald Trump, in the last 24 to 48 hours, has really toned down the rhetoric when it comes to the speaker of the House, even - it sounds like even Donald Trump is trying to move in that direction of unity, and we'll have to see what the - you know, what they say after this meeting on the Senate side. But not as tall a taller hurdle for Donald Trump on the Senate side at this point.

[12:10:23] Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: Right. All right, thank you for that, Jim Acosta.

Again, I want to bring in our chief political analyst, Gloria Borger. If I had to make a word cloud of all the things that I heard coming from Speaker Ryan's mouth, I would have to say quickly, very encouraged, planting seeds, process. I did not hear endorsement. Unify. And then there's core principles.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Right.

BANFIELD: I heard core principles over and over and over.

BORGER: Right.

BANFIELD: And specifically separation of powers, which I wasn't sure if he was referring to Obama or Trump.

BORGER: Well, look, he's got to go big because, as Speaker Ryan pointed out and doesn't have to, to all of us, he's got a lot of specific concerns with Donald Trump on policy. And he raised one of those today, according to Dana Bash's reporting, which is the question of entitlements, right? Because Paul Ryan, former budget guy, you know, really cares about preserving entitlements. Donald Trump has said, I'm not going to touch Social Security, right? But the way he's going to get to yes with Donald Trump and it's not in his interests and it's not in Donald Trump's interests for them to kind of remain at odds with each other because, after all, he wants to preserve his majority in the House of Representatives and Donald Trump wants him to do that as well, is to make it bigger and to talk about this common core of principles that you're talking about, which include not only separation of powers, and, yes, he is probably referring to Barack Obama and executive action and that, but - and, of course, they all agree on that, but this question of the Constitution he also talked about. You're not going to get any broader than that.

Ryan also mentioned pro-life. Ryan is very much pro-life and Donald Trump is pro-life. And so he's trying to find a place where they can sit together, right? And those are places they can sit together. He did say that, you know, we're going to get deeper into the policy weeds as these conversations continue because Ryan wants to have an agenda that he agrees with Donald Trump on, that his House members can unite around because he understands that Donald Trump is bringing in new voters to the Republican Party that can help him, and he understands that they have to figure out a way to be united. It is not in either of their self-interests to be involved in an argument over policy right now. So they have to figure out a place that they agree.

BANFIELD: And again, planting the seeds.

BORGER: Planting the seeds.

BANFIELD: So today was a seed, folks.

BORGER: Right.

BANFIELD: You don't get your full endorsement.

BORGER: Soon it will blossom and bloom.

BANFIELD: They hope.

BORGER: Well, they hope.

BANFIELD: They hope.

BORGER: Yes.

BANFIELD: Gloria Borger, thank you for that. Also Dana Bash, Jim Acosta, appreciate your reporting as well.

I'm joined now by Republican Congressman Bill Shuster, he's a Donald Trump supporter, delegate to the GOP convention and a proud representative of the battleground state of Pennsylvania.

Thank you very much for taking the time to be with us today, congressman. I really appreciate this.

And I need to ask your initial reaction to what you heard from the speaker, what you heard from Reince Priebus. We're still waiting to hear from Donald Trump. But give me your assessment of today so far.

REP. BILL SHUSTER (R), PENNSYLVANIA: I think it's a very positive first step. It's important that the highest ranking Republican in the government sits down with the presumptive nominee and they talk and get to know each other. This is going to be important as we move forward and I have no doubt in my mind that we will all come together and unite because this is going to be a very tough general election. You mentioned Pennsylvania. We think Pennsylvania can be in the Trump column on Election Day, but it's Republicans coming together is how we do it.

BANFIELD: So I'm glad you said that because this whole unification issue involves people and people can differ, even when they're from the same state. You have a remarkable state, the state of Pennsylvania. It is a great place. And you have a senator named Senator Patrick Toomey, who told "The New York Times" in an interview the other day some of his thoughts about Donald Trump. So this is where I'm going with the whole unity issue.

SHUSTER: Sure.

BANFIELD: He said, "Donald Trump did earn a mandate from the Republican primary voters. My advice to him is that he should now consider how he will appeal to the many Republican and non-Republican voters who have serious concerns about his candidacy." You can understand the tight walking rope that the speaker is on because he's got members who actually represent that point of view. How do you accommodate for those members?

SHUSTER: Look, this has to be a big tent party, and it is. We do have differing views in our party, but we have core beliefs to move forward, reducing the size of government, making sure it's friendly to businesses, friendly to families, making sure we reduce that regulatory burden. You know, we're going to find those core principles to come together on. I'm confident of it. And right now people are trying to figure out, you know, exactly where Donald is on some of these issues.

[12:15:17] But at the end of the day, I think we'll be united. I think we have to be united or we'll see what happened - the same thing happen, it happened in 2012, when people said, oh, Mitt Romney wasn't just that or just conservative enough. People, Republicans have to come together and, of course, we have to bring over Democrats and independents. And I think Pennsylvania's a good barometer of that. We will see that. and we've already seen, in my district alone, there were over 5,000 Democrats that switched parties. And I believe most of them switched to vote for Donald Trump. So this is a good start.

BANFIELD: So here's the - it's a good start. I hear you and I've been hearing the good start, the seeds, et cetera. But on the core values -

SHUSTER: Sure.

BANFIELD: You can't have a meeting of the minds when you're pro-life and your friends aren't. You can't. And then Donald Trump has also, just since Indiana, just in the last week or so, changed his stance on minimum wage. He's changed his stance on taxing the rich, although he's qualified what his comments made (ph). He's walked back the Muslim ban, suggesting now it's only a suggestion, it's not definitive, even though his statement was absolutely definitive, complete and total. He's talked about his change in stance on entitlement. He's actually sort of reversed himself on funding his own campaign, which was almost the lead line of every single one of these amazing rallies. I'm my own guy. And now he's actually going to need the money from the Republican machine.

So when you have these kinds of changes, is that a good thing in your opinion because he can maybe also change towards the core principles that the Republican leadership is talking about, or is it a bad thing because some people see this as flip-flopping, which they hate about politicians.

SHUSTER: Look, Donald Trump is his own man. As I said earlier, there are going to be differences on policy. There are going to be difference amongst Republicans, myself and my other colleagues. But I think we can come together and I think Donald Trump can bring us together. And it's about uniting the party first and then being able to cross over and attract independents and Democrats. And I think Donald Trump will do that with a message that will be strong and it will be able to, as I said, unite the party and attract those Democrats and independents that want to see a change. And that's what Donald Trump's been talking about. He's been talking

about things that Americans want to see change. He's going to - he's going to shake up Washington, D.C., which it needs to be. And we need to be able to have a president that we can work with to make these reforms pass and get to the president's desk to sign into law. So I just am confident. I think it was a positive day today. I think the speaker is doing the right thing by sitting down with the presumptive nominee and them getting to know each other and talk about the policies that will benefit all of us moving forward.

BANFIELD: Made some seismic headlines, I'll tell you that much. Congressman Bill Shuster, nice to have you. Thanks for being with us today. Appreciate it.

SHUSTER: Thank you very much.

BANFIELD: Coming up next, if what we just heard from Paul Ryan wasn't an endorsement of Donald Trump, and he did not say it was, but what exactly was it then? And where exactly would that particular decision come if it were going to come at all? Is this a turning point in the GOP race, a new way forward for Republicans, or is this just what Donald Trump hates about politicians, hot air? We'll discuss in a minute.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:22:17] BANFIELD: The self-described deal maker, Donald Trump, is making the ultimate pitch to GOP leaders. And what's at stake? Nothing short of the unity and the future of the Republican Party. So, you know, no big whoop. Huge whoop. After months of slamming the Washington establishment, the presumptive GOP nominee has had a whirlwind day that is continuing now on Capitol Hill. Among the most important meetings was the first one, as it would be, meeting with the speaker of the House, Paul Ryan. Speaker Ryan called that face-to-face very encouraging he said and he even spoke about Mr. Trump's personality.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. PAUL RYAN (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: I thought he has a very good personality. He's a very warm and genuine person. Like I said, I met him for like 30 seconds in 2012. So we really don't know each other. And we started to get to know each other. So I actually had a very pleasant exchange with him. That's point number one.

Point number two. Look, there are just things we really believe in as conservatives. We believe in limited government. We believe in the Constitution. We believe in the proper role of the differences in the separation of powers. We believe in things like life. I know we're - not everyone is pro-choice in our party and we accept all comers, but we are a majority pro-life party. And these are things that are important to us. And so we just had a good exchange of views on these kinds of issues.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BANFIELD: CNN chief political analyst Gloria Borger is back with us. And joining us now, CNN political commentator and contributor for "The Atlantic," Peter Beinart.

Peter, one of the questions that came from a fantastic, astute press, because all the questions were very pointed, the answers danced a little as they typically do, but one of those questions was, when you're talking about these core principles as being so important, aren't you papering over the biggest issues here when you say everything was great? Because isn't everything great when the party's already together when you get your nominee?

PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Right. I think what's interesting is to compare what Ryan said today to what he said in the interview with Jake Tapper. One of the people that he referenced with the Jake Tapper interview but didn't mention today was Jack Kemp. That was code for saying, we don't like the Muslim ban. We don't like the way he talks about Latinos. We don't like the way he talks about African-American protesters. That wasn't there.

The other thing - the other word he used in the Jake Tapper interview, which is very important, is the word inherit, which is to say the Republican Party has a fixed identity. It's the party of Lincoln and Reagan. You can't just remake it. That wasn't there either. He was giving a lot of ground.

BANFIELD: Yes - well, OK, but we all are getting a very strong sense of the kind of person Donald Trump is. You don't tell Donald Trump what to do. Just go ask anybody along that trail of tears of 16 candidates who fell real hard next to his insults. And this is something that Donald Trump told "The New York Times" in a telephone interview. He said, "I think I have a mandate from the people. The people are tired of incompetent leadership at the highest level. They're tired of trade deals that are ripping our jobs apart and taking their wages."

[12:25:12] And I think a lot of people agree with him. You're darn right. We're the voters. Give them hell up on Capitol Hill, Mr. Smith. A lot of the voters would say that. But at the same time, you still have what you said, a party that he needs and a party that needs him. And, Gloria, I'm not exactly sure where you come to terms, if you need to negotiate with a guy who says he's a negotiator, but at the same time says he has a mandate, before he's president.

BORGER: Well, the truth of the matter is that Donald Trump brought huge new amounts of Republican voters into the system. He walked into this meeting saying, OK, I've got to take my castor oil here because I've got to meet with these leaders. But, honestly, cutting deals with leaders of Congress is not Donald Trump's brand. It isn't. It isn't. But he walked in there because he understands that he'd rather try and get on the semblance of the same page with them than be engaged in a back and forth because it doesn't help him, it doesn't help retain control of the Congress for Republicans and he's going to want that if he becomes president.

He also walked in there, in his back pocket, with battleground state polls which shows that -

BANFIELD: It's close.

BORGER: That he and Hillary Clinton are neck and neck.

BANFIELD: Yes.

BORGER: So he walked in there with a bunch of leverage and Paul Ryan had to say to him, let's find common ground because we know where we disagree.

What we didn't hear from Paul Ryan, and I bet it was also discussed but he wasn't going to talk about it, was this question of tone. And, you know, you talk about the Muslim ban. We heard Donald Trump softening his positions -

BANFIELD: Saying it's a suggestion now, not a (INAUDIBLE) policy.

BORGER: Saying it's a suggestion on the Muslim ban. I don't think he's going to do a flip on it because he's got 70 to 80 percent of Republican primary voters with him on that issue.

BANFIELD: That liked what he said.

BORGER: So I think they have to find a way to thread the needle.

BANFIELD: OK.

BORGER: And the way to do it is to go big rather than to go into the weeds here.

BANFIELD: So those huge voters you were talking about -

BORGER: Yes.

BANFIELD: David Winston (ph), if you don't know, he ran Newt Gingrich's 2012 campaign for president. And he said this. Again, I'm going to quote it. He said it to "The New York Times" in this wide- ranging interview. He said, "at this point, at a minimum, he," meaning Donald Trump, "is at least 50 million voters short of what he's going to need. He has created an interesting dynamic in that during the course of the campaign he was basically calling those individual names, which didn't endear him to their supporters."

So, Peter, their supporters don't like that they were - their leaders were - their establishment were having their, you know - they were being dragged through the mud, little Marco and all the rest. But his supporters are fine with it. So who is he going to appease as he move forward? Who does he need to appease as he moves forward to try to get those 50 million votes?

BEINART: The problem is, to win a presidential election, you need to win different kinds of voters, right? So Donald Trump has a certain core of voters who really like him for a variety of reasons. His problem is - and he may be able to - I think what Paul Ryan may help him do is win some core conservatives, people who've supported Ted Cruz, let's say, but can be brought to Donald Trump on, what? On the issue of abortion, for instance. You notice that Ryan mentioned life twice.

BORGER: Right.

BEINART: Because I think he knows that for a lot of core conservatives they can say, even though there are a lot of things I don't like Donald Trump, at least he will appoint anti-abortion Supreme Court justices. So he can get some more people on that.

The problem is people who are a little bit less ideologically conservative who are repelled by the way Donald Trump conducts himself and the way he's dividing the country who would normally vote Republican, especially women. That's going to be a big problem. The other problem is going to be the potentially epic turnout you find among Hispanics and other Democratic leading groups who are terrified about the prospect of a man who they consider a bigot becoming the president of the United States.

BANFIELD: Yes, I think somebody several months ago called Donald Trump a one man turnout machine for the Democratic Party. I -

BEINART: We're already starting to see it.

BORGER: But Hillary Clinton, you know, could -

BANFIELD: Could be the one man turnout machine for the Republicans.

BORGER: Could be the turnout machine for the Republicans.

BANFIELD: It's true.

BORGER: Exactly.

BANFIELD: So much still to talk about. I have to leave it there, though. Thank you, Peter Beinart and Gloria Borger, as always, for your perspective.

BEINART: Thank you.

BORGER: Sure.

BANFIELD: Coming up next, what are Trump campaign insiders, insiders, the ones who talk to him, what are they saying about today's huddle with Washington insiders? We're going to ask one of them coming up because so far, boo, not boo from Donald Trump.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)