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Longtime Friend Of Donald Trump Discusses The Man Behind The Campaign; Trump Trying To Walk Back His Muslim Ban; Trump Continues "Unity Tour". Aired 4-5p ET
Aired May 15, 2016 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:01] REP. PAUL RYAN, (R) HOUSE SPEAKER: It looks like in the Republican Party. As I said before, this takes some time. This isn't done with a couple of meetings.
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: All right. So will Ryan eventually endorse Trump? And if so, when? The presumptive nominee's top aide tells CNN's Jake Tapper don't expect any major changes from Trump going forward.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL MANAFORT, CONVENTION MANAGER, DONALD TRUMP CAMPAIGN: Donald Trump was not asked by the leadership to change and there's no reason for him to change. He's just won the primary process with a record number of votes. The conversation that they had focused on the Trump agenda to make America great again and Paul Ryan's agenda to return prosperity. There was a lot of overlap of the objectives of both of those programs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: All right, despite the growing number of conservative leaders who have vowed to support Donald Trump, there are new reports of a movement toward the opposite scenario. A third-party run. This was the front page of the "Washington Post" this morning. The paper says Mitt Romney and a "Band of exasperated Republicans including 2012 presidential nominee Mitt Romney is actively plotting to draft an independent presidential candidate.
Well, joining me now to talk more about his is Jackie Gingrich Cushman, she is an author and also the daughter and advisor of former House Speaker and presidential candidate Newt Gingrich. All right, good to see you.
JACKIE GINGRICH CUSHMAN, NEWT GINGRICH'S DAUGHTER: Thank you thanks for having me here.
WHITFIELD: OK, so this has been an interesting and somewhat rather rocky season. Would you agree?
CUSHMAN: Absolutely. It's been just amazing. Amazing to watch. Who would have thought we'd be here today talking about Donald Trump the presumptive nominee, right.
WHITFIELD: That's right. We couldn't have called any of this because now you're talking about, you know, this party unity conversation.
CUSHMAN: Right.
WHITFIELD: At the same time simultaneously, the conversation is about a third-party candidate.
CUSHMAN: Right. And the same time you think about an opposite side, Hillary Clinton still has not locked it up and she's running against Bernie Sanders. So the whole to your point, the whole field is wide open.
WHITFIELD: It is, indeed. So let's talk about the Republicans and, you know, perhaps the folks that you know and these inner circles and workings of Washington. What are they saying, are they seriously considering or conservative Republicans seriously considering a third party?
CUSHMAN: Well, I can see things. I think first of all, you see the people in power like Paul Ryan who met this week with Donald Trump.
WHITFIELD: Right.
CUSHMAN: Completely they're starting to work together. Reince Priebus has already said that he's endorsing Trump, they're moving forward. So I think he see a lot of Republicans and most Republican saying he is our nominee, he'll be our nominee come this summer. Let's figure out how he can win and beat Hillary Clinton. I do think there are a few that aren't too happy with where we are now who never imagined this could happen.
WHITFIELD: Right.
CUSHMAN: And are very -- they want to go and they want to hold onto power. And that's this is all about. They want to attain the power. They want to make sure that Washington has, I think, you know, that the guideline and can make sure they determine what's going to happen. And Donald Trump is a different candidate. He talks about the people. He talks about getting things done. So very different from the establishment and those that are trying to hold onto power are honestly a little scared.
WHITFIELD: You mentioned Reince Priebus. Let's listen to what he had to say about his concerns about all of this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REINCE PRIEBUS, CHAIRMAN, REPUBLICAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE: And these are things that he's going to have to answer for, but I also think there are things from many years ago. And I think that, you know, as Christians judging each other I think is problematic. I think it's when people live in glass houses and throw stones is when people getting in trouble.
And so, you know, as Hillary Clinton, is the classic Clinton operation, now suddenly these things are coming out. It's not necessarily that people make mistakes or have regrets or seek forgiveness. It's whether or not the person launching the charge is authentic in their own life and can actually be pure enough to make such a charge. That's what I think most people look at when they evaluate people's character. Again, I don't think Donald Trump is being judged based on his personal life. I think they're judging Donald Trump as to whether or not he's someone that's going to go to Washington and shake things up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Could you agree with him, is that part of the problem that there are people who are judging him about his qualifications? They're judging him over his business prowess? They are judging him about relationship he may or may not have had, how he may have treated people, particularly women?
CUSHMAN: I think the challenge to Donald Trump has and I think actually could be to his advantage in the end, is that people haven't really him from very long, from a political standpoint. I mean, his been around a long in real estate.
WHITFIELD: Sure. Well, he admits, he's new to politics.
CUSHMAN: Absolutely. He's been part of, you know, he's very, you know, very out in the public eye. But he's new in politics. So, if you look at the two -- if you look at predominate. Look at Hillary Clinton, who's been not only in the public eye but in the public eye regarding politics for decades. OK, we know her very well we know what she's about.
Donald Trump is relatively new. So I think when you look at both of them, they both have very high infavorables. But, the difference is we know. And we don't like Hillary Clinton, but we just kind of met Donald Trump on the political side. He's new to us. He's different. I mean, he's not a Mitt Romney ...
[16:05:02] WHITFIELD: Have you sized him up, so to speak? I mean, I have this exclusive interview with Louise Sunshine. You probably write about her in the art of DEO, you know about her as one of, you know, one of the executive vice president who work with him 15 years.
And in my sit down conversation with her, she talks about her perspective, her working experience with hem, that in her words, he respects women that he wanted to see a trajectory for women. He helped her in her ascension. He was a mentor. He was a leader. Flip side to that, you hear from other reports from women who've had experience with him who say that, you know, he was classless in many ways and that he was less than a gentleman and he wasn't respectful. So, have you sized him up or have you made an assessment about the candidate, the presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump and whether you like him as a woman?
CUSHMAN: Exactly, I think I'm among the rest of the America. I think I'm waiting to see more of Donald Trump. I think, as we see more, more of him. I think to your point you obviously has had women in his company with very high positions. He's helped them really on their careers and relied on them. He said, they're very hard workers and they are effective and efficient and they get things done. And he likes that, he like all the accomplish things. And so he really relies on women.
In terms of I think you're referring to the "New York Times." that to me is kind of a hit piece. It looks like they tried to figure out what they could say bad about him. Be fascinating that to line up against so they could find bad to say against, let say President Clinton. Who clearly doesn't have a great track record either with women in terms of how he relates to them in the personal matter. So I think we really just begin to know Donald Trump.
WHITFIELD: Related to your point, people feel like they know his history and President Clinton, but they're still getting to know Donald Trump as a political, now, force.
CUSHMAN: Absolutely. And I think what we'll see -- I don't know Donald Trump personally, so I can't judge himself ...
WHITFIELD: But you'll be voting and you're a Republican.
CUSHMAN: Absolutely. And at this point, I can say I will vote for Donald Trump because I think Donald Trump will be a better president than Hillary Clinton. I know Hillary Clinton very well. I mean, I think she's very smart, very hard worker. I don't agree with her policies and I think like many American did she's not trustworthy. I think she changes depending on what she needs to do, very smart, very hard worker.
Donald Trump, businessman, can get things done, very successful, he's obviously promoted women and done very well in terms of putting them on the forefront. I think he's obviously change the face of politics. We can say that now.
WHITFIELD: Yeah.
CUSHMAN: Who would have thought he was the nominee.
WHITFIELD: Great.
CUSHMAN: And I think kind of looks a huge change in our country as well.
WHITFIELD: He says he wants to be in the company of someone with political experience as he assesses his vice presidential picks. Your dad ran at least once right and he's available, is he not? Is he on the list? Newt Gingrich as possibly, you know, thinking about working with a Donald Trump?
CUSHMAN: Well, I think if you look at what Trump needs for a vice presidential candidate, he needs two things. He needs first of all a person that can be president, OK? So if you look at the ticket you have Donald Trump and someone that could president.
I think secondarily, he needs someone that he can get along with. I mean, he is not -- I think that will do this. I mean, I've watched the people around him. And I think the one think they know is they have to be with Donald Trump. And what you don't want do is have two people that who look good on paper because of the geography, but really can't work together. What you need -- let's look at my dad. He balanced the budget as speaker.
WHITFIELD: Right.
CUSHMAN: Hasn't been done since then. I mean, that would be nice to have done. He actually worked with a Democratic president, President Bill Clinton and they accomplished things even though they had very different viewpoints. They can work together. I think the country is crying out for people to reach across the aisle and accomplish thing so in that way he would be a good bet.
WHITFIELD: So even your dad spoke today on Fox. In fact let hear him, Newt Gingrich.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NEWT GINGRICH, (R) FORMER HOUSE SPEAKER: Well, If he asks me, I'm certainly going to say I want to sit down and talk about it. I don't think it's an automatic yes. I think you have to think through what does he think the job involves.
CHRIS WALLACE, FOX ANCHOR: And if he indicates, as I'm sure he would, you're going to play a big role.
GINGRICH: If he can convince Calista and me that it's doable and that it's serious and we would, in fact, contribute I think we would be very hard pressed not to say yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: All right, so about this cohesion, you know.
CUSHMAN: Right.
WHITFIELD: If Donald Trump is the presumptive nominee, if he indeed going to be the guy, the party has to rally around him.
CUSHMAN: Well, absolutely. I think at the end of the day. And first of all, you have to assume that Hillary Clinton beats Bernie Sanders. And we're not there yet. And who would have thought we'd be talking about Bernie Sanders now? He's run an incredible campaign. And I think a lot of the enthusiasm on his side is what we see on Donald Trump side, its people are really tired of kind of old establishment Washington. In the end if you have a Clinton versus a Trump ...
WHITFIELD: Is that strange though when you have that in Donald Trump that's in large part behind his success in this campaign run. But then now he says, you know, not now but he said it many months ago that he wants to be surrounded by people with political experience because he's got the business things, but he needs the politics. But does that send a message to voters that some who's familiar political face, that might be tired of will get use to it because they are coming back, if there's a Trump in the White House. [16:10:03] CUSH: Right now, I hear what you're saying. But I think it says to people is that. He's actually going to learn from somebody else. I think it's a huge statement for Donald Trump.
We all know we listen to him and talk about how smart he is, how successful he is. So when I hear that he wants to go out and get very seasoned people to understand how politics work, to me I'm like, great. He's going to have advisors that know what they're talking about.
WHITFIELD: So is the party doing exactly this, are they now trying to say, OK, well this is our guy, now we got to explain and try justify, help each other figure out how we better embrace him, because we have all this time. Bit now, we have not choice. Is that's what's happening?
CUSHMAN: Well, I don't think it's no choice. I think you have to as a party has to listen to people. The voters voted for him and you have to respect that.
WHITFIELD: OK, we'll leave it there.
CUSHMAN: Fascinating.
WHITFIELD: It has been fascinating. All right, thank you Jackie, good to see you.
CUSHMAN: Thank you.
All right, coming up next, Hillary Clinton are hitting the campaign trail hard today in Kentucky holding multiple rallies in fact. Will it be enough to stop Sanders' winning momentum? We'll discuss.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right, Donald Trump standing firm on his stance to not release his tax returns right now. The presumptive GOP nominee says he's currently being audited and will release them after that process is complete, but acknowledges that might not be before the general election. Hillary Clinton pounced on that one wondering who Trump's motivation is for keeping the returns private.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So what about his taxes? So we'll get around to that, too. Because when you run for president, especially when you become the nominee, that is kind of expected. My husband and I have released 33 years of tax returns. We got eight years on our website right now. So you got to ask yourself, why doesn't he want to release them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: All right, so how big of an issue is this? Let's talk about it with Republican Strategist Brian Morganstern and Republican -- Political Analyst Ellis Henican. Sorry, whoa ha. [16:15:02] All right, so let's talk about this. Tax returns, not requirement, but it's become customary, since 76. So Ellis, you first. How important is it to release them?
ELLIS HENICAN, POLITICAL ANALYST: It's something. I mean, it's something you can beat up on him about. By the way, I really like the way Hillary said we'll get around to that. It sounds exactly like something Bill Clinton would say. She's wasn't shouting. She wasn't pointing her finger. She was just kind of winking at you and we'll be back on that one.
WHITFIELD: So, Brian, I guess, you know, really the question is, how potentially revealing is it when a candidate releases their taxes? What is it that a voter learns from this that they need to know?
BRIAN MONGENSTERN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, the reason tax returns matter in general is because you can fairly assess the credibility of a candidate based on where they're earning their money, you know, who's paying them. And you can factor that into how much credibility you give to their message. For Trump, it's interesting because we can learn, you know, whether he actually earns as much as he says he does. We can learn if he actually donates to veteran's charities when he skips debates to raise money for them.
We can learn what, if any, his offshore holdings might be, you know, things like that. So there are some potential interesting land mines in there for Trump which is I think why his returns might be a little bit more interesting than your average candidate.
WHITFIELD: So, in Donald Trump's case, it might be different for the other candidates Ellis, it's almost like a truth-o-meter? Is that what we're getting here base on what, you know, Brian was describing? Does the tax return or is it reflective of many of the things that Donald Trump has said?
HENICAN: Yeah. Brian's right about that. The difference here, most of these political people, Hillary certainly example that. Have understood for decades that their tax returns were going to be part of the public document and so, you know, they craft them very carefully, they are aware of the message those thing in.
Donald, who never had any clue he was going to be a serious presidential candidate presumably filed his tax returns without that -- that shield in them. So, yeah, it's a much riskier proposition, one of the reasons I want to see him.
WHITFIELD: So how far back is adequate required interesting Brian, for Donald Trump?
MONGENSTERN: Yeah. I mean, the Clinton's going 33 years. I think that's overkill for sure. Trying to make up for some of the transparency and trust deficit that she's facing. So she's, you know, trying to make up for that there. For Trump, you know, I would say, I think Romney did two or three years, Trump might want to do a little more because he's someone running on a business record and not a political record. Maybe he wants to do, you know, five or seven years, you know, something like that. It's a judgment call and it's tough to, you know, land on a number. But I would say probably more than two, less than ten.
WHITFIELD: But Ellis, would Donald Trump's feeling be, you know what? If I don't really have to do it, I'm not going to and I can just let you guys ask about it for as long as you want to until we just, you know, go to the polls and. We'll voters really cast a ballot or not based on that?
HENICAN: Oh boy, you just put your finger on the interesting issue there. I mean, Donald is clearly different from most politicians. He's gotten away politically with things that nobody else could have gotten away with. You know at some point, you wonder these things sort of add up into just some kind of generalized impression that makes people look at the guy and goes (inaudible). But, you know, it didn't happen to Republican Primaries. I think it's more likely to happen now, but it hasn't happened yet.
WHITFIELD: All right, you all are making me laugh. You're funny. All right, Ellis, Brian. Thanks so much. But that's why I love you guys so much. You make me laugh all the time. Appreciate it.
MONGENSTERN: Oh, well try. Good to see you Fred.
[16:19:02] WHITFIELD: Straight ahead, nine dead, dozens injured. That was the scene in Waco, Texas, nearly one year ago. Now some of the witnesses to that biker gang shootout are speaking out and giving their side of the story to CNN. Our special report next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: It was a scene of chaos at a Texas Restaurant nearly one year ago. A massive brawl broke out between rival motorcycle clubs leaving nine bikers dead in a trail of bloodshed and destruction. And now some of the people who were there that day are opening up telling their side of the story to our Ed Lavandera. Ed's joining us now. Ed?
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDET: Hi, Fredricka. Well, you know, many people cannot forget the headlines. Nine bikers killed. 177 arrested. That moment when all of those mug shots were released was a fascinating moment. But Waco, didn't just come out of the blue, didn't happen out of thin air. There were moments that led up to that violent altercation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA: Cossacks and Bandidos, angry, dangerous, and bitter enemies. Months of rage and violence have led to this moment. An all- out battle in the parking lot of a favorite biker hangout. Hundreds of bullets have been fired as armed police officers are nearby watching. Dozens are down, wounded or dead. And the bloody clash shows no signs of stopping.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There would be a pause in the gun shot, and then you'd hear a few more go off.
LAVANDERA: Seconds into the showdown, surveillance video show this biker running from the Twin Peaks patio covered in blood.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I mean it was pretty horrific, they were guys getting hit and fall in and. I realized that I needed to get away from where I was.
LAVANDERA: Biker John Wilson did get away. You can see him here inside Twin Peaks, duck for cover.
[16:25:01] But this man seen in the red bandana was not as lucky. He hits another biker in the throat with what looks like a chain. They wrestle to the ground. Then he's strike several times in the head. Stomped on at least one and looks to be shot by a third biker. He seems lifeless as the men he was fighting walk away.
Then another fight breaks out. Look closely as the highlighted biker is shot in the leg during the skirmish. Cossack Richard Kershner stumbles to the curb and collapsed. When the area is secure, member of the Cossacks carry him away for help. Both bikers die at the scene.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA: Fedricka, there are still many, many questions surrounding exactly what happened and what is going to happen here in the future. We'll get into a lot of that. What led up to Waco, what happened at Waco and what happens next?
WHITFIELD: We look forward to it. Thank you so much Ed Lavandera CNN's special report "Biker Brawl" inside the Texas shoot out airs at tomorrow night 9:00 eastern time.
All right, Donald Trump's success so far in politics may have come to a surprise to some, but not to Louise Sunshine. Up next, my exclusive face-to-face interview with the woman who calls the presumptive Republican nominee not just a mentor, but one of her closest friends.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right, hello again. And thanks for joining me. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. Donald Trump's rapid rise in the 2016 presidential race may have caught some pundits and the public by surprise. But it his assent is not unexpected to one of his close friends and former proteges. I recently sat down face-to-face with executive interview with Business Executive Louise Sunshine at her Miami home. Louise worked for Trump for 15 years and speaks with him often.
[16:30:03] She talked about what he's really like, his controversies, and his leadership style.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[16:30:04] WHITFIELD: The late 1970s, a very costly and controversial Vietnam War is over.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY CARTER, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: I. Jimmy Carter, do solemnly swear.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Georgia peanut farmer Jimmy Carter is the 39th American President. The king, Elvis found dead. Saturday Night Live premieres, the start of a favorite TV past time poking fun at pop culture and politics.
And New York developer, Donald Trump in his late 20s and early 30s, already making a splash in a New York real estate market, acquiring prestigious Manhattan properties with a style of his own.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LOUISE SUNSHINE, FORMER DONALD TRUMP'S EXECUTIVE VICE PRESIDENT: I was gaga over Donald.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Close friend and former Trump organization business executive, Louise Sunshine says at a time when women were not invited to the table, let alone the board room, Trump brought her in.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SUNSHINE: There was no boardroom. That's number one. The boardroom was in Donald's head. The boardroom was all of this idea -- these ideas he had, the vision he had, and if you could buy into his vision and you were trustworthy and you were intelligent and you were proactive; proactive was the key.
WHITFIELD: So, describe the climate of the late '70s.
SUNSHINE: I mean, the glass ceiling was about -- if the ceiling today is -- my ceiling is 22 feet high in my home and the ceiling then could have been 2 feet high. Every once in a while in your lifetime there comes a person or an opportunity or a person with an opportunity, you know, and I'm a woman. I mean, and women don't have these opportunities very often.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Before the hit TV show "Apprentice," Sunshine play add role in the real life version.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: How was he as a boss?
SUNSHINE: He was never a boss. That's the truth.
WHITFIELD: How would you...
SUNSHINE: He was never a boss. He was a leader. It's a lot different to have a boss than a leader. He was a leader. He taught me. He mentored me. He showed me the way. That's it. I was like smitten. See, Donald doesn't distinguish between women and men. He
distinguishes -- he looks for talent. He looks for trustworthy talent. Trump, t means trustworthy talent. Just think about it that way.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: After 16 years at the Trump organization, Sunshine branched off blazing her own trail in real estate development, through her own company, the Sunshine Group. All the while close relations with Trump. She says he remains a part of her daily life throughout her Miami home, reminders of Trump's impact and regular phone calls, pointers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: What's the last time you spoke with him?
SUNSHINE: Yesterday.
WHITFIELD: And what was that conversation like?
SUNSHINE: It was a very simple conversation. He said he missed me. He doesn't have a lot of time these days.
WHITFIELD: When you see him as the frontrunner, the presumptive Republican nominee and you see the way he has led his campaign, is that the same way he has led his business all of these years? Do you see the same Donald Trump?
SUNSHINE: I see the same Donald Trump, but I'm not sure that the way he has led his business which has been entirely successful works in politics because I think sometimes he forgets what the politic thing is, to say -- and of course that's what politics is all about. And I think he just marches -- he has continued to march to the tune of his own drummer.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: Or in other words, Trump says in his book, "The Art of the Deal," sometimes it pays to be a little wild.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: So then when you hear Donald Trump today on the campaign trail and when he calls Hillary Clinton crooked or when you hear him use language that some say is sexist, certainly unflattering of women...
CARLY FIORINA, FORMER HEWLETT PACKARD, CEO: I think women all over this country heard very clearly what Mr. Trump said.
DONALD TRUMP, (R) U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And you could see there was blood coming out of her eyes, blood coming out of her -- wherever.
[16:35:04] WHITFIELD: And you just describe that in your view your experience was he didn't have a distinction between men and women, that he just saw your mind.
But then when you see this Donald Trump on the campaign trail, is he recognizable to you? Is that the same person?
SUNSHINE: But he doesn't -- but he also calls Marco Rubio short. He calls Ted Cruz something else. He calls Lindsey Graham...
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: Lying Ted.
SUNSHINE: ... something else. It doesn't matter if you're a man or woman. And when I hear him say those things, I put in my ear plugs.
WHITFIELD: What do you mean?
SUNSHINE: I have Donald Trump ear plugs. I have ear plugs about a lot of things in life.
WHITFIELD: So, you put your head in the sand and just say he didn't really say that?
SUNSHINE: No, not my head in the sand. I put in my ear plugs. So, it doesn't matter.
WHITFIELD: So, it's excusing -- it's excusing language like that that you put your plugs on?
SUNSHINE: No, I'm not excusing. What am I going to do about it?
WHITFIELD: But he's your good friend. You could call him up and say...
SUNSHINE: I could.
WHITFIELD: ... give him a piece of your mind.
SUNSHINE: But this is when I called him. The only time I called him during the whole campaign was to tell him that I loved the slogan, America first. Because I thought it was much more positive than make America great again.
WHITFIELD: You shared that with him?
SUNSHINE: Yes.
WHITFIELD: And his response?
SUNSHINE: He loved it. He said, "I miss you."
TRUMP: And it's an honor to have everybody here...
SUNSHINE: And so when he started to run for president -- and people said to me I was ridiculous, his joke, blah, blah, blah, I said, he's going to win.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: But possibly winning the presidency is still six months away, with lots of room for campaign surprises like this newly released 25-year-old recording of a voice Trump denies is his.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: You know when we...
SUNSHINE: And when was the recording made?
WHITFIELD: This was 25 years ago.
SUNSHINE: Oh, that's right up my alley.
WHITFIELD: All right. Let's listen.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, it's just that he really decided that he wasn't -- you know, he didn't want to make -- a commitment. He thought it was way too soon. He's coming out of a marriage and he's starting to do tremendously well financially.
SUNSHINE: I did not hear Donald's voice.
WHITFIELD: You did not?
SUNSHINE: Not the Donald I know.
WHITFIELD: What do you mean?
SUNSHINE: I just didn't hear his voice. Not the voice that resonates in my ears.
WHITFIELD: So was there a John Miller? Do you recall a John Miller?
SUNSHINE: No, I don't know John Miller.
WHITFIELD: Would it be odd, would it be disappointing if that were Donald Trump posing as or representing himself as a John Miller?
SUNSHINE: I don't believe Donald to do things like that. I've never known him to do things like that. He has never done things like that in my presence or my 15 years with him. He doesn't have to. He's Donald Trump.
WHITFIELD: And you feel like you know him well?
SUNSHINE: No. I know him well. I don't feel like it. I know that I know him well.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: All right. And later on this hour, there is more in my conversation with close friend and colleague Louise Sunshine, as she shares a very unique piece of New York history that Trump actually was part of a project and now she has kind of the byproduct of it. Something that got a lot of headlines. More on that later.
Also coming up, Donald Trump representing America on the global stage. What would it look like exactly if the billionaire businessman makes it all the way to the White House? We debate that next.
[16:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right. Donald Trump is walking back his plan to temporarily ban Muslims from entering the U.S. saying now it was just a suggestion. When he was asked about London's newly elected mayor who is Muslim, Trump says there would always be exceptions to the ban. Well, this is what Mayor Sadiq Khan had to say about him that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SADIQ KHAN, LONDON MAYOR: My message to Donald Trump and his team is that your views of Islam are ignorant. It is possible to be a Muslim and to live in the West.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: So, is there a ripple effect, Trump's comments and foreign policy ideas are having on other parts of the world?
I want to talk it over with CNN politics senior reporter Stephen Collinson, and Peter Beinart, he is a CNN political commentator and a contributor to The Atlantic.
Good to see both of you. All right. So, Peter, you first. So, what are people on the world stage thinking and feeling about a possible Donald Trump in the White House?
PETER BEINART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, given the reporting, I think people don't really know whether to laugh or cry. I mean, they don't know whether this is just some big joke that America's playing or whether a man this profoundly ignorant and profoundly bigoted and profoundly reckless could be the leader of the most powerful country in the world.
Were that to actually happen, it would be very unpredictable, where he did try to put any version of that Muslim ban into place, the consequences in terms of America's relationships with Muslim countries would be totally hard to predict, but very, very dangerous and I think it would be a horrifying spectacle.
Where he would try to put his 45 percent tariff on Chinese goods into place, that would really threaten the world economy. Where he -- to try to renegotiate on America's debt like he suggested that would also threaten the world economy. So I think people are frightened and they have a right to be frightened.
WHITFIELD: And, Stephen, the U.S. and U.K. relationship is very strong and very important when you have the London Mayor Sadiq Khan saying that, you know, he's ignorant, that Donald Trump is ignorant.
That certainly doesn't start off on a good foot if indeed it were Donald Trump in the White House and his, you know, expected relations and dialogue that would have to happen with not just the U.K. as a whole, but with London.
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS REPORTER: That's right, Fred. You don't often hear British politicians or any foreign politicians talking that way about a potential U.S. president. They usually like to keep their powder a little bit dry because they want to work with whoever gets elected.
[16:45:02] So it's very unusual in that sense. I think there is in Britain some consternation and across Europe, confusion, exactly about what Donald Trump would do as president.
You know, for instance, his comments on NATO, for example, have really raised a lot of fears. Because it basically seems like he's willing to turn his back on the post-war compact that kept the peace in the Europe for 70 years. He has basically saying that he doesn't think or has said on several occasions that NATO is very relevant anymore and it's not very relevant to the big question.
Another issue that's troubling Europeans is his apparent admiration for Vladimir Putin who has taken Russia back to some post, sort of Cold War style behavior, rewriting some of the boundaries of Eastern Europe.
So, I think there's a lot of worry about what exactly Donald Trump would do. There's some confusion about whether he would do what he says he will do. And a think lot of people are watching the election abroad with some concern.
WHITFIELD: Yes. And, you know, Peter, you've got this anti-Trump kind of movement within the United States. Is there an equivalency as it pertains to the world stage?
BEINART: Well, it will be interesting to see, I mean, were he actually to win how people abroad would react. I mean, what I think is so interesting about the new London mayor saying he would not come to the United States even if Donald Trump granted him an exception from Trump's Muslim ban, is that I would think and hope frankly that a lot of foreign leaders and dignitaries would say no.
If you are going to have a religious test and ban members of a particular -- of one religious group from the United States which represents a kind of horrifying betrayal of America's core values of religious liberty, then no, we are not going to come to the United States either.
So, I would hope that it would not only be London Muslim mayor but other people of countries as well who would say if you're not going to allow Muslims into the United States, then we're not coming either.
WHITFIELD: And, Stephen, we haven't even solidify the race for the White house 2016. And on cnn.com, you're already looking way ahead and talking 2020. Why is it not too early for that?
COLLINSON: Well, I think when you talk to people and say you're looking at the election in 2020, they're horrified. And they think, you know, we can't even get through this election. It's too long and it's crazy.
But I think what you're seeing with a number of the most prominent politicians in Washington and some that were in this campaign like Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio, politicians are trying to work out where the political sands are going to settle.
Donald Trump has been so tumultuous. He's turned the political system and environment on its head. And people are trying to work out, career politicians, for example, House Speaker Paul Ryan, are trying to work out how to reconcile their positions with not just an eye on their own future, but an eye on their party's future.
So, I think it's a very difficult time in U.S. politics. And I think what we're seeing is people like ted Cruz for example, he's clearly playing a long political game. Many people believe that he didn't even think he could win this election, but he's trying to position himself in case Trump loses.
And you have some people on Capitol Hill, Republicans trying to work out, Ok, can I stay in power with alienating Donald Trump supporters. So, it's a very difficult political moment and there's a lot of turmoil right now. And people are really looking to their futures.
WHITFIELD: Stephen Collinson and Peter Beinart, Always good to see you. Thanks so much.
BEINART: Thanks.
COLLINSON: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: All right. We'll have much more on the political landscape next.
But first, San Diego, California, is one of the wealthiest cities in the U.S. But less than an hour away across the border in the outskirts of Tijuana, Mexico, many families are living in desperate poverty. No running water, electricity, or proper shelter. That's where this week's CNN hero from San Diego lends a helping hand.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PAULA CLAUSSEN, CNN HERO: It's important to remember that these families that we're helping in Mexico are our neighbors; they're just right across the border. It's night and day the difference.
We are helping the communities come together and we are teaching them that there is love in the world, that other people do care about them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: To see how Paula Claussen can change an entire family's life in one day, go to cnnheroes.com. And while you're there, nominate someone you think deserves to be a CNN hero.
[16:50:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: All right. Over the past few hours, we've been sharing with you an insightful, exclusive face to face conversation with Louise Sunshine. She is a close friend and former executive vice president for Donald Trump.
And while talking with her, we also learned that she has a unique piece of New York history. It's an artifact linked to one of Trump's most important and controversial real estate projects.
Trump tower, the 68-story shiny mixed used behemoth on Sixth Avenue. A symbol of its name sake, Donald Trump, and his footprint on New York real development. But in some circles, according to what Trump wrote in his bestseller. "The Art of the Deal" he became quote, "a symbol of everything evil about modern developers."
Largely because before Trump tower went up, the specialty landmark department store Bonwit Teller came down and along with it, reportedly precious art deco items such as two limestone relief panels or carvings.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: You have on your balcony something that represents the history of Bonwit Teller.
Former Trump executive now living in Miami.
Show me.
SUNSHINE: I'm so fortunate to have this.
WHITFIELD: Louise Sunshine sheds some light.
SUNSHINE: This was the lovely lady that was the relief on the Bonwit Teller building.
WHITFIELD: One of two.
Have you or even Donald Trump tried to correct published reports that say the relieves, this being one of them, you say, that the relieves were destroyed when he tore down the Bonwit Teller building to put up the Trump tower?
[16:55:04] SUNSHINE: Well I don't know what Donald has tried to do, but now you've seen the head in person and you have photographed it and you're putting it on TV. That will help to correct some of the erroneous information.
And this lady is a symbol of good luck, good fortune, and all of the success I've enjoyed in my life due to my relationship with Donald Trump. She goes with me everywhere I go except that one day I'm sure I'll have to give her to a museum.
(END VIDEO CLIP) WHITFIELD: All right. We'll have more from Louise Sunshine in the next hour. Thanks so much for being with me today in the Newsroom. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.
Much more straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Hello. You are in the CNN Newsroom. I'm Ana Cabrera, in for Poppy Harlow. Great to have you with me.
Donald Trump's unity effort may be hitting a roadblock today as Republicans try to wrangle their party together. Signs of fresh splinter that could rip the GOP apart.
I'm talking about a possible third-party candidate now entering the race.
The Washington Post reporting this morning Mitt Romney and a, quote, "band of exasperated Republicans are actively searching for an independent willing to challenge Trump.
[17:00:06] The only problem, no potential candidates are saying yes.
