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ANDERSON COOPER 360 DEGREES
Coverage of the Clashes outside a Trump rally in San Diego; Pro-Trump, Anti-Trump Groups Clash In San Diego; Police Trying To Disperse Protesters At Site Of Trump Rally; Police "Unlawful Assembly" Outside Site Of Trump Rally. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired May 27, 2016 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[20:00:08] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: Good evening, thanks for joining us. We begin with breaking news.
Clashes outside a Trump rally that just ended in San Diego. A heavy police presence, they declared it an unlawful gathering, reports of arrests, protesters throwing eggs. It has been a pretty scenes.
CNN's Paul Vercammen joins us now from San Diego.
What's the latest? What's been going on? We have been watching this now for the better part of an hour.
PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Anderson, I'm right off camera here. We are starting to see come spikes break out. And others are trying to make peace here as we see Trump supporters are on one side of the street and they are clashing with anti-Trump demonstrators on the other side. And now as you look off to my right, police with night sticks, helmets on, visors down are moving all of us down the street in San Diego, not far at all where the Trump rally was held earlier today. And now the police are getting very -- they're moving people off. We are obviously being pushed to the side. And we will give you a better perspective in a second when we settle.
But it got very tense and they declared this unlawful assembly, Anderson. And that's often a precursor to making arrests. And Jordan, if you can get down, you can look and see on the hips a lot of these officers on those plastic flexible handcuffs, they can be used those in an emergency to make arrests. There have been several arrests so far. But just as you came to us, they made this major move to try to separate as you saw these two groups that were throwing things at each other.
COOPER: So Paul, if you can, try to explain what we are seeing. We see a line of police officers obviously in riot gear on the left-hand side. We see some folks with looks like pro-Trump sign on the right. So you are saying they -- are the police now in between the two groups?
VERCAMMEN: Not completely. What happened was they did separate the two groups with a whole series of barricades, k -rails and all sorts of other riot police. At times they were hundreds of yards away. But as they spilled back onto the streets of San Diego, many of them, they to go to their cars, the anti-Trump demonstrators and people leading the Trump rally blended together.
And I should say there's quite a number of people who I don't think were part of either side and then just sort of showed up and got involved in this. So they are not completely between them now. As you look I front of me, Anderson, they're just sealing this part of the street.
But over there in the middle, you can see there is a blending. You see the anti-Trump signs far off in the distance, about 30 yards. And then right in front of me these are all Trump supporters. So they will indeed have to make a move at some point to again separate them. And they did earlier, but they just came back together again. So now they are trying to box this group in and declare this unlawful assembly and threaten with arrests.
I'm sorry, Anderson, it is hard to hear.
COOPER: No, no.
And Paul, earlier I was watching some of your video in the last hour on CNN and it looked like some objects were being thrown. I couldn't tell exactly what was being thrown and to what effect.
VERCAMMEN: Well, what we saw was mainly plastic bottles and some eggs. And in fact, I am going to have Jordan, my cameraman, show you what one of the targets was - excuse me. Jordan, go ahead and tilt up. They threw some eggs against this building right there. And I guess that's about the third floor, they were holding up Trump shirts and basically chanting and taunting some of the crowd below that was anti-Trump. So that was one of the targets.
And then they were just throwing things across the street right over here at each other. But I should note I did not see any major injuries in terms of somebody throwing let's say glass or a rock or anything heavy, not that there's a lot of that available right here, but once again you can look to the other side, Anderson, and the taunting is beginning once more.
COOPER: And so, is -- because the groups aren't necessarily separated at this point are you still seeing, we're seeing some people talking to the police and I'm not sure what they're saying. They are pointing at the police. But are there still arguments going on between pro and anti-Trump individuals?
VERCAMMEN: Yes, and a lot of shouting, a lot of pushing, a lot of shoving. But by the way this has been a rather calm moment right now as they set up this line of riot gear clad officers on both sides. They seem to be getting a little handle on it. It was much worse at let's say five minutes ago. But no doubt some of the pushing and shoving will start again.
As you can look in front of me, the people in front over there are wearing red Trump caps and they are being taunted. Their caps being pulled off, et cetera, as they move through. That's where we have seen skirmishes and some of the fights. They're throwing some water on some of the Trump people leaving as well. And obviously, riot police are trying to move everyone along here. They seem to be making a pencil-like move to go ahead and surround all these people. And I'm sure we're going to hear them issue, we have another arrest right in front of us, Anderson. And it is from the inside-out. It such a scrum. Sometimes it is hard to see what led to someone being detained. And we can't say in every single instance that somebody being detained is being arrested. I mean, there is a difference. Sometimes they grab somebody because they were swallowed by the crowd and they just want to get them out of there. But in this case you can hear them, chanting "let him go."
[20:05:51] COOPER: You talked about what's going on right before essentially we went on air. We have some of that video. And I just to call for that now just to give a sense and this was earlier. You probably can't see it, Paul. This is a wide shot taken from an overhead angle where you see sort of the size of crowds and you see some things being thrown. And looks like some people may be trying to calm others down. But it definitely seems like a tense scene.
VERCAMMEN: Great word, it is extremely tense. It went well for a long time today, by the way. There were peaceful protests. There was dancing on both sides. There were a lot of Trump supporters shouting their allegiance to Donald Trump. And there are a lot of Trump protesters who were basically decrying all of Trump's policies. And then as you said you could see people throwing things. What's going on now in front of us is these are Trump supporters and they're leaving and they are walking away and they being taunted by anti-Trump demonstrators.
And so the goal obviously right now for the police here in San Diego is to separate the two. And I should tell you, this is a tremendous show of force. All the blue uniformed officers or San Diego police, you might see way off in the distance, the green jacket officers are San Diego county sheriffs. They called in mutual aid from everywhere. There are of hundreds and hundreds of officers here and ready to suppress a riot if need. You can't see here, but we have seen them. They have those yellow or orange button bean bag guns. They're prepared to use those if they need it. We saw a SWAT vehicle off in the distance as well.
The goal right now is to calm tensions here. But as I said every time a Trump supporters walks through this gauntlet, of you will, they either get yelled at or they throw something at them. You can see the cap there, clearly on the Trump side, Anderson.
COOPER: Do now, those Trump supporters, are those people leaving the venue? Has the venue already cleared out? Because obviously that's always a concern when you have people who have been inside coming out. You mentioned they came out earlier. As far as you know, is the venue pretty much empty now?
VERCAMMEN: From what I can tell, yes. And as I told you, they went through great lengths to walk these people leaving the venue, at times several hundred yards away from the anti-Trump demonstrators. They have to go downstairs or around all sorts of metal mazes, and move around. But I think the trouble started here on the streets of San Diego when some of them had to walk to parking structures, often the distance right over there. There's not a baseball game tonight, but there's a lot of parking there. That's actually the San Diego Padre Petro Park. That's where they played the game. That's also where a lot of the parking is.
So, as these Trump supporters or attendees of the event left, then they couldn't help but sort of for lack of a better term rub shoulders with the anti-Trump demonstrators. And that's where the confrontations and the taunting, and the throwing things started. We have seen some punches thrown. But I also should tell you this, Anderson. To characterize it, we saw a guy take a swing, guy with a camera, and he looked like he had nothing to do with the protest. He looked like he was just a mentally deranged guy that walked into the middle of the scrum, decided to throw a punch.
COOPER: We are looking again now live pictures again from a different vantage point, Paul. Again, you can't see it. This is an overhead angle. Looks like some people with anti-Trump signs there. And there you see police moving in, again, forming new line or whether they are leaving. It is hard to tell. Look like they are trying to kind of solidify a new line of their positioning there.
Let's take a look. We have got some images from earlier where I think we see one of the sort of the confrontations that was going on. And again, Paul, I know you can't see this. You see something has been thrown. It looks like a number people though -- there's a lot of pushing, a lot of shoving, as people kind of yelling and arguing there on the left-hand side of the screen, people getting in each other's faces. In some cases trying to wait for something to happen, and then, of course, it does. There's pushing, some punches being thrown there.
Again, this occurred a short time before we went on air. Again, this is a scene that's been going on now for quite some time.
So Paul, what we are seeing is we are seeing - this this is earlier, one of the, I guess fights you could call it that took place, pushing and shoving. But it certainly seems to have calmed down. Again, now we're seeing this earlier shot. It looks like there were fort a lot of people egging people on, shouts being given, Paul, and then someone would throw a punch or push and it would escalate quickly and then dissipate. Is that about right?
[20:11:08] VERCAMMEN: Yes. That's a great characterization. In fact, you would hear some of the Trump supporters say let's build that wall. And then you would hear the anti-Trump demonstrators say tear down that wall. Then they would get nose to nose, start arguing with each other. And here is what's playing out right now, it is another cluster of Trump supporters leaving or walking this way as the police in riot gear walk behind them and they are now being taunted again by anti-Trump demonstrators. As I said, this is where they have been shoulder to shoulder walking away on the streets, and there are many, many shouting matches. There were a lot of insults thrown back and forth and we got some pushing and shoving going on.
Jordan, this way, please. Right over here, looks like a full on fight is breaking out now right now in front of me, Anderson. And there's peace makers in front. They have been trying to keep this from escalating. They are yelling all kinds of things, including "go home you redneck." This is just basically what's been going on. Some of the people are trying to lead. And they are being taunted. And you see the peace makers trying to get between them, some of them are actually anti-Trump supporters or in the protest, but want peaceful resolution to this.
COOPER: So there are actually people, you are saying, I know see one gentleman in a red shirt standing between what I imagine is a Trump supporter and some people who opposed to Trump who continue to follow this man as he is leaving. So there are people trying to kind of stand between the two sides.
VERCAMMEN: That's exactly right. We have seen a number of them break up what could break into a full-fledged fight by inserting themselves between basically a Trump supporter and clusters of that raid anti- Trump demonstrators. This is the challenge when these -- go ahead.
COOPER: I'm sorry, Paul. We should also point out our reporter from inside said the event said that the event is over itself. The venue is cleared. Donald Trump is actually we are told in the air. He is no longer even on the scene. And there, what we are watching if you are just joining us, there are Trump supporters who is basically being sort of continually followed by a group of I assume anti-Trump people. He is yelling at them. They seem to be yelling at him. There are people in between them trying to keep them apart. It is a chaotic scene.
It seems, Paul, from the vantage point now, an over the head shot, and I'm not sure where it is in relation to you, but we see that long police line on the left-hand side of the screen and what looks like a smaller group, it sort of basically hemmed in at least on two sides by police. Does it seem like the crowd itself is dissipating?
VERCAMMEN: Well, there trying to make it dissipate. That's for sure, Anderson. I was in that little, those the two rows just a second ago. And you know, every time I look around I see more and more law enforcement officers. As we told you before, these are San Diego sheriff's deputies helping out their partners in the city of San Diego because they didn't call a mutual aid. We see another group of officers in riot gear, there are federal agents on the ground as well. So they are calling in everybody possible to try to quell this and get this under control.
It's not been a situation where we had let's say mass lines of people running at each other or trying to get past barricades. It is just been those little skirmishes you see where someone is throwing something or someone starts pushing, that a punch or two is thrown. And then they are able to get people out.
So the next move I guess they make is try to sweep through here. And as I said, you could see here is another group of officers ready to get in the middle of these pushing, shoving, shouting and arguing crowds on both sides. And I think it bears repeating that we don't know they're all supporters for or anti-Trump. Some other people seem to have shown up and got in the middle of it. COOPER: Right. Some people are obviously sort of this is an
opportunity for some people who just want to get in the middle of something like this.
We will take a short break. Paul is going to continue be on scene. We will follow developments in San Diego in the hour ahead, talk to our panel about not only about what we are seeing but else what else is happening in the day of politics.
Also Hillary Clinton seen as untrustworthy by majority of voters in a number of poll. Trump's numbers on trustworthy issue are no better. Some cases worse. We are going to look at what's driving that opinion coming up next.
[20:19:19] COOPER: Well, we are continuing to monitor the tension and the clashes and you see in San Diego where Trump rally has ended where you see confrontations between pro and anti-Trump demonstrations broke out or at least venue participants. The venue has emptied out. Donald Trump has left the scenes entirely or at least you can see police, some others, and protesters by for and against Trump and others who are just kind of that wanted to be there are out on the streets.
So Paul Vercammen joins us once again.
Paul, just what is the latest on this? It looks like more police are starting to move in?
VERCAMMEN: That's right. And they are making a major move now. What they are doing is they are condensing the size of the rally. There were some people who were sitting down on the floor. And they basically crap them up and now they are moving away from that area where we saw the bottle, throwing plastic bottles, we should say, and eggs earlier. And you can tell they are using (INAUDIBLE) and what not to create a buffer between themselves and the members of the crowd and who are trying to get a sense for how far they want this crowd to move. I guess they are stopping right here.
Somewhat remarkable about all this is not far from here literally 20 yards behind me, Anderson. They have run a little red trolley which is, you know, transit to San Diego. I don't know how they have been able to do it all day, but they have. And I don't know if this move have anything to do with them possibly coming through here again if they decided to suspend running that trolley. But obviously, tensions right now between mainly right here, these are anti-Trump demonstrators and San Diego police in riot gear.
[20:20:54] COOPER: And Paul, you may not be able to have seen from your vantage point, looks like we saw at least two people we saw being cuffed and moved off the site. Not sure if they'll be formally arrested or just, I'm not sure exactly what is - but they are clearly being taken away. And they continue there to chant as he is taken away. You see that individual on the right-hand side. Do you know where, Paul, where those arrests are being made in
relation to where you are? Because we are seeing kind of two different screens here, one where arrests were being made from that kind of camera. There was look like an overhead scene. And that's we are seeing right now in the left more of the street level which I think is your camera.
VERCAMMEN: Right. So we are on street level. So what we see is we see people being taken away, some of them in those flexible white plastic handcuffs. Some of them not. Sometimes they taken somebody away. We are being moved again, Anderson. Hang on.
COOPER: Yes. You can see now this very playing going on both cameras, the police moving in in a coordinated way.
VERCAMMEN: They are making a major move.
COOPER: And is the idea on that just disperse the crowd, keep them moving, try to just encourage everybody to leave?
VERCAMMEN: Exactly. And also part of it was to separate the Trump supporters from anti-Trump demonstrators. And so, I think they're trying to move them all to one side. That's the direction that we are headed right now of the street and get them away from -- we are literally on these rail lines right now. So we will see where they have everybody stop. But as I told you several times in both English and Spanish they declared over bull horns this is an unlawful assembly, often precursor to arrests. OK, and they stopped right here as a next sort of move. They trying to shrink the area of where the protesters can stand. And not to our left, making another major move and they're getting support from agencies all over San Diego County.
And we're walking back best we can, Anderson as they are now pushing us toward the center where Trump spoke earlier today. We're now headed toward the ocean across the street by these group of officers who as I said got their riot helmets on, visors down, night sticks out making an aggressive move in the stand right here.
COOPER: And at this point, Paul, at least in the crowd that we are seeing, it appears to be more sort of anti-Trump demonstrators. It doesn't look like there's too many clashes within the groups of people. It looks like it is mostly now police moving folks who don't want to leave or who are slowly leaving. Are you seeing clashes between people?
VERCAMMEN: No, you're exactly right, Anderson. The people who are being moved with me and the camera I'm on now are pretty much all anti-Trump demonstrators. And you can hear some of the chanting whose streets, our streets. And they are being moved toward the convention center where Trump spoke.
We got to step right now. Hang on. Jordan, good job. We are walking backwards on the street obviously. I didn't want to see my cameraman go down. So now they are reforming closer to the convention center and it looks like this is where they're going to hold the line for now. COOPER: And Paul, I think it is always important and difficult
sometimes in a situation, particularly from ground level to get a sense of how many people we are talking about. As far as you can tell - I mean, from what I have been watching over, of course, the last hour or so, it seems like the groups were larger before, and maybe that is because they were more pro-Trump people as they were leaving the venue. It does seems like the group has gotten smaller, sort of more die hard people who are continuing the anti-Trump protests.
But can you get a sense of just the area we are looking at? Is this pretty much contained to just the area that we are seeing? I mean, is it all just one clump of people?
[20:25:27] VERCAMMEN: Well, what I'm going to do is I'm going to go ahead and walk over here, Anderson. I'm going to give you a better view. It does seems like it is contained. It definitely seems like there were a lot more demonstrators or protesters out here before.
Excuse me. We're going to cross through. And it seems as if they have a better handle on it. We definitely saw a lot more anti-Trump demonstrators. We definitely saw a lot more Trump supporters. And there is a little way for us to get up here, and give you a better glimpse of what's going on.
Here's another arrestee right in front of us. As things flare up, it is not easy to find out why someone is arrested. You will see a skirmish, a punch thrown, someone taken away. We can't even say if they were definitely anti-Trump or pro-Trump.
But Here's about the best vantage point of all this. If you look that way, there were hundreds more anti-Trump demonstrators out here on the street before. And then off in the distance we say about 200 yards at 1:00, that's where you saw us earlier. That's where you saw this extremely aggressive move by all of the police officers in riot gear.
Over this way about another 100 yards at let's say 11:00, those are all for the most part people who left the convention center and their Trump supporters. So they have effectively out. We were live cut these two groups off.
And then right here in front of us playing out again as the taunting that we have seen and heard all day, the anti-Trump group and Trump group going at it. And now you're seeing, looks like that train, believe it or not, I can't imagine they are going to doing this, but it might be coming through as the crossing guards are coming down. And maybe that's why they were so sure they wanted to break up that crowd and move through with the force you saw, Anderson.
COOPER: We're going to take another short break. But you can see on the right-hand side of the screen from the overhead shot just the numbers of law enforcement personnel who clearly have a strategy in place, clearly have, you know, clear lines of demarcation of where they want people to be and where they want people to go and how they want them to disburse. And they, you know, it seems very organized on the law enforcement side and the crowds are getting smaller. And I always think it is important to point that out so you get a sense that this is, you know, bigger than it may actually be.
We are going to take a short break. Coverage of this and the day in politics continues in a moment.
[20:32:03] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN AC360 ANCHOR: Just watching an arrest right before we came back on air. Part of a very large police presence right now on the streets in the area of the San Diego Convention Center. Scenes of a substantial apparently shrinking protest shortly after a Trump rally ended. Once again we're going to check in with CNN's Paul Vercammen at the scene, I understand police are making kind of another move, try to move this people along?
PAUL VERCAMMEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, a couple of things are happening here now. They made a big move, Anderson, and their trying to disburse this crowd. And then if we look over to our right, we can see a whole bunch of people who are running down the street, and I'm not sure if there's anything that touched that off, but they're sprinting that way, and then you've got a group of officers in right gear also running that way.
So, it seems like this entire protest is headed in a different direction and the crowd is -- seems so far successfully being disbursed. This is a far cry from what we saw earlier when you joined us and you saw that pushing and shoving and throwing of different objects. But it looks like they're going to go ahead and stand make those stand right here. And a lot of the crowd just sort of willfully ran down the street.
COOPER: All right, we'll continue to monitor that Paul, thank you very much for your coverage also for your crew, continue be careful. I want to bring in the panel as we continue look at this, let's bring New York 1 political anchor, Errol Louis who's covered Donald Trump for years, "New York Times" presidential campaign correspondent Maggie Haberman, Trump supporter Kayleigh McEnany, former Congressional black caucus executive director Angela Rye, and Republican strategist Susan Del Percio.
As we watch this, Kayleigh, I mean what do you make of what you're seeing?
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, first it's worth saying there's no place in political discourse for violence, that's just uncalled for, it should not be condoned, it should not be welcomed in any way, it should be dismissed.
That being said, you know, it's worth tracing where this began and I think Chicago back in mid march is where we saw protesters show up with the intent of shutting down a Trump event. Thereafter in many Trump events we've seen similar tasks in Albuquerque, New Mexico. You saw police windows being smashed out, you saw protesters setting fire to Trump memorabilia, in Costa Mesa, California, you had a young Trump who was bloodied, beaten down. I think it's a sad state when you can't attend a rally and peace without having personal smashed from your body, without witnessing, cars being smashed in front of you, I think we should be able to congregate in peace, protesting is fine, violence is not.
COOPER: We should also point out that, earlier during Trump rallies we did see police are (inaudible) today, but months ago individuals, fights inside Trump rallies and people being pushed around on frankly in both sides. Angela what do you see it from today?
ANGELA RYE, POLITICAL STRATEGIST: Couple of things, I mean I watched this scene and frankly got very emotional. I'm seeing this and I'm hearing some of the things that are yelled that, the reporter talked about someone yelling build that wall and some -- and other folks yelling tear down that wall. And I heard with my own ears someone yell go back to Mexico.
[20:35:03] And for me it is not about the fact that Donald Trump got or had protesters outside of his rallies and starting in Chicago, Kayleigh you mentioned. This is about the type of rhetoric that Donald Trump had espoused frankly since before he was a presidential candidate. And what you're seeing frankly are what happens when you refuse to listen to each other. What happens when nobody feels hurt, what happens when the oppressed gets tired of being oppressed? What happens when assumptions are made about people, there was a guy earlier who was wearing a t-shirt that said, I just look like an illegal immigrant.
And so if we take a step back from all of this and realize that this comes from a real place of misunderstanding, and pre-judging the fact that people can be called thug even though they're graduates with them, some of the most prestigious universities. It's frustrating to me and I think we have to remember just by day we're chanting at this rally, and I heard growing up, going to rallies and protest. I guess, the people united will never be defeated. And we have to stand united on something at some point.
COOPER: But Susan, do you think this helps Donald Trump in some ways, does it hurt Donald Trump?
SUSAN DEL PERCIO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: It hurts both sides of the issue. It hurts Donald Trump, it hurts the Democrats. This kind of discourse is bad for everybody. This is not one sided. This is -- when you look at it, both sides are engaging in it. What's really interesting to me is that it used to be in the days people used to rally outside an event, and then once the cameras got them, and they have people went into the event, they left, and everyone went home.
Now these folks are staying at these events to protest and argue against each other. It's not even unifying against the speaker, this is a very personal, deep feeling, a very frustrated angry people.
COOPER: Maggie, how do you see it?
MAGGIE HABERMAN, NEW YORK TIMES PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN CORRESPONDENT: I mean, I think that's right. I think that looking at this, I think you have to take Chicago as an isolated incident, I think you have to take this as an isolated incident, but you do have to look at a collection of protests and wonder what the Cleveland convention is going to be like, and that's what I keep thinking about. You know, Kayleigh said before that there's, you know, no place for violence. I don't think you heard the candidate who's being protest say that, and I that is going to be the push he is going to have repeatedly in the lead up to the convention is to, you know, make clear violence is not to be condoned, and to be clear, doesn't mean it shouldn't be condoned on the other side either. You saw somebody burning a Trump hat, that's not right either.
MCENANY: But at every people rally, he play the tape saying there's no place for violence, it's not permitted here. Donald Trump has dismissed violence more than anyone in this campaign.
COOPER: Well that that's ....
MCENANY: After the Chicago rally, he dismissed it 14 times on Don Lemon there after he just said 10 times already, he had dismissed violence. We have a societal problems ...
COOPER: He did early on ...
COOPER: ... but just for accuracy, I mean look, we all know, we all saw early on in his campaign him saying, you know, I'd like to punch that person ...
HABERMAN: The thing this person -- maybe this person deserved to get roughed up ...
HABERMAN: ... they're been a lot of it.
MCENANY: There were statements before violence started breaking out at this rally ...
HABERMAN: Kayleigh, I attend these rallies and I cover them, that's not just true ,so.
MCENANY: We have a societal problem if bigger than Donald Trump and it started in Ferguson when you saw buildings same burned down. We saw violence in Baltimore. There's been violence, it is not just Donald Trump rallies, there are people out there with an intention disrupt, they want to be seen, they want to be on camera, it's more than a candidate.
MCENANY: If they problem, that frankly is on the left ...
RYE: Kayleigh, do you really think that people are risking their lives just to be seen on camera?
MCENANY: I don't think anyone is risking their lives, because people are throwing punches are at Donald Trump supporters. We've seen -- I ...
MCENANY: I would love to see someone enumerate the number of times Donald Trump supporters engaged in violence, because I tried painstakingly on the internet to find this times. There have been three instances at rallies.
COOPER: One at a time.
DEL PRECIO: But no matter what happens, just the way it's perceived, is that this is a Donald Trump problem. And Donald Trump has to work hard around it. Whether or not it is true, it is definitely perceived that Donald Trump is the cause, that this people are protesting him and his policies.
COOPER: I know that everybody perceives -- I mean a lot of people perceive this, I mean to Kayleigh's point as these are people are trying to stop Donald Trump from being able to speak, you could oppose to Donald Trump, but again I'm not advocating that position. I'm just saying I don't know that everybody sees this. I mean I'm looking my Twitter right now.
DEL PRECIO: I should say it's spurred from Donald Trump. I mean this is someone -- it's his policies that are most ...
ERROL LOUIS, NY1 POLITICAL ANCHOR: It ends up attaching to him. I mean there have been 20 people who ran for president, and there isn't one other candidate that's consistently drawn this kind of a response. The images we're seeing here, the masked different sort of police forces, amid they have been very disciplined by the way in San Diego.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
LOUIS: Clearly they're trained, clearly they're professional, they're taking their time, nobody is going to falling out of the ranks and lashing out, or anything like that, but it's still what an awful image of how we pick the next leader of the free world, and its something that is going to be used in ads, and it's going to be used down the line to say that if you need a president who's going to bring the country together, this is not the guy.
[20:40:08] COOPER: Well I guess that was my question about who does this hurt most, I mean I assume some voters will see and think, wow, is this what we are in for, you know, up until the election or even after a Donald Trump becomes president, and others will see this as well, this makes them rally toward Donald Trump, because they feel this is unfair that he isn't being allowed or I mean is being allowed to speak, but people try to stop him.
HABERMAN: The protest against him I mean that's definitely a real issue and he absolutely has a right to speak at his rallies, and those protests being done, because that's the main, those are his main events, that's how he communicates with supporters.
And he absolutely has a right, and anyone would object to protesters, everyone does. The difference is that saying I'd like to punch them in the face, So I would pay the legal bills. And that is a difference and it does attach them as Errol said in a different way. I think what we saw with Trump throughout this week, just taking it away from tonight for a second. After Trump won the Indiana primary and the race ended much quicker than we all expected, no contested convention, he was suddenly the presumptive nominee.
We heard a lot about how views he was going to be more presidential in tone, he was going to shift. He clearly doesn't want to do that. He clearly likes, you know, how he won in the primary. And he is running in a lot of ways and Dan Balz wrote this in the "Washington Post", but it's accurate, he's running against the Republican brand. So he's borrowing that nomination that might help him appeal to Democrats but it might also turn off some Republican voters. We don't really know how this going to be play at.
COOPER: We got to take a quick break. We're going to continue this conservation as we continue to live coverage from San Diego when we come back.
COOPER: Welcome back, continue our live coverage. Protesters police on the streets in San Diego following a Trump rally at the convention center there some clashes, broke up, pushing and shoving there are some blows between anti-and pro-Trump forces. Police declaring gathering unlawful forming lines advancing on protesters dispersing many arresting some.
I want to bring in back our panel, also now joining the conversation is Basil Smikle, executive director of the New York state Democratic Party, he is a supporter of Hillary Clinton.
You know, as we continue to watch this and I really does seem to have been dissipating, so I think it's important to point that out, not make too much of it as a continuing on-going thing, although clearly the police as -- I think Paul Vercammen were saying have this very well in hand at this stage. Basil I mean, do you see this continuing at as and just escalating as we get closer to Election Day?
BASIL SMIKLE, POLITICAL CONSULTANT: I don't know about escalating, but definitely continuing. I think just listening to your panelists before i came out here. I do think there's high correlation between the language that he's used, the rhetoric that he's used, and the activity we're seeing on the street. I don't think the protesters want to be on camera, I don't think the protesters have a sense of entitlement. I think what they're sensing is that there is this attack on communities of color this could means a color, poor people.
[20:45:08] And I think this rhetoric which doesn't seem to be dissipating, this seems only to be getting stronger, is -- I think will promote of these type protests. I don't know if it will escalate. I personally don't want to see violence being done here, but these folks have a right to protest and I think you'll continue to see ...
COOPER: Or it's just for actors the second part of protesting is getting on camera approach. I mean, if you're protesting and no one is there to see it, I mean, it's like a tree falling in the forest.
So I mean, I've been in protests and I can tell you when you point a camera in some directions, there are people who want to get in front of that camera. I'm not saying all the people, I'm not -- I don't want to paint with a broad brush, but I don't ...
SMIKLE: I understand -- no, I totally understand what you're saying, but I want to underscore this isn't about vanity, this is about -- these are some real issues that I think folk -- have made folks very nervous.
I think Donald Trump has voice -- has given voice to a lot of folks with a lot of ideas and opinions that there are a lot of people that didn't think were still there in this country that I think are surprised to see it, and I think it's appropriate for people to come out and protest against him.
COOPER: I want Kayleigh to respond to that, but I just want to go quickly with Paul Vercammen, because Paul now, we just -- as we came back it looked like there was something of a scuffle and, again, it looks like police are now kind of continuing and I thought this is largely disbursed, but it does look like police are still continuing to try to move people along.
VERCAMMEN: Yes, they're moving people down. This is Harper Boulevard in San Diego and as you said, a little bit of a scuffle broke out just a short while ago and police at one point, you see he's dousing this gentleman's eyes, somebody shot pepper spray as they were trying to move people down the street.
Tempers flared between police and one of the protesters. And here's a woman who's getting very emotional over here as they move us around. Let me see if I can try to listen to what she's saying.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You know, that is OK for them to treat us like this? We are Americans. We are here. They cannot treat us like this. They cannot do this to us. I cannot believe this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now you're crying (inaudible).
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, don't hit him, dude. Let him go, don't hit him. Hey, don't hit him. You guys -- just let him ...
COOPER: OK, so again, now we're seeing -- OK, go ahead, Paul.
VERCAMMEN: There's been a couple of people who have been in the middle of standoffs all afternoon long and as I said, in some instances you can't definitely say they are Trump supporter or not a Trump supporter. Anyway, this gentleman has been in the middle of some things. He might be getting arrest him right now. In front of us there's a police take a run after him. We're going to head on down the street. It looks like he is being arrested.
Hang on, Anderson. We're being backed up. Go ahead.
COOPER: It does seem, I mean one of the tactics which obviously we've seen now and police are sort of been, I think kind of learning from other demonstrations is they do try to identify people who are continuing actors in these events and when I say actors, continually, you know, presents.
They try to identify people who may be spurring other people on or taking agitators or taking a larger role, you know, even a leadership role and move quickly, take them out, either arrest them or to detain them, and then reform their lives. And it seems like that's what we just witnessed.
VERCAMMEN: Absolutely, almost on cue, I said it looked like he had been in the middle of some of this crime that was a gentleman in the Lakers jersey and they did isolate him and you saw they went after him and tackled him because it looked like he was going to square off with another one of the demonstrators.
And again, a very aggressive move as they come down at Harvard Boulevard where near the ocean in San Diego and as we back we're trying not to trip over any of these various barricades that have been knocked over.
But, behind the police as well, you can see, Anderson, looks like armored personnel character -- carriers, excuse me. This is clearly. I think maybe one of their last moves as they get people away from the convention center which is often by left in the background.
And the crowd has spin out dramatically and now someone has thrown a plastic bottle at the officers that was off to my right. It didn't hit. We're going to go ahead and give you a pan now down the street and show you what sort of left of the disbursing crowd.
They're moving over here toward this bridge, also right up on top, officers on a pedestrian bridge keeping watch over all of this and we're down to less than 100 demonstrators in this area right now. And it was clear to me that there are probably at least 500 earlier.
These would mainly be anti-Trump demonstrators, but there are some Trump supporters mixed in and that's why I think they went ahead and arrested the gentleman, the Kobe Bryant jersey. He looked like he was going to square off with somebody else I said, Anderson.
[20:50:09] COOPER: Right, yeah he had a signs saying free speech area. All right, we'll continue to watch that, but it definitely seems to be, again, the police on the move in very organized fashion trying to disburse people. Kayleigh, I mean -- I want you to be able to, to respond before we went to that. MCENANY: Yeah, you know, I think it's problematic when you blame a candidate for the third party actions of others who cannot engage in civil discourse and instead opt to engage in violence. This is a problem when you have people coming with the intense of squelching speech because they believe less speech is better than more. Rather than engaging the issue. If they have a problem with the notion of building a wall, engage that idea, don't come and knock out police windows and cars, don't put the police lives in danger, don't put Trump supporters' lives in danger. Don't bloody your face of a Trump's supporter in California.
If you have a problem, yes by all means, show up, get your point across, but do not engage in violence.
SMIKIE: But I was ...
MCENANY: I've seen it repeatedly.
COOPER: Let him first.
SMIKLE: What If I can say -- I mean, first of all I said at the beginning, I don't condone violence. But what makes their speech less valid than his? That's the concern that I have, that it seems as though their speech is sort of attached to thuggery. I think, that's problematic because that's actually falls right into -- that actually falls right into exactly what Donald Trump is saying why they have a right ...
DEL PERCIO: But people going to Donald Trump rally have absolute rights to go there, to listen to be a partner and supporter.
COOPER: And to leave in peace, right?
DEL PERCIO: When they're -- I mean, this is a confrontation and as I was say, it takes two to tango. I mean, this is not just happening in a vacuum. It's not that these protesters to the Trump speeches are just showing up and not doing anything to, you know?
COOPER: They are engaging, right?
DEL PERCIO: They are engaging. The Trump supporters definitely have a right to be there, for every right that the protesters do. So this is -- a bigger problem is that now that discourse has become very into -- violence has been now accepted as a form of discourse or at least the pushing and shoving and in your face kind of conversation. And that's what makes this all so ugly.
RYE: I reject the notion that the pushing and shoving belongs to those protesters Donald Trump. I really do. And the protesters, the Donald Trump people are pushing back. I mean, it's back, but it's ... DEL PERCIO: No one side owns this. You'd be making a huge mistake to say one side or the other actually owns it.
RYE: I think that my point is that what exactly what I said at the beginning, and that is when folks are oppressed continue to feel as though they're not heard. This is what happen and when you have a candidate like Donald Trump who literary be little and the means, the opinions of those who are different, this is a result of that. I think that ...
COOPER: Susan I want you to respond, and we going to go to break.
DEL PERCIO: But at the same time don't forget the Donald Trump supporters, they are angry, they are frustrated. They feel that they haven't been heard. They are going to listen to someone who they support. Who they believe is representing them and representing their frustration and their anger too. They're not showing up. He has people showing up who have never been involved in the political process. And that's because they're mostly angry and frustrated and they're sick and tired of what they see in Washington and want somebody new.
COOPER: All right, we're going to take a quick break. I'm going to check again in -- with Paul Vercammen for an update on the situation in San Diego. We'll be right back.
[20:55:26] COOPER: Demonstrations and spreading clashes on the streets of San Diego, after Trump rally. Large numbers of anti-Trump protesters confronting Trump supporters, a heavy police trying to disperse the crowds that's how it look earlier on. Things have quieted down substantially.
Police kept a very tight lid on it and part by making arrests, using pepper spray at one point, you could see. Mainly relying on sheer numbers and organization, and pulling suspected hot heads out of the crowd before violent confrontations could actually take place.
Once again, we want to check with CNN Paul Vercammen who is at the scene now. Paul?
VERCAMMEN: Well, as you can see, they decided to make a stand here on -- this is the bridge going over Harvard Boulevard. Off in the distance, motorcycle officers and armor personnel carriers, they also have pepper spray handy just in case. They used a little bit of it earlier to disperse part of the crowd. It seems what they're going to do is go ahead and march them over this Harvard Boulevard bridge in San Diego. They've got a pretty good handle of things and as we've been discussing, Anderson. And every time, you come back in the crowd tense out a little bit more. And it has again, they've been yelling whose streets, our streets.
Anyway, Anderson, it's a lot calmer than it was before and the officers as we said are continuing to move them. What they'll do is. They'll yell, move forward, and then they'll all step in mass down the Harvard Boulevard here. And I also would like to give a shotout to my cameraman here, Anderson, Jordan Gazardo (ph) and producer my Jack Cannon (ph) and security for being steady and easy as you well. You know, they go through a lot on shoots like this to capture these images.
COOPER: Shooting much of it walking backwards, and being pushed around. So kuddos to them. No doubt about it.
We're going obviously continue to monitor this, Paul. As you see, the numbers drastically reduced. And now they're seems to be much sort of a younger crowd who are sticking with this. Being moved along by police but not wanting to fully go away. And we'll continue to monitor this throughout the evening. That does it though for us right now.
Thanks very much for watching. CNN Film "Blackfish" starts after a short break.