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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Trump Rally in California; Presidential Race; Antibiotic- Resistant Bacteria. Aired 12-12:30p ET

Aired May 27, 2016 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:00:00] ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Oakland, California. We are going to be bringing you her comments once she takes the stage. That's coming in our next hour.

And then also, take a look at the time clock, Donald Trump's going to hold the first of two of his rallies today. Also making his big West Coast push, Bernie Sanders. He's set to address voters about 2:00 this afternoon. Topping off the day is Mr. Trump with another rally, this one happening 5:00 p.m., San Diego. So, you've got a full calendar for TV watching today.

The presumptive GOP nominee is showing no signs of letting up, even after a milestone day when he actually did that clinch, the big one, the magic number, 1,237 delegates. So, it's official, that's the guy. As if you didn't already know it though.

Joining us now, CNN's Dan Simon, who's live outside of Donald Trump's first event of the day.

And I'm looking behind you. I can already see the protesters have started amassing. But what is that community expecting and how are they prepared to deal with it?

DAN SIMON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi, Ashleigh.

We are in front of (INAUDIBLE). This is where Donald Trump will be holding his event in just about an hour from now. You can see the protesters that have gathered. We're talking about dozens at this point, not hundreds. The crowds are smaller than what we've seen in other cities. The fact that this is a daytime event is giving hope to the Fresno Police Department that we won't see any violence. Then again, we did see some problems break out in the middle of the afternoon a couple of days ago in Anaheim. But this is how the chief talked about the preparations that are being made. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF JERRY DYER, FRESNO, CALIFORNIA POLICE DEPARTMENT: We have police officers that are fully equipped. If they need to come in and address the crowd should things get violent, they have the ability to move crowds. And we also have the ability to deploy chemical agents should we need to, but we don't anticipate it. But, again, we're - we're planning for that should the crowd get unruly. The main thing is making sure that at the onset, when we start to see any type of behavior that's going to be inciting a riot, that we remove those individuals. And we will. We're not going to tolerate violence in our city.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIMON: So the Fresno Police Department says they are fully prepared for any eventuality, Ashleigh.

In terms of the people that are here, we should point out that Fresno has a big migrant population from Mexico given the focus on the agriculture industry in the community. So, naturally, you are seeing people who are protesting Donald Trump's immigration proposals.

Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: Eek, I do not like to hear chemical agents, but I think I understand what he means and let's hope for the best that it doesn't get to that point.

Dan Simon, thank you for that in Fresno.

I want to break down the race with our panel. Scottie Neil Hughes is a radio commentator and also a Donald Trump supporter, Sally Kohn is a Bernie Sanders supporter and "Daily Beast" Columnist, and David Gergen is our senior political analyst and former advisor to four United States presidents.

So, as the senior among us in terms of politics, David Gergen, I am going to ask you this question. It's becoming evident, and "The Washington Post" reporting on it as well, that Donald Trump is focusing on a 15 state pathway to the electoral college win. And we've heard of these pathways before. Virginia's in there. Michigan's in there. Understand that. They're a battleground. But California and New York are among that list. And I want to ask you, who has been through many an election, if that is a Republican strategy that can work.

DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, first, Ashleigh, let me ask you a question. There is a picture of you on twenty - on Twitter that suggests you're in your '80s punk rock glory. Is that really you, Ashleigh Banfield?

BANFIELD: You're actually showing it. Thank God that - thank God your iPhone went blank. You iPhone went blank. I'm so glad.

GERGEN: Look at that picture.

BANFIELD: No, it's blank. David, nobody can see it. That's a good thing. That's a good thing. It does show you, though. This is my question. Oh, there he goes again. I am old and I've been through a bunch of elections and I know that the Republicans usually look at California and New York and say, look, you're not going to get those ones. Spend your money and your time to shore up the one you can get and then the one that you're not so sure you can get. So what about that strategy? I need to hear it from you, who knows more about politics than anyone.

GERGEN: Well, listen, I - I think that states like Michigan and Pennsylvania, of course he needs to go after those. And he - and he may well have a shot. I think he could have a shot in New York given that's his home base. I think it's doubtful. But, you know, he was thinking of running for governor of New York. So he's obviously taking a look at that.

I - California is the one that shocks because that seems so far beyond the capacity of any Republican to win now. You know, they look like they're going to have a Senate race down - out there that's going to come down to two Democrats running against each other. California was once a purple state. But from Bill Clinton on - Bill Clinton basically lived out there for a lot of his presidency, really brought it around. It's been a solid blue state now for a long time. Very hard to see how a Republican, like Trump, can win there.

[12:05:07] BANFIELD: All right, I want to move on to the e-mail issue, because that is going to be a struggle, an uphill battle throughout the next several months, I think, for Hillary Clinton. If we know Donald Trump's M.O. And she had to address this yesterday. In fact, I want you to hear what she said in a CNN interview about that very topic. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE (voice-over): Well, I thought it was allowed. I knew past secretaries of state used personal e-mail. Secretary Kerry did for a period of time until the rules were clarified. They were not a model of clarity and it seems like there's still more work to do on that. So, yes, I believed it was allowed, but that's not the point. I said it was a mistake.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Important word that she says, "I believed it was allowed," because now we come to know that there were actually standards and practices and policies that were put into place that said it wasn't necessarily allowed in the manner she says.

Sally, this is going to be an off repeated refrain and she followed it up by calling Donald Trump unqualified and a loose cannon, which I believe will be an off-repeated refrain. But which one's more powerful?

SALLY KOHN, SANDERS SUPPORTER: I mean, honestly, look, for the vast majority of voters, look, for people who have already made up their mind, this isn't - this is nothing new. People who already have reason to not like Hillary sort of are going to use the e-mail as their, you know, sort of tangible thing to attach their feelings to, and people who support her are going to continue to support her.

The issue is the people on the fence. And in all honesty, she made a mistake. It was stupid. It wasn't transparent. It was all of those things. Compare that to someone who knows absolutely nothing about foreign policy, has said he wants to bankrupt this country, wants to round up, detain and deport 11 million people and ban 30 percent of the world's population from coming to and participating in our country and our economy, this is kind of an easy choice when push comes to shove. And while the far right is making hay and will continue to make hay about this, you know, she - what that report made clear is, she didn't do anything illegal. Former secretaries of state had done it, including Colin Powell, who was not investigated. And this is - this still continues to be much ado about nothing compared to the real issues that are facing this country, that we need a president who knows what they're doing to deal with.

BANFIELD: I still want to get - I still want to get to those issues, and I seem like every day we're talking all of these other ancillary things in this race.

So, Scottie, I'm going to go to the Rubio story with you, if I can. Marco Rubio sat down with our Jake Tapper and he gave some comments, which we - I think a lot of people might find surprising. And I'm only going to set it up this way. This is the stuff that he was saying before he had the sit-down with Jake Tapper. So in the last few months, he called this a complete fiasco and carnival, what Donald Trump had made the primary process. He said he'd be selling watches in Manhattan if he hadn't inherited $200 million. He called him a con artist, Donald Trump. He also said Donald Trump has been the most vulgar person to ever aspire to the presidency. And now here comes the interview with Jake Tapper. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MARCO RUBIO (R), FLORIDA: My sense is I'm going to go to the convention.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: You are?

RUBIO: And I don't know if I'll have a role in the convention, but I have a lot of people going there that were supporters.

TAPPER: But if Donald Trump asked you to speak on his behalf, you would do so?

RUBIO: I mean I'd certainly - yes, I want to be helpful. I don't want to be harmful, because I don't want Hillary Clinton to be president.

TAPPER: Are you planning on releasing your delegates?

RUBIO: Yes, in fact, basically, technically, have already because Donald is going to have the majority number and the point will be relevant. So if we haven't done so already, we will.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So, I should also mention that Donald Trump followed that up with a tweet about Marco Rubio. Says, poll data shows @marcorubio does by far the best in holding on to his Senate seat in Florida. Important to keep the majority. Run, Marco."

So my question is, Scottie, is this a cold peace that is being forged and increasingly more and more people are forging peace it seems with Donald Trump, who heretofore had been the least likely candidates to forge a peace. And does that kind of peace work? A cold peace? Does that work or do you need a warm embrace to make the Republican Party move well?

SCOTTIE NEIL HUGHES, TRUMP SUPPORTER: No, I think it definitely does work. I think it was very classy what Senator Rubio did and it showed that he put the party over his own ego. We know this is a very bloody primary and the words said back and forth almost all the candidates, but especially between Mr. Trump and each of the different ones, definitely were some major daggers. But in the end, we realized, just like Marco Rubio points out in his interview with Jake, he says, I'm going to keep - I want to do everything I can to keep Hillary Clinton out of office because the mistakes she had make, they're not just small mistakes. They are absolute things that endanger our entire country, our national security and she's done that in the past and that just shows what her track record will be for the future. Most Republicans realize this, embrace it, see through the spin of a lot of her pundits and go, no, she really is a very dangerous person who has made some mistakes on purpose and just thinks that she is above the law and can get away with anything. That's why I think Marco Rubio is doing this.

[12:10:12] BANFIELD: Can I ask you one - I want to ask you one other question, Scottie, if I can. I was watching, you know, primetime television last night and I saw a lot of treatment of Donald Trump's comments at a news conference when he once again referred to Elizabeth Warren as Pocahontas. It's not the first time. He's done it many, many times. But this time someone in the audience, and, in fact, it was a reporter said, isn't that racist? And another reporter, who happens to be Native American Indian, did yell out, that is offensive. And a commentator said last night, if a CEO said that, he'd be fired. If anyone in an office said that, they might be fired. If a school principal saw that happening in class, somebody might actually be, you know, suspended. I just wonder if that kind of language is funny or appropriate in Donald Trump's book.

HUGHES: Well, what's interesting is what is - what is offensive is someone who claims to be Native American in order that she can get a gig at Harvard where she -

BANFIELD: Maybe. I don't disagree. I don't disagree with you.

HUGHES: And that's what she did. She lied. And let's hold her accountable for it.

BANFIELD: OK. I don't disagree with you there. But -

HUGHES: And so she brought this on herself.

BANFIELD: So is the name calling OK?

HUGHES: No. Well, when she's -

KOHN: No.

HUGHES: He's calling out the fact that she sat there and pretended that she was Native American in order to gain a minority position at Harvard.

BANFIELD: But we don't know yet. No, we don't know that it (INAUDIBLE) that, right?

HUGHES: No, no, it's been proven that - no, we - it has been proven time and time again that she actually lied and said that she was -

BANFIELD: And, again, I think the issue - the bigger issue, though, would a president say something like that? And I will also say this -

KOHN: I'm sorry -

BANFIELD: I will also add this. A commentator last night on CNN brought up another issue, that the word Pocahontas, when you're calling someone that name, is no different than calling someone who's African-American Aunt Jemima. And that is absolutely unacceptable. It is - it is unacceptable by American standards. So what is out of bounds for Donald Trump in terms of getting back at somebody for something he doesn't like?

HUGHES: Well, except for the fact that she's the one that lied about her position in the first place.

KOHN: Oh.

HUGHES: (INAUDIBLE) call somebody, though she's the one that said that she was the one of Indian descent. For some reason nobody's called her on that necessarily in this whole thing. And then she goes against Mr. Trump. He's only referring to her based on what she called herself. She's the one that offended the - no, she called herself an -

KOHN: Ah, no, she never used that word.

BANFIELD: Sally, quick comment on it, and then I want to get David to weigh in.

KOHN: I'm sorry, but this is someone who's running to be the president of the United States of America and the leader of the free world, who -

HUGHES: And she's a senator and she lied. She lied.

KOHN: Excuse me. Excuse me. Whose job would be among other many important jobs he's clearly unqualified for, to have relationships, trusted, respectful relationships with the Native American community in this country, which, by the way, we don't exactly have the prettiest history with. So it's one thing for him to - you know, this is Donald Trump. The bar is continually lower. Call her a liar, but insulting names? But the larger issue here is, what do - how do we have someone who's running for president who when someone attacks them substantively on the substance of his policies for working class people, for the housing market, for the economy, his response is insulting base, gutter snippy, personal attacks.

HUGHES: No, he's reminding people -

KOHN: That is not OK.

BANFIELD: You know what, I have to - guys, I'm running perilously low -

HUGHES: Why don't you go ask the Native American community how they felt when she lied?

BANFIELD: On time, but I want to get - I want to get David Gergen to just button that up and just give me a sense of this. Is this becoming sort of a normalization that this is just going to continue happening and we just have to sort of accept that name calling is OK because it's perceived as being - you know, it's a reaction to something else that happened?

GERGEN: Well, there's an old phrase by Daniel Patrick Moynihan about defining deviancy down. And I think this is sort of defining discourse down. Look, I think the first time he used Pocahontas was off the cuff in a telephone conversation with a reporter or something. And at that time it was funny. But to keep repeating it is offensive. I don't think it - I don't think it's any big, big deal. I mean talking about - do you think the - the e-mail controversy is much ado about nothing. This is much ado about very, very little. You know, there are far bigger issues at stake. He ought to get off it, of course. It does give offense to some people, but I don't think we ought to blow it up and say, oh my God, you know, I can't believe he would say that. I don't think a child would be suspended from school using that phrase, or using that name, for example.

BANFIELD: I have to -

GERGEN: But, overall, listen, I think the big thing is, Elizabeth Warren is emerging as a - as a major figure and as a major force in this race. It was all Bernie Sanders versus Hillary. It's not Elizabeth Warren versus Hillary. I think she can really help Hillary's campaign. But there is a growing possibility, many people are speculating, she could actually be on the ticket with Hillary. We'll wait and see.

BANFIELD: All right, David Gergen, thank you for that. Sally Kohn, as always.

GERGEN: Thank you.

BANFIELD: And Scottie Neil Hughes, appreciate all of your perspectives today. Thank you, guys, and enjoy your long weekend if you're so lucky to have Monday off.

And if you don't, I'll see you here on Monday. Thanks, guys. Appreciate it.

And we're going to continue watching what's going on outside of the Donald Trump rally in Fresno, California. These are the protesters that have shown up. We heard Dan Simon report earlier they were in the dozens, but they may be growing and the police have come and put a presence out and have said they're going to try their best to keep things - keep a lid on things.

[12:15:09] And inside you can see the warm-up acts have begun. Those who come to give speeches before Donald Trump addresses the Fresno crowd are already going. So we are minutes away from Donald Trump as well. Stay here. We are back live, Donald Trump's live at 1:00-ish. Fluid. Back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: For the first time, a rare superbug, one that cannot be killed by any antibiotics, has made its way to the United States. A 49-year-old Pennsylvania woman testing positive for this bacteria, which is a rare form of E.coli. Officials aren't saying how she got infected, but we do know that she has not traveled outside of the United States this year. And although this is the first superbug we've seen in this country, there are concerns that it just might not be the last.

Joining me now to talk about this is Dr. Anthony Fauci, who is the director of National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases at the National Institutes of Health.

Doctor, thank you so much for being with me.

Obviously the first question is, what do we do about this? She's one person, but she's not going to be the last.

[12:20:02] DR. ANTHONY FAUCI, DIR, NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF ALLERGY AND INFECTIOUS DISEASES: No, that's true. And the - and one of the issues that needs to be addressed is what we call good infection control. In other words, if this person is in a particular facility, a hospital, to make sure that the microbe, in this case an E. coli, that has this gene that's resistant to this last resort drug does not spread around. I mean we've known about this particular type of bacteria and this particular type of resistant gene for some time now. It's been present in China. It's been present in Canada. It's been present in certain European countries, in food and in people. But this is the first time that we've seen it here. And that's the reason why we've really got to keep our antennas up, watching out for it, because the very fact that it's in one person means almost certainly we're going to see it again.

BANFIELD: And I guess the concern for someone watching is, if I get it, and I can't get any antibiotics to treat it, what happens to me? I mean what - what effectively is the course of action for the people who contract this?

FAUCI: Well, first of all, you've got to understand what particular type of infection you get. I mean some people can be - have this microbe in them and not even get ill. But if you have a serious infection, an infection related to a surgical procedure, an infection related to a complication, for example, with chemotherapy and you wind up with this particular microbe that has this resistant gene, then you have a serious problem because you've essentially run out of antibiotics and that's one of the reasons why we've got to control it, but also have a very aggressive effort to develop alternative antibiotics that can then be used against this particular strain, which is a major effort that's undergoing right now to be able to do that.

BANFIELD: Yes, and that's my next question, where are we in the process? Are we close to finding, you know, solutions to these superbugs? Will we find something to combat this particular one?

FAUCI: I think we will, but we need to move quickly and we need to put a concerted effort. Over the last couple of years, there has been an effort to attack antibiotic resistance that has been essentially from the White House down, the president had an executive order and we've had an action plan now to put a considerable amount of effort into one controlling antibiotic resistance and developing new drugs to take the place of those drugs that are no longer useful. So we've seen an up surge in effort over the last couple of years in that direction.

BANFIELD: Well, I hope there is a great success and that it's sooner rather than later. Dr. Fauci, thank you for being with us. I appreciate it.

FAUCI: Good to be with you.

BANFIELD: Coming up next, President Obama did today what no other U.S. president has done before. He visited the site where the United States dropped a nuclear bomb in Japan, one of those sites. And coming up, what he said about this historic visit to Hiroshima and his touching moment with one of the survivors of that blast. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:27:07] BANFIELD: There's a lot of action on the campaign trail today and all of it seems to be California. This is Oakland. You can see Secretary Hillary Clinton on the left-hand side of your screen. This is something called a community discussion. Kind of a town hall diner-esque and she's going to be speaking a little bit throughout the day as well. So we'll tap in just as soon as we hear something from the secretary.

In the meantime, I want to take you to something that's making a lot of headlines for the images and for the moments that are being created. More than 70 years ago, the United States became the first and only country to use nuclear weapons in warfare when it dropped an atomic bomb on the Japanese city of Hiroshima during World War II. One hundred and forty thousand people were killed and much of Hiroshima was reduced to what you're seeing, rubble. Nagasaki was the next city to be hit. The images were much the same.

Today, President Obama became the first sitting U.S. president to visit Hiroshima. He did not apologize for that bombing, but instead he laid a wreath at the city's Peace Memorial Park and he looked toward a world without nuclear weapons.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Seventy-one years ago, on a bright, cloudless morning, death fell from the sky and the world was changed, and demonstrated that mankind possessed the means to destroy itself.

Why do we come to this place? To Hiroshima? We come to ponder a terrible force unleashed in a not so distant past. We come to mourn the dead. Their souls speak to us. And they ask us to look inward, to take stock of who we are, and what we might become.

Technological progress without an equivalent progress in human institutions can doom us.

[12:29:50] We may not be able to eliminate man's capacity to do evil. So nations and the alliances that we formed must possess the means to defend ourselves. But among those nations like my own that hold nuclear stockpiles, we must have the courage to escape the logic of fear and pursue a world without