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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

Trump Insider Says Nominee is "Jekyll and Hyde"; Trump On Judge Comments: "Get Over It"; Stanford Rape Survivor Says She Is "Uplifted" By Public Support; ESPN Host Outraged Over Stanford Rapist's Sentence; Father To Rapist's Father: "Brock Is Not The Victim"; White House: No Place For Campus Sexual Assault; Hero Grad Student Describes Catching Rapist. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired June 08, 2016 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[12:30:00] ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: You know, positionally, within the Republican, get those things like, you know, get over it to someone like the Speaker of the House, a significant, you know, position within the Republican Party.

I guess the question is, you alluded to it in the last segment, but the Republican Party needs to unify. I think we all agree that that's how you fight a campaign, but does he just not believe that?

BORIS EPSHTEYN, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: She does believe it of course. Now, first of all, as far as the...

BANFIELD: But then how do you say get over it?

EPSHTEYN: As far as a senior advisor goes without a name, I don't -- I'm not going to comment on it. I think that's very -- that's what's hurtful to campaigns. People who are leaking, people who will not be named as a source...

BANFIELD: OK, I'll agree with it.

EPSHTEYN: ... or going out and shooting off the mouth. So, that's a problem. Now substantively, listen, he is his own man. He's not being controlled by anyone on the campaign. He is making the decisions and that's why he's going to be the right person to run the country unlike Hillary Clinton who'll have a conference call of 30 people.

BANFIELD: But you're not answering the question. Does Donald believe that unity in the Republican Party is critical in order for the Republicans to win against Hillary Clinton or does Donald Trump believes I can fly by the seat of my pants and do this on my own. Let Donald be Donald because I'm winning this far. I will win it in November.

EPSHTEYN: Donald Trump believes that the party should be unified. It has to be unified and he's doing everything he can to do it. Now, speak...

BANFIELD: But does he thing it's necessary? EPSHTEYN: The speaker of -- it's necessary. It will be helpful, but can he now -- can he win without Speaker Ryan? Of course, he can. But Speaker Ryan is still endorsing him. And can he win without Secretary (inaudible), of course he can

BANFIELD: OK. You named two and I'm just -- I just said this off the top of the show, in the last 24 hours-ish, we have Nevada Governor Brian Sandoval, we got Tennessee Senator Bob Corker, we got South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham saying, if you're looking for an off- ramp, you got it...

(CROSSTALK)

BANFIELD: The senate majority leader is no small position either Mitch McConnell. It's time to quit attacking various people that you've competed with. House Speaker Paul Ryan, Illinois Senator Mark Kirk, Tom Ridge, first Homeland Security Secretary Susan Collins, has not just one or two.

EPSHTEYN: I'll seat here and I'll name names on the other side. I'll name Chris Christie. I'll name Sessions. I'll name Newt Gingrich.

BANFIELD: One hundred percent, I defer to you on that but that is not unity.

EPSHTEYN: But here's what I'm saying. It is important to have unity of these top people you're talking about but most important is the voters. How many voters do you think are going to change their mind because Lindsey Graham who supported Jed Bush said he would never support Ted Cruz then flip-flopped and supported Ted Cruz. And now, he doesn't like Donald Trump. How people do you think are going to change their vote because of Lindsey Graham? Very few, very few. The voters are what matters.

BANFIELD: What if those Sanders supporters that he's reaching out to do hear this?

EPSHTEYN: One-fourth of Sanders' supporters have already said they're open to crossing party lines.

BANFIELD: Open to but what if this affects them?

EPSHTEYN: In fact, Lindsey Graham is not going to affect them. They're open to it because of Donald Trump is, because of who Donald Trump is.

BANFIELD: All right. Mitch McConnell. Well, these are very respectable -- don't tell me these aren't very respectable. It figures the American politics and culture.

EPSHTEYN: They are but congressional poll rating is 20%. So, let's not forget that. This is a man, Donald Trump running for president, running to change Washington, not to keep Washington as is. And some of these folks in the Republican Party will hear one thing and they running off to the mountains, scared now, should not be doing so and should be unifying. Because some of the Republicans, they'll say we need unity and then to go on bash on Donald Trump at the same time, that's hypocrisy and it's worst.

BANFIELD: You know what? It keeps us watching because I am dying to find out what the next Donald Trump appearance is going to look like, it could look like last night or it will continue to be these, you know, rattling moments.

EPSHTEYN: The campaign is going to be a combination and it's going to be a success because of that.

BANFIELD: It's great to have you Boris Epshteyn as always. We appreciate it.

EPSHTEYN: Thanks so much.

BANFIELD: I want to take you to our other big story we have been following this week.

The outrage over a convicted rapist getting only six months in jail, the survivor's eloquent letter read in court and then on this program. And next, I'm talking to co-host of ESP "Mike & Mike" about his incredible reaction to this case.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE GOLIC, CO-HOST, "MIKE & MIKE": Does Brock's father or this judge understand there was a woman assaulted in this?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:38:18] BANFIELD: The survivor in the Stanford rape case still wants to remain anonymous, but you should know that she has shared some thoughts with me.

In fact, she let us know that she was indeed watching on the day that I read her statement live on television, and that she heard every single word and this is the message that she sent to me via the prosecutor, quote, "Watching her speak my every word floored me, uplifted me, gave me new energy. I was in a trance and my heart was humming."

She has a lot of people in her corner from all background, from all walks of life, all demographics and one is Mike Golic who's the co- host of "Mike & Mike" who used his ESPN platform to express his outrage.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOLIC: In his quote from the judge, "A prison sentence would have a severe impact on him. I think he will not be a danger to others." Oh, do you? Do you? You got that from him. You got that from Brock, did you, that he won't be a danger to other and you think prison might be too harsh for him?

Do you see what he did, judge? The girl was unconscious next to a dumpster and if it wasn't for two guys riding by in their bikes who stopped it, God knows what would have happened to this young lady. Does Brock's father or this judge understand there was a woman assaulted in this? At all?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Mike Golic joins me live.

Now, Mike thanks so much for being with me. I was very moved by your reaction and I couldn't help thinking this is not the kind of thing that a sports program typically would tackle and it sure doesn't usually elicit that kind of a response.

[12:40:09] I want you to bring me to your feelings and your thoughts.

GOLIC: Well, you're right, normally, it doesn't. And by the way, your reading of the young lady's comment was incredible as well. It was something else.

As far as our show getting involved in that, unfortunately, Ashleigh, we had another situation now at Baylor where the President Ken Starr and the AD Ian McCaw, head football coach Art Briles all don't have a job anymore because of the culture that we're finding out that was going on with Baylor and sexual assault.

In this situation, I just couldn't understand. You would know more than I the legalities of the judge going from what could have been a 14-year sentence to the recommendation for the prosecution of a six- year to six-month, I know listening to the probation officers in this. But to say that it would be too severe impact, isn't that what we're supposed to do when you do something as heinous as he did? Last I checked, three felony counts of sexual assault. Isn't that what we do? We punish for that.

And also, make the punishment severe enough so that when we don't think about doing it again. It's two-fold and in this case, it's no fold. So that aggravated me and then the father, and I'm a father of three. And one is a daughter who just graduated from college. And so I understand the love of a father for your child, but I was appalled at Dan Turner, Brock's father, his letter. Not one time did he mention her. All we read about was how he can't eat anymore. Brock can't eat. Brock can't sleep. Brock's life has changed. Guess who else's life has changed?

Brock was the cause and this young lady is the effect of what happened. And I was just blown away that her, she wasn't brought up at all in any of this. It was all about Brock, (inaudible) from the sentencing. Brock, his life is going to change now. OK. But Brock did this. And he still won't neglect to doing this even though he was convicted but Brock did this and well on its way to ruining a young lady's life. And i was just stunned that there was no mention of this at all and I come from the world of the sport's world, Ashleigh. Time and time again where we do see the rich at times privileged athlete or privileged family get leniency in situations as well and we deal with what's their effect when that person would get back on the field or the court or the ice or whatever the situation may be, but this one just struck me as a complete thoughtlessness of the victim in this situation.

BANFIELD: Let me ask you this about the father, Dan Turner also has a daughter. I mean, Brock is not his only child, he's got a daughter. He has come out in the last 24 hours with a clarification of his statement because it went viral as well. The 20 minutes of action comment. And this is what he said, Mike. He said, "My words have been misinterpreted by people. What I meant with that comment is a 20-minute period of time. I was not referring to sexual activity by the word action. It was unfortunate choice of words and I did not mean to be disrespectful and offensive to anyone."

And just to be completely crystal clear, the way this works is you write your statement, you submit it to the court and through approval of this character reference, you then can stand in open court and assert your right to deliver a character statement so is not an off- hand comment. It was written. It must have been approved by a lawyer, I assume, should have been, and it was read in open court. Does this mitigate at all the father's comments that he has done this recharacterization?

GOLIC: No, not one bit for me. Listen, the 20 minutes of action I know was the highlighted line from his letter. But quite honestly, I'm looking at the full letter. I'm looking at the explanation of how Brock can't eat his favorite food or can't sleep anymore or even at the end of the letter, how the father was trying to say, not only, you know, should Brock not be punished for this, jail time, but he can help society now by going out and speaking to other colleges which maybe he can down the line, but he should be punished first.

And I'm just amazed that the daughter to this man and any woman involved in Dan Turner's life could read that letter and not just twinge a little bit in the gut almost saying really, you know, where's any mention, any mention at all of the victim in this of the other life that was ruined or maybe on the way to being ruined in this? So no. Him saying he was misrepresented in that line, that's just one line of the whole letter that I basically shook my head almost all the way through.

BANFIELD: Yes. And I should also let people know of the geographics of a courtroom. He was delivering these remarks probably just feet from where she was sitting.

[12:45:00] Mike Golic, thank you for bringing this up on your program. Thank you for talking about it on my program. I think the more this gets out, the bigger a platform for mothers, fathers, and everyone to discuss the critical nature of consent and when you cannot get consent and it is critical because kids might not know and they need to. Thank you, Mike.

GOLIC: You're welcome. Thank you.

BANFIELD: Coming up next, words from one father to another father. My next guest wrote a very powerful letter with a line including like this, "We do not get kudos for only raping one person in our lifetime. I don't believe your son is a monster but he acted like one and that needs to be accounted for. And there is much more. Find out what and hear from him next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: There is another letter on the Stanford rape case that is going viral right now and this time, it is from a dad. And it is to Brock Turner's dad. John Pavlovitz is a pastor from Raleigh, North Carolina, and he posted the letter on his blog. And I want you to listen for a moment to some of the things he has said in this case.

[12:50:06] "I need you to understand something, and I say this as a father who dearly loves my son as much as you must love yours. Brock is not the victim here. His victim is the victim. She is the wounded one. He is the damager. If his life has been deeply altered, it is because he has horribly altered another human being, because he made a reprehensible choice to take advantage of someone for his own pleasure.

Pastor John Pavlovitz joins me live now from North Carolina. Thank you, pastor, for being with us right now.

I wanted to ask you what prompted you to write this letter and if you expected to get the platform you're now getting.

JOHN PAVLOVITZ, PASTOR, BLOGGER: Well, Ashleigh, I've been a local church pastor for the past 19 years and I've seen the way we silence people when crimes like this are committed, where we ascribe blame to victims and the way we remove culpability from assailants.

And as a father, as a husband, as a pastor and really as a member of humanity, I didn't feel like I could be silent in the face of this. I wanted to speak into it and allow conversation to happen that was productive.

BANFIELD: Your words have really resonated. It resonated with me and they are certainly resonating with a lot of readers online right now.

The father in Brock's case, Dan Turner, you can understand as a father yourself, I can't imagine being in that terrible position, but juxtapose that with your writings about being that person at that moment and read for me what you said about that.

PAVLOVITZ: I understand you trying to humanize your son in your letter talking to the judge about his favorite snacks and swim practice and about the memories that are sweet for you as his father but to be honest, I don't give a damn and if his victim was your daughter, I'm quite sure you wouldn't either.

I imagine this young woman had favorite snacks and sports too and parents who have wonderful plans for her that didn't include this nightmare. There is no scenario where your son should be the sympathetic figure here. He is the assailant, he is the rapist. I can't imagine as a father how gut wrenching that reality that is for you, but it is true.

BANFIELD: So pastor, do you suspect that the demographics that have universally been reached by this story, by her letter, by your letter, by the facts of the case, the details, by the sentence, do you suspect we may be at a cultural turning point where parents everywhere have the critical conversations with their sons and their daughters about what it means to give consent and that you cannot get consent if the other party has been drinking too much?

PAVLOVITZ: Yes, I think for me, people asking me, you know, what can we do on college campuses to change this and for me, it's a hard issue, it's helping, you know, challenging young men to see the inherent dignity of women and to really ask them to be accountable for their actions and to make other men accountable. It's really about seeing the inherent value of other people. And so for me, that's where I need this to happen. I want men to be looking in the mirror and looking at other men and asking them to do better.

BANFIELD: Pastor, one last quick question. If you had a chance to counsel Brock, what would you say to him?

PAVLOVITZ: I'd say that this isn't the sum total of your life, but this is a part of your life and you need to make something happen with this, with the platform you have now. You have to show other men where you went wrong and you have to show them that women matter and that the victims of sexual assault need to be the ones who receive the encouragement and the support and they need the wholeness.

BANFIELD: Pastor Pavlovitz, thank you so much for your time. Thank you writing your letter. And thank you for your thoughts.

PAVLOVITZ: Thank you, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: This story, by the way, has made it all the way to the White House. Press Secretary Josh Earnest was asked specifically about this case yesterday and this is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The president believes strongly that sexual assault is wrong, that there is no place for it in our military. There's no place for it on college campuses. There's no place for it in our society.

And the president and the vice president have played a leading role in the It's On Us campaign to not just speak out against the scourge of sexual assault, but also to encourage men and women across the country to not shirk from their responsibility to intervene when the risk of sexual assault is heightened. That it's on us, as Americans, as active members of our community to protect one another and to look out for one another and where necessary to intervene to stop a sexual assault.

[12:55:09] BANFIELD: Very fitting because that is what two Stanford grad students did. Two brave men from Sweden who while biking saw the unthinkable and did, in fact, intervene.

Carl-Fredrik Arndt is one of those cyclists and spoke to NBC about the events of that horrible night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CARL-FREDRIK ARNDT, BICYCLIST WHO FOUND RAPE VICTIM: We saw a couple which seemed OK at first and then when we look closer, we just started noticing later she wasn't moving then stopped. Basically talked about what to do, we started to approach her and started to ask what was going on. And after he stood up, we saw she wasn't moving at all. So I talk to him briefly and then he started running away.

My friend Peter ran after and caught him on. I attended to her quickly then basically we stayed until the police came.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: As has been echoed by so many, thank God for the heroes.

Thank you so much for walking Legal View today. Wolf starts right after this quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)