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European Investors Head for Safe Havens; Polls Show "Leave" Campaign Gaining Ground; Cambridge VC: Funding to Suffer Under Brexit; German Government Bond: Negative Territory for First Time; Volatility of U.S. Stocks Hits 4-month High; Obama Rips Trump Over Orlando Shooting Reaction; France: Killing of Couple an Act of Terrorism; Russia Could be Tossed From Euro 2016; Many U.K. Scientist Fear Loss of EU Funding. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired June 14, 2016 - 16:00:00   ET


[16:05:00] 16:00:00] RICHARD QUEST, CNN ANCHOR: Dow Jones is closing in New York. The market bell is ringing. It is another down day in New York. A

variety of reasons why the market is down. We'll discuss most of them, perhaps the most important, significant one. That is a very wimpy gavel.

From the New York stock exchange. That brings trading to a close. It's Tuesday, it's June the 14th.

Tonight, Britain's biggest newspaper says it's time to leave the European Union. The Vice Chancellor of Cambridge University says they're living in

Alice in Wonderland. For some Britons that are looking for exit, investors they're looking for safe havens. And President Obama takes on terror and

Trump in a blistering speech at the U.S. Treasury. I'm Richard Quest, you joined me live tonight in Cambridge, in England. We're at the famous

university to gauge the mood, to gauge the measure amongst these ancient treasures. I'm Richard Quest. I mean business.

Good evening tonight from Cambridge. I'll bring you an update on the terror attacks in Orlando and in France later in this hour. But tonight, as we

start a special week of coverage, moving throughout the United Kingdom and looking at the effects gauging the mood and taking the temperature.

Whichever cliche to say you want to look at you want to look at, we're all about Brexit on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS this week or at least to give a

nonpolitical more neutral phrase, we are looking at the EU referendum that will decide whether or not the U.K. will leave Europe.

First tonight, though, markets are falling and bond yields are turning negative. From the pinnacles of Kings Cottage Cambridge to the palace of

Westminster, there is deep anxiety that Britain is primed to leave the European Union. All this week, we're touring the country in search of the

voices on both sides of the debate. I think that clock at King's College might be a little bit late. It's after 9:00 but it's chiming just now.

This is our vehicle of choice, as we wend our merry way across on our trip. It is Freddy Brexit, a 1978 Bedford camper van, chosen specifically because

it was designed and built in the decade and era when the U.K. joined the European Union. A little later in the hour, I will show you inside Freddy

Brexit. Tonight, the campaign to get Britain out of the EU is gaining steam but nine days to go before Britons cast their vote. A new TNS poll shows a

7-point lead for the "Leave" campaign. That follows a trend in recent weeks and if you look at -- that's the Remain 40, Leave 47 and 13 Undecideds.

[16:05:00] This is one of the most extraordinary perhaps developments of the past 24 hours. Britain's top-selling newspaper, sells more than 2

million, it is "The Sun." "Believe in Britain." It's jumped on board the Brexit bandwagon. On its front page, if I just basically say to you,

"Throughout the 43-year membership of the European Union, the EU has proven increasing greedy, wasteful, bullying and breathtakingly incompetent in a

crisis." Keith Vaz is joining me, he is the chairman of the Home Affairs Select Committee and Labour member of parliament. I delighted to see that

you dressed for the occasion for QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. it is the May balls, isn't it?

KEITH VAZ, CHAIRMAN, UK HOME AFFAIRS SELECT COMMITTEE: It is, yes. And I've come to my old college where I was at the time of the last referendum.

QUEST: Which College?

VAZ: Keys.

QUEST: Oh, you are at Keys College.

VAZ: Just up there. The best in Cambridge.

QUEST: I think we might have a bit of a disagreement from those who are here. Do you recognize this description from "The Sun"? Increasingly

greedy, wasteful, bullying and breathtakingly incompetent in a crisis. You were Britain's Europe Minister. Do you recognize that description?

VAZ: I don't. But I'm not surprised that "The Sun" is saying this. Because Richard, they have always had this view that Britain should come out of the

EU. So I'm not surprised at the headline. I'm very surprised at the poll. I didn't expect us to be behind by 7 percent a week before the country votes.

So that is a bit of a shock to me. And I think what it means is that people need to redouble their efforts in order to get out and vote next Thursday.

QUEST: The truth is, though, the way in which the "Leave" campaign has picked up steam has taken everybody perhaps by surprise. Particularly the

"Remain" campaign, which, frankly, does seem somewhat shambolic.

VAZ: Well is not shambolic it's just because --

QUEST: It is not -- it is not connecting with people. People are not going to vote "Remain" out of some passion.

VAZ: Well, that's true but we didn't have Freddy. Maybe if we had Freddy instead of the red buses that we have had it might have had a different

result. But I think what it reminds us of the need for the political parties to come together. At the moment, with the "Remain" campaign, we

have the prime minister leading the "Remain campaign. We have the Labour Party with their own campaign and Scottish nationalists doing their own in

Scotland. So we all need to come together. This headline and the poll will unite us over these next seven days.

QUEST: Why do you --

VAZ: And make is work harder.

QUEST: Why do you believe this will unite you to a "Remain" and not embolden a "Leave"? Why will this be a rallying call to your side and not a

magnet for others?

VAZ: Because until now I think people took it for granted that the British people will vote to remain. I certainly wanted a referendum. I was one of

the very few members of my party that wanted a referendum. I was perhaps a little complacent that everyone would want to stay in because it's better

to stay in. Without us making the arguments. What we need to say is to stay in the European Union, but it is capable of reform. Obviously, "The Sun"

has gone a little over the top in the way in which it's described the EU. There are probables with the EU, so I'm for staying in. But I'm for making

sure that the EU is reformed. Reform doesn't just shop on the 23rd of June. After all --

QUEST: All right. I think that we can all agree, reasonable men and women can agree, that in the last 48 hours, 72 hours, whatever you want to say,

this has turned dangerously, dangerous if you like, for the "Leave" side. Sorry, for the "Remain" side. You've got a lot of work to do.

VAZ: We do. And it starts tomorrow because there's a very important debate in the House of Commons tomorrow led by the Labour Party. And that is when

we should come up with a very big majority in support of staying in. It's the first time we've discussed Europe for some time on a motion. So

tomorrow night you should tune in to the vote at 7:00, and we'll have a very, very big all-party majority for staying in.

QUEST: Sir, thank you. Thank you for raising the elegance of the program this evening. And enjoy --

VAZ: Shall I leave this with you or maybe put it on Freddy?

QUEST: You really like Freddy.

VAZ: I do, yes.

QUEST: I'll give you a ride in it next time. Good to see you. Thank you very much, thank you.

Now we're at Cambridge University and we are looking at the way in which the university's academia and the whole question is being viewed. The vice

chancellor of Cambridge tells me that a Brexit would be a disaster and the supporters are living in an Alice in Wonderland.

[16:10:00] Leszek is the university's top academic administrative official. Although they have this weird thing in Cambridge and in Oxford where the

colleges seem to rule the roost, it's actually the university that's responsible for 20,000 students. And the vice chancellor was born to Polish

parents in a Welsh immigrant town. In 2001, he was knighted for his valuable vaccine research. Cambridge is largest institution benefiting from

the EU. Speaking to me in his beautiful ancient office, Leszek said a Brexit would make scientific research more difficult. He disputed --

particularly bearing in mind these headlines -- the "Leave" campaign's claim that funding levels for universities would not be cut.


LESZEK BORYSIEWICZ, VICE CHANCELLOR, UNIVERSITY OF CAMBRIDGE: Well, if the Brexiteers learn to do basic mathematics in terms of the numbers they

usually quote I might have had more faith in them. They seemed to have spent the money five or six times over. Anybody in higher education or

research does not really believe there's going to be much left over for this particular section, for the particular aspects of research and higher


QUEST: Is your argument mainly one of finance?

BORYSIEWICZ: Definitely not. Look, we can get finance as a top international university. We can -- we will almost certainly find a way of

bringing significant finances back. But you could remember what EU funding really funds. At the European Union money funds major collaborations on

global challenging areas. Allows us to work easily together easily with colleagues from Switzerland, from anywhere in the -- on the continent of

Europe. And it's those collaborations that will result in new treatments for cancer, attempts at getting at dementia, major international programs

and projects. That's what really counts.

QUEST: The argument is it's bigger than this though. I mean, it's bigger almost then the economic argument which has been brought forward by

treasury, Bank of England, the IMF. It is bigger than the academic argument. The "Leave" campaign goes on with sovereignty, democracy. The

opportunity for Britain to go its own way. You don't go with this?

BORYSIEWICZ: Definitely not. What is sovereignty, is if you end up having to export to markets or engage in research that is actually about different

regulatory systems, when you're not at the table helping to establish what those regulatory systems are, and you still going to have to comply to the

regulations if you're going to be exporting to that market? Secondly, when you're doing research you will still engage with research as a partner to

some of those institutions. The intellectual property then will not come back to the United Kingdom as it does today, it will remain with the EU

partner states.

QUEST: How fearful are you about this vote? If the polls are right, it is too close to call but, of course, it does look as if "Leave" might be eking

out a small within margin of error majority?

BORYSIEWICZ: Well, from my point of view, I think it's little short of disastrous. At the end of the day, the idea of remaining in from the point

of view of academic institutions, of science and of research, it's basically the only show in town. It's why even most people are usually

saying about 80 percent to 85 percent of academics are really behind remaining in the European Union.

QUEST: So, those that aren't, what are they seeing that you're not, sir?

BORYSIEWICZ: Well, I think they're seeing an Alice in Wonderland world as if often promoted by the Brexiteers that actually I would rather look at a

world that's a reality for my children, my grandchildren, for the future instead of a world where they can't even to this day, actually describe

what that world looks like. So I'm afraid I vote and look at what is the reality rather than what looks like a pie in the sky.

QUEST: This place will survive whatever happens.

BORYSIEWICZ: Absolutely. But at the end of the day there's a question of between surviving in difficult circumstances and surviving being able to

move forward as rapidly as we are moving forward at the end of the day to be not only one of Europe's major centers for economic growth in the whole

of Europe, but actually utilizing the research that we have got to find new cures if dementia, for cancer, for real things that matter to real people

in order to enable us to use the intellectual property to drive economic growth in a region such as Cambridge, which is probably the biggest area of

economic growth in the whole of the European Union today. That's what I want to keep maintaining. And not to see us falling backwards and stumbling

over ourselves, with a lurching into a very uncertain tomorrow using the same words I used previously, an Alice in Wonderland world where nothing is

certain, nobody knows where anything is going. Putting frankly, as far as I'm concerned, the whole of the academic community of our leadership in

research and academic work at risk for the future for a completely unknown set of goals.


[16:15:00] QUEST: Leszek Borysiewicz is the vice chancellor here at Cambridge University. So you've heard from the politician. You've heard

from if you like the top man at the university. Now let's actually hear from the students at Cambridge.

Alex Rice, graduated in 2015 with a degree in anthropology and archaeology. Alex, you are firmly to "Leave." Marc Christian Jansen is a Dutch PhD

business student and would like to "Remain." Priscilla Mensah is the president of the students' union. Your job to represent all Cambridge

students, many of whom from the EU and to promote student engagement. I'll start with you, Madame President. The decision, I mean, you're firmly in

the "Remain" camp both as the representative, as the president, and personally. And yet, the votes or the polls seem to be against you at the

moment, don't they?

PERCILLA MENSAH, PRESIDENT, CAMBRIDGE UNIVERSITY STUDENTS' UNION: I wouldn't say that. I think students are on either side of the debate. We've

seen engagement on both sides of the debate and for us it's about encouraging student's engagement of the issues. And particularly student-

based issues like teaching and research. And so trying to promote students actually getting registered is first concern and also going to vote in the


QUEST: Mark, why are you "Remain"?

MARC CHRISTIAN JANSEN, DUTCH PHD BUSINESS STUDENT: Well, I'm not eligible to vote, first of all.

QUEST: If you were. Even better. Even better. We've got somebody that can't even vote, but never mind.

JANSEN: So why I think it's important to remain is that I'm one of many international students here in Cambridge depending on funding, depending on

research exchange with the rest of Europe and at this moment I still have a couple of months to go and if we were to leave the EU, I don't know what

would happen to my status as a student. And not at all clear how this might affect future relationships between countries of mostly international

students within the University of Cambridge.

QUEST: Alex, it's not by intention that we have taken a "Leave" and sandwiched you between two "Remains". But I think it's fair to say that

under the -- amongst students and certainly here at university you are probably in a minority.

ALEX RICE, ANTHROPOLOGY AND ARCHAEOLOGY GRADUATE: That's true and I think students more than capable of looking outside of university as you say.

Your graduating in a few moments, as are you. It's hardly surprising that Brexit is making gains. It looks hired and been told by elites they know

what to do. Especially when you got Keith Vaz coming in in the black tie. It's easy to make the antiestablishment case then.

QUEST: Why -- right. Surely a university like Cambridge is much better off and your future arguably is much better off with a "Remain".

RICE: No. I don't think that's true at all. Firstly, I come to this from a left wing point of view. I see the EU as a neoliberal organization. What I

see being pushed at the moment isn't socially progressive projects. It seems like TPP. So that's why I'm --

QUEST: That's the Trans-Pacific Partnership trade agreement.

RICE: It is, yes.

QUEST: So you on the other hand see this completely differently. You believe that it is crucial for students to be within.

MENSAH: Well, for me, it is about ensuring that, you know -- by what the university gets from the EU. The university seems to get a million euros in

funding from the EU every year, and this of course impacts its research. And so those are the kinds of facts that we bring to the debate when

thinking about the referendum.

QUEST: Thank you very much for joining us. Good to hear. Good to see you. Thank you very much. I suppose we will find what -- we'll find out in the

days ahead what the vote will be. Are you going to any May balls?

RICE: We are my band will one tonight. It's sports team and it'll be Keyes. So I'll see Keith Vaz.

Enjoy the May balls. Are you dressed properly?

RICE: No, he'll change. Somewhere there, so I can't play down to figuring in white tie I'm afraid.

QUEST: Excellent. Thank you very much, indeed. Nice to see you. Now, we are covering all kinds of this debate on QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. Later in the

hour, you will hear from the "Leave" side. The scientist, Vicar Matt Ridley, will be joining me on the program to put this in to perspective.

[16:20:00] So at any given moment you'll hear perhaps one side more than the other. But over the totality of the coverage, I promise you it will be

balanced. Uncertainly over the possible Brexit is sending investors looking for safe havens. That resulted in a milestone for German government bonds.

Clare Sebastian has been getting very excited about government bonds in Germany. Why?

CLARE SEBASTIAN CNN MONEY REPORTING: Well, Richard, were talking here about a flight to safety. It's not just German government bonds, but of course,

this is the most dramatic part of the story today. You can see it dropped below -- the 10-year bond drop below 0 percent for the first time in

history today. That means Richard, that we effectively live in a world people have to pay the German government for the privilege of lending them

money for ten years. It's a topsy-turvy world any way you look at it. You may think it sounds ridiculous, but that it's the level of uncertainty out

there on the market today. That of course accelerated by those polls in the U.K. showing momentum for the "Leave" campaign.

It is not just in Germany. Here in the U.S., the 10-year treasury is the yield is falling. As you can see, it's around 1.6 percent right now. That

is hovering near its lowest points for the year. The last time it was there and February, when of course as you remember, U.S. stocks and stocks in

fact around the world sharing a large degree of turmoil. So that, of course, you know, the selloff in government bonds are a real part of the

story at the moment. The rally in government bonds, a major part of the story at the moment. People looking for safety and as we know the vanguard

in terms of a flight to safety is gold. Gold prices rise with uncertainty out there. They have come up around 5 percent just in the month of June.

Twenty-one percent over the course of this year. And we so we have the flight to safety here, these three things.

But I want to show you another part of the story here, Richard. We've got the VIX INDEX, that is a measure of volatility in the S&P 500 and that you

can see spiking over the course of this month. It's up around 50 percent in June alone. Just showing the level of volatility. The level of uncertainty

out there. It is not as high as -- just in case you thought the world might be ending here, it's not as high as it was in February. It's certainly not

as high as it was back in August. When as you remember, we saw those dramatic falls in U.S. stocks over worries about China. It is not just the

EU referendum in the U.K. causing the concern. China still a worry, the level of debt over there. The IMF again warning today that they need to do

more to accelerate reforms. But they see, Richard, topsy-turvy world we live in, lenders paying borrowers. We've got bonds rallying around the

world and Britain voting next week on whether it should remain in the European Union.

QUEST: And I expect you, Clare, during the course of our week to keep reporting on exactly how those markets are performing, Clare Sebastian

Throughout the course of the week, we are at Cambridge University tonight, but throughout the course of the week we will be traveling the country.

When we come back after the break, it's a war of words in the aftermath of the mass killing in Orlando. President Obama with perhaps a sharpest attack

on the presumptive Republican nominee Donald Trump. Among other things, calling him dangerous. It's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. We're in Cambridge in



[16:25:15] QUEST: Welcome back, QUEST MEANS BUSINESS. President Obama had harsh words for Donald Trump in the wake of the massacre in Orlando. Trump

originally criticized the president for not using the words radical Islamic terrorism. To describe the attack. But Mr. Obama said calling a threat by

another name does not make it go away.


BARACK OBAMA, U.S. PRESIDENT: There's no magic to the phrase radical Islam. It's political talking point. It's not a strategy.


QUEST: CNN's White House correspondent Michelle Kosinski joins me now from the White House. Michelle, listening to the president and now putting it in

the wider context, I mean, he's walking a very delicate line but he is campaigning.

MICHELLE KOSINSKI, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: yes, absolutely. I mean, I don't think he's going to make any bones about this anymore. And the

White House was asked about that directly, too. He made this speech that was supposed to be about countering ISIS extremely political. I mean, when

you look at it, about half of it on countering the Republican rhetoric. It was almost as if this had been building up for a long time.

Donald Trump had a pretty fiery speech this week and then the president decided to just sort of let loose with what he's wanting to say on this in

this speech. It was very blunt. He's alluded to these things before. He's explained very calmly why he doesn't say the three words, radical Islamic

terrorism. But this time he was head on. He confronted this to the point about the very words that his critics say he refuses to say. And, you know,

at times he was almost ridiculing what his critics are believing. But I think you can sort of look at this in two ways, because as much as the

president was dismissing what his rivals are saying, the president devoted about half of his speech to what they're saying.

So clearly he feels it's important. And when we asked the White House today, why did he even do this? What did he expect to accomplish by

countering that rhetoric here in this setting when it was really supposed to be more about, you know, what the administration is doing? They said,

they feel the debate is very important and that we can't remake the mistakes that we have made in the past out of fear.

QUEST: Is there a feeling, do you think, yet that the argument, the policy, the whole responsibility for dealing with this is now shifting away from

President Obama? I hesitate to use the phrase lame duck but that he is a bit player, if you like, as Secretary Clinton and Donald Trump now battle

this issue out.

KOSINSKI: Yes, you can feel that. You can feel it even in the way he looks forward in a lot of addresses he gives lately. He almost sets that tone at

times while he's speaking. Still talks about what his administration is actively doing. I mean, in no way to convey that he's a lame duck. But he

is looking forward to the next administration. He and the Clinton campaign are obviously trying to align closely. But that said it's been interesting

in the past couple of days, to see how Clinton is willing to frame some of these exact same arguments, and what she's willing to say. I mean, it

almost does seem ridiculous to be talking for such a listening time and depth about whether or not to use certain words. I mean, at this point, it

seems like a moot point. She will say it. She was asked will you use those words? She said she's happy to and not really about the words. And also in

her attacks on Donald Trump, she is naming Donald Trump while the president isn't. So he's sort of remaining in many cases a sort of step away from the

harsh political action and then Hillary Clinton taking on the mantle, mirroring the president's words in many ways, but then a step further.

QUEST: Michelle, we'll talk much more about this as it's hottest and nastier from conventions to general election in the weeks ahead. Michelle

Kosinski, who is at the White House this evening. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS continues. We have a chosen a wonderful week to be in Cambridge. It is May

week when the balls, all the parties take place. And our vehicle of choice for traveling this wonderful land is Freddy. There's Freddy Brexit. It is a

1978 camper van and we will be showing you later the delights inside a trusty steed.

[16:30:00] QUEST MEANS BUSINESS we're live in Cambridge.


QUEST: Hello. I'm Richard Quest in Cambridge in England and there's more QUEST MEANS BUSINESS in just a moment. When the master of Churchill College

tells me why she's terrified of a Brexit. We'll have that story. And I'm going to give you a tour of Freddy, the EU referendum camper van that's got

to get me around the country for the next week. It's only about 40 odd years old, but it's doing grand service. And for all of that this is CNN.

And on this network the news always comes first.

A survivor of the Orlando terror attack says the gunman went from body to body making sure his victims were dead. Angel Colon was shot multiple times

before being rescued. Speaking earlier today, he described the first moments of the attack.


ANGEL COLON, SURVIVOR OF ORLANDO ATTACK: I was shot about three times in my leg. So I had fallen down. I tried to get back up. But everyone started

running everywhere. I got trampled over. And I shattered and broke my bones on my left leg. So by this time I couldn't walk at all. All I could do was

just lay down there and everyone while everyone was just running on top of me trying to get to where they had to be.


QUEST: Meanwhile, president Obama's has delivered a forceful statement about the U.S. response to terror and criticized Donald Trump's proposed

ban on Muslin immigrants. The president said the proposal would violate the principles of American democracy and harm U.S. security.


OBAMA: We don't have religious tests here. Our founders, our constitution, our bill of rights are clear about that. And if we ever abandon those

values, we would not only make it a lot easier to radicalize people here and around the world, but we would have betrayed the very things we are

trying to protect. (END VIDEO CLIP)

QUEST: The man who pledged allegiance to ISIS killed has killed a police officer and his partner at their home in France. Officials are calling it

an act of terrorism. A SWAT team nearly killed the attacker and rescued the couple's 3-year-old child. The killer posted video of the murder scene on

Facebook, and threatened the Euro 2016 football tournament.

[16:35:00] More violence by Russian football fans could lead to their being kicked out or the team being kicked out of Euro 2016. Russia was given a

suspended squad disqualification. It means if there's a repeat of last Saturday's trouble in the stands, the squad will be tossed from the euro

2016 tournament.

On the pitch, a major upset in the opening round of group F. Hungary beat Austria 2-0. And right now Portugal and Iceland are tied 1-1 late in the

second half.

Returning to the terror attacks in France, and the man who killed a French police officer and his partner threatened the Euro 2016 football

championship under way in France. In a Facebook video, Larossi Abballa, said the tournament will look like a cemetery. Melissa Bell, the

International Correspondent at France 24. Melissa is live with us from Paris. Samuel Burke is in San Francisco at the NASDAQ entrepreneurial

center. Melissa, I want to start with you. This was to some extent the nightmare scenario for Euro 2016 that authorities had warned against.

Obviously what happened with the police officer and the partner was serious, but does it represent a systemic threat, if you like, to the


MELISSA BELL, INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT, FRANCE 24: Well, insofar as it's represents a systemic failure of security services, Richard, yes. Once

again, just as when we looked at the terror attacks of November 13th, here's a man who had been arrested, who'd been kept under suspicion --

under surveillance, I'm sorry -- who'd been with the French called -- like a number of suspects in November 13th attacks who was being actively

watched by French security services. And so you have to wonder how they can pretend to be ensuring the security of a country when even the people they

identified as being dangerous, even the people who have been sentenced to three years in jail, they're not able to keep sufficiently close eye on, to

make sure that this kind of tragedy does not occur again. So yes, in the sense that there is a systemic failure of security services once again.

Only six months after November 13th, there is a serious danger here in France, of course.

QUEST: Samuel Burke in San Francisco, it is inevitable, is it not, that somebody does something like this, posts it either live or recorded on

Facebook, and then you have to wait for Facebook to respond once the complaints start arriving to take it down.

SAMUEL BURKE, CNN MONEY BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT: And I want to just make that distinction, Richard. He didn't just post it, he broadcasted this live

on Facebook. And in other words there was no delay or little to no delay between what he was doing, the aftermath of the attack and the people

seeing it on Facebook. Now, that's social network has taken down the video and taken down his page. And a spokesperson tells us the following, "We are

working closely with the French authorities as they deal with this terrible crime. Terrorism and acts of terrorism have no place on Facebook. Whenever

terrorist content is reported we remove it as quickly as possible. We treat take-down requests by law enforcement with the highest urgency." But to

your point, Richard, they depend on the community. People like you and me to flag it up to them and then they take it down. Of course, by that time

it's too late. It's already been broadcasted.

QUEST: Melissa in Paris, this attack is the worst nightmare of the authorities in this case. Is there a feeling in Paris or in France as this

competition goes ahead that the authorities are on top of, if you like, the security threat or are they behind? Are they playing catch up?

BELL: You have this remarkable situation, Richard, where you have all of these football fans milling around the streets of Paris and there are

thousands, tens of thousands of them here. You can feel it on the streets. They're everywhere, dressed in the national colors. There is this festive

atmosphere as a result. But all of them all the time, looking over the shoulder, because of what went on here just six months ago. What the French

authorities were expecting, what they were fearing was what the head of France's security services talked about in front of parliament, just a few

weeks ago, that France is the number one target -- they believe, French Security Services that is -- for terrorist groups including the Islamic

state organization and what they were fearing the kind of terrorist attack where someone walks into a crowded place -- and of course there are a

number of them around France whenever a match is broadcast live in an open space all night -- they would be targeted by terrorists.

[16:40:00] That hasn't happened so far and you can see by the police presence around the streets of Paris, that's what they're looking for. This

is almost worse. Going into someone's house, taking them hostage, killing them in that most barbaric way, you get the sense that no one is safe. How

could the police possibly keep an eye on the house of every single policeman in France? In a sense, this attack almost adds the sense of

insecurity even though it was not at all what authorities had been fearing.

QUEST: Finally, to Samuel in San Francisco, Samuel, the long and short of it, I don't care whether it's Periscope, whether it's Twitter, whether it's

Facebook, any form of streaming social media site simply what more can they do?

BURKE: It's incredible to think just what we have seen in the past month, Richard, an alleged rape, live streamed on Periscope. We've seen a suicide,

pardon me, first one was Facebook. We have seen a suicide on Periscope and now this attack or the aftermath of it on Facebook. It's quite interesting

because here in Silicon Valley, Richard, this is the talk of the town. The advancement with live stream, how they could take over big media

corporations, because so many people are using this. And then on the flip side, Richard, what I hear from expert after expert is that this could

become the new normal. People imitating other attacks, whether a lone wolf or some with ISIS. They're afraid of people duplicating the content online


QUEST: And arguably some would say it is inevitable. Samuel Burke is in San Francisco. Melissa is in Paris for us tonight. Both of you, thank you very

much, indeed.

We are in Cambridge and this is one of the stories that absolutely rocked the whole Brexit question. "The Sun" newspaper says, "Believe in Britain."

The largest selling newspaper coming out in favor of the U.K. leaving the European Union. At the same time as the polls showing a gain, a solidifying

gain for the "Leave" campaign. We are in Cambridge tonight, a university town. Famous university town after the break you'll hear the students,

you'll hear the academics and you'll hear how they are terrified about losing hard earned European cash. This is King's College Cambridge.


QUEST: We are in the university town of Cambridge where they are concerned about losing vast amounts of European funding if the country votes to leave

the EU. Well, your funding is safe. That's the "Leave" campaign's response to a group of scientists and Nobel laureates, all who fear that a Brexit

would be a commercial and financial disaster for the scientific research in Britain.

[16:45:00] The concern is that vital financial support from the EU would evaporate if Britain leaves. 13 pro-Brexit ministers published an open

letter. The letter said, "There is more than enough money to ensure that those who now get funding from the EU will continue to do so while also

ensuring that we can save money that can be spent on our priorities." The problem is the universities don't necessarily agree. The students are

worried. And put it altogether and you have the sleepy world of academia something of a furor.


QUEST (voice-over): Eighty kilometers north of London is Cambridge. One of the world's best known university towns, here at this ancient academic

institution, Isaac Newton, Charles Darwin and Lord Byron pondered the great issues of their day.

EDDIE IZZARD, COMEDIAN: I don't know if you know the figures but 75 percent of the people are positive about Europe. Interesting isn't it.

QUEST: Now it's the turn of the comedian, Eddie Izard, to urge students at the prestigious student's union to make their voices heard on the biggest

issue facing Britain today. The vote on membership of the European Union.

IZZARD: I'm here talking to young people to put forward the ideas and our ideas are more complicated. Our ideas are saying, yes, we are proud to be

British. We're proud to be U.K. citizens, but also, we like to look out and say, well, who are you? Are you French or German, you Italian? And what do

you do? Can we learn from you? Can you learn from us? Well, let's keep working on it. Let's keep seeing what we can do. We're trying to head

forward and put out our hands, rather than pull back, put up a wall and put up our fists. That's more negative viewpoint. I'm going out there --

QUEST: For these students, born and brought up over the decades of Britain's EU membership, they're being asked to help make a decision about

a totally different future.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE STUDENT: On the economic if we leave it will definitely be damaged and seems to leave on a powerful economic union.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE STUDENT: Being a student and being somebody who studied economics, looking to go into the financial services sector, putting more

benefits to remain.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE STUDENT: I'm a Eurosceptic and I believe that economically the case is stronger on the political face.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE STUDENT: I'm basically "Leave" because I think that we need democratic control in this country.

QUEST: The university, too, has a lot at stake. Nearly a quarter of Cambridge University's research budget comes from the EU. Dame Athene

Donald, is professor of experimental physics and master of Churchill College at the university. She's one of 150 scientists who signed a letter

expressing grave concern for the future of the U.K.'s universities in science.

DAME ATHENE DONALD, MASTER OF CHURCHILL COLLEGE, CAMBRIDGE UNIVERSITY: I'm terrified that we will leave. I really am. Because I think the knock-on

effect could be just catastrophic and unimaginable for probably the whole of Europe.

QUEST (on camera): What is your fundamental fear here?

DONALD: My fundamental fear is that science in the U.K. is fantastically strong. We often rated only second to the U.S. despite the size of the

country. And we get a very substantial part of our funding from the EU. And in terms of what the government itself puts in, the -- we're rather load on

the "Leave" table.

QUEST: If the vote is to leave, I mean, the argument of the other side would be, well, the U.K. government will have more money that it's not

putting into Europe, therefore, it can make up the shortfall.

DONALD: Indeed, that is the argument the Brexiteers make. But there is no evidence that is what they would do. The government has made the right

noises about science, but it isn't really investing. Why should we believe that they will suddenly change their policy and up the level of funding and

research just because we've come out of the EU?

QUEST: King's College Cambridge founded in 1441 by King Henry VI. It is the prospect of losing large sums of money from EU grants and funding that's

created this sense of almost panic amongst academic institutions, whether of ancient origin like Cambridge or newer institutions. The reality is that

for universities and colleges like Kings, having survived for centuries, they're now facing perhaps the biggest threat right to the bottom line.

[16:50:00] Cambridge, the university, and the cluster of companies that have built up around it, is closest thing Europe has to Silicon Valley.

With more than 1,500 tech companies employing over 60,000 people, there's little doubt that Cambridge stands to suffer if the U.K. leaves.


QUEST: Vicar Matt Ridley is a scientist and the author of "The Rational Optimist", how prosperity evolves. He's a member of the House of Lords.

He's supporting the "Leave" campaign and His Lordship joins me now live from Newcastle. Lord Ridley, the reality is you've heard the arguments and

we have heard them on this program. One, there isn't going to be enough money to go around bearing in mind the promises that have been made from

the "Leave" campaign. Do you accept that there will be a shortfall in cash?

MATT RIDLEY, MEMBER OF THE HOUSE OF LORDS: Not at all. Because when you look into this European funding, it's comes mainly from something call

Horizon 20/20. That is a program open to non-EU European countries. In fact, non-European countries, as well. So for example, there are 15

countries that are part of the program like Tunisia, Israel, Turkey, Armenia, Georgia, Iceland, Norway, Switzerland. These countries all

participate in this program and there's no reason that Britain couldn't if it was outside the EU. It would go on completely as before. It would simply

go on contributing to this program and getting money from this program.

QUEST: But their argument, of course, is also, again, you're familiar that there wouldn't be the -- it would be more difficult to get visas for

European academics who wish to come into the country. What is a simple process of creating collaboration would become infinitely more difficult.

We've heard it said tonight from the vice chancellor of Cambridge University.

RIDLEY: No. What the truth is that at the moment there's real crisis in British universities, because they are in a global marketplace. Cambridge

is as Dame Athene Donald, quite rightly said, one of the great universities in the world, and it's competing with universities in America and China and

elsewhere. And at the moment it's hard to get visas for talented people coming in from elsewhere in the world. Now, why is that true? Because

Britain's having to crack down on non-EU migration and can't limit EU migration. In fact, those cluster companies that you mentioned outside

Cambridge, they really need to have access to global talent just as Silicon Valley does, because 90 percent of the STEM graduates in the world in 2030

are going to be outside the EU. So actually by leaving we would improve our access to talent elsewhere in the world.

QUEST: Right. But, Lord Ridley, the upshot is finding an academic who takes the "Leave" position like yourself, perhaps is the exception. Finding an

academic who takes the "Remain" position -- I have to shout, who's for "Remain" and come out the woodwork.

RIDLEY: Yes, and that's because people are under the misapprehension the Horizon 20/20 program, and others like it, depend on being in the European

Union. And that's simply not true. I'm afraid there is a lot of misinformation going on in universities at the moment about this position.

And it really does need to be corrected.

QUEST: Thank you, sir. Thank you very much, indeed, your Lordship, for joining us. We appreciate it from Newcastle this evening.

Freddy the Brexit debate bus and I are on the front lines of the referendum debate. We'll show you where we're headed and the salubrious establishment

of vehicular travel we will be enjoying. QUEST MEANS BUSINESS.


[16:56:04] QUEST: Welcome back. Let me now show you the delights of our Freddy Brexit bus, U.K. In or Out? #drivewithquest. That's where I'd like

help and join me throughout all of this. And come on in and have a -- let me tell you where we're going to be going. We are first of all here in

Cambridge tonight. On Wednesday we are going to be in Boston at a camp site. Thursday we will be in the delights of Stoke-on-Trent. And on Friday

we will be up in Liverpool looking at that famous city.

This is what we have for you in terms of the Brexit bus, where I will be visiting. This is a vehicle that was designed in the 1970s and has since

been constructed -- well you can see we have kettles. Come on in and enjoy the view. There's plenty of room to sleep. If you choose top at the top.

The table comes down. There's a stove. There's a sink. There's eating and we have one or two little souvenirs that will help make the way along as we

continue. It's the Brexit bus that we'll be following throughout. And if you happen to be on the way, well, I promise you there will be one night or

two that I'm actually going to sleep in this. 1978, the same decade that we joined or that the U.K. joined the European Union. I'll have a Profitable

Moment after the break.



[17:00:00] QUEST: Tonight's Profitable Moment from Cambridge. There is something deliciously British about punting up the River Cam while it's

pouring down with rain. For the academic institutions, the universities like Cambridge, there really is deep, serious concern that if Brexit wins

they'll be badly out of pocket. But it's more than just money. They say the collaborative effort which often follows the funds will also disappear. And

the students, who are paying tens of thousands of pounds to go to top institutions, fear they will have limited job prospects. The university

argument is pretty much universally against Brexit. But it is only one aspect of this larger debate that we'll be following throughout the course

of the week. For the moment, the universities are firmly "Remain".


Ah, a Profitable Moment and the delights of modern travel. That's QUEST MEANS BUSINESS for this Tuesday night. I'm Richard Quest in the Brexit van

in Cambridge. Whatever you're up to in the hours ahead, I hope it's profitable. I'll see you in the campsite tomorrow.