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Olympic Fears; FBI Interviews Hillary Clinton; Terror Overseas. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired July 04, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

RICHARD ROTH, CNN SENIOR U.N. CORRESPONDENT: In 2008, Wiesel and his foundation learned they were among the victims of financial schemer Bernard Madoff.

Wiesel always said he was a writer and a teacher. He said he never spoke for all the Holocaust victims, but serves to remind nations to not let it happen again.

ELIE WIESEL, NOBEL PRIZE WINNER AND HOLOCAUST SURVIVOR: As a teacher, I always believe in questions.

The question is, will the world ever learn?

Thank you.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: And we continue on. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

We have got breaking news for you here at the top of the hour, this wave of terror attacks overseas. Let's talk Saudi Arabia first and foremost, multiple explosions across three cities there, two blasts hitting near a Shia mosque in Saudi Arabia's eastern city of Qatif. A third suicide bomb detonating close to a security headquarters where the Prophet Mohammed is buried in the city of Medina.

These blasts coming after that explosion near the U.S. Consulate in the Saudi city of Jeddah. To be clear, ISIS has not claimed responsibility for the attacks in Saudi Arabia, but they do follow a wave of attacks from that terror group around the world here making good on their pledge to step up these attacks during the Muslim holy month of Ramadan.

In Baghdad, a suicide truck bomb has ripped through a Baghdad neighborhood. That is now being called the single deadliest terror attack in Iraq since 2003. Just to put this in perspective for you, to show you the stale of the suicide bombing here in Baghdad, CNN actually flew this drone just so you can see the scale of the devastation, the entire building incinerated; 215 people are believed to be dead there.

This comes after 44 people were killed in Istanbul in a coordinated ISIS bombing inside the airport there. And then days later, Dhaka, Bangladesh, 22 people were killed in a 10-hour standoff with ISIS militants inside of a cafe.

Joining me now, two senior international correspondents. I have Ben Wedeman standing by live for us from Baghdad, and in Istanbul, Nima Elbagir.

But, Ben, let me just begin with you here. Talk to me a little bit about the hours you spent at the site of the bombing, and also the mortar attacks in the last couple hours near the airport.

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this was a rocket attack, we're told, by Iraqi officials. They found the truck from which the rockets were launched.

They were aimed, they said, toward Camp Liberty, which is right next to Baghdad International Airport, but some of those rockets went astray and hit local nearby village, wounding, we understand, several civilians. But that pales in comparison to the gore and bloodshed that is still on the scene at this the blast site from Saturday night.

They are still at this time pulling body parts and bodies out of the ashes, out of the ruins there. The bomb was caused by, it's believed, a suicide truck bomber in a refrigerator truck that was parked right between two very active malls. And the explosion threw a wall of flame into both of them, killing, as we said, 215 people at this point.

But that number is likely to go up. As far as Iraqi officials go, they have only -- of the bodies they have pulled out, 81 are charred beyond recognition and it will take DNA tests to verify their identities. And because there's so many people who have lost loved ones and have no trace of them, when we were at the bomb scene today for about five-and-a-half to six hours, we saw one group after another coming up looking, asking for information, sifting through the ashes and the rubble for some sign of the dead.

One man was looking for five relatives who had gone missing. He found a cell phone which had the SIM card of his cousin and he's still looking for the others. Another woman who had spent more than 24 hours going from one hospital to another, to one Baghdad morgue to another, she still can't find her 29-year-old son who was in that shopping area looking for clothing to buy for the holiday that concludes the holy month of Ramadan -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: So, as Ben points out, the violence there, the death toll likely to rise. Meantime, just several nights ago, you had the triple suicide attack inside that Istanbul Airport inside the international departures area.

Nima, to you, the question over the last couple days will then be how will Turkey retaliate within Syria? Tell me about that.

[15:05:01]

NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, it appears that retaliation, that fight back has already begun.

Turkey's semi-official news agency is quoting security sources that there have already been strikes hitting ISIS targets inside Northern Syria. They're saying their security forces are confirming 14 dead. You were here. You saw the scale of that devastation and you were here for President Erdogan's blistering speech in which he vowed that for every one of us they kill, he said we will kill 10 of them.

But that isn't just about making good on the view of retribution. Turkish authorities are telling the news agency that they believe that this was an active plot against Turkey that they are foiling, that they hit these targets because they believe this is where a new plot was being gestated. As you said, ISIS vowed an uptick in terror, but they vowed that that uptick in terror would be relentless.

And here in Turkey they have, clearly, they have decided that the only solution to fight back against ISIS as it wreaks havoc across the world is to hit them in their headquarters, inside Syria, to take the fight to them, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Nima Elbagir, thank you, my friend, in Istanbul.

Let's have a broader conversation on all these different attacks over the past week or so.

Karen Greenberg is joining me, director at the Center of National Security at Fordham University Law School here in New York and author of "Rogue Justice: The Making of the Security State." And joining us, CNN military analyst Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona, who is in Oregon for us right now.

Welcome to both of you.

Karen, let me just turn to you. The scale of the attacks, the call to attack during Ramadan, the death toll, success?

KAREN GREENBERG, CENTER ON NATIONAL SECURITY: Well, it depends on how you look at it. There are some experts who would say that this is what our winning and their losing looks like.

So you have a number of things that are overlapping here. One is the end of Ramadan. There was a call for these attacks during Ramadan. It is about to end. It ends officially on the 5th and there's a three-day celebration of the ending it to end the fast.

But you also have to fact that ISIS had been losing ground and they have been losing ground in big ways in the embattled areas in Iraq, as you know, Syria, and so there is a sense of desperation that's spinning out into all other places.

In addition to that, because the focus is on the Muslim world now, we're not talking about the United States and Europe right now, there's a sense of them building on the Muslim divisions that there are there, so you see these attacks in Baghdad were on the Shia.

(CROSSTALK)

GREENBERG: And you see in Saudi Arabia -- in Saudi Arabia as well that this -- we're seeing what we have been expecting for a long time and seen simmering below the surface, which is this Shia/Sunni divide.

And then on top of that, you layer the politics of all of this, like the Turkish divisions, the divisions inside Turkey with the PKK and others. And what you're now seeing is a conflagration in the region for all of these reasons, sort of like the perfect storm happening as Ramadan comes to an end.

BALDWIN: You say it's a perfect storm.

Colonel, let me turn to you. Yes, you could see it does depend on perspective as far as wins or losses, but to me it's the bottom line of the death toll. Just even talking to Ben Wedeman and the several hundred lives lost, and that number is climbing because of that attack there. It's hard to swallow.

I know for us in the U.S. it seems farther away, but still you have had these attacks back to back to back.

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, it's this constant wave and Karen, she took the words right out of my mouth. This is the perfect storm. We're at a tipping point now.

We see ISIS losing all of its territory and they have to do something. Any terrorist organization, what you want to do is create these significant emotional events, and they have done that.

BALDWIN: And they get attention.

FRANCONA: Over the past week, for sure. And as they lose territory, they're striking out because they have to find some other piece of ground, whether they can exploit divisions in Turkey, Saudi Arabia or what, but they eventually have got to be in a geographic area.

Otherwise, they're not a state, they're not a caliphate. That's what they want to be. If they can't do that, they just morph into another terrorist organization and they become competitors for al Qaeda, but without a state.

BALDWIN: This is the first time, Karen, just being totally real, I have had friends here in the U.S. who have seen what's happened, and I think especially seeing what happened in the Istanbul Airport and all those innocent people just wanting to travel and folks here looking around the airport thinking about, OK, where would I get out heaven forbid something were to happen? How worried are you about that?

GREENBERG: It depends on where in the world you're talking about.

BALDWIN: U.S.

GREENBERG: In the U.S., I think we understand this problem in a very intelligent and sophisticated way.

So I may be less worried than others. I trust our law enforcement and intelligence agents to keep us safe. Is it a perfect safety, 100 percent I can guarantee? No. But they spent 15 years and many trillions of dollars learning this business.

[15:10:05]

Having said that, you never know what is going to happen, but I do think what's happening now is really focused in the Muslim world. And it's very interesting, because one thing the United States has always done, like it or not, is to say this is the Muslim religion against the world.

Now we're seeing the divisiveness is in the Muslim world, and so it makes me even less afraid here in some ways.

BALDWIN: How is it divisive? You have Muslims and then you have terrorists.

GREENBERG: Because -- but terrorists who are claiming themselves to be the Islamic State, who are attacking other Muslims.

BALDWIN: Right. It's an ideology.

(CROSSTALK)

GREENBERG: Right. Exactly.

So you saw this in Turkey. Now you're seeing in the Iraq. And I think the sense of where does the United States fit into this is a different chapter and a different story. And I think in way our law enforcement agents are going to have to evolve to understand this kind of risk. But it's not making me in particular think that I should be warning or anything like that.

I think we are living in the same state we were before. This right now, this moment is about this wave of attacks throughout the Muslim world and it's interesting for that reason. And it's terribly sad.

BALDWIN: OK. So sad. Just leaving Istanbul yesterday and waiting in the passport line and seeing those bullet holes, just it was chilling, it was chilling to know it happened right there and 44 people were killed.

Karen, thank you very much. And, Colonel Francona, thank you as well.

Coming up next here, the interview. Hillary Clinton speaks with the FBI for three-and-a-half-hours as part of an investigation into her personal e-mail server while secretary of state. What sources are telling CNN about the possibility of charges here. All of this as Donald Trump finds himself in his own firestorm over a tweet targeting Secretary Clinton. All of this just two weeks before the Republican National Convention. We will discuss what you need to know coming up.

Plus, Major League Baseball plays its first game ever on an active military base. I love this story today. In the stands, this 90-year- old World War II veteran getting the VIP treatment. His grandson set the whole thing up. He will join us live to share what the historic game meant to both of them. So great.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:15:35]

BALDWIN: Let's talk about some political fireworks, shall we, on this Independence Day? You have these exchanges exploding on the political front between the contenders here for the presidency and accusations of anti-Semitism involved.

Hillary Clinton today seizing on this deleted treat from Donald Trump where this tweet this is the initial one declares crooked Hillary makes history with $100 bills as the backdrop of her face, and beside it, you can read most corrupt candidate ever inside the shape of the Star of David, a Jewish symbol.

A short time ago, the Clinton campaign sent out a statement. Let me just read it for you. They say this -- quote -- "Donald Trump's use of a blatantly anti-Semitic image from racist Web sites to promote his campaign would be disturbing enough, but the fact that it's a part of a pattern should give voters major cause for concern. Now not only won't he apologize for it, he's peddling lies and blaming others."

After deleting the original, Trump sent out a new tweet that uses a circle instead of the star. He sent out the initial tweet Saturday. That was the day Secretary Clinton interviewed with the FBI for three- and-a-half-hours over her use of that private e-mail server when she was secretary of state.

So let's having a big old conversation on this Fourth of July, shall we, with CNN political director David Chalian and CNN political reporter Sara Murray.

Great to see both of you.

Sara Murray, to you first. Can you just talk to me about where that initial tweet or where the image with the Star of David came from?

SARA MURRAY, CNN NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we also found the image appeared on a white supremacist message board. What's not clear is how an image like that would go from a white supremacist message board on to Donald Trump's Twitter feed.

And, of course, we have asked a number of his advisers multiple times today if they could explain how something like this ended up happening. They have not responded to any of those requests, but Donald Trump did what he does best, and he took to Twitter today

He said: "Dishonest media is trying their absolute best to depict a star and a tweet as the Star of David rather than a sheriff's star or plain star." What's a little confusing about that, Brooke, is they obviously felt the need to replace the image with the star with one of a circle instead, so there is clearly some thinking within the Trump campaign that they needed to do something to correct this.

BALDWIN: Before we move off this, David Chalian, I just want to have you marinate on it. If they're saying it wasn't anti-Semitic, the question is, why then did they delete it?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Exactly.

BALDWIN: How bad is this for them?

CHALIAN: I just think this once again raises the question. The key question that Sara said is going unanswered so far is, how does an image like this, what is the process by which the Trump campaign finds this image, this enters into their digital communications playbook as something to use and put out to millions of supporters?

Yes, there's a clear admission that it was bad because they changed it. But I don't understand, just if you did sort of an autopsy of this moment about how a campaign takes this into their warehouse, if you will, and then distributes it to millions of followers, how does that happen without somebody catching that this doesn't belong as part of presidential politics?

MURRAY: And I think the other question, to David's point, is, was this intentional or was this unintentional? Because if it was intentional, that was one thing. If it was unintentional, why does this continue happening? Why has Donald Trump retweeted apparent neo- Nazi supporters? What did he blast out this graphic previously with incorrect and racially charged crime statistics?

And why isn't there some process by which these images, these graphics, these retweets are looked at if they have had a number of missteps and if this is in fact another one?

BALDWIN: So you have all of that. Then let's pivot to the veepstakes and other tweets from Trump where he's mentioned Senator Tom Cotton from Arkansas, Indiana Governor Mike Pence and Iowa Senator Joni Ernst.

And just to remind people, Joni Ernst, when she was running before, she was running as a veteran, running as a conservative and also this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JONI ERNST (R), IOWA: I'm Joni Ernst. I grew up castrating hogs on an Iowa farm. So when I get to Washington, I will know how to cut pork. I approve this message because Washington is full of big spenders. Let's make them squeal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Just reminding everyone that ad. CHALIAN: Such a good ad.

BALDWIN: David, oh, good.

[15:20:00]

Can you run through just pros, cons for these different people, David Chalian?

CHALIAN: By the way, the same team of consultants and people that worked on Joni Ernst's campaign were Marco Rubio's advisers in this last presidential campaign, which is an added layer of intrigue.

BALDWIN: Oh, wow.

CHALIAN: But, listen, I do think -- you mentioned Mike Pence. He met with Mike Pence over the weekend.

I do think that somebody like Mike Pence checks a lot of boxes for Donald Trump. Donald Trump has said over and over again, Brooke, I want somebody who really knows the ways of Washington, knows how to execute and get stuff done. This is somebody who was the House leadership, not just a run-of-the-mill congressman, but somebody who was in House leadership at one point, has now been at the statehouse running a state in that sort of critical region of the country in that Rust Belt, Midwest area that Donald Trump is looking at as well.

And I just think for instant credibility with the Republican establishment that Donald Trump has had a tough time with, officeholders, donors, what have you, Mike Pence checks a lot of boxes. He also really would warm a lot of social conservative hearts. He is a real -- he is of the social conservative movement as well.

So if Donald Trump is looking for someone coming into and out of his convention to really help stitch all of the facets of the Republican Party together, Mike Pence is somebody who fits that bill.

BALDWIN: Which might be a reason for them to announce before the convention to grab some of those Republicans and bring them to Cleveland, Sara Murray. Do we know if that might happen and who's speaking at the convention?

MURRAY: Well, it's certainly possible he will announce his V.P. pick ahead of the convention, despite for a while saying he wanted kind of a big flashy rollout, he wanted the fanfare of the convention.

But I do think that they have had some problems lining up convention speakers. We have obviously seen a number of banner Republicans saying that they're not even going to appear at the convention, much less speak there.

And so we know he said that he will have business leaders, he will have his family members, he will have Ivanka Trump speaking, Melania Trump speaking. We also know that he's asked Ben Carson to speak at the convention. But the rest of the list, despite Donald Trump tweeting that it's all filled out, is still very much up in the air. And I think that raises more questions about his meeting today with Joni Ernst. Let's say, for instance, that she's not particularly interested in the V.P. slot, or the the's just sort of speaking with her perfunctorily and not necessarily because he really wants her for the V.P. slot. She could be another great convention speaker for him at a time where he is short on those at the moment, so we will see how that pans out, Brooke.

BALDWIN: What about, David, just quickly on the Clinton campaign side? We know they announced today that they have raised some $70 million for the month of June. Put that in context for us and how concerned should the Trump camp be?

CHALIAN: Well, listen, this is exactly the kind of financial juggernaut that Hillary Clinton was looking to put together. This is now the first full month of her with coordinated efforts with the DNC and Hillary Victory Fund to help state parties.

That's why the number is bigger than what we have seen in some previous months. It also shows a consolidation of Democrats coming around in the aftermath of the nomination fight. As you know, Donald Trump says he's raising money hand over fist. We won't know. They don't have to report their June numbers until July 20, so the Clinton campaign got their number out there and just put it out. We can't verify it until the 20th of July.

We have not heard what the Trump number. He had such a dismal May and ends up with $1.3 million on hand, Brooke, that really June is going to have to be dramatically different. He says it will be. We will see in a few weeks if that's true.

BALDWIN: OK, David, Sara, thank you both. Happy Fourth to both of you.

MURRAY: Thank you.

BALDWIN: And as we talk about the conventions, we also want to talk about the Olympics. We're about a month now away from the opening ceremonies in Rio de Janeiro down in Brazil and the official there says you are more likely to get Zika in Florida than Brazil.

He also slammed police for another issue ahead of the Games. We will take you live to Rio for more details from his controversial interview.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:27:27]

BALDWIN: Just a month now before Rio de Janeiro welcomes thousands of athletes and visitors for the 2016 Summer Olympic Games, the city's image continues to take hits.

The city's mayor is now lashing out at a state official over a rise in violent crime, the armed robbery of Olympic sailors, just one of a number of high-profile crimes that has a lot of people worried in Rio.

CNN international correspondent Shasta Darlington sat down for an interview with the city's mayor. And while he blasted the policing efforts, the mayor downplayed all these concerns about the Zika virus and vowed the Games will be a success.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

EDUARDO PAES, MAYOR OF RIO DE JANEIRO: Fortunately, this is not going to happen on the Games. It's going to be the national force here, the army, the navy. Everyone is going to here.

So, as you know this is not a city responsibility in Brazil. It's a state-level responsibility. I think they do a terrible job on security. They do a terrible job before the Games and after the Games. Fortunately, they're not going to be the ones responsible for security during the Games.

SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think you raise a valid point. There's also the question of residents. Police aren't getting paid. Crime is rising.

Do you worry that your citizens, that your -- especially the most vulnerable could be abandoned during the Olympic Games when everybody is taking care of the tourists?

PAES: I'm not worried about them being abandoned on the Games time. I'm worried about them being abandoned everyday, the everyday life.

So, this is the most serious issue in Rio and the state level is doing a horrible, a terrible job here. And it's completely been failing in its work of police taking care of security in the states.

DARLINGTON: One of the big problems has been Zika. Athletes have been canceling. Do you think you might be underestimating the impact that the fear over the Zika virus is going to happen on the Games?

PAES: I don't think so.

Actually, what's happening is exactly the contrary. People are overestimating what could happen. At this time in Rio, if you're American, please don't go to Florida. You have got more cases of Zika in Florida than what we have now in Rio.

I'm not saying there's not a problem. It is a problem that we have to face, but, as we always said, especially during this time of the year, it's wintertime in Brazil, in Rio. So, the weather gets better, so the spread of the mosquito, it gets better, so we don't have much cases of Zika now.

DARLINGTON: I live here in Brazil. I live in Rio. I'm rooting for these Olympics to work, but it just seems like every time something can go wrong, it does. And even more, how are you going to even get people excited about these Games?

PAES: These are the kind of problems that you face in the U.S.. And it was a kid in the lake in Disneyland and -- Disney World, and then the crocodile comes and (INAUDIBLE) eats the kid, you know?

I mean, there's a crazy guy that -- American guy that goes into a -- a gay disco and shoots, I don't know, 40 people.