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Legal View with Ashleigh Banfield

GOP Delegates Work To Finalize Platform; GOP Leaning Further Right On LGBT and Religious Issues; Justice Ruth Bader Ginsberg Under Fire For Slamming Trump; Former Trump U Instructor Describes Sales Role, Won't Discuss Real Estate Background; Clinton Speaks At Site Of Lincoln's "House Divided" Speech. Aired 12:30-1p ET

Aired July 13, 2016 - 12:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[12:30:02] PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I think so. I think the interesting thing if you look at past platforms and why we've noticed that this has clearly moved right on the whole compared to 2012 is, there is a Supreme Court decision that essentially very -- literally legalized gay marriage that has changed since the 2012 platform was considered.

So, you saw the language and you saw the delegates trying to grapple with that reality as it currently stands. But there's no question about it. Republicans as it currently stands, every social conservative, still very uncomfortable with this issue as Jim Bach who's a very strong social conservative made very clear.

They believe this is identity politics. They don't even want it to mention in their platform let alone recognized throughout various parts of it, Ashleigh. So, the divide is still there not just nationally but most certainly within the Republican Party. ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: OK. So here is a really dumb question

and I'm going to ask it anyway. Because every time before we're, you know, leading up to a big convention we talk so deeply about the platform and how it's going to work its way into the convention, how important the issues in the party platform are. And then we don't talk about it again.

So, how significant is the platform and how much does it get raised after we stop talking about it?

MATTINGLY: Yes, we'll probably talk about it again a lot in July 2020. No, but you're right Ashleigh. The reality is and I think this is, this is why you made an important point in the beginning, right. This is strategic for the Trump campaign. They have advisers who were in this meetings, who were around but they weren't weighing in, they weren't making strong pushes on specific elements of this platform except for -- as I noted, trade and the wall with Mexico because they recognize this is not binding to Donald Trump, this is not binding to the party, this isn't binding to lawmakers on Capitol Hill.

What this really is is a statement of principles, core tenants of the direction of the Republican Party wants to go. But if you're Trump's team, and I've talked to advisors who've noted this. Let the social conservatives have this. Obviously, some still very wary of Donald Trump, perhaps, this helps mollify them, this helps brings them closer into the fold as this party tries desperately to unify in this final days before the convention here, Ashleigh.

BANFIELD: I almost wonder if that's punctuated by Trump saying duly noted. Next. But we'll wait for that.

Phil Mattingly, enjoy yourself. You have a busy couple of weeks ahead. Thank you sir.

MATTINGLY: Thanks.

BANFIELD: Coming up next, Donald Trump says Ruth Bader Ginsburg should resign from the Supreme Court over what she said about him. Don't hold your breath for that to happen though. But, did the liberal justice cross the line? Even some Democrats say, "Yeah, you bet." That's ahead.

And also, we're still waiting on those live comments from Hillary Clinton, the presumptive Democratic nominee about the recent police shootings and protests speaking from the very place where Abraham Lincoln made the historic house divided speech, and where Barack Obama launched his campaign to be president of the United States.

Back in a moment.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:37:15] BANFIELD: Just a couple of moments for now, we're expecting the live mic to light up at the old state capital. And if that lectern looks familiar, it should, if you remember back to '07, that's where President Obama launched his candidacy for his current job, a job that's about to end. It's where Hillary Clinton plans to make a pitch to get that job. That's coming up any moment. So we're going to bring it to you live just as soon as it does.

In the meantime, Supreme Court is on its summer holiday. That's awfully nice. But one justice is still putting out opinions. And she's taking heat like she never has before. Ruth Bader Ginsburg, the court's eldest member at 83, and its liberal mainstay, now has given three different press interviews in less than a week.

That in itself is pretty extraordinary for any Supreme Court justice. But then there was this, in each one of those interviews, she effectively trashed the presumptive GOP nominee Donald Trump.

Justice Ginsburg told CNN and I "He is a faker. He has no consistency about him. He says whatever comes into his head at the moment." She quipped to the associated press that she might consider moving to New Zealand if Trump is elected. And to the New York Times a somber Ginsburg said, and I quote her again, "I can't imagine what the country would be with Donald Trump as our president. For the country, it could be four years. For the court, it could be -- I don't even want to contemplate that." And that, Trump is sharing his own opinions about Justice Ginsburg tweeting and I quote Donald Trump, "Justice Ginsburg of the U.S. Supreme Court has embarrassed all by making very dumb political statements about me. Her mind is shot. Resign."

Joining me with more on this extra-judicial firestorm is CNN legal analyst and Supreme Court biographer and giggling only because it seems so jaw dropping. Joan Biskupic, you were there. You were doing the interview with Justice Ginsburg in which she told CNN that pretty spectacular little nugget.

Was this jaw dropping in the moment when you were actually sitting across from her as it certainly seemed imprint?

JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: No, because I'll tell you why, Ashleigh. She had based some remarks earlier and I covered lots of subjects with her. And then I said, you know, what about what you had said earlier about Donald Trump. And I frankly thought she might walk it back a bit. I thought, you know, it's gotten a lot of attention what she said. I wouldn't have guessed that she would have wanted this kind of attention, so I was prepared for her to say, "Oh, I was just joking."

And she first laughed about her New Zealand comment, about the fact her late husband Martin Ginsburg had quipped that maybe they should move to New Zealand under other circumstances.

[12:40:06] But then she came on even stronger. And it was as if she was presenting some sort of a legal brief to me. I said, "Well then, elaborate on what it is about Donald Trump." And that's when she went through the whole litany of, "He's a faker. He is inconsistent. He says what pops right into his mind" and then what about the fact that he's been allowed not to release his income taxes.

So I had known her for a long time. I know that she speaks her mind. You earlier had that remark about Donald Trump, let Donald Trump be Donald Trump. There is something about Ruth Bader Ginsburg especially at this point in her life where she's going to be herself.

And it wasn't that surprising to me that she said it, that she reinforced it, got my attention certainly. And the fact that it's been part of this firestorm at this -- in this very unusual election year, that actually is not surprising.

BANFIELD: Might be why she has the moniker, the notorious RBG. But, what's interesting though Joan and I'm going to have to wrap it there but there might be calls for her to recuse herself at anything election-oriented and stuff on their desk.

But again, I do have to wrap it there. We have a live event we're waiting. Joan, great work. Thank you.

BISKUPIC: Thank you.

BANFIELD: Coming up, the brand-new twist in the Donald Trump story about the university, Trump University. CNN's Investigative Correspondent Drew Griffin sits down with a former instructor to talk about his real estate seminar.

But our CNN team found that the claims that he was making didn't always add up. And he had to face that with live cameras rolling. And it's really something you have to see. It's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:46:04] BANFIELD: Today, lawyers for Donald Trump are going to be in a California courtroom where a judge is going to hear arguments over whether or not to release deposition video of Donald Trump while he's testifying. He was recorded while he was answering the questions that were being asked about Trump University.

All part of the series of lawsuits and it's just one of those lawsuits that alleged despite promises Trump University wasn't a University. The school did not teach Donald Trump real state secrets and teachers and mentors were neither real estate experts nor handpicked by Donald Trump. Those are the allegations against him. And you're going to hear from one of the so-called experts. You can decide for your self.

CNN's senior investigative correspondent Drew Griffin invited the man who helps to bring in the money for Trump, Trump University in particular, to sit down and have a chat about all the things that he had said and done. And this is how it went.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMES HARRIS, FORMER INSTRUCTOR, TRUMP UNIVERSITY: We were bringing in the money.

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A lot of it.

HARRIS: A lot of money.

GRIFFIN: Were you -- you said you're the top guy, were you the top guy.

HARRIS: I don't know if I was. I just know I was -- I'm really good at what I do.

GRIFFIN: You said you were the top guy.

HARRIS: OK. So, maybe I was the top guy. I don't really know whether I was or not. I just know that my numbers were one of the -- from week to week to week, my numbers were in the top one or two.

GRIFFIN: James Harris's job was to get people to believe they, too, could be as successful at real estate as Donald Trump. And to reel them in, sign them up, get them to pay as much as $34,000 and the promise that the next seminar, the next class would teach them all they need to know.

What do you know about real estate?

HARRIS: Real estate is a very wide, huge business. I got involved in real estate personally myself in the 90s. GRIFFIN: And if you attended of James Trump University seminar you would hear a lot more about Harris's claims of success and experience in real estate. Claims made in this verbatim transcript of a Trump seminar he gave in San Bernardino, California.

Do you remember when you said this, "I'm former licensed agent broker at 29 I became top 1 percent broker in the country. I build homes in Atlanta, Georgia, and I used to live in Beverly Hills."

HARRIS: Yes. If I said those things, they are true. I did live in Beverly Hills. And I ...

GRIFFIN: We have no record of you ever living in Beverly Hills.

HARRIS: OK.

GRIFFIN: We can't find your broker's license anywhere.

HARRIS: OK.

GRIFFIN: And I have no idea what homes you built in Atlanta, Georgia. You built homes in Georgia.

HARRIS: I'm not prepared to answer those questions today.

GRIFFIN: This is part of your speech. Is any of that true?

HARRIS: Again, I'm not going to answer those questions because I'm in CNN.

GRIFFIN: Well, you certainly know when you've done in your life?

HARRIS: Well, I don't know where that's coming from. I don't know where you got it.

GRIFFIN: This is a transcript submitted in court ...

HARRIS: I've never seen it ...

GRIFFIN: ... of the taped presentation that you gave in San Bernardino, California.

HARRIS: I don't know if that's a court document or not. I've never seen it.

GRIFFIN: It's a court document.

HARRIS: OK.

GRIFFIN: Well, what do you know about real estate?

HARRIS: Again, I'm not prepared to answer those questions today. This is about Trump University.

BON GUILLO, FORMER STUDENT, TRUMP UNIVERSITY: He kept walking up and down the aisle flashing his Rolex in our faces. GRIFFIN: Bob Guillo was one of James Harris's students. He is part of a lawsuit trying to get back his $34, 000. He says the school was a fraud, so was his teacher.

GUILLO: He bragged that he had dinner with Donald Trump.

GRIFFIN: Did you have dinner with him?

HARRIS: I never had dinner with him.

GRIFFIN: Bob Guillo was in one of your conferences and you said you just had dinner with Donald Trump.

HARRIS: I don't have any recollection of that.

GRIFFIN: James Harris admits his main job wasn't to teach real state. It was to sell real estate seminars, always with the goal of hooking his audience into buying more classes.

[12:50:02] HARRIS: I was told to promote and sell the Trump University packages and the programs that they were offering. And that's what I did. They had to pay a fee to come to further their training at the next event.

So it was, you know, I went from event to event to event.

GRIFFIN: Is that step by step as it's been described, up sell, by up sell, by up sell?

HARRIS: Kind of sort of, yup. It's a little up sell from, you know, well if you pay this amount we're going to teach you this much. And you pay this amount we're go further with you.

GRIFFIN: Here's an e-mail you wrote.

"I just spoke to Austin and Irene, the older retired couple who had to pull the 30,000 balance for the gold. And she said it's done and should be in Monday. So that will be another 35k. We will easily have another $100k hit by Friday, yahoo."

Your associate Brian, response, "We've always been a dangerous team, brotherman. These peeps don't have a chance against us." Smiley face.

HARRIS: That's called sales.

GRIFFIN: Is that called ripping off an old couple?

HARRIS: Absolutely not.

GRIFFIN: Austin and Irene.

HARRIS: Again, I never saw that e-mail but that is sales. That's typical sales e-mail between two sales -- of two sales people working on deal. I don't know if those people had the money or not. They could've been putting up their last dollar, I don't know. All I know is ...

GRIFFIN: Do you care?

HARRIS: Of course we care, but I was doing my job. We did our job.

GRIFFIN: Regardless of that they could afford it or not?

HARRIS: Regardless if they could afford it or not. I didn't know if they could afford it or not. That was not my position. That was not my job. Other people did that. I don't know if they could afford it or not.

We were told to show them all the ways that they could afford it. They could come up with the finances to get into the business, period, end of story.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Our Drew Griffin doing the reporting for us. So did Donald Trump even know that man, James Harris? The answer seems to be, no. Trump couldn't recall a single name of his live events instructors when he was asked under oath. Even the self-described salesman who claims he was Trump's number one.

So as for that number one, James Harris, as we just saw, he's moved on. He posts easy money work from home. Those are videos on the internet. And yet, he touts his success at Trump University as one of the reasons that you can trust him.

I want to move back to a different kind of politic, the live kind, Hillary Clinton speaking live at the state house in Springfield Illinois.

(JOINED IN PROGRESS)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D) PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: -- gone entirely. Our country would never be truly united and at peace.

So on June 16th, 1858, when Mr. Lincoln kicked off his campaign for the United States Senate, he delivered an address on how slavery was tearing our country apart and that it must go.

Some thought that he ended up losing the Senate race because of that speech, but then he won the presidency, and some thought it was because of that speech.

President Lincoln led America during the most challenging period in our nation's history. He defended our union, our Constitution and the ideal of a nation, conceived in liberty and dedicated to the proposition that all men are created equal.

His legacy included laws and amendments that enshrined those values for future generations. They protect and guide us still.

I'm here today in this place because the words Lincoln spoke all those years ago still hold resonance for us now. Remember, he said "A house divided against itself cannot stand. I believe this government cannot endure permanently half slave and half free. I do not expect," he went on, "the union to be dissolved. I do not expect the house to fall. But I do expect it will cease to be divided. It will become all one thing or all the other."

CLINTON: The challenges we face today do not approach those of Lincoln's time. Not even close, and we should be very clear about that. But recent events have left people across America asking hard questions about whether we are still a house divided.

Despite our best efforts and highest hopes, America's long struggle with race is far from finished. In just the past week, we saw black men killed by police and five police officers killed by a sniper targeting white police.

There is too much violence and hate in our country. Too little trust and common ground. It can feel impossible to have the conversations we need to have to fix what is broken. And despite being the richest country on earth, we have too much economic inequality. And that also undermines the foundation of our democracy.

Lincoln understood that threat, too. He deeply believed everyone deserved, in his words, "a fair chance in the race of life." He saw it as a defining feature of the United States and believed it was vital that hard-working people be free to enjoy the fruits of their own labor.

It is one of the reasons he was so strongly against slavery because it violated that entire notion. And as president, he took pains to use the tools of government, to create more economic opportunity for Americans at every level of society.

So, too, must we fight inequality and create opportunity in our time, not just for some Americans, but for all. So I come today as a mother, and a grandmother, to two beautiful little children, who I want them and all of our children to glow up in a country where violence like the kind we saw last week doesn't happen again. And where the American dream is big enough for everyone.

I'm also here as a candidate for president who is deeply concerned about the divisions that still hold our people apart and our nation back. I believe that our future peace and prosperity depends on whether we meet this moment with honesty and courage.

That means taking a hard look at our laws and our attitudes. It means embracing policies that promote justice for all people and standing firm against any attempt to roll back the clock on the rights and opportunities that so many sacrificed so much to secure.

And all of that starts with doing a better job of listening to each other. We need to listen to the families who loved ones have been killed in police incidents. Alton Sterling and Philando Castile are just the latest of a long and painful litany of African-Americans dying after encounters with police officers.

We remember Laquan McDonald, killed in Chicago a year and a half ago and Sandra Bland who grew up in Illinois who died one year ago today.

Time after time, no one is held accountable. And surely, we can all agree that's deeply wrong and needs to change. And yes, we do need to listen to those who say "black lives matter."

Too many black Americans, especially young men, feel like their lives are disposable and they worry every single day about what might happen. They have every reason to feel that way and it is absolutely unacceptable. Everyone in America, everyone deserves to be treated with respect and dignity.

CLINTON: Surely, that is something we can all unite behind.

We need to acknowledge the five Latinos who also lost their lives in police incidents last week. Their stories didn't get national media coverage, but their families and communities are mourning, too.

[13:00:07] And at the same time, we need to listen to the dedicated, principled police officers working hard every day to rebuild trust with the communities they serve and protect. Our men and women in blue put their lives on the line every day to keep us safe and keep our democracy strong.