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Driver Identified in France Terror Attack; Donald Trump to Announce VP Pick; Aired 10-10:30a ET

Aired July 15, 2016 - 10:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[10:00:30] ANDERSON COOPER, CNN ANCHOR: And thanks for joining us. To our viewers in the United States and watching around the world, I'm Anderson Cooper.

A lot to get to this hour. Just minutes ago, we learned that investigators in France have identified the man who drove a truck through a crowd along the French Riviera. He's a 31-year-old French Tunisian and resident of Nice where last night's attacks took place.

Investigators are still collecting evidence in the French Riviera town of Nice. And we want to warn you some of the video is disturbing and difficult to watch.

As you know, a massive truck plowed through a holiday crowd. People running in all directions. Many simply couldn't get out of the way. 84 people killed in all. We learned in this last hour from France's president another 50 are still said to be critically -- in a critical state, critically injured. Many of the dead and injured are children.

The rampage stretched for a -- for about 1.3 miles. The beach area was packed with locals and tourists, partiers and families all gathered for Bastille Day, a holiday celebrating France's independence. Some witnesses say the driver was also shooting as he plowed through the crowd, though that has not been confirmed. The handgun was found with the driver.

As you can see from the bullet riddled windshield, he was finally shot to death by police.

CNN has correspondents and experts covering every angle of this developing story. Let's begin in Nice with CNN's Nic Robertson.

Nic, you're outside, I think, the killer's -- the terrorist's house. What have you learned?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, we've learned from neighbors here, Anderson, that he was a relatively quiet man. That he lived separately from his wife and three young children. We know neighbors describe him as a man who would sort of come out of his apartment on the street here, walk up the road to a nearby cafe, have a coffee by himself.

You know, as you know, going out to a cafe here in France, very normal sort of thing to do. But he wouldn't talk to anyone. And that's what the neighbors have remarked upon here. He would go out, come back. The police, just in the last sort of 45 minutes here, have finished a forensic examination of a small delivery truck parked just across the road here. The neighbors say they're not sure if it was his delivery truck, what his connection was to it, but the police blew out the windows of the vehicle when they began the search, then police and forensic protective clothing, masks on their faces began a very, very detailed search of the vehicle for about -- lasting about three to four hours.

They pulled out what appeared to be stacks of paper, possibly receipts. They were putting that in brown forensic evidence bags to take away. The police appear to be quite relaxed during that procedure. They didn't appear to be feeling that there was potentially explosives in this vehicle. The vehicle of course now has been towed away. This neighborhood here, not poor, not terribly affluent, but reasonably prosperous in the outskirts of Nice just where the hills, mountains, begin to go up. About 10 or 15 minutes drive from here to the Promenade Anglais where the attack took place.

So what do we know about this man? At the moment is merely the thinnest of details. 31 years old. French Tunisian national according to French officials here. Slightly odd enough that the local community here could notice that he was a little bit of a loner. But apart from that, very, very details, concrete details so far, Anderson.

COOPER: A source had told -- close to the investigation had told CNN, Nic, that he had a record of -- sort of a petty criminal record, was not on French police radar as an extremist, as a jihadist.

ROBERTSON: Those are the details that we have. The police have yet to go on the record, if you will, or at least announce that publicly, but that appears to be the case. In France, if you're believed to be a radical or suspected of wanting to plan a terrorist event, the police take out what they call a fish-S on you. This is a record keeping device, if you will, that they will then begin to investigate you.

This hadn't happened for Mohamed Bouhlel. He was only known, as you say, for those petty crimes. We've heard it reported that they were small gun-related crimes, petty criminality. Nothing, as far as we know, to do with terrorism. And, indeed, Tunisian officials have been reported as saying that he last visited his home in Tunisia, family home, of course, four years ago, that they have no record of him having an association with terrorists in Tunisia either.

[10:05:16] That, again, not something that police here are confirming to us yet. But these are details here that are beginning to emerge in some reports -- Anderson.

COOPER: And as we talked about in the past hour, a number of the people that we've seen taking part in these Islamist jihadist attacks, the Bataclan and "Charlie Hebdo," were petty criminals essentially, without a long record or a lot of association with Islamic groups.

Nic Robertson, we'll continue to check in with you.

Will Ripley is near the scene of the terror attack.

Will, it's been cordoned off now. Police are still treating it. I mean, there's a lot of evidence to collect still at the scene.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and there are a lot of police barricades around this area, Anderson. Normally it might take you five minutes to get somewhere. Today it might take you 30 minutes or even an hour. And I'll show you what the police have done. You kind of -- you can see how they have completely blocked off our view of the entire beach front promenade here. This is because they don't want necessarily the media or anybody to see what has really been a gruesome scene, that we saw in photos and videos on social media when this truck came and traveled for more than a mile, aiming towards specific groups of people.

Even when we arrived here about five hours ago, we were hearing over the police scanners at those police barricades that they were still transporting people to the hospital. We know that those 28 children very critically hurt because a lot of people were out here, families, students on school trips have been coming to the French Riviera. It's a dream vacation for a lot of people from outside of France and this is a very popular vacation destination.

Inside, it's the Bastille Day weekend. A lot of people have left Paris. They were off work. And so while there was heavy security in Paris and events there were not interrupted, down here, we're also told there was intense security. But -- police were looking for improvised explosive devices, not for somebody with a truck. They just haven't seen anything like this before.

COOPER: Yes. And Will, I mean, I was in Nice, on that promenade, just a couple of weeks ago. I mean, for someone who hasn't been there, that is really the key kind of avenue in the city. If you're going to go anywhere, that's where you go because it's along the water, it's where there's cafes and restaurants and some of the best hotels as well.

RIPLEY: And especially last night because this is -- the best view of the fireworks was here. And those who, you know, reported also hearing the gunfire, they say it began simultaneously with the fireworks display. Obviously those two sounds are virtually identical, which would lead investigators and of course we'll hear more from them in the coming hours and days. But it seems as if there was a deliberate attempt to conceal the sound of gunfire before the truck started moving down the promenade.

This is, sadly, becoming really a fact of life for the French people. This country in particular is vulnerable because there's the easy access in the European Union in and out. So people from outside can cross relatively easily. Whereas it would be harder to access, for example, the UK which would be a desirable target and certainly the United States, a much more difficult target for terrorists.

But here also, I mean, this is in the heart of Europe, the epicenter of European-Western values. It's a secular country that jihadists despise the most. Last 19 months, three major attacks and a number of smaller attack as well, some successful. Dozens of ongoing terror investigations now. But how do you police somebody who's never been on the jihadist radar until they commit an attack like this?

People are having to accept the reality that this could become a more regular occurrence not only here but elsewhere. Despite thousands of extra police officers on the streets who have been working during the Euro soccer tournament, during the Fete de la Musique, the music festival that was in Paris last month. During of course all of the celebrations yesterday. And yet still this one individual, whether he was a lone wolf or had accomplices, was able to kill so many people and injure so many more, including those children.

COOPER: Yes. And the state of emergency has now been extended for an additional three months. It was to end on July 26th.

Will Ripley, thanks for the reporting from the scene.

Mark Kikorian is an American staying in an apartment about a half mile from the scene of last night's terror attack. He had been on the Bastille Day fireworks show or he'd been to it, and had gone back home when he saw crowds of people fleeing in panic. Mark joins us now from Nice.

So, Mark, when you realized something terrible was happening, were you already back home? And what did you see and hear?

MARK KIKORIAN, WITNESSED CROWDS FLEEING IN PANIC: Yes, I was. I was at the fireworks down on the promenade and the wife and kids and in- laws didn't want to come, they were too tired. So I just went. And when it was over, I -- even though there were musical performances continuing, I just headed home. We're only a couple of blocks away from the promenade.

[10:10:07] And as soon as I got into the apartment, the street that our apartment overlooks, there's a pedestrian mall that has cafes and stores and stuff. As soon as I got in, I started hearing screaming, people, you know, running, knocking things over, knocking tables over, glass breaking. It was almost like something out of the movies except it was a real thing. I didn't know what was going on. But obviously there was some kind of attack or fear of an attack. So my kids were all gawking at the windows. I told them to get away from the windows. And, you know, then only little by little did I learn what had happened down here.

COOPER: And in terms of the security that you had seen while you were out, how was it?

KIKORIAN: Well, you know, beforehand, I mean, during the fireworks, it was just like fireworks in the United States. You know, Fourth of July. There was all kinds of people, lots of foreigners obviously because it's a big tourist town. You know that. And, you know, people with kids on their shoulders, the whole thing. And then afterwards, once things settled down right in front of my apartment and there was no more actual screaming and running, I went out to see what was going on. I was able to get down to the police line which, you know, was a good

ways away from where the attacks were but you could see where they were. And even two hours later, there were still ambulances streaming in to the -- you know, into the -- into the restricted area. And, in fact, the grimmest thing was a whole convoy of minivans from the Nice coroner's office, come to do their grim jobs.

COOPER: Mark Kikorian, appreciate you talking to us. I'm glad you and your family are OK.

Our Atika Shubert is at a hospital in Nice where she's just spoken to some victims.

Atika, what have you learned?

ATIKA SHUBERT, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. We've been speaking to doctors and victims who were at the attack last night. What doctors have been telling us is the scene last night here was eerie. That patients were being brought in. Very young children suffering from these catastrophic injuries. The kinds of injuries you would see in a terrible car accident. Chest injuries. Limbs being twisted around the wrong way. Quite a number of very serious head injuries as well.

There are now 28 children at this hospital here still being treated. At least three are still in very serious condition. One of the problems that doctors have had here is simply identifying children because so many of them were actually separated from their parents. And they were unconscious. They didn't know who the kids were. They have now been able to identify most of them, though one still remains unidentified.

We've also had the chance to speak with one 14-year-old girl who's just come out, fortunately. Her injury was relatively light. But the psychological trauma she has from simply witnessing this event will stay with her for the rest of her life. She broke down in tears as she told us what she saw. The mangled bodies. People being pushed, trying to escape any way they can. And she just curled up into a ball, trying to protect herself as the stampede ran over her.

It's those kinds of horrific experiences that we're hearing about here. And that kind of trauma is going to stay with them for the rest of their lives, Anderson.

COOPER: Yes, those poor kids separated from their family members for hours while they were in the hospital.

Atika Shubert, appreciate you being there.

Donald Trump was to supposed to announce Indiana Governor Mike Pence as his vice president pick next hour, an event he delayed in the wake of the terror attack. CNN has learned that the Trump campaign will make the announcement sometime today.

CNN's Sara Murray is outside Trump Towers.

So, Sara, it just seems like there will be some sort of announcement today after all?

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Anderson. That's what we're hearing is that Donald Trump will announce that Mike Pence is the pick today, but they will not appear jointly until tomorrow morning, likely in New Jersey.

Now there was an element of surprise of course that was already gone. CNN confirmed yesterday that Mike Pence was the pick. And today they have to file the paperwork to withdraw from the Indiana governor's race. So there was going to be an element of surprise that was lost at any -- at any rate today no matter how they sort of handled this, so it looks like the Trump campaign will confirm that Mike Pence is the pick at some point today and then tomorrow they will have their joint event that was postponed today in the wake of the terror attack in Nice, Anderson.

COOPER: All right. Sara Murray. Sara, thanks very much.

Of course the convention begins on Monday. We'll be there starting Sunday, Sunday evening broadcasting.

Still to come, France now coming with the painful -- coping with the painful reality. Three major terror attacks in 18 months. Why has it become such a target? And what can be done to stop it from happening again? Can that -- is that possible even? We'll be right back.

[10:15:01]

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COOPER: President Obama says he's willing to do whatever he can to help France in the wake of this terror attack. I want to go to our Evan Perez who's in Washington on what the intelligence or what intel the U.S. is getting this morning.

Evan, what have you learned?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Anderson, at this stage, investigators here don't really find any connection with terrorist groups. It appears that this is a lone attacker. Obviously it's early in the investigations. And right now those investigators are going through the communications and other databases to learn what they can about this terrorist.

And so far they only see that he has a minor criminal background. He wasn't on the radar as a possible extremist. And they believe he only rented this truck a couple of days ago before the attack which really gives you a sense of how difficult it is to prevent an attack like this.

Now this morning, security is being beefed up at prominent locations in New York City. The New York Governor Andrew Cuomo says that he's ordered more security at places like airports and mass transit and tunnels.

[10:20:04] And as you mentioned, President Obama has said he's offered the assistance of U.S. investigators to the French government.

And right now law enforcement officials are reviewing ongoing cases of suspected extremists here in this country, you know, does someone have access to large trucks through their work, do they have a commercial driver's license? Is there anyone under surveillance that is trying to rent a vehicle like this.

Now we've seen these types of attacks using large vehicles. It's not a new tactic. But this attack means that there's going to be renewed focus on this issue, Anderson.

COOPER: Yes. Certainly should be. Evan Perez, thanks very much.

It's hard to believe this is France's third major terror attack in 18 months. The question of course is why has the country become such a target.

I want to bring in CNN law enforcement analyst Art Roderick, CNN contributor and co-author of "ISIS: Inside the Army of Terror," Michael Weiss. We're also joined by Peter Neuman, he's the director of the International Center for Studies of Radicalization and Political Violence at King's College.

Michael, you know, it's so interesting, when you hear -- what we know about this individual now. Petty crimes, the leader of the mosque in Nice saying really he has no history of being in mosque or association necessarily with religion. Didn't seem like a devout person.

MICHAEL WEISS, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Yes.

COOPER: We've seen this time and time again. It seems these are kind of life's losers who often latch on to this to kind of give them some sort of depraved glory.

WEISS: Right now it seems like he's got the early CV for potential graduate into a jihadist and what's missing is any kind of flirtation with the Islamist ideology, was he watching Anwar al-Awlaki videos, was he reading "Dabiq" or "Inspire" magazine, this kind of thing.

Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, the founder of AQI, which is now ISIS, same kind of background. He was a pimp and a thug, running around Jordan, had tattoos, was an alcoholic, used to get into fights, was thrown in prison. His mom said I need to sort you out, she sent him to a mosque. And that's when he started to imbibe the radical ideology. And was told you have to go fight Afghanistan.

COOPER: I mean, obviously this person has committed an act of terror. He's -- I mean, a mass horrific, horrific event.

WEISS: Yes.

COOPER: Does -- does he want the label of a terrorist? Does that give him some identity?

WEISS: I mean, you know, before we went on the air, I said, what's the difference between a mass murderer and a terrorist? It's a declaration of allegiance to some organization. So far, we haven't seen that yet. You know, he didn't post anything on social media saying -- pledging to Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi or even to, you know, Osama bin Laden or Ayman al-Zawahiri.

We don't know what really motivated this guy. He could be a loser. You know, I've seen reports he was married with three kids. His marriage broke down. He went into a deep dark depression. Who knows? I mean, a lot of people -- you know, it's hard for the western imagination to understand this but when you interview people who join ISIS, and you ask them why did you join, a lot of them don't say it's because, you know, I want heaven on earth or I believe in the mission of the caliphate, I'm looking to usher in the end times.

Often it's, you know, I wasn't getting what I wanted out of my current affiliation whether with a rebel group or an activist constituency. And they were giving me a pragmatic reason for joining. They gave me a banner, you know, could be the same thing with this guy.

COOPER: Peter Neuman, what stands out to you about this attack?

PETER NEUMAN, INTERNATIONAL CENTER FOR THE STUDY OF RADICALIZATION, KING'S COLLEGE: I think it's really shocking to see that 84 people died in a relatively simple attack. We know that ISIS has been calling for these attacks at least since September 2014. And in fact in December 2014, there were a number of cars that were being driven into Christmas markets in France. But on none of these occasions more than one person die. The fact that 84 people died in a very simple car attack, it must be sending a signal to other potential lone wolves that you can potentially kill a lot of people with a very simple and almost unpreventable type of attack.

COOPER: And Art, I mean, that certainly raises for law enforcement, you know, a very concerning specter. I mean, how do you -- if somebody who is not on the radar as a jihadist or as an extremist, with just petty criminal and weapons charges I believe this individual had, chooses to get behind a truck, you know, how hard is that to prevent?

ART RODERICK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: It's almost impossible. We know that if you're willing to die for a cause, then it's almost impossible to stop the individual. But using the -- using the truck is unique over there in Europe, but as a deadly weapon anyway. But we've had some experience over here at least using a truck as explosives. You go as far back as '93, the first World Trade Center bombing. The bombing of the federal building in Oklahoma City.

And the U.S. government established certain setback guidelines to prevent that type of incident from occurring. I think what you're going to see here with the two conventions coming up is also an exterior perimeter that will be somewhat hardened, based on this particular attack.

[10:25:03] But again if somebody's willing to die for their cause, regardless of what that cause is, yes, we've seen these same types of individuals recruited not only by al Qaeda and ISIS but also by white supremist groups here in the U.S. and by cults. They look for disenfranchised individuals to bring on board. And once that individual makes that commitment, it's almost impossible to stop them.

COOPER: Michael, how well versed are these people usually in the Quran, in ideology?

WEISS: It's funny, I just interviewed a guy who deserted from ISIS. He was actually arrested and imprisoned for 3 1/2 months as an ISIS fighter. They accused him of spying for the coalition. And he said that the religious indoctrination, he was being taught by a 25-year- old from Tunisia who probably couldn't cite one hadif. But he was -- he said this is back to basics. He's like, I'm already a Muslim. Why are you telling me things I know, the pillars of Islam and all that?

A lot of the time -- I mean, one of the more interesting aspects of ISIS is they are self-inventing an ideology. One that doesn't even exist within the annals of the Salafi jihadism. There are things that they are finding arcane references to in Quran and creating whole cloth justifications for it. Throwing homosexuals off rooftops for instance. A lot of Salafi jihadists have said we don't even have this as a form of punishment. We haven't accepted this as a viable form of punishment.

ISIS has created an entire theology around it. And they're finding clerics, creating their own clerics, their own clerisy, to promulgate this stuff. It's a brainwashing exercise, you know, trying to mold people. You know, get them young.

COOPER: Michael Weiss, Art Roderick, Peter Neuman, appreciate your expertise. Much more after the break. We'll be right back.

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