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Hillary V.P. Watch; Cruz Disruption; Trump Night at Republican National Convention. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired July 21, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[15:00:30]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Here we go. We are live in Cleveland, Ohio. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Sweeping in there, the star of the show, the Q. That is where we will see Donald Trump the fourth and final night here making his mega- speech on this last day of the Republican National Convention.

Mr. Trump has just completed his walk-through on the convention stage. I can tell you that. He popped through as he prepares for what will amount to the biggest speech of his life. In just a couple of hours, he will step forward in front of millions of eyeballs and formally accept the Republican nomination for president.

But his former rival, Ted Cruz, he is stealing some of the headlines on this Thursday. In his speech before that crowd at the RNC, the Texas senator refused to endorse Donald Trump, setting off this cacophony of boos right there on the convention floor. That's how it played out if you were standing on the floor last night.

Meantime, flash-forward to this morning, Ted Cruz speaking to his Texas delegation there, defending his actions, explaining that it was personal. It was family loyalty that superseded party unity.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. TED CRUZ (R), TEXAS: I addressed the convention. I addressed the convention because Donald Trump asked me to. And when Donald asked me to, he didn't ask me to endorse.

And, indeed, three days ago, I talked on the phone with him and told him I am not going to endorse you. I am not in the habit of supporting people who attack my wife and attack my father.

(CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

CRUZ: And that pledge was not a blanket commitment that if you go and slander and attack Heidi, then I'm going to nonetheless come like a servile puppy dog and say thank you very much for maligning my wife and maligning my father.

What does it say when you stand up and say, vote your conscience, and rabid supporters of our nominee begin screaming, what a horrible thing to say? (CHEERING AND APPLAUSE)

CRUZ: If we can't make the case to the American people that voting for our party's nominee is consistent with voting your conscience, it's consistent with defending freedom and being faithful to the Constitution, then we are not going to win and we don't deserve to win.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: All right.

So, first up, senior White House correspondent Jim Acosta.

Jim, let's talk about this evening. Obviously, Donald Trump wants to move on from some of the -- some of these headlines. What do we know about his speech this evening, what he will do, how he will enter?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, I can tell you just from being in that hall last night, it is going to be a very different reception that Donald Trump will have tonight vs. what you heard just aimed at Ted Cruz.

There was no question about it as to how that crowd felt about Ted Cruz. This is a very pro-Donald Trump crowd, as you would expect it to be, at the Republican National Convention. After all, he is the nominee.

But I did talk to a Trump campaign official earlier this morning. Yes, Donald Trump will try to turn the page. But from talking to officials and hearing from officials, they are not all that distracted from what Ted Cruz had to say last night.

Donald Trump is still focused on delivering his vision to the country tonight. He's going to have a massive television audience, perhaps the largest television audience he's had so far as a candidate for the White House. This is what a Trump campaign official told me earlier this morning as to what the real estate tycoon and GOP nominee plans to do.

He said -- this official said -- quote -- "Trump will paint his vision of a Trump presidency tonight and the benefit it will have for everyday families, a la how Donald Trump is going to work for you."

So, he is really going to try to take himself down off of that pedestal, you might say, of being this celebrity billionaire real estate reality TV star and try to speak in plain language as to what his policies and proposals will do for everyday Americans.

And then it also goes on to say that he's going to run through specific campaign themes, specific proposals as he lays out the contrast between a Trump presidency and a Clinton presidency.

And so, Brooke, does that mean that Donald Trump's going to get his wonk side on? I don't know about that. We don't hear that very often from Donald Trump. But it does sound like he's going to go through some specific proposals.

[15:05:05]

And, at the same time, I think it is important to point out the warmup acts for Donald Trump speak volumes as well, Ivanka Trump, who is the daughter of Donald Trump. She's obviously been a star throughout this campaign, considered a secret weapon. She will be taking the stage tonight after her brothers and sister, Tiffany, did so earlier this week.

And we will also hear from the Oklahoma governor, Mary Fallin, and Peter Thiel, who is a tech billionaire, who is also openly gay and is going to be the first gay Republican to speak at an RNC in an open fashion talking about how he is proud to be gay person and a Republican all in one.

And so those are the types of things you're going to be hearing tonight. And that is a very different sort of night for the Republican Party, you might say, on the final day of a convention. But no question about it, when you talk to people inside the Trump campaign, Brooke, Donald Trump understands this is his big moment. He certainly wants to take full advantage of it later on tonight, Brooke.

BALDWIN: Yes. Jim Acosta, thank you so much.

Jim hit on so many points.

Let me just bring my panel right in, Democratic CNN contributor Van Jones, Republicans and contributors Kayleigh McEnany and Margaret Hoover, Margaret Hoover, who worked in the George W. Bush White House, Kayleigh, ardent supporter of Mr. Trump, and Carl Bernstein, author of Hillary Clinton biography "A Woman in Charge: The Life of Hillary Rodham Clinton."

Happy Thursday, happy RNC day number four to all of you.

And just out of the gate, looking ahead to Trump tonight, what does he need to do, what does he say, how much policy does he talk?

To you first.

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Trump tonight is introducing himself to the American public, or reintroducing, I should say, exiting officially into the general election.

We're going to see a positive vision put forth. That doesn't mean he is not going to mention Hillary Clinton. I have heard reporting that suggests he might use a play on words with her I'm with her theme and say I'm with you. We recall he gave that line in a speech. It was one of the most effective lines I think he gave.

Plus, I suspect you will hear a little of that. But more than that, you're going to hear what Donald Trump wants to do for the American people.

BALDWIN: Van, what do you think? VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, look, first of all, so

far, my view is, this whole thing has been pretty much mostly anger, not that many answers.

A lot of sideshows, not a lot of solutions. He has a huge opportunity to fix that. He could come out there and he could really give some specifics. I can't tell yet if you don't have a large number of people making a bet around him that the status quo is so intolerable just for people that they don't need any answers.

We are going to see tonight. What is the ratio of stoking the outrage, of painting the opposition in negative colors vs. really showing specifically how he can make it better. If he actually does that, the Democrats have something to worry about, because then you would have several days despite all the distractions of really painting Hillary Clinton in a bad light and now coming forward with some real answers.

BALDWIN: He's got to talk policy, Margaret. I'm looking to you now. But this sort of explosive interview with "The New York Times" and what he said with NATO, he has to talk foreign policy. How much of that do you think we will hear from?

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: I hope we hear a lot because some of the things he said in that recent interview, basically communicating that he doesn't have a real understanding on the purpose of NATO or why it is important or how America benefits from our alliances in Europe, are hugely troubling.

If you're an honest American, whether you are a Republican or you're a Democrat, you have got to think, if the next leader of the free world potentially doesn't understand what has kept the world in this sort of Pax Americana state after World War II, it doesn't matter about the Supreme Court justices if we are going to start on a path where we're emboldening our enemies to invade allies in Europe.

Now we're starting to get into the place where partisanship has to end at the water's edge. And we need presidents who understand what's kept us safe for the last 60 years, 80 years.

BALDWIN: Carl Bernstein, jump in on that.

But, also, does he touch, address any sort of nuance to what happened with Ted Cruz?

CARL BERNSTEIN, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: I think he's got a problem. He's had a successful convention in many ways thus far in terms of reconfiguring a view of him, that others are giving him a look who did not before.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You do think he's been successful doing that?

BERNSTEIN: Somewhat. Somewhat.

JONES: Because the kids -- the kids are amazing.

(CROSSTALK)

BERNSTEIN: Somewhat. But I think that the noise outside the convention hall from other Republicans, not just Cruz, Bobby Jindal calling him a madman, Lindsey Graham saying he's incompetent, et cetera, Nikki Haley, in really amazing terms, characterizing him as unfit for the presidency, this noise is really damaging.

And I don't think so far he's been able to substantively give a vision otherwise. And that's the task tonight and I'm not sure that he's capable of it.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Can he appear presidential?

BERNSTEIN: I think this is a thing for panels of us to talk, can he be presidential?

[15:10:03]

BALDWIN: David Gergen moments ago said to me he believes he could be. He could appear that way.

BERNSTEIN: Again, it is an appearance.

I think, does he have the substance to say, I know what a president needs to do in terms of policy and present it? So far, the evidence is he's totally incapable of it. And look at the interviews today in the newspapers.

JONES: Can I just say something, at the risk of surprising people? I don't know if a bunch of Republican establishment people saying mean things about Donald Trump is a disaster for him.

There is a rebellion in both parties. The rebellion in the Democratic Party was put down by Hillary Clinton, but the rebellion won in this party. To me, you got some sore losers in the establishment. I don't know if this doesn't help him, that he could say, look, they don't like me, but I like you.

(CROSSTALK)

MCENANY: Van's right. And you said this earlier in the election. I thought it was such a profound thing. You said the fault lines might be a little different in this election

It's not sometimes so much Republican/Democrat or conservative Republican establishment. What it is, is outsider/insider. You have a lot of anger in this country on both sides. We saw that with the Bernie Sanders voters. We see it with the Donald Trump voters.

There is a reason two outsiders who had no shot at the nomination, the political class proclaimed them dead from the start, they defied odds. Bernie Sanders in many ways defied odds. BALDWIN: Margaret, I wanted to ask you, because Jim Acosta brought up

Peter, is it Thiel?

HOOVER: Peter Thiel.

BALDWIN: Peter Thiel, who is openly gay, here he is speaking on a mega-stage this evening, Silicon Valley entrepreneur. One look is it's a wonderful thing and a major deal here at the RNC. But you're saying not so fast.

HOOVER: Well, first of all, of, it is great. To have an openly gay Republican addressing the Republican National Convention is a great leap forward, frankly, for -- pardon the pun and the historic reference. Actually, it really is progress on the Republican side, because there is nothing in conflict with being a Republican who believes in individual freedom and being gay.

Caitlyn Jenner was here in the RNC in Cleveland yesterday. You have Montel Williams, a straight ally, advocating for LGBT freedom within the context of being a conservative Republican.

BALDWIN: You too.

HOOVER: All right? And I work in this space as well.

Trump has had really strong rhetoric that is supportive rhetoric on LGBT freedom, which has been incredibly heartening for people like me who are activists on that side. When the rubber hits the road, however, the poignant thing is he hasn't been there, because we have a 2016 platform that marriage is legal, but there are six traditional marriage references in this platform as the only way to be married.

There is conversion therapy, a widely disreputed practice in this platform. And this is the most anti-LGBT Republican platform that we have had in history. It is worse four years later than Mitt Romney's platform in 2012. And that's really quite disappointing, because for all the rhetoric that Donald Trump shared positively for LGBT freedom, when the rubber hit the road in terms of creating a platform that reflected his views, his staff, his operatives, his team were totally opposite.

JONES: And also the Pence pick. Everybody I think has been just so relieved that Pence is a competent person. But the reality is his reputation on LGBT stuff is also bad. So, I think that is -- when you look at the platform, you look at the pick, not good on LGBT.

BALDWIN: I think we will hear more about that in the coming months.

To you, sir, tomorrow morning, what will we be talking about?

BERNSTEIN: I think we will be talking about, did Donald Trump reach the people of the United States outside the hall? So far what he has done is he has identified in this country that people are disaffected, that our institutions are not working.

He has done it with more success than any other candidate. His antenna has been better than any of the other candidates. Now, can he continue to do that? And what I'm saying about Jindal and the others is that for the first time he is now being scrutinized much more carefully in terms of the wildness of a lot of what he is saying, and it is not holding up for the first time.

And that is the test. Can he get out of here? He's done this amazing thing. He's got this antenna vibrating with disaffected people in this country, and others who know that they have been screwed in this economy for the last 25 years. But he also is saying things that are off the chart. He's never read a biography of a president of the United States, he just said an interview.

JONES: No matter what he does tonight, he will still land lower than he would have had the convention been executed bitter. There have been so many sideshows.

MCENANY: I don't know about that.

JONES: I thought there have been many sideshows that, if he lands here, he could have been here.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: There have been sideshows. There have been incredible speeches. And I think we need to at least mention the kids. We have got to go, but the kids have been extraordinary.

I shouldn't say kids. They're adults. But Mike Pence said it best, you can't fake good kids. Ivanka, talk about all eyes on her tonight teeing up her father.

Kayleigh and Van and Carl and Margaret, thank you all so much.

MCENANY: Thank you.

BALDWIN: We're all watching the Q this evening. By the way, a new interview with Trump is definitely sparking some backlash today after he says it is not -- possible that the U.S. may not actually go and defend its NATO allies. It's going to depend on the situation.

[15:15:10]

We have much more on that explosive interview he did with "The New York Times" in the thick of his convention. We will talk about that.

Also ahead, Don Jr., Donald Trump Jr., definitely never one to hold back, he reacts to Ted Cruz, talks about the relationship with Ivanka and his siblings, especially over this past crazy year.

And we're now in that window for Hillary Clinton to announce her running mate. And we are now hearing that list has expanded by one. Hear whose name is rising.

You're watching CNN's special live coverage.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [15:20:14]

BALDWIN: So it's not often that the White House actually issues a statement clarifying the stance of a presidential nominee, but they just did after Donald Trump made some comments that have definitely had some in Europe and beyond, the foreign policy community, a little nervous.

Mr. Trump in an interview with "The New York Times" in the last 24 hours saying that he would not necessarily defend America's NATO allies if they were confronted by a foreign power, a la Russia, for example, unless those allies are essentially paying their bills.

So, first, let me just bring in my friend Brianna Keilar, our senior political correspondent, with more on what exactly Mr. Trump told "The Times" and the response.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: There is so much response, Brooke, coming from the Clinton campaign, the White House, the head of NATO, European countries, for instance.

But just to explain what this is, we are talking about NATO, 28 member nations. One of the really important principles behind NATO is Article V, collective defense, the idea that if I'm a NATO nation and you are a NATO nation and you're attacked, I am going to back you up.

So, this has been invoked once, after 9/11. This is the only time where NATO really followed through on that, but obviously a very key moment. And Donald Trump was asked about this in an interview with "The New York Times."

He said: "You can't forget the bills. Many NATO nations are not making payments, not making what they're supposed to make." And then he was asked, well, what if a NATO nation were attacked by Russia? What would the U.S. do?

And he seemed to put conditions on it. He said: "Have they fulfilled their obligations to us? If they have fulfilled their obligations to us, the answer is yes."

So a lot of reaction. The Clinton campaign saying Ronald Reagan would be ashamed, Harry Truman would be ashamed, and referring to the speeches at the convention last night, they said, "Tonight, Mike Pence said Donald Trump would stand with our allies. Tonight, Donald Trump flatly contradicted him."

The White House coming out as well saying that, look, this is an ironclad pledge that the U.S. has to NATO, that this is a steadfast commitment. And it just shows you, Brooke, that -- and I will say that privately a number of Republicans are concerned about this.

They, the White House, the Clinton campaign, they have a different point of view on the role of NATO. They believe it's an important alliance, it provides stability in Europe, and that this is something that works for the U.S. We're seeing a real schism here between that and Donald Trump, who

seems to really view it as a one-way street, where the U.S. isn't getting the better end of this deal.

BALDWIN: And also perhaps a schism with his own vice president on the ticket.

KEILAR: That's right.

BALDWIN: We will get to that.

KEILAR: Definitely.

BALDWIN: Brianna Keilar, thank you very much.

KEILAR: You bet.

BALDWIN: Let me bring in Kristen Soltis Anderson, columnist for "The Washington Examiner" and Republican strategist and pollster. Also, Mark Preston, executive editor for CNN politics.

Hello to both of you.

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Hi.

BALDWIN: Springboarding off of -- Brianna's sort of spelled it out, but let's also I just mentioned Governor Mike Pence on the ticket, speaking out last night. You have what Mr. Trump told "The Times," and then you have what Governor Pence said to the nation last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. MIKE PENCE (R-IN), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We cannot have four more years apologizing to our enemies and abandoning our friends. America needs to be strong for the world, to be safe, and on the world stage, Donald Trump will lead from strength.

Donald Trump will rebuild our military and stand with our allies. four

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Those last words, Kristen, stand with our allies, doesn't that contradict what Mr. Trump told "The Times"?

SOLTIS ANDERSON: There is a real hope on the Republican side that Mike Pence can be this bridge between the things that Donald Trump just kind of thinks in his mind and says, sort of shoots from the hip, and more traditional sort of Republican thought on how to handle issues, that Mike Pence can be somebody that says, hey, Donald, this is what the real implications are of what you said.

I think there's hope on the Republican side that rather this being a split, it's the sort thing where Pence can perhaps talk to the top of the ticket and get him back on the same page.

BALDWIN: What do you think of that and also why do you think he did this interview?

MARK PRESTON, CNN POLITICAL EDITOR: Right. Who knows why Donald Trump does much of anything?

But what's interesting is that they are diametrically opposed on so many issues, where you have Mike Pence having this truly robust, really conservative look at foreign policy, while Donald Trump doesn't seem to have that.

But in addition to that, when Donald Trump goes out and says we may not defend our allies, if you go back a few months, he talked about they need to pay their own way, that the United States shouldn't be funding NATO as a whole.

And what's interesting about that is, is that plays pretty well here in the United States when you have people, why are we sending money overseas, when we need to get our economy back?

BALDWIN: He's saying America first.

[15:25:00]

PRESTON: Right. So, that works well for a populist message that Donald Trump has been preaching.

And certainly that's why he won the Republican nomination, but it is going to cause problems in the Republican Party, there's no question.

BALDWIN: Does he -- I mean, he has to in the speech tonight address foreign policy. There has been this sort of cacophonous cry for him to be specific on foreign policy. So we got some of that, right, in this "New York Times" interview, and even talking about he's making some valid points, but NATO, it goes back to World War II.

This is a huge deal. Does he address -- do you think he doubles down on this tonight?

SOLTIS ANDERSON: Well, this has been something he's also been saying about Japan, so speaking of World War II, about how they also -- after World War II, we said we will defend Japan instead of them having their own military. He sort of challenged that idea.

In the polls, Donald Trump does really well against Hillary Clinton on the issue of the economy. He struggles on foreign policy. And so tonight he needs that to pass that commander in chief test and needs to prove that he doesn't just have tough rhetoric that sort of changes with the wind and just goes from the gut and he doesn't understand the geopolitical implications of what he's saying.

He needs tonight to prove you can have me at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and I'm not going to do things that create a scarier world. That's going to be a tough test for him, given where voters are right now.

PRESTON: Obviously, I think there is going to be an incredible amount of scrutiny on this speech, on everything he says. But I think he's probably served if he does two things, one, if he

stays with script, which we know he will not. He will eventually go off-script. Two, to be broad in when he talks about foreign policy. If he gets into specifics, guaranteed he will trip by tomorrow morning.

And we will wonder, why did he say that last night when he only said six months ago something entirely different?

BALDWIN: Tonight is the night. It is his night to speak, and we will -- the world will be watching.

Kristen.

And, Mark, happy birthday. Twenty-five looks good. Twenty-five looks very good.

PRESTON: Twenty-two.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Very good. Very good.

All right, moving on, Hillary Clinton, meantime, we're all going to be in Philadelphia next week right for her big show, the DNC. Hillary Clinton could be fewer than 24 hours away from announcing her pick for vice president. And New Jersey Senator Cory Booker seems to be on the short list.

We will talk about the final contenders here, as we're watching and waiting for that announcement in Florida.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)