Return to Transcripts main page


France's Highest Court Overturned Burkini Ban; Some French Mayors Refusing To End Burkini Ban; Trump To Deliver Immigration Policy Speech; Trump's New Ad Slams Clinton's Economic Policies; Weiner And Wife Separating Amid Sexting Allegations; President Santos: Colombia Will Accept Peace Deal; President Rousseff Defends Herself At Impeachment Trial; Some Villages Might Not Be Rebuilt. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired August 29, 2016 - 15:00:00   ET




HANNAH VAUGHAN JONES, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello. A very good evening to you. I'm Hannah Vaughan Jones sitting in for Hala Gorani, live

from CNN London. This is THE WORLD RIGHT NOW.

Welcome to the program. Liberty, equality, and fraternity, the fundamentals of what it means to be French, but now some mayors maybe going

rogue against those principles, point blank refusing to remove their ban on the burkini.

That means they are defying the country's highest court, which says those rules have got to go. The big question here, is it more insulting to

French culture to wear a burkini or to force a woman to take one off?

The debate is going on in many homes throughout France right now. The country's former president, Nicholas Sarkozy, who plans to run for the

office again next year, is also weighing in.


NICHOLAS SARKOZY, FORMER FRENCH PRESIDENT (through translator): I call today for a law because we can't leave mayors facing the situation on their

own. A law which would ban the Islamic swim suit or burkini. I'm not sure how to call it. A law which would special target the wearing of burkinis

on beaches and swimming pools because they're women. What will be the next step? What will they ask for? Different access hours?


JONES: There's a lot to talk about. As you can imagine, I'm going to bring in our political commentator, journalist, and author, Agnes Poiret,

who joins me now in the studio. Nicholas Sarkozy says he wants to defend French values, but is he also violating French principles in the process?

AGNES POIRIER, POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I would assume so because the state council, which is the highest administration court in France said it was

unconstitutional. Basically what happened is that the state council didn't retain the context, which was the source of the burkini ban.

Remember, because 86 people died in an Islamist terrorist attack and it's not a coincidence that it should be a few dozen towns just near Nice that

passed this ban in August.

And let's not forget that the ban is only for the months of August. So the mayors, you know, are pandering, really. It's a political pantomime,

because in effect, in two days' time, this ban is disappearing.

So they are just, you know, being defiant, but just for the theater of it. They know that if it goes on for a very long time, there will be sanctions.

You cannot deny the highest constitutional court.

JONES: The question I suppose here is about the un-French-ness, if you like, of the burkini. This ban, there are only a couple of days left to

it, it's specific to a Muslim dress. A French nun, for example, wouldn't be asked to remove her habit on the beach. It's specific to Muslim women.

POIRIER: Well, in effect, as the interior minister said yesterday, there is no need for this ban because there is a law, you know and it's been in

existence since 1905. There will be no ostentatious religious sign in public spaces.

But what we know as public spaces in France, it's the courts, the schools, the administrations. So, you know, what Nicholas Sarkozy did when he

passed the burqa ban a few years ago, he sort of extended the realm of public spaces.

Therefore this is this gray zone. Should the beach, the street, be considered as the same place as the court? So this is where that kind of

misunderstanding tends to happen.

JONES: One of those gray spaces, we see a live picture from Cannes, Cannes of course one of the cities, the towns most affected by this burkini ban,

it was first introduced there, Cannes itself was the first place to introduce it, and we understand that they will plan to defy to the high

court there and actually continue to ban the burkini on the shores there. Are we at the stage there where French values and incompatible with Muslim


[15:05:08]POIRIER: No, I don't think so, obviously not, and that's what the state council said very firmly. You know, it said the burkini ban is

in breach of fundamental freedom and doesn't improve public order, end of story.

What's happening in the south of France, let us not forget, it's a bastion of the French right and the extreme right, and we have upcoming general

elections and presidential elections in a few months' time. I would be very surprised if tomorrow and the day after, anybody gets fined.

JONES: Presumably there's no legal basis for the upholding of this ban as well by the mayors. They can't simply say, well, we just ignore what the

highest court in France is saying and actually send policemen out onto the beaches to force women to remove items of clothing. They just can't do it.

POIRIER: They can't do it. They can say they will defy it, but it's a political theater.

JONES: OK, well, this story will run on longer, even though we only have a few days until the end of the month. Agnes Poirier, we appreciate your

perspective on that. Thank you very much indeed.

Now this really isn't just about what people wear. It's also about national and personal identity. Tomorrow, Hala Gorani will bring you THE

WORLD RIGHT NOW live from Paris. She'll be joined by the former French foreign minister and a range of guests, this time tomorrow. Don't miss


Now, if you're having trouble keeping track of where Donald Trump stands on immigration, well, frankly, so are we. For days the U.S. Republican

presidential candidate has been softening his tone on some hard line policies. His campaign insists nothing has really changed. As Sara Murray

reports, all the speculation could soon come to an end.


DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are going to get rid of the criminals and it's going to happen within one hour after I take office,

believe me.

SARA MURRAY, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER (voice-over): Donald Trump announcing he'll deliver a highly anticipated immigration speech Wednesday in Arizona

after all.

KELLYANNE CONWAY, TRUMP CAMPAIGN MANAGER: If you want to be here legally, you have to apply to be here legally.

MURRAY: The Trump campaign insisting the proposal won't amount to amnesty or include a pathway to citizenship for undocumented immigrants.

CONWAY: We all learned in kindergarten to stand in line and wait our turn.

MURRAY: But as questions mount about to whether Trump is softening his hard line position from the primaries.

TRUMP: At least 11 million people in this country that came in illegally, they will go out.

MURRAY: Even his allies appear unclear on his stance.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST, "STATE OF THE UNION": What about the millions in this country right now?

MIKE PENCE, U.S. REPUBLICAN VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I think Donald Trump will articulate what we do with the people who are here. But I

promise you --

TAPPER: But he already has articulated it.

MURRAY: The GOP chairman even saying deporting all 11 million undocumented immigrants living in the U.S. is complicated.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's reflecting on it and his position is going to be known.

MURRAY: This as Trump plans a Labor Day weekend trip to a predominantly black church in Detroit, part of his ongoing effort to woo minority voters.

TRUMP: African-Americans, Hispanics, vote for Donald Trump. What do you have to lose? It can't get any worse. What do you have to lose?

MURRAY: The Republican nominee sparking controversy over the weekend for politicizing the death of Chicago Bulls star, Dwayne Wade's cousin,

tweeting, "Just what I have been saying, African-Americans will vote Trump."

An hour later, Trump offered his condolences. This tweet just the latest example of Trump facing criticism for touting his political positions in

the wake of tragedies.

TRUMP: It's horrible and it's only getting worse. I say vote for Donald Trump. I will fix it.

MURRAY: As Trump continues to blame the Democratic Party and Hillary Clinton for minority hardship and racial tension.

TRUMP (via telephone): They've run the inner cities for years and look what you have. They're like war zones.

How quickly people have forgotten that Hillary Clinton called black youth super predators, remember that, super predators.

MURRAY: Both Trump and Clinton's campaigns using their opponents' own words against each other.

TRUMP: What the hell do you have to lose?


JONES: Sara Murray reporting there. Hillary Clinton has outspent Trump on TV ads by far. He's making a big push this week, expanding an ad campaign

from four states to nine. Trump's new commercial targets Clinton's economic policies.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): In Hillary Clinton's America, the middle class gets crushed. Spending goes up. Taxes go up. Hundreds of thousands

of jobs disappear. It's more of the same but worse. In Donald Trump's America, working families get tax relief. Millions of new jobs are

created. Wages go up. Small businesses thrive. The American dream, achievable. Change that makes America great again.


[15:10:13]JONES: The presidential race is often the talk of Washington, but today it's sharing those headlines with a new scandal involving the

husband of long time Hillary Clinton aide, Huma Abedin.

A new report says Anthony Weiner has been caught sexting again. This time he reportedly exchanged racy photos with a woman for a year including one

that showed his son sleeping next to him.

Shortly after the news broke, Huma Abedin had some news of her own announcing she is separating from her husband, adding that they both,

quote, "remain devoted to doing what is best for our son."

Donald Trump, as you might imagine, didn't waste any time weighing in on this Weiner scandal. Let's get more on this now from CNN's Miguel Marquez,

live for us in New York.

Miguel, just explain to us why this very personal affair, personal breakup, could soon sort of define the presidential race.

MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Maybe not define it, but it's certainly bubbling up to presidential politics. One simple reason, the

headline in the Rupert-Murdoch-owned "New York Post," "pop goes the Weiner."

This woman, a 40-year-old divorcee, as "The New York Post" puts it for out west, that he had a relationship with over texting from January of last

year until just recently.

And in one of those photos, while they were in the midst of a sexual conversation, his son came in and laid down next to him. He tweeted to her

something to the effect of "someone just climbed into my bed."

"The New York Post" got ahold of all that and put it out there. Huma Abedin released her statement saying that they were separating. A friend

of hers tells CNN that they had been separated for months and she wasn't even wearing a wedding ring.

Donald Trump calls it more indication of Hillary Clinton's bad judgment, from a statement in part he says, "I only worry for the country in that

Hillary Clinton was careless and negligent in allowing Weiner to have such close proximity to highly classified information. Who knows what he

learned and who he told.

It's just another example of Hillary Clinton's bad judgment. It is possible that our country and its security have been greatly compromised by

this." There is not any indication that that is the case in "The New York Post's" article.

Weiner said that he felt that they were friends for some time, he and this woman, that their conversation was private, and there was never anything

inappropriate shared with her. I think clearly some people have a different scale for what is appropriate or inappropriate.

But no sign of the Hillary Clinton campaign saying anything official on this, but it deeply, deeply humiliating situation for Huma Abedin.

Anthony Weiner, who was could you tell out in 2011 when he meant to send a direct message via Twitter, instead he sent a tweet to the world that was

explicit in nature to a 21-year-old woman.

He was forced to resign. It looked like he was making an a comeback in 2013, running for mayor of New York, but once again caught sexting, using

the alias "Carlos Danger," ending his career -- Hannah.

GORANI: Thank you very much. It's also ended his marriage now. Miguel Marquez, thank you very much.

Still to come on the program, the Colombian president said perfect peace is possible. Will Colombians accept a deal to end the long-running conflict?

Plus Brazil's president is not going down without a fight. Hear what she said as she testified in her impeachment trial. We're live in the

Brazilian capital. Stay with us.



GORANI: Hello, welcome back. The Colombian president sells CNN he believes his country will accept an historic peace deal. It would end a

52-year conflict between the government and the rebel group called Farc. The deal still has to be approved by voters in a referendum on October 2nd,

but President Juan Santos told our Christiane Amanpour this is the best outcome possible.


JUAN MANUEL SANTOS, COLOMBIAN PRESIDENTI: Colombia is fed up with war. We don't want any more war. The more we explain what we achieved and the

terms of the agreement, people are accepting it more and more.

Because they know that perfect peace is impossible, but a good peace, like the one we just negotiated, that's the best thing for every Colombian and

for the world, because always to have peace is much better than to have war.


JONES: The final agreement was struck during talks in the Cuban capital. That's where we find our correspondent, Patrick Oppmann, who joins us from

Havana. Patrick, good to see you. Five decades or more of this conflict. Talk us through some of the most defining elements, if you like, of this

guerilla warfare.

PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It's the longest-running insurgency in Latin America. The U.S. pours billions of dollars into the government to

fight not only drug trafficking, but terrorism. The Farc is considered to be a terror group.

At one point, they controlled a piece of (inaudible) that was the size of Switzerland. We believe they have about 7,000 foot soldiers. So this is a

very modern, well-armed, guerilla force that makes a lot of money.

Critics accused by drug trafficking. It's not clear that there would ever be an end to the war on the battlefield. So pretty much everyone has

always said it needed to come down to peace talks.

The Colombian Army, although they have struck hard against the Farc in recent years, they've said they can't get into the deepest jungles where

they had their camps and this how the conflict had to end. Both sides are coming together and working out their differences, which is what they say

they have done -- Hannah.

JONES: The Colombian president told Christiane Amanpour that this is the best possible outcome that nothing is perfect. Is it a foregone conclusion

that the Colombian people will endorse this deal?

OPPMANN: Not at all. And really this is where after four years of grueling negotiations, the real work begins, both sides campaigning of who

are against this deal and there is a very vocal minority, some would say, but very vocal part of the society, led by a former president, that says

this is a bad deal.

That this is a group of killers and terrorists and they should be tried, should be fought on the battlefield, it should not be given what they call

amnesty. But it does seem at least right now that the yes vote will carry the day.

Of course, we still have over a month to go, but Colombians are exhausted by this war. Even if they hate the Farc, they believe, many Colombians,

that this is the best chance for peace.

And it seems like the majority will go out and vote yes. Of course nothing is done until it's done and both sides are campaigning very, very hard.

They either pass or kill this deal.

JONES: That vote taking place October 2nd. Patrick Oppmann live for us in Havana, the Cuban capital, thanks very much indeed.

Now suspended Brazilian president, Dilma Rousseff, has made one last push declaring her innocence at the start of her impeachment trial. In an

impassioned speech to the Brazilian Senate, she defended her record.

She's accused of doctoring the budget to hide a growing deficit ahead of her re-election two years ago. She insisted the nine months long attempt

to impeach her was nothing more than a power grab by her rivals.

[15:20:03]Senators are expected to take a final vote on Tuesday on whether to remove her from office. Let's talk more about what all this means ahead

of that crucial vote.

CNN's correspondent, Shasta Darlington joins us live from Brasilia. Not much time then for her to give her testimony for them to make a decision by


SHASTA DARLINGTON, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hannah, this is the dramatic finale of long-drawn-out impeachment proceedings. In fact, Rousseff was suspended

last May. It's only now that she's appearing in the Senate for the first time in person to defend herself against those accusations that she

manipulated the budget to hide a shortfall.

So she did have other opportunities, but she herself chose to come here to look her accusers in the eye and tell them that she hasn't doesn't anything

illegal that merits impeachment.

She actually used part of that impassioned 45-minute testimony to point her fingers at some of the lawmakers spearheading the impeachment drive who are

themselves being investigated for corruption. She says first that this is nothing more than a parliamentary coup de etat. Take a listen.


DILMA ROUSSEFF, BRAZILIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): In the face of these accusations against me in this process, I cannot stop feeling in my

mouth the sharp and bitter taste of injustice. And that's why as in the past, I resist. Don't expect from me the silent obsequiousness to cowards,

who in the past used weapons in today the judicial (inaudible) that aims a new to undermine democracy in the rule of law.


DARLINGTON: Now of course, there's been a long and drawn out Q and A following that testimony. Each of the 81 senators can use up to five

minutes to ask her questions and Rousseff can use as much time as she wants to answer them.

So voting is expected to begin as early as tomorrow, as you mentioned. It could begin even later. Two-thirds of senators would have to vote in favor

of the impeachment to finally remove Rousseff permanently from office.

That is widely expected to happen, in which case her vice president who replaced her on a temporary basis last May, he would take over permanently

until the term ends in 2018.

This is someone that Rousseff accuses of working behind the scenes to have her removed and who says he wants to shift both economic and social policy

further right, including privatizations, if and when this is confirmed -- Hannah.

JONES: Outside of the Senate, Shasta, what about the public mood? Now that the Olympics are over, have they turned their sporting joy to

political anger again?

DARLINGTON: You know, it hasn't heated up nearly as much as we saw just a few months ago. There were some supporters waiting for Dilma Rousseff when

she arrived at the Senate, they were carrying red flags and giving her roses. But the groups have been pretty small.

The Olympics provided a very entertaining distraction. At least at this point it doesn't look like the two rival sides have gone back out into the

streets in the forces we saw in the first half of this year.

Considering the vice president has already set up a government, we don't expect any big changes to make out of this if, as expected, the impeachment

is confirmed -- Hannah.

GORANI: All right, we have to leave it there. Shasta, good to talk to you as always, live for us there in Brazil. Thank you.

Facebook's CEO Mark Zuckerburg has met Pope Francis to talk about ways technology can help improve people's lives. Zuckerburg and his wife

greeted the pope earlier today at the Vatican. They talked about bringing hope to the world's most disadvantaged.

Zuckerberg later updated his personal Facebook page with this photo and gave Pope Francis a model of his company's drone. It's solar powered.

Facebook hopes it will expand internet access into developing countries.

Zuckerberg went on to hold a town hall in Rome, announcing last week this he would visit Italy after the country was hit by that devastating

earthquake in Central Italy.

Staying in the country, officials say nearly 3,000 people have been displaced by last week's quake and are living in temporary camps.

Investigators are looking into whether shoddy building standards contributed to the scale of the destruction. Some buildings were recently

renovated, yet they did not withstand the shaking.

As Fred Pleitgen reports, some picturesque villages that were destroyed may never be rebuilt.


FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The grueling work continues for Italian search crews still pulling bodies

from the rubble. Whole communities have been shattered by the loss of life and infrastructure.

(Inaudible) Paratzi (ph) was in the hardest-hit town of Amatrice when the earth began to shake. "It was my daughter's birthday the day of the wake,"

he says. "We organized a party. Five of the girls were invited were killed in the quake. She had played with some of them the night before the


[15:25:02]More than 200 people died in Amatrice alone. Italy's prime minister has vowed to rebuild this ancient town, but some of the smaller

villages in this mountainous area may not be so lucky.

This town is just down the road from Amatrice.

(on camera): Like so many villages in this area, this one has been evacuated after the earthquake, but the residents here face a much more

fundamental question, and that is whether they'll ever be able to return to their homes, whether this village will be viable in the future.

(voice-over): Rosella Santerili (ph) is one of only 12 residents of the village. She's been staying in this camper van since the quake struck,

afraid to enter any building because of frequent aftershocks.

"I don't think there will be a future," she says. "Our village is poor, there are no people and no jobs." Amatrice is five miles away but there's

nothing left of that.

As she and the others survey the damage to their houses, Italy has some tough decisions to make. Should villages like this one with a tiny

population in an area prone to earthquakes be fixed or is it better or safer to abandon them?

There are villages that were already empty before the quake, she says. There are almost no young people anywhere. The towns are old. I think now

they will really depopulate.

For many tourists, villages like this one epitomize the beauty of the Italian countryside. On top of the horrible human toll this earthquake has

caused, in the long run, it may have accelerated the demise of a piece of this country's rich, ancient heritage as well. Fred Pleitgen, CNN, Italy.


GORANI: Well, there was a glimmer of optimism for residents of one town hit by that quake. A couple got married over the weekend, despite their

local church being severely damaged. They decided to go ahead with their wedding plans to try to bring some joy to the locals and their neighbors.

Instead of the church, they held their ceremony right in the middle of the town square. Congratulations to them.

Coming up on the program, Turkey's president reaffirms his determination to fight terrorism as Turkey's military hits targets in Northern Syria. We'll

look closer at the country's latest controversial moves in a live report just ahead.

Plus this pen could save your life, but what if you couldn't afford it? A price hike had the maker of EpiPen facing a PR nightmare. What they're

doing now to ease the public anger. All that and more after this break.


JONES: Hello. Welcome back. We're going to take you through this hour's top stories. Several French mayors are refusing to drop their city's ban

on burkini even after France's highest court struck down the bans. Supporters of the bans say burkinis are inconsistent with France's

secularism. Critiques say the defiant mayors are trying to appease right wing voters.

The FBI is investigating how hackers got access to databases for elections systems in the U.S. states of Arizona and Illinois. Investigators say in

Illinois alone more than 200,000 voters' records were compromised. The attack happened in late June. Officials say they don't believe the

breaches will have an impact on November's presidential election.

Brazilian President Dilma Rousseff defended herself today at the start of her impeachment trial. She told the Brazilian Senate she's innocent and

did not commit a crime. Mr. Rousseff is accused of manipulating the country's budget ahead of her 2014 reelection. A final Senate vote is

expected on Tuesday.

Turkey's president is strengthening his stance on the fight against terrorism. He says his country will not differentiate between terrorist

organizations. Among the groups he included are ISIS, Syrian Kurds, and the plotters of Turkey's failed coup.

His comments come as the Turkish military escalates its attacks in Northern Syria. Turkey media reports that in just 24 hours Turkey has launched 61

artillery strikes around the border town of Jarablus.

Many of those strikes were against Kurdish forces whom Turkey considers terrorists but whom the U.S. supports in the fight against ISIS. And

Turkish media says the military helped the Free Syrian Army, quote, "cleanse terrorist" from 13 Syrian villages near those country's borders.

Let's head straight to Gaziantep in Southern Turkey, just north of the Syrian border and that's where we find our senior international

correspondent, Nick Paton Walsh.

It's a confusing picture, Nick, Turkish action on Syrian soil now, must be making it even more confusing for coalition forces in the area.

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, the Americans today are trying to bring some sense of clarity to this.

Remember, they found themselves caught, frankly, on both sides of the line.

When Turkey intervened about six days ago assisting Syrian rebels, they were helping people who were already getting American help to kick ISIS out

of the border town of Jarablus intentionally move further into Northern Syria.

That's very much in keeping with U.S. policy, something Washington is keen to see happen. But it meant they ran into another American ally in the

fight against ISIS, the Syrian Kurds, who Turkey consider to be terrorists.

Those Syrian Kurds have moved into a town called Manbij which they kicked ISIS out of. Those two forces have been clashing over the past days.

There's been an air strike claimed by the Turkish military to have killed 25 Syrian Kurdish militants.

Some activists said civilians were caught in that too. They've cleaned out villages. The Americans have stepped in and basically trying to get both

sides to pull back. The Americans drew a red line a few days ago saying the Syrian Kurds they were supporting shouldn't be across the Euphrates


They now claim those Syrian Kurdish forces they've been backing are moving or are mostly across the eastern side of the Euphrates, respecting that red

line. They've asked the Turks not to attack those Syrian Kurds and not move much further south than Jarablus.

We'll have to wait and see if either side is listening to the Americans. They have very specific agendas of their own. We get the indication the

Syrian Kurds are pulling east as requested, maybe moving out of Manbij, not entirely clear. We could get the idea that Syrian rebels are moving south

with quite a degree of force here and Turkish backing.

The broad question is do they keep fighting as in the past few days or this American intervention actually keep them away from each other? If they're

fighting each other, they're not fighting ISIS, and that frankly is bad for everybody -- Hannah.

GORANI: Nick, we appreciate it. Nick Paton Walsh in Gaziantep, Southern Turkey for us. Turkey's president has made it clear he'll fight Kurdish

forces with the same determination as he fights ISIS. But the military's action in Syria has caused concern in the U.S., as Nick was explaining.

Well, Soner Cagaptay joins me now live from Washington, the director of the Turkish Research Program at the Washington Institute. Good to talk to you.

Let's break this down for us, if you can.

As I understand it, Turkey and the U.S. are on the same side, and yet the U.S. is currently fighting against ISIS, whereas Turkey doesn't want them

to use the Kurds in order to actually defeat ISIS. It's confusing for anyone, right?

SONER CAGAPTAY, DIRECTOR, TURKISH RESEARCH PROGRAM, WASHINGTON INSTITUTE: It sure is. The way it goes is, the United States is trying to

compartmentalize its war against ISIS in Syria, work with one actor in one area in Syria and with another actor in another part of Syria.

That worked until recently, until Turkey led an incursion into northern Syria, a very successful one, to take the border town of Jarablus from the

Islamic State. There's a major accomplishment because Jarablus is a major conduit for ISIS to smuggle foreign fighters into Syria and suicide bombers

out of Syria.

So we're all safer because Turkey took that town. At the same time, now that Turkey is in Western Syria, it has complicated U.S. efforts to

compartmentalize its struggle against ISIS.

Because Turkey takes issue with close U.S. cooperation with the Kurds, the Syrian Kurdish party which is closely linked to the Turkish-Kurdish Party

that Ankara is fighting. By extension, the Turks are very unhappy about the U.S. alliance.

I think what Washington is trying to do is re-compartmentalize the situation so that the Kurds will withdraw east of the Euphrates and that it

can work with the Turks west of the Euphrates.

Really what it boils down to I think is that the Kurdish groups that have captured large territories east of the Euphrates want to do the same along

the western side and Turkey wants to block that.

Turkey is fighting ISIS, but it's also trying to block Kurdish advances, and it's hitting two birds with one stone at the same time.

JONES: Of course, we could argue that one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. I guess this is what President Erdogan is trying to say

today, he says a terrorist is a terrorist, whether we're talking about the PKK or ISIS. Is there any accuracy in that claim that the PKK is actually

a terrorist organization?

CAGAPTAY: The PKK is a terrorist organization. This is how it's recognized not just by the government of Turkey but by NATO, the European

Union, and the United States. It has targeted civilians in the past, including through suicide bombings. There is no doubt about it.

I think the question is whether the PKK-aligned group in Syria can make further territorial advances. Turkey has until recently watched advances

by Syrian Kurds as the group marched from East Syria into West Syria and crossed the Euphrates.

I think Washington's policy was that the United States wanted the Syrian Kurds to take parts of towns from ISIS, but after they liberated those

towns, they would withdraw from them back into Syria.

The Syrian Kurds did not hold on to their end of the bargain. And I think that's one reason why Turkish intervention came in, because Turkey wanted

them to move out.

Of course, Turkey went in really to liberate towns from Jarablus, but it now finds itself in a strategically positive situation, in the sense that

it has artillery inside Syria and can shell those Kurdish positions west of Euphrates, which it could not do before the incursion because they were too

far away and outside the reach of the Turkish artillery.

If I could guess, I would say that Turkey will be successful in driving the Kurds east of Euphrates because Washington wants to work with both Turkey

and the Kurds, and the only way it can do that is to re-compartmentalize the battle against ISIS and Syria.

So that east of the Euphrates it works with the Kurds and Turkey does not have a problem with that, that the United States works with the Kurds east

of the Euphrates but at the same time they'll work with the Turks west of the Euphrates.

JONES: We understand today that at the end of the week, on the fringes of the G-20, President Obama and President Erdogan will meet, no doubt top of

the agenda for them. What does Turkey want, though? Does it want the U.S. to completely abandon Kurdish forces in the fight against ISIS, or just to

refrain them from acting on the Turkey/Syria border?

CAGAPTAY: I think Turkey wants at the minimum that the United States uses influence over Kurdish groups so that they do not form a Kurdish, pro-PKK-

friendly belt along the Turkish border that would be nearly 400 miles long. Much of that belt is formed east of the Euphrates.

I think Ankara's fear is that the Kurdish groups would capture territory enveloping Turkey to the south, creating a PKK-friendly Kurdish entity. I

think Turkey's objections are against the Kurdish group capturing territory and enveloping Turkey from the south.

There is an opportunity here. Until recently, Turkey was almost obsessed, I say obsessed because it was, with the idea of ousting Assad. That is not

happening. I think Turkey is now seeing the writing on the wall, that the Assad regime is saying, that Washington and Russia might agree.

So it is really shifting its priorities from ousting Assad to fight Assad and blocking Kurdish offensive.

[15:40:11]JONES: Just one final question to you, sir, then. What about Turkey recently cozying up, if you like, to Russia? That's got to be

worrying to the United States. Is that a change of tack by President Erdogan?

CAGAPTAY: I think it's part reality and part theater. The reality part of it is that the coup in Turkey was a very traumatic event. This was not a

coup in the sense that the military didn't try to take over.

It was a faction within the military that carried out an attack against the president and against the parliament and bombed the country's capital. The

country was traumatized and Russia was the first country to reach out.

I think that what it's real that the Turks appreciate that. But there is also theater, Turkey is not going to leave NATO. I think Turkey remains a

committed NATO ally, but of course Putin wants to take advantage of this to divide Turkey away from NATO.

That's why I think it's great that President Obama is going to meet Turkish President Erdogan at the G-20 Summit in China. I think Turkey needs tender

loving care and that's what it ought to be getting from President Obama.

JONES: It's always good to talk to you. We appreciate your perspective. No doubt we'll speak to you again after that meeting between Erdogan and

Obama. Thank you.

Millions of civilians have fled the ongoing violence inside Syria. Now the Obama administration is reaching its target of resettling 10,000 Syrian

refugees in the U.S. by October the 1st. One month early.

America's national security adviser is calling the milestone a, quote, "meaningful step" that we hope to build upon. The International Rescue

Committee has already urged a new commitment from the U.S. to welcome 140,000 refugees next year.

This is THE WORLD RIGHT NOW. Coming up next, a critical lifeline for allergy suffers as one drug maker discounts this vital medicine. But why

did it take a global backlash to make them do it?

Then Beyonce made a huge splash at the Music Video Awards last night, but perhaps her biggest moment was offstage. We'll explain all, ahead.


JONES: The drug maker, Mylan, says it will soon offer a generic version of its lifesaving allergy treatment, EpiPen, and at half the price. But Mylan

says cost is the only difference, otherwise the two versions are identical, both in formula and function.

The off-brand version comes after Mylan hikes the price is setting off a fierce backlash. A social media campaign started by parents highlighted

the fact that prices had surged more than 400 percent since 2009.

Let's bring in CNN Money editor-at-large, Richard Quest, who is live for us from New York at the moment. Richard, good to see you. Talk us through

what the outrage is here. Is it the fact that there was a price hike of the original pen or that there is a delay in issuing the new one?

[15:45:13]RICHARD QUEST, CNN MONEY EDITOR-AT-LARGE: No, the outrage is the way over the last five years the EpiPen price has effectively gone up by

500 percent for a product that's been around for some years, that's well- amortized its research and development costs, and is believed to cost less than $200 to actually manufacture.

So what the families have said is this is price gouging pure and simple on the back of insurance companies who pay the bill. Now, the extraordinary

development, if you like, is this announcement that Mylan is going to make a cheaper version which is the same thing.

Because as has been pointed out, effectively what they're doing is halving the price but calling it something else. Now, usually, Hannah, when

companies make a generic, they do it secretly, they supply somebody else with it, they don't want to dilute the brand name by appearing to make a

tawdry second class product, if you like.

But here, they're saying, no, no, this is identical, same formula, works same way, it's just half the price. It is absolutely bewildering, what

purpose their announcement serves, since no one in their right mind would buy the full price one even though it's got "EpiPen" on it, if you can buy

it half price because it has "Epidoodle" or whatever on it.

JONES: This EpiPen that is widely use across the United States, but how does it compare in usage and also price across the world?

QUEST: Well, look, the EpiPen has got roughly 90 percent of the market in the United States. There are others, one made by an Israeli company called

Teva, which has been refused a license in the U.S. for the time being. So there are others encroaching into the market.

That's very much what Mylan is doing. Even if there are others elsewhere selling, you make more money selling pharmaceuticals in the United States

than anywhere else. That is not new.

Antiretrovirals for HIV can be up to ten times more expensive than they would be charged in a developing or even in the European Union. Take the

United Kingdom. There's a pyramid, if you like. Top is the United States.

Thereafter, you've got countries like the United Kingdom, Germany, France, Australia, thereafter, you've got secondary countries, third countries, and

then you start working down to developing countries where those same pharmaceuticals can be sold for as little as 10 percent of the cost that

the market will bear in the U.S.

JONES: Just briefly then, Richard, when is this generic pen going to be available? How long will people have to wait before they get their cut

price anti-allergy pen?

QUEST: I haven't seen a time or date on that. I think people are slightly gob smacked at the audacity of Mylan to announce they're bringing out

exactly the same product at half the price with a different name. Hannah, I've covered these things for a long time. I've never seen quite such an

announcement that makes so little sense as this one.

JONES: Thank you for explaining what we know so far. Richard Quest, thanks very much indeed.

A freak weather incident has left environmentalists baffled and stunned. What we're about to show you is very disturbing and the result of a

devastating act of Mother Nature.

It happened in Norway. A lightning strike killed more than 300 wild reindeer. The carcasses were discovered across a small area in a national

park after a heavy storm. The Norwegian Environment Agency says it's never seen so many animals killed by a lightning strike at the same time.

Meteorologist, Tom Sater, joins us now from CNN Weather Center. Tom, just explain what's happened here.

TOM SATER, AMS METEOROLOGIST: It's extremely interesting, Hannah. They were in a herd, outdoors, and likely the highest object. However to have

that many is a little concerning. It's an in Norway. We don't have that much lightning activity when it comes to the rest of the world.

We have lightning cloud to cloud, but it's the ones that come down to the ground. If you're outside and there is a lightning storm and your hair

stands up that means you got positive charges that are making your hair stand up.

Lightning strikes, you know, it's five times hotter than the surface of the sun. It's like 95,000 degrees kelvin. Usually it's in open areas.

Lightning strikes the earth 100 times a second. It varies on where you live.

[15:50:05]And we can break that down a little bit more, but first, the national park is to the west in Oslo. The satellite imagery confirms on

Friday a pretty tremendous storm moved through with heavy rain. The back end, they had the lightning.

They didn't realize that this herd was down until they did a flyover on Friday afternoon. But this is what's interesting. You go to the north in

Scandinavia, the light colors of purple, this is your lightning rates. It's typical in the tropics. Not that far to the north.

So it doesn't mean there wasn't a lightning strike, but authorities are going to take a sample from every one of those reindeer that is one year of

age and older. They'll do brain samples, a typical process that they do to check for disease.

But I mean, your chances of getting struck are 1 in 12,000. Ninety percent of the people do survive, 32 deaths this year in the U.S., the greatest

number of deaths in the U.S. in the lasting seven years. The states in red, typically because you're outdoors, farming, at the beach.

Not just the U.S. but all of the northern hemisphere, in July where you see the greatest deaths. So on average, 33 in the U.S. Look at India, 2,000

to 3,000. This has been a terrible year for the monsoon season.

In fact, the end of June we had over 190 deaths, Bangladesh had another 65. What's sad about the story was that 70 were calves of the 323. Five are

still alive, but they had to euthanize those. Authorities will look over this to make sure it was lightning, but most likely it was. Cardiac arrest

for the entire herd.

JONES: Such a sad story. Tom, we appreciate it. Tom Sater there at the CNN Weather Center, thank you.

Stay with us here on THE WORLD RIGHT NOW. Plenty more stories coming up after this break. Don't go away.




JONES: Well, she ain't called Queen Bee for nothing. Superstar singer, Beyonce stole the show at Sunday night's MTV Music Video Awards. She

snatched up eight prices including the top one. Beyonce invited some African-American mothers whose unarmed sons were shot by police.

They were joining her on the red carpet. Gun violence has been a strong theme in her latest album as well. There was a lot of action then at last

night's award show.

Let's get into it all with CNN's entertainment reporter, Chloe Melas, who is with us from New York. Chloe, good to see you. Blink and you missed

another outfit change from Beyonce, but she also used her superstar status to really make something of a political statement.

CHLOE MELAS, CNN ENTERTAINMENT REPORTER: Of course, and we would expect nothing less from her. Nobody knew she would be attending, even though she

was nominated for 11 nominations last night. You might have thought she would close out the show, but no, she surprised everybody in the middle.

I was there live in the audience, I can tell you people were shocked, screaming, jumping up and down. She did make a political statement, not

only empowering female African-American women all over the world, basically moving forward the conversation with Black Lives Matter.

She did so many hits off of Lemonade, I couldn't even keep up watching her. I was exhausted for her.

JONES: And Kanye also there, most people looking at Kim Kardashian, but what was Kanye up to?

[15:55:05]MELAS: Well, so Kanye was given 4 minutes by MTV to go up there and just talked about whatever he wanted. He premiered a new music video,

but while he was up there, he took on, again, the Black Lives Matter Movement, talking about the shootings and the gun violence in Chicago.

And then he even called out his ex-girlfriend, Amber Rose, in the audience, who I actually got a chance to speak to on the red carpet. And I think

actually we have a clip of what she told me about standing up for women and how she's been slut-shamed and cyberbullied. It was really interesting.


AMBER ROSE, HOST, VMA: I took a lot of punches for that, for being a feminist, and a lot of scrutiny. I'm OK with that because I do it for

women. And it makes me very happy to take that pain away from them and put it on myself. That's why I have my second annual slut-walk, October 1st.

We talk about body image, no sexual violence, no slut-shaming. It's an extreme form of bullying we deal with as women. It's really unfortunate.

I like to be the voice to bring confidence to women and bring awareness to everyone.


MELAS: So he's definitely using her celebrity for good. Kanye was only given four minutes by MTV and of course, he went over, he went over five

minutes, and premiered his new music video, "Fade," which was not controversial but had a very bizarre ending, everybody was left, like,

what, what happened? It was weird. But I want to tell you about Britney Spears, about her big come back performance, do we have time for that?

JONES: I'm not sure we do, though. We'll have to tell our viewers to go and watch it themselves and catch up with what Kanye was up to as well. We

have to leave it there, Chloe. We appreciate it, thank you.

One thing you didn't see in the crowd there, Taylor Swift. That's right, Swifties, there was a blank space in her spot because she was on jury duty,

which her fellow jurors found guilty of being awesome. They took pictures and videos and shared them on Twitter.

If you see Swift in a courtroom in Nashville, Tennessee sometime soon, watch out, she'll know you were in trouble when you walked in, oh, yes, we

did it.

That has been THE WORLD RIGHT NOW. Thanks so much for watching. Richard Quest has "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" up next.


QUEST: The Dow Jones Industrials is up 109 points. Industry is ringing the closing bell. I have a good feeling about this, Gentlemen. The gavel

will be a good start with a start of a good week --