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Interview With Texas Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee; Presidential Debate Moderators Announced; Storm Drenches East Coast; FBI Releases Clinton E-Mail Report. Aired 15-15:30p ET

Aired September 02, 2016 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:00]

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hour two. We begin with breaking news. Thanks for being with me on this Friday. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Let's get to it, these new Details from inside Hillary Clinton's closed-door meeting with the FBI. CNN now has obtained this report that the FBI sent on to the Justice Department recommending no charges be brought against Hillary Clinton during this investigation into her private e-mail server.

From this report, we expect to be able to learn why, first of all, why she wasn't charged in connection with her use of this private e-mail server when she was secretary of state, but it also contains the FBI's notes on the answers that Clinton gave to them when they were questioning her.

You remember this meeting in July only lasted about three-and-a-half- hours.

So, let's begin here with Evan Perez, our justice correspondent who's been combing through this report, him and our justice team.

And, so, Evan, what have you found?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brooke, there were 39 times, 39 times that the FBI asked questions of Hillary Clinton, and in which she responded that she could not recall.

And most of these have to do with questions that she was asked about how she knew or what kind of preparations she was given, any kind of training she was given of how to handle classified information.

She repeatedly said that she could not recall being instructed about how to handle some of these classified materials on her unclassified e-mail system. She did say that she did not set up this system to evade the Freedom of Information Act or the Federal Records Act, that she did it, as she said has before, for convenience.

But one of the things that emerges from this interview in particular is you see what caused her the biggest problems here. And that is the repeated discussions about the drone program, the CIA drone program. This is a program that the CIA still is -- it is a covert program. Everybody knows it exists. And if you are the State Department, you often have to deal with it.

But talking about it in an unclassified e-mail is a big, big problem. And that is what has overshadowed her entire campaign. That's what really began these questions from the CIA and the intelligence community.

And the other thing that you get from reading these documents is the awareness she has and people on her team about hackers and the possibility that they may be trying to break in to not only her system, but those of people who she's communicating with. She's aware that some of the people she's talking to have been hacked.

And you can see repeated discussions. The FBI asks her about that, but she doesn't seem to really grasp that this was a problem for her unclassified e-mail system.

We do have -- obviously, this is a political story, and we already have a response or a reaction from the Trump campaign. A spokesman sent out a statement. I will read you a part of it. It says: "Hillary Clinton is applying for a job that begins each day with a top-secret intelligence briefing, and the notes from her FBI interview reinforce her tremendously bad judgment and dishonesty."

I think if you talk to the Clinton campaign, they wanted these documents out, Brooke, because they think they believe it will help show that the FBI really did everything they could to see if there was anything here to bring charges, and they arrived at the conclusion that while she was careless, obviously, it did not merit bringing charges against the former secretary of state.

BALDWIN: OK. Evan, stick around with me. I want you to join my next conversation here, because you are the one who's been in the weeds going through all of these pages of notes.

And so joining me now, I have co-author of "52 Reasons to Vote for Hillary," former Clinton pollster Bernard Whitman, and Boris Epshteyn, senior adviser to the Trump campaign.

Here we go. Actually, I would like to begin with you here, because on the last note of Evan's was on these -- the worries of hacking. And to take it a step further, I know Evan has said that the FBI cannot say for sure that these e-mails were not hacked.

BERNARD WHITMAN, CO-AUTHOR, "52 REASONS TO VOTE FOR HILLARY": You know what's amazing, Brooke? You know what the FBI can say for sure and has said for sure for over a year-and-a-half? That the State Department e-mail system was hacked numerous times.

It was the worst cyber-intrusion in the United States government history.

BORIS EPSHTEYN, SENIOR ADVISER, TRUMP CAMPAIGN: I haven't heard that at all.

WHITMAN: Are you kidding? Go back to look at the report. It was 18 months ago. It was March, right when this whole thing blew up. The FBI said the Russian hackers attacked the State Department e-mail system numerous times.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: I think one thing we know is that the State Department e- mail system was hacked. Hillary Clinton's e-mails system likely was not.

EPSHTEYN: OK, that is a ridiculous pivot.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: But hang on. Hang on. Hang on, Boris. I know you want to jump in.

But the fact that the FBI cannot say with regard to her e-mails that they were not conclusively not totally hacked, that's not a good thing.

WHITMAN: No, it's not a good thing. But you know what is a good thing? The release of this report.

The Clinton campaign wanted this report to come out. Why? Because the FBI had an exhaustive year-long investigation. They talked to probably dozens and dozens and dozens of people, hours, hours and hours of testimony. And the decision not to recommend prosecution for her was absolutely unanimous.

Was it careless? Yes. Was it a mistake? Yes. Has Hillary Clinton said, I should not have done this and if I ever had to do it again, I would make a different decision? Yes.

BALDWIN: But was it criminal? No.

(CROSSTALK)

[15:05:01]

WHITMAN: It was not criminal. Let's move on.

EPSHTEYN: I guess that is the benchmark not to become president, is not to be a criminal in jail.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: To be competent, Boris, unlike your candidate.

EPSHTEYN: Go through the facts, 17,500 e-mails that she lied about turning over. The server wipe. Within weeks of there being a report that she had a private server, it was wiped.

She thought that C which stands for classified stood for cookie or something, which stands for classified. She thought that drone strikes are not classified. She said that the reason she used the private servers is for

convenience and that she only had one device. She used 13 BlackBerrys -- let me finish -- and five iPads. At least she doesn't stick to the BlackBerry, iPad.

This is somebody who is absolutely disqualified from becoming president. They destroyed BlackBerrys with hammers in the State Department. That's not...

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Evan -- hold on.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. Hang on.

Evan Perez, hammers? Fact-check that for me, please, on the fly.

PEREZ: Yes, they did, Brooke.

EPSHTEYN: Thanks, Evan.

BALDWIN: They did.

PEREZ: As you mentioned, there were 13 devices, mobile devices, and five iPads that the FBI said that in some way were used with her private e-mail server. And they did in some cases just destroy them with hammers when they were done using them.

WHITMAN: That's a pretty good way of destroying a device.

(CROSSTALK)

EPSHTEYN: That is absolutely not following the rules and regulations of the State Department. You know it. Your 52 reasons just went down to one. No reasons left.

Listen, here's the bottom line here. This is somebody who's disqualified from becoming president. She said that she didn't remember her training because of the concussion.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: Enough of your grandstanding.

(CROSSTALK)

EPSHTEYN: These are all facts.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: Boris, your candidate has committed inducement to incite espionage.

(CROSSTALK) EPSHTEYN: What are you talking about?

WHITMAN: Are you kidding?

EPSHTEYN: OK, sounds good.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: ... commit espionage against the United States. That, frankly, should be a treasonous offense.

EPSHTEYN: That is a huge reach.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: It is not a huge reach.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: Where are you going with that?

EPSHTEYN: Yes, he's going nowhere.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: One voice, gentlemen, please.

WHITMAN: We have someone who is so irresponsible with national security information that he is inviting a foreign leader who is hostile to the United States to engage in electronic espionage against the government and against the party.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You're referring to Putin.

WHITMAN: Vladimir Putin.

EPSHTEYN: What is the example?

WHITMAN: He said, you know what, why don't you go ahead and hack the DNC?

EPSHTEYN: That's not all he said. He said, if anyone -- can we have Evan fact-check that? Because that is not the truth.

The fact of the matter is, all Donald Trump said, if anyone has those e-mails out there, we should turn them over to the FBI.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: It was inducement to commit espionage.

EPSHTEYN: OK. In your mind only. Maybe that's another reason for your book.

BALDWIN: On the I don't recall point, Evan, let me actually just bring you back, because you said 39 times she said I could not recall.

In what context? Was that with regard to all different kinds of questions, on drones and in classification levels or what?

PEREZ: They had mostly to do, Brooke, with whether or not she was aware of the propriety of using her unclassified system to discuss some of these different issues, whether or not she ever got a security training briefing to tell her how to use her unclassified system to talk about sensitive programs.

And here is the most interesting one. There is a discussion back in 2011 around Christmastime that the CIA is planning to do a drone strike. There is some discussion among some State Department officials. What's remarkable is the secretary of state says that she wasn't aware of what the rules are for handling this type of stuff over Christmas holidays, because, as you know, over the holidays, people are traveling.

They don't have access to their classified SCIFs, their secure systems to communicate. And she said she didn't really know. There was no protocols for dealing with that. That's kind of shocking, frankly, that you don't know that you can't talk about something so sensitive as the drone program.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: I actually think it is an indictment of the system that the State Department clearly had.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: You are passing the buck onto the system. It doesn't look good.

WHITMAN: Look, the fact of the matter is, this has been investigated ad nauseam. There is -- Hillary Clinton even said, is there smoke? Yes, there is smoke, but there is no fire here. We need to move on to the actual real issues.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: Not only did she fail as secretary of state. She was a horrible secretary of state. We just had the information...

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: We just had the information on Iran come out. That deal had secret a clause in it which allowed Iran to keep uranium. She was a terrible secretary of state.

But she couldn't even follow the rules. Listen, if you had a teacher in a school that broke all the rules of that school, you wouldn't elect that teacher to be principal. That is what she is trying to do. She is absolutely unqualified.

There is going to be more that is coming out just 20 minutes ago, about half-hour, that all this broke. There will be more coming out. She could not bring herself to follow the rules of the State Department. And the question has to be asked, why? What is she hiding? What was in those 13 BlackBerrys?

You know there is also a laptop of information with classified information that's simply missing now? That came out in the 302s as well. No one knows where it is. She was so responsible. She cannot be allowed to be president.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: I understand this is something -- and we will continue hearing this from the Trump campaign until it is November 8.

WHITMAN: And when Donald Trump is defeated for the presidency.

[15:10:01]

BALDWIN: OK.

EPSHTEYN: That's your answer. She is not qualified to be president. There is about a million reasons in here.

(CROSSTALK)

WHITMAN: Actually, I think that the American people will absolutely decide that she is qualified. And that's why she's ahead in the polls.

EPSHTEYN: She's not ahead in the polls. We're ahead in the polls. And we will be ahead by a lot after all this.

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: We're going.

Evan Perez, thank you so much as well. Thank you.

Now to this. Now to Tropical Storm Hermine, threatening virtually the entire East Coast just in time, of course, for Labor Day weekend here. Hermine is no longer a hurricane, but the weather service is warning this is still a very, very dangerous storm.

Right now, you have these communities all up and down Georgia, the Carolinas. They're preparing for high winds and flooding. We have shelters are opening as well. The storm hit Florida overnight, flooded neighborhoods, downed trees, knocked out power. Hermine is now heading northward.

We have my colleague Martin Savidge, who is Outer Banks, Kill Devil Hills, North Carolina.

How are things looking there, Martin?

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The conditions have started to get worse, Brooke, no doubt about it. About 1:00 is when the rain set in, but now the wind is starting to

pick up. Not expected to be a major, devastating storm here, but it is still one that they are very concerned about for a number of reasons. It is expected that here at the Outer Banks is where Hermine is going to once again get over water.

Once that happens, that has the potential to create this storm or give it more strength. They will be watching that very closely. Right now, the wind gusts are expected to be around 30, 40 miles an hour, six to eight inches. All of that is not thought to be hugely problematic.

But in the state here, they aren't taking anything lightly; 33 counties have been placed under states of emergency. That's essentially to have the equipment and the emergency personnel ready. As the governor put it, they'd rather be overprepared and underwhelm by this storm.

The biggest concern right now and the greatest danger is really out on the water itself. Along this beach, they have shut it down because of riptides. And that's potentially the greatest threat to life all along the Eastern Seaboard this holiday weekend. A lot of folks would want to be in the water. Now it is simply too dangerous for that to happen.

They are telling people, get out, stay out. So for now it is not looking like it is going to be a highly destructive storm here. They will be watching out for spinoff tornadoes and, of course, flash flooding. The greatest damage right now seems to be to many people's holiday plans. A lot of folks have packed up, headed north and decided home is the best place to ride out a wet weekend -- Brooke.

BALDWIN: Oh, boy, I will be at my very first U.S. Navy football game. I can think a lot of sailors who are hoping for a first time. They don't want see the water.

Martin Savidge, thank you so much there for us in Kill Devil Hills, North Carolina.

Finally here, just three weeks until the big debate, the moderators revealed. Does Donald Trump think they're fair? Let's discuss that.

Also ahead, the bishop interviewing Mr. Trump tomorrow in Detroit is being called a sellout. He's being called a pawn. We talked to him last hour. Strong interview. We learned Trump reportedly got the questions, scripted the answers in advance of their sit-down. How might that change the interview? You will hear coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:17:08]

BALDWIN: Welcome back. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.

Big news today on the presidential debate front. Have you heard? We know now who will be refereeing when Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton finally get to go at each other face to face here.

You have NBC's Lester Holt. He will be moderating that very first debate. The second will be jointly handled by ABC's Martha Raddatz and our own Anderson Cooper. And then FOX's Chris Wallace will host the final contest.

Scott Adams has a unique perspective on the presidential race, the debates. He is the cartoonist behind "Dilbert" and something of a self-taught expert in the persuasion, theory, and technique.

So, Scott, nice to have you on.

SCOTT ADAMS, CARTOONIST: Thanks. Thanks for having me.

BALDWIN: Unlike many, many pundits early on, you did not write off Donald Trump. I am curious, looking ahead to these debates, I have read that you said they could actually work in Trump's favor. Why?

ADAMS: Yes.

Trump's got a few advantages. What I write about is not the politics so much as the persuasion talents of the two candidates. And Trump has great persuasion technique and no doubt Clinton will have great persuasion advice going into it. But one of the differences that Trump can simply take things further. He can take a bigger risk.

BALDWIN: How do you mean?

ADAMS: He's got extra weapons because, well, his brand allows him to be a little more outrageous, a little more provocative.

He can be the man bites dog. But a typical candidate is going to have to stay within their lane. So that gives him a little bit more unpredictability, a little bit more weaponry for this.

BALDWIN: What about Hillary Clinton? Because, I mean, you talk about staying in the lane, but we also -- we learned this week that her campaign's actually wrong with the co-author of "Art of the Deal" and also reportedly talking to a psychological expert to sort of figure out -- you're big on the psychology here -- to figure out Trump's vulnerabilities and where Hillary Clinton can needle him.

ADAMS: Well, you know, they really have a tough time, because the expectations for his debate performance are going to be sort of low in terms of how much command of the details he has.

So if he shows up knowing just a little bit more than people expected, they're going to be impressed and they're going to say, hey, he must be working, heading in the right direction. Things are going in the right direction for someone who's trying to be president, whereas Clinton has to be perfect, and then maybe a little extra, because we already expect she knows the details, she knows the policies.

And we are kind of expecting that. That's discounted.

BALDWIN: What about, Scott, this word dark that we have been hearing from the Clinton campaign?

(LAUGHTER)

BALDWIN: You laugh. And I know you have pointed this out for previous months, but I have really noticed it especially in the wake of Trump's immigration speech this weekend. You have the surrogate -- Clinton surrogates and Clinton herself saying this was the darkest speech ever. You think the word dark is clever. Why?

[15:20:00]

ADAMS: Yes.

So, first of all, it is not accidental, because you saw all the surrogates say it immediately after Trump's speech at the convention.

BALDWIN: That's right.

ADAMS: And this is one of those words that I think you will see in a new book coming out called "Pre-Suasion" by Robert Cialdini. I think it is available in September. I have seen an early copy.

And this is the sort of thing that kind of primes the audience to imagine that anything that happens afterwards might fit that label. It is very similar to what Trump has been doing all along. He will start a label like crooked Hillary, and then all the news come in and you say, well, that sort of fits your label. And it reinforces it.

BALDWIN: That's your linguistic kill shot. Is that what it is?

ADAMS: That is. That is what I call it.

But dark is one of those things that just sets the tone. You start imaging that everything that he does might fit that label a little bit. It is a great way to establish a persuasion before events even unfold.

BALDWIN: Final question, prediction time. With let's just say the first debate, who wins?

ADAMS: Ah, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that Trump will outperform and that Clinton will perform, and that's going to look like a win for Trump, even if Clinton is much better in the fact- checking.

BALDWIN: Scott Adams, let's talk after those debates, shall we? Thank you so much. It is so, so great to talk to you.

ADAMS: Thank you.

BALDWIN: Speaking of Donald Trump -- thank you -- moments ago, Mr. Trump met with more than a dozen African-American leaders there in Philadelphia.

It is a day before his much-anticipated interview with a prominent Detroit pastor. Congresswoman and Clinton supporter Sheila Jackson Lee will join me next with her take on Clinton's outreach to the black community.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:26:14]

BALDWIN: Little more than two months to go here until Election Day. Donald Trump is spending the next two days trying to win over more African-American voters.

Right now, I can tell you that the man is in Philadelphia. He has just met with about a dozen business, civic, religious leaders in the African-American community at a local charter school. Here they are chatting, sitting around this big table there.

Tomorrow, Trump will then travel to Detroit. He's going to sit down for a taped interview at a black church, and then attend services at Greater Faith Ministries. Last hour, I spoke to the pastor who will be the one interviewing Mr. Trump. He is Bishop Wayne Jackson. He confirmed reports to me that we have seen today in "The New York Times" that the Trump campaign did indeed receive his questions in advance.

But he also says that that doesn't tell the whole story.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: s a man of faith, right, you speak from your heart.

And critics are coming forward and thinking, if you're sitting in front of someone who wants to be the next commander in chief, should he not be speaking from his heart as well, instead of having word-for- word scripted answers? I'm just telling you what some folks are wondering.

PASTOR WAYNE JACKSON, GREATER FAITH MINISTRIES: Well, Brooke, we fixed that. I have new questions.

BALDWIN: You do have new questions? You do have new questions?

JACKSON: We have new questions, yes. And nobody seen these questions but me, my secretary and a couple people who are close to me.

And some of these questions came from prominent black ministers around the country. I'm not a sellout or trying to be something that I'm not. We want answers. We're tired -- if it's Democrat or if it's Republicans, we need help and we need somebody that's going to be in that office that's not going to give us more broken promises. I don't care who it is.

BALDWIN: How do you think your congregation is going to receive him?

JACKSON: I teach my people love is the way and the course to go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: I'm joined now by Texas Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee. Congresswoman, nice to have you on. Welcome.

REP. SHEILA JACKSON LEE (D), TEXAS: How are you? Good to be with you.

BALDWIN: I'm doing all right.

But my question to you is, you heard the snippet of my conversation with the bishop there in Detroit. You know, as the Trump campaign would say, this is their outreach to black voters. You heard the bishop's response. What did you make of that?

JACKSON LEE: Well, first of all, Brooke, let me say that I am a great respecter of the men and women of faith and they have every right to lead their flocks in whatever faith they have.

This is an opportunity not so much for the bishop, but this is an opportunity for Donald Trump to use the African-American community and, as he has done previously with minorities, to abuse the African- American community.

I think what should be noted is that 50 percent of the American people believe that the word racist is either very much a part of Mr. Trump or somewhat a part of Mr. Trump; 35 percent believe it is much associated with Mr. Trump; 56 percent of the American people believe that he is biased against minorities and women.

And so my point is that everyone deserves an opportunity to express their beliefs. But I pose the question often of,Well, where is Mr. Trump's civil rights moment? Where is his involvement with the historically black colleges? We saw the questions that the bishop offered, and then the answers.

The answers that were written by his campaign were nothing but platitudes. He called for a race-neutral or a country that did not consider race. And I am certainly one that believes in opportunity for all. But the Supreme Court indicated that affirmative action has merit in the 21st century because of the lack of opportunities for many minorities, including women.

Does Mr. Trump even know that? Hillary Clinton does. She has lived civil rights. She has provided a record, but also service to African- Americans.