Return to Transcripts main page
NEW DAY SATURDAY
Flash Flood Watches And Warnings For Carolina Coasts; FBI Releases Clinton Email Investigation Report; Santa Clara Police May Boycott 49ers Games; Pastor Burns Controversy; Earthquake in Oklahoma. Aired 8-9a ET
Aired September 3, 2016 - 08:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[08:00:00] SHERISSE PHAM, CNN PRODUCER: Like you said, inland flooding is a major concern for North Carolina right now. We were on the coastal road a little while ago and there was not too much flooding there, but police say to stay off the road if you can. If you come across standing water, don't try to drive through.
The storm passed through the worst of it came through last night and it left more than 31,000 people without power and reports of a possible tornado touch down not too far from us in Hatteras.
So now officials are saying stay out of the ocean. This is Labor Day weekend. We have lots of storms and visitors here. We saw a couple of them walking on the beach, actually, they are still walking along the beach, very determined and optimistic folks.
But officials saying please stay out of the water. Dangerous surf conditions and strong rip tides. Back to you guys.
CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: Even though it looks dangerous, I know people will still attempt to go in. Sherisse Pham, we appreciate it. Thank you.
Let's get to CNN meteorologist, Allison Chinchar now. Hermine is expected to strengthen before it hits the northeast. If it does strengthen to hurricane forces, what does that mean for them?
ALLISON CHINCHAR, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Very strong winds. So we're talking, as it continues to go back out over open water, it's the warm water that fuels what it needs. Notice the track, it kind of just goes back and forth because it has things blocking the position.
But look at the winds, we'll go from 60 miles per hour to 75 miles per hour. So that is what we mean when we talk about the hurricane force winds. But also the flooding potential because of the rain is also going to be there.
Take a look at the some of these cities, Ocean City, Maryland, your threat for the rain is going to start Saturday morning, but the peak is going to be tonight through tomorrow morning.
Atlantic City, New Jersey, your peak will be Sunday morning through Monday morning. New York City, we're talking about the peak being Sunday night into Monday night, which unfortunately is the worst timing possible for the holiday weekend. But why is it going to strengthen?
Let's take a look at that. So we've got the particular storm that you can see down beneath me. It's going to enter into that very warm gulf waters, the Gulf Stream. Not the Gulf of Mexico, the Gulf Stream, where it has those very warm temperatures in the low 80s.
That is fuel for this particular storm. The eye wall kind of with that warm water rising is able to creates extra convection inside of the storm and it will allow for the storm to strengthen a little bit over the coming days.
That's going to be key because as it continues to make its way north, that strengthening could impact places from Nantucket. We're talking Cape Cod, New York City, all the way up and down the New Jersey coast. So certainly, Victor and Christi, something to keep a close eye on over the coming days.
PAUL: All right, appreciate it so much, Allison. Allison Chinchar there, thank you.
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Well, in just a few hours Donald Trump will be at a black church in Detroit attending service and then participating in a Q&A tape with the pastor of that church. This is an effort to increase black support.
And here are the latest numbers, Donald Trump here from the Suffolk University/"USA Today" poll had 2 percent in the bottom of the four- way race among African-American voters.
On the Democratic side, Hillary Clinton is using the "I do not recall" defense. That's what she told the FBI at least 39 times during an interview about her use of a private e-mail server. Donald Trump, of course, quick to pounce on this. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When you look at what they've done in respect to these FBI notes where she didn't know what the letter "c" was. That's a lie unless she's not an intelligent person, that's a total lie.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: All right, CNN's Ryan Nobles following this story for us. Ryan, what else are we learning from the recent document release?
RYAN NOBLES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Victor, among the many things these notes reveal is that there were attempts to hack into Hillary Clinton's private e-mail server, but none of those attacks were successful.
The FBI conducted a forensic analysis of Clinton's server and certain devices they had access to, but there was as many as 13 different devices that Clinton used that they wanted to examine, but that Clinton's law firm did not produce. Now, as a result, the investigators wrote that they were unable to, quote, "conclusively determine" whether or not classified information had been compromised.
However, some of the people who Clinton was in communication with including her long-time friend, Sidney Blumenthal, were hacked and those hackers got access to material that was sent from Clinton's server.
But they never got access to the server itself. Now a big part of what the newly released documents reveal is that Clinton did not recommend or recollect many of the key points of information that these investigators were in search of, including how much she knew about how to handle classified information.
On, note reads, quote, "Clinton could not recall any briefing or training by state related to the handling of classified information. But it did seem that Clinton herself was at least somewhat concerned that her e-mail could be compromised."
The report reads that Clinton was, quote, "worried someone was hacking into her e-mail" given that she had received an e-mail from a known associate containing a link to a website with pornographic material.
Now in addition to the concern about a potential hack, Clinton also told investigators that she did not know what the letter "c" on certain correspondence meant. You heard Donald Trump talking about that.
Clinton said that she thought it was denoting an alphabetical order of the information. That "c" actually means confidential. We should point out, though, that is the lowest level of classification of the top of the e-mail in question that did read confidential which Clinton acknowledged.
Now while this new report did not reveal any new major revelations, they do keep the conversation of Clinton's private e-mail server in the news and Donald Trump and his campaign did not miss the opportunity to pounce. He said in a statement that Clinton's answers to the FBI, quote, "defy belief" --Victor.
BLACKWELL: All right, Brian Nobles for us there in Washington, thank you so much. The question now, what impact will this have on Clinton's campaign? We'll talk to both Trump and Clinton supporters right after the break.
Also, Donald Trump makes his pitch to African-American voters this morning by doing something he has not done yet during this campaign season, visiting a black church.
He's polling with black voters just at 1 percent or 2 percent this morning, but that is not stopping one of Trump's favorite African- American supporters from coming out on the stump to advocate for him.
Mark Burns spoke at the RNC, you see him here. He helped facilitate Trump's meeting this morning with Wayne Jackson and speaking at that church. But he's probably best known for this, this tweet, which he has since taken down and apologized for, showing a cartoon of Hillary Clinton in black face.
Well, now there are questions about his past, his bio that he was in the Army Reserves and a fraternity, graduated from college. So when I sat down with him this week, I asked him about those claims and things got a bit uncomfortable. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: Did you attend North Greenville University?
PASTOR MARK BURNS, TRUMP SURROGATE: I did attend North Greenville University.
BLACKWELL: Did you graduate from North Greenville University?
BURNS: No, I didn't complete the degree at North Greenville University.
BLACKWELL: OK, again, the bio that's on your website claims that you earned a Bachelor of Science degree. Did you make that claim?
BURNS: Actually, just a moment ago, as we were opened up -- first of all, I said we were off the record.
BLACKWELL: I didn't agree with that.
BURNS: Yes, but I did.
BLACKWELL: We're still rolling. I'm still asking you questions on the record.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: So later this hour, you'll see the entire interview. It ended with Pastor Burns walked out of the interview and drove away from the church leaving us sitting there. And you're going to hear his new statement out late yesterday about hl bio, which he now says he overstated.
All of that coming up, in addition to that fallout from the Colin Kaepernick controversy. Police are now talking about a counter protest.
PAUL: Back to our top political story at this hour, the release of the latest on the FBI report on Hillary Clinton's e-mails. CNN political commentator, Jeffrey Lord, a Donald Trump supporter and former Reagan White House political director, and Robert Zimmerman, a Democratic strategist and Hillary Clinton fundraiser and supporter with us now. Gentlemen, good morning to you. Thank you. Hillary Clinton said 39 times that she did not recall or remember that she said this to questions from the FBI in the reports that are just coming out.
The report, it certainly confirmed the findings of FBI Director James Comey, but it doesn't reveal anything criminal by any means, Jeffrey, so I think the question is, does this matter in the general election?
JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Sure. Because it's a question of judgment and let's remember, this is a candidate who is adverting her preparedness and her experience to be president.
And here we have her performance as secretary of state, which she number one put all of the stuff on a private server, which was unheard of.
And number two, you know, badly, badly misunderstood classification procedures as secretary of state. I mean, this is one of two things as we look back on CNN last night at Watergate, one of the things Democrats of the day said, that Richard Nixon was either lying or he was incompetent.
Well, eventually we found out, of course, he wasn't telling the truth and that is what is going on here.
PAUL: And that sounds very much like a sound bite that Donald Trump gave that Hillary Clinton is, I think that's what you're referring to in the last 24 hours here.
So Reince Priebus we know called the release a devastating indictment of Hillary Clinton's judgment and honesty. Robert, that is hitting her in a spot where she is very, very vulnerable with the electorate. Could this cost her votes?
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, actually, Christi, because it is from Reince Priebus, you can't really overreact or take it too serious. He's the Republican National chair.
The bigger point is simply this, that in fact when you look at this one mistake that Hillary Clinton admitted in dollars and owned up to over her entire career of public service versus Donald Trump's foreign policy agenda, which he publicly advocates allowing North Korea and Saudi Arabia to have nuclear weapons.
He advocates dismantling NATO, wants to be neutral between Israel and Palestine, which is an unprecedented break from American foreign policy.
When you consider -- in fact he didn't even know that Russia was in Crimea, when you analyze his foreign policy agenda then you understand why so many Republican foreign policy leaders who served in the Reagan and Bush administrations are now lining up to endorse Hillary Clinton.
In fact, there were about 20 one to four-star generals endorsing Hillary Clinton because they believed she'll keep us safe and she'll be effective in pushing back on securities issues, fighting ISIS. That's the perspective to have here.
PAUL: But that does not alleviate the fact that all the polls show, honesty and trustworthiness is something that she falls very short with. There's a big deficit there. I want to listen to something --
ZIMMERMAN: Christi, if I can make a point?
PAUL: Go ahead.
ZIMMERMAN: Yes. She has that deficit and so does Donald Trump, but 65 percent of America feeling like he's not fit to be president. That's the defining issue.
PAUL: OK, let's listen to Hillary Clinton here who said last year that there was nothing classified in her e-mails.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There is no classified material so I am certainly well aware of the classification requirements and did not send classified material.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[08:15:04]PAUL: Why do you think this controversy still has life? Is it because the explanation -- it seems so hard to define an explanation here or is it because opponents will not let it go, Jeffrey?
LORD: Well, it's the nature of the controversy itself. I mean, this is not going to go away all the way through to election and for that matter, it will probably hang around after the election.
I mean, this is about her performance in office as secretary of state as exhibited in these e-mails. And every few days, you know, something drip-drops out that the Clinton people just can't control.
They have no control over it. So this is going to keep going on and every single time it comes back to a question of her judgment. I mean, we can talk about it in the larger sense --
PAUL: But in a sense Donald Trump's judgment has come into play as well particularly this week on immigration, seeming to give two different speeches in two different places and looking as though he is two different men. Do we have that sound here?
The speech he gave in Mexico, the speech he gave in Phoenix. Some people say, a lot of people looking at that and saying at the beginning of the day, he looked in Mexico like he was very presidential in Mexico. He had it very solidly put together and then things changed by the end of the day. Let's look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We did discuss the wall. We didn't discuss payment of the wall. That will be for a later date. Mexico will pay for the wall. They don't know it yet, but they're going to pay for the wall.
There is crime, as you know. There is a lot of crime and there is a lot of problems, but I think together we'll solve those problems.
Zero tolerance for criminal aliens, zero, zero.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL: OK, so Jeffrey, this is, of course, on top of a report that's out in "The New York Times" this morning talking about tensions that have grown, they say, between Donald Trump's campaign and the RNC.
They are reporting that their Trump aides who have used contemptuous language against RNC chair, Mr. Priebus, that the RNC in return, there have been complaints about half-hazard nature of Mr. Trump's operation. Can he win without them, Jeffrey?
LORD: Well, first of all, Reince Priebus is solidly on board with Donald Trump and so as the Republican National Committee. They are doing a terrific job of organizing --
PAUL: Not according to this report. There's a very big rift.
LORD: I just spoke to someone here in Pennsylvania on the ground, who was telling me in detail about the organization right here and all the door knocking and phoning that is going on in this very systemized, systematized, et cetera.
So I mean, I think I have to believe what I'm seeing right here in the middle of Pennsylvania, which is a key state. So I don't have any worry about that. As to the other, I don't see any contradictions there.
I mean, what he's saying is different versions of the same thing both in Mexico and here in America.
PAUL: OK, Robert, I want to give you a chance to respond.
ZIMMERMAN: There's a dramatic contradiction. First of all, Donald Trump lied about his meeting with the president of Mexico when he said the cost of the wall was not brought up.
Secondly, you saw Donald Trump, of course, give a good photo op when he was with the president of Mexico. Then I guess the tranquilizers wore off and you saw him go back to the same kind of hate mongering and racist rhetoric that is, in fact, alienating him from mainstream Republicans.
It is worth noting that when Donald Trump has been denounced, divisive and bigoted with rhetoric, there's not one Republican leader that stood to defend him. Not Paul Ryan, the speaker of the House, not Mitch McConnell.
In fact, you see the enormous deficit he has in the polls around these points. So it's not just about two Donald trumps at stake here, you're dealing with a danger neophyte and that is why you see him polling so far in terms of the temperament and leadership to be president.
PAUL: No doubt about it. I think we can all agree this is an election season like no other that we have ever seen and both of these candidates having unfavorables well above half on each side of the aisle. So we're going to keep watching to see what happens. Robert Zimmerman, Jeffrey Lord, we appreciate both of you gentlemen being here. Thank you.
BLACKWELL: All right, so let's turn now to this debate over the national anthem and the protest we are seeing from Colin Kaepernick still refusing to stand up. It's taking a turn that I would say some people did not expect. CNN's Coy Wire has the latest on that.
BLACKWELL: Santa Clara police may stop working in San Francisco 49ers home games amid Colin Kaepernick's national anthem protest.
PAUL: CNN sports anchor, Coy Wire has the latest on this controversy. I don't know if anybody saw this angle coming.
WIRE: Yes, this is a big twist coming. So we are all mostly aware that Colin Kaepernick has chosen to sit during the national anthem to protest racial injustice and police brutality in our country. He even had a teammate join him in the last pre-season game, kneeling during the national anthem.
He said all along that it was never his intention to disrespect the military. That's what people are upset about. Well, a lot of folks including military members have supported Kaepernick in his right to sit.
But a lot of people are unhappy with his actions including some of the members of the union representing Santa Clara police officers.
According to the San Francisco station KNTV, union members sent a letter to the 49ers saying that the team doesn't take action against Kaepernick, quote, "It could result in police officers choosing not to work at your facilities," unquote.
That means at games, at the stadium, on game day. Now CNN has reached out to the union and the police department, the 49ers told us they support Kaepernick saying they recognize an individual's right to participate or not in the national anthem.
But now they may be forced to address this issue if they feel that the safety of their fans could be compromised at their games on game day.
Kaepernick has been getting a lot of buzz about the socks he's been wearing, socks with pigs on them, wearing police officer hats, and now he said he didn't mean the bash all police officers with this stance. Just rogue cops as he called them. This combined with that refusal to stand during the national anthem led the president of Santa Clara Police Officers Association to say, quote, "The 49ers are allowing this to come out from an employee and is making for a hostile work environment for us at the stadium," unquote.
[08:25:01]How long will this go on, guys? He has said that he will not stop his stance and his mission until he sees significant change. We're now seeing his teammate, even players from other teams join him in his refusal to stand during the national anthem to call attention to this cause.
PAUL: All right. Coy, thank you so much.
So Donald Trump making a direct pitch to minority voters today. He's face to face with the black voters at a church in Detroit. We'll have more details for you.
BLACKWELL: Meantime, one of his most outspoken advocates in the black community accused of taking liberties with the truth. Someone called it simply lying. When I asked him about those misrepresentations, things got a little awkward.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURNS: This is from my page, but what I'm saying is, obviously this has been manipulated or either hacked or added.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: In about an hour, Donald Trump is going to do what some of his critics said that he should have done a long time ago if he's serious about reaching out to black voters.
PAUL: He's attending a worship service at an African-American church in Detroit. He held a roundtable with African-American business leaders in Philadelphia yesterday. The campaign says he'll address the congregation, but the church hasn't confirmed that he will do so. So there is a little bit of a question right now as to what his role will be this morning in Detroit.
BLACKWELL: Yes, so there is that and following the service Trump will sit down for a taped interview with Bishop Wayne T. Jackson for the Impact Television Network.
The man who helped to arrange that meeting is Pastor Mark Burns, one of Trump's key surrogates as the candidate tries to reach out to African-American voters. Burns also spoke at the Republican convention.
[08:30:08] But most recently he made news for posting the tweet here of Hillary Clinton, a cartoon in black face, which he later took down. He apologized for that. Well as questions arose about him and his background, Burns agreed to
sit down with us for an on-the-record, on-camera interview. But, as you'll see here, he soon wanted to take the conversation off the record.
BURNS: We need a warrior, we need a champion, we need a winner, and that is Donald...
BLACKWELL: He's the small town preacher who's become a major surrogate for Donald Trump's campaign for President.
BURNS: The last thing I want to do is to draw attention away from Mr. Trump's policy...
BLACKWELL: Pastor Mark Burns, a frequent cable news guest, a crowd favorite at Trump rallies, even a speaker at the Republican National Convention.
BURNS: From the great state of South Carolina...
BLACKWELL: But before the campaign, he was virtually unknown.
BURNS: I think Donald Trump is a great judge of character. You know, you would think he would just choose the greatest names. But Donald Trump values character more so than popularity or name. And I think that I fall in that category.
BLACKWELL: Pastor Burns' Harvest Praise and Worship Center in Easley, South Carolina is a small operation. The church just a few folding chairs, tables, and cameras for his televangelism.
BURNS: Help us to receive the wisdom of the Lord Jesus Christ.
BLACKWELL: After attending Trump's November meeting with black pastors in New York, Burns says former campaign manager, Corey Lewandowski asked him to speak on Trump's behalf at Bob Jones University. He's been a favorite of the campaign ever since.
DAMON DAVIS, KAPPA ALPHA PSI MEMBER: He just came out of the blue.
BLACKWELL: Virginia Beach Navy veteran Damon Davis says he's a Republican, but had never heard of the fiery Southern pastor. Neither had his friends.
DAVIS: So they looked him up and he web pages up. And they saw one of the claims was that he was a member of Kappa Alpha Psi.
BLACKWELL: Davis, who is a member of the predominantly African- American fraternity, says he first saw the claim in Pastor Burns' bio on his church's website. Davis said he captured the screen grab in July, just days after Burns spoke at the RNC. Then he started investigating.
And what did you find? DAVIS: There is no person named Mark Burns, John Mark Burns, or any variha -- variation thereof in the fraternity ever.
BLACKWELL: David says he contacted Pastor Burns. Soon after, Davis says the web page disappeared. Well CNN called Kappa headquarters too. They have no record of him. So when we sat down with Burns, we asked about that.
BURNS: I did, without question, say that I had crossed -- not crossed -- but I had started the process of -- of -- of -- of being a part of that organization. But that's the furthest that I've got.
BLACKWELL: Is that the bio from your website?
BURNS: It is, but it is not the -- it is the bio, but this is not an accurate depiction of the bio. I mean information has obviously been added. I'm pretty -- I'm pretty -- I own up to any mistakes that I've made, like I did with my tweet. But obviously in this case, that's not...
BLACKWELL: So this is not from your page?
BURNS: No, this is from my page. But what I'm saying is, obviously this has been manipulated or either -- or either -- either hacked or added...
BLACKWELL: CNN asked the site's host, Wix, about the possibility that someone could have tampered with the church's website. The company tells CNN there is no evidence of a hack. And CNN obtained the pastor's full bio from the church's website through an Internet archive.
You also claimed that you served six years in the Army Reserves. Is that accurate?
BURNS: Yes, it is.
BLACKWELL: OK, we called the Army, and they said that you had no active Army or Army Reserve service.
BURNS: I was never part of the... No, no, I was a part the South Carolina National Guard.
BLACKWELL: OK, I just asked you about Army Reserves. That was my question. You in this bio claimed six years in the Army Reserves.
BURNS: Which is -- it is Reserves. It is the Army -- the Army South Carolina National Guard is Reserves.
BLACKWELL: In a statement to CNN, the U.S. Army says Burns served in the South Carolina National Guard from 2001 to 2005, was discharged in 2008. He has no active Army or Army Reserve service time.
Did you attend North Greenville University?
BURNS: I did attend North Greenville University. BLACKWELL: Did you graduate from North Greenville University?
BURNS: No, I didn't complete the degree at North Greenville University.
BLACKWELL: In fact, the University tells CNN he was here one semester.
Again, the bio that's on your website claims that you -- you earned a Bachelor of Science degree. Did you make that claim?
BURNS: I asked you just a moment ago, as we were just opened up this... First of all, I said we were off the record.
BLACKWELL: I didn't hear that.
BURNS: Yeah, but I did. I did. And I...
BLACKWELL: We're still rolling. I'm still asking you questions on the record. Did you...
BURNS: I'm off the record.
BLACKWELL: Did you make that claim that you graduated from North Greenville University?
BURNS: I'm off the record because I think it's not fair that you -- this is not fair at all. This is not what I agreed. I thought we were doing a profile, and all of a sudden you're here to try to destroy my character. (inaudible)
BLACKWELL: I'm not -- I'm not coming here to destroy your character. These are claims that were made on your website that was live while you were speaking at the Republican National Convention. My question is are those claims accurate?
BURNS: I understand this is what media does. And I understand that, when you find someone that is speaking out their heart and speaking out their desire to bring people together and to get past the political correctness of society, that the job of that -- of -- of investigative journalism or, you know, in this case is to try to destroy the -- the character of the individual so their voice is silenced. What I'm saying is this. In reference to my website, if there's inaccurate information on there that -- that can easily be manipulated by other people, and it can be manipulated by hackers. People can do and say and do and -- and -- and -- create whatever they want to create.
BLACKWELL: Again, the website host says there is no evidence of a hack.
BURNS: I don't feel comfortable at all. This is not...
BLACKWELL: You also claimed to be studying at the Anderson Theological Seminary.
BURNS: Theological Seminary. Yes, I did. Mm-hm.
BLACKWELL: Currently working on his Master of Theology and Pastoral Leadership, according to the church's website.
We called them. You're not enrolled there, and you enrolled in 2008 and never advanced.
BURNS: Right. But do you know how old these -- do you know how old this is? This has been up... I think there's an updated -- there's an updated profile on me that's on the website. These are...
BLACKWELL: So is it old, or is it tampered?
BURNS: These are old information. This is extremely, extremely old information.
BLACKWELL: Seconds later...
BURNS: This is a... Thank you, thank you so much. I would appreciate you come and you just take this.
BLACKWELL: Pastor Burns walked out, leaving us in his church.
In fact, he got into his car and drove off. And you heard the pastor there blame a hack, blame Photoshopping, blame the media. Well, he's now released this statement. "As a young man starting my church in Greenville, South Carolina, I overstated several details of my biography because I was worried I wouldn't be taken seriously as a new pastor. This was wrong. I wasn't truthful then, and I have to take full responsibility for my actions. Since that time, I should have taken steps to correct any misrepresentations of my background. We all make mistakes, and I hope that the measure of my character and the quality of my work speak for what kind of person I am."
He goes on to say this. "I do also want to set the record straight about why this attack is happening because I'm a black man supporting Donald Trump for President. For too long African-American votes have been taken for granted by Democratic politicians and enough is enough. It's a shame that the political insiders and the media choose to attack me, because I'm not going to stay silent about Hillary Clinton's pandering to our community. Instead, I'm going to tell people that there is another option, an option that represents a positive vision that will unify our country. That's why I have and will continue to tirelessly support Mr. Trump."
We have put questions into the Trump campaign about their vetting process. We don't have any answers just yet.
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
PAUL: Breaking news just in to CNN. A very strong earthquake just minutes ago felt in at least three states, Texas, Oklahoma, Kansas. I want to go straight to CNN meteorologist, Allison Chinchar. Allison, what are you hearing about this? ALLISON CHINCHAR, AMS METEOROLOGIST: So as of right now, the information that we have from the U.S. Geological Survey, the U.S.G.S., is that about a 5.6 earthquake happened just about an hour and a half north of Oklahoma City, and about an hour west of Tulsa, Oklahoma. That's where the epicenter was located. Relatively shallow. We're talking about 6.6 kilometers deep, which in an overall scale, that's very shallow. That allows for areas pretty far from the epicenter to still feel the earthquake. So we know of folks even as far as Dallas that have been able to feel this earthquake.
Even though you may think to yourself, 5.6 may not seem like that high of a number, it is for this region. Now according to the U.S.G.S., the largest earthquake in Oklahoma took place in 1952 at a 5.5. So this 5.6 is going to be if it -- if it holds at that number -- will end up being the strongest earthquake in Oklahoma history, recorded history. So, again, right now about 74 miles north northeast of Oklahoma City, Oklahoma, and at a depth of about 6.6 kilometers.
We talked about how being that shallow, it allows for it to travel pretty good distances, including Dallas, where we have a gentleman who was apparently awoken from his bed, that was able to feel this earthquake. So, (Leo), kind of explain to us what happened to you this morning.
(LEO DAVIS): Yes, I was in bed and all of a sudden -- I think the first thing I noticed is I heard the walls of my condo, which is in a 26-story high rise on Main Street, start to crack a little bit. Kind of like it would in a storm or strong winds. And then the next thing, I felt the bed just move back and forth. It was a mild moving back and forth. And it was just (want) something. You know, maybe that's just me.
Then it was three or four, five times in succession after that. I'm thinking, no, this is an earthquake. So immediately I looked out the window and I could see the tower next to me, which is the tower that lights up green at night here in Dallas, and the glass on the side, I could actually see that shaking a little bit. And I'm thinking, this has to be an earthquake.
CHINCHAR: All right, folks, thank you so much. That was (Leo Davis) joining us from Dallas to explain this morning how he was kind of woken up by this earthquake. Again, Christi, just the stats, 5.6 magnitude earthquake in Oklahoma. And, as we mentioned, if it holds at that number it will end up being the largest earthquake in Oklahoma recorded history. So we'll be sure to give you some more updates as they become available.
PAUL: Yeah, definitely. And as we are getting some more information from people in that area, and making sure that there are no injuries and no downed buildings. But thank you so much, Allison. We appreciate it. And we'll be right back.
BLACKWELL: Hi. Back with us now to discuss the interview with Pastor Mark Burns, we have Marc Lamont Hill, CNN political commentator and professor at Morehouse College, and Jeffrey Lord, CNN political commentator as well, and Donald Trump supporter. Good morning to both of you.
And, Jeffrey, I want to start with you. Pastor Burns has been one of the more fervent supporters for Donald Trump. And I want to show you an exchange that happened just a few weeks ago on Brooke Baldwin's show. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURNS: I have said it across this country that there are no white people...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When it comes to the Democratic Party...
BURNS: But she's a liar...
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: OK, OK, OK, on that -- on that...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: All right, the first portion, you saw that. That was a mistake. But here, in that exchange, you heard Pastor Burns say "She's a liar, she's a liar," speaking about Hillary Clinton. Can he still effectively prosecute that case, considering he lied for years about his experience and lied to me during that interview?
JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICLA COMMENTATOR: You're asking me, Victor?
LORD: Yeah. Victor, you know, in all candor, I really don't think that -- that, whether it's -- and I mean no offense to Pastor Burns, just in general, this whole election is between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump. And you've got all sorts of people all over the place, in both sides, but the candidates are always the focus. And you can go through... I mean, for instance, we're not talking this morning about Al Sharpton still not paying his taxes, which as I read somewhere this summer, in the Daily Caller I think, you know somewhere in the neighborhood of five, $500,000...
BLACKWELL: I don't know that Al Sharpton is a surrogate for -- for any campaign, though. And he's a man that...
LORD: Well, he's a...
BLACKWELL: This is a man that Donald Trump has sent on his behalf to speak at events.
LORD: Victor, Victor, Hillary Clinton has gone hat in hand to ask for Al Sharpton's support. I mean he is a big player in Democratic Party politics, but no one seems to care. I mean I don't think frankly people are going to care about what Pastor Burns did or did not do. And I will say this though...
BLACKWELL: Right. LORD: ...in his defense. As -- as a conservative black man, just like Clarence Thomas, just like -- I have a number of friends who are black and conservative -- they all come under attack because asked for leave the plantation.
BLACKWELL: OK. All right. Well, OK. He does say that he's getting this because he's a black man supporting Donald Trump. Marc, to you.
MARC LAMONT HILL, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, first, Jeffrey's done everything but answer the actual question, which was, you know, does he have the moral authority to continue to call -- to stump for Donald Trump when he called Hillary Clinton a liar, and his entire resume seems to have been falsified. And the actual answer to the question is no, he can't do that. Jeffrey might be right. Maybe people won't care.
That -- that's just not the issue. The issue is should they care. And is -- is there an is -- a moral issue here, and I think there is. Not because he's a pastor, but simply because he didn't tell the truth consistently. It also speaks to Donald Trump's judgment. As opposed to Al Sharpton, who is not a Hillary Clinton surrogate, and who Hillary Clinton has not had speak for her at the Democratic National Convention.
HILL: And Pastor Burns said... And -- and -- and, listen, you can laugh, but in -- in -- I have DVR. We can rewind it and see that she hasn't asked him to go there. It's one thing to ask someone for support. It's another thing...
LORD: Has she asked for his support?
HILL: It's a -- it's a -- it's another to -- it's another thing to have someone actually act as a surrogate for you. That's speaks to association, and I absolutely guarantee that, if Hillary Clinton had standing next to her a pastor who was somehow of questionable character or background, Donald Trump's campaign would -- would -- would (accolade) and criticize her, as they should. Eight years ago, us -- there's another pastor, Jeremiah Wright, who stood next to a guy you may have heard of named Barack Obama. The right also criticized him. Not because of his record, but because of Jeremiah Wright's record. They said, look at who you're standing next to. So Donald Trump has to be open to the same scrutiny that...
LORD: But he was his pastor for 20 years. There is a bit of a difference.
BLACKWELL: We got to -- we got to wrap it here. We got to get to the breaking on this earthquake coming out of Oklahoma. I know you both understand I need to keep this tight. Marc Lamont Hill, Jeffrey Lord, thank you both.
LORD: Thank you.
BLACKWELL: We'll take a quick break, and we'll go back to the breaking news.
PAUL: Good evening. Minutes past the hour. Former Stanford University swimmer, Brock Turner, is a free man this morning after he was convicted of sexually assaulting an unconscious woman. And Turner has four days to register as a sex offender now. He left the Santa Clara County Jail in California yesterday, you see him here, after serving just three months of a six months' sentence. CNN legal analyst and criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson with us now.
So, Joey, we understand that, since this case, legislation's been approved in California mandating prison time for some sexual assaults. Is this case going to make changes, not just in that state, but in others, in your opinion?
JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Good morning, Christi. With regard to that legislation, just to be clear, it speaks to the issue of mandatory minimums. And just so that the viewers know, there are certain crimes in certain states where there's a mandatory time that you have to spend in jail. And so what California is seeking to do is have a three-year mandatory minimum as it relates to rape. Now they currently do, Christi, but it's only as it relates to forcible rape.
The argument with the legislature is, why should there be a distinction between rape that's forced and rape that's imposed upon a woman who is unconscious or otherwise too intoxicated to consent. And so it closes the loophole in that regard. The Governor has until the end of September to sign it. But I do think that cases like Brock Turner resonate throughout the country and, as a result of that, I think we'll be looking at other states, if they do have loopholes, to close them and to address the issue of discretionary sentences that simply don't make sense and demean the victim.
PAUL: You know, there was so much emotion everywhere about this, particularly with -- with parents and with young women. We understand that he does have to register as a sex offender now for life. That he has his picture, his conviction information, his address will publicly be available on Ohio sex offender registries. Ohio is where he is again. Do you think that he will be feeling the pressure of this for a long time?
JACKSON: You know, I do think so, Christi. At the same time, though, he has his liberty. And when a person has their liberty, they're out. And they can do whatever it is that they deem appropriate to do. Now certainly he can live a law-abiding life and go on in being a productive citizen. But the argument is, if that we're going to have a system that takes punishment seriously, then punish. And get that you have punishment, deterrents, and rehabilitation but, when you look at certain offenses, and you look at this particular crime, and you look at the victim's impact statement, certainly we know it had an impact upon her. The sleepless nights, the change in her demeanor, the fact that's she psychologically damaged, the fact that of course she had the courage to move forward.
And so, yes, he has to register as a sex offender for life, he is on probation for three years. Of course in that registration, he has to do it every 90 days. His -- his neighbors will get postcards. But he's out, and he's at liberty. And so there has to be some mechanism in the law that punishes with regard to keeping someone behind bars for a period of time so that others know you can't do it and simply get a slap on the wrist for it.
PAUL: Mm-hm. All right. Joey Jackson, we appreciate it so much. Thank you. I actually wrote an op-ed about this, Victor, on CNN.com, if anybody wants to check it out.
BLACKWELL: Go there, and we'll tweet it out so people can find it easily.
There's a lot of news to tell you about this morning. Stay with us. "NEWSROOM" starts after this short break.