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NC Protests Turn Violent After Police Shooting; 12 Officers Were Hurt After Deadly Police Shooting; DOJ Investigating Killing Of Terence Crutcher; Mother Demands Justice For Son And Other Killings; Officer's Attorney: She Perceived A Threat; NY Bombing Suspect Hit With Federal Charges. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired September 21, 2016 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[09:00:00] CAROL COSTELLO, CNN ANCHOR: And good morning. I'm Carol Costello. Thank you so much for joining me.

Another police shooting, another African-American man killed just hours after the Justice Department opens an investigation into a police killing in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Anger boils over in yet another American city.

Charlotte, North Carolina, police say the man was armed, his family says he was carrying only a book. We'll hear from the family in a news conference next hour. And in just about a half hour, the Charlotte mayor will speak to reporters and, of course, we will bring that to you live.

Some protesters, though, do turned on police, a dozen police officers injured, a handful of arrests and a city brought to a standstill. Some demonstrators marched on to a highway, loot the trucks that pended and then set fires. Police shoot tear gas and chase the crowds off the street, but the big questions remain. What led to yesterday's fatal police shooting in North Carolina and what happens today in Charlotte?

CNN's Brynn Gingras is here with more. Good morning.

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, good morning, Carol. In so many of these cases, of course, we have video to look at but in this particular case, no video as of yet in this investigation. It is just in the beginning stages. That, as you saw, hasn't stopped protesters from taking to the streets of Charlotte, outraged by the shooting death of 43-year-old Keith Lamont Scott, a father of seven who his family says was not armed when he was killed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GINGRAS (voice-over): Overnight, violent protests erupting on the streets of Charlotte, North Carolina.

UNIDENTIFED MALE: Hold the police officers accountable for what they do.

GINGRAS (voice-over): Several hundred protesters blocking a major highway, looting trucks and setting fire to some of their cargo. Officers in riot gear deploying tear gas, setting off flash bangs as angry crowds swarmed squad cars throwing water bottles and rocks at the officers, injuring at least a dozen.

Protesters moving to a local Walmart, video shows them attempting to break in but running once SWAT teams arrive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The citizens have a legitimate concern, and their concerns shouldn't be taken lightly.

GINGRAS (voice-over): The clashes breaking out following the fatal shooting of a Black man, Keith Lamont Scott. Police say they arrived at an apartment complex looking to go serve a warrant to another individual when they encountered Scott who they say was armed.

KERR PUTNEY, CHIEF OF POLICE, CHARLOTTE-MECKLENBURG POLICE DEPARTMENT: Made some eminent threat to them and because of that at least one of our officers fired rounds at the subject.

GINGRAS (voice-over): Brantley Vinson, identified as the officer who shot Scott, is also a Black male, according to local reports, now placed on administrative leave. But protesters are out in full force, questioning when will Black lives truly matter?

NICHELLE DUNLAP, PROTESTER: A terrorist, New Jersey, New York, he was taken alive. They said they wanted to question him. So because of you wanting to question him, does his life mean more than our Black men across the nation?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GINGRAS: And that exact comment being echoed all over social media at this point. Charlotte's mayor promising a full investigation, Carol, but at this time, she's just asking for everything to be calm.

COSTELLO: All right. Brynn Gingras, thanks so much. So there is a lot to break so I want to bring in our panel right now. Art Roderick is a CNN law enforcement analyst and former assistant director at the U.S. Marshals Office and Laura Coates is a CNN legal analyst and former Federal prosecutor. Welcome to both of you.

Art, I suppose we should make clear the officer involved in this particular shooting was an African-American man. Does that matter?

ART RODERICK, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: I don't think it matters. It doesn't matter. I mean, the bottom line is that police officer did not wake up to start his shift in the morning and say, hey, I'm going to go out and shoot somebody.

Now, you know, I feel for the family. This is not -- this is a situation that affects everyone, not only the community but it also affects the police officer and obviously the family of the individual who has been shot, but also the police department overall.

I've been on both sides of this issue. I've investigated officer- involved shootings and I've been instigated for an officer-involved shooting. And, you know, just bringing the perspective of law enforcement in here, it takes a heavy toll on the police officer himself as well as the law enforcement agency themselves, too.

COSTELLO: And, Laura, you know, I asked Art that question because, from a civil rights perspective -- maybe a Federal investigation will come down the pike at some point -- does it matter that it was an African-American police officer and a Black suspect?

[09:04:50] LAURA COATES, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: No, it doesn't because, frankly, we've seen over time that blue trumps Black and that the color of the uniform is far more important in the Justice Department's inquiry into any case.

It's not about whether the victim was Black or the officer was Black or the office was White. It's about whether there is a system in place, a training malfunction, or there's simply a perception of evil or perception that the person they're targeting is always going to be armed and lethal. That's the real inquiry here, not the race of the officer.

COSTELLO: So, Art, police say they confiscated a gun in this case. There is an open carry law in North Carolina that means it's legal to show a gun.

RODERICK: Right.

COSTELLO: So what would make police initially approach Scott?

RODERICK: It's hard to say. I mean, we don't have a lot of facts on this particular shooting. This is in the early stages. I'm always hesitant to make a comment on a particular case until I have got the facts in, and we really don't know a heck of a lot about this particular shooting at this point in time.

I think investigations by a third party, a third investigative organization, whether it's the Department of Justice or whether it's the State Police, should come in and handle these types of shootings. I know law enforcement is looking at this particular issue overall across the country. In fact, I'm attending a summit next week on this particular issue to address this in the law enforcement community.

COSTELLO: And I want to show you some Facebook video that was taken last night and officers, you know during this protest. Apparently, this Facebook video was taken by the victim's daughter, Lyric Scott. She was at the scene. Keep in mind she had just lost her father, she was highly emotional. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LYRIC SCOTT, DAUGHTHER OF KEITH LAMONT SCOTT: I want the (bleep) police officer that (bleep) shot my (bleep) daddy and killed him. Of today (ph), he just say he dead. They put on the news he was (bleep) dead. The officer shot my daddy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Y'all going to explain that (bleep)?

SCOTT: We just good.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Y'all going to explain that?

SCOTT: I'm going to tear your (bleep). I'm about to set (bleep) off.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So, Art, I just want to ask you this question. As a police officer on the scene, I'm not sure if they knew that this was the daughter of the victim, but how does that affect the work of police during a protest?

RODERICK: It affects everything. I mean, again, you know, peaceful protests are what we want. I mean, that's what this country is based on. I think what happens is you got a lot of individuals in the community that co-op these types of -- these peaceful protests, and then you have exactly what occurred last night in Charlotte.

It's a shame. It's a horrible thing to watch all the way around. You know, I'm sitting here and it's affecting me. I feel for the family. I feel for everybody in this particular case and, you know, unfortunately, these investigations are very complicated and they take a long time.

COSTELLO: All right. I want you both to stay --

COATES: Well --

COSTELLO: I want you both to stay with me because I want to bring in what happened in Tulsa, Laura, and I'd like us to talk about that to put these past several weeks in context.

In Tulsa, the police-involved shooting of an unarmed Black man has now sparked an investigation by the Justice Department. Terence Crutcher, the family of four, shown in this helicopter -- he's a father of four rather -- shown in this helicopter video as he walks back to a stalled SUV on Friday with his hands up. His family says he was waiting for help, but Crutcher is shot to death moments later after the attorney for the officer involved says she perceived a threat from this man. Crutcher's family exclusively talking with CNN this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEANNA CRUTCHER, TERENCE CRUTCHER'S MOTHER: And we need to come to some type of way of making this right, getting justice for not only Terence but for all of those killings across our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COSTELLO: So what exactly went down in Tulsa? CNN's Anna Cabrera has been looking into that. She joins us live this morning. Good morning.

ANA CABRERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol. There are two separate ongoing investigations right now. You mentioned the Department of Justice civil rights probe. There's also the local criminal police investigation in which they will determine whether or not the use of force was justified from a criminal perspective.

We've heard from family members, we've heard from the community here urging officials here on the ground to arrest Officer Betty Shelby. She is the one who opened fire.

Now, when you look at that police video, you do see Terence Crutcher with his arms up as he's walking back to his vehicle, but you don't see exactly what he's doing or where his hands are at the moment Officer Shelby opens fire. Her attorney tells us that he was reaching inside the vehicle. She feared he was reaching for a weapon, and that's why she shot one single round killing Crutcher. However, the attorneys for Crutcher say the video shows evidence to the contrary. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BENJAMIN CRUMP, ATTORNEY FOR THE FAMILY OF TERENCE CRUTCHER: This is the objective video frame that shows the window was up so how could he be reaching into the car if the window is up and there is blood on the glass?

SCOTT WOOD, ATTORNEY FOR TULSA OFFICER BETTY SHELBY: So I feel pretty confident that if it wasn't all the way down, it was certainly down enough for him to get his arm through the -- into the interior of the car.

[09:10:07] CABRERA: So you still stand by that part of her account about what happened?

WOOD: Absolutely. Yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Now, as investigators sort through the facts of the case and look at that issue in particular, the family is speaking out about the man they love and lost and why they are hoping his story might have a larger positive impact. They spoke exclusively to CNN's "NEW DAY" this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CRUTCHER: What's breaking my heart is that his youngest son -- we call him little Terence -- asked me the day before yesterday, where is my dad? Because he hadn't seen him, you know, in a couple of days. So in his mind, he's wondering what's going on. So we told him, because we are people of faith, that dad went to heaven and that kind of satisfied him for the moment because he knows dad is in a good place.

DR. TIFFANY CRUTCHER, TERENCE CRUTCHER'S SISTER: I have a final text message, the very last one, where he told me that he loved me. I told him that I loved him and he said God is going to get the glory out of my life in that text message.

If any good can come out of this, we're hoping that America will open their eyes, everybody, and see that there is an issue, a systemic issue, that needs to be solved. And we're pleading with the leadership of this country, everyone, to just see that, and let's put some systems in place to prevent this from happening again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CABRERA: Now, that's a sentiment that we're seeing echoed all over the country and on social media with everybody, from politicians to sports figures, weighing in on issues about policing and race, using the hashtag, Terence Crutcher. Carol.

COSTELLO: All right. Ana Cabrera reporting live from Tulsa, Oklahoma this morning. Back to my panel now, Laura Coates and Art Roderick. So, Laura, the Feds have been called to investigate the case in Tulsa. Why so fast?

COATES: Because what you're seeing here, Carol, is a continuation of what seems to be the same script by officers across the country in these police-involved shootings. They seem to echo the same level of sentiment and the same statements. They all say, look, there was a justified use of excessive force, and it seems to be very, very, very skeptical by the Department of Justice to say, you all cannot be following the same exact script and having the facts actually line up.

But what you're seeing in Tulsa is an example when the Feds look at it and said, I heard the script that's used by officers based on Supreme Court precedent to try justify use of force shootings but the facts don't line up. So perhaps this is an indication where an officer is trying to use a Monday morning quarterback remedy, a justification for what has already happened, and the Feds are suspicious of that for good reason.

When officers use a script or rely on Supreme Court precedent to justify their actions, they are looked at with higher level of scrutiny by the Department of Justice because it can be disbelieved very easily and should.

COSTELLO: OK. So I want to take you back out to Tulsa for just a minute and show you this police video. You can see -- let me see. OK. You can see that the suspect has his hands up and officers have their guns drawn. The suspect is walking back toward his car. The officers said the window was partially down, they don't know what the suspect is doing at this time, and then the suspect is shot.

So, Art, what's going through the minds of police officers at that point?

RODERICK: Well, I mean, again, this is a situation where we don't have all the facts. There's no audio included in any of this video, and you've got several officers that are blocking exactly what occurred at the window.

COSTELLO: But when an officer has his gun or her gun drawn and the suspect has his hands up, do they normally order the suspect to stop?

RODERICK: Absolutely. Yes. I'm sure that was occurring here. That is my take on it. And you can hear, I believe it's one of the officers in the helicopter, talk about he's not following commands that are given to him on the street.

Again, this is a situation where we don't exactly have all the statements from the officers at the scene. I think, obviously, that's going to play a big role in this particular issue. But, you know, again, let's wait until all the facts are in before we make a decision. The Department of Justice is involved in this. They're looking at it from a civil rights standpoint and I think, again, this case will be investigated fully.

COSTELLO: All right. I have to leave it there. Art Roderick, Laura Coates, thank you so much.

Any minute now, we are expecting the Mayor and the Police Chief in Charlotte to speak out. Of course, we will bring you to Charlotte live when that happens.

[09:14:53] And take a look at this. This is a church in Cleveland where Donald Trump is expected to speak at any moment now with the leader of his Diversity Coalition, this after saying Black communities are in their worst shape ever, ever, ever.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: All right. I want to take you for a moment to Cleveland, to the New Spirit Revival Center.

Of course, you are looking at Don King, the famous boxing promoter. I don't know who he is talking to, but he is appearing at this church in support of Donald Trump who he has supposedly endorsed. Donald Trump will be talking to the African-American pastor at the New Spirit Revival, he will also be talking I would assume to parishioners. Of course, when this event starts, we will bring you a bit of it live.

In other news this morning, new court documents reveal chilling detailing about bombing suspect Ahmad Khan Rahami, among them, allegations that Rahami materials on eBay to build his bombs, testing out explosives days before the attack, and praised Osama bin Laden in his journal.

Now, Rahami is up against federal charges, including use of weapons of mass destruction.

[09:20:01] Let's bring in CNN justice correspondent Evan Perez.

Good morning.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Carol.

Ahmad Rahami is now facing multiple federal charges in New York and New Jersey, including for using weapons of mass destruction and bombing of a public place. The criminal complaints, they're filed by prosecutors are offering new insight into just exactly how the alleged bomber carried out this weekend's attacks, in addition to what may have motivated him and the potential for these bombings to have been a lot worse.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PEREZ (voice-over): Federal investigators say this weekend's bombings were in the works for months. According to a criminal complaint, alleged bomber Ahmad Khan Rahami bought the components for the explosives on eBay over the summer, including citric acid and circuit boards.

And shipped the materials to his workplace, then just days before the attacks a video shows Rahami experimenting with explosives, officials say, the video recovered from a family member's cell phone shows Rahami igniting incendiary material in a cylindrical container, then billowing smoke and laughter.

The bomb that ultimately exploded Saturday night in New York City, powerful enough to propel this 100 pound dumpster more than 120 feet, shattering windows three stories high and 400 feet from the detonation. Twelve fingerprints on the unexploded bomb ultimately leading authorities to Rahami.

Another key piece of evidence, a handwritten journal found on Rahami when he was captured in New Jersey, which authorities say references terrorists, including American born al Qaeda cleric Anwar al-Awlaki and Osama bin Laden. Rahami writing, "God willing, the sounds of the bombs will be heard in the streets."

The complaint references a social media account officials believe to be Rahami's, showing that the suspect favorited two videos related to jihad.

These details coming as authorities confirmed that Rahami came on the FBI's radar two years ago. U.S. Customs telling the CNN that they notified the bureau about Rahami after he turned from a trip to Pakistan and Afghanistan in 2014. Later that year, the FBI investigated a tip alleging the suspect's father was calling his son a terrorist.

REPORTER: Why did you call the FBI two years ago? What happened?

MOHAMMAD RAHAMI, FATHER OF BOMBING SUSPECT: He doing bad.

REPORTER: He doing bad. What did he do bad?

RAHAMI: He stabbed my son, he hit my wife, and I put him to jail four years ago.

PEREZ: His father ultimately retracting that accusation, leading authorities to conclude it was a domestic matter.

A friend of the suspect's says that Rahami and his family have been at odds since he got his girlfriend pregnant in high school.

EHSAN, FAMILY FRIEND OF NY BOMBING SUSPECT: For him, it was his father. And it was just, it was just tension. It was his part, too. He should have listened more to his father, maybe stayed in school.

(END VIDEOTAPE) PEREZ: The FBI still investigating whether family members or his friends knew anything about this bombing plot. According to a U.S. official, Carol, Rahami's wife left the United States before Saturday's bombings. She was scheduled to fly back to the United States this week and she is currently in the United Arab Emirates where she is cooperating with investigators.

COSTELLO: All right. Evan Perez, stay right there, because I want to bring in Mia Bloom. She's a professor of communications and Middle East studies at Georgia State University. She's also the author of "Dying to Kill: The Allure of Suicide Terror."

Welcome, Mia.

Mia, first question to you. Rahami stabbed his brother, he hit his mother, he was married, he had children from two different women he could not financially support. Is he the kind of person that's easily swayed by extremist views?

MIA BLOOM, PROFESSOR OF COMMUNICATION & MIDDLE EAST STUDIES, GEORGIA STATE UNIVERSITY: We see the terrorists recruiting all different kinds of people. Sometimes they go for what we might consider to be low hanging fruit, people who are feeling like they are losers, so they are going to go from zero to hero by joining a terrorist organization or doing something that will make them memorable. So, in fact, a lot of these terrorist groups will look at someone like Rahami as a possible recruit because they are already in the United States.

But I think from what Evan and you have been saying, this influence looks far more to be al Qaeda influence than ISIS.

COSTELLO: So, Evan, would you agree with that? You know, on the low hanging fruit part, the father did tell the FBI that, you know, his son was a terrorist. The FBI did at least talk with the family but they didn't talk to Rahami himself, right?

PEREZ: That's right. This was an assessment that was done back in 2014 after there was a family fight essentially and someone overheard the father calling his son a terrorist. This tip got to the FBI, the father -- the father did an interview with the FBI.

But during that interview he said, well, actually that's not true and said, you know, if I did say that it was in -- in a moment of passion because, you know, we were angry during this fight. So, the FBI did some more investigating, they ended up closing this matter because they thought that this was just a domestic issue with this family that clearly at the time seemed a lot more dysfunction than anything else.

[09:25:02] COSTELLO: So, Mia, should the FBI have done more? Let's says face it, yes, this was a domestic, he went to Afghanistan. He met a woman in Pakistan and was going to marry her. Should they have questioned the family more or Rahami himself?

BLOOM: I think that Phil Mudd talking to Chris Cuomo earlier said, it would be difficult to follow up on every single lead if they are recanted. But as you remember with the well-known underwear bomber, his father

contacted authorities and said, my son is being radicalized. And so, there is a lot of leads that are not followed up on just because of the shear volume.

So, it's impossible to know when someone is being a fantacist and saying that they are going to -- you know, I'm angry, I'm upset, you start to see elements of radicalization. There is a difference between the verbal statements and when they start purchasing bombs or when they start buying the various elements to create bombs that we saw in Boston.

So, I think that we have to make that distinction. The FBI probably should have followed up in some capacity and certainly the police could have issued some sort of restraining orders. He was a deadbeat dad, He wasn't paying the mother her child support.

So, the fact remains not a good guy all around.

COSTELLO: All right. I have to leave it there. Evan Perez and Mia Bloom, thanks to both of you.

Any minute now, we are expecting the Charlotte mayor and police chief to talk about the police shooting that led to violent protests overnight. We'll bring that to you live when it happens.

Plus, Donald Trump on the ground in Cleveland, Ohio, set to speak momentarily at a church with the leader of his diversity coalition.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COSTELLO: All right. I'm going to bring you to the city of Charlotte. This is Mayor Jennifer Roberts talking about the police involved shooting yesterday.

MAYOR JENNIFER ROBERTS, CHARLOTE, NORTH CAROLINA: With regard to the officer-involved shooting involving Keith Lamont Scott and Officer Brentley Vinson.

I want to take a minute and acknowledge our community partners who are here and our city council members, our state officials, our county officials. I want to appreciate them. We are working very collaboratively and I'm so glad they are here with us this morning.

This is a difficult situation for everyone involved. And the city expresses condolences to the family of Mr. Scott.

I also want to say that we express our concern for the officers who have been injured. There is a lot of information that is still to be sorted out and so, I am asking our community, I'm asking people here to please, wait until all information is available.

In Charlotte, we have a long history of working together to solve problems thoughtfully and peacefully and you have the commitment of your elected officials, you have the commitment of Charlotte- Mecklenburg, our police, our neighborhood and business leaders and our faith communities.