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Massive Manhunt in Washington State for Shooter; Presidential Candidates Prepare for Monday's Debate; Authorities to Release Scott Police Shooting Video as Rally Planned in Charlotte; Obama Speaks at Black Museum Opening; Reverend Tries to Bridge Differences of Police, Black Community; Reverend Tries to Bridge Differences of Police, Black Community; Presidential Candidates Prepare for Monday's Debate; Memorable Debate Confrontations of the Past; Inside Museum of African- American History & Culture. Aired 1-2p ET
Aired September 24, 2016 - 13:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[13:01:05] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, again, everyone. Thanks for joining me. I'm Fredricka Whitfield. We are live from Hofstra University, in Hempstead, New York, where the first presidential debate will take place in just two days.
All right, first, you are looking at live pictures out of Charlotte, North Carolina. People are gathering for a rally at Marshall Park, set to begin at any moment. This is in response to the shooting death of Keith Lamont Scott at the hands of Charlotte police. Our Nick Valencia is nearby. We'll check in with him in a few moments.
We are also following breaking news out of Washington State where a massive manhunt is still under way for a man who opened fire at in a shopping mall, killing five people. We have brand-new surveillance photos in to CNN of the man, the suspect. Police have not identified who he is. They say he entered the mall without a gun and 10 minutes later showed up with a rifle inside a Macy's store and started shooting. He is still on the loose. They believe he may be in his late teens or early 20s.
CNN's Jessica Schneider is following the story for us -- Jessica?
JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Fredricka, the manhunt continues. Making it more difficult is that police have not been able to positively identify this gunman. They are piecing together surveillance video from inside the mall so they can distribute it to ask the community for help.
Based on this video, authorities say the suspect is in his teens or early 20s. Police say the video actually shows the suspect entering the mall without a gun and 10 minutes later, walking into a Macy's with the rifle. He shot and killed four women and one man. More than 200 officers converged on the scene searching for the suspect and canines over night and getting people to safety.
Police say it appears the gunman left the mall before police arrived and headed toward Interstate 5 on foot. Talking this afternoon and this morning, Burlington's mayor didn't hold back when he talked about his contempt for the gunman and the deadly attack.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE SEXTON, BURLINGTON, WASHINGTON MAYOR: Now our support goes with them to help them extend the long arm law to bring the son of a (EXPLETIVE DELETED) to justice that did this to our community. And, our community comes together in times of tragedy. We are going do it again. I want everybody out there to know if any information you may have on who might have done this, please contact the authorities. And, again, our thoughts and prayers to the families as their lives are changed forever.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHNEIDER: So, a lot of questions this afternoon. Who is this gunman and how did he get away? Police saying they don't have surveillance footage from outside the mall. It is unclear how the gunman got away and where he is now. But the FBI stressing, at this point, there is nothing to indicate this was an act of terrorism -- Fredricka?
WHITFIELD: Jessica Schneider, thank you so much for that.
I'm quoting now, "It will be bigger than the moon landing, the World Cup, the Super Bowl and the royal wedding" -- that's the prediction about Monday's first presidential debate coming from a former Clinton aide. Clinton is off the campaign trail today, preparing for Monday night. She is at her home in New York. She is also just received the endorsement of "The New York Times" editorial board. Trump is holding a rally tonight in Roanoke, Virginia, sticking to his mantra that he doesn't want to over-prepare for the debate.
Joining me now from outside the Hofstra University debate hall -- or, well, we are about a mile away from the actual hall right now. But let's talk right now about all of this with CNN political commentators, Kayleigh McEnany and Sally Kohn, right here at Hofstra University.
We're about a mile away from the sports arena where it usually hosts basketball games and wrestling matches, it will be a showdown like no one has seen before. Even though Hofstra University is used to presidential debates now. This is the third one in a row. That's history making, in and of itself.
Let's talk about the differences of the two candidates, how they are preparing or not preparing, and how that will control the demeanor of what will unfold on Monday.
So, Kayleigh, your candidate says he doesn't want to over-prepare. He wants to be himself. But, surely he has been boning up on issues, policy, or no?
[13:05:58] KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No doubt he has been boning up on policy. He's met with several advisers. Going back to just after the primary, learning about the economy, getting ideas out there, hammering out there, likewise national security. What's so important with Donald Trump is he wants to be himself, show his heart to the American people. He's not going to try to be someone he's not. There's a risk if Clinton tries to lighten up and not be herself. That can be bad. Being yourself tends to be the best way to go with these.
WHITFIELD: And, Sally?
SALLY KOHN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I actually hope that Donald Trump comes to the debate and is himself because it would be nice if the American people, all of the American people, finally saw how dreadfully unqualified Donald Trump is to be the president of the United States of America. Dreadfully unqualified when it comes to knowledge and basic expertise about the fundamental workings of this country and the world, unqualified when it comes to temperament, his ability to behave like a grown-up and responsibly with his finger on our nuclear weapons, and dreadfully unqualified when it comes to his disrespect for the values of inclusion, tolerance, and diversity that have -- we have always strived to apply to make this country great.
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: Let me just add that Donald Trump just tweeted -- maybe he's listening to our conversation.
(LAUGHTER)
He's responding to what has been taking place with two days to go. He tweeted this -- I feel like I have to lean into your camera.
(LAUGHTER)
It says, "If Mark Cuban of failed benefactor fame wants to sit in the front row, perhaps I will put Gennifer Flowers right alongside of him."
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: Mark Cuban, a big advocate for Hillary Clinton right now, response to that.
Is that the kind of dialogue to help set the stage of what's to come? A very serious setting for the most important, one of the most important jobs in America and this is setting the tone.
MCENANY: I think both campaigns are playing mind games. Mark Cuban was put in that place for a reason, to get under Trump's skin before it begins. If you are going to put someone in that seat, there's many people I could put in my seat that might throw Hillary Clinton off. But what we heard from Sally is what illustrates what is so flawed about Hillary Clinton's strategy. She spent $100 million trying to define Trump as something he's not. Our supporters are supposedly racist and homophobic, et cetera, et cetera. By painting him so bad and putting him on the stage, and Trump being himself -- he is a nice guy, a wonderful guy, a smart guy -- she risks over-defining him as something he's not. When he shows up and isn't that all of those things, the American people are going to say, wait, all of these negative -- (CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: This is what could happen at a debate. At every presidential debate, it is up to that candidate to set the tone, have a monologue or a message that they want to drive home. That's how they can stay in the driver's seat, you know, of the potential outcome of any debate.
What might be that message that monologue, that Donald Trump, that Hillary Clinton wants to dictate the evolution of this debate Monday night?
[13:09:33] KOHN: Look, there's no question Hillary Clinton has to. As she has all along, put forward a positive vision and tell the American people, remind the American people who know, and tell those who may not, who she is and what she stands for.
By the way, she has been doing that throughout the campaign. Unfortunately, when it comes to these moments, we talk about what the candidates said about each other, the gaffes they made, rather than the substance. Hopefully, it is a chance to talk about how she is going to create jobs for the American people, and not just create them, but make good jobs with a good wage, a livable wage, with paid family leave, affordable health care and debt-free college, the kinds of things that would actually make this country great again.
And at the same time, she does have to show the American people what is at stake if they have to make the unthinkable decision to make Donald Trump the free leader of the world. There has to be a moment of reckoning where the false equivalency is put on stage for the American people, and they say, whatever you think of Hillary Clinton, how can you possibly contemplate electing this man president? I hope that she really finds a way to crystallize that for the American people.
WHITFIELD: What will be the mission of Donald Trump to crystallize his message, his mission if he gets this job?
MCENANY: While Hillary Clinton is trying to make this negative referendum on Donald Trump, Trump is trying to put forward his positive agenda. Everyone knows what his themes are. Everyone knows he is about rectifying the wrongs in the economy. You have Hillary Clinton describe everything as peachy, great, the economy is rolling along. But meanwhile, 60 percent of voters in battleground states -- a recent CBS poll -- think the economy is rigged against them. That's extraordinary, Fred, that 60 percent of voters think the economy is rigged against them. Donald Trump spoken to the reality a lot of Americans face. His vision will be one of economic strength amid chaos. We had three bombs go off in the tri-state area last week. People are scared. They're very scared. And Donald Trump has a solution.
KOHN: Can I just say, the idea that Donald Trump has run a positive campaign is positively Orwellian, number one and, number two, yes, those voters think the economy is rigged against them. It's rigged against them in favor of billionaires like Donald Trump, as he himself has shown --
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: -- eight years of President Obama.
KOHN: And his economic policy, Kayleigh, you know as well as I do, he doesn't want to help the middle class. He wants to give $7 billion more in tax breaks to millionaires and billionaires. Again, whatever you want to say rhetorically --
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Whatever you want to say rhetorically -- well, they are wrong!
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: I'm sorry, that's possible.
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: -- either one or both will be successful in hammering home the messages. At the same time, there are pitfalls both candidates want to avoid while on that stage.
What are those things in terms of Donald Trump? What does he want to avoid to not re-define him, his message, the candidate.
MCENANY: When you look at debate history, particularly between male and female candidates, unfortunately, there are gender expectations and stereotypes. One thing male candidates run afoul of, as you see George H.W. Bush and Geraldine Ferraro in 1984, he was depicted as a bully. And he said was say, "Mrs. Ferraro, let me tell you something about foreign policy." That was taken as aggressive. Bernie Sanders, when he said, "Excuse me," and Hillary Clinton took that moment to inject gender into the debate. So males --
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: -- a measuring stick was how Donald Trump behaved himself or what his demeanor was --
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: Absolutely. Absolutely. That's important.
WHITFIELD: Is he conscious of that? Will it be a distraction for him?
MCENANY: I'm not sure. There is a focus, I bet -- I'm not with the campaign -- on being firm but not be slight, and finding that measured balance. So --
KOHN: You are making me laugh because you are dying here.
(CROSSTALK) KOHN: First of all, I want to be clear, part of the reason -- I want to go back to something. Part of the reason polls think voters think this about Trump and that about Trump is because, frankly, he barely talked about the substance of his policies. Again, we talk about his personal attacks and mean things he says, which I think are dismal. Let's be clear, his policies and the things he's planning to do for this country are more dismal than his bathroom locker trash talk, number one. Number two, I really -- look, you know, Hillary Clinton has made missteps. She apologizes for them. Donald Trump has repeatedly --
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Donald Trump has repeatedly --
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Donald Trump has repeatedly called women thing that is are so degrading that, frankly, I can't explain to my daughter, how the president of the United States of America could call women fat pigs and disgusting slobs, and not only not apologize, continue to do so.
MCENANY: Hillary Clinton --
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: This is what we hear time and time again. Negative Donald Trump. Negative Donald Trump. There's an onus on Hillary Clinton to explain to the American people what she will do differently than President Obama --
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: There is a track record. And when you have recordings of many of these events, I mean --
KOHN: You can't deflect what is wrong with Donald Trump --
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: -- by pointing to criticism of Hillary Clinton.
WHITFIELD: There has to be a response.
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Kayleigh, when she called voters, Trump voters deplorable, I didn't like it. I thought it was wrong. I criticized it. She apologized.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: She apologized about her math.
KOHN: She apologized.
MCENANY: About her math.
[13:15:05] KOHN: She clarified what she meant.
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: You are sitting here defending him saying women are disgusting and fat pigs and slobs.
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: He's empowered women in his company.
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: That's not OK.
MCENANY: He has lifted women up. You point to one statement -- we owe the American people policies --
(CROSSTALK)
MCENANY: -- going to better their lives --
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: He owes the American people an apology. He's owes my daughter an apology. He owes every woman and girl in this country --
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: We'll see if that plays out on the stage two days away.
Sally, Kayleigh, we're going to have you both back because we have more to talk about.
We'll have more from Hofstra University. Just two days away from the first presidential debate. It will air here, live, Monday, 9:00 eastern time, with our coverage kicking off even before that at 4:00 eastern time.
And we'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WHITFIELD: Welcome back. I'm Fredricka Whitfield, at Hofstra University, in Hempstead, New York.
Our attention also in Charlotte, North Carolina, where authorities tell CNN they may release police video of the killing of Keith Lamont Scott as early as today.
This, as people are gathering for a rally at Marshall Park. Scott was shot dead by a Charlotte officer on Tuesday. Police resisted putting out dash or body cam video for fear of compromising the investigation, they say.
CNN's Nick Valencia and Ed Lavandera are joining me with the latest developments.
Ed, let me go to you first.
You are at the location where many gathered for a rally today.
[13:19:58] ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we are. This is a rally sponsored by a variety of community organizations in the city of Charlotte. You can see several hundred people turning out this afternoon. It hasn't kicked off yet. There will be a stage with various speakers and that sort of thing. These are a lot of people we have seen marching through the streets the last three or four nights. Really, the loudest chant that ties in with what is going on today is the calls and demands for the release of the dash cam and body cam videos. These are some of the groups that have been putting pressure on city officials here, calling for transparency to release the videos. They want to see that. The news of the possibility of this is starting to trickle down, but many people anxious to see the videos today.
WHITFIELD: Nick, outside the police department there, talk to us about the potential availability of that video and from which perspectives.
NICK VALENCIA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Earlier, we spoke to a city official. I called directly to speak with a spokesperson to ask about those tapes. The demands have not waivered for the tapes to be released, essentially among the demonstrators. I asked the city if there was a potential for it to happen today. Their answer was they were working as hard as fast as they could to release information to the public. I asked directly, will the tapes be released today. The only response was that those discussions were currently under way. Still no timetable given. The tapes though are a sticking point for the demonstrations. And police anticipate even more protest throughout the day and perhaps tonight until the tapes are released.
Yesterday, at a press conference, the police chief saying this not the panacea, that one or two police tapes doesn't speak for the whole narrative of what happened during the fatal shooting of Keith Scott on Tuesday afternoon. Still, the demonstrators are calling for that to happen -- Fred?
WHITFIELD: Nick Valencia and Ed Lavandera, we'll check back with you. Thank you so much from Charlotte, North Carolina.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[13:25:44] WHITFIELD: Welcome back. President Barack Obama says the African-American story is complicated, messy, and full of contradictions, but is a glorious story, nonetheless, and central to the American experience. The president spoke at the opening of the new Smithsonian African-American Museum of History and Culture with an all-star lineup of celebrities and politicians and ordinary citizens. The president said the museum contains context for debates of our times. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Perhaps it can help a white visitor understand the pain and anger of demonstrators in places like Ferguson and Charlotte. But it can also help black visitors appreciate the fact that not only is this younger generation carrying on traditions of the past, but within the white communities, across the nation, we see the sincerity of law enforcement officers, officials, who, in fits and starts, are struggling to understand and are trying to do the right thing. It reminds us that routine discrimination and Jim Crow aren't ancient history. It's just a blink in the eye of history.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: The president made references to the unrest in Ferguson and in Charlotte, violence in both cities triggered by the fatal police shooting of black men. The president said that not all the healing was accomplished.
Let's bring in someone who may have a unique perspective, who does have a unique perspective on the recent events. Sheron Patterson is the author of "Lead Yourself Now."
Sheron, good to see you.
You are the daughter of William Covington, a trailblazer, helping to integrate the Charlotte Police Department, correct?
REV. SHERON PATTERSON, DAUGHTER OF RETIRED CHARLOTTE POLICE OFFICER & AUTHOR: Very much correct. Yes, ma'am.
WHITFIELD: OK. You wrote a very emotion-filled opinion page in the "Charlotte Observer." I want to read a portion of it to set the stage of where you are coming from. You say, "I'm an African-American clergywoman who supports the blue, and the daughter of a retired Charlotte policeman, who supports Black Lives Matter." Further down in your piece, you say, "Black Lives Matter and the police are often at odds in America. I stand between the two divergent organizations. Often, it is like holding the reigns of two strapping horse who want to charge in opposite directions. I cannot let go of either set of reigns. Holding on threatens to rip me in half. I feel the anger, frustration and the fear of both."
Further elaborate on this real feeling of conflict you have.
PATTERSON: Yes. Fredricka, growing up in America, growing up the daughter of a policeman, I grew up in a cocoon of love for the blue. As I matured and went to the Black Power movement, I noticed African- Americans were not treated well in America. I grew up with the two of those inside me. Fast forward to 2016, here we are with the police on one side and Black Lives Matter on the other side. The two of them are always at odds. There's so much against them. I feel I have been called to stand in the middle, as a police daughter, as an African- American, to pull the two sides together and find a middle ground and find a piece in this war, actually. Do you feel like you have a finger on the pulse of the kind of
frustration we are seeing that has emerged over the last four days, particularly as a result of the shooting of Keith Lamont Scott, in your town of Charlotte?
PATTERSON: I certainly do feel the anger, the frustration, the rage of those persons that are all throughout downtown Charlotte.
[13:30:00] I understand they feel locked out, left out. The black community in Charlotte, even totally American, is enraged with the killing of so my black men, enraged with our school systems, enraged with the prison pipeline system. There's an ongoing rage nationwide and, yes, ma'am, I do feel it.
WHITFIELD: You saw the video tape released from Mr. Scott's wife, tape that she, you know, carried out on her cell phone and watched her or she -- you could hear that she heard the sounds of the gunfire and then saw her husband laying on the ground. What is your reaction to that in contrast with the urging of police to release their own version of the video in order to get a complete picture?
PATTERSON: Fredricka, when I saw Mrs. Scott's video, it was excruciating to watch, to hear her pleading with the police and her husband. She was at the sidelines for safety sake. I understood that. But to hear her plead and beg with both of them that he might be alive is excruciating. It sheds more light in America to see the desperate situation between police and the community.
The point of my column, Fredricka, was that, in the sense that my father was a community police, I believe that we should move more towards that because, in that world, the police would have known Mr. Scott and Mr. Scott would have known the police.
WHITFIELD: Do you have an opinion as to whether it was a mistake or not to have this delay? We have not seen the release of the police video, but they are saying it might happen today. Do you have any personal views as to the amount of time that is elapsed before police release the video?
PATTERSON: Yes, Fredricka. I believe this police video should have been released a long time ago. Number one, it would have calmed down the rage and the anger. Number two, it would have brought clarity to what's really going on. Three, it would have brought about some transparency because transparency leads to trust and trust is what the black community wants from the police and vice versa.
WHITFIELD: Sheron Patterson, thanks for your time. Appreciate it.
PATTERSON: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[13:36:01] WHITFIELD: Welcome back. We are two days away from the showdown between these two, Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump, at Hofstra University, the first presidential debate. Hofstra University, they have done this before. This will be the third consecutive, in fact, presidential debate. But some folks are describing it as the Super Bowl of all debates. "Atlantic Magazine's" James Fallows (ph), writes, it will be must-watch tv because, quote, "the most extreme personal, intellectual and political styles in America's Democratic history, right brain versus left brain, gut versus any portion of the brain at all, impulse versus calculation, I.D. versus super ego and, of course, man versus woman."
Joining me now, CNN's senior media correspondent, Brian Stelter.
Brian, there you are. I was like where did you go.
What are you forecasting? It's all of that wrapped up into one, isn't it
BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT & CNN HOST, RELIABLE SOURCES: I went across the street. It's getting secure here. This is a different area here. Behind me is where the arena is being built or the debate stage is being built. In more than 48 hours, we are going to see that epic face-off between this man and woman who have not met up in public since the campaign started. I think that's why expectations are so high, Fred. We are not used to these historic candidates. Both are historic. They have not been on stage until this moment. That's why the ratings are expected to be higher than normal debates. And so much more anticipation in the country. More plans for viewing parties and things like that than normal debates.
WHITFIELD: Brian, you are outside the sports complex hosting wrestling matches and concerts. This will be a different kind of match up for sure.
STELTER: Right.
WHITFIELD: They are fine tuning inside. I tried to get inside, it didn't happen. Have you had any --
(CROSSTALK)
STELTER: I can't either.
WHITFIELD: -- about the set up is?
STELTER: No, not yet. We know there's a studio audience. There's a relatively small stage, only two podiums, for two people. The man in the middle is Lester Holt, the debate moderator from NBC News. He's been preparing all weekend long. He took off the last couple days of his news staff. He's surrounded by friends and family. Several, like Chuck Todd and others, are helping him with questions. But the debate starts, he's all alone up there. He gets no help from anybody. He has 90 minutes, no commercial breaks, just him and the two candidates.
WHITFIELD: Something tells me, he will be fine. He's a fantastic journalist.
They have three areas they are focusing on, America's direction, achieving prosperity, securing America. They have 90 minutes, as you say, 15-minute increments, no commercial breaks. A lot on the line. We'll all be watching.
Brian, thank you so much.
STELTER: Thank you.
WHITFIELD: Of course, you can see the first presidential debate here on CNN Monday night, 9:00 p.m. eastern. Our coverage, however, kicks off early, 4:00 eastern.
We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[13:43:00] DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Meet Amy Palmiero-Winters, an accomplished ultra marathon runner and triathlete.
AMY PALMIERO-WINTERS, TRIATHLETE & AMPUTEE: I have been running since 8 years old. Running is what I love to do and makes me happy and part of who I am.
GUPTA: She's also an amputee. The 44-year-old mother of two lost her leg in a motorcycle accident. Amy has since competed in countless races and holds 11 world records.
PALMIERO-WINTERS: When I'm running, I'm always thinking about my kids and taking one more step.
GUPTA: Now she's training for one of the toughest ultra marathons, the Angeles Crest 100.
(CHEERING)
GUPTA: Runners have 33 hours to complete the grueling 100-mile course. Most run all night and many don't finish.
For Amy, the steep and narrow trails made it difficult to run on her prosthetic and she missed the time cut off at mile 26.
PALMIERO-WINTERS: I feel great. I just missed the time cut off.
This is just as much of a success as failure. If you can learn from it, you walk away a smarter person.
I will absolutely be back.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
WHITFIELD: Now we are at Hofstra University, and this is almost like a big sporting event, meaning tens of millions of Americans are expected to watch this highly anticipated face-off between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump Monday night. A lot is at stake in a televised show down with the potential to
produce a key moment that will stick with voters. There have been memorable confrontations in the past.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LLOYD BENTSON, (D), FORMER VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Senator, I served with Jack Kennedy. I knew Jack Kennedy. Jack Kennedy was a friend of mine. Senator, you are no Jack Kennedy.
(CHEERING)
RONALD REAGAN, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I will not make age an issue in this campaign. I am not going to exploit for political purposes my opponents youth and inexperience.
(LAUGHTER)
UNIDENTIFIED DEBATE MODERATOR: We have a question here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, how has the national debt personally affected --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[13:45:11] WHITFIELD: Lots of moments, and lots of opportunities for a candidate to define, if not redefine themselves, even something as small as getting caught looking at your watch in the middle of a debate can catch you up, if you were George H.W. Bush. He found out the hard way.
I want to bring in the political panel to talk about the impact of the debates. Kayleigh McEnany is a CNN political commentator and Donald Trump supporter. And Sally Kohn is a CNN political commentator and a Hillary Clinton supporter.
All right. Good to see both of you again.
These kind of gotcha-type moments, potentially make or break. Sometimes a candidate even if they are caught, they can show humor or great character in the way in which they respond.
SALLY KOHN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yeah, sure. I mean, look, the truth is, much though we love them and I will have a giant bowl of popcorn and maybe a giant bowl of alcohol.
(LAUGHTER)
Much though we love them, turns out debates don't sway the influence of elections that much.
WHITFIELD: Is that really true? I don't know.
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Apparently, according to people that study these things. What I will say is I think the stakes are incredibly high for Donald
Trump, realistically, because, look, the truth is the American people have known Hillary Clinton for a long time. Her disapproval ratings are comparable to 2008. Her approval ratings when she's in are much job higher. People kind of have already made up their mind about her. They haven't necessarily made up their minds about Trump. They have seen things they like and things they don't like. If he shows that short fuse, childish temper, as well as a lack of command of basic New Jersey and expertise you expect of a president, he's going to be hurt by this.
WHITFIELD: Kayleigh?
KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I disagree. I think this debate could be the moment we look back and say this is the moment that set the trajectory of the race. They are essentially dead even in the polls. They both have high unfavorables. Voters are trying to be comfortable. The margin of undecided voters is higher than we have seen in the past. 13 percent to 15 percent could change their minds. They might switch candidates. They are going to have a 90-minute unfiltered look at the candidates. An unfiltered glance at candidates they are unsure about.
WHITFIELD: Sometimes these moments are created not because a candidate tried to crack it, but a moment was created as a result of a consequence. You know, you think about certain moments, like whether it's Al Gore, who was kind of grimacing and got into the space of George W. Bush, and George W. Bush turned it around like, how you doing? He showed that kind of character. These candidates are getting advice on the spontaneity and the craft.
They have advised Donald Trump, you know, to try to show some kind of compassion, you know, deference to Hillary Clinton to a degree. Will Donald Trump listen to that?
KOHN: I hope he has enough money to buy compassion to turn on in the debate.
(LAUGHTER)
It should go without noting, Roger Ailes is an acquaintance. I worked at FOX News. It's worth noting that a candidate who has a horrible reputation of misogyny is historically unpopular with women. Has now brought into his campaign to advise him on debates, a man who was just let go of his job because of serial sexual assaults and innuendos.
(CROSSTALK)
KOHN: Let's talk about that for a second.
MCENANY: It feeds into this narrative of last time. Hillary Clinton wants to go negative. You will never hear them put forth their economic vision or --
(CROSSTALK)
WHITFIELD: It pertains to the advice they are receiving.
On the eve of this debate, is Donald Trump or Hillary Clinton taking the advice of people around them? Are they saying I'm trying to find my comfort zone? I need to find what I can do and best excel at.
MCENANY: I think the take the advice, yes. But for Trump, he has had his hand on the polls to change electorate. They don't like Republican politicians or Democratic politicians. Donald Trump knows that if he is himself, he will be good.
To your point on taking advice, it is important to have a moment of compassion. We saw that moment that was well received when he said if I have personally hurt anyone, I regret that and take it back. That was a moment of humility. For Donald Trump to show that other side of him that doesn't always come through, it would be a good moment. If that's the advice, take it.
[13:49:54] KOHN: Can I just say, I don't think Donald Trump has his finger on the pulse of the electorate. He has his hand on the throat on our democracy, first and foremost. And second of all, he had to make that very thin, general unspecific apology with the use of a teleprompter. So I'm not sure if he again can muster that kind of humility. And by the way, and I am not sure anyone will believe it. You keep telling him to be himself. He is not the guy that apologizes for saying misogynistic things or racially bigoted things. That's not who he is. If you want him to be himself, defend the things he says.
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WHITFIELD: Humility or empathy?
MCENANY: First of all, we talked about Donald Trump and humility. I think it is important for your candidate to convince the nation she's trustworthy. People don't trust your candidate and she has to have a moment, which is not herself, which is to say that she's trustworthy, she doesn't mislead the public, she doesn't blame the server on Colin Powell or on her aides like she with the FBI. You keep talking apologies, but when you say it was a mistake to blame it on third parties, that's not an apology.
WHITFIELD: These candidates have America's direction, achieving prosperity, securing America, in which to come up with their mantra, their mission, as it pertains to those three categories and they had 90 minutes to do it. No commercial breaks.
Sally Kohn, Sally McEnany, thanks so much to all of you.
We will continue the conversations. We have two days to go of much more chatting on how these candidates are preparing themselves for the big stage on the debate stage.
We'll be right back.
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[13:55:36] WHITFIELD: All right, that was Patty Labelle singing "Change is Going to Come" at today's dedication ceremony, opening of the new Smithsonian African-American Museum of History and Culture in the nation's capital.
I recently had an opportunity to go in that museum and visit and see the glorious eight floors there. And while there, I had the privilege of talking with a number of people who donated their personal items to the museum and people who helped decide which historical artifacts were included.
Here's some of what they had to say.
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WHITFIELD: What did this mean to make a donation to this museum and what did you donate?
CARLOTTA WALLS LANIER, MEMBER OF LITTLE ROCK NINE: I donated my dress that I wore on the first day of attempting to go into Little Rock Central High School on September 4th, along with my report card and my diploma and probably 14 other boxes of memorabilia.
WHITFIELD: It had to be a very difficult decision what to include. How did you go about doing that and how gratifying is this feeling tonight?
DAMON THOMAS, AMERICAN-AMERICAN MUSEUM CURATOR OF SPORTS: The challenge of deciding what to include, it was really hard, but I know I want to create a gallery that really situated sports and larger political and social context, so that's what really drove my decision to figure out which items to place. We just didn't want to celebrate tremendous athletic accomplishment but we wanted to think about how sports matter and why sports matter beyond the playing field. This gallery is really a social history of the meaning of sports for the African-American struggle.
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WHITFIELD: As of today, everyone can visit the new Smithsonian Museum in the nation's capital.
The next hour of CNN NEWSROOM begins after a short break.
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