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Senate Overwhelmingly Votes to Override Obama Veto; Breaking, School Shooting in Anderson County, S.C.; Ben Stein: What Trump Might be Afraid to Reveal in Tax Returns; Michelle Obama, Bernie Sanders on Campaign Trail for Clinton. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired September 28, 2016 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Also, Millennial voters came out in droves to elect President Obama both times, but what do they care about most this election? I will speak with some of them. They participated in a focus group during the debate. The results, fascinating.

Also, we're awaiting a live event with Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire.

Much more ahead. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:34:42] HARLOW: Breaking news. The Senate just voting to override President Obama's veto of a controversial bill that would have allowed the families of 9/11 victims to sue Saudi Arabia for its alleged role in the terror attack. The Senate vote was overwhelming, 97-1.

Manu Raju is on the Hill for us.

It's complicated. Walk us through the justification for this veto override. This is a first in the entire Obama presidency.

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: Very significant. Very rarely have we seen Democrats buck the White House the way they did right here. The White House has argued that this bill that would allow those victims, those families victimized by the 9/11 attacks to sue count these have been culpable in those attacks, namely Saudi Arabia, the White House has said this bill is not the right approach. They believe it could open up -- overseas, Americans overseas to potential retaliatory actions by foreign governments if the United States does military action abroad. That's been their big argument.

They've been lobbying members of Congress. President Obama has been on the phone with Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader, and Harry Reid, the Senate minority leader. That fell on deaf ears. Harry Reid being the one Democrat that listened to the White House and voted to sustain the veto. The White House is not taking this well at all.

Josh Earnest, the White House press secretary, was just asked about this veto override and he said this. He said, "This is the single most embarrassing thing the Senate has done since 1983." He was referring to another veto override vote that happened. Very strong words.

I've been talking to Senate Democrats. They are not happy. One Democratic aide said, in response, that it's amateur hour at the White House.

I talked to Democratic Senator Chris Coons of Delaware, who said, "Asking us z stand between 9/11 families and their day in court is asking a lot." And a Hawaii Democratic Senator said Josh Earnest's comments are overcooked.

So a lot of tension here on this final day of Congress as they try to wrap up section before the elections.

HARLOW: Manu, before I let you go, for a lot of people that don't know the background, it's important to know. Can you talk about the decision-making process the White House went through in terms of getting here? Chris Coons, of Dover, makes a good point, asking us to stand between 9/11 families, people who lost their loved ones on 9/11, and going to court and taking parties they think are culpable to court. The White House had to weigh things and decide whether they were going to be on the side of the families. They had to weigh that with what they're saying is the protection of U.S. citizens overseas.

RAJU: Not only that, but also their diplomatic relations in the Middle East with Saudi Arabia. That's been a tense relationship between the United States and Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia warned it could pull billions of dollars of assets out of America if this legislation became law. So there are a lot of considerations with those Americans overseas. That's why the White House has come out strong but virtually nobody in Congress is listening to them -- Poppy?

HARLOW: Thank you, Manu, live for us on Capitol Hill. We appreciate that.

Coming up, Hillary Rodham Clinton says Donald Trump is hiding something in his taxes and that's why he won't release his tax returns. My next guest vetted then-President Richard Nixon's tax returns back in 1974. Hear what Ben Stein says Trump might be afraid to reveal.

Also, moments from now, Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton hitting the stage together in a big moment for former rivals coming together. It wasn't that long ago they were debating one another. Stand by for that live event.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:32:40] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

HARLOW: We're following breaking news, confirmation of a shooting at a school in South Carolina. These are live pictures of Townville Elementary School. This is in Anderson County, South Carolina. What we know, at this hour, emergency crews say two students have been shot. We don't have word of their condition. We know the fire department says it has been told to be on standby. The school is being cleared at the moment. Of course, as we have updates we will give them to you. We also know a Life flight dispatched to Townville Elementary School in Anderson County. No more specifics. We'll bring you more as we have it.

Meantime, back to politics. Donald Trump's statement about his taxes is continuing to raise eyebrows today. Here's a reminder of what he said during the debate Monday night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Maybe he doesn't want the American people, all of you watching tonight, to know that he's paid nothing in federal taxes.

DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: That makes me smart.

CLINTON: That means zero. That means zero for troops, zero for vets, zero for schools or health.

(CROSSTALK)

CLINTON: And maybe because you haven't paid any federal income tax for a lot of years.

(CHEERING)

CLINTON: And the other thing I think is important --

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: It would be squandered, too, believe me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Joining me now, Ben Stein, actor, comedian and acclaimed conservative economist.

Ben, thank you for being here.

BEN STEIN, ACTOR, COMEDIAN, CONSERVATIVE ECONOMIST & ATTORNEY: Lawyer. That's the main thing, lawyer.

HARLOW: I should add that. My mistake.

(LAUGHTER)

Ben, thank you for -

STEIN: That's OK.

HARLOW: -- being here.

Let's take a walk down memory lane. Take me back to the White House, President Richard Nixon, 1974. You get called into the White House to dig through a bunch of boxes of his tax returns. STEIN: I was there working for your friend and correspondent, Dave

Gergen, and he called me down and said, "Look at these boxes." It was around midnight. He said, "Go through them and find what's going on and find me a way to prove it was all right." Those turned out to be Patricia R. and Richard M. Nixon's tax returns for a number of years. He had been taking deductions for turning over his presidential papers to the General Services Administration on their way to the Library of Congress, and it was quite clear that that was not allowed. And so early in the morning -- I think I stayed there all night -- I reported this was not going to work, that this deduction, as far as I was aware, from tax law, was not going to work. And he said, "Call Mr. Nixon's tax lawyer in New York and see what happened." And I called him and he said, "I'm just glad you're working on it and not me." So that's what happened.

[14:45:19] HARLOW: But --

STEIN: Go ahead. Sorry.

HARLOW: But it's germane to the conversation about Donald Trump's tax returns. Although not equivalent, he was under audit, and he was president and he released his tax returns to the public. Donald Trump is saying because he's under audit his lawyers have said not to release his tax returns. You've talked about the fact that he should. Clinton went after him hard on Monday night and said, look, there's got to be something embarrassing, she said, if not dangerous what could be dangerous? You know what we would see. What could be dangerous?

STEIN: Well, I think the problem for Mr. Trump is that he's bragged about how rich he is and it's going to turn out he paid either zero or close to zero in income tax, and he bragged about how rich he was, and it will turn out he's nowhere near as rich. So I think it will be embarrassing for him no matter what it is. I would add, if I may, as a Republican, that it's nowhere near as bad, in my humble view, as destroying 30,000 subpoenaed e-mailed, but it's darn bad.

HARLOW: And he said that. He said, look, when you release your 33,000 deleted e-mails I'll release my tax returns. I don't think we're going to get either, especially before the election.

(LAUGHTER)

STEIN: No.

HARLOW: Or ever. But here's something that is important, and it's whether -- the only thing that matters for two of them is how much voters care about it. I was in Pennsylvania yesterday speaking with a lot of voters, many of them undecided. I sat down with an Independent woman, who made the decision to vote for Donald Trump. And I asked her about taxes, she said, yeah, I guess it bothers me, but here's the thing, it's not Donald Trump's fault, she said, if he didn't pay any federal taxes, that is the fault of the politicians that wrote the tax code that hasn't been changed since 1984, and therefore Donald Trump is just being smart by following it. What do you think? STEIN: Well, it's partly that, partly he has an army of lawyers and

accountants and they say we can figure out a way to minimize your tax. Now ever --

HARLOW: But her argument that it's not his fault, even if he didn't pay taxes, that's not on him, she says.

(CROSSTALK)

STEIN: I think it's on him, and I think, as a matter of decent human character, a terribly rich person should pay tax. We all seek to minimize our taxes. I certainly seek to minimize mine. And my income is nothing compared with his. But I think if he's going to brag about how rich he is, he can't do that and at the same time show zero taxable income for income tax purposes. He can't have it both bays.

HARLOW: So the question you're getting at is, is what does it say to the average American? To middle-class folks who say --

(CROSSTALK)

STEIN: I'm much fatter than the average American. But I will say, if I may, I don't think it looks good. I don't think he's done anything illegal but it's not pretty to look at. And I think it does make an impression. We're all supposed to minimize our tax burden, but we're also not supposed to say we have $10 billion when we don't.

HARLOW: Ben, correct me if I'm wrong, we've not seen the audit letter from the IRS that they send to everyone being audited. But aside from that, wherever this audit, ends we would not know, the public would not be made aware by the IRS, correct? It would be up to Trump to say the audit is over?

STEIN: But he can show the returns any time he wants. That's not a good argument about the audit. He has many counter arguments he can make to attack Mrs. Clinton. It's my guess that's what he should a do. And he should say we seek to minimize our taxes. But it doesn't look good for a person who has a private jet and a million houses and resorts and so forth to say I have zero taxable income. It doesn't look right.

HARLOW: Ben Stein, thank you.

STEIN: Thank you.

HARLOW: More ahead on our breaking news. We have confirmed a shooting at an elementary school in South Carolina. We are told two students have been shot there. Much more ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:51:00] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

HARLOW: We are continuing to follow breaking news out of South Carolina. You are looking at live pictures of an elementary school in Anderson County, South Carolina. What we know at this hour, we know two children have been shot

according to EMS. Obviously this is just preliminary reporting, but right we're told by EMS that two children have been shot. One of them is being treated at Greenville Trauma Center. EMS says they are trying to make sure this is not still a dangerous scene as they escort students out of the building. We've just heard there is a lone shooter and that shooter has been apprehended. The lone shooter in Townville, South Carolina, has been apprehended. The condition of the other students is unknown. Many of them escorted out. But as of now, EMS telling CNN two children were shot. One was taken by helicopter to Greenville Trauma Center. We don't know if the shooter was a child or an adult. EMS saying they believe the shooter is in custody. And we have just learned and confirmed that, indeed, the shooter has been taken down by law enforcement. Much more of breaking news on this school shooting in Townville, South Carolina, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:56:34] HARLOW: Top of the hour, I'm Poppy Harlow, in today for my friend, Brooke Baldwin.

41 days, that's it, folks. 41 days until Election Day. And soon you will see Donald Trump make his case to voters in the Midwest. Meantime, Hillary Clinton is making a move on Millennials. She is courting those young voters with two political heavyweights today. The First Lady Michelle Obama speaking in Pennsylvania moments ago in Pennsylvania. And moments from now, Clinton's former rival, Bernie Sanders, will appear by her side.

Let's go to CNN senior Washington correspondent, Jeff Zeleny, in Durham, New Hampshire, where, at any moment, we're expecting Hillary Clinton and Bernie Sanders to take the stage.

Before we get to that, let's talk about Michelle Obama. The first lady rallying for Hillary Clinton in Philadelphia making a very strong pitch and really with an urgency to it for young voters to get behind Hillary Clinton.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, there was urgency to it. And if you want any political figure in your corner across the spectrum, both parties, Michelle Obama is one of the most popular figures out there. She's making her second campaign trip today, solo campaign trip for Hillary Clinton. She's also on the airwaves with a new ad for Hillary Clinton making the case to voters that, A, they should pay more attention to this race but, B, warning them in blunt terms for a third party candidate, against Gary Johnson, the Libertarian, or Jill Stein, the Green Party candidate. And sharp words. She didn't mince her words saying a vote for either of those candidates is a vote for Donald Trump.

Now Hillary Clinton is going to be here with Bernie Sanders. You can see the stage behind me here lined up. They are going to be talking about debt-free college. That is one of the central issues for younger voters. And Bernie Sanders, Poppy, I can tell you, so popular here. A couple of students I've been talking to said they were Sanders supporters, now they are Hillary Clinton supporters -- HARLOW: Hey, Jeff.

ZELENY: -- but it took time for them to get there.

HARLOW: Jeff, let's take a moment to listen to the first lady and what she said in Pennsylvania today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHELLE OBAMA, FIRST LADY OF THE UNITED STATES: And then, of course, there are those who questioned and continue to question for the past eight years whether my husband was even born in this country.

(BOOING)

OBAMA: And let me say, hurtful, deceitful questions, deliberately designed to undermine his presidency, questions that cannot be blamed on others or swept under the rug.

We also need someone who is study and measured because, when making life-or-death, war-or-peace decisions, a president just can't pop off or lash out irrationally. No.

(CHEERING)

OBAMA: We need an adult in the White House.

And trust me, a candidate is not going to suddenly change once they are in office. Just the opposite. In fact, because the minute that individual takes that oath, they are under the hottest, harshest light there is. And there's no way to hide who they really are.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Jeff, this is the second time we've seen her on the trail for Hillary Clinton. Interesting she used the same wording "pop off." We can't have someone who pops off." She used that just a week or so ago. She's speaking to temperament. Donald Trump said on the debate stage, "I have the best temperament." She's going right after his temperament. They call her "the closer" for a reason. How effective can she be for Clinton?

ZELENY: Poppy, I think she can be very effective for voters who may not be as excited about Hillary Clinton as the Clinton campaign would like them to be.