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What Candidate's Debate Body Language Reveals; Trump Disagrees, Has "Spoken with" Pence on Syria; Ex "Access Hollywood" Producer on Tape Leak. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired October 10, 2016 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[14:32:31] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Perhaps more than any other debate in this cycle, body language, front and center, starting with the very first moment.

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(APPLAUSE)

HILLARY CLINTON, (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Hello, hello, hello.

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BALDWIN: What didn't happen there? There was no handshake. Then they're walking around one another. Trump's posture at times behind her as she was responding to questions.

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CLINTON: I'm going to fix it, because I agree with you, premiums have gotten too high, co-pays, deductibles, prescription drug costs, and I've laid out a series of actions that we can take to try to get those costs down. But here's what I don't want people to forget --

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BALDWIN: And in the end, there was finally a handshake, initiated by Donald Trump.

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(APPLAUSE)

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BALDWIN: Todd Graham is back with us, debate director at Southern University-Carbondale.

Todd, let's begin with -- I know you gave grades. We'll put the full screen up, in different aspects of the debate. Let's begin with, this was a town hall, so Americans were in the audience asking their own questions. And how Hillary Clinton would get up and walk towards them. Did you like that?

TODD GRAHAM, DEBATE DIRECTOR, SOUTHERN UNIVERSITY-CARBONDALE: Oh, I loved that. I think that's exactly what you should do in a town hall format. In fact, that's why they give them the microphone so they're mobile. You should get up and go talk to the person who was asking the question. She was clearly on her "A" game on that.

Two of the things I teach my debaters are to use their name, try to remember their name, and she did that quite a lot, and to use part of their question in her answer. That shows she's more personable, she's more warm. As you and I know, one of the critiques of her is she's been too robotic. I think the town hall fixed that last night.

BALDWIN: You give them grades, personality, warmth, humor, nonverbal. Clinton B-plus, Trump C-minus. It was almost like a cage match, sort of walking around one another and it points -- Trump sometimes looking menacing behind her.

GRAHAM: Yeah, the looming figure of Donald Trump is not exactly what probably he wanted to portray. I always tell my debaters, you have to practice just like the real event. That means you should practice standing, walking around. And then sit, when it's not your turn. You'll notice Hillary went and sat when it wasn't her turn. He needed to take that lead. He would wander into the camera shot, and it looked like he was hovering over her. And especially after the language choices that just came out over the last few days, the last thing you want is for a giant, grown man to be hovering over a woman in a debate. The visuals are awful.

[14:35:39] BALDWIN: At the same time, maybe his supporters like it. They like him looking a little more tough. That's why they're supporting him.

I know you look into linguistics and body language, but what's with the sniffing? Have we figured that out, the sniffling?

GRAHAM: No. Again, if you just practice with the microphone, which he didn't do. I think he could he hear it and then fixed it. But last night, it was unbearably strong. He was sniffing louder than any coke-fiend I've ever known. I thought, boy, oh, boy, this isn't going to go well. And it was for the whole 90 minutes.

BALDWIN: What was one big positive? Let me end on a positive for Trump, though. What did he do that you think really reached out?

GRAHAM: The town hall format softened him a little bit. I think that was good. He definitely interrupted Clinton, but much less than he did in the previous debate. I thought that he was -- while he didn't walk up to the audience, the town hall softened his approach in general. He didn't seem loud. He didn't seem too aggressive in the debate. That was a positive that he could definitely bring out of the debate.

BALDWIN: One to go in Vegas next week. We'll be there.

Todd Graham, thank you for now. Coming up, Are Donald Trump and Mike Pence split on one very key

foreign policy issue, how to handle the war in Syria? We'll discuss that with our senior international correspondent, Clarissa Ward, who's been there, done extensive reporting in Syria. We'll get Clarissa's take next.

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[14:41:35] BALDWIN: Republican vice presidential candidate, Mike Pence, today dismissing any speculation he and Donald Trump are at odds on their positions on Syria. Pence insists they're on the same page, even though during the debate last night, Trump flat-out contradicted Pence's idea about using military force when asked about how to stop the humanitarian crisis in Aleppo.

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DONALD TRUMP, (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He and I haven't spoken and I disagree. I disagree.

MARTHA RADDATZ, DEBATE MODERATOR: You disagree with your running mate?

TRUMP: We've got to knock out ISIS. Right now, Syria is fighting ISIS. We have people that want to fight both at the same time. But Syria is no longer Syria. Syria is Russia and it's Iran. I believe we have to get ISIS. We have to worry about ISIS before we can get too much more involved.

PENCE: The question I had -- and you can check the transcript, so can your viewers -- was about the humanitarian crisis in Aleppo and what we ought to do. Donald Trump's Trump position, our position is that we need to establish safe zones. You need to be willing to use -- you need to be willing to use resources, and including military power, to secure those safe zones to allow those people, including 100,000 children, to be able to evacuate. Last night, she conflated that and referred to general provocation and involvement by the Russians, the Syrian regime. You know, Donald Trump's made it clear, our policy is safe zones for people suffering in Syria.

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BALDWIN: So, we really wanted to hone in on the Syria issue.

Clarissa Ward, we're coming straight to you, our senior international correspondent. You've covered Syria extensively. One take away from that initial statement from Trump, he said he hasn't talked to his running mate, number one. Number two, he said Aleppo is a disaster. He said he doesn't like Assad. But, quote, "Assad is killing ISIS." When you heard that, did you read that as Trump praising Assad? What did you make of his response?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: What I made of his response is essentially he's branding himself as sort of an apologist for Assad and Russia and Iran and the action those three forces have taken combined together inside Syria. What he's essentially saying it is unfortunately that they're killing all these other people, but they're also killing ISIS. To a certain extent, that is true. Russia did, with Assad's forces, take back the ancient city of Palmyra from ISIS. We have seen Iranian military advisers in Iraq advising and helping with the fight against ISIS in Iraq. So there is some truth to that.

But what it ignores is the larger picture which shows quite clearly that ISIS has thrived precisely because of Assad's atrocities. It has grown as a result of the vacuum left by the Syrian civil war.

And when you spend time in Aleppo, as I do, you see and understand firsthand how it is that this devastating humanitarian conflict is quickly turning into an incubator for extremism.

What also confused me is that Donald Trump also says he would like to see safe zones. So, on the one hand, he seems to be willing to let Assad do his thing, along with Russians and Iranians. But it would be interesting for me to see how he plans to implement these safe zones, because this is an idea that obviously has been put forward by many different diplomats at many different junctures in this conflict. The reality is that the Assad regime has not been amenable to that, nor have its Russian backers. So there's a lot of confliction in the Syrian policy he articulates -- Brooke?

BALDWIN: So that was Trump. This was Hillary Clinton's response to what she would do in Syria.

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[14:45:17] CLINTON: I would not use American ground forces in Syria. I think that would be a very serious mistake. I don't think American troops should be holding territory, which is what they would have to do as an occupying force. I don't think that is a smart strategy. I do think the use of Special Forces, which we're using, the use of enablers and trainers in Iraq, which has had some positive effects, are very much in our interests.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: It sounded to me that her response was very similar to the strategy of the current administration. When President Obama himself was asked about Syria last month, he said it haunts him. You know, in terms of helping in the war then, what -- did you hear enough in her response?

WARD: One very major difference from President Barack Obama, she said she would like to see a no-fly zone implemented in Syria. That would offer some kind of protection to the civilians who have live under that relentless bombardment for five years now. But she didn't give any details on how that no-fly zone would be implemented. The jury is not out on this one. A lot of analysts are saying, hold on, that's a major military investment. It would require potentially escalating the conflict in Syria even further because it is the Russian fighter jets who are ruling the skies over northern Syria right now, not the U.S. But certainly, this is a significant departure from the policy of President Barack Obama, and potentially one that the people of Syria would very much welcome -- Brooke?

BALDWIN: Well, you're the one to talk to, having testified at the United Nations and being to Syria multiple times.

Clarissa Ward, thank you for your voice.

Coming up next, inside the shocking hot-mic moment shaking up the current presidential election. Up next, we'll talk to a former producer for "Access Hollywood," his thoughts on who might have leaked that 2005 video between Trump and Billy Bush, and is there more from where that came from?

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[14:51:34] BALDWIN: Billy Bush, hot mics and a videotape, this is a moment that could be a turning point in the race for president. From what we know, a producer at "Access Hollywood" remembered they interviewed Trump back in 2005, they pulled the tape, they discovered this hot-mic conversation between the nominee and star host. Vulgar, disgusting and newsworthy. "Access Hollywood" says it alerted NBC News of what they found, but the executives sat on it for days, so someone leaked this tape to "The Washington Post." Within hours, bam, an apology tour, parade of Republican deflections, and first 30 minutes of the nastiest debate we have ever seen. The question is, are there more tapes to come?

Joining me, Antony Beilinsohn, you were a senior broadcast producer at "Access Hollywood," and he worked with both Billy Bush and Nancy O'Dell. Also with me, CNN senior media correspondent, host of "Reliable Sources, Mr. Brian Stelter.

Antony, you first.

We know "Access Hollywood" said, we remember we interviewed Trump, let's go to the archives, they pull the tape from 2005, they alerted NBC News, and they sat on it. You have been in those news rooms. What's the process? Take me back to when they would have found the tape. Who would have found it? Who would have seen it?

ANTONY BEILINSOHN, FORMER SENIOR BROADCAST PRODUCER, ACCESS HOLLYWOOD: Well, here's what happened. Once a story becomes newsworthy, obviously, Trump is running for the presidency of the United States, and what a news organization will do is go back through all the footage they have and find out if -- they've done hundreds of shoots with Trump over the years. Find out if there is something potentially newsworthy. Once they found that newsworthy item, then it goes to the producers of the show and the lawyers. Listen, "Access Hollywood" is not technically a news organization. So it is sort of overseen a little differently than NBC News. They have to assess whether they can air a piece of tape that was recorded privately between Trump and the host. And so that takes discussions. That takes some legal conversations. And sort of in-between them finding the tape, the legal discussion, somebody has decided that they, then, want to leak that tape, obviously, to embarrass Trump. So, that's --

(CROSSTALK) BALDWIN: So you're getting ahead of me. Before someone decides to leak the tape, why do you think they decided to sit on it?

BEILINSOHN: I think they decided to sit on it for a couple of reasons. First of all, it's a private conversation. It's kind of like being on the record and off the record. Trump and Billy were having a conversation. They technically weren't rolling, so they were technically off the record. Once the tapes were rolling, rolling with the segment, then it becomes on the record. So, he had have to make an assessment as to whether they I believe, legally because it's a private conversation. There are rules that dictate private conversations. Because "Access Hollywood" is not technically a news organization, they're under different guidelines than news organizations. So, they decided to sit on it --

(CROSSTALK)

BRIAN STELTER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA CORRESPONDENT & CNN HOST, RELIABLE SOURCES: I would point out that Donald Trump and Billy Bush, they're television stars. They know when they're wearing a microphone on --

(CROSSTALK)

BALDWIN: I don't care where are you, you've got a microphone on, you should shh.

STELTER: Exactly. There were concerns that delayed this a couple days. I believe NBC would have aired this some time, maybe this week, but clearly someone inside NBC didn't think so, because this leaked out, apparently, from inside NBC, to "The Washington Post."

BALDWIN: Antony, do you think it would have been a lower level tape producer sort of person or an upper level, you know, executive or producer?

BEILINSOHN: Well, here's the truth. The tapes go into a centralized system and everybody at that organization has access to it.

BALDWIN: Would have had access.

BEILINSOHN: Everybody has access to that tape. And obviously this is being discussed, it's discussed in the news room, everybody knows it's potentially in the system. So, once it goes to the legal department, there could be anybody in that organization, and that's potentially hundreds of people, that could have had access to that tape.

[14:55:26] BALDWIN: OK.

STELTER: You know, this is incredible. Donald Trump was built up by NBC. He was a star of "The Apprentice" for many years. I believe Trump and some at the RNC now think it was top NBC executives, liberal Hollywood types, trying to get back at Trump, trying hurt Trump and leak that tape.

BALDWIN: Look --

STELTER: I'm not saying that happened. I don't think it did. But Trump in his own mind is wonder who did this to me.

BALDWIN: Hang on, hang on.

Trump is a piece of it. And Billy Bush is as well. He has been suspended by the "Today" show.

BEILINSOHN: Absolutely.

BALDWIN: I want to talk to you, Antony, about your thoughts on Billy Bush. You worked with him. Also about Nancy O'Dell, who they were talking so nastily about.

Stay with me. Nobody move. Quick break.

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BALDWIN: Everyone holding their collective breath. Now I have Antony Beilinsohn and Brian Stelter standing by. Antony, former "Access Hollywood" producer.

The question, you worked by Billy Bush, who's been suspended by the "Today" show, what do you make of what he has said and what is he like?

BEILINSOHN: Listen, I think what happened is it's kind of like having -- holding a dinner party and you invite a guest and the guest comes on and they arrive at the dinner party and they say something inappropriate. You're put in a very difficult situation. I think at the time, as Billy said, and he's admitted and apologized, he was very immature and he was young. And this is not apologizing for his comments or his behavior, but the truth is that the comments Trump made were highly inappropriate, to say the least. And I think that --

BALDWIN: But he wasn't just laughing, Billy Bush. He was not just laughing in that conversation. He played an active role.

BEILINSOHN: Absolutely. I think he has sort of apologized for that. Listen, I personally like Billy. I've traveled around the country with him. I find him to be a very congenial guy and a nice fellow.

I think one of the reasons the tapes were held on to for so long is because Billy has been promoted to a position that's incredibly influential inside NBC News and the "Today" show.

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BEILINSOHN: There's talk about him taking over the "Today" show somewhere down the line, and they wanted to protect him, so that's why -- how do we release these tapes that he is sort of in evident and at the same time --