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Clinton and Trump Face off in Second Presidential Debate; Analysis of Candidates' Performances. Aired 3:30-4a ET

Aired October 10, 2016 - 03:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

GEORGE HOWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Debate Night in America, welcome to our viewers around the world, I'm George Howell at the CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta. You've been watching a replay of Sunday Night Second Presidential Debate between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

These two candidates shook hands at the end of the debate. They did not shake hands as it started which is customary. Fair to say, this was a debate unlike any other with attack after attack between both candidates.

And now we want to bring you some analysis of this Second U.S. Presidential Debate, here is CNNs, Wolf Blitzer from earlier after the face-off ended between Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: We did the math Donald Trump spoke for 40 minutes and 10 seconds. Hillary Clinton spoke for 39 minutes and five seconds, almost exactly the same amount of time. John King, you didn't really hear a very robust emotional apology from Donald Trump, did you?

[03:35:00] JOHN KING, AMERICAN JOURNALIST, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No, you didn't and in the incoming -- the inbox from Republicans that's one of the things they're worried about because they believe that's very powerful for Hillary Clinton to use that tape in advertising, to use Donald Trump in his own words saying such vulgar, predatory things about women and he didn't say anything aggressively to apologize.

He did say he didn't do that behavior when pressed by Anderson Cooper. He did say he didn't do those things. That was one of the unanswered questions where he says in the topics (ph) in the tape about assaulting women. Now, he says he didn't do those. He was just talking about, he said he apologized.

Nowhere near as aggressive in his personal thing as many Republicans wanted. Instead he went straight into the personal attacks on her bringing Bill Clinton into it. That first 20 minutes, as Jake said, I think he will be judged as long as (ph) based on it. If you're watching at home, where do you stand from a partisan perspective?

What Donald Trump is getting better review is for his being more engage and more aggressive, more responsive and more counter punching by throwing Mike Pence under the bus at a time when Mike Pence is standing by him through this personal thing is very interest and dynamic and he also significantly did say that, yes, he took that giant deduction so that he wouldn't pay federal income taxes you can bet that's coming to a TV ad in the final days without a doubt.

BLITZER: You can certainly bet that that is true. Jake, back to you.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN HOST: Thanks Wolf. Let's check in with our panel of experts about what they think. Gloria, I said it was a wash, but feel free to completely disagree with me.

GLORIA BORGER, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think at the beginning of the debate, Donald Trump did exactly the opposite of what I thought he should have done. He said that he was embarrassed by this, the videotape. He said that it was locker room talk. He did not apologize to any of the women involved.

And he kept saying, you know, it's words and it wasn't anything more than that, period end of sentence. So, there was nothing more than anything he had already said. He had already had the press conference about Bill Clinton, et cetera so we knew that story. And then when they were asked, are you different now than you were when you were at the young age of 59?

He just said, "I'm not proud of it. It's locker room talk and I have great respect for people, my family." And, you know, Hillary got him on that because she came back and she said you needed to apologize. Then for the rest of the debate, I think Donald Trump, once he got over that hurdle, was a little bit more disciplined, if that's the right word.

Attacking Hillary, I thought well, on the email issue where she is vulnerable. And, I think in a sense, he may have done enough -- she was -- she seemed a little stilted at times and I think that he may have done enough to kind of, as you put it, stop the bleeding. I'm not sure any minds were changed at this debate tonight.

I think so much has occurred over this last 48 hours and this last week that people have to digest all of this, including this debate tonight to kind of see where they stand. I want to echo one thing that John has said, which was stunning was the Mike Pence remark.

TAPPER: Yes.

BORGER: I mean, he's praising a dictator who was trying to interfere with our election, period. And, you know, whom his running mate said we should, you know...

TAPPER: Stand up to.

BORGER: ...bomb because -- yes, stand up to and we should, you know, bomb Assad who Putin is propping up. So, that really struck a discordant note.

TAPPER: Well, he said he hadn't spoken with his own running mate about Syria...

BORGER: Yes. TAPPER: ...and he disagrees with him.

BORGER: Yes, that's about it.

(CROSSTALK)

DAVID AXELROD, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, yes -- well, what was odd about that was I'm sure he watched the debate on Tuesday night as we all do. We all commented on the fact that Mike Pence's policy on these issues seemed different than Donald Trump's. He went out that night, the next day, that night on Twitter, the next day in person (ph) and said what a brilliant job he did and it never occurred to him to say, by the way, your policy and my policy aren't the same policy. That seems peculiar to me.

TAPPER: Give us a broader look at the...

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: ...what you think.

AXELROD: Look, I agree with Gloria in that I think his handling of the issue of the day, which is that tape was nearly disastrous. I think generally he was much more animated and was much more -- much better counter puncher. I think that he did poorly on that question.

He did poorly on the strange Syria discussion where he got off on kind of a rant there which, you know, I think will leave a lot of questions and led to the Mike Pence question. But the truth is Hillary Clinton also had several struggles with the same issues that she always struggles with...

BORGER: Yes.

AXELROD: ...emails, speeches.

BORGER: Right.

(CROSSTALK)

AXELROD: I thought his counterpunch on the Lincoln comment was good and I -- at the end of the day, I came to the -- I come to the same conclusion Gloria does. I think she probably wins this on points, but I don't think it changes much and I think that his base will feel satisfied with his performance, but the question is has he grown it at all tonight?

BORGER: Yes.

[03:40:00] TAPPER: Yes, and, you know, just to set the stage, I mean this has been one of the most disastrous periods for a presidential nominee in the history of the United States from the first debate until before this debate. Did he change that at all?

NIA-MAIKA HENDERSON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL REPORTER: I think he, as you said, I think he sort of stopped the panic among most of the Republicans there who were panicking, at least for now, right? I thought it was basically a draw, which is a good thing for Donald Trump. I think a lot of Democrats came in here thinking that Hillary Clinton was going to knock him out of this debate and have such a strong performance that there will be no question of where this race stood.

I don't think she had that greater performance. She was fine. I think stylistically he was kind of odd, right pacing around and standing over her in some of those shots I think that's going to be a lot of material stylistically I think, I mean for SNL. I think she counter punched pretty well on the, "You've been there for 30 years what have you been doing."

And then she listed all of the things that she had done, children's healthcare spending healthcare, offered veterans, her work as secretary of state, 400 pieces of legislation. So, I thought that was a good moment for her. And she did ask and drop one of those sorts of Hillary Clinton new information things at the end, kind of an Alicia Machado thing when she talked about Trump gobbling up illegal steel from China to build his buildings. I bet we'll hear more about that.

TAPPER: Yes, that was, I believe that was a news week story...

HENDERSON: Yes.

TAPPER: ...from a few days ago about two out of three buildings that his projects are using the steel that actually hurts American workers, what do you think, Smers (ph)?

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN HOST: I think that the night belongs to Donald Trump. I think that he was border line in free fall as the evening began and by the end of the night, by the end of the debate, we're not talking about the Trump tape. I think he was able to pivot away from that. He was strong, barely controlled at some points and it was a greatest hits reel for the 14 million who voted for him.

I mean no hand shake at the outset, builds infidelities, the email erasure, radical Islam, dishonesty on her part. The media, I think you're going to hear a lot from the Trump forces about how they interpreted the role of the moderators in this. So, I think that those who voted for him got everything they wanted in their vote.

Did he grow the tent? I can't see that there was any outreach. I look carefully for those moments where I thought that he could have expanded the base that he already has. But I think it's his night. Not a knockout, but his night on points.

TAPPER: Where could he have expanded the base? Obviously, there was a Muslim American woman who spoke. There was an African-American who wanted the country -- an African-American gentleman, James Carter who wanted the country to be united, would he be devoted to the country to bring us together? Where were the opportunities that Mike says maybe he didn't take?

BORGER: I think he could have been more expansive about what he wants to do on healthcare reform rather than repeal but replace it with what and how and whom it would benefit. I think he could talk more about the reforms he wants in the tax code aside from getting rid of carry interest for wealthy people.

I think he, you know, where he always falls down is that he goes right on the attack without when a direct question is asked, what would you do about X, Y, or Z he goes -- he deflects and goes on the attack about Hillary has been here 30 years and she didn't do anything, so I think the way you bring people into the tent is to tell them exactly what you would do for them.

And on those important issues to Americans like their taxes and like their healthcare, I still do not think that we got much beyond Obama Care as a disaster and why didn't she fix the tax code before this so people like me didn't take advantage of it. And by the way, I think we might have heard him admit and I'm not sure about this, that he did use on the $918 million debt that he...

TAPPER: Yes.

BORGER: ...actually used that not to...

TAPPER: Not to pay federal...

BORGER: We don't know for how long...

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: I think he didn't say -- he didn't say how long, but he did say he used it.

BORGER: Yes.

HENDERSON: I think the Trump team thinks they're reaching out to suburban white women and college educated white women when they talk about African Americans and inner cities and Hispanics. I think he hurts his case because of his record in the way he talks about African-Americans and the fact that he tends to say, the African- Americans and not just African Americans, which is an acronystic way of referring to folks and deeply odd. So, I think they think they're doing that but I don't think there's any success in growing that tent.

AXELROD: I mean the real question is, do the people who are held back from supporting Trump because they fear he doesn't have the right temperament or they fear he doesn't have command, were they reassured in any way tonight or were they -- will they think of him differently as a result of this performance, I quite agree with Michael I think that was speaking to the base and I think the base is probably very happy. The base is just not big enough...

[03:45:00] SMERCONISH: The demographic, yes -- the demographics of the country are such that they're just -- I'm sorry to hit this data point again, but George Herbert Walker Bush and Mitt Romney got the same percentage of the white vote, 59%. What earned George Herbert Walker Bush 426 electoral votes got Mitt Romney only 206 and there in a nutshell was the changing demographic of the country and that's why the missed opportunity was with the Muslim woman and African-American man at the end. That was his opportunity to be magnanimous.

TAPPER: And where he is doing poorly where he needs to improve significantly has to do with college-educated white voters...

AXELROD: Right, particularly with...

TAPPER: ...he is losing college educated white women...

HENDERSON: Yes.

TAPPER: ...and he's even with college educated white men.

BORGER: Who handled healthcare in their families...

AXELROD: Yes, there was a poll...

BORGER: ...who are...

AXELROD: ...there was a poll out today in your home state, in your home state...

SMERCONISH: Yes.

AXELROD: ...that had him leading in your home state that her leading among college-educated voters -- white voters by 20 points. This is a cohort that Mitt Romney carried by 14% in 2012, that's stunning.

(CROSSTALK)

HENDERSON: ...intolerance, right, I mean and that's what...

TAPPER: They think he's the biggest.

HENDERSON: They think he's the biggest, right and that's why -- that's why you hear Hillary Clinton all of her ads are about Donald Trump and what he said and those words whether it's about women, whether it's about the birther controversy those things turn off college-educated white voters.

BORGER: And not only...

HENDERSON: And he can't undo that because he spends so much time branding himself in that way...

BORGER: Right.

HENDERSON: ...as this kind of unreconstructed alpha male and the tape only underscores that.

TAPPER: Let me just say one thing about the tape because we're all talking about the debate and that's wonderful and that's going to be our focus until 1:00 in the morning, but tomorrow morning we wake up in a world where the debate is over. We're not talking about it anymore. We're talking about something else and I just can't help but think that the Clinton campaign is going make sure that tape is...

HENDERSON: Oh, yes.

TAPPER: ...everywhere from now...

HENDERSON: Yes.

TAPPER: ...until election...

BORGER: Right and it's about...

(CROSSTALK)

SMERCONISH: ...that will be the image of the women. I mean from this point forward...

TAPPER: That's right.

BORGER: Well, right but...

(CROSSTALK)

BORGER: ...for those...

(CROSSTALK)

TAPPER: Exactly.

AXELROD: ...for women and Donald Trump and that story is going to get told.

BORGER: For those college educated, white women that we've been talking about not only...

AXELROD: ...but that just make one other point which is...

BORGER: ...behind, but...

AXELROD: ...it's very clear they don't like each other very much. It was kind of an irritating debate in that sense because they were firing these jives back-and-forth and what was missing from it was any invocation of people....

BORGER: Yes.

AXELROD: ...humanity...

BORGER: Right.

AXELROD: ...where in a Town Hall meeting, the only person that was raised I think Hillary Clinton raised an individual and just in the last minute she raised an individual, you know, to weaponize that story against Donald Trump but the data day struggled -- we're talking about the healthcare nobody mentioned anybody who is actually struggling with healthcare...

BORGER: Right.

AXELROD: ...nobody -- I was surprised by that.

TAPPER: Let's go back to the tape. I want to play Donald Trump's response when the subject of this access how he would tape him talking very crudely about women seeming to boast about grabbing women, assaulting women inappropriately here is his response.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: You are called what you said "locker-room banter", you described women without consent, grabbing their genitals that is sexual assault, you brag that you have sexually assaulted women, do you understand that?

TRUMP: No, I didn't say that at all. I don't think you understood what was said. This was "locker-room talk". I'm not proud of it. I apologize to my family. I apologize to the American people. Certainly, I'm not proud of it, but this is "locker-room talk," you know, when we have a world where you have ISIS chopping off heads, where you have and frankly drowning people in steel cages, where you have wars and horrible -- horrible sites all over where you have so many bad things happening this is like Medieval times, we haven't seen anything this the carnage all over the world and they look and they say, can you imagine the people that are frankly doing so well against us with ISIS and they look at our country and they see what's going on yes, I'm very embarrassed by it. I hate it, but it's "locker-room talk" and it's one of those things. I will knock the hell out of ISIS. We're going to defeat ISIS. ISIS happen a number of years ago in a vacuum that was left...

COOPER: So...

TRUMP: ...because of bad judgement and I will tell you I will take care of ISIS.

(END VIDEO CLLIP)

TAPPER: So, the basic response there Van, it was "locker-room talk" but nothing compared to the horrors of ISIS and I'm going to stop ISIS.

VAN JONES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes, you know, I just thought that was just horrible of he -- rather than apologizing, he minimized and that was something that everybody here agreed he should avoid doing. And basically if -- the only thing you have to say about yourself is, I'm as bad as ISIS...

(LAUGHTER)

JONES: ...I'm not -- I mean that's your...

(LAUGHTER)

JONES: ...that's your defense...

(LAUGHTER)

JONES: ...there's something wrong with that...

(CROWD CHEERING)

JONES: ...response. The other thing is that you cannot under estimate the history that was made in our country, a line was crossed I don't know it's been crossed in my lifetime maybe ever he threatened to jail his opponent...

BORGER: Yes, right.

(CROSSTALK)

[03:50:00] JONES: He threatened to jail Hillary Clinton if he became president of United States that is something I think is a new low in American democracy, but I will say something maybe provocative. I think Hillary won because Donald Trump kind of won. In other words, the worse possibly outcome for Hillary Clinton could have been if she knocked him out.

If she had knocked him out and forced him out of the race, you could have been in a situation where the Republican Party could rally get somebody else in there. It was actually a good outcome for her. She did well enough. He did well enough. He stabilizes himself and he's going to bleed out and she's going to be able to get across the finish line.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: Kayleigh?

KAYLEIGH MCENANY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I'm not sure that we watched the same debate because...

(LAUGHTER)

MCENANY: ...he is a transcript guy. Donald Trump issued three more apologies. He is now up to issuing five. That's enough for most of the American people. I'm still waiting on the media to call for an apology to Hillary Clinton lying to the families of Benghazi members when she told them their relatives are dead because of the video which was not true. I'm still waiting for the call for that apology.

But, I think something very big happened tonight that I think has lost upon most of us. What we saw tonight was someone speaks for the people against the Washington elite. There are people in this country, two- thirds of the country, thinks we're in the wrong direction. They are tired of being promised, hoped and change, which is what President Obama promised millenials, promised the American people and it did not materialize in.

You saw Donald Trump flawlessly exposed the double standards of justice when he said -- when he said, if someone in American citizen had done one fifth of what you have done with your emails their lives would have been destroyed. And there was an audible boo from the audience, because people know Hillary Clinton lied when she retorted with the fact that, "I didn't do anything wrong with my emails." The audience booed because there are two standards, the Washington elite get one and we the American people get another...

TAPPER: Well, I think...

MCENANY: ...that was exposed.

TAPPER: I think the audience had Trump's supporters and Clinton's supporters and we heard both sides. But, let me go into -- let me play some of what you're talking about and specifically Van Jones, it's the -- Van Jones, it's the moment that you referred to where he said that -- where he in-charge of the laws, she would be in jail.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

TRUMP: I didn't think I would say this, but I'm going to say it and I hate to say it, but if I win, I am going to instruct my attorney general to get a special prosecutor to look into your situation, because there has never been so many lies, so much deception. There has never been anything like it and we're going to have a special prosecutor. When I speak, I go out and speak, the people of this country are furious.

In my opinion, the people that have been long-term workers at the FBI are furious. There has never been anything like this where emails and you get a subpoena -- you get a subpoena and after getting the subpoena, you delete 33,000 emails. And then you acid wash them or bleach them, as you would say very expensive process.

So, we're going to get a special prosecutor and we're going to look into it, because you know what, people have been -- their lives have been destroyed for doing one-fifth of what you've done and it's a disgrace. And honestly, you ought to be ashamed of yourself.

RADDATZ: Secretary?

CLINTON: Everything he just said is absolutely false, but I'm not surprised.

TRUMP: Oh, really.

CLINTON: I told people that it would be impossible to be fact-checking Donald all the time. I'd never get to talk about anything I want to do and how we're going to really make lives better for people. So, once again, go to hillaryclinton.com. We have literally Trump, you can fact-check him -- fact-check him in real time. It's just awfully good that someone with the temperament of Donald Trump is not in-charge of the law in our country.

TRUMP: Yes, because you'd be in jail.

RADDATZ: Secretary Clinton.

(CROWD CHEERING)

(LAUGHTER) (END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So, Jeffry, I heard you laughing.

JEFFREY LORD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes.

(LAUGHTER)

TAPPER: You see that is a crowd pleaser -- that's a crowd pleaser for Trump supporters. There's no question about that. He already has Trump supporters.

LORD: OK.

TAPPER: They already support him. He is that the kind of line that exemplifies the kind of temperament that those who are undecided want to hear from him.

LORD: Yes. And I'll why. This is about as Kayleigh was saying this is about the American people versus the political class in this country media elites, politicians, et cetera who as he said repeatedly there talk, talk, talk, talk and they never get anything done and they lie and they dissemble. And she would, in fact, if she were not Hillary Clinton, she would be in huge trouble, you know, with these emails and she would conceivably be going to jail.

I mean other people have gone to jail for these kind of problems. So what he's doing there is hitting the broad themes one the division between the American people and the political class, two her character, if you remember that famous Quinnipiac Poll from last year where they asked people to pre-associate, you know, one word descriptions of the candidates and for her it was dishonest and liar, that's...

TAPPER: You know, that's kind of a bogus poll where they I mean they -- I think the biggest ones for Trump were unflattering as well. But I take your point on the fact that she has very, very low trustworthy and honesty numbers...

LORD: So, he was hitting this.

TAPPER: OK, Paul?

[03:55:00] PAUL BEGALA, CNN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: The strategic context in which this debate occurs is the Trump campaign in meltdown and it meltdown especially with women because of this really horrific tape where he brags about committing sexual assault. He -- I don't think he put it to bed. You keep hearing stories that there are more tapes to come. Look, I did 10 to 14 years on television and people keep saying we're going to go through these tapes maybe they will maybe they won't.

But he certainly did nothing to put it behind him or even to inoculate against the stories to come. Now, tonight's audience, I bet you they call (ph) to be much more female than male first off, more voters are female than male. But tonight, we're up against Sunday Night football Packers, by the way, 17 and 9 over the Giants leading right now.

(LAUGHTER)

BEGALA: But of course, the performance he put on first being so bizarre about this sexual assault. One of the answers he mentioned ISIS immigration and the economy and one of the follow-ups he rambled on it about Michelle Obama, Sidney Blumenthal, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Bernie Sanders' emails that doesn't -- sway to (ph) any women voters and then the style throughout the debate I kept hearing from a lot of women, they didn't like the pacing, the stalking...

MCENANY: Yes.

BEGALA: ...the really kind of creepy behavior when he wasn't speaking towards, you know, last time he was got in trouble for interrupting. He did a fair amount of that again. He seemed to actually pick a lot of unwise fights with Martha Raddatz also less so with Anderson. I've -- this is not -- if I'm -- as the Super Pac guy, I may worked for the Super Pac as opposing Trump and supporting Hillary, I'm real happy about this. If I were Trump's strategy side I would say, boss, we've got a problem with women and you just made it worse.

TAPPER: All right, we're going to -- we're going to stay -- keep it there. Everybody stay. We're going to at least -- we still got two hours. Wolf, let me throw it back to you.

BLITZER: Anderson -- no, it's not (ph) Anderson, Jake, thanks very much. We've got excellent moment right now to discuss something I've never heard in any of these debates before between two presidential candidates and Dana let's talk a little about this.

One candidate says, not only is he going to put forward a special prosecutor to investigate his rival, but this is very -- he's going to put her in jail if he's elected president of the United States, that's pretty extraordinary.

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: OK, not to sound too corny, but what makes this country different from countries with dictators in Africa or Stalin or Hitler or any of those countries with dictators and totalitarian leaders is that when they took over, they put their opponents in jail.

So, hear one presidential candidate say, even if it was a flip comment, which it was, you're going to be in jail to another presidential candidate on the debate stage in the United States of America, stunning, just stunning.

BLITZER: Certainly is, John...

HOWELL: That is CNN's Dana Bash there talking about something that is unprecedented. I'm George Howell, our post debate coverage continues now on "EARLY START" here on CNN.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

CLINTON: It's just awfully good that someone with the temperament of Donald Trump is not in-charge of the law in our country.

TRUMP: Because you would be in jail.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTINE ROMANS, CNN ANCHOR: Wow. All right, this time it's personal Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton head to head to the night of nasty insults and interruptions.

Good morning, welcome to "EARLY START". I'm Christine Romans.

JOHN BERMAN, ANCHOR: I'm John Berman. It's Monday October 10th, it's 4:00 a.m. in the east. We want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and all around the world.