Return to Transcripts main page


Clinton, Trump On Campaign Blitz In Florida; Iraqi And Peshmerga Forces Press The Offensive; Demolition Of "Jungle" Migrant Camp Begins; Quest Meets First-Time Voters In Key Swing State; Washington Clawing Back Bonuses From Veterans; Changing Reality, Virtually; Banker Gave Up Wall Street To Help Out Orphans. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired October 25, 2016 - 15:00   ET




[15:00:23] HALA GORANI, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. I'm Hala Gorani. We are live at CNN London. Thanks for being with us. This is THE WORLD RIGHT


All right, we have some new numbers this hour that are very interesting in the presidential race. Hillary Clinton and Donald Trump have exactly two

weeks left for a frenzy of last-minute campaigning, but a brand new poll is showing most Americans believe basically that the race is now all but over.

A CNN/ORC survey finds that 68 percent of registered voters think Clinton will win. That's compared to just 27 for Trump, but Clinton doesn't have

that big of a margin when it becomes a question of support.

The poll shows 49 percent of likely voters are backing her, 44 support Trump. As Clinton well knows it doesn't matter if you're ahead in the

polls if your supporters stay home on Election Day and she is focusing on getting out to vote at a rally in Florida. These are live villages coming

to us from Coconut Creek, Florida.

Donald Trump is also campaigning in Florida. He's due at a rally in Stanford anytime now. Let's bring in senior political reporter, Stephen

Collinson for the very latest. Why Florida today, why so much effort in that state?

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR ENTERPRISE REPORTER: Well, Hala, it's not even just today, Donald Trump has spent the last three days in

Florida. As you say Hillary Clinton is down there as well and it is quite simple for Donald Trump. Florida is the biggest swing state in terms of

electoral votes.

If he doesn't win, it is over. He can't win the election. Currently most polls have him down about 4 percent in Florida. So this really is a sort

of a war to lose state for him, if you will. He really, really must to win Florida, and I think he also has a kinship with the state.

It's his second home, he has golf courses there, a beach club in Florida. When you go to a Donald Trump rally in Florida, he really talks about how

the state means a lot to him and the people mean a lot to him.

And I think there is electoral sort of reasons for him to be there, and there's a certain amount of personal pride, but just to reiterate, if he

doesn't win Florida, it is over.

GORANI: Yes, he's 4 points behind in that latest Quinnipiac poll, but one of the figures in one of the surveys is how many Americans seemed to

believe that this is a done deal for Hillary Clinton. What is the potential impact on the race?

COLLINSON: Yes, I think that poll is interesting because it encapsulates what it seems like is happening in the electorate. If you talk to people,

you know, just around in the country, they feel that Hillary Clinton is going to win.

Reading between the lines of the two campaigns, it seems there is a growing realization that, you know, Donald Trump is so far behind that this

election is going to go Hillary Clinton's way.

But you're right earlier when you said, you know, Hillary Clinton needs her voters to come out and if you're a Hillary Clinton voter and you have a

busy life and you think she will win anyway, perhaps you don't come out and that could be certainly dangerous for the Clinton campaign.

At the same time, if Donald Trump's supporters feel that he has no chance of winning that might suppress his turnout and that would be dangerous for


I think there is certainly evidence that some of Donald Trump's accusations that the election is being rigged and he's got to chance to win anyway,

might actually be having a bad effect on his own turnout and the enthusiasm of his own voters.

GORANI: Well, we see if he adjust his message then. Stephen Collinson, thanks very much.

In Washington resources are limited in presidential campaigns, though, some of the sums that are spent are eye popping, but they are limited. So

candidates usually focus their efforts on states where they have a fighting chance.

This year, though, Hillary Clinton is hoping to win some traditionally Republican territory. Take a look at this map that breaks down to road to

270 electoral votes, state by state, that's what you need to win, blue states, solid Democrat, red states, solid Republican.

[15:05:09]But here's the interesting phenomenon, Clinton has managed to turn the traditional GOP stronghold of Georgia pink, which means that there

is possibility it might go her way. And she's even a contender in Texas, a state that has not gone Democrat in a presidential in decades.

Let's talk about these battleground states with two experts, Cal Jillson is a professor of political science at Southern Methodist University in

Dallas, and Larry Sabato is the director of the Center for Politics at the University of Virginia.

Gentlemen, thanks for being with us. Larry, I'm going to start with you and Georgia. Take a look at the latest AJC poll there, Donald Trump at 44

percent, Hillary Clinton at 42 percent, and Gary Johnson at 9 percent. They're only 2 points apart within the margin of error and we are talking

about Georgia here. What's going on, Larry?

LARRY SABATO, DIRECTOR, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA CENTER FOR POLITICS: Well, what's going is that Donald Trump is doing more poorly than any modern

Republican nominee including John McCain who lost by 7 points in 2008 in a lot of these red states.

Now Trump is more than two points ahead in Georgia. I'd say it's more like four or five and if Clinton somehow wins Georgia, it is a complete blow


I don't think that's going to happen, but what is revealing about Georgia is that it suggest Trump is having great difficulty even in Republican


GORANI: Yes, absolutely. And we are seeing it as well in Texas, Cal Jillson, over to you and let's talk about, first of all, early voting

numbers are hitting record levels and we're also seeing a very close race in Texas, which is usually solidly Republican. What is going on?

CAL JILLSON, SOUTHERN METHODIST UNIVERSITY: We just had one day of early voting that started yesterday on Monday and the numbers are up, but

population growth in Texas has been rampant. It looks like there is a lot of enthusiasm for this election, it's yet too early to tell what side that

is going to help.

Whether Clinton or Trump, but like Georgia, the polling in Texas shows a much closer race than traditionally has been the case. Back in The

Republican won by 12. Romney in 2012 won by 16 points and the whole Republican statewide in 2014 won by 20 points.

So the normal Republican advantage in Texas may be 15, and so to have Trump winning Texas by two, three, four, five points in several recent polls just

shows, as Larry said, how he's under performing in traditionally red states.

GORANI: And Cal Jillson, early turnout, lots of enthusiasm, by the way, we were showing our viewers some very long lines and queues of voters waiting

to cast their ballots, typically who does that favor and in this case, which candidate do you think this would favor?

JILLSON: Well, it is hard to tell which candidate it favors. Often times it will be the Democratic candidate, particularly if black churches

organize bus groups to go to the polls and things like that, and then the Republican vote comes in on Election Day, but this is very early.

We just have one day of numbers. We do see those long lines. I think partisans, people deeply committed, who have known for months, are banking

those as early as possible, and then forget about this election. I think almost everyone in America is ready to be done with this.

GORANI: Right, yes, absolutely. I'm hearing that sentiments expressed by everyone on both sides of the aisle. Larry, let me ask you a little bit

about Ohio and Florida. Those are the two important battleground states and a Republican candidate has to win in the case of Donald Trump, has to

win Florida, Ohio as well.

But in terms of the overall picture, does it look like Trump here has a chance and if not how does he turn things around?

SABATO: Well, he has a chance in Ohio. The polling averages show that virtually tied. Florida not so much. Florida is in Clinton's column by at

least three or four percentage points. Some polls have had it a little higher.

And I'll tell you just compare that to the extremely close race in Florida in 2,000 between Bush and Gore in 2004, in 2008, in 2012. We're used to

very close races in Florida. If Clinton wins it even by three points, that's a blowout in Florida.

GORANI: It's a blow out and Ohio as well, so is that possibly, if I could ask you, Cal Jillson, a tossup here or is the expectation really that that

will go in the Trump column?

JILLSON: Well, it has been trending for Trump for a long time, but it is very, very close. And the professionals running these campaigns know that

Ohio is less of a worry to the Trump campaign than as Florida.

[15:10:08]No Republican has won the White House without carrying Florida since 1924 so you absolutely have to get that and then you go to Ohio when

you're a little bit in better shape, and no Republican has ever won the White House from Abraham Lincoln in 1860 forward to today without carrying


So those are two absolutely must win states for Trump. Clinton would love to have them if she wins Florida we can all go to bed early on election


GORANI: That is certainly -- we'll see how that pans out, but I have to ask you, Larry, we're talking here -- this may sound a little bit like

we're in in the weeds, but it is important to see because of how the U.S. electoral system function, that it is those swing states that will

ultimately determine the final outcome.

But let's look a little bit at the bigger picture. Why is Donald Trump doing so poorly in traditionally Republican states where he should be far

ahead by now?

SABATO: You know, it is really interesting. First of all you have a slice of Republicans that have never signed on to the Trump train. They've never

liked him. They don't like him now. They may not be voting for Hillary Clinton, but they are not going to support Donald Trump.

And in the end, a candidate has to consolidate about 90 percent of his or her party vote in order to win. And beyond that, there are a lot of

Republicans who agree with Democrats and independents that Donald Trump does not have the experience to be president, and does not have the

temperament to serve in the oval office.

GORANI: All right, Larry Sabato and Cal Jillson, thanks very much to both of you for joining us on CNN. We appreciate your analysis and we hope to

speak soon.

Let's turn our attention now to the Middle East and of course, that all- important battle for Mosul. We're a little more than a week into it. The American-led coalition again ISIS is laying the ground work for retaking

after Mosul, Raqqa.

We're talking about the de facto ISIS capital in Syria. It is the next phase in the wider war to tackle the terrorist group. About a dozen

defense ministers met in Paris today to talk strategy.

The Pentagon chief stressed that the coalition must be ready for anything and cannot predict what will happen after ISIS is ousted from its

strongholds. But Ashton Carter says he is encouraged by the results of the Mosul offensive. Take a listen.


ASHTON CARTER, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: It has been proceeding as planned. As you know, we've recently reached a critical milestone in that plan with

our local partners in the Iraqi Security Forces and the Kurdish Peshmerga. Having commenced the operation to envelop and collapse ISIL's control over

the city of Mosul. The Iraqis are fighting with skill, commitment, and courage enabled by the coalition.


GORANI: Ashton Carter there, Raqqa is a long way away. That's because well, to be quite frank, Mosul is still very much a long way away perhaps

not geographically, but in terms of how long it will take to get there.

Our Arwa Damon is standing by in Iraq with the latest on what she saw today -- Arwa.

ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Hala. Yes, as you mentioned, we don't know how long it will take for forces to actually reach

Mosul and then recapture that strategic city. But key in all of this is U.S. and other coalition partners' support and as part of that offensive,

the U.S. military has set itself up to be able to cooperate directly with the Iraqi units advising, placing its troops, thousands of them throughout

the country, and we visited one of the main air bases.


DAMON: This is (inaudible) West, America's largest forward position in Iraq, at the forefront of the battle for Mosul.

(on camera): From the moment you get a call, you can mobile in this and out firing on to an enemy position within 2 minutes.


DAMON (voice-over): Lt. Keegan Aldridge shows us the latest generation of precision artillery.

LT. KEEGAN ALDRIDGE, U.S. ARMY: So we are the further reaching artillery system on the battlefield, highly accurate, highly precise because our

system minimizes the collateral damage because there is a lot of urban targets that we are prosecuting.

DAMON: This facility was a base during the U.S. led occupation of Iraq. Some of the blast falls are from those days. When ISIS was finally driven

out in August, they destroyed the runway. Mounts of earth hid bombs and building were booby trapped. Now the runway is clear and hundreds of

troops are based here.

(on camera): Everyone has their gas mask?


[15:15:03]DAMON (voice-over): That is because obnoxious smoke from a fire set by ISIS at a nearby sulfur plant, which cast a dense pall over a huge

area. Inside the joint operation center, commanders closely watch drone feeds that we cannot see. Right now, a group of ISIS fighters is the

target. Cheers erupt as they are hit.

ALDRIDGE: The fire support that we have been providing for this operation has been unprecedented. Since the Mosul liberation kicked off, we've

dropped over 1,700 munitions.

DAMON: But if all goes according to plan, the operation will have to change.

ALDRIDGE: The civilian population does complicate the situation and avoiding civilian casualties is a very high priority for the coalition

obviously. So it will change the way that we look at our targeting.

DAMON: ISIS has long shown that it's a determined enemy.

(on camera): And the enemy always has a vote.

ALDRIDGE: I believe in what I have seen from our Iraqi and Peshmerga forces, the cooperation, the support that the coalition is providing, I

believe that our vote will outweigh their vote.

DAMON (voice-over): But what is a win in a country that has already lost so much?


DAMON: And Hala, of course right now the troops are pushing through territory surrounding Mosul that is by and large open space or it is the

smaller villages that for the most part are deserted. The entire dynamics are going to change once they reach the city of Mosul itself, for the

civilian population of upwards of 1.2 million people.

GORANI: All right, Arwa Damon, still a long road ahead, thanks very much for that report. A lot more to come this evening, do stay with us.

The demolition has begun, we're live in Calais as France starts to take apart the "Jungle" migrant camp. The very latest on that, we are live.

Plus the Vatican issues new rules on cremation, rules that effect the world's one billion Catholics. We'll explain just ahead.


GORANI: Well, it's an area thousands have called home for the last two years, but a few hours ago, the "Jungle" camp in the French port city of

Calais started coming down. Take a look at some of the video from today.

They're not bulldozing anything yet. It is all still by hand with chainsaws and power tools. They had shovels as well. Workers dismantled

those temporary structures, got rid of possessions, and cleared some areas.

But we've learned that 4,000 migrants have been bussed out of the area to be resettled around France, but that some of them are not leaving. Let's

go to Melissa Bell. She is at the camp in Calais with the very latest. So what is the situation now at the camp?

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It has been another day of evacuation, Hala, as you said, that new figure, 4,000 migrants who have not been bussed

out was announced by the French authorities a little earlier this evening and that is a figure they are very pleased with.

They've managed to convince 4,000 migrants to leave voluntarily by offering them the possibility of seeking asylum in one France's regions.

And this is something that the French authorities are very pleased about. On the other hand, you have the demolition of the camp itself. That's gone

much more slowly than had been anticipated. It began with a slight delay this morning and it's going very slowly so far, have a look.


BELL (voice-over): For months the threat had hanged over the camp. Tuesday, the clearing began as the diggers got to work on the edge of the

Jungle, some of it women protested.

(on camera): It was amid a heavy police presence that the dismantling of the Calais Jungle finally got underway delayed by several hours, it will

now continue, say local authorities, until every last tent on this camp has been cleared.

(voice-over): And it may not take that long. Already thousands of migrants have left. Many of the Jungle's homes lie empty, its shops

padlocked, its restaurants boarded up.

The Jungle has become, in part, a shadow of its former self. Some though are holding fast, refusing to give up on their dream of getting one day to

the United Kingdom, and like many Aziz (ph) has seen it all before.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This jungle never going to be finish. I've seen this same situation in 2007 and I'm back in 2016 and same situation. Nothing

will be happen. People will move from there, three weeks, one month, it'll be same thing again.

BELL: As the demolition of its edges continues, the resistance from within the camp grows, in the shape of fires, migrants burning what little they

had to signal how little they want to leave.


BELL: Now, Hala, this is the situation tonight, you can see that those fires continue on the very far (inaudible) of the camp and all along

structurally the camp is much as it was yesterday. That beginning of demolition that you saw there in our story has continues, but very gently,

very slowly and largely by hand.

So that essentially the camp tonight is relatively intact. What has changed for these fires, these protests that the migrants have been making

over the course of the day, and of course, you have to remember the thousands of migrants are still in that camp and for the time being

refusing to leave.

GORANI: All right, Melissa Bell, thanks very much. Live in Calais for us this evening with the very latest on what appears to be a slower than

expected dismantling of that camp.

We'll keep our eye on that story. I'm sure many of you will have passed London's Heathrow airport at some stage. It's one of the biggest airports

in the world, 75 million people a year fly through it and it is about to get busier.

The government has now approved plans for a third runway bringing in millions of extra passengers, but as Erin McLaughlin reports not everyone

is happy about that.


ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: For the people of a tiny village of Harmondsworth, the construction of a third Heathrow Airport runway means

much more than a billion dollar economic boost or having to deal with extra air and noise pollution, for many of the people who live here, it means

they lose their homes.

Up to 800 homes is set to be demolished as part of this now government- backed plan across three different villages, and while for the young people who live here, it is not much of a problem, they will simply be compensated

and move on.

Residents tell us that the elderly who live here simply don't know what to do.


ELISH STORE, HARMONDSWORTH RESIDENT: It's very, very difficult for many of our older people who live in this community and particularly neighbors who

live along here, you know, in their 80s and 90s. What on earth is going to happen to them? What will happen to them? Many of them have years and

years and years of history. Families were brought up in this community. It's going to be destroyed.

ELLA, HARMONDSWORTH RESIDENT: I'm on my own. I have no family. I have no children or no husband or anything. So I'm on my own. I don't think it's

fair for us.


BELL: And it is the fairness of this proposal that will be scrutinized for the next 18 months. Erin McLaughlin, CNN, Harmondsworth, U.K.

GORANI: More than a billion people around the world have just been given new rules on what should happen to them if they're cremated. The Catholic

Church today issued the guidelines saying ashes should not be scattered or stored on a mantle.

Our Vatican correspondent, Delia Gallagher, joins us from Rome. Delia, you know, we have seen it done, we heard of it being done, people are cremated

and they say scatter my ashes in this part of the world or in my favorite park or that kind of thing, but if they're Catholic now, these guidelines

are recommending they don't do that.

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely, Hala. They're saying it's against the rules of the Catholic Church to scatter the ashes

or were to use them in particular ways. The problem for the Vatican, Hala, is not cremation in itself. That has been allowed since 1963 in the

Catholic Church.

The problem is what you do with the ashes afterwards. So the Vatican has said today that the best thing to do is to place them in a sacred place,

which for them would be a Catholic cemetery.

What you should not do is scatter them at sea or on land. You should not keep them in urns in the home or divide them up amongst family members and

they say you should not even keep them in lockets and in other jewelry.

They say their preferred method is bodily burial. Why are they so intent on the whole idea of bodily burial? Because it goes to one of their major

beliefs, which is in life after death, and the resurrection of the body, we'll have these bodies as we have them now after death.

So the Vatican says today that sometimes this increase in cremation and scattering of ashes can signify that people no longer believe in life after

death. It's kind of annihilation of the person they say and that's what they are trying to counteract -- Hala.

GORANI: But why has it taken so long to come up with these guidelines? Because if cremation has been authorized since the `60s, that is a couple

of generations of people, who have not been made aware that this is the Catholic Church's recommendation?

GALLAGHER: Well, to be fair, Hala, this has been the guideline since 1963, since cremation has been allowed. They have been against the scattering of

ashes. They have brought it up again today as new guidelines because they say that there is this increase in what you can do and what people are

doing with ashes.

So they want to reiterate the point. They brought up another interesting point, which is they see this kind of cremation and the scattering of ashes

as part of they say an individualistic outlook where the remains of the deceased family member are private property of the family.

And they say that is not the case, that for them they belong to the Christian community and they should have a public and sacred place where

they can be visited and celebrated.

In fact, they say in the case, for example, of war soldiers where you can't get the remains back, there needs to be a memorial for that person with his

name that people can go to visit and pray at -- Hala.

GORANI: All right, got it, thanks very much, Delia Gallagher in Rome. Still to come, battleground Florida, both Clinton and Trump are in the

swing state as we speak. We'll hear from voters excited to play a crucial role in this election. We'll speak to our Richard Quest.

Plus Washington has a message for thousands of military veteran. Remember those bonuses you got to go to war? We need those back. We'll explain,



[15:30:33] GORANI: Our top story this hour, both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton are on the campaign trail in Florida today. Live pictures for you,

Trump has just touched down in Stanford, Florida where he will hold a rally shortly. Clinton traveled to Coconut Creek, Florida. That state is

considered must win for Trump in the presidential election.

Also among the top stories we're following, ISIS has claimed responsibility for a deadly attack in southwest Pakistan. Officials say militants broke

into a police training academy overnight as cadets slept. They've murdered at least 61 people. Dozens of others are wounded. Authorities initially

blamed another group.

Four people have been killed on a ride at one of Australia's most popular theme parks. They were the Thunder Rivers Rapids Ride at Dreamworld on

Queensland's Gold Coast. Two people were actually thrown right off the ride. The other two victims were pulled horrifically into the conveyor

belts. All died at the scene.

We will be here at CNN focusing on the swing state of Florida on this day and for the next few days. A whopping 29 Electoral College votes in the

history of closing races makes this one of the most important contests.

Polls are tight, but Quinnipiac gives Clinton the edge. Our own Richard Quest is gauging the mood of Florida voters. He found himself in Clinton

country on the campus of the historically black Florida A&M University.


RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It is homecoming weekend at Florida A&M University and watching the college football team,

the Rattlers is a great way to bring alumni and college students together at this predominantly African-American university. FAMU as its known has

9,500 students and plays a huge role in the advancement of the South's black community.

LARRY ROBINSON, PRESIDENT, FLORIDA A&M UNIVERSITY: We have so many kids that are first generation students, but when they leave year, the average

compensation is greater than that of the households they left. So in four years, it is a life changing event that occurs.

QUEST: Any idea that these students have been so turned off by this year's bizarre election, they won't vote is far from reality.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I feel like it is important for young students or young adults to go out and support.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I always thinking about voting. It's very important for us, young people to vote so we can have a voice.

QUEST (on camera): What do you think the biggest issue has been for people of your age this election?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Getting to vote that's an issue.

QUEST: What do you make of the election so far?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So far I'm disappointed because I just turned 18. It's my first time to vote, and it is not what I expected it to be.

QUEST: Did you even think about Donald?


QUEST (voice-over): At the tailgate parties, outside the stadium, there is plenty of opportunity to enjoy real southern food.

(on camera): I can see that is chicken, why do you mean by drunk chicken?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is a chicken on a beer.

QUEST (voice-over): The drunk chicken will have to wait and drink more. I'm trying to find Donald Trump supporters.

(on camera): Could you ever bring yourself to vote for Donald Trump?


QUEST: Do you want to think about it?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No. I don't want to think about it.

QUEST: What do you make of the election?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I have to vote for Hillary Clinton, I like her. She is a good girl.

QUEST (voice-over): The very suggestion to these FAMU (inaudible) that they might support Mr. Trump is rubbished.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really can't see a black African-American like myself voting for Donald Trump, no, I cannot.

QUEST: In an election, full of the rancor and spite, here there is still much to celebrate, for instance, the school's homecoming king and queen and

the award-winning marching bands performance at halftime.

For some of the freshman students, this election is their first time to vote. Skeptical and cynical they may be about politicians, but they're

still excited to cast their first ballot.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think it will be amazing to have a first woman president. My heart would just soar because that is something I got to see

and contribute to.

[15:35:08]QUEST: I'm not surprised I failed to find any Trump supporters here. Even so, I leave FAMU reinforced having met students who are

determined to vote, whatever the outcome on November the 8th.


GORANI: Richard Quest there. Do tune in to "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" at the top of the hour. Richard Quest will be broadcasting from an orange grove

speaking to Florida farmers for their take on this election.

Now in American politics, almost everything is fair game, but going after war veterans is normally totally off limits. Now though thousands of

American soldiers who went to fight in Iraq and Afghanistan are stuck in a new fight with their own government.

Washington gave them bonuses to re-enlist or stay in the Army. Now it says it wants that money back. CNN's Drew Griffin has the full story.

DREW GRIFFIN, CNN SENIOR INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: The U.S. military had a problem in 2006. It wasn't recruiting enough new enlistees so what

it did, it threw money at the problem.


GRIFFIN (voice-over): In 2006, the military desperately needed soldiers to fight in Iraq and Afghanistan, but it was missing recruitment goals for new

enlistees. So the Defense Department started paying incentive bonuses to keep the soldiers it already have, re-enlist and you get not just money,

but loan forgiveness, and other benefits.

It was a good deal, thousands re-enlisted. Now nearly 10,000 of them are being told that good deal was a crime. A federal investigation found

enlistment officers committing fraud. In California, the FBI went after Master Sergeant Joni Jatti (ph), who pled guilty to submitting false and

fictitious claims on behalf of her fellow California National Guard members.

Her efforts alone added up to $15.2 million in illegal payouts and loan repayments to California Guardsmen. Jatti has gone to prison, but

inexplicably the Department of Defense has gone after the soldiers to pay back their bonuses.

Chris Van Meter served his country an extra six years and then was forced to pay back $46,000.

CHRISTOPHER VAN METER, U.S. NATIONAL GUARD RESERVIST (RETIRED): You think it's a joke. Obviously it was not a joke and it's gut wrenching because

you have to figure out what you are going to do and how you are going to survive. I had a young family at that time.

GRIFFIN: The California National Guard shares the frustration, but says it does not have the authority to wave the debts. California Congressman Adam

Schiff today told CNN he's already written to the head of the California National Guard asking any attempts to reclaim soldiers' bonus money be

stopped until he and Congress can work out a solution.

ADAM SCHIFF, U.S. HOUSE DEMOCRAT: I think it is outrageous they're being asked to repay bonuses that they had every right to expect.

GRIFFIN (on camera): There is already a crime from many members of Congress including the two U.S. senators from California demanding there be

an investigation and at least a temporary halt.

(voice-over): Having these soldiers pay back their money, but this problem has been going on now for several years and so far no solution.


GORANI: And Drew Griffin joins me now from CNN Center. So what can be done for these soldiers? It's $46,000, I think one of them was asked to

repay -- that's a yearly salary for a family?

GRIFFIN: It's an incredible amount of money, one master sergeant, a woman, whose husband and son, both also served, says she has to give up like a

quarter of her salary every month just to pay down her $25,000 debt.

Here's what is being done. There is a lot of talk about trying to fix this. The California National Guard and the Army say there's is a

temporary solution where you have to appeal each case individually, but that takes time. It takes lawyers.

It's worked for some. It doesn't work for everybody, but there has to be a congressional kind of administration solution to this so that they can just

absolve these kind of debts or waive this payback program.

GORANI: Right. And these soldiers re-enlisted or they extended their military career based on the promise that they would get these bonuses.

This was an intensive.

GRIFFIN. Yes, in some cases, reenlisted for six years at a time when they knew they were going to be deployed right into harm's way. I mean, the

Army needed soldiers on the ground in Iraq and Afghanistan.

They couldn't get new enlistees to join so they tried to come up with this program to incentivize actual people in the Army to stay in the Army, and I

got to tell you, this problem has been around for five and a half years.

It's got nothing but talk, nothing but talk in Congress, and the administration and the Department of Defense. It's just unconscionable

that this continues to go on with all this political talk and no real solution.

GORANI: So why has it taken -- five and a half years, why has it taken so long to get people's attention?

[05:40:06]GRIFFIN: You know, I think, quite frankly, it is a leadership question. Who in Washington, D.C. is taking charge of this and trying to

solve it? Those are questions that we need to ask for the United States, these elected officials, who once again are coming out with letters and

demanding a fix, but nobody actually is proposing a fix. That's where it needs to take place.

GORANI: All right, we'll keep our eye on this. Thanks for your reporting. Drew Griffin at the CNN Center. You can check out our Facebook page and we

will put up some of our reports from this hour and interviews

All right, a quick break. When we come back, President Obama has been on the campaign trail singing Hillary Clinton's praises. His latest campaign

stop, and there is a punch line this time, that is ahead.


GORANI: Well, it appears as though I'm sitting in front of a wall of cookies. If you're anything like me, getting through a whole box of them

is not that difficult, but as CNN's Will Ripley discovered, some researchers in Japan are looking to help us change that.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Strawberry chocolate chip cookie.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Strawberry chocolate chip? I don't think I have had a strawberry chocolate chip cookie, should I try it?


RIPLEY: I like strawberry chocolate chip. It is weird, it tastes different.

(voice-over): This headset is as odd as it looks, but what it does can change the way we eat. By playing with your sense of smell and altering

what you're looking at, these researchers are trying to hack your taste buds and they kind of do.

This is the Cyber-Interface Lab. Here, Takuji Narumi, is experimenting with how virtual reality can play a role in weight loss and obesity.

(on camera): I just see those two cookies and they look like they have my name on them.

(voice-over): This second headset is all about portion control.

(on camera): So right now, this is my normal hand. I guess, I should try it.

(voice-over): The idea is pretty simple. By changing your perception of how big this cookie is, your brain actually believes you're eating more

than you are.

So much so, Narumi claims he can reduce food intake by 10 percent. And while we may not be sitting around the dinner table wearing these headsets

just yet, knowing our minds can be tricked in this way might mean it's only a matter of time before technology catches up and looking even further into

the future --

(on camera): It's really nice to meet you, why don't we shake hands.

(voice-over): This is unbelievable. I just met Hiroyuki Shinoda and we just shook hands without making any physical contact.

(on camera): This is the kind of thing that what we used to see in science fiction, and you're actually bringing it to life, now.


RIPLEY (voice-over): That might not mean anything to you and before this, it didn't to me, either. (Inaudible) technology helps facilitate

communication by touch.

It's everywhere from interacting with the touch screens on our smart phones to a vibrating steering wheel in an arcade game. Professor Shinoda is

leading research in bringing this technology to virtual reality or maybe just reality.

(on camera): So right now I can see the projection of the ball and you're saying I can knock the real ball out of that box by touching the



RIPLEY: OK, I'll try. Wow, and I felt like I was touching something.

(voice-over): By creating a 3D hologram and working with a series ultrasounds, he is able to add a sense of touch over distance essentially

allowing to interact with something that you previously only be able to hear and see.

(on camera): It really blows my mind that you don't have to wear a headset or anything to see this.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think that is an important point. I think the future (inaudible) will go through (inaudible).

RIPLEY (voice-over): Shinoda's vision of how people can interact is really only limited by his imagination.



GORANI: Just absolutely fascinating technology there. Coming up, we'll share a laugh with the comedian-in-chief. His mean tweets reading is

ahead. That and a lot more coming up. Stay with us.


GORANI: For so many of us, work basically takes over our whole lives. It's even harder to tear ourselves away when we feel we're doing well.

[15:50:04]But one banker gave up his job on Wall Street to help orphans and his foundation has now helped nearly 10,000 children as part of CNN's

Freedom Project. Here is Andy Stein's story.


ANDY STEIN, FOUNDER AND EXECUTIVE CHAIRMAN, ORPHAN STARFISH FOUNDATION: To me, magic is a tool, it is a way to make children around the world laugh.

It is a way to make churn feel like they have the ability to do anything in the world.

My name is Andy Stein, and I'm the founder and the executive chairman of the Orphan Starfish Foundation.

I'm a recovering banker. Sixteen years ago, I was one of the top fliers in the United States on Continental Airlines. And I decided to go to every

country manager at the bank and say if you want me to come and pitch business, you have to find me an orphanage.

Two hours in the schedule and let me play with some kids and that was going to be my salvation for these trips and that's what happened. I would spend

half a day with them. I do magic tricks. I help them with their homework.

I just show them that someone cared about them. It wasn't a "Jerry McGuire" moment. That maybe leave banking to come to Orphan Starfish and

do it full time.

I started in Chile then it was Brazil then it was Panama then it was Mexico. The third time back in Chile, the nuns said look, I'm not sure if

you know what happens here. At the age of 18, by law, these girls are considered adults and they have to leave our little home.

And 100 percent of these girls become prostitutes or live on the streets. So we sat down and had a - discussion what would be the best way out for

these girls.

And we determine that education and job training was going to be the way out. So I went back to New York. I convinced the law firm that it made

(inaudible) to create a 501C3 and went to family and friends raised about $40,000 and we built a state of the art computer center.

Then six months later, I went back and it was magic. The younger kids became the top of their class. The older kids learned how to use Microsoft

Office, the keyboard, the internet. They had a skill.

The Orphan Starfish Foundation now has 50 computer centers in 25 countries around the world and we now help over 10,000 orphans, victims of abuse,

victims of trafficking and victims of poverty worldwide.

When I go back, and I talk to my old friends in banking and people asked me if I miss the toys and the big house, and I told them I don't miss it

really at all.

There is magic in the world. You can make more of a difference than you can possibly imagine. I have the very incredible feeling of knowing what I

was put here to do and having the ability to do it.


GORANI: All right, really heroic work there, one man making a difference, part of our "Freedom Project." Now are you ready for a party has that been

a century in the making? That's what we could see the Chicago Cubs win the World Series.

America's iconic baseball championship, which starts in a few hours. Last time they did that was in 1908. We thought we would give you a snapshot of

the world right then, believe or not, 1908 began with the first ever New Year's ball drop.

The iron and wood ball was not nearly this glitzy, but it began the Times Square tradition. Only in 1908, only 46 states rang in that New Year,

Arizona, New Mexico, Alaska and Hawaii weren't states yet.

Later that year, Henry Ford started producing Model T's from his Detroit, Michigan plant. Briefly back to the Cubs, (Inaudible) "Three-Finger" Brown

was the pitcher with you, guessed it," three fingers and a thumb. Records indicate the Cubs paid him $3,500 in 1908. Today's Cubs pitcher makes

around $25 million. Just a little bit more.

Now U.S. President Barack Obama dropped by ABC's Jimmy Kimmel and actually discussed the historic nature of the Cubs potential win.


BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: You know, I watched the end of the last game and to see just how happy everybody was, I

actually felt pretty good. I am rooting for my hometown team even though it is not my team.

I was watching these press reports about the last time they won a World Series. Thomas Edison was still alive. Sliced bread had not been

invented. So this is literally the best thing since sliced bread for Cubs fans.


[15:55:05]GORANI: Well, of course, Mr. Obama was there to discuss the election and he also faced some of his critics in mean tweets, the

President Obama edition.


PRESIDENT OBAMA: Barack Obama is the nickel-back of presidents. Obama couldn't negotiate getting a Whooper without pickles. Thanks, Dave.

I bet Obama likes mustard on his hotdogs because he's gross.

Just found out my daughter shares a birthday with Obama, puke, in caps.

Barack Obama dances like how his jeans look. You know, this jeans thing, this is so old. Come on.

My mom bought new conditioner and it sucks and isn't even conditioning my hair, I blame Obama.

Barack Obama, bro, do you even lift?

Well, I lifted the ban on Cuban cigars, that's worth something.

Barack Obama is the "Sharknado" of presidents. Loud, stupid, and over- hyped #sharknado4.

President Obama will go down as the worst president in the history of the United States! @realdonaldtrump.

Well, @realdonaldtrump, at least I will go down as a president.


GORANI: That got a lot of applause at the end. Thanks for watching, everybody. I'll see you same place, same time tomorrow. This has been THE

WORLD RIGHT NOW. I'm Hala Gorani. "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is in Florida coming up next.