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Wolf

Pearl Harbor Attack Survivor Shares Story; U.S. Military, Defense Department Evolved After Pearl Harbor; Obama Talks ISIS Threat in CNN Interview; Calls for Ceasefire Unheeded in Aleppo. Aired 1:30- 2p ET

Aired December 07, 2016 - 13:59   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:31:17] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back. You're looking at like pictures from Joint Base Pearl Harbor, where 75 years ago, today, Japanese attack planes dropped bombs over parts of Hawaii, propelling the United States to enter World War II. The U.S. Navy and National Park Service are hosting a memorial ceremony right now. Live pictures coming in.

And we're watching two other major events commemorating Pearl Harbor. The Vice President-elect Mike Pence visiting the World War II Memorial here in Washington, D.C. And at Texas A&M University, former President George H.W. Bush and former Senator Bob Dole, remembered for their service during World War II as well.

While these ceremonies honor the veterans at Pearl Harbor during that fateful day, one survivor never felt like a hero. He tells CNN's Kyung Lah why, this year, he is going back to Pearl Harbor for the very first time.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KYUNG LAH, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Ask B.C. Wilborn the secret to living to age 95 in good health, he'll say love of a vibrant hobby, like horse racing, and a lot of experience in surviving.

(on camera): Do you think, I'm a war hero?

B.C. WILBORN, WORLD WAR II VETERAN & FORMER NAVY FIRST CLASS PETTY OFFICER: Oh, no, no. Gosh. Just the opposite. You think what you could have done, and didn't do.

ANNOUNCER: The Japanese have attacked Pearl Harbor.

LAH (voice-over): 75 years ago, Wilborn stood aboard the "USS Maryland" as the Japanese launched an early morning attack on Pearl Harbor. Wilborn just a 20-year-old first class petty officer in the Navy.

(on camera): What did it feel like to be in the middle of that?

WILBORN: I didn't have no fear. I see everything happening, and it just seemed like -- unreal. LAH: Daughter, Edie, and her husband, Ron.

EDIE STANTON, DAUGHTER OF B.C. WILSON: They pay a big price for us to be free.

LAH: How old are you here?

WILBORN: I was 24, 25.

LAH: They had pictures and saw their father's purple heart but he never talked about World War II, until, for reasons no one can explain, a few years ago -

(on camera): Just started talking?

RON STANTON, SON-IN-LAW OF B.C. WILBORN: Just started talking. Sad to say, I didn't have a tape recorder to get it.

LAH (voice-over): And he hasn't stopped talking, Wilborn sharing horrors, the men he couldn't save aboard the capsized "USS Oklahoma."

WILBORN: You hear them tapping on the wall and wonder, I guess thinking they're going to get rescued. After about two days, maybe, on the third day, stopped. No more.

LAH: More than 400 men died on "The Oklahoma."

(on camera): 75 years later, you can still recall that sound?

WILBORN: Oh, gosh, yes. And I thought it was about the sad evidence thing I saw in the Navy. I was -- I don't know. Seemed so helpless.

LAH: Unlike many survivors, Wilborn never went back to Pearl Harbor. That's changing this year. 75 years later, he's returning for the first time since that day of infamy.

(on camera): What changed? Why did you start thinking about it?

WILBORN: It's a sad day, and -- I don't know. You try to get it out of your mind and then, it don't go.

LAH (voice-over): So the survivor faces one last battle of his own memories.

Kyung Lah, CNN, Collinsville, Illinois.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: Defense Secretary Ash Carter, he's in Japan today, pledging America's commitment to its alliance with Japan and praising the security relationship the two countries share.

Let's talk a little more how the Defense Department and U.S. military have evolved since Pearl Harbor, 75 years ago, today.

Let's bring in CNN military analyst, retired Air Force Colonel, Cedric Leighton.

Colonel, thanks very much for joining us.

[13:35:09] CEDRIC LEIGHTON, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: My pleasure, Wolf.

BLITZER: Your dad served in the U.S. Army in World War II. I was a former Pentagon correspondent. Is it -- it's not unusual that a lot of those veterans, for years and years, they never wanted to talk about what they went through during World War II.

LEIGHTON: Absolutely true, and I think it's particularly true with people who actually saw close combat. My dad did not see close combat but served in the intelligence side of the army and he worked a lot of the code-breaking issues that became really famous in later years. First of all, he couldn't really talk about that in the close proximity to World War II because of the classification, but then he was able to talk more about it, and it was very clear that that had a decisive impact on the war.

BLITZER: I can only imagine how emotional this trip to Pearl Harbor for this 95-year-old veteran is going to be.

Let's talk about the lessons of Pearl Harbor, lessons that are important today. We often hear military analysts say it's important to prevent another Pearl Harbor. In today's worldwide, what does that mean?

LEIGHTON: Pervaded the language quite a bit. You're trying to prevent a surprise attack. You want to be prepared. It's all a readiness. And if something bad happens, you want the resilience necessary to overcome that particular surprise attack. So, if there is an action, like a Pearl Harbor or a 9/11 attack, you want to be able to make sure that you have the resources and the military capability that can actually prevent or actually practice retribution against an attack of that type.

BLITZER: Because Pearl Harbor was clearly an intelligence failure?

LEIGHTON: Absolutely. The real shame of Pearl Harbor, Wolf, was the fact that you had a situation where there was information available, that there was some type of Japanese attack being planned, but the precise nature of the attack wasn't known, the precise manner, timing of the attack, that also wasn't known, and that was a significant failure. And also, the fact they didn't fuse intelligence with operational information, such as the radar picture, and that prevented a great deal of activity as well, and really caused the surprise to be a complete surprise.

BLITZER: The former defense secretary, Leon Panetta, speaks of a cyber Pearl Harbor threat to the United States right now. And that is enormous, that cyber warfare potential attack.

LEIGHTON: Absolutely. Because, unlike a kinetic attack, like Pearl Harbor was, really what 9/11 was, a cyber Pearl Harbor would be an attack that would be a stealth attack until it's too late, and what they're really worried about, people like Leon Panetta, are worried about is an attack on the infrastructure, the power grid, hospitals, things that make daily life possible today in our society. If an attack like that were to happen, it would have significant social disruption for this country.

BLITZER: The U.S. military works around the clock to prevent precisely that. That's what keeps them up at night.

Thanks so much. Cedric, thanks for joining us.

LEIGHTON: You bet, Wolf. My pleasure.

BLITZER: Senator John McCain, himself a Vietnam War veteran, is speaking at the World War II Memorial right now commemorating the 75th anniversary of Pearl Harbor himself. A very, very emotional day for so many people.

Coming up, President Obama opens up to CNN about a threat to the country that took him by surprise, and why it wasn't on his intelligence radar. His candid interview, that's coming up next.

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[13:42:54] BLITZER: President Obama sat down with CNN's Fareed Zakaria reflecting on his eight years as commander-in-chief. One of the biggest challenges he faced, the rise of ISIS.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FAREED ZAKARIA, CNN HOST, FAREED ZAKARIA, GPS: Let me ask you if it's possible in your position to be completely honest and say --

(LAUGHTER)

-- the rise of the Islamic State surprised you. It took you by surprise. It took the administration by surprise.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The ability of ISIL to initiate major land offenses, that was not on my intelligence radar screen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SHOUTING)

ZAKARIA (voice-over): Everyone was stunned that a few thousand militants swept three Iraq and Syria, sowing fear in the region and the war.

UNIDENTIFIED ISIS MEMBER: We will chop out of off the heads of the Americans, chop off the heads of the French, chop off of heads of whoever you may bring.

ZAKARIA: They created a caliphate --

(SHOUTING)

ZAKARIA: -- ruled by strict Sharia Law, meting out punishments in the most barbaric ways imaginable.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Fareed is the host, "Fareed Zakaria, GPS." The CNN special report, "The Legacy of Barack Obama," airs later tonight.

Fareed, thanks very much for doing this and joining us.

How much does the president think the war or terror will actually wind up playing into his legacy?

ZAKARIA: I think he hopes one of the things he's managed to do is to put terrorism in perspective. By which I mean, you know, he yesterday in his national security speech, this is not an existential threat to the United States and we shouldn't treat it as such because we elevate this gang of thugs and give them the attention and - we build them into the kind of fearful monster that they want the world to think of themselves as.

I'm sure that one of the things that he grapples with is that he was determined to draw down in Iraq and draw down even in Afghanistan, and he did that very skillfully, but it did, in some ways, produce the vacuum that allowed ISIS to step in. Now, I think he and his administration argue that a lot of that was because of the prime minister of Iraq and the policies he pursued, but we, you know, in the documentary, we do try to present both sides. And you see a president who is very effectively drawing down ground troops aggressively, using drones, the whole thing seems to be working, Osama bin Laden is killed, but two years later you get the rise of ISIS. It's a very -- it's a story of some very big successes, but some failures.

[11:45:37] BLITZER: Very powerful moment in the documentary as well.

You also have, Fareed, a very candid conversation with the president about race relations in America. Tell our viewers what he told you.

ZAKARIA: Well, the question I asked him was -- you know, I said, you are going to go down in history, first, for not something you did but for who you are, the first African-American president. But actually, you're not really black. You're half white. You were raised by three white people, you mother and your two grandparents. And he interjected, "and don't forget the Indonesian stepfather." And we had a very interesting conversation about what it means to be black in America and how important it was for him to be the president who happened to be black and, at the same time, a symbol for African- Americans. You know, it was -- he was always negotiating those two roles. He wanted to be the president, and he also recognized he had a very powerful symbolic value that he provided to African-Americans. So, he had to be, you know, non-racial enough to appeal to the country, and black enough to assure black Americans that he hadn't forgotten them. And you see it. We have this wonderful segment on race. You see him navigating every crisis through those two lenses.

BLITZER: I can't wait to see it, Fareed. Thanks so much for doing it. And to our viewers here in the United States and around the world,

don't miss Fareed's special report, "The Legacy of Barack Obama," airing later tonight, 9:00 p.m. eastern and pacific, right here on CNN.

We've got live pictures coming in from the World War II Memorial here in Washington, D.C., where people are remembering the 75th anniversary of the Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor.

We'll take a quick break. We'll be right back.

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[13:51:23] BLITZER: Western countries are calling for an immediate ceasefire in Aleppo, Syria. President Obama is joining with the leaders of Britain, Germany, Italy, France and Canada in demanding Syria's government address the crisis by allowing U.N. aid into eastern Aleppo. It follows a call from rebels for a five-day humanitarian break in the fighting.

Our senior international correspondent, Fred Pleitgen, is in Aleppo for us right now. Fred is joining us live.

Fred, how close are regime forces to recapturing that entire city where you are?

FRED PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTENATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They have an unbelievable amount of momentum, Wolf, and what we've seen in the past couple days is they've taken large chunks of the territory the rebels once held away from them. We were able to go into the old town of Aleppo today and the Syrian government has taken most of that back overnight. We saw thousands of civilians fleeing. Many of them malnourished, very tired. It doesn't look as though the Syrian government is willing to curb its offensive.

Here's what we saw.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(EXPLOSION)

PLETIGEN (voice-over): This is Aleppo 24/7. Shelling and air strikes raining down on rebel held areas.

(EXPLOSION)

PLEITGEN: Near the front line, it's not just Syrian troops, Russians and Iranians battling on the government side. We meet these Syrian Palestinian fighters who show us what they claim was a former Jabbat al Nusra field hospital they found when they advanced into this area.

"Every injured rebel would be taken here" he says. "You see the medicine and blankets. This is one of their instruments they used."

(EXPLOSION) PLEITGEN: Syrian pro-government forces have brought heavy weapons to the front line as they continue push the opposition back. They showed us these homemade mortars and accused rebels of lacing them with chemicals the army says it discovered in this room close by.

(on camera): This alleged weapons facility is inside what used to be an elementary school in this former rebel-held district. The Syrian army says it found this place when it was sweeping the area as rebels were retreating.

(voice-over): The battles show no sign of letting up as Syrian forces continue pound rebel-held districts, killing hundreds in the past days, and leaving thousands of civilians trapped and at risk.

In an interview with CNN, a Syrian general says government forces will not stop unless opposition fighters withdraw.

BRIG. GEN. FAWAZ MUSTAFA, SYRIAN ARMY: If he insisted to go on fighting and bombing our people in Aleppo and civilians or the army, we have to continue our mission to get the city back to its people.

PLEITGEN: And what that means is plain for everyone in Aleppo to see and hear.

(EXPLOSION)

(END VIDEOTAPE)

PLEITGEN: And, Wolf, that's what we're seeing and hearing as the Syrian government continues to pound those rebel-held areas. The latest information that we're getting is that the Syrian government has won additional areas back from the rebels. It seems they only have about four square miles of territory left in eastern Aleppo. And one of the things we're hearing from people fleeing the area, they say, the rebels' morale is low -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Fred Pleitgen, be careful over there in Aleppo for us. Doing some amazing reporting. Thank you so much.

Other international news we're following, in Pakistan, officials say there are no survivors of a plane crash there. The Pakistan International Airlines flight carrying 48 people, including the crew, was headed for Islamabad. The cause of the crash still under investigation.

[13:54:56] In Indonesia, right now, officials say at least 97 people have been killed in a powerful earthquake. The 6.5 magnitude quake hit the Aceh Province early Wednesday morning as residents were preparing for prayers. Rescuers are, right now, combing through rubble for survivors. Many homes, many mosques have been destroyed, also a hospital in the area as well. Officials say they expect the death toll to rise. Let's hope for the best over there.

That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. I'll be back 5:00 p.m. eastern in "The Situation Room."

For our international viewers, "Amanpour" is coming up next.

For our viewers here in North America, NEWSROOM with Ana Cabrera starts right after a quick break.

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[14:00:06] ANA CABRERA, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, on this Wednesday. I'm Ana Cabrera, in for Brooke Baldwin. Thanks so much for joining me.

Now, on the day Donald Trump is labeled president of the divided states of America --