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Crime and Justice With Ashleigh Banfield
Boy Blames Alternate Personality for Murder/One Guilty in Deadly Teen Bathroom Brawl. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired April 13, 2017 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEAN CASAREZ, GUEST HOST (voice-over): An 8th grader calls 911 to report a murder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I swear it wasn`t me. It was -- it was Jeff.
BANFIELD: The thing is, Jeff, that teen claims, is one of his alternate personalities.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeff is inside me.
BANFIELD: Now he`s charged with murder in the death of his father`s girlfriend.
The brutal beating of a 16-year-old girl caught on video, the attack so severe, she died in that bathroom.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s been a great deal of confusion as to how this could have ever (INAUDIBLE)
BANFIELD: Now three teenage girls charged as juveniles in that horrific attack learn their fate.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You cannot brutalize someone, pummel someone in the bathroom and lead to their death and there`s consequence for that action.
BANFIELD: He was sentenced to death for kidnapping, raping and killing 11- year-old Carly Bruscia (ph).
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was no question that Joe Smith (ph) was guilty.
BANFIELD: Now more than a decade later, attorneys for Joseph Smith want that sentence thrown out.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There`s (ph) almost certain that Mr. Smith`s death sentence will be reversed.
BANFIELD: Because how his penalty was decided was ruled unconstitutional by the U.S. Supreme Court.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Whether he dies in prison or whether he dies on a table with IVs in his arm, he`s going to die.
BANFIELD: A baby brought to the ER with terrible injuries.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s very shocking.
BANFIELD: Not only did the 3-month-old have bruises on his arms, his legs and his face, but a fractured skull and ribs. But what was even worse,
police say, the child had Super Glue around his mouth.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s just really crazy that people have that mindset that they can do something like that to a child.
BANFIELD: Now they`re trying to track down who may have done this.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
BANFIELD: Good evening. I`m Jean Casarez, in for Ashleigh Banfield. Thank you so much for joining us. This is PRIMETIME JUSTICE.
In Ohio, a 14-year-old 8th grader is charged with killing his father`s girlfriend. Prosecutors say the boy planned the murder of 40-year-old Heidi
Fay Taylor and allegedly used multiple weapons, including a knife and a gun. And though they have not decided yet whether or not to try the teen as
an adult -- and that`s why we`re not naming him -- we may have gotten a glimpse of the 14-year-old`s defense during the 911 call he made after
Taylor`s death. Take a listen.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: 911, where is your emergency?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just killed my mother.
911 OPERATOR: What happened, sir?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just killed my mother. And I need to go to the hospital.
911 OPERATOR: And what happened?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It wasn`t me who -- who -- it wasn`t me who killed her. It was Jeff.
911 OPERATOR: What happened? Who did it?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jeff. Yes, I`m sorry. This is going to be really hard to explain, but I kind of have another person inside me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: You heard that right. The teen blamed Jeff, another personality, for the gruesome killing. A judge made the decision to keep the boy locked
up. The pretrial hearing begins next week.
Katherine Collins is a reporter for WHIO-TV. She joins us tonight from Dayton, Ohio. You know, I`ve got to ask you, it was one week ago that Heidi
Fay Taylor was alive and well, and now she`s dead. What happened?
KATHERINE COLLINS, WHIO-TV: Right. So we`re still working to figure out what`s going on in this case. It`s still really early, like you said.
He was just -- the 14-year-old was just charged last Friday. He appeared in court last Friday. But what we do know so far is that the sheriff`s office
has charged him with murder of his father`s girlfriend. He appeared in court, and his attorney said they want -- they`re seeking a mental health
evaluation to see if he`s fit to stand trial.
We talked to the prosecutor, who said he believes that he did plan this attack and actually planned to flee, but he hurt his leg in the attack and
wasn`t able to. So what we learned a lot about what might have happened came from the 911 call, where he talks about someone named Jeff...
BANFIELD: What were the weapons?
COLLINS: ... who take over his body.
BANFIELD: Do we know -- do we know the cause of death? Do we know what happened to her?
COLLINS: We don`t know exactly. So I think you actually get a lot of information from that 911 call where he talks about -- I think -- I think,
if I`m right, he says, I stabbed or Jeff stabbed her and then shot her. What we know from the prosecutor...
BANFIELD: Right, so there we know...
[20:05:04]COLLINS: Yes.
BANFIELD: ... two deadly weapons were allegedly used, at this point. He`s charged with murder and aggravated murder. Aggravated murder under Ohio law
means you planned it, you premeditated, you deliberated before you killed anyone. Do we know any facts that go toward this pre-planning?
COLLINS: Not so much. I know that the only thing the prosecutor said to us about this is that he believes that the 14-year-old kind of lured Heidi
into the position to attack her, and maybe that`s where that`s coming from and -- but besides that, that`s really all we know at his point about that.
BANFIELD: Or as he says, it was someone else. Jena Kravitz...
COLLINS: Right.
BANFIELD: ... is a clinical neuropsychologist. She join us tonight from Los Angeles. Doctor, thank you. Let`s suppose at this point that it`s all true,
what this young boy is saying that we`re not naming, that all of a sudden, this other person takes him over and he`s not doing the acts, but the other
person is. What is this psychologically?
JENA KRAVITZ, NEUROPSYCHOLOGIST: Right. So most people would refer to this as a multiple personality disorder. We call it dissociative identity
disorder. And that`s what he`s referring to. It`s when at least two or more personalities can sort of split in -- within one person. And it is a real
diagnosis.
The problem with his testimony on the 911 call for me is that one of the most -- one of the hallmark features of this diagnosis is big lapses of
memory when alternate personalities are present, right? So I don`t know how he would be able to recall which weapons were used because, oftentimes,
when one personality is, you know, happening and present in real life, the other -- the normal personality, the person you see every day, doesn`t
recall anything happening.
BANFIELD: And what causes it?
KRAVITZ: So you know, there isn`t necessarily one cause, but the majority of the literature about dissociative identity disorder suggests that it`s
childhood trauma, usually sexually -- sexual trauma, physical trauma, emotional trauma, the those are the most likely factors. And typically,
what happens with children is that this is the best coping they have, is to create an alternate reality for themselves because of this level of trauma.
And so it`s a coping mechanism that...
BANFIELD: All right. Well, Jena, we`ve got a little bit more. We want everybody to listen to more. And remember, the devil`s in the details when
you listen to a call like this. Let`s play more of this 911 call.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Are you OK?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. I stabbed myself.
911 OPERATOR: You stabbed yourself?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. Hurry (INAUDIBLE)
911 OPERATOR: What happened to your mom?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He killed her. He snapped.
911 OPERATOR: All right. Are you able to say who`s with you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I -- I am by myself, me and Jeff.
911 OPERATOR: OK. And what happened to your mom? What did you do?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He -- he stabbed her and then he shot her.
911 OPERATOR: All right. So he...
(END AUDIO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: ... you have a 14-year-old, and I -- you know, we as a society, and you mentioned at the outset, Jean, that they
haven`t made a determination as to whether to charge him as an adult or not.
I think that`s a critical thing that needs to be discussed, too. Now, what Ohio has is, apparently, you don`t have automatic transfers to adult court
predicated upon the type of crime. In fact, a court declared that unconstitutional. There has to be some type of hearing to determine whether
it`s in the best interests of society that that occur.
But even if that were to be the case, now you have the battle of the experts. And you heard Jena Kravitz, as an expert herself, say, Well, wait.
The call is strange.
On the one hand, the defense may use that, in the event that there`s some insanity plea, to say he`s talking about me and Jeff, Jeff killed her. You
know, this sounds like something`s amiss and awry. As a result of that, how could he appreciate the wrongfulness of his conduct?
On the other hand, Jena Kravitz -- she said, Hey, that sounds a bit strange. Why? Because people generally have memory lapses in that regard,
and so it may be a bit contrived. And so there would be a lot of course (ph) for the defense to overcome if they went forward with regards to an
insanity defense.
BANFIELD: And he knows what`s wrong. He knows the difference between right and wrong.
[20:10:02]Brian, I want you to listen to this next piece of the 911 call. I think you could argue that it`s very incriminating against him. Listen to
this.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: All right. Now, why did you hurt your mom or why did Jeff hurt your mom?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He was always tired of her. She always -- she always did drugs and she totally, like, ignored me. Like, once she hit me, and she was
just -- she was done.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BANFIELD: "She was done." She kept ignoring me. Once she hit me -- so now we don`t have Jeff. He`s talking as the young man who`s the defendant right
here.
BRIAN CLAYPOOL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Right. The Jeff defense is falling apart because another big reason. There`s now motive. There`s a motive for him to
kill this woman. He feels like she is with his father now and she`s ignoring him or abusing him. So that`s the problem with this defense is now
there is a motive.
But like you said earlier, Jean, the devil`s going to be in the details on this. They`re going to delve into his background. Is there a history of
mental health illness? Is there a history of him taking any medication? If there`s not, then this defense I don`t think is going to fly.
BANFIELD: We have learned that there were no behavioral issues that were spotted in the classroom, all right?
CLAYPOOL: That`s huge.
BANFIELD: Let`s listen to more of this 911 call. This young man is definitely distraught. I mean, your heart cries out for him in a sense when
you forget that this beautiful young woman is dead. Listen to this next part of the 911 call.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am so scared. I didn`t -- I -- I didn`t want to kill her. I hate Jeff so much! He`s -- he -- he`s going to make me die in
prison!
911 OPERATOR: Is there -- is this Jeff you`re talking about?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
911 OPERATOR: Yes?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He couldn`t have taken somebody else. No, he took me. He (INAUDIBLE) to be a stupid person.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Katherine Collins, you are with WHIO television right there in Florida (sic). He was just in court. Ohio, thank you. Did you see him in
court? Was his demeanor? What was he like?
COLLINS: Yes, I did see him in court. He`s a very small kid, very tiny. He`s only 14. He`s an 8th grader, long shaggy hair. He was very quiet, kind
of just looked down the entire time, said, Yes, ma`am, No, ma`am, to the judge, and that was pretty much it.
BANFIELD: Jena Kravitz, clinical neuropsychologist, are you surprised that there were no behavioral issues in the classroom?
KRAVITZ: Yes. I`m surprised that there -- it`s not behavioral issues, but anything out of the norm. Some of these types of kids isolate themselves or
other kids might think they`re weird at times. I`m also wondering -- you know, he mentioned that his mom was doing drugs. I`m wondering if it`s
possible that he might have been on drugs because that can also trigger a psychosis like this.
BANFIELD: That`s interesting. Now, should the defense have already done a psychological assessment of him immediately?
KRAVITZ: Well, you know, that depends. He came in injured to the hospital, I assume. In most of these types of cases -- and I used to work in a large
hospital, also. Cases like this would have a psychiatric evaluation right off the bat to determine whether they needed to be held in the hospital for
their own safety. So I assume that there is some preliminary psychiatric evaluation on him already.
BANFIELD: Right.
KRAVITZ: But at this point, yes, an extensive psychiatric evaluation.
BANFIELD: As close in time as possible, a defense can learn he didn`t know right from wrong when he committed the crime. So all right.
A Delaware teenager dies after she jumped in the girls` bathroom -- she was jumped. Now two of her attackers could be locked up.
And a heart-stopping drive-by shooting barely misses a 4-year-old girl caught in the crossfire.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:18:58]BANFIELD: The video is just plain disturbing to watch, a 16-year- old beaten in the bathroom of her high school in Delaware. And Amy Joyner- Francis -- she didn`t make it out there alive. An autopsy found she had a rare undiagnosed heart condition which was aggravated by the physical and
emotional stress caused by the attack.
Three teenagers, who were all 16 at the time of the fight, were arrested and charged as juveniles in her death. And now after a non-jury trial, a
judge has found today one of those teens guilty of criminally negligent homicide. Another, who kicked Joyner-Francis while she was down on the
ground, was convicted of conspiracy charges. The judge acquitted the third girl of any charges, saying there was no evidence she played a role in the
beatdown.
Amy Joyner-Francis`s family -- they were actually satisfied with the decision.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SHERRY DORSEY, FAMILY SPOKESWOMAN: At the end of the day, you cannot brutalize someone, pummel someone in the bathroom and lead to their death
and there`s no consequence for that action.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[20:20:05]BANFIELD: Karl Baker is a reporter for "The News-Journal." He was in the courtroom today. He joins us live from Wilmington, Delaware. Karl, I
first want to ask you, what are the facts here? I mean, why did these three girls decide to attack their friend in the bathroom at school?
KARL BAKER, "NEWS-JOURNAL": So to be clear, I think the evidence, at least according to the judge, showed that at least two were involved. The third,
I don`t know if we can say was involved. She was acquitted. This goes back to a day prior...
BANFIELD: Maybe it didn`t rise to a criminal standard, but...
BAKER: Sure.
BANFIELD: Go on. I understand what you`re saying.
BAKER: So yes. So a day prior to that, there had been apparently a group text message that Amy Anita (ph) Joyner-Francis had been involved with, as
well as Trinity Carr. And there had been something said to the effect that Amy Anita had been warning of somebody being a, quote, "switch-up," which I
guess is parlance for somebody who changes the way they act around somebody. Trinity Carr interpreted that to mean that she was talking about
her, and that kind of set off the chain of events.
BANFIELD: So -- so -- but was it all about a boy? Was it all...
BAKER: I -- there was no evidence -- there was -- that was not introduced during court. There were rumors about that the day that it happened, but I
have not heard any credible evidence that that was the case.
BANFIELD: OK. So what happened? Explain to us. Did they lure her into the bathroom? What did you hear?
BAKER: According to testimony, they followed her into the bathroom that morning. There was an argument in the bathroom, and at some point during
the argument, Trinity Carr began punching Amy Anita Joyner-Francis and...
BANFIELD: So who videotaped it? Where did we get this videotape from?
BAKER: There were -- according to testimony, there were as many as 30 people viewing, watching, onlookers, bystanders watching this attack in the
bathroom itself. At least two of them videotaped it, maybe more.
BANFIELD: Unbelievable. You`re watching it right there. Right there, you`re watching it. And let me tell you, she didn`t make it out of that bathroom.
She died minutes after you see her struggling there on the floor, and the last thing she said, They jumped me. They snuck up on me. Those were the
last things she said, and then she died.
Now, isn`t true, Karl, that she did have a heart condition? Explain that to us.
BAKER: Yes, that`s right. She had -- she had according to the autopsy report, as well -- well, primarily to the state medical examiner that she
had a rare condition, really two conditions, as I understand it, pulmonary hypertension, as well as what`s called atrial septal defect, which is a
hole in her heart. Those two conditions essentially were aggravated by the attack. The stress of the attack triggered what the medical examiner called
the fight or flight effect, and that led to her death.
BANFIELD: All right. So Joey Jackson, the main defense here was she didn`t -- they -- she didn`t cause the death. She didn`t know about this.
JACKSON: Falls on deaf ears, Jean, and here`s why. You know, we all learn about something in law school called the thin skull plaintiff, right? And
that`s a person or a victim who they may have some preexisting condition. But the fact that she had some heart condition doesn`t excuse your conduct
which ultimately led to her death.
And so this case was as much about what we saw the videotapes and the facts as about the law because the defense`s argument was, Wait a second. You
can`t hold her accountable for killing her as a result of this preexisting condition. And the judge said, No, of course you can because it was your
gross deviation from the standard of care by attacking her in that way that ultimately led to the death.
And just to be clear for the viewers, of course, there`s a distinction between murder, which is the intentional act to kill someone, and when you
engage in conduct which likely to cause the result, even though, Jean, you didn`t mean to do it.
BANFIELD: Right.
JACKSON: And that`s where you get criminally negligent homicide.
BANFIELD: That`s right, criminal negligence that caused the death, though, right?
JACKSON: Exactly. Right.
BANFIELD: Brian, let me ask you this. They were tried as juveniles, all right? So it`s a -- it`s not a conviction, it`s that she was determined to
be responsible. Should they have been tried as an adult? And what should the punishment be because she`s a juvenile. And I`m talking about the main
girl here. It can be nothing. It can be like a probation. It could be like a supervision. It can be in jail for a little bit of time. What does she
deserve?
CLAYPOOL: Well, I`m on the fence with this because I think young adults deserve a chance for rehabilitation. And this is a horrible tragedy, and I
think this young woman should be held responsible for the death. But I think maybe a few years of incarceration and then given that opportunity to
rehabilitate and live a more productive life and use this as a platform then maybe to prevent bullying in the future.
[20:25:26]BANFIELD: Karl, you were in the courtroom. What`s the demeanor that you saw from these young girls?
BAKER: There was very little observable reaction from any of the girls. They...
BANFIELD: Really? So they didn`t seem sad, remorseful?
BAKER: I can`t comment on that. I can`t determine whether they were sad based upon no reaction.
BANFIELD: So no reaction is a reaction. No reaction at all. Joey, what do you think?
JACKSON: You know, listen, a lot of times, children -- not that this excuses it at all, but they know not what they do. I mean, I`m certain they
didn`t mean to kill, or at least I should say her because the other one was acquitted, the second one found responsible for conspiracy but not
convicted of it.
But you know, children do things that adults ultimately do not, and they just don`t understand the severity and the significance and what it could
lead to. And in this case, it led to that death. And so but you have to wonder -- you know, we`re talking about all these stories, the first story
involving, you know, someone who killed someone who`s a young child. These kids are young. What are our young people doing? What the is the larger
issue that`s causing...
BANFIELD: Exactly.
(CROSSTALK)
BANFIELD: How do you stop it but have a sentence that can deter?
JACKSON: That`s a great point. That`s a great point. And you know, as a society, we have to determine what do we do with children? Juvenile and the
whole system of justice there, Jean, is to rehabilitate because you think there`s a redeeming quality. These kids are young. They`ve got a long way
to go. You can`t throw them away forever. And to the extent that they`ll be out in society, you want them to be productive and you want them to lead
lives that`ll be law-abiding, significant, and contributory to society.
BANFIELD: You know, I want to read what the judge said because I think this is important before we leave this. The verdict -- this was a bench trial,
and the judge said, quote, "The attack on Amy Joyner-Francis had known potential consequences and risks. I purposefully use the word `attack`
because that is what the evidence established. Even reasonable 16-year-olds have standards. Trinity Carr`s attack on Amy Joyner-Francis and her failure
to perceive the risk of death is a gross deviation from the standard." And that judge also said it was a brutal attack.
Tonight, as the search for Elizabeth Thomas continues, the local district attorney is talking to the media.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRENT COOPER, MAURY COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: If we jeopardize our criminal case by releasing something, if it leads to her being found, it`ll be worth
it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Thomas appeared on -- disappeared on March 13th. And she is believed to be with her 50-year-old teacher, Tad Cummins. Two days later,
they were seen together on surveillance video right there. There they are at an Oklahoma City Walmart. Brent Cooper says that a note found by Tad
Cummins`s wife was actually a false lead intended to mislead police and buy the pair time as they hit the road.
He also has asked doctors and pharmacists to be on the lookout for the pair because Tad Cummins could be running low on blood pressure medicine.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: Ask anyone, any doctors, walk-in clinics, if -- you know, to be extra alert. If they`re in the States, he`ll have to go -- he`ll have to
get a doctor to refill that. You know, of course, if they`re in Mexico, maybe not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: Cooper also had a direct message for Elizabeth Thomas.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COOPER: You don`t even have to tell them where you are. Just borrow someone`s phone, call them and say, I`m OK. At some point, we`re either
going to find them through just good police work or a lucky break.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BANFIELD: If you recognize them or know where they are, police want to hear from you.
And to Chicago, where Joshua Smith was in court today for a bond hearing in the shooting death of Judge Raymond Myles. Prosecutors surprised the
courtroom by saying Judge Myles was not the primary target in the deadly armed robbery. They say the target was Myles`s girlfriend, who was injured
in the altercation.
Prosecutors say Smith told the police he and an unidentified partner had actually been watching her movements for several weeks before the attack.
Police are still searching for Smith`s accomplice, and Smith is facing first degree murder, battery and obstruction charges.
The randomness of gun violence was dramatically caught on video this week in Arizona. Look at this. In the surveillance video, you can see a 4-year-
old girl skipping around inside a strip mall barbershop. Seconds after she sits down, two shots are fired through the plate glass window. Take a
closer look at this. You can see the two shots blow past on either side of the child. If she had sat in a different seat, this would be a much
different story. As it is, she suffered minor injuries from the broken glass.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL O`HARA, WORKS NEXT DOOR TO BARBERSHOP: We saw the bullet holes in the window (INAUDIBLE). That`s really shocking. Really lucky that she
didn`t get hurt worse.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CASAREZ: Police say that shooting was the result of some sort of confrontation at a nearby tattoo parlor.
Two suspects are in custody, Michael Hart and Rafael Santos. Police say Hart was the triggerman and fired at least three rounds at the tattoo
parlor as he, Santos and a third unidentified male drove away. Hart and Santos are both charged with aggravated assault and endangerment.
In 2006, this man was sentenced to death for the rape and murder of 11- year-old Carlie Brucia. You remember this case. Well, he wants off death row and he might have a good legal argument to make it happen.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CASAREZ: For more than a decade, Joseph Smith has been an inmate on Florida`s death row. And if his name rings a bell, it should. Smith was
convicted of kidnapping, raping and killing a 11-year-old Carlie Brucia. You remember this.
She was snatched from a carwash by Smith, an act that was caught on the now infamous surveillance video. Carlie`s body was found days later few miles
away in the wooded area behind a church.
Joseph Smith was found guilty of her murder. And remember this, by a 10 to 2 vote the jury sentenced him to death, something Carlie`s stepfather
supported.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVEN KANSLER, CARLIE BRUCIA`S STEPFATHER: When he`s executed, I get to go up there and watch him. Then, that will be my closure where I`ll feel like
she`s been set free.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There was no question that Joe Smith was guilty. No question at all. You had to see the pictures. You had to realize the life
that was taken and how it was taken. I will use the word heinous, evil.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CASAREZ: Despite the jury`s decision, Smith did throw himself on the mercy of the court.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSEPH SMITH, CARLIE BRUCIA`S MURDERER: Judge Owens, I do not ask for mercy for myself. As you have heard, there have been many times that I did not
care whether I lived or died. The only reason that I can see to ask you to give a lighter sentence is for the sake of my family.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CASAREZ: But Joseph Smith`s time on death row could be coming to an end. That`s because the US Supreme Court has found Florida`s death penalty
sentencing law to be unconstitutional. In Florida, it was always a majority vote for the death penalty and it meant the jury was recommending death.
Like, 7 to 5, 8 to 4, 9 to 3.
Well, now Florida says, it must be unanimous. With Joseph Smith, it wasn`t unanimous. Only 10 out of 12 jurors voted in favor of death.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ADAM TEBRUGGE, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR JOSEPH SMITH: It appears almost certain that Mr. Smith`s death sentence will be reversed and his case will be
remanded back to Sarasota County.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CASAREZ: But no decisions have been made. Kate Flexter is a reporter for WWSB-TV. She joins us from Sarasota.
All right. So, Joseph Smith was 39 years old in that video at the time of trial. He`s now 51 years old. He wants to go back to court. What`s his
claim?
KATE FLEXTER, REPORTER, WWSB-TV: Well, so two dissenting votes that you mentioned, it used to be, as you said, that majority votes. But now it`s
unanimous. And he says, like hundreds of death row inmates that he should be given a re-sentencing.
CASAREZ: Right. So, he wants a new sentencing hearing because it was not unanimous for the death penalty.
Joining us tonight is a really special guest. It`s Ron Kruzel. He was the jury foreman in Joseph Smith`s trial. He joins us tonight from Mineral
Springs, Florida.
Ron, thank you for joining us. I first want to ask you, this must have been - well, you tell me. As a juror, was this life-changing to hear what you
had to hear about this death and of the pictures you had to look at, the video that we all looked at across the country?
RON KRUZEL, JURY FOREMAN IN JOSEPH SMITH`S TRIAL: Well, thank you for having me on, Jean. I never expected to be on the jury to begin with
because I am a pastor and I didn`t believe that I will get through Voir Dire process.
Apparently, both sides felt that I was going to be fair, honest, abide by the law, the assumption of innocence until proven guilty and then following
through the responsibilities of jurisprudence.
[20:40:18] It was hard. It was very hard, especially being a pastor because every life is precious. Every life is precious. And I will even say that
Joe Smith`s life has value. But when we do certain things in life, we reap certain consequences.
CASAREZ: The two jurors that argued for life and not death, what was their argument? Was it based on the evidence or was it based on the lack of
aggravating factors or was it based on God giveth life, God taketh life?
KRUZEL: Well, you have to understand how we went through the process. When we went through the guilt or innocence phase, we examined every piece,
every testimony, every evidence of everything. We looked at everything with regard to the law, front to back, as it was presented to us.
When we went to the sentencing phase, we went through the same process. We were given certain criteria. In Florida, there happen to be 11 criteria
that merits the recommendation that a jury would make to the judge for the death penalty.
And of the 11 criteria, Joe Smith met seven of those.
CASAREZ: So, why did two jurors not want to sentence him to death, to recommend a sentence of death?
KRUZEL: Well, we didn`t actually deliberate in that sense. When I was leading with -
CASAREZ: OK. So, you didn`t know.
KRUZEL: When I was leading the jury through the process, what we did was, we went step by step by step through the law. And everybody kept their own
notes and everybody kept their opinions. We didn`t opine about them. We didn`t talk. We didn`t have general discussions about that.
CASAREZ: All right.
KRUZEL: And when we got a certain point, I just decided, OK, let`s just see, we`ll take a vote and we passed around a brown paper bag and you wrote
what your choice was and you put it in the bag.
CASAREZ: And you didn`t have to be unanimous, and so you still recommended death.
I want to go to Ed Brodsky because he is the state attorney for the 12th judicial circuit in Florida. He joins us from Sarasota.
First of all, Mr. Brodsky, I want you to just reiterate. You sent heinous and evil. I want to hear some of the facts again. We don`t have much time,
but I want to hear the facts that you brought out in court before that jury and why you feel he does not deserve a new resentencing hearing?
ED BRODSKY, STATE ATTORNEY FOR THE 12TH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT: Well, this was, as many of America saw and certainly those in Florida saw, this was a young
child, 11 years old, who was abducted after having left her friend`s house.
And the evidence that was presented at trial certainly indicated that she was - that there was a sexual battery committed against her and that she
was killed. It was a very sad tragic case and certainly touched many in our community and I think across the nation.
CASAREZ: Was she bound, gagged and strangled?
BRODSKY: Yes.
CASAREZ: So, she was - legally, torture is one thing, but she was tortured just as we all know it to be.
BRODSKY: Well, there was significant evidence during the trial that was presented in that regard. It`s difficult for me to talk too much about the
case simply because we are in posture right now where the case is currently being litigated in this collateral attack.
And we are awaiting a ruling from the court to decide and to direct whether there will be a new penalty phase and we`ll have to ask a new jury to
decide what sentence should be imposed upon Joseph Smith, life or death. And because of that, I`m a little cautious (inaudible 4:40).
CASAREZ: No, I understand. What have you said - before we close, what have you said in court in your written motions about why he does not deserve a
new sentencing hearing?
BRODSKY: Well, our case has been - throughout the entire direct - series of direct appeals in collateral attacks, the case has been represented by the
office of the attorney general`s office, General Pam Bondi and her folks and her fine folks who`ve done a wonderful job.
But the crux of the issue was that Joseph Smith was convicted of two underlying felonies in addition to the capital felony for the homicide for
kidnapping her and for committing sexual battery and she`s also a minor.
Those three facts, which the jury made a finding that he was guilty as charged as to those crimes, the jury found those crimes unanimously.
Therefore, the argument that`s presented is that in light of the fact that the jury made findings unanimously of what constitutes aggravators in the
State of Florida to recommend the death penalty that we feel that this does not merit a new penalty phase for Joseph Smith.
CASAREZ: Well, it would be very interesting to see what happens and this could be precedent-setting for other cases that may come along. But not too
many are like Joseph Smith. I will grant you that. Thank you so much.
A 3-month-old baby is taken to the hospital with a fractured skull and bruises and superglue around his mouth, but his parents are nowhere to be
found. Where are they? How did this happen?
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:50:53] CASAREZ: Authorities in two states are investigating a despicable case of child abuse, but say they haven`t been able to track
down who did this. Police say a woman brought the 3-month-old to a hospital in Arkansas near the Missouri border after finding him in poor condition,
being watched by someone who is not his mother or his father.
After initial checkup, employees at the medical center called 911. According to officers, the baby had bruising on his face, arms and legs,
facial swelling and what appeared to be superglue around his mouth.
Further tests revealed the child had fractures. Now, police are trying to find out how this happened to him.
Dave Mack is a syndicated talk show host. He joins us tonight from Birmingham, Alabama. All right, Dave. I want to really look at the injuries
of this child. They were fractures. Do we know where the fractures were?
DAVE MACK, SYNDICATED TALK SHOW HOST: We know that he has fractures on his ribs, of course he has a fractured skull. He`s got bruising on his arms and
his face. He has all the signs of abuse, which is why police were called almost immediately, Jean.
CASAREZ: Right. So, we`ve got two fractures that we know of, the skull and ribs, OK?
MACK: Correct.
CASAREZ: Now, this is a 3-month-old baby. I know from some of the legal work that I`ve done that ribs in a 3-month-old can be very bendable and
pliable because they`re not formed yet, so they`re like a rubber band. They do not break easily. It`s very hard to break ribs at this point.
Tell me about the superglue on the mouth.
MACK: Jean, everything about this is heartbreaking. You are talking about how the bones bend at this stage in particular, the ribs, one can only
imagine that whoever was in charge of taking care of this 12-week-old baby that they were trying to silence the baby and used superglue, while holding
his face - that`s why you got bruising around the face as they were trying to hold the baby`s mouth shut ostensibly to keep him from crying and poured
superglue around the baby`s mouth to try to get it to shut.
CASAREZ: Yes. Brian and Joey, you see the state of mind just right there. Brian, if the baby just had the injuries, the fractures and the bruising,
you could say he fell or somebody accidentally dropped him or you could find - but the superglue, Brian?
BRIAN CLAYPOOL, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Yes. I handle child abuse cases, so this is torture for me to hear this, but that is just flat out categorical
evidence of child neglect, abuse and torture.
JOEY JACKSON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: And the purposeful nature of it, Jean. And you think about this, OK? It`s a 3-month-old baby, right? How precious is a
3-month-old to all of us? You would coddle a 3-year-old and kiss and hug and love. How does something like this happen to the point where we don`t
even know who is responsible? Doesn`t make sense.
CASAREZ: Right. And how do you break the skull and the ribs?
JACKSON: Through a lack of humanity, through wickedness, through purposeful conduct, through action which is just deplorable.
CASAREZ: And through extreme force.
JACKSON: Exactly.
CASAREZ: Right. It has been years since we have started CNN Heroes to recognize everyday people changing the world. And we are proud that many
schools have now incorporated the campaign into their curriculum.
Brian O`Connor, a fifth-grade teacher in suburban New York City, has found a unique way to connect his students with these extraordinary individuals.
Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIAN O`CONNOR, FIFTH-GRADE TEACHER IN SUBURBAN NEW YORK CITY: Throughout our school here, we will set up several Skype calls with various heroes.
They`re a celebrity to my kids, as they should be. The kids come up with amazing questions.
When I see how excited that fifth grader is, it makes me realize that we`re doing something right in here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CASAREZ: To see the full impact of CNN Heroes in the classroom, go to CNNheroes.com. And while you`re there, nominate somebody that you think
should be 2017`s CNN Hero. We`ll be right back.
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