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General Flynn And Russia; Yates And Clapper To Testify; Ivanka Trump Booed in Berlin; North Korea Conducts Drills; Three Americans Still Detained in North Korea. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired April 25, 2017 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[13:00:00] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Wolf Blitzer. It's 1:00 p.m. here in New York. Wherever you're watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

We begin with breaking news. More trouble for the fired national security adviser, Michael Flynn. The chairman and ranking member of a House panel says it appears Flynn failed to follow the law and did not properly disclose payments from foreign governments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JASON CHAFFETZ (R-UT), CHAIRMAN, OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE: As a former military officer, you simply cannot take money from Russia, Turkey or anybody else. And it appears as if he did take that money. It was inappropriate. And there are repercussions for the violation of law.

REP. ELIJAH CUMMINGS (D-MD), RANKING MEMBER, OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE: Right now, we cannot discuss the contents of the documents that we just saw because they are indeed classified. But we can say this. They are extremely troubling. We have concerns. And I believe these documents should be declassified to the fullest extent possible without compromising sources and methods.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's bring in our Chief National Security Correspondent Jim Sciutto and our Senior White House Correspondent Jim Acosta. Jim Sciutto, the lawmakers, they viewed these classified documents but they also say the White House declined to provide other documents requested by -- as part of the investigation. Walk us through these late-breaking developments.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, Wolf, I'll tell you, to see the top Republican and Democrat there from the House Oversight Committee, Jason Chaffetz, Elijah Cummings, is significant and, frankly, worrisome for Michael Flynn. They've seen the documents here. At issue is $45,000 that Flynn was paid by R.T. This is a Russian controlled -- really, kremlin-controlled television network seen by the U.S., by the State Department as, in effect, government propaganda.

He took that money. You and our viewers will probably remember the picture of him sitting at a banquet in Moscow next to the Russian president, Vladimir Putin, when he went to give this speech. That's one thing. He didn't ask permission to give it. That's key. He's a retired general. Needed to do so from the Army and the Defense Department.

But, two, and this is crucial, did not report the money that he was paid for, that speech, on a security clearance form for the White House when he was picked as the national security adviser. That's not just frowned upon, that is potentially illegal. And that's what you hear from both Chaffetz and Cummings there.

Now, they've asked the White House for documents to further corroborate this, but the White House referring them to the Defense Department and not cooperating on other issues. But when you have a Republican and Democrat, they are from the House Oversight Committee, pushing for this, talking about possible breaking of the law by Flynn, that's significant. We've not seen the end of this case.

BLITZER: I think you're absolutely right. Jim Acosta, the White House is pushing back a bit on the suggestion that they're refusing to provide documents to this committee. What are you hearing from inside the Trump administration?

JIM ACOSTA, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Wolf. The White House is saying it's impossible for them to turnover these documents to the House Oversight Committee because they don't have them. And so, they are referring the Oversight Committee to the relevant agencies and that process apparently is now underway.

They're not disputing this letter was sent from the White House over to the committee. They acknowledge that they did send that letter.

We should also point out that General Flynn's attorney did put out a statement on this. We can put that up on screen. It says, as has been previously reported, General Flynn briefed the Defense Intelligence Agency, a component agency of DOD, extensively regarding the R.T., the Russia Television speaking event trip before and after the trip. And he answered any questions that were posed by DIA concerning the trip during those briefings.

So, you also have the attorney for Michael Flynn pushing back on that as well, Wolf. But this just goes to show you how problematic the selection of General Flynn has been for President Trump when he selected Mike Flynn for national security adviser. This has been a drip, drip, drip process, in terms of getting to the bottom of the just what Michael Flynn was up to when he was having these discussions with Russian officials during the campaign, during the transition and so.

And keep in mind, Wolf, there is just this messy component to all of this in that during the campaign, and you'll recall this, Wolf, Michael Flynn led those chants of lock her up. He did so during campaign rallies and so on. And now, you have the heads of the House Oversight Committee, both Democrat and Republican, saying that Michael Flynn did not comply with the law and so, you know, Democrats are just going to have a field day with this for just as long as they can -- Wolf.

BLITZER: Yes, but as Jim Sciutto points out, it's not just Elijah Cummings, the Ranking Democrat, it's the chairman of this Oversight Committee, Jason --

ACOSTA: That's right.

BLITZER: -- Chaffetz, as well. They appeared together. They were making these very strong statements.

Jim Sciutto, the former acting attorney general, Sally Yates, and the former director of national intelligence, James Clapper, they're now set to testify a second time. May 8th on Russian interference of the 2016 presidential election. They're going to be testifying on May 8th before the Senate Judiciary Committee. Earlier, they were both testifying before the House Intelligence Committee.

[13:05:10] But Senator Lindsey Graham, he's the chairman of this subcommittee, of the Judiciary Committee, what is he saying about Yates's testimony? This could be very significant.

SCIUTTO: Senator Graham is saying he's interested in a couple things. One, he's interested in why the former Trump campaign national security adviser, Carter Page, was a subject of a FISA warrant requested by the FBI. He wants to know what was behind that. Where that may lead, that's key to him.

And keep in mind now, you will have the former acting attorney general, Sally Yates and the former director of national intelligence, James Clapper, likely to testify before three committees now. Because you have the Senate and the House Intelligence Committees. They're doing their own investigation. The Senate hasn't released their list yet, but it's pretty certain you're going to have Clapper and Yates on that list.

And now, you have the subcommittee from Judiciary, Lindsey Graham's pursuit as well. So, it shows you that, you know, you've got three tracks here going, almost competing tracks talking to the same people. Where does this lead? Clearly, the investigation is going to go on for some time.

Senator Graham says he's also interested in Michael Flynn, his ties to Russia and this particular issue. Sally Yates had said her concern was that he might be blackmailable by Russia because of things he does. The things he did in the past. We're not sure what that is. And Senator Graham wants to know exactly why that is. He wants to pursue it through his subcommittee as well.

BLITZER: And as you know, based on what Sally Yates told the White House, he eventually, Flynn, was dismissed by the president of the United States, only a month or so on the job as national security advisor.

Jim Sciutto, Jim Acosta, thanks for your reporting.

Lots of developments to discuss with our panel. We have our CNN Military Analyst, retired Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton; CNN Political Commentator Errol Louis, he's the political anchor for Spectrum News; and Shelby Holiday, Politics and Business Reporter for "The Wall Street Journal."

Colonel, first to you. You worked with General Flynn on the joint staff back, what, in 2008, 2009. So, what's your reaction to the news that he may have not followed the law when he was seeking security clearances to become the president's national security adviser and apparently did not notify anyone at the time those security clearances that he received, what, about $45,000, from R.T., Russian Television?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, Wolf, my reaction is supreme disappointment. You know, when you work for somebody and you've been around them for quite some time, you want them to uphold the highest standards. You know, you were held to those standards yourself and you expect your seniors to do the same thing.

So, I would characterize it as supreme disappointment. I am not only concerned about this, but it does look to me as if there is a lot more that -- as Jim Sciutto and Jim Acosta mentioned, a lot more to this than what we currently see.

BLITZER: Colonel, when you worked with him, what was your impression of Michael Flynn? Because you had a close working relationship with him. And did you think he was qualified to become the national security adviser to the president of the United States?

LEIGHTON: General Flynn was a really good tactician. He was supremely capable when it came to special operation style missions. And, basically, he had done those things extremely well.

But when it came to the bigger picture, all the kinds of things that one deals with on a strategic basis at the Pentagon and beyond and obviously in the White House, I did not think that he was the right individual to be the national security adviser to the president. And that's not including the political aspect of what he did during the campaign which is something that I thought was unprecedented.

When you look at the other types of national security advisers that have come from a military background, somebody like Brent Scowcroft or Colin Powell, completely different people. People with a very set world view. One that allowed them to think strategically and act strategically which is exactly what you want in that -- in that role.

We did not see that with General Flynn, and I did not think that he was in that mold.

BLITZER: Yes, he clearly was no Colin Powell or Brent Scowcroft. Errol, how much of a problem is Flynn for the White House right now? He's gone. He was dismissed. But there's still, potentially, a political problem?

ERROL LOUIS, CNN MILITARY COMMENTATOR: Well, that's right. Every time you talk about Flynn, anytime we talk about Flynn, the White House, I'm sure, goes crazy. In part because it does a lot -- it causes a lot of problems all at the same time. It strains the relationship with the Republican leadership on Capitol Hill with whom they have to cut all kinds of other deals.

And every time these various subcommittees start coming up with more information, it strains those relationships. It casts a cloud of legitimacy, frankly, over the administration that has -- it's, kind of, made the president personally kind of nuts, you know? He tweets about it. He calls it fake news. He doesn't want us talking about it. But we have to talk about it because it's extremely important.

And then, finally, you know, as we total up the pros and cons of the first 100 days, you give him the pros. You give the president the pros. The Neil Gorsuch nomination that went through successfully.

[13:10:07] But, you know, on the other side of the ledger is Mike Flynn.

BLITZER: You know, and I assume, Shelby, the White House is not very happy. All these hearings now, the Judiciary Committee in the Senate, the Intelligence Committee in the Senate and the House, as well as the ongoing FBI criminal investigation on the Russia involvement in the presidential election. They're not happy about all of this open testimony that's about to take place.

SHELBY HOLIDAY, POLITICS AND BUSINESS REPORTER, "THE WALL STREET JOURNAL": No, it's certainly a thorn in the president's side. And it's also not the story the president wants leading up to his big hundred-day mark.

Michael Flynn represents a bigger problem this White House has with staffing. We still have plenty of staff jobs unfilled. Appointees unconfirmed at this point. Either Donald Trump's team wasn't ready to run the government, maybe they were surprised or they just didn't take the vetting process seriously. But this does represent a big overall problem.

And Wilbur Ross was talking this morning --

BLITZER: The Commerce secretary.

HOLIDAY: -- saying to CNBC saying he has all these bilateral trade agreements he wants to negotiate. That's a huge promise Donald Trump made on the campaign trail. But does he have the manpower? He struggled to answer that questions. You have to have lots of people in place to get these things moving.

BLITZER: Yes, there are hundreds and hundreds of jobs that have still not yet been filled.

HOLIDAY: Exactly. It's a being problem for the White House. It's not good in the first hundred days. A hundred days is a long time.

BLITZER: Everybody stand by. There's more coming up.

Still ahead, more threats from North Korea as the United States parks a nuclear submarine in the neighborhood.

Also, the president's daughter is jeered a bit in Germany as she stands up for her dad and his history with women. We're going to hear from Ivanka Trump and take you live to Berlin. That's coming up next.

[13:12:02]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:15:31] BLITZER: President Donald Trump spoke today at a very solemn event, the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum's National Day of Remembrance up on Capitol Hill. The president spoke about the bond between the United States and Israel and he strongly pledged to act against anti-Semitism anywhere in the world.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We are here today to remember and to bear witness, to make sure that humanity never, ever forgets. The Nazis massacred 6 million Jews. Two out of every three Jews in Europe were murdered in the genocide. Yet even today there are those who want to forget the past. Worse still, there are even those filled with such hate, total hate, that they want to erase the Holocaust from history.

This is my pledge to you. We will confront anti-Semitism.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Very strong words from the president of the United States. His comments were closely watched. He had been criticized in the recent past for not speaking out forcefully enough about incidents of anti-Semitism. That clearly changed dramatically today.

The first daughter, Ivanka Trump, who herself is Jewish, was the target of a bit of derision during a women's panel in Berlin, Germany, today. She faced a few hisses from the crowd as she defended her father's record and past comments on women. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

IVANKA TRUMP, PRESIDENT TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: He's been a tremendous champion of supporting - and enabling in the new reality -

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You hear the reaction from the audience.

TRUMP: I certainly heard the criticism from the media and - that's been perpetuated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Ivanka Trump seemingly blaming the news media there for the criticism of her father.

Our White House reporter, Kate Bennett, is in Berlin for us. She's traveling with Ivanka Trump. Kate, this is her first overseas trip since being elevated to an official advisory role in the White House. What was her reaction to that reception she received from the audience?

KATE BENNETT, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, Wolf, as we just heard in that clip, the reception was just for a moment during this panel sort of probably what she wasn't anticipating. Ivanka, of course, was talking on a fairly formidable panel. She was on there with Angela Merkel, Christine Lagarde of the IMF, the queen of the Netherlands. I mean this is definitely dipping her toe onto a global stage, discussing women's entrepreneurship, closing the gender pay gap, et cetera. So that one moment that happened was perhaps unexpected, but she was overall pretty much, I think it's fair to say, grilled by the moderator about her role in the White House and she handle it well. You know, unlike perhaps her father, she's somewhat unflappable.

Afterwards there was an off camera gaggle with a few members of the media and she was asked about that incident where people in the crowd reacted and she said, you know, it's politics. Politics is politics. I'm getting used to it. As long as there's a dialogue and it's sort of forcing a conversation, she's fine with it. She was also asked if she felt the moderator was too hard on her and she said, again, I'm used to it. It was fine. She just wanted to sort of move the ball forward with her conversation about women's issues and funding and helping women entrepreneurs get off the ground and sort of help the global economy.

BLITZER: The hisses that we heard, and it was very brief, but it was a big crowd. Was it only a handful of people who were reacting like that, or was it more significant?

BENNETT: Well, I think it sort of rippled a bit through the crowd. Once there was a hiss, there was a couple other ones. For the most part, again, this was a lengthy panel. There was a degree of respect involved. However, what she did touch on that thought about how her father is supportive of American families, that was when the noise was heard. And again, you know, she mentioned it again that her father was supportive of American families in her off camera gaggle as well. It's not something she's backing down from. But certainly people here in Germany, attendees of this W-20 Summit, did have -- they're up on their politics. They likely followed the campaign. They're very interested in what she has to say and what President Trump intends to do and they weren't shy about expressing that one sentiment during this panel.

[13:20:14] BLITZER: Ivanka Trump also spoke about her father's decision to launch those tomahawk cruise missiles at that Syrian air base of Bashar - the regime of Bashar al Assad. What did she say on that?

BENNETT: Well, she did say that despite an interview that Eric Trump, her brother, had with an outlet a few - a couple of weeks ago saying that because of Ivanka's being heartbroken by the images, that was the impetus for the strikes. Ivanka said that's not the case. She was heartbroken. She did consult with her father. She did share her feelings. But she said in no way did her feelings and her sentiments lead directly to the strikes. She said of course presidents don't act solely on emotion. There is a large panel of experienced people acting in his administration. It wasn't done because Ivanka said to do it. She cleared that up pretty quickly.

BLITZER: Yes. It was the first time the U.S. actually launched a military strike against the regime of the Syrian President Bashar al Assad following that chemical weapons attack against those civilians that resulted in a lot of deaths, including a lot of children that were killed.

Kate Bennett in Berlin for us on the scene. Thanks very much, Kate, for that report.

Meanwhile, the U.S. has sent a nuclear submarine to South Korea. Just ahead, we're going live inside Pyongyang, North Korea, to see how North Korea's ramping up its own military activity and the latest threats from Kim Jong-un.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:26:09] BLITZER: We're following new developments with North Korea today. The USS Michigan, the nuclear submarine, has just arrived in South Korea. Just as the U.S. conducts military exercises with both South Korea and Japan, an apparent show of force amid rising tensions between Washington and Pyongyang.

CNN's Will Ripley is in North Korea right now and says the leader there, Kim Jong-un, is displaying a show of force of his own.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Wolf, despite warnings from President Trump and the Pentagon, more provocative behavior from North Korea's Supreme Leader Kim Jong-un, a long range artillery drill involving hundreds of North Korean soldiers reportedly. And this is especially concerning to people in South Korea because the North has a lot of long range artillery pointed at the Seoul metropolitan area, home to tens of millions of people. In fact, some analysts believe those conventional weapons could do more harm in the short term than North Korea's nuclear weapons, which are still under development.

North Korea has not yet conducted their sixth nuclear test, which analysts say could happen at any time, but there were other events to mark the 85th anniversary of the Korean people's army, known as army day, here in North Korea. There was dancing in the streets of Pyongyang. Students and civilians turning out for these celebrations. They are expected to be out to show their revolutionary spirit, even on their rare days off. Also a more somber event, a wreath laying ceremony to honor the hundreds of thousands of North Koreans who died in the Korean War.

Meanwhile, on the U.S. side, you have President Trump talking to the U.N. Security Council, calling North Korea's growing arsenal a grave threat to the world. He's hoping that China will exert more pressure, economic pressure, on North Korea to rein in its nuclear program. And the U.S. also showing force in the waters off the Korean Peninsula, deploying a U.S. nuclear submarine and, of course, the USS Carl Vinson carrier strike group approaching the waters off the shore of the peninsula.

All of this unfolding as there's another situation involving three detained Americans. A man named Tony Kim, a professor, was arrested at the Pyongyang Airport over the weekend. We don't know what charges he's facing or even where he's being held right now, be he joins at least two other U.S. citizens in North Korean custody, University of Virginia student Otto Warmbier, serving 15 years hard labor for stealing a sign from his hotel or taking that sign off the wall and putting it on the ground, and then also Kim Dong-chul, a U.S. citizen serving ten years hard labor accused of spying. So you have those two events unfolding, the military provocations and American citizens being held h ere in North Korea.

Wolf.

BLITZER: All disturbing developments. Will Ripley in Pyongyang for us. Thanks, Will, very much.

I want to bring in David Rohde to talk about this, our CNN global affairs analyst and national security investigations editor for Reuters.

David, thanks for joining us.

All the activity, the military activity, the USS Carl Vinson, joint exercises with Japan, eventually with South Korea. This is an aircraft carrier strike force. And now this nuclear powered submarine moving towards the region. I know that this makes the North Koreans very nervous.

DAVID ROHDE, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: It does and it's clearly designed to pressure them. I also think it's partly to pressure the Chinese to really produce results. You know, everyone's talked about how China has the economic leverage to get maybe North Korea to stop this rapid development of its nuclear capacity. So I think there is two audience for this, one in Beijing and one in Pyongyang.

BLITZER: So the actual military maneuvers plus the tough talk from the U.S. may have an impact on North Korea, but what you're - what you're suggesting, it's really designed to convince the Chinese to get more involved because they have some influence, some leverage over North Korea?

[13:29:44] ROHDE: The fear is, you know, this unpredictability, that there is a possibility that they want the Chinese to think that the Trump administration could carry out a unilateral military strike against North Korea. That's very unlikely. This artillery activity in North Korea is designed to show why that would be so dangerous. You know, many of these weapons could reach Seoul, as was talked about. Any - you know, you could take out and damage the nuclear capability, but you'd have immediate retaliatory artillery strikes against Seoul that could kill thousands, tens of thousands of civilians.