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White House Warns Syria over Chemical Weapons Attack; ISIS Pushes into Southeast Asia in Philippines; Breaking, Mitch McConnell Delaying Senate Health Care Vote. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired June 27, 2017 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:31:36] WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: Looking at live pictures from the White House briefing room. Sean Spicer getting ready for his White House briefing. This one will be on camera. The first time briefing reporters on-camera in a week. We'll, of course, have live coverage. The Energy secretary, Rick Perry, by the way, will join Sean Spicer at that briefing and kick it off with some words of his own. All of that coming up on CNN, live coverage.

Meantime, other important news we're following, Russia and Iran, you just heard, are pushing back on a warning from the White House to the Syrian regime. U.S. officials telling Bash al Assad he'll pay a, quote, "heavy price" if he launches another chemical weapons attack.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIKKI HALEY, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED NATIONS: I believe the goal is at this point not just to send Assad a message, but to send Russia and Iran a message that if this happens again, we are putting you on notice.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLITZER: Let's discuss with retired Rear Admiral John Kirby, CNN's military and diplomatic analyst. He served as State Department and Pentagon spokesman. Also joining us, our Pentagon reporter, Ryan Browne; and Lieutenant Colonel Rick Francona, a CNN military analyst, retired U.S. military attache in Syria.

Ryan, at the Pentagon first, tell us what prompted this very, very strong warning from the Trump administration.

RYAN BROWNE, CNN PENTAGON REPORTER: Right, Wolf. The military has been seeing preparations at the Shayrat Air Base. If you recall, that's the same base the U.S. launched 59 Tomahawk missiles against back in April in retaliation for that chemical weapons strike by the regime forces. They are seeing similar preparations as they saw back in April going on right now, with one Pentagon official telling us that that intelligence had become particularly more compelling in the last 24 hours, including seeing some MIG fighters brought into a bunker, or shelter area, where chemical weapons are believed to be stored. So signs like this, say points, suggests that the regime may be preparing nor chemical weapons attack in the near future. BLITZER: You heard Nikki Haley, the U.S. ambassador to the U.N.,

Ryan, going a step further, not only warning Bashar al Assad's regime, but also its backers in Iran and Russia. That's a significant statement.

BROWNE: That's right. She said, putting them on notice. Again, Russia actually maintains some personnel at this air base, at Shayrat Air Base, we're told. Again, very much wanting to send a message to both Bashar al Assad and his two key backers, Iran and Russia, that chemical weapons use will not be tolerated in this upcoming period.

BLITZER: Interesting, Admiral Kirby, that the Russians released a statement. I'll put it on the screen. This is a statement from the Russians: "Another dangerous U.S. escalation in Syria on fake pretext will only serve ISIS precisely when it's being wiped out by Iraqi and Syrian people."

So the Russians are reacting. The Iranians are reacting. Sounds like an escalation now?

ADM. JOHN KIRBY, CNN MILTIARY & DIPLOMATIC ANALYST: You can expect them to react like that. Look, they've both been bolstering the Assad regime. They're not necessarily working in tandem, Russia or Iran. And frankly, the Assad regime. I think their reaction should have been expected. It certainly got their attention. And if this warning has a deterrent effect and can prevent them from conducting an attack like this again, it's all for the good.

[13:35:12] BLITZER: The president, President Bashar al Assad, he actually visited a Russian military base in Syria today, presumably, sending his own message.

KIRBY: Maybe. We don't know if he did this particularly because of the warning out of the White House or whether it was long planned. Any chance he can get to show he has backing and support of the Russian military, I think he feels emboldened by that.

BLITZER: Colonel Francona, is the Trump administration laying down a red line right now?

LT. COL. RICK FRANCONA, CNN MILITARY ANALYST: I guess you'd have to call it -- I mean, you read the announcement from the White House, you look at Nikki Haley's statements, of course, they're putting down this marker. And there's precedent. The last time they used chemical weapons, it drew an American reaction. And I think it's clear that if they do it again, they'll draw an American action. Just following with what the admiral said, we expect the Russians and Iranians to make these statements, but in private counsel, they're probably telling the Syrians this is not a good idea. They're ramping up tensions where they don't need to.

BLITZER: But the Syrians, the regime, they saw what President Trump was willing to do. Why would they even risk another chemical weapons attack right now, knowing that if they were to do that, a lot more Tomahawk cruise missiles might be fired in? FRANCONA: Well, actually, the regime has not said they're threatening

the use of chemical weapons. We're saying that we're seeing indications that that is happening.

(CROSSTALK)

FRANCONA: We're not really sure what's going on.

BLITZER: If they were to use chemical weapons again, why would they do that, knowing there would be a severe retaliatory strike from the U.S.?

FRANCONA: It makes absolutely no sense for them to launch a chemical attack. They know what will happen in response. If you look at the military situation on the ground, it's not going to change it. They're winning the fight against ISIS. They don't need to use chemical weapons. If they use it up in Idlib, they're going to draw the same reaction. It's not going to change the military situation. These chemical weapons are military insignificant. They're a terror weapon and they're designed to demonstrate to the Syrian people that he's in charge. But militarily, insignificant.

BLITZER: But the point is, Admiral, if they were to use chemical weapons, not necessarily against ISIS but against those Democratic Forces, as they're called, who are resisting Bashar al Assad's regime, they, too, oppose ISIS?

KIRBY: Sure. Let's be honest, the regime isn't interested in fighting ISIS, never have been. They're interested in putting down the civil war, going after the opposition. They are none too happy about the fact that SDF forces, Syria Democratic Forces, are moving on Raqqa, and Raqqa is something they want back. I don't know whether that was what was planned here, a chemical attack against the SDF, but clearly counterproductive to the larger effort. And I think Rick is right, it would exactly draw the response they don't want.

Look, I think they had to move quickly on this statement, because as Rick can attest, it doesn't take that long to mount up weaponry or a fighter jet. Obviously, they saw indications that was happening quickly. So I think they moved as fast as they could on this.

BLITZER: Rick Francona, a lot of us remember the warning, the red line warning that President Obama delivered to the Syrian regime back in 2012. Listen to what he said then, because it sounds similar to what we're hearing now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, FORM PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have been very clear to the Assad regime but also to other players on the ground that a red line for us is, we start seeing a whole bunch of chemical weapons moving around or being utilized, that would change my calculus, that would change my equation.

(END VIDEO CLIP) BLITZER: So the Syrians heard that once before. That red line was crossed. The U.S. did not immediately respond. So how effective is the current rhetoric?

FRANCONA: Oh, I think it's very effective, because, on April 6th, following an April 4th attack, the United States did respond. We're on record, and there's a precedent, if they do this, we will take action. And I think Bashar al Assad knows that, and he's figuring that into his calculation. I also think that the Russians are probably going to get to him and say, Bashar, not a good idea.

[13:39:21] BLITZER: I assume you're right.

All right, Rick Francona, thank you.

John Kirby, thanks to you.

Ryan Browne, thanks as well.

Up next, we're going to the Philippines were ISIS fighters right now are battling to create their own foothold in Southeast Asia. What could this mean for the region? We'll take a closer look when we come back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLITZER: After years of fighting in the Middle East, ISIS is now asserting its presence in Southeast Asia. The violence may be just the start of a new front for the terror group.

Our senior international correspondent, Ivan Watson, reports on this emerging threat in the Philippines.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

(GUNFIRE)

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This was the scene when ISIS militants stormed the city of Marawi in the Philippines on May 23rd -

(GUNFIRE)

WATSON: -- triggering the longest and deadliest urban battle the Philippine military has fought in decades and marking the appearance of a tenacious enemy with international ambitions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The aim of taking over pert was to have the credentials to announce the establishment of a formal province of Islamic State in Southeast Asia.

WATSON: Counterterrorism experts say ISIS in the Philippines is actually a coalition of local Islamist insurgent groups.

[13:45:05] UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's so extraordinary about this coalition is that it bridges ethnic and regional ties in a way that really hasn't happened in the Philippines before.

WATSON: These are the top commanders of ISIS in the Philippines. They filmed themselves planning their assault on this area. And this video later captured and distributed by the Philippine military.

Among the leaders, Abdullah and Omar Moute (ph), two brothers from Marawi who spent time living in the Middle East. Omar Moute (ph) also taught English and preached sermons at this mosque and Islamic school in Indonesia. Somewhere along the way, he also became a violent extremist.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stressing the Philippines, is a place to share fighters. They share skills. They share ideas. And they share human resources.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It was very easy for us.

WATSON: This man is a former member of one of the Philippines most notorious jihadi groups. In this exclusive interview with CNN, he said extremists have had decades to develop sophisticated international smuggling networks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They can easily transport arms and money, very easily.

WATSON (on camera): Between which countries?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Malaysia and Philippines, through the backdoor.

WATSON (voice-over): The back door, the islands between the Philippines, Indonesia and Malaysia, which smugglers navigate using small boats.

(GUNFIRE)

WASTSON: Some of the foreign fighters battling in Marawi may have actually island-hopped their way here.

Recently, the Philippines, Indonesia and Malaysia announced plans for joint counterterror Navy patrols and information sharing.

The month-long battle in Marawi, an international wake-up call, to the terror threat growing in Southeast Asia.

(GUNFIRE)

WATSON: Ivan Watson, CNN, the Philippines.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BLITZER: All right. There's breaking news, very significant breaking news. We're now learning that the Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, has decided to delay the vote on the Senate Republican health care bill.

Let's go to senior congressional correspondent, Manu Raju, up on the Hill.

Manu, a major setback for the majority leader and his Republican leadership. They really wanted this vote before the July 4th recess?

MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: No question about it, Wolf. What we're hearing from sources who were in the room where the Senator majority leader just made this announcement, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell telling Senators he does not want to have the vote this week because of concerns from his own Republican conference, saying he wants this bill to pass. And say he is actually open to changes to the bill, wants to get a new cost estimate for those new changes to the bill. And then try to have is a vote sometime later in the month.

This, a recognition of the pushback from a number of his member who did not even want to begin debate on this bill and a real concern that even going forward with this process and seeing the bill go down would be really detrimental for the cause to repeal this bill, something they've promising to do since 2009.

Also, at this closed-door lunch, Vice President Mike Pence inviting Senators to a meeting with President Trump at the White House this afternoon, where they will talk about this issue.

But no question about it, Wolf, the Republican leadership wanted to get this done before recess, because they were concerned. It is going to get harder and harder as more public opposition presumably would mount. People would get concerned about this bill. Town hall meetings would get loud, protests and the like. That's one reason why they're pushing very hard to get this passed this week. But now that it's being delayed, it gives more time for the opposition to mobilize. But the majority leader really had no choice, believing that's the only way to get a deal within his own conference, see if he can get the bill out of the Senate sometime this month, before it goes back to the House for more negotiations, or even for final passage on a Senate bill.

A big development here on Capitol Hill. Mitch McConnell not wanting to move forward with this vote this week because of opposition from Republican Senators to the bill that he just unveiled --Wolf?

BLITZER: And we're told that the majority leader, Mitch McConnell, will make a public statement on all this shortly. We'll, of course, have live coverage of that.

Let me bring in Dana Bash up on Capitol Hill as well.

Dana, a major setback at least for the time being. No vote on a procedural vote or a substantive vote this week.

[13:49:48] DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Look, at the end of the day, and we saw this coming, really, starting yesterday when the CBO numbers came out and said that 22 million Americans would lose coverage and had other bits of data in there that made people on the Republican side -- of course, that's all we're talking about here, the Republicans who are maybe the more moderates, who are already concerned about that recoil even more. The Susan Collins of the world, even Dean Heller of Nevada.

So at the end of the day, Mitch McConnell had to make a difficult choice. Was he going to bring this to the floor of the United States Senate, knowing that he didn't even have the votes from his own caucus to begin debate on this bill because those were the numbers that we were counting up. I mean, between me and my colleagues, we talked to four or five Republicans who said they wouldn't even vote to start debate. Again, they could only afford to lose two Republicans. So have that vote, and just shrug your shoulders and move on, if you're Mitch McConnell, or listen to what so many of his rank-and-file Republicans were begging him to do, not just in private, but in public. Whether it was Lisa Murkowski on "The Situation Room -- I talked to her on your show yesterday, Wolf -- or Ron Johnson, or so many others saying, hold on, take a deep breath. We need more time. We need more information before we can vote on something that has such a huge effect on so many constituents across the country.

So, you know, at the end of the day, the process didn't work out for Mitch McConnell of keeping this behind closed doors, putting it out there for Republicans to see. And, frankly, for Republicans to jump on before the proponents of this could even explain the good things that they thought were in it. But this is beyond process. This is about the substance.

And it's still a very open question, Wolf, whether or not things will change after recess. I mean, if there is even a way to get to "yes" for enough of these Republicans in order to get the votes, it's an open question. Mitch McConnell didn't think that leaving this out there over the congressional recess would be a good thing, but he didn't have any choice. The votes just weren't there.

BLITZER: It's interesting, Dana.

Stand by.

We're waiting for Mitch McConnell to walk over to that live microphone -- a live picture -- and make his statement on that major on the breaking news we're following, no vote in the Senate, at least this week, before the July 4th recess on the Republican health care repeal- and-replace legislation.

David Chalian is our political director.

David, we saw something similar unfold in the House of Representatives before final passage in the House. They, too, didn't have the votes originally. They delayed a vote. Then they got their act together. They convinced the moderated, the conservatives, let's pass this, and they narrowly did. Are we seeing something potentially similar in the Senate?

DAVID CHALIAN, CNN POLITICAL DIRECTOR: Potentially, it's deja vu all over again. I was thinking how this was playing out like the House process in that way, which is specifically Paul Ryan had to pull that bill, you know, cancel that vote on the floor of the House, mostly because he didn't have enough of his own conservatives. The House Freedom Caucus wasn't on board. They moved the bill further to the right than it was. They got that big contingent of Freedom Caucus members on board.

The problem here for Mitch McConnell is he doesn't have as much room to work with as Paul Ryan did. He can only let two of his Senators go. So here, the trick is, OK, if you're going to try and make this a more conservative bill to bring on someone like Ted Cruz and Mike Lee and Rand Paul and get -- well, then, you really have locked in Dean Heller and Susan Collins as "no" votes. You better make sure the rest of those moderates, Murkowski, Portman, people who are concerned about Medicaid and other factors in the bill, you got to make sure they're all locked up. He doesn't have as much wiggle room as Paul Ryan had. That is the trick for Senator McConnell. And I am not sure that more time is necessarily going to be the answer here.

BLITZER: Was there ever -- Manu, you're on the Hill, watching this so closely. Was there ever any serious thought on the part of Mitch McConnell, the Senate majority leader, to allow a vote, no matter what, even if were to fail. Simply get it over with. Then move on to other issues. They had been making that threat.

RAJU: They had been making that threat, Wolf. But the real concern would be if they actually were to get on the bill and beginning debate because there would be a number of amendments that would be offered because of the process in which they were bringing this bill up under the budget process. That essentially allows that any member can offer an amendment to get voted on, which is unusual in the Senate. Typically, you need an agreement just to get a vote on an amendment. But because of this process, it allows anybody to offer an amendment to this bill. So what does that mean? A number of Republican Senators would have had to take a lot of very, very tough votes, very politically poisonous votes, things that could hurt them in their own campaigns. So there was a lot of skepticism from the Senators I talked to that McConnell would be really willing to go through that entire process knowing that the bill would go down, knowing that members would take tough votes, just to see the bill fail at the end of the day. Which is one calculation, one reason why, a big reason why Mitch McConnell decided to pull back. Not only would it have probably failed in the procedural vote, but it could have failed on the actual substance of the bill if they actually began debate. So that just shows how problematic this bill is right now and how many significant changes that McConnell will have to make over the recess in order to get both the conservatives and his more moderate members and vulnerable members on board.

No matter the delay, though, it does not necessarily make it easier, Wolf. And in some ways, it could make it trickier.

[13:55:52] BLITZER: Yes.

I want to go to Phil Mattingly, over at where Mitch McConnell is going to be walking out and making his former statement.

Phil, we are now told, inside behind closed doors, he told the Republican Senators, all of whom were there, at least most of them were there, that there's not going to be a vote before the July 4th recess. What else are you hearing? PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, a couple things. First and

foremost, the vice president also sitting in the meeting. A very heavy White House presence on Capitol Hill today, Wolf. Made clear there's an invitation for all Republican Senators to come to the White House at 4:00 p.m. today. So that's going to happen.

Look, this is a recognition of a couple things. Manu did a really good job of laying out why you don't want to start this process if you don't know the end game here. They didn't know the end game. They did not have the votes. They did not have the votes even to start moving forward on the process, let alone get to those very politically dangerous amendments that were certainly going to come up on the Democratic side of things.

But I think the big question for Republican Senators is, what's going to change. The message we heard repeatedly from leaders over the last couple of days is, look, we know the dynamics. We know where our moderates are. We know where the Medicaid expansion Senators are. We know where our conservatives are. How do you get them to kind of bridge that gap? How is one more week going to actually change that? We'll have to wait and see.

But one thing was made clear. I think there has been an open question among some Senators, how much does the Senate majority leader want this. Is he willing to let this die because of the ambitious agenda they have going forward, that they want to make sure they get to? This point was reiterated in this meeting behind closed doors, I'm told, that the majority leader wants to get to "yes." He wants to get these members the space to get to "yes." Because of that, they're now going to have an extra week-plus to try and figure out how to bridge those very, very real gaps.

I think one kind of final key point to make, Wolf, this is not an interparty split that can be massaged over. These are sharp ideological differences about the role of health care and the government's role in health care that are within this conference. All 52 members with those sharp disagreements. That's the bridge they need to figure out to build over the course of the next week, week and a half. Whether they can do that is an open question. This idea that they had a grand plan throughout this week, that was blown up yesterday. And can they figure out a way to come back from that in the days ahead? The hope is yes. The Senate majority leader certainly giving them the space to get to "yes." We'll see if they can actually get there -- Wolf?

BLITZER: It's interesting, David, yesterday, the president, President Trump, tweeted this almost suspecting maybe they're not going to be able to get the votes in the Senate: "Republican Senators are working very hard to get there with no help from the Democrats, not easy. Perhaps just let Obamacare crash and burn."

You saw that tweet from yesterday.

CHALIAN: I did, but it's not a viable solution, obviously. Because the Republicans own the health care system now because they're in charge of every corner of power in Washington, D.C. I don't think that actually can get the president to his desired results.

I do think, by Mitch McConnell saying, guys, we're going to hold off, wait until after the recess, he's already giving a win to some of the Senators that expressed reservations. Ron Johnson and others who said, we can't have a vote this week. We need more time to look at this. They're already getting a victory now and able to go back to constituents and say that. So this will give McConnell some breathing room to try piece this together. I'm not sure of that with president and how he's going to go about doing it.

BLITZER: We're waiting for Mitch McConnell, the Senate Republican leader, the majority leader to come to that lectern over there and make his official statement. But we are told that he's decided there are not enough votes. They're going to have to delay this vote. He didn't want to do it. It's an embarrassment, but he really had no choice.

CHALIAN: That's right. This is an embarrassment by necessity. The idea of going to the floor with a bill that he knew was going to fail after seven years of making this the fundamental core promise of his party to voters, to repeal Obamacare, you can't just let it fail, throw your hands up and say, we tried, this is not happening. This has been the organizing principle of the Republican Party for the last seven years. The problem is, he's caught between a rock and a hard place. You have the promise and you have an unpopular solution. That is why you see all these Senators battling with each other.

BLITZER: Yes. We're going to stay on top of this story.

I'll be back, 5:00 p.m. Eastern in "The Situation Room."

In the meantime, our breaking news coverage continues right now.

[14:00:10] ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.