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Senate GOP Delays Health Care Amid Opposition; Three Chicago Officers Accused of Cover-up in Teen Shooting; DHS to Announce New Security Rules for Airlines; Interview with Senator Patty Murray. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired June 28, 2017 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00] JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: -- just sort of went down in silence. They couldn't get people to agree on it. So is it just a matter of making some small changes, giving maybe the conservatives more choice and more flexibility and giving some of the more centrist more money for Medicaid?

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I don't think it's small changes. I mean, we're talking about billions of dollars at stake here. And obviously there were some senators that had big problems with the bill. But that doesn't mean it can't be worked out over the course of a few days. And I have also heard this morning from some people familiar with Senator McConnell's thinking that the White House is fully engaged and actually helping getting these votes in line and getting the policy in line.

So it strikes me this morning that the reason you're hearing some positive vibes coming out of the Senate Republicans is that you do have positive movement and you also have a White House at the presidential level and at the staff level that's engaged and helping get this thing over the line.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: You have some, you know, positive vibes coming from the president. You also have Susan Collins who is saying, yes, no tinkering is going to get this done. It has to be bigger than that.

Let me ask you, Chris, because you have worked for some of the more moderate Democrats, like Senator Joe Manchin. Do you think Democrats feel any pressure right now to do more than stand on the sidelines and watch?

BERMAN: Do anything.

HARLOW: Do anything?

CHRIS KOFINIS, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, not as long as the bill is what it is. I mean, when you're talking about basically taking away health care from 22 million people, imposing lifetime caps, essentially, you know, providing a tax cut to the wealthiest 1 percent while you raise rates and health care costs for middle and working class Americans, you're not going to get a lot of Democrats, whether liberal Democrats or moderate Democrats like my old boss, wanting to be involved. I mean, the problem here from the very get-go was the process became

political, you know, through the election and really from the beginning. You saw it in the House, you saw it in the Senate. There's no willingness to work together. Every side is going to blame the other side.

But here is the problem. When you're dealing with an issue that's as complex as health care, the idea that you want to rush it through and you're going to end up with a good bill or one that basically invites bipartisan support is foolishness. It's just fantasy.

BERMAN: Well, one of the things that you seem to get when it comes to public opinion in health care is that most Americans seem to dislike any version of the health care that they currently have or is being proposed. Right? There's a new NBC, you know, Marist poll --

HARLOW: Well, I saw an NPR-PBS poll as well showing 17 percent.

BERMAN: Seventeen percent. Not a lot of people like this new bill that's coming out from the Senate as they are trying to tinker with it, maybe making improvements on it to make it more palatable.

So I'm struck by something that Scott Jennings said just as we were coming on here, saying the president is now fully engaged, which is actually a message that the president himself seems to want to be sending this morning. You know, he sent out a message saying, you know, don't pay attention to the "New York Times" is saying that I don't understand the details. I get it. I understand health care.

Why is the White House sending that message and perhaps people, you know, like Scott sending that this morning as well?

TARA PALMERI, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: President Trump is clearly on the defensive right now. He feels that he -- it shows that he has lost his juice, especially with the Senate and the House. This is the second time they've had to bring a bill back to work on it again. Clearly, his -- you know, his dinner, his schmoozing, his threats, they're just not working.

I remember when the House bill, the first iteration, came through, some monikers were telling me that Trump's major concern about the bill wasn't necessarily the policy details but the way they were marketing it, which goes back to, you know, Trump's roots as a master marketer. He didn't like the word buckets to describe the phases. He felt that buckets were something you put trash in.

So while he may be fully engaged, he may not be engaged in the same sort of policy nitty-gritty that a lot of these lawmakers really care about and so because of that, Mike Pence, the vice-president, he had a lot more juice because when he was on the Hill, he was known as a policy wonk. And a lot of these guys, they want to talk about policy.

The one thing that Trump, according to aides that I've spoken to, seems to be really passionate about is deregulation. And that goes back to his real estate days where his health care policy -- you know, he really cares about tax reform even more than that and sees this as a hurdle to get to what he wants to do.

HARLOW: He needs one to get to the other. And there's a lot of issues with the money and the financing and how you're going to get to all of it. You can't just move right on.

Scott, let me get your take on "The New York Times" headline on McConnell. McConnell's reputation as a master tactician takes a hit. Everyone yesterday was saying, if anyone can thread this shrinking, you know, hole of the needle, if you will, it's going to be McConnell. He couldn't do it. So is that a correct assessment?

JENNINGS: Well, he wasn't able to get it done this week. But that doesn't mean it won't get done next week or sometime in the month of July. And I suspect if it does get done, we'll look back on the short-term delay as a minor blip.

Any time Congress is doing big complex things, there are always 1,000 deaths. The obituary is written on all these big complex bills 100 times before they actually become law. And that's what we'll be talking about.

[10:35:02] One thing that McConnell has going in his favor is that circumstances may overtake us. We're at nearly half of all counties in the United States having only one or no insurance carriers because of the collapse of the insurance market. That is a circumstance that exists and has to be dealt with. We're also still in a place where premiums are going up by double digits in states all over the country.

As long as those circumstances continue to exist, it will continue to put pressure on the Republicans to finally put up or shut up on writing a bill. I think McConnell trying to force the issue and force the party to put details behind the policies that they ran on in the campaign has been a good thing and it will ultimately lead to success.

BERMAN: Look, if he gets a bill, no one is going to remember it took an extra week or two or three if he ultimately gets it through.

JENNINGS: That's right.

BERMAN: The question is, can he bridge what seems like a very, very big gap here?

Chris Kofinis, Roger Stone, you know, he of Netflix fame, he has been in the political world. I'm sure you've crossed path with him over time. He's going to testify to the House Intelligence Committee, though, behind closed doors about what he knows or knew in his dealings with Russia during the presidential campaign.

How colorful do you think this moment will be even with it behind closed doors?

KOFINIS: Well, I can't -- those stories will be leaking out before the -- you know, the interview is already done, the testimony is given. So, I mean, it's going to be colorful. But this is another chapter in the endless, you know, set of bad stories for the administration when it comes to this, you know, Russia investigation. I mean, the reality here is as long as this continues the president's

power is weakened. It's that simple. And there is no -- you know, this could take another two, three, four, six months, a year. So as long as that is out there, the political capital the president has on the Hill -- and this is where, you know, the Russia and health care issues don't necessarily seem to connect, but they do. A weakened president is weakened in terms of their influence on Capitol Hill.

And there's no way that a moderate senator, especially those that are up, like Dean Heller, in less than two years is going to sit there and listen to the president saying you should take this risk, when he sees a president whose numbers are in the 30s. So that is why these issues end up connecting.

BERMAN: Again we will see. He got through the House. We'll see if -- you know, if that is faded by the time it gets to the Senate in the next few weeks.

HARLOW: Thank you all very much.

Ahead for us, three Chicago police officers accused of lying to cover up the details in a shooting death of Laquan McDonald. We are live in Chicago next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:41:47] BERMAN: Felony charges for three Chicago police officers, including one who was still on the force. They are accused of covering up the shooting death of a black teenager who was killed by a white officer. Their story came into question when dash cam video was released showing Laquan McDonald walking away from police. He was holding a four-inch knife.

HARLOW: Yes, this contradicts the officer's original story that McDonald had lunged towards them with the knife.

Our correspondent Ryan Young is live in Chicago with more.

So what have you learned?

RYAN YOUNG, CNN CORRESPONDENT: John and Poppy, this really changed things in Chicago. When the shooting first happened and that video was released, it sparked protest across the city. In fact, the term was 16 shots and a cover-up. And now you're seeing the special prosecutor and a grand jury sort of cutting into this debate in terms of what's going on by charging these three officers.

As we show you this video, everyone sees it to this point, Laquan McDonald walking away with that knife, it appears to be, and then all of a sudden the shots are fired. 16 shots were fired by Jason Van Dyke, an officer at the time who's also facing a separate court case in this -- involvement. But now we know that three officers, according to this special prosecutor, have been charged with lying.

In fact they've been charged with conspiracy, obstruction of justice and official misconduct. It said that they not only tried to avoid interviewing witnesses who had a differing account, but they said that McDonald lunged at them and assaulted them with that knife and that after the shots were fired, that he tried to get up again and lunged towards those officers.

The special prosecutor actually pointed to the code of silence here in Chicago and said it's something the city can't stand for.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATRICIA BROWN HOLMES, SPECIAL PROSECUTOR: This indictment alleges that these defendants lied about what occurred during a police- involved shooting in order to prevent independent criminal investigators from learning the truth. The indictment makes clear that it is unacceptable to obey an unofficial code of silence.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

YOUNG: John and Poppy, I think something to remember here is that this investigation still continues. More officers could be charged. Since this shooting and that protest, that 16 shots and a cover-up, we've seen massive changes to the Chicago Police Department. A lot of people in this community realized this is not over just yet.

HARLOW: Ryan Young with the latest in Chicago. Thank you for that update.

BERMAN: All right. We're watching the White House this morning. The president has an event very, very shortly where he will speak. We will bring that to you live. Will he discuss the current state of play, Republicans trying to hammer out a new deal on health care by Friday? Are there signs of progress this morning? Stick around.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:48:21] BERMAN: There is some breaking news. Homeland Security Secretary John Kelly is set to lay out some new security measures for airports today.

CNN's Rene Marsh has the details on this.

Rene, what are you learning?

RENE MARSH, CNN AVIATION AND GOVERNMENT REGULATION CORRESPONDENT: That's right, John and Poppy. This information coming from three different sources saying that these new measures will essentially be a mandate at overseas airports. Any airport overseas with direct flights to the United States, they'll have to follow these new aviation security measures.

This is a way to get around that laptop ban that we've been speaking about so much. This is a compromise so to speak to that in that if all of these measures are followed, countries can avoid this laptop ban.

I spoke with one airline industry official who tells me that they expect that some of the issues that DHS will lay out will be increased use of K-9s as well as explosion detective -- explosive detective equipment. Back to you, guys.

HARLOW: All right. Rene Marsh, thank you for that.

Again breaking news, John Kelly will announce these new measures shortly. We'll bring them to you when we know more.

Also as Republicans re-group on health care, the message from the president this morning is, I understand the inner workings of health care. That's after some criticism from a Republican senator was reported in "The New York Times." But if President Trump was supposed to be the closer, a bridge to the gap between conservatives and moderates in his party, it hasn't happened yet.

BERMAN: The president will be speaking very shortly at the White House. And we're going to see what he knows or says about the new efforts for the Republicans get to 50 on the health care push.

Joining us now is someone who will not be part of that was 50, Democratic Senator Patty Murray from Washington.

Senator, thank you so much for being with us. The president this morning was writing about health care. He says, "I know the subject well." He also says he's fully engaged.

[10:50:04] Do you think he's fully engaged and knows the subject well?

SEN. PATTY MURRAY (D), WASHINGTON: Well, I think if this rhetoric continues to be Obamacare is broken, it's broken, it's broken, then he really isn't listening to what the facts are of insurance companies telling us, as long as this administration continues to undermine the subsidies and to continue the uncertainty, that is what's creating a lot of the chaos in the marketplace.

HARLOW: Well, Senator, this administration, there was a threat of pulling the subsidies but has not carried through on that. And would you admit that some of the instability of Obamacare is coming not as a result of this administration, some the insurance companies have said yes, it's because of a confusing message from this administration, but aren't there things in it that need to be fixed and hopefully as voters tell us by both parties together?

MURRAY: Yes, but insurance companies are telling us is they have to look out into the future and they do not know what's going to happen. They can't operate month to month with this uncertainty of whether or not this administration will pay the subsidies.

The other part of your question is, what can we do to make sure this health care system is more affordable and accessible? And obviously, as Democrats we want to participate in that conversation. But if the goal of this administration and Republicans is repeal Obamacare, take health care away from millions of people, increase costs and leave a lot of people uninsured, that's not a conversation we're going to participate in.

BERMAN: So you wrote the backroom deals and arm-twisting are going into overdrive starting now. MURRAY: Right.

BERMAN: This is in the effort to get to 50. I'm going to ask you this. If part of those backroom deals include more money for Medicaid, for instance, more money to fight opioid addiction, isn't that moving the bill in the right direction?

MURRAY: This isn't a compromise between 24 million people uninsured or 15 million people uninsured. Fifteen million people uninsured is not a goal we should be working towards.

Yes, we need to make sure we're looking at how we improve our health care system. But what we are urging our Republican colleagues to do is to throw away this mantra of repeal Obamacare and work with us through a committee. Let's have hearings. Let's talk about a public option. Will that help solve some of the problems in the bill counties? How do we make sure that we're looking at prescription drugs, a major part of our health care cost today, so that we can make sure that they are affordable?

There's a number of things we are going to look at. But having a period of a couple more days or another week for this administration to buy off a few senators, by having a few less than 22 million people uninsured, is not a compromise that will work for the American people.

BERMAN: Senator Patty Murray of Washington, thanks for being with us. Again we will see if there is any compromise or working together across party lines, something, you know, Washington could all use more of.

Thank you, Senator.

The World Series champion Chicago Cubs going back for seconds. Some of the members of the team set to make a new trip to the White House. We will tell you in the "Bleacher Report" next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:57:01] BERMAN: The Florida Gators, they won the College Baseball World Series for the first time in school history.

HARLOW: Coy Wire has more in this morning's "Bleacher Report."

Good for them. Good morning.

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Good morning, Poppy and John. Florida became just the fourth school in history to have won titles in baseball, football and men's basketball.

The gators are celebrating. There are two LSU fans that need to be celebrated. During Monday's game, Dr. Jerry Poche, the father of LSU pitcher Jerry Poche, along with another LSU dad, saved an elderly Florida fan's life. His heart stopped beating. They revived him, they performed CPR until paramedics arrived.

As so far as this game, the score was close nearly the entire time but the Gators scored four runs in the eighth inning putting it out of reach for the Tigers. The Gators win 6-1, sweeping the series and winning their first title in their program's 103-year history.

The World Series champion Chicago Cubs are making a second visit to the White House today. They are in town to play the Nationals. This has been dubbed as an informal visit and it's closed to the media. Manager Joe Madden said it's voluntary for his players and that it has to do with the fact that the owners of the Cubs, the Ricketts family, have strong ties to Capitol Hill. Chairman Tom Ricketts donated to Donald Trump's campaign in a big way.

He said he thinks the president thought it'd be fun to have an unofficial visit with the team while they're in town. The Cubs visited Chicago native President Obama at the White House in January.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL JORDAN, FORMER NBA STAR: You want to know the secret to victory? Fail to make the varsity team.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Spend 108 years as a local loser.

SERENA WILLIAMS, TENNIS CHAMPION: Be on the wrong side of the biggest upset in your sport.

JORDAN: You really want to know the secret to victory?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Matt Ryan who is in utter disbelief.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Defeat.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WIRE: Matt Ryan, Serena Williams and others starring alongside Michael Jordan in a rare ad appearance revealing that sometimes our greatest success in life comes after our worst defeats. Our failures can fuel us. We can find strength in our struggles. A unique ad by Gatorade highlighting the flipside of some of the biggest wins in sports.

Finally it's official. Phil Jackson as a coach has more titles than any coach in NBA history. But he just got let go as a front office exec by the Knicks. Just 80 wins and 166 losses in his three-year tenure there. The big part, no playoff appearances. Fans were not happy with his tenure there. But now many fans feel like the biggest Knicks fan of them all, Spike Lee, who posted this photo on Instagram, saying, alleluia.

ESPN's Darren Rovell tweeted that Jackson was the highest paid executive in American sports earning $12 million per year.

BERMAN: I got to say, as a Celtics fan, I am sorry to see him go. He made the league safe for anyone who wanted to root against the Knicks.

HARLOW: Poor sports, John Berman.

Coy Wire, thank you. We appreciate it.

WIRE: You're welcome.

HARLOW: And thank you all for being with us today. I'm Poppy Harlow.

BERMAN: I'm John Berman. "AT THIS HOUR" with Kate Bolduan starts now.