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NEW DAY SUNDAY
North Korea Announces Successful Hydrogen Bomb Test; Trump Declares National Day of Prayer for Harvey Victims; White House To Announce "Dreamers" Decision Tuesday; North Korea's Face of Propaganda For 40 Years Aired 6:30-7:00a
Aired September 3, 2017 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (voice-over): -- 60 percent success rate. Out of 18 test launches, the interceptors have only struck its target 10 times in controlled launches.
SENATOR DAN SULLIVAN (R), ALASKA: Just because we have had some failures doesn't mean we are not learning.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Alaska Senator Dan Sullivan believes the interceptors are still America's best shot as a last defense as North Korea rapidly moves closer to being able to strike the U.S. mainland introducing --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: And the breaking news from North Korea. This morning, a Pyongyang is claiming to have successfully tested a hydrogen bomb designed to fits its intercontinental ballistic missile. These are pictures of North Korean leader, Kim Jong-un, right after the test.
CHRISTI PAUL, CNN ANCHOR: The North Korean state media is calling the test a perfect success and it means this could put the U.S., Japan, and South Korea, within striking range. The test caused a 6.3 magnitude quake in the country's northeast. The tremors 10 times stronger than the last nuclear test.
BLACKWELL: So, there was an emergency call by South Korea and the Emergency National Council meeting presided over President Moon Jae- in. I want you to listen to South Korea's presidential chief security adviser.
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CHUNG EUI-YONG, SOUTH KOREA'S PRESIDENTIAL CHIEF SECURITY ADVISOR (through translation): North Korea today ignored the repeated warnings from us in the international society, and conducted a stronger nuclear test than before.
With the continued provocation of ICBM-level missile launch, President Moon has ordered the most powerful response to condemn North Korea along with the international society and decided to seek diplomatic measures such as pushing ahead for new NSC resolution to completely isolate North Korea.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PAUL: Now this is the country's sixth ever test of a nuclear weapon and the first test Kim Jong-un's regime has conducted since President Donald Trump took office.
BLACKWELL: CNN is covering this from all angles. We have Will Ripley in Tokyo, just returning from Pyongyang, Boris Sanchez in Washington, and our panel of political experts, Julian Zelizer and Sarah Westwood are with us as well.
PAUL: I want to begin with CNN's Will Ripley live from Tokyo. I think a lot of people are waking up, Will, and they are saying what is the danger of this test?
WILL RIPLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think the bottom line here, Christi, is that the world is not necessarily more dangerous now than it was several hours ago before North Korea conducted this nuclear test because the United States and South Korea have known since at least April North Korea was ready to push the button on this nuclear test at any moment on the orders of Kim Jong-un.
So, instead of thinking about this in terms of danger, we need to think in terms of context about what has been unfolding over the last week or so. We have the conclusion of those joint military exercises between the U.S. and South Korea, exercises that always infuriate the North Korean regime.
And we saw them fire their intermediate range (inaudible) ballistic missile over Hokkaido, an island here in Northern Japan. People woke up to air raid sirens and alert messages on their phones so a very scary situation for people in this region.
Then of course, we saw the U.S. respond with flying a B-2b bombers and fighter jets alongside South Korean fighters over the Korean Peninsula, a provocative act. North Korea's initial response was relatively calm.
They didn't indicate any imminent action, but what we saw from North Korea was a high-level meeting between the North Korean leader, Kim Jong-Un, and members of his (inaudible) bureau on Sunday afternoon local time and they decided to give the order to conduct this sixth nuclear test.
Sending a message of defiance to the United States, which is just about 48 hours ago North Korean state media while I was inside Pyongyang put out a statement saying it's time for the U.S. to change its longstanding policy of refusing to acknowledge North Korea as a nuclear weapon state.
North Korea has long been saying that want the United States to change course, to stop what North Korea considers a hostile policy, to accept North Korea as a nuclear power and sit down with them at the diplomatic table.
But of course, for the U.S. this poses a huge challenge because would they be essentially rewarding North Korea for conducting missile tests and nuclear tests flagrant violation of international law.
But from the North Korean's viewpoint and I just woke up in Pyongyang yesterday and landed in Tokyo last night. They say North Korea's nuclear program has come too far and they are not going to give it up.
BLACKWELL: All right. Will Ripley for us in Tokyo, thanks so much. Let's go now to CNN's Boris Sanchez joining us now from Washington. What is the reaction from the U.S.?
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, good morning, Victor and Christi. So far, CNN has reached out to the White House and the Pentagon, but we have not yet heard back.
I did want to point out in that security meeting you mentioned in South Korea, one of the key components coming from that meeting is that the country's chief security adviser said he spoke with the United States about, quote, "Deploying the strongest U.S. military assets in the region to neutralize North Korea."
We know that he had had a conversation earlier today shortly after this nuclear test with the national security adviser, his counterpart in the United States, H.R. McMaster.
So, we know the administration is at least aware of this test and perhaps preparing some kind of response and it will be an interesting one to look for, in part, because we have seen this back and forth.
[06:05:11] There is a test or a missile launch from North Korea and then there is a strong threatening response from President Trump, whether it be saying that the U.S. would respond with fire and fury the likes of which the world had never seen, saying that our military assets are locked and loaded, all options are on the table.
Despite that, just a few days ago, the president, himself, actually left the door ever so slightly open for diplomacy. Listen closely to what he said at a rally.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Kim Jong-Un, I respect the fact that I believe he is starting to respect us. I respect that fact very much and maybe -- probably not -- but maybe something positive can come about.
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SANCHEZ: Maybe, but probably not. Then you had North Korea launching missiles over Japan and that pushed the president to send out a tweet saying that the United States was paying extortion money to North Korea and saying talking is not the answer.
That runs contradictory to something many of his closest advisers have said. Secretary of Defense James Mattis just a few days ago saying diplomacy should be the path forward for dealing with North Korea because we have seen these provocations continuously escalate.
The president's response today will be key. We have yet to hear from the White House but as soon as we do, we will bring it to you -- Victor and Christi.
PAUL: All right, Boris Sanchez, thank you so much for the latest there.
BLACKWELL: All right, let's bring in now our panel, Julian Zelizer, CNN political analyst and historian at Princeton University, and Sarah Westwood, White House correspondent for the "Washington Examiner." Good morning to you.
I want to pick up, Julian, first with the thread that Boris offered here. Virtual silence from this administration. We are hearing from leaders around the world. Again, time zones probably play some role into that. But why haven't we heard? What do you glean from this silence?
JULIAN ZELIZER, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I assume something is going to come soon so we should watch that Twitter feed. But I do think the administration is trying to figure out what to do. It has followed this path of being pretty provocative in response to what North Korea does.
And there's clearly pressure from the secretary of state as well as Secretary Mattis to think through a more diplomatic track at this point because the other isn't working. So, some of the silence might be some thinking and some of it might just be waiting and we are going to see a flurry of responses in the next few hours.
PAUL: Sarah, we keep hearing about diplomacy, that it has to be practiced here. Is there a political contingent in Washington that could sit down with Pyongyang?
SARAH WESTWOOD, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "WASHINGTON EXAMINER": Well, I think when we hear about diplomacy, when we heard Defense Secretary Mattis talked about it earlier this week, he made it clear that a dialogue is not the only diplomatic tool at the U.S.' disposal.
And it's one that Washington wouldn't pursue unless North Korea was being less provocative and scaling back its nuclear test, missile test, and provocative activity and that's not what we are seeing happen.
The other diplomatic tools that Mattis described includes economic sanctions pressuring some of the countries that do deal directly with North Korea like China is the primary one to enforce these sanctions more strictly.
Those are the types of things that we might see the U.S. focused on given that the conditions that Washington has played out for is diplomatic dialogue to take place have not been met and are actually North Korea is moving farther away from those. WHITFIELD: So you have, Julian, these conflicting messages from the administration. First, President Trump tweets out on Thursday that talking is not the answer. Then on Friday, as you both have referenced, Secretary Mattis -- let's play what Secretary Mattis said, if we have it available.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are we out of diplomatic solutions for North Korea?
JAMES MATTIS, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: No. Here in Washington, we are keenly aware that South Korea is on the front line and we are not complacent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: So, not out of diplomatic solutions. Julian, is this coordinated good cop/bad cop or do you have a president who may be off the page, or this secretary of defense who refutes what the president asserts?
ZELIZER: Look, I think it's both. I think with President Trump, everything is not so calculated. I do think he goes back and forth on many issues and allows different members of his administration to say different things.
But historically, this is what administrations will do on many foreign policy crises. They will send out both messages. This is the whole motto of peace through strength under Ronald Reagan, we will be tough and use use military force but also keep the door open for diplomacy.
[06:10:11] What is very important is that North Korea keeps isolating itself and if President Trump intervenes in the wrong way as he did I think in August by making himself part of the story, he undermines that.
If he allows North Korea to do the talking, part of what happens is internationally, they become more and more isolated and that actually creates opportunities for international dialogue.
PAUL: Sarah, with that said, do you get the sense that this is, on some level, an ego competition between both leaders?
WESTWOOD: Well, I think that is the case always when you have Kim Jong-un who is someone whose public image is very central to his power. So that is always going to be the case when Kim Jong-un is facing off against any leader.
And I do agree, I think the administration has a coherent strategy when it comes to North Korea, a basic framework for it, if you will, that military option is the last option that the Washington wants to pursue that first and foremost, they would like to just negotiate, if North Korea can meet a certain set of conditions.
What the administration has not agreed on is how to you talk about it because President Trump is out there making these vague, but very strong, threats that have sort of unsettled the international community a little bit.
And Jim Mattis is bringing the temperature down a little bit, but doesn't change the underling strategy and I think that is important to remember whenever we see President Trump say that he is surrounded by people who do have more or less a clear idea of what they want to do to contain North Korea.
BLACKWELL: All right. Julian Zelizer and Sarah Westwood, thank you both for being a part of the conversation.
All right. So, you'll remember, the president saying that he is a bad or sick guy, that is President Trump talking about President Obama, accusing him of wiretapping Trump Tower.
PAUL: The Department of Justice says there is no proof that it ever happened, though. Is the damage already done? We are going to talk about that.
Also, President Trump says the decision is coming Tuesday regarding protections for young undocumented immigrants. Will the president scrap the DREAMER Program or follow the advice from several GOP colleagues to leave it intact?
PAUL: We have breaking news this hour as things seem to be developing between North Korea and the U.S. North Korea is claiming to have had, quote, "perfect success" in testing a hydrogen bomb overnight. This is fourth intercontinental ballistic missile. I want to show you some of pictures of North Korean Leader Kim Jong-un right after the test.
BLACKWELL: This is Pyongyang's sixth test of a nuclear weapon the first since President Trump took office. Japan says the tremors caused by the test were at least 10 times more powerful than the last test. We'll get back to that breaking news in just a moment.
But now let's turn to the Justice Department saying that it has found zero evidence that former President Obama wiretapped Trump Tower despite the accusations of President Trump in a filing the DOJ writes this.
Quote, "The FBI and National Security Division confirm that they have no records related to wiretaps as described by the March 4, 2017 tweets." Those tweets back in March, here is one of them.
"Terrible. Just found out that Obama had my "wires tapped" in Trump Tower just before the victory. Nothing found. This is McCarthyism."
All right. Here now CNN national security analyst, Shawn Turner. Shawn, good morning to you. I wonder, I mean, does this go the way of birther claim 3 million to 5 million people voted illegally. I saw thousands of people cheering on a roof on 9/11 and millions of dollars on a pallet headed to Iran? Just outright logic with no consequence.
SHAWN TURNER, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: You know, unfortunately, it looks that way, Victor. You know, what this report does if you recall back in March when the president sent this tweet it wasn't senior intelligence officials who said that this was baseless.
But it was also senior Republicans, you know, you had Devin Nunez, Congressman Ryan, and others come out and say that there was no evidence that this happened. So, I think this really does kind of go in that category of another baseless claim that the president has made.
And it's really unfortunate because this is one that is particularly egregious from my perspective with regard to its implications for national security.
BLACKWELL: So let's talk about that because you have concerns about how this will impact the intelligence relationship between the U.S. and the U.K. Specifically, you point to the news conference in which former Press Secretary Sean Spicer tried to defend it and put it on the GCHQ.
TURNER: That's right. You know, if you recall, Sean Spicer stood at the podium and talked about some anonymous sources that suggested that the former president had conspired with British intelligence sources. The GCHQ to wire-tap Trump Tower.
Now for so many reasons that is problematic. First of all, I mean, the current president would have been breaking the law if he had done that. We don't spy on U.S. citizens.
But more importantly, what something like that does, it sends a chilling affect -- this sends a real chill through the relationship, the intelligence sharing relationship that we have with our partners and allies.
So, you know, what the president has to understand is that right now, our national security needs really should not be impacted by this kind of baseless claim.
BLACKWELL: All right. Shawn Turner, thanks so much for being with us this morning.
TURNER: Thanks, Richard.
PAUL: As we follow the breaking news out of North Korea and their latest nuclear test claim, we have reaction from Seoul, South Korea.
PAUL: So grateful to have your company here on this Sunday as we follow this breaking news out of North Korea. It is showing its most powerful and most provocative nuclear test yet. BLACKWELL: And the regime is calling today's hydrogen bomb test a perfect success and also claiming the bomb is capable of being launched on an intercontinental ballistic missile. That was proved to be really a major development.
PAUL: At this point, yes, this is the regime's sixth nuclear test. A Norway-based monitoring group estimated the blast at 120 kilotons. It's a massive upgrade from earlier tests that we've seen there.
We have our correspondents standing by around the world. But was does provocative new test means and what comes next? Christiane Amanpour there you see with us. Paula Hancocks is in Seoul, South Korea.
Paula, want to start with you if we could please, where the president there is talking about this this morning. What is the reaction there?
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Christi and Victor, let me give you an update, first of all, we are getting new information now from the Korea Meteorological Agency.
They say that they believed that it was 50 kilotons as opposed to 120 kilotons, which you are hearing from (inaudible) we are trying to figure out exactly which figure is correct.
[06:25:08] Even if it's 50 kilotons that is significantly larger than what we saw in September of last year. That was 10 kilotons so clearly North Korea making some improvements.
Now we know that from the Defense Ministry point of view here in South Korea, they are saying that whatever happens now, the responsibility lies on North Korea. We know the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff in the U.S., General Joseph Dunford, has spoken twice on the phone to his South Korean counterpart.
They said that they are going to prepare and execute combined military measures as soon as possible. What could that be? Potentially that could be a show of force. We've seen B-1B bombers flying over the peninsula before as recently as last week.
It's difficult to see what they could do beyond that, whether they will have extra military assets coming into the region. That certainly what the South Korean President Moon Jae-in wants.
He has said that he wants extra assets what they will be, we will have to wait and see. We are trying to get some clarification from the U.S. side, but he has had a strong response in the national security meeting this morning.
This is a quote from Moon Jae-in himself saying North Korea made an absurd strategic mistake that will further isolate it from the international community. This from the man who came to power saying he wanted dialogue with North Korea.
But, clearly, this is putting him, putting the region in a very difficult situation. So, we will have to wait and see what kind of military measures we will see from the U.S. and South Korea. PAUL: All right. Paula Hancocks, thank you so much for the update.
BLACKWELL: All right. Joining us is CNN chief international correspondent, Christiane Amanpour. Christiane, it's been about 90 minutes since we've talked with you. So, I want you to just frame the conversation for us.
Because if as we've discussed earlier, this nuclear program for Kim is about self-preservation. The challenge for the rest of the world is to try to convince him to abandon something he equates with survival.
CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. The challenge is a very real one, but the most important thing to keep in mind, especially for you all over in the United States, is that the key development today is not just in the nuclear realm.
It's in the fact that they say it's a militarized warhead that they have successfully tested in order to be able to put it on an ICBM that intercontinental ballistic missile, which they have also been testing and trying to perfect.
That means it could reach the United States. That puts a whole different amount of pressure, a whole different context in this development for the U.S. To that end, what happens next?
U.S. officials who have been talking and engaging with the most important North Korean officials believe that they have no interest in denuclearization. You know, what was always the basis of the sanctions, of the engagement, of the whole sort of strategic context around so-called six-party talks in North Korea, denuclearize the Korean Peninsula.
But the North Koreans have been telling their American (inaudible), no, we are not doing that. This is our final deterrent. We want assurance that our regime survives and there is no regime change in the offing, that our country survives, that we are taken as serious international partner that is now a nuclear power.
They want to improve their economy. So, all of those things is what they want according to former U.S. Defense Secretary William Perry according to former CIA analyst the latest and last to talk to significant North Korean officials in Sweden just this past June in an attempt to see what it might take to restart negotiations and walk back from this brink.
So, they want to use it because they don't want any kind of regime change so has is really the main thing. Now the U.S., which is wanting to engage China and all the rest, needs to persuade China that reining in North Korea does not mean regime change in Pyongyang because China, as we've seen, has been reluctant to put the kind of pressure on North Korea that only it can.
Why? Not because of the fear of North Korea collapsing and tens of millions if not more North Koreans flooding into China and destabilizing the region, China, but also because China doesn't want to lose its buffer. North Korea's buffer between China and U.S. military force in the region, South Korea, Japan, et cetera. So, there really needs to be a meeting of the minds between all of these powers to decide how with one voice to rein in North Korea.
PAUL: Often times, Christiane, we look back at history to see what has worked and hasn't worked and an ability to look forward. But there has not been, as you pointed out -- I'd love your take on this -- it seems a consistent strategy from the U.S. when it comes to North Korea.
How do we set a consistent strategy, especially with Kim Jong-un who is very different to deal with than his father?
AMANPOUR: Yes. And his grandfather as well because the grandfather, Kim Il-sung, was the founder of the Kim dynasty and he actually was moving towards the whole sort of nuclear issue and the Clinton administration, Bill Clinton in the '90s, they engaged finally when there was -- you know, it came to a very, very tense moment in the mid '90s and they engaged -- and they came up with an agreement and that worked to an extent for a period of years.
And then George W. Bush's administration started, in 2000 and 2001 by basically ditching all of that and trying to be really tough guys and confronting North Korea and that resulted in exactly the opposite effect because it meant North Korea pulling out of the nuclear nonproliferation treaty, kicking out the U.N. inspectors and IAEA nuclear inspectors and therefore no eyes on North Korea while they sort of galloped ahead with their nuclear program.
In the second administration, the second term of the George W. Bush administration they reversed course and they did actually engage. And we all went to North Korea and there was, you know, cultural diplomacy along with nuclear diplomacy and that also achieved a halt of their known nuclear program at the time, the plutonium reactor at Yongbyon which is outside Pyongyang, the capital.
So that worked a while and the U.S., you know, made reciprocal steps. It wasn't all carrot. It was carrot and stick.
Then that fell apart when, among other things, Kim Jong-il died and then Kim Jong-un became the leader and there were no really meaningful negotiations, certainly no bilateral negotiations and, instead, they raced ahead with their program so that's where we are now. And, you know, just about most senior and serious players don't believe that the option is any longer on the table for them to give up their nuclear capacity.
The question is how do you deal with it? How do you contain it? And how do you somehow at some point, you know, perhaps after a period of sort of cooling off get around with your allies a coherent strategy to engage in some kind of, you know, of detente, of trying to rein it in?
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Christiane, what is the role of personal legacy here? Kim Jong-un inherited this role as a very young man when his father died. He is likely trying to establish his legacy in the shadow of his grandfather and father.
What is the role did that plays in the ambition of this nuclear warhead?
AMANPOUR: Well, you know, it's really hard because -- hard to know because Kim Jong-un has not engaged internationally in the same way that Kim Jong-il did. You know, it was limited but nonetheless he engaged with various international powers including importantly with the Chinese leadership so did, obviously, his father Kim Il-sung, the founder who actually met the former U.S. president at the time Jimmy Carter, and that led to a range of improvements in terms of trying to limit the damage from their nuclear program.
Kim Jong-un has been completely different. He hasn't gone to Beijing. He hasn't met with the Chinese leadership.
He hasn't met with any other leadership as far as we know around the world either. And he also has got this incredibly ruthless streak that he has been very careful to sort of develop into this savage cult (ph) of (ph) personality.
The machine gunning of family members who he decided were opponents. The VX nerve gassing of his own brother, half brother in that airport, in Malaysia, I think it was. And really sort of knocking off all the opposition while at the same time racing towards this nuclear ambition.
Having said that, those who have engaged William Perry, former defense secretary, they don't believe that he is suicidal. He may be volatile, he may be determined to have his nuclear program, he may blunder into a miscommunication, a misinterpretation of what U.S. strategy is or whatever it might be but they don't believe they want to start a nuclear war.
BLACKWELL: All right. Christiane Amanpour joining us from London. Christiane, thank you so much.
PAUL: And with all this news I don't know if you remember that today is a national day for prayer for those affected by Hurricane Harvey.
President Trump made the declaration from the Oval Office on Friday along with faith leader and representatives from the Red Cross and Salvation Army.
BLACKWELL: So far 53 people, the number just updated this morning have died in Houston in that area alone and thousands more displaced.
The president and first lady met with storm survivors in Texas and Louisiana yesterday. They also met with local and state officials and pledged billions of dollars from the government to help rebuild.
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SEN. TED CRUZ (R), TEXAS: I've been working to help coordinator and connect city officials and county officials with state official and federal officials to ensure that the assistance that is entitled under federal law is delivered. And I'm confident when Congress returns next week that we are going to see widespread bipartisan agreement on providing very substantial assistance to the people of Texas.
And the president has given his unequivocal and strong support that he is going to have our back. And I and every other Texan are very grateful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BLACKWELL: Texas Senator Ted Cruz there saying that some neighborhoods will also be under water for weeks and it could take years to completely rebuild.
PAUL: All right. Well, a lot of people are looking ahead to Tuesday. The White House saying that is when a decision will come regarding the DACA program.
The question is, will the president scrap that "Dreamer" program for young undocumented immigrants? Or is he going to give the power to Congress to try to change it? We are talking to two people who could be affected by this decision.
BLACKWELL: The breaking new this morning.
North Korea launching and testing its most powerful and provocative nuclear element yet. The regime is calling today's hydrogen bomb test a perfect success. They're also claiming the bomb is capable of being launched on an intercontinental ballistic missile and that would prove to be a major development.
PAUL: Well, voices in the GOP stepping up, voices support for DACA. That's the program that offers protection for young undocumented immigrants.
House Speaker Paul Ryan says that the president should leave it alone and allow Congress to fix it. Senator Jeff Flake said Congress must -- quote -- "take action to protect DACA kids."
The White House said the final decision on whether to scrap the program will be decided and announced on Tuesday. So let's talk about this with people who could really be affected by the changes to this program.
Jessica Stern is immigration attorney and two beneficiaries of the program, Jose and Alma Piedra are with us. Thank you all so much for being here.
Jose, help us understand what is going through your mind as you wait for this decision from the president.
JOSE PIEDRA, PROTECTED BY DREAM ACT: You know, it's kind of a rough decision because I was very thankful that President Obama, he gave us a chance to be here.
PAUL: When did you come to America?
JOSE PIEDRA: I came when I was 13 years old.
PAUL: You were 13?
JOSE PIEDRA: Yes.
PAUL: So you've been here for how long?
JOSE PIEDRA: Seventeen years.
PAUL: OK. And do you remember much about where you came from in the differences in your life?
JOSE PIEDRA: I still remember a little bit because, you know, I was a child, but, you know, I've been here my whole life so, yes. I mean, it's different.
PAUL: Alma, what about you? When were you brought to the U.S.?
ALMA PIEDRA, PROTECTED BY THE DREAM ACT: I was brought here when I was 6. It was -- I don't have any memory of, you know, where I'm from. And it's kind of, you know, surreal to be thinking about the fact that we might end up where we came from and it's foreign to me.
PAUL: Where would you go? If you are forced out, where would you go?
ALMA PIEDRA: Mexico.
PAUL: To Mexico?
ALMA PIEDRA: Yes.
PAUL: Do you have family there that you know?
ALMA PIEDRA: Barely. It's very -- I mean, small.
PAUL: So your family is all here --
ALMA PIEDRA: Yes.
PAUL: -- and this is all you know?
ALMA PIEDRA: This is all I know.
JESSICA STERN, IMMIGRATION ATTORNEY: (INAUDIBLE) they went to Carrollton High School. They pledge allegiance to the flag every single morning since, you know, elementary, middle school, high school.
And these kids identify -- young people identify as Americans and it's going to be really difficult to strip them and 800,000 others of the ability to live a life like their friend that they grew up, like neighbors, kid that grew up with them. And they have been able to work and be a part of society, and if Donald Trump takes that away and the president changes the policy, that's going to leave them and so many others without the ability to live here.
PAUL: Is there any -- is there any recourse for them? Is there any appeal that would go out immediately? From an attorney standpoint, do you have a plan if the president comes out and says I'm scrapping this?
STERN: Yes. And the plan would be to prepare everyone to be able to fight a case if there was some sort of deportation proceeding because, ultimately, if the president changes this, it would make Alma and Jose and so many other deportable again. And so we would need to protect them from that and go to the lawmaker and make sure they are making some actual legislation to protect the "Dreamers."
PAUL: OK. And real quickly, Alma, what is your family saying about this? What conversations are you having?
ALMA PIEDRA: The conversations that we are basically having is like, what are we going to do? We have nothing.
We have with a home here. We have -- I want to be a nurse. I want to do things here and it's crazy how to even think that that could be taken away.
Like he said I'm very thankful also that we have this opportunity, but it's a scary thought.
PAUL: OK. Well, thank you.
I'm sorry we have run out of time. We are so glad that you came in to talk to us. We will be watching this on Tuesday along with you as well and wishing you and your families best of luck.
ALMA PIEDRA: Thank you.
JOSE PIEDRA: Thank you.
PAUL: Jessica, thank you as well.
STERN: Thank you. Victor --
BLACKWELL: All right. The breaking news.
North Korea announcing its most powerful and most provocative nuclear test yet. What can the tremors caused by this test tell us about the power of the blast?
CNN's meteorologist Allison Chinchar joins us live.
ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: That's right.
And how does this tremor compare to some of the tremors of the past in North Korea? We will also break down the difference between this to artificial type of earthquake versus your more traditional geological type of earthquakes.
PAUL: Breaking news this hour. North Korea claiming this morning that they -- quote -- "had perfect success in testing a hydrogen bomb overnight that is designed to fit its intercontinental ballistic missile."
BLACKWELL: This morning, China is urging Pyongyang to -- quote -- "stop taking wrong actions." But China also says it started emergency monitoring for radiation along its border with North Korea.
PAUL: Now the tremor caused by this test we are told were 10 times stronger than the previous nuclear test.
BLACKWELL: For more on the geological readings let's go now to CNN meteorologist Allison Chinchar.
This one is supposed to be much stronger than the last?
CHINCHAR: And a hundred times stronger than the original 4.3. So it's important to understand the scale, OK?
So the earthquake from this morning was a magnitude 6.3, OK? Now the one from last year, September of last year, was a 5.3 and in term of magnitude you're talking a one-point difference but in terms of strength, it's 10 times stronger the one that we just had.
Now comparing it to the one back in October of 2006, 11 years ago, which was a 4.3, a 6.3 from today is 100 times stronger, OK? Even though it may only be a 2.0 difference on the actual magnitude. All right?
So the other thing is when you start getting earthquakes especially of that scale 6.3, in the Korean peninsula our first thought -- a lot of red flags go off but this is more likely an artificial quake. Here's why.
These are the major fault lines, these red lines that you see here. The Korean peninsula well to the west because it doesn't necessarily fall on a major fault line that's a big indicator that it's likely an artificial rather than a geological type of earthquake the ones you typically have in Japan, California, Alaska, OK?
The other thing that raises some red flags is the depth. Earthquake this morning was a 6.3 magnitude with a depth of zero. Standard traditional type of earthquakes tend to have a depth of anywhere between 1.0 to even 100 kilo meters deep, OK? Because they are initiated underground.
That's what a geological earthquake is. This one was different. Now the other thing too to mention only 8 1/2 minutes after that initial quake we had a secondary one, guys, that was a 4.1, OK?
Keep in mind that is 100 -- over 150 times weaker than the initial one, OK? Even though we're talking only a difference of a 6.3 versus a 4.1. The depth of that one also zero kilometers.
Victor and Christi, what was likely taking place for this second one the national -- or the U.S. Geological Survey is estimating that it was probably likely some type of structural collapse triggered from the initial quake.
BLACKWELL: All right. Allison Chinchar, thank you so much.
The U.S. is counting on the THAAD, anti -- a missile defense system to protect Guam and Hawaii from any North Korean missiles.
PAUL: Yes. But much closer to Pyongyang we've got of course South Korea. And there's concern over how useful that system may be because it likely cannot protect the country's biggest cities.
Here is CNN's Anna Coren.
ANNA COREN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Fighting missiles with missiles to protect America and its allies. It's a defensive strategy based on THAAD or the Terminal High Altitude Area Defense system. It's designed to shoot down incoming short, medium and intermediate range missiles, exactly the type of weapons North Korea says it has.
So how does THAAD work? First, if uses radar to detect incoming missiles. Then an interceptor missile will be fired from a truck mounted launcher to destroy the incoming threat mid air.
Last month the U.S. said it tested THAAD and shot down a target over Alaska. The system has been in place several years in the U.S. states of Hawaii and territory of Guam both of which North Korea has threatened.
(on camera): U.S. officials say a North Korean missile would take just 14 minutes to reach the territory of Guam where thousands of U.S. military personnel and assets are based.
(voice-over): THAAD along with nearby warships equipped with another missile defense system called Aegis would play a critical role in defending the island.
In South Korea there's criticism over how useful THAAD can really be. In theory it could shoot down North Korean missiles aimed at several areas of the country which include key military and ammunition bases.
(on camera): But that can't protect the 10 million people here in South Korea's capital. Seoul is less than 60 kilometers from the border with the north which means that it is vulnerable to shorter range missile attack.
(voice-over): China and Russia have consistently criticized the deployment of the U.S. anti-missile systems seeing them as a threat to their own military capabilities and saying that an American military buildup in Asia will only increase tensions.
(on camera): Adding to the increasingly dramatic war of words between the United States and North Korea. Anna Coren, CNN, Seoul.
BLACKWELL: You have likely seen every time North Korea has announced a nuclear test or missile launch, we are talking about North Korean television anchor Ri Chun-hee. She delivers government propaganda on state T.V., re-announced the nuclear test today.
PAUL: Now she's one of the North Korea's most familiar faces. Yes, she's been on the airwaves of the country's only television channel for more than 40 years and the public face of everything from missile tests to satellite launches.
But one of her defining moments was in 1994. She went her way through the announcement that supreme leader Kim Il-sung had died.
BLACKWELL: Well, her tips for aspiring anchors she offered those a reporter in China on Chinese television.
Develop your own personal style, that's a good one, and make sure you mix up your tone depending on the situation.
PAUL: In other words, know what you're talking about --
BLACKWELL: Yes, that's true.
PAUL: -- and convey it properly.
BLACKWELL: That is probably the best advice but something there from Ri Chun-hee.
All right. Coming up on NEW DAY an international reaction to North Korea's latest nuclear test. North Korea is calling it the final step in attaining what it's calling a state nuclear force. South Korea calls it absurd strategic mistake.
NEW DAY continues after a break.
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
PAUL: So grateful to have you with us here to our viewers here in the U.S. and around the world. I'm Christi Paul.
BLACKWELL: I'm Victor Blackwell. Good morning to you. And new developments in the breaking news. Russia is now calling for the strongest condemnation of North Korea after it has announced its powerful and most provocative nuclear test yet.
PAUL: Yes. The regime calling today's hydrogen bomb test a -- quote -- "perfect success" -- North Korea saying that.