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Crime and Justice With Ashleigh Banfield

Caught on Video; Shocking Video. Aired 8:30-9p ET

Aired September 20, 2017 - 20:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ASHLEIGH BANFIELD, HOST (voice-over): His idol was a notorious serial killer.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The idol John Wayne Gacy...

BANFIELD: Was Nathaniel Sebastian just as sick?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Postings on his Facebook that were quotations of Gacy..

BANFIELD: The victim, his own mother.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This has all been a three-ring circus.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I love my mother.

BANFIELD: The hiding place for her body? Her own front porch.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You could see him getting nervous when they started taking the latticework down around the porch.

BANFIELD: But was it his fascination with the serial killing clown...

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When they (INAUDIBLE) that I was this monster...

BANFIELD: ... that may land him a date with death.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is ludicrous.

BANFIELD: Talk about being stabbed in the back.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It`s not something we recommend.

BANFIELD: A good Samaritan stops an armed robber from ripping off a Starbucks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He`s a hero.

BANFIELD: And for his heroics, he`s stabbed in the neck and could have died.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He very well could have.

BANFIELD: Now the accused robber is planning to sue the good guy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He has 17 total stab wounds, lacerations and defensive wounds.

BANFIELD: He says that hero went too far and put him in the hospital for days.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The guy, in my opinion, went from a good Samaritan to a vigilante.

BANFIELD: Which begs the question -- are you kidding me?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That is ludicrous.

BANFIELD: It`s gone viral for a reason, a jaw-dropping video of a woman berating a war vet and his service dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

BANFIELD: That veteran fought for her freedom and now has PTSD.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s alive because he fought for our country!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Congratulations!

BANFIELD: But she won`t sacrifice her God-given right to the buffet...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE)

BANFIELD: ... choosing to hurl insults...

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are (EXPLETIVE DELETED).

BANFIELD: ... after insult.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Until the whore (ph) behind you stopped me, I was happily moving (INAUDIBLE)

BANFIELD: Perhaps the Internet will teach her what it means to be a patriot when she poisons everyone`s Facebook feed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You`re a liar (EXPLETIVE DELETED)!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: Hello, everyone. I`m Ashleigh Banfield.

Call it a sign of the times that used to be you would never see an investigation and the discovery of a body and an arrest all playing out in

real time on video just like an episode of "Law & Order." But near Mobile, Alabama, a virtual movie seemed to be shooting in the front yard of a quiet

little house where Susan Mayo (ph) lived with her son, Nathaniel. And the key word here is "lived," past tense, because that house is also where

Susan Mayo died and where her body lay rotting for months jammed into a 55- gallon barrel buried three feet under the porch.

And she might have stayed that way forever, too, were it not for her son Sebastian`s fixation with a psychotic serial killer named John Wayne Gacy.

Remember that fellow who dressed like a clown, raped and murdered his victims before burying them all under the house back in the `70s? And if

police have it right, Nathaniel idolized Gacy. And that`s why they brought cadaver dogs and a shovel to his house before hitting on that barrel that

contained Susan Mayo.

Who knows if the neighbors had any idea what was in that barrel that they rolled out onto the front lawn. Who knows if the neighbors could actually

smell what it was that sickened the officers so much, they had to walk away after they pried open that barrel.

But one thing is certain. Those neighbors were treated to one hell of a show, the immediate arrest of Nathaniel Sebastian right there, cuffed,

patted down and put into the back of the cruiser. Probably what you cannot see right here in this incredible Mobile County sheriff`s office video is

that somewhere on his person, maybe even in his mouth, right at this moment he`s hiding something, a hand-made handcuff key. Police say ultimately,

they did find it. It was in Nathaniel`s mouth. They caught it there while they were booking him into the jail. They promptly confiscated that key.

So here`s Nathaniel doing what we call a perp walk in the business. He`s being peppered with questions from reporters.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: They said that you confessed. Did you confess? Did you kill your mother?

NATHANIEL SEBASTIAN, ACCUSED OF MURDER: No comment.

QUESTION: How did you know she was under the porch?

SEBASTIAN: No comment.

QUESTION: You don`t have anything to say in defense of yourself? I mean, they`re calling you a monster, killed your mother, put her under the porch.

SEBASTIAN: I love my mother.

QUESTION: What happened?

QUESTION: Why are you being arrested?

SEBASTIAN: No comment.

QUESTION: You`re not even bothered by the the fact that your mother was found today?

SEBASTIAN: No.

QUESTION: You`re not bothered by that?

SEBASTIAN: Uh-uh.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: If it seems like he was kind of mumbling, he may have been because the key was supposedly in his mouth. And if all of this isn`t

weird enough, that`s his granny. That`s Nathaniel`s grandmother. Just to be clear, that`s the victim`s mother, Doris Clark (ph), who was cuffed and

booked right alongside her grandson. Police say that Doris wasn`t so worried about her daughter`s rotting corpse under the porch. They say that

she just didn`t want her grandson to be rotting in a prison. And then they say she obstructed their investigation because of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: Did you know that he killed your daughter?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, I didn`t know anything.

QUESTION: Did you know she was buried underneath the home?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Of course not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: OK. So that`s a lot to digest. Captain Paul Burch is with the Mobile County sheriff`s office. He was there when Nathaniel Sebastian was

arrested. He saw that all without a lens. He was right there to witness everything. He joins me live from Mobile.

Captain Burch, this has been sort of an astounding crime to see play out. And then we start to learn other details that seem a bit jaw-dropping. Is

it true that this young man actually told investigators that he did this to his mother because his mother ran off his girlfriend?

CAPTAIN PAUL BURCH, MOBILE COUNTY SHERIFF`S OFFICE (via telephone): Well, that was part of his reasoning, that there was a, I guess, violent history

between the two, but his primary reason for the escalation of violence was because she ran off his girlfriend.

BANFIELD: So the girlfriend has said that there was not only a violent relationship between the two, but that she was worried. I mean, she was

concerned about this. Do you have a lot of details about what kind of violence happened between Mom and son before Mom died?

BURCH: Oh, yes. It was verbal and physical. We learned through the investigation that Nathaniel had an extremely violent history and would get

quickly angered over just minuscule things.

BANFIELD: So that girlfriend`s father, I think, highlights a lot of what you say, Captain. His name`s Bobby Williams (ph). And of course, the

girlfriend is an ex-girlfriend now. So this is that ex-girlfriend`s dad talking about what he says is a very violent past and a very violent

personality when it comes to Nathaniel Sebastian. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They both had it, both at this side of the window (INAUDIBLE) You can tell where a hammer mark printed right here. He showed

up at my house several times like that, throwing rocks at the house. Basically, it`s like saying, you know, I`m fixing to get rid of her or

whatever, you know. That`s the way I took it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So I want to reiterate that this, you know, alleged murderer, his ex-girlfriend`s dad knew him and knew his characteristics and had more

to say about whether he thought that that young man could actually be the person who would kill his mom. And this is how Bobby Williams phrased it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I believe he could have. I really do. He said several things about, you know, how we like to -- he would like to do things, you

know, hurt her and things like that because they always had arguments and fights and stuff. So I mean, I don`t know how else to express, but I`m

hoping maybe they`re just going to keep him there. You know, I mean, they really need to get him some help. They really do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: So Captain, about this violent tendency, there are reports that Nathaniel Sebastian was arrested last year because he had harassed the

family of his ex, that exact man who was quoted, Bobby Williams. Do you know the details about that, what he did?

BURCH: Yes, like I say, he would continually harass them. He mailed them some mail and Facebook posts with John Gacy photos and quotes, you know.

And we say his ex-girlfriend, but this is -- you know, he`s 32 years old. This is his one and only girlfriend that he`s ever had. You know, he`s

lived home with Mama his whole life, and, you know, we believe that`s why he was so fixated on her. But he just bombarded them with a variety of

harassing communications, being electronic or actual letters.

BANFIELD: Is it true that he tried to run over members of his girlfriend`s family?

BURCH: He did. He attempted to run over them. He`s damaged their vehicles, sent threatening messages, just, you know, wouldn`t go away.

BANFIELD: So one of the neighbors who lived nearby said that they were just sort of stunned. You hear this a lot. You know, a neighbor who sees

all of you show up and what we just witnessed, that whole unearthing of the barrel coffin and the arrest of Nathaniel. The neighbors were slightly

surprised. This is at least how one of them put it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: To think she`s been here all this time, and we didn`t even know. It is sad. But I`m glad -- I`m so thankful. I`m praising God

that they -- that it`s over now and she can at least get a decent burial now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: You know, Captain, I don` know if the neighbors knew much about what was going on in this house, but we`re told that -- that one of

Nathaniel`s brothers -- I`m not sure if he has others -- but certainly, one brother decided two years ago he had enough, and he moved away because he

was -- and I`m going to quote here -- extremely fearful of Nathaniel. What do you know about that?

BURCH: Yes, it`s a younger brother, and he is extremely fearful of Nathaniel. And he left because of some of the violence between Susan and

Nathaniel, as well as violence from Nathaniel toward the younger brother. I will say, during one of the interviews with the younger brother, he

literally chewed his fingernail off, he was so fearful of talking with us about Nathaniel.

BANFIELD: It just sounds so disturbing. There were a few other things we found very disturbing about Nathaniel Sebastian, and it has to do with

animals. This is something we hear often in stories of violence and in stories of troubled individuals, that Nathaniel would often kill animals

for fun. And I want to just play this, a very strange bit of tape of Nathaniel that was posted about cooking a snake for dinner. Have a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Tonight, snake is what to eat! Tonight, snake is what to eat!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That just sort of gives me the chills. It`s just so unusual. I don`t think it`s unusual perhaps to eat snake. I just think how that`s

presented, Captain, is frightening. It`s not what most people would consider typical behavior. And of course, that leads to this question. Do

you think that there are other potential victims of Nathaniel Sebastian, other than his mother?

BURCH: I`ll say that we are looking into that possibility. There are some things on his computer that we`re interested in, in that realm. There`s

also a suspicious death of an infant sibling of Nathaniel`s that died while in his care a number of years ago.

BANFIELD: What do you know about that?

BURCH: Well, it was worked by another agency. We`re working to get copies of those reports and looking into that case.

BANFIELD: This is an infant who was much younger than he was, or was he young at the time? I mean, what...

BURCH: Yes.

BANFIELD: ... what timeframe are we talking about here? He`s 32 years old.

BURCH: Yes, it was a number of years ago. I don`t recall the year, but he was an adult, a young adult. But again, I don`t know the year, but you

know, it was a suspicious death.

BANFIELD: And is it an open file, or was that case closed?

BURCH: Well, again, it`s not our -- it was worked by another agency. We`re currently trying to get our hands on those reports.

BANFIELD: Can I ask you if you`re going to be looking to exhume the body of that infant?

BURCH: It would just be based what we find when we do at the reports, look at the autopsy that was performed, if any. And there`s certainly a

possibility. Just have to see where the investigation goes.

BANFIELD: You know, I just want to ask you another -- this is always difficult territory, but it`s critical territory given the fact that he

worshiped a man like John Wayne Gacy who was a serial rapist, who raped his victims, murdered his victims, at least 33 that we know of, buried many of

them under his home. And so to that end, do you think there is a sexual deviance piece to this crime or to this character or to this person?

BURCH: I believe there is. It`s based on some of his behavior. You know, I will say through the course of the investigation, we`ve been told of some

possible inappropriate behavior between a mother and son. So there`s a lot of different possibilities that we`re looking into.

BANFIELD: And do you have any idea of what kind of -- I mean, there`s one thing to talk about rumors down the street, and it`s another thing to have

direct evidence or things on -- you know, on a hard drive. Do you have any evidence?

BURCH: I mean, we obviously have obtained statements from people who are close to the family and are trying to flesh those out.

BANFIELD: Can you give me an idea and characterize those statements?

BURCH: Yes. To sum it up, you know, the best way, it would be to read between the lines. I mean, he`s lived at home with Mom, never had a

girlfriend. You know, he had allegations of an, you know, inappropriate relationship between those two as a possibility. And you know, Mama ran

the girlfriend off because she didn`t want her there. So you know, we`re just trying to still get those details out.

BANFIELD: Again, I -- you`ll have to forgive me the morbidity of this, but we are told that there was a sex assault kit done on Susan Mayo`s cadaver.

I can`t imagine after months locked in -- or, you know, sealed into a barrel underground, the decomposition would have been extreme, but is that

true, there was this sex assault kit done?

BURCH: It was, but that is -- that`s routinely done in a homicide involving a female.

BANFIELD: One last question. Any truth to the fact that this young man, Nathaniel Sebastian, 32 years old, has a 6-month-old child with that ex-

girlfriend?

BURCH: Yes, he does.

BANFIELD: And what is the status in terms of -- does he know that that is his child? And what does the girlfriend want for that child going forward

in terms of who that child`s father is?

BURCH: Well, some of his behavior was wanting to see the child. And she is doing everything in her effort to stay away from him and keep the child

away from him, and reasonably so.

BANFIELD: It is just -- it`s just disturbing on so many fronts. Captain, you`ve -- I want to say you`ve got your work cut out for you, but I tend to

think you don`t. There`s so many comments that were made by Nathaniel Sebastian and so much red flag behavior. It`s -- this is going to be a

death penalty case, isn`t it, sir?

BURCH: That will ultimately be up to the district attorney`s office to make that determination. You know, right now, there aren`t any death

penalty charges that would jump out. There has to be an underlying element in the commission of a murder. You know, he did commit, you know, some

crimes, but it was after the fact. He, you know, said that he beat on her dead body several times out of anger after he killed her. You know, but

that`s after the fact. So unless we determine another felony that was committed in relation to the murder, then it would not meet the standard of

a death penalty case. But that`s ultimately up to the district attorney`s office.

BANFIELD: And I think you still have some investigating ahead of you, as well. Captain Paul Burch, thank you very much for being here tonight, and

thank you for all the details and being so candid.

BURCH: All right. Thank you.

BANFIELD: Captain Burch from the Mobile County sheriff`s office joining us live tonight.

A Fresno man was hailed a hero for taking down an armed robber at his local Starbucks. So you`d think it would end there. No, no. Now he`s the one

who might actually be sued for allegedly using too much force against the alleged robber. And this...

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m not going to (INAUDIBLE) myself. I`m going to (INAUDIBLE) Nothing!

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) nasty and there`s a dog. So what? What do you want to do about it?

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He`s alive because he fought for our country (INAUDIBLE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Congratulations!

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s the point?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That is a woman in Delaware going on a profanity-laced tirade at an Army veteran and his service dog. And for good measure, she called his

wife a whore. You will find out what else she said next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Playing dress-up can be a lot of fun if you`re a kid, but normally, if you see a grown-up wearing a mask and heading for a cash

register, it`s a good bet something`s about to go down. So when this fellow walked into a California Starbucks wearing a Transformers mask,

waving around a gun and a knife and a plastic bag and then started to demand money, I guess it`s no surprise that a good Samaritan decided to

step in and save the day. And he did. Wasn`t easy. Now, that good Samaritan got knifed in the neck, needed six staples to close that wound.

But robbery averted. Bad guy arrested.

Wouldn`t you know it that that good Samaritan is the one who actually may end up being sued because the guy in the mask got hurt. I`m going to wait

for you to sit down, maybe even get a bourbon for this one. I want to take you to the tape so you can see exactly how everything played out and you

can be Judge Judy.

On the right-hand side of your screen, you can see the good Samaritan, arrows pointing to him. He`s got his drink. And on the left, you can see

the man walks into the Starbucks, makes his way to the counter, pulls the gun out of the yellow bag, begins yelling at the barista, then to up the

ante, pulls out a knife, points that at the barista. Cut back to the front of the store, you can actually see a worker who`s on her phone calling the

police.

And our good Samaritan`s now heading for the counter armed with a chair. And he slams that chair over the back of the perp, knocking the mask off

his face, but the attempted robber doesn`t flee. He goes after the good Samaritan, fighting back with his knife. The battle intensifies. Customer

grabs him in what looks like a chokehold. They knock over a store display and some tables. It is really intense. Perp is stabbing wildly with that

knife, is taken down to the ground. He`s being punched over and over.

Oh, look at this. There`s the knife and it is coming straight for the good Samaritan`s neck. The struggle for both the knife and the gun continued.

At one point, you can see that customer wrestles away the knife and then begins using it on the alleged robber. Down for the count.

You should know that both of these men suffered serious injuries, OK? But when the smoke cleared and the cops arrived, it was Ryan Michael Flores,

the alleged robber, who ended up behind bars charged with some serious stuff, robbery, assault with a deadly weapon.

But that alleged robber`s mom and dad are mad that he got hurt by the good Samaritan, and they say they`re thinking of suing that good Samaritan, say

that, you know, using that chair and then stabbing their son with their son`s own knife -- well, they say that amounts to excessive force.

Aaron Abeytia is the afternoon anchor for KMJ newsradio, joins me from Fresno. So did I get all those facts right, Aaron, just to be clear

because it seems a bit crazy, so I want to make sure I`m right with all that. Am I?

AARON ABEYTIA, KMJ NEWS RADIO: You did. As strange as it sounds, that`s in fact what occurred.

BANFIELD: OK, so there`s got to be some back story, like the alleged robber`s got to some have story, a reason for all this to try to be a

little more sympathetic. What is it?

ABEYTIA: He does. He says that he at the time was high on Xanax. He didn`t have any money for his wife and child. So he drove around -- this

is almost on the outskirts of Fresno, highway 99 going through California`s major route. And so he said that he had contemplated holding up a gas

station, but he said that he didn`t feel right taking advantage of the owner of that gas station, so he saw a Starbucks and thought, Why not

Starbucks? It`s a corporation, nobody will be personally harmed.

BANFIELD: OK. So is there a little bit more to it? Because I think I read somewhere that he was high on meth and Xanax, which doesn`t give our

audience...

ABEYTIA: Methadone and Xanax.

BANFIELD: Or methadone. OK. SO doesn`t give our audience a lot of sympathy for him except when you hear the reason, because as I understand

it, he had originally had had a motorcycle accident...

ABEYTIA: Right.

BANFIELD: ... and because of the painkillers became an addict. The addiction led to being broke, wife and kid, no money, spends it all on

drugs, ends up robbing. Is that sort of the chain of events?

ABEYTIA: That`s what they`re saying, he and his parents.

BANFIELD: So did you see the video as I saw the video? Because it looked like when Ryan Michael Flores turned and, you know, got hit in the back

with the chair, he didn`t run. He didn`t run for the door. He actually went for the good Samaritan, Cregg Jerri.

ABEYTIA: Right. It looked as though he wanted a confrontation. I mean, I don`t know what exactly was going through his mind, but watching that, what

else could you think? I mean, he very much tried to retaliate and to continue the confrontation. And then at one point, he struck Mr. Jerri in

the neck.

BANFIELD: So let me bring in Paula Chiminienti because Paula Chiminienti is Ryan Michael Flores`s mom. She`s the mom of the man that you saw with

the mask and the gun and the knife. Pamela, you know, I feel sympathy when I hear somebody who becomes an addict because of an accident or because of

a football injury, and you know -- but I have a very tough time seeing someone menace a poor barista with a knife and a gun, and then sort of

turning and attacking the person who`s protecting her. And you think it`s the person who was protecting her who`s at fault here.

PAMELA CHIMINIENTI, MOTHER OF ALLEGED ROBBER: I`m not here to discuss what Ryan did. I`m here to -- what you`re discussing is the beginning of the

confrontation. My son was brutally and violently attacked when he was unarmed and stabbed 17 times and 16 while he was on the ground, on his

belly, his back. And the perpetrator of that not willingly at one point stopped -- because you haven`t seen the entire video. And what you`ve

shown your viewers is only the part of the robbery and when the good Samaritan...

BANFIELD: So I hear you. But I will say this, Pamela. I understand what you`re saying. If I were, you know, your son`s mom, I would be devastated,

too. But then you have to realize the good Samaritan saw a man with a knife and a gun robbing a place, and when he tried to stop it, he himself

was attacked. He himself got a knife to the neck, which is a lethal injury. And he ended up in a struggle for a gun and a knife.

By the way, the struggle for the gun on the floor was when your son was on his belly not giving up the gun that this Samaritan thought, Well, if I

took a knife to the neck a few seconds ago, I`m about to take a gun to the head. Can you not see where his mindset would be at?

CHIMINIENTI: I think your facts are incorrect on the gun...

BANFIELD: I`m looking at the video.

CHIMINIENTI: ... was plastic, and the good Samaritan knew it was a plastic gun.

BANFIELD: How does the good Samaritan know it was a plastic gun? I`m sorry?

CHIMIENTI: Because it was on the floor. The gun was already gone.

BANFIELD: So, OK, what about that knife? Was that plastic? Because it caused a knife wound to his neck.

(CROSSTALK)

CHIMIENTI: It couldn`t have been, Ashleigh, because the good Samaritan stabbed my son 17 times with it.

BANFIELD: Sure, but you know what I mean, right? Like, the good Samaritan took a knife to the neck which could be a lethal knife, and then they`re

struggling for those weapons on the floor, right? And you`re telling me that the gun -- you`re telling me that for sure the gun was fake? Because

you know that`s still a felony, right? You still go to prison if the gun is real or fake?

CHIMIENTI: Yes, we know. We know. But they don`t know -- there`s no for sure time or even how the injury occurred. It could have been while he was

wielding the knife at my son 17 times.

BANFIELD: So let me get this straight. Your son, if he is this sympathetic character that he says he is, you know, because he`s got this addiction,

he`s got a wife and kid he`s trying to support, he chose a Starbucks because it`s supposed to be a victimless crime. I don`t buy that. I think

crime is crime. That barista will never be the same.

She is now faced down what she thinks is a real gun and a very sharp knife and a man with a scary mask who she doesn`t know maybe has a laundry list

of felonies behind him and has no compunction whatsoever to use those those weapons against her. So, she never ran for those two exits.

And I`m going to show the video over and over so everybody can see there`s daylight to the right and there`s daylight to the left. He had two escape

routes he could have left the minute that chair hit him in the back, but he didn`t. He did not, Mrs. Chimienti. He instead went after the man who tried

to stop the robbery.

CHIMIENTI: He went for the one in the back.

BANFIELD: He didn`t. Look at the video.

CHIMIENTI: He went for the one in the back. The baristas actually thought it was a joke. She testified under oath. She thought her co-workers were

playing a joke on her. That`s why she`s laughing in the video. You can clearly see it.

BANFIELD: So, do you think that when she see blood gushing out of the man`s neck that it`s funny and that she`ll still get over it?

CHIMIENTI: Oh, no. Actually they had to bring in -- Starbucks brought in counselors for the baristas because of what they witnessed that man did to

my son.

BANFIELD: It has nothing to do with the robbery. The good Samaritan got a knife wound in his neck. Nothing like that? No?

CHIMIENTI: They had to bring people in because they were horrified what they saw, what he did to him. He took the (INAUDIBLE). He took the

(INAUDIBLE) in court.

BANFIELD: I know you`re not cemented in on the idea of a lawsuit, that you`re still considering it. But are you seriously considering suing that

good Samaritan who stopped the robbery, who stopped your son right there in the video from wielding a knife on anybody in that store?

CHIMIENTI: Not my choice.

BANFIELD: What`s not your choice, to file a lawsuit?

CHIMIENTI: Yes. I`m not going to be the one to file the lawsuit.

BANFIELD: Who is going to file the lawsuit then?

CHIMIENTI: Gee, who got injured, my son.

BANFIELD: So, your son is the one that wants to file the lawsuit?

CHIMIENTI: Yes.

BANFIELD: Not you. We were misinformed. We were told it was you.

CHIMIENTI: Before you put people and report stuff, do your homework. Get the facts right.

BANFIELD: I would say before you pick up a knife and a gun and put on a mask and menace society, do your homework. You could get hurt. Doesn`t that

make sense? Doesn`t it make sense that your damn son could have really have hurt somebody? Doesn`t it make sense that your son committed a crime?

Doesn`t it make sense that someone else tried to stop a crime and got seriously hurt and nearly died and you`re blaming him? Are you kidding me?

Are you seriously here saying you`re going to sue that man?

CHIMIENTI: Excessive force under any circumstances --

BANFIELD: Saving your own life from a knife wielding crazed man! You think that`s excessive force? I think the apple doesn`t fall far from the tree.

Good luck, Mrs. Chimienti, with your damn lawsuit. I hope you lose and the sheriff --

CHIMIENTI: I have no intention of suing --

BANFIELD: Wow, now I know where your son gets it. Some people! Coming up next, another one of these people. A woman going berserk when she sees a

veteran, a U.S. army veteran with PTSD and a service dog to help him. Gosh, couldn`t you imagine he brought that dog into a restaurant? How dare he?

The whole thing is caught on tape.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s disgusting to have an animal inside of a public restaurant. And --

(CROSSTALK)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[20:35:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: You know, our veterans don`t always get the respect and the gratitude that they really deserve. I know that once a year we honor the

millions of veterans across the country, but, you know, a lot of times the scars that are suffered by the veterans run very, very deep.

A lot of times the pain is visible, there`s a missing limb, a scar. But for a lot of other people, you don`t see the pain. A lot of hidden anguish,

PTSD, sometimes, and for treatment, service dogs have been unbelievable. And those animals can tag along anywhere that service member goes, even in

restaurants.

[20:40:00] But there was this one restaurant in Delaware and there was this one woman in that restaurant who just wasn`t having any of it, not at her

buffet. When she spotted a veteran`s service dog inside the restaurant, she completely lost it.

She even went so far as to call the veteran`s wife a whore, twice. Called his niece the "B" word. Mentioned that, what, mm, four times? All of it was

caught on video and she sure seemed proud.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m not going to excuse myself. I`m going to push it just like I did it. Nothing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s OK.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is nasty and there`s a dog. So what?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do you want to do about it? He`s alive because he fought for our country.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Congratulations. Congratulations.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s your point? That`s why he has a dog.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s nasty. I don`t care! It`s nasty to me, you bitch. It should be abstention.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What`s that --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shut up. Shut the (bleep) up.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop it. Stop it. Just stop it. Just stop it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I didn`t think so.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That`s enough.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I didn`t think so.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, hey.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nothing can shut the hell off me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, why don`t you just calm down for 30 seconds?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nothing can shut the hell off me.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, why don`t you just stop, stop, stop and just calm down?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She came over here. You got a choice to go someplace else.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What the hell do you think I`m going? Until the whore behind you stopped me, I was happily -- well, don`t get into my god damn --

when standing there. I don`t give a -- that`s.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You call me a whore?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are (bleep) in front of my shop -- you are a (bleep).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sue in a nice manner.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, you touched me. You didn`t ask me a question. You didn`t ask me. There`s a difference. I got no problem. Answer the question.

You came at me. So guess what? You got to come (bleep).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stop. That`s enough.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I`m sorry?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Record me. It`s disgusting to have an animal inside of a public restaurant. And it should be -- not that. Not that. It`s still my

opinion. And it`s not going to change. You keep saying you, you, you. I think it`s gross.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I wasn`t in the --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Shut it right down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop, stop. Stop.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Get out. Get out of my face.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everybody just stop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, let it go.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Stop. Let go. Just stop. Everybody just calm down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just let it go. Just let it go.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Just stop.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Just let them go.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BANFIELD: You are damn right that she`s beneath you. Straight ahead, Bill Austin is the army vet who was on the receiving end of all of that along

with his dog, J.P. He`s going to join us to tell us what he was thinking as she unloaded on him, and how he kept his cool throughout.

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[20:45:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: Just before the break, we showed you a woman who seems to have lost it after finding out a military veteran`s service dog was allowed

inside a restaurant in Delaware. That`s federal law. But that didn`t matter to her because she just wanted to tell anybody who would listen loud and

proud that she wasn`t happy about that at all.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don`t care. Record me. Like I said, it`s disgusting to have an animal inside of a public restaurant. And it should be

controlled and in a special area. Not that. That`s still my opinion. And it`s not going to change.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It`s your opinion.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You, you, you, you. I think it`s gross. I think it`s gross.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BANFIELD: That animal has a name.

[20:50:00] And it`s J.P. And that animal`s handler, J.P.`s handler, has a name too. It`s Master Sergeant Bill Austin. Master Sergeant Bill Austin is

an army veteran who was involved in that jaw-dropping altercation. He joins me live now from Rapid City, South Dakota.

First and foremost, master sergeant, thank you for your service. Tours in Afghanistan, as I recall, Iraq, Bosnia, multiple tours overseas. So we are

indebted to you, sir. And thank you again. Can I just ask you how both you and J.P. reacted to that woman?

BILL AUSTIN, VETERAN INVOLVED IN RESTAURANT ALTERCATION (via telephone): Good evening, Miss Ashleigh. Thank you in regards to your comments about my

service. You know, it is and was my honor and my privilege.

When I went through training with my dog, with J.P., one of the things that, you know, we were told was that there are certain ways that dogs are

supposed to behave, you know. And so this is exactly the result of that training, J.P. stayed by me and was looking after me.

As far as my thoughts when all this went down, I was just so glad that it didn`t get aggressive and nobody got hurt. I mean, even the woman who was

going off, you know, being angry and everything. It would have done no good to see her get hurt. It would have done no good to see her go to jail

either.

BANFIELD: You know, I got to be honest, I watched the video. I counted five F-bombs from that woman. I believe she called your wife and your niece the

"B" word four times. And I believe she called your wife a whore twice. I don`t know how you restrained yourself. I don`t know how J.P. restrained

himself. How did you?

AUSTIN (via telephone): Well, again, I mean, you know, I was more focused on hoping people didn`t get hurt. That`s what I wanted most of all. One of

the other things that, you know, I keep in mind with PTSD, there`s so much stigma in the social media world that when veterans that have PTSD get

angry and they become vocal, then all of a sudden they`re crazy. And that`s far from the truth.

I mean, any person, when put in a situation where they can get angry, they either become vocal or they act out in some other way. But unfortunately,

because the stigma that is associated with PTSD, that individual is crazy. So I tried very hard not to get in that situation. I don`t like

confrontation to begin with. I think there`s better ways of dealing with things. And so that`s kind of how it played out.

BANFIELD: Well, let me tell you something. Anybody who sees this knows full well who the honorable person is in this video. You are a remarkable man

for everything you`ve done up until this moment. And in particular in this moment as well. We can see that you`re a true American patriot and that you

stand for all the things that our incredible veterans stand for. So I just want to say thank you, Master Sergeant Austin.

AUSTIN (via telephone): My pleasure.

BANFIELD: And thank you to J.P. as well. He`s just adorable. He can come anywhere I am at any time. He looks adorable. I want to also bring in if I

can --

AUSTIN (via telephone): Let me tell you, I love him.

BANFIELD: I`ll bet you do. I`ll bet you do. I just want to give him a big old kiss right now. I want to bring in Dr. Harry Croft too if I can, master

sergeant, because he`s a former army doctor, a psychiatrist, also a PTSD expert. He joins me from San Antonio, Texas.

Dr. Croft, I`m sure this is the kind of thing that makes you clench your knuckles, extraordinarily frustrating, but it`s probably something you`ve

seen before.

HARRY CROFT, FORMER ARMY DOCTOR AND A PSYCHIATRIST (via telephone): Yes. You know, it`s amazing how uneducated, how unreasonable, how inappropriate

and how angry people can get for things that don`t make much sense.

And this is one of those instances. That dog probably is instrumental in helping Master Sergeant Austin deal with day-to-day life activities because

he has PTSD from serving us and our country. It`s interesting as I watch the video how calm J.P. was.

BANFIELD: I know.

CROFT (via telephone): That`s a (INAUDIBLE) thing to do.

BANFIELD: I couldn`t believe it either. And I just want to bring in Caroline Polisi real quick right now. As a defense attorney, you want to

say this has to be an offense of some kind. She has to be breaking a law of some kind. Tell me she is.

CAROLINE POLISI, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Absolutely. She may have been disturbing the peace even though she wasn`t really inciting violence. Of course, she

was yelling expletives. She was really fired up.

[20:55:00] She absolutely could have been charged with something here.

BANFIELD: I just want everyone to know that the Americans with Disabilities Act says a service animal can go anywhere, period. I don`t care what that

lady says. And by the way, I`m not even going to call her a lady. J.P.`s real name actually stands for nonjudicial punishment. And guess what? I

think that lady is going to get her nonjudicial punishment on the internet. We`ll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BANFIELD: My great thanks to Caroline Polisi for stopping by tonight. Thanks to all of you for watching. We`re back here tomorrow at 8:00 for

"Primetime Justice." "Forensic Files" is up next.

[21:00:00]

END