Return to Transcripts main page
ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT
NYC Suspect Charged With Federal Terrorism Crimes; Complaint: NYC Suspect Wanted To Display ISIS Flag On Attack Truck And In Hospital Room; Official: NYC Suspect Connected To Person FBI Had On Radar; Trump Calls U.S. Justice System "A Joke And Laughing Stock". Aired 7-8p ET
Aired November 1, 2017 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER: That's it for me. Thanks very much for watching. Erin Burnett "OutFront" starts right now.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR: "OutFront" next the breaking news, federal terror charges filed against Sayfullo Saipov moments ago. Investigators revealing stunning details about the attack, he's talking.
Plus, President Trump quick to point the finger in the wake of the attack, blaming Democrats. And the victims, what we're learning about the eight people who lost their lives in this horrific attack, including a group of friends on a high school reunion.
Good evening, I'm Erin Burnett. "OutFront" tonight, the breaking news. Charged with terror, the 29-year-old suspect in the New York terror attack who killed eight people moments ago charged with federal terrorism crimes. The official charges that Sayfullo Saipov provided material support to ISIS and violence and destruction of motor vehicles.
Also breaking at this hour, Saipov speaking with police revealing stunning new details about the attack, including this, he planned to continue his rampage after striking on the West Side Highway of Manhattan to drive across the city and strike on the Brooklyn Bridge and he planned his attack for two months. Choosing Halloween as the day because there are more people, he said, more potential victims that he thought he could kill.
Officials say Saipov told them he wanted to display the ISIS flag in his New York hospital room. He planned to fly the flag from his truck during the attack, something he decided against because he thought it might draw unwanted attention. Saipov told investigators he feels good about the attack and he told them his goal was to kill as many people as possible.
An NYPD official calling yesterday's attack straight out of the ISIS playbook.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JOHN MILLER, DEPUTY NEW YORK POLICE COMMISSIONER: He appears to have followed almost exactly to a "T", the instructions that ISIS has put out in its social media channels before with instructions to their followers on how to carry out such an attack.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Earlier today, the FBI issuing this poster, seeking information about another Uzbek national in relation to the attack. The FBI then quickly saying they had located the man offering no further information. We're going to have more on that in a moment, a potential crucial piece of this puzzle.
Also today, the New York Police Officer, Ryan Nash, who took such incredible action in taking down the suspect, spoke out for the first time.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OFFICER RYAN NASH, NEW YORK POLICE DEPARTMENT: I appreciate the public recognition of the actions of myself and my fellow officers yesterday. Although I feel we were just doing our job, like thousands of officers do every day, I understand the importance of yesterday's events and the role we played and I'm grateful for the recognition we have received.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: CNN covering every detail of this fast breaking story from the scene of the attack to the suspect's home in New Jersey where he began his rampage to the breaking details on the law enforcement.
We begin now with Shimon Prokupecz who is in Washington. And Shimon, you've been breaking the details here. What more do you know about the second individual, this poster that was put out that they were seeking information about?
SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Right. So what we know is moments really after, maybe about half hour or so after the FBI released this photo, they told us they found him.
Now, this is not something the FBI does lightly releasing a photo, a name of an individual that they're seeking and they're really right now just telling us that they want to question him. Perhaps he has answers to some of the questions that the FBI has. They had spent the day looking for him. They were not able to find him and then they decided to put his photo out.
And then shortly after, we're told we found him, and now we're told that he is with them, with the FBI and with the NYPD officials and they're questioning him. And it seems right now that they're treating him as a witness.
We're told there was no public safety issue relating to him, but it appears that he has -- he perhaps may have some answers to questions that they have. It could be about the timeline. It could be whether or not he may have known what Saipov was up to. So these are all the things that they perhaps want to ask him.
BURNETT: Right. Crucial questions and, of course, as they are so, you know, desperately trying to find out whether he had help or accomplices of any sort. As you say, very significant that they would even have requested that information. Thank you very much, Shimon.
And I want to go to Brynn Gingras "OutFront" at the scene of the attack with some breaking details. What we are learning about the suspect, Brynn?
BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Erin, we know now that Saipov has appeared before a federal judge on those two charges. We know he was in court in a wheelchair. We also know he did not have to enter a plea and that's because an indictment hasn't been filed and we know that the U.S. attorney's office has 30 days to file that indictment in which he'll have to make a plea then.
BURNETT: And they did, of course, as you said, the indictment (INAUDIBLE), but they did file this complaint and I know you've had a chance to comb through it. There are a lot of crucial details in here.
[19:05:03] GINGRAS: A lot of crucial details. Erin, one of the biggest one is the fact that he wanted to cause mass casualties according to authorities. As you said, this all comes from a federal complaint, but in that complaint there is details about investigator's conversations with Saipov and he talks about the whole truck issue.
He says that he actually planned an attack a year ago, but decided on using a truck just two months ago because, "He thought that that would inflict maximum damage." We also know that he specifically picked Halloween night hoping that most pedestrians, it would have the most pedestrians on the streets.
We also know from that complaint that Saipov planned to actually drive not only just on the West Side Highway, which he did, but also then continue down the Brooklyn Bridge. And as you've already mentioned to your viewers, Erin, he wanted to display that flag, that ISIS flag, on the truck, but then decided against it thinking that it would cause too much -- it would, you know, be obvious to other people what he was doing.
However, he also did tell investigators that he wanted to display that ISIS flag in his hospital room, saying that really he had no regrets for what he did, Erin.
BURNETT: He had no remorse at all. And you're also, Brynn, getting some new information on what they found in that truck.
GINGRAS: Yes, a lot more was found in that truck. We knew about that paint ball gun and that BB gun. We also knew about those knives. But what we didn't know was that those knives were in a bag and investigators say through conversations with him, he intended to reach for that bag, possibly then we can infer maybe that he was trying to cause -- wanted to cause more harm to people. Obviously he wasn't able to reach that bag. Also in that bag, we're told from that complaint, there was a stun gun. And also we know that there were cell phones. The other thing that we've learned from this complaint is a little bit more detail about that note which pledged his allegiance to ISIS. Word for word I can tell you from that complaint that it said, "No god, but god and Muhammed is his prophet. Islamic supplication, it will endure." Investigators say that last part, will endure, directly refer to ISIS.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Brynn Gingras.
And I want to go "OutFront" now to the Democratic Congressman Jerry Nadler who was at the press conference this morning, has been briefed on that attack and represents the district where the attack occurred. Congressman, I appreciate you being with me and I'm sorry it's under this circumstances.
REP. JERRY NADLER, REPRESENTS DISTRICT WHERE NEW YORK ATTACK OCCURED: Thank you.
BURNETT: I want to start by asking you about this other individual that law enforcement said they wanted information about. As you heard, our Shimon Prokupecz is reporting that they are now questioning this individual as we speak. They issued this poster with his face on it. Couple hours later said they'd located him. Do you have any information as to whether he knew about this attack or was involve in anyway?
NADLER: No, no, no. I have no information about the second individual. I assumed he'd be further, but they obviously had reason to suspect that he knows something, whether he's involved is another question and they have them him and they're questioning him.
BURNETT: Now, do you think that the terrorist, the attacker, acted alone or do you think he had help in some way?
NADLER: Well, we don't know. I don't know and I'm not going to speculate at this point. We have to see what the investigation reveals. It's possible he acted alone. Using a truck in that way is -- can be done by one person. It's possible that he conspired with someone else. I'm sure that's what they're talking to this second person about. But I'm not going to get ahead of the investigation here.
BURNETT: A law enforcement official tells us, Congressman, that the terrorist is connected to an individual that the FBI did have on its radar. Saipov himself though, the alleged attacker, was not on any terror watch lists despite as we know having his cell phone now full of thousands of ISIS images and videos, which we're going to be sharing more with our viewers in a moment. Should he have been on any sort of watch list or --
NADLER: Well, you know, we have -- we spend a lot of money and time and effort on trying to follow terrorists or potential terrorists. Unfortunately, the President in his budget has greatly reduced the terrorism funds. I don't know why, maybe he'll rethink that now. But you cannot know what's on everybody's individual computer.
This, the attacker came to this country seven years ago. It's quite possible and I'm sure he was vetted properly at that time. But it's quite possible that he was perfectly fine then and subsequently, you know --
BURNETT: Yes. They have said --
NADLER: -- looking at propaganda on social media got radicalized.
NADLER: And when that happens, there's very little you can find out about it.
BURNETT: And they are saying they believe he was radicalized in this country, at least at this time. Congressman --
NADLER: Which is why the President's immediately politicizing this and saying that this is the fault of immigration. It is so disappointing. You know, when there was a mass shooting in Las Vegas and people start talking about doing something about guns, the President and his people say, "No, no, no, we shouldn't politicize this, not the time."
BURNETT: Yes. It's not the time for that.
[19:10:04] NADLER: And all of a sudden when we know virtually nothing about what happened, suddenly it's the fault of immigrants, it's the fault of Chuck Schumer. It's very wrong of the President to exploit this politically.
BURNETT: He did, of course, tweet about Chuck Schumer and then we are going to talk about that. I want to ask you, though, about, again, that the questions of whether this was possible to prevent.
I mean, we know the attack began on the corner of Houston Street in the West Side Highway, a very specific location, right, where the attacker drove on to the bike path. This picture is in that exact location. And you can see that phone, that cell phone has the ISIS flag on it.
The terror tracking group site posted this picture on August 23rd, more than two months ago. We know now that he started planning these two months ago and he did this attack in this exact same location. Do you think that this picture, which was out there publicly, influenced the attacker? Is it possible?
NADLER: It's possible. Again, I'm not going to speculate. The interrogations will find that out. Unfortunately, it is impossible to track everything that everybody is reading on social media.
BURNETT: You have long pushed to close the Guantanamo Bay prison camp -- NADLER: Yes.
BURNETT: -- where terror suspects, of course, are held. You've called it a stain on your national honor, to use your words.
BURNETT: The President was asked today whether he would send Saipov to Gitmo. Here's what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I would certainly consider that, yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're considering right now, sir.
TRUMP: I would certainly consider that. Send him to Gitmo.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Your response?
NADLER: Well, my response is first of all, we had -- Khalid Sheikh Mohammed is at Gitmo who -- and he was one of the people involved in 9/11. He still hasn't been tried because the military commissions down there don't work.
This terrorist should be tried in an American court in New York and convicted, presumably he's guilty, and convicted and sentenced to a harsh sentence. And if you want justice done, that's the way to do it.
BURNETT: Like the death penalty, do you support that in this case?
NADLER: Well, I don't support the death penalty ever, but under federal law, he may very well get the death penalty in a federal court in New York. If you want to make sure that nothing happens for 20 years, send him to Guantanamo.
BURNETT: Thank you very much, Congressman Nadler. I appreciate your time tonight.
We have new details on how the suspect prepared for the attack. He had actually rented the truck for dry runs, those breaking details next. Plus, President Trump playing politics with a tragedy saying this about the American justice system.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: What we have right now is a joke and it's a laughing stock.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: That after he blamed all this on a Chuck Schumer beauty. And the Paul Manafort story tonight getting stranger. Trump's former campaign chairman applied for 10 passports in 10 years and he traveled with a fake name. Why did he need an alias?
[19:16:38] BURNETT: Breaking news, disturbing new details in the New York terror attack. Officials tonight revealing exactly what they found on the suspect's cell phones, he had two of them, and both of them were with him during the attack.
Miguel Marquez is "OutFront." He is in Paterson, New Jersey where the suspect was living. And, Miguel, what are we learning? A lot was on these two phones.
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this guy was clearly consuming a lot of social media. There were 90 videos that caught investigator's eye, many of them beheading videos, killing of prisoners, and even how to make improvised explosive devices.
There was also thousands, some 3,800 images, ISIS inspired images on that cell phone. Clearly, this individual was consuming lots of material online before he himself turned deadly.
MARQUEZ (voice-over): Agents searching the Paterson, New Jersey home of Sayfullo Saipov. Search warrants being served on several locations as authorities begin to dig into the 29-year-old Uzbek's life.
MILLER: Based on the investigation overnight, it appears that Mr. Saipov had been planning this for a number of weeks. He did this in the name of ISIS.
MARQUEZ (voice-over): In the rented Home Depot truck turned into an instrument of terror, authorities found knives along with a note.
MILLER: The notes were handwritten in Arabic. They had symbols and words, but the jest of the note was that the Islamic state would endure forever.
MARQUEZ (voice-over): Neighbors say Saipov was seen driving a rented Home Depot truck for weeks and never appeared to be doing any work, just driving.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: First time I saw it was three weeks ago. I guess he constantly rented the same model truck out.
MARQUEZ (voice-over): The federal charging document says he rented the vehicle to practice making turns. It says he chose Halloween because he believed more people would be on the street. He was inspired by ISIS leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi.
For all the planning, the attack didn't take long. Authorities say he rented the truck at a Home Depot in Passaic, New Jersey at 2:06 p.m. He crossed into Manhattan at 2:43 by George Washington Bridge. 21 minutes later, at 3:04 p.m., he entered into the bicycle path and started his killing spree. Four minutes later, dozens of 911 calls flooded into police dispatch. MILLER: He appears to have followed almost exactly to a "T" the instructions that ISIS has put out in its social media channels before with instructions to their followers on how to carry out such an attack.
MARQUEZ (voice-over): Accounts from neighbors of Saipov vary. Some say he was polite, unconfrontational and even at times, a peacemaker. An acquaintance in Ohio saying he was a nervous man, even aggressive, but saw no signs of radicalization.
MARQUEZ: Now one of the interesting things about Mr. Saipov, he was not on any terror watch list and had been -- he hadn't been the direct focus of an NYPD or FBI investigation, but he may have been a character in the investigation of others and that's something that authorities are looking into now, just how close was he to other people who were radicalized out there. Erin?
BURNETT: Miguel, thank you very much with all those new details.
I want to go now to James Gagliano, retired FBI Supervisory Special Agent and Tim Clemente, former FBI Counterterror Agent.
[19:20:08] James, let me start with you. You heard what Miguel just said that he had been seen in the neighborhood for weeks driving a truck like this. His neighbor said without seeing doing any work. And it this complaint that we have, they said that he did so to practice making turns, clearly premeditated.
JAMES GAGLIANO, RETIRED FBI SUPERVISORY SPECIAL AGENT: Absolutely. That is indisputable. So we know that once he entered Manhattan, he knew that to come down south in the West Side Highway was going to put him directly next to where the bike path was.
And also, Erin, we're familiar being New Yorkers with the bike path. We know that there are spots where there are bollards, concrete bollards barriers and impediments. He knew where to enter.
He entered somewhere below Tribeca, which is the triangle below Canal street in Lower Manhattan where I used to work then by the federal building and he entered there and was able to run 16 blocks in one mile and kill eight people.
The important thing here for investigator is to determine this for motive. Was he ISIS directed, which means it was definitely a conspiracy?
GAGLIANO: ISIS inspired, which means he looked at things online.
BURNETT: And showed the video as Miguel is reporting, yes.
GAGLIANO: That's it, or an aspirant. Was he somebody that just saw something and said, "Hey, I think I'm going to go kill people and say it's in the name Allah."
BURNETT: And that is the crucial thing. They don't yet have the answer too. I mean, Tim, you know, on page eight of this complaint, this very sobering statement that I think will sort of bring a chill to everyone.
They say during the interview with law enforcement, Saipov requested to display ISIS' flag in his hospital room and stated that he felt good about what he had done. Absolutely no remorse, pride, in fact, Tim.
TIM CLEMENTE, FORMER FBI COUNTERTERRORISM AGENT: That's what I would expect, Erin. This is -- he did this for this very reason. He is proud of what he did because he now feels like he is a part of ISIS.
And I would add to what Jim just said. To become a part of ISIS, there's no playbook you have to follow. There's no rulebook. There's no process that you go through to become an ISIS fighter. All you do is pledge fealty to ISIS and to its leader, Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and commit and act. And ISIS, I believe, will claim this as one of their own because that note may have been enough to -- for them to accept his fealty to the group.
And it's unfortunate that -- I mean, we're going to see more and more of this around the world and ISIS as a group has become much more fluid in their membership and their capabilities by reaching out and saying in the video literally that was just mentioned minutes ago in the report, that what are you doing for the Muslims that are being harmed around the world? What are you doing? It's playing on guilt and trying to get people everywhere to adhere to their ridiculous and sadistic ideology.
BURNETT: I mean -- and it's also James, you know, we are learning here that he prepared -- he was prepared to continue this attack. As we showed the map of Manhattan that he was going to do an attack on the West Side Highway and (INAUDIBLE) going to go to the Brooklyn Bridge. He had picked Halloween because he thought there would be the most number of people on the streets to kill.
It is unclear from all of this, though, whether that means anyone else was involved. Although we now know there was somebody they cared about enough to put a poster about today that they are now questioning.
GAGLIANO: Absolutely. Two things here that we have that we don't usually have in these things. Remember, similar attack, the London bridge attack, which happened in June of this year?
GAGLIANO: Remember that instance, nobody survived it. So in this instance, we have the subject who was wounded by police officer, but is alive and talking. We don't know if he's cooperating. And we know he has a spouse that's also talking. We don't know if they're cooperating. What I can't underscore enough right now is the connection to East Asia. We look at the Middle East and we look at Syria and Iraq and we think that's where ISIS has their caliphate and that's where all these fighters come from.
But this guy came from Uzbekistan and three years ago, the New York City Police Department and the FBI thwarted a plan two Uzbeks' and a guy from Kazakhstan that were trying to go to Raqqah to fight for the caliphate. And then they were going to conduct attacks like this, they thwarted that. Unfortunately, this was one that we didn't get the intelligence about and were able to stop.
BURNETT: Tim, they say that he was -- they believe radicalized here in the United States. Obviously, he was here legally, but he is not an American citizen, an Uzbek national. He left the notes behind pledging fealty to ISIS, Tim, in both Arabic and English. Obviously, his native language is not the Arabic.
What does this say about his level of radicalization or, I mean, he, of course, if he could have had someone else write it, I supposed, or printed it. But to your mind, how significant is that, dual language?
CLEMENTE: I think he's trying to prove that he is a student of Islam. The language of Islam is Arabic and so the Arabic language is used on ISIS flag. Its use on everything -- every proclamation made by ISIS and by its leader. And so by him using Arabic, a native -- tongue that's not native to him he's showing, "I am with you, I am part of this group. Look at me, I'm part of ISIS."
BURNETT: All right. Thanks very much to both of you.
Next, President Trump weighing in and getting extremely political just hours after the terror attack. He, of course, didn't want to do that after Las Vegas. He was very explicit about that. Why?
[19:25:10] And the secret life of Paul Manafort exposed tonight, multiple passports and a fake name that he was using even for a phone. Why?
BURNETT: Breaking news, President Trump talking about the New York terror attack calling the American justice system a joke. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We need quick justice and we need strong justice, much quicker and much stronger than we have right now, because what we have right now is a joke and it's a laughing stock.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Sara Murray is "OutFront" live at the White House. And Sara, tonight, the White House on the defensive, explaining why the President said that and, of course, why he blamed Democrats for the terror attack only 16 hours after eight people were mercilessly killed.
SARA MURRAY, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Erin. And the White House is basically insisting that the President wasn't politicizing any of this. Let's just remind people what he was saying on Twitter this morning.
Trump tweeted, "The terrorists came into our country through what is called the diversity visa lottery program, a Chuck Schumer beauty. I want merit based." So you see him there calling out Chuck Schumer in specific. In another tweet he called out Democrats more broadly.
Now, this is a very different tone from what we heard from the President in the wake of those shootings in Las Vegas. At that point, the President didn't want to weight into politics. He certainly didn't want to weight into policy changes. When he was asked about the possibility of moving forward with gun control, here's how he answered that question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We're not going to talk about that today, we were working out that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MURRAY: Now, the White House insisted that when the President was talking about immigration, when he was talking about bringing in to this visa lottery system, he was just reiterating his long-held stance on a number of policies and views he's held for a while. Although if you ask gun control advocates, I'm sure they would say something similar in the wake of the shooting in Las Vegas -- Erin.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: All right. Thank you very much, Sara Murray.
And I want to go now to Bob Baer, former CIA operative, and Josh Geltzer, former NSC senior director for counterterror.
I appreciate both of your time.
Josh, let me start with you. The justice -- the Department of Homeland Security does confirm Saipov entered the United States in 2010 on a diversity immigrant visa and you just saw the tweet, what the president said 16 hours after the attack.
The terrorists came in through the diversity visa lottery program, a Chuck Schumer beauty. I want merit-based.
A Chuck Schumer beauty. What is your reaction to the president's choice of saying this 16 hours after a terror attack in New York?
JOSHUA GELTZER, FORMER NSC SENIOR DIRECTOR FOR COUNTERTERRORISM: Well, I'm concerned about politicizing something that is at this point both an individual tragedy, but also something that should be bringing us together as a country. He seems to me, the president is asking the wrong question here. He's asking, how do we keep terrorists out? But based on what we know, this individual became a terrorist while here. That's a challenge but it's its own type.
BURNETT: And what do you make of that, Bob Baer? A Chuck Schumer beauty, that's his response.
ROBERT BAER, FORMER CIA OPERATIVE: Well, first of all, it's not factually correct. This happened under George H.W. Bush. It had wide bipartisan support. Schumer didn't write this law. He tried to get it revoked in 2013.
And by the way, politicizing this is just playing into the game of Islamic State. I mean, you look at everything they publish and it's to divide the United States. These terror attacks are meant to, you know, discourage us and divide the country and that's what it's about. So he's playing right into their hands, in what a country should do after an attack like this is unify and come up with a bipartisan objective foreign policy and not attack the other party.
Again, Trump is making things worse.
BURNETT: And as you point out, long on the fact, not just on the divisive intent of the message. The president today called the U.S. justice system when it comes to terrorism, a joke. We played a short clip of that, but I want to play more so people can truly hear the full context of what he said. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We also have to come up with punishment that's far quicker and far greater than the punishment these animals are getting right now. They'll go through court for years. At the end, they'll be who knows what happens. We need quick justice and we need strong justice, much quicker and much stronger than we have right now. Because what we have right now is a joke. And it's a laughingstock.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BAER: Well, Erin, you know, it's hard to even address comments like that. Our justice system works great. We can put people away for their lives who have committed terror attacks. It's an open, transparent justice system and what we don't want is a justice system like exists in Saudi Arabia and the rest of the Middle East because this is what provokes more terrorism.
You know, it's amazing. I mean, you know, the FBI and Department of Justice work just fine. They're not letting terrorists out of jail and so why mess with the system? And the idea, the suggestion that we send this people to Guantanamo, you cannot -- you just can't do that. They committed a crime in this country. They go to trial. They go to prison, or capital punishment. Depending on the case, but it works fine.
BURNETT: Just like Tsarnaev, of course, was given the death penalty, obviously you've got appeals, but the system works. I mean, let me ask you, Josh, on this point about Gitmo that Bob just raised. The president was asked specifically about whether this individual should go to Gitmo who by the way lived in the United States was here legally -- yes, obviously, is a Uzbek national. Here's how he answered the question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: Mr. President, do you want the assailant sent to Gitmo? Mr. President --
TRUMP: I would certainly consider that. Yes.
REPORTER: Are you considering that now, sir?
TRUMP: I would certainly consider that. Send him to Gitmo.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Send him to Gitmo, Josh.
GELTZER: The president may consider it, but that's not what any national security professional would consider here. You know, the goal for a national security professional in a situation like this is, how do you take someone who appears to be a terrorist off the battlefield so to speak, even if the battlefield is here. The clear tool from the toolkit useful here is criminal prosecution in Article Three court.
It's been proven. It gets extremely long sentences. And while this individual like anyone is innocent until proven guilty, this case based on footage we've also seen is a prosecutor's dream. The idea of sending someone to Gitmo, even if you put aside the human rights concerns about it is a nightmare for those who would to have to deal with the habeas petition from there, calling into question perhaps the applicability of the 2001 authorization for use of military force to ISIS because he'd be the first ISIS-associated individual there and dealing with what it means for an LPR to go from the United States with rights other than Gitmo may not be deemed by the courts to have.
BURNETT: Right, you mean legally protected resident I assume?
GELTZER: That's right, that's right, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you both so much. I appreciate your time.
And next, the mystery man. Paul Manafort. We're learning some startling new details like these. Three passports, traveling with a phone register today a fake name. This is not normal.
And the man who pleaded guilty to lying to the FBI about Russia, much more involved with the Trump campaign than the White House is admitting.
We have new details tonight about George Papadopoulos.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BURNETT: New tonight: Paul Manafort's fake alias. A court filing from special counsel Robert Mueller revealing Manafort had both a phone and e-mail account register to a fake name. We're also learning Manafort applied for 10 different passports in the same number of years.
[19:40:02] Chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto is OUTFRONT. And, Jim, a phone and an e-mail under a fake name, ten different
passport requests. These things are not normal.
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: They're not. In fact, worse. In this filing, the special counsel calls the behavior both misleading and deceptive. This is contained in a memorandum where the prosecutors make their case to impose this sizeable $10 million bail on Manafort, the same bail that Bernie Madoff had, as well as house arrest while he waits trial for these very serious charges.
But they also relate to the broader case here, right, because they're alleging not only was his travel deceptive, but his business dealings are deceptive and illegal, and that's the base of these charges.
But I think, Erin, also, as you look at this, because it's a pattern of behavior here and after all, this was the president's campaign chairman for a number of months, it shows the kinds of things this special counsel is zeroing in on, deceptive behavior, certainly lying under oath, deceptive business dealings, not reporting work for foreign companies and countries. These are the areas that he's looking into not just for Manafort and Gates, but others potentially involved in this investigation -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Jim.
And I want to go now to our chief political correspondent Gloria Borger along with a former White House counsel for President Nixon, John Dean.
John, let me start with you.
Given this news, Manafort applied for ten different passports in roughly as many years. He had three passports concurrently. There was a phone and an e-mail account registered under a fake name, as he was traveling to various countries including China, Ecuador, others.
Does someone do this if they have nothing to hide?
JOHN DEAN, FORMER NIXON WHITE HOUSE COUNSEL: No, they do not. It's extraordinary. It's extraordinary somebody like this would be associated with any presidential campaign. I don't know who he's hiding from, whether it's the government, other governments, his own business colleagues. But this is extraordinary behavior, particularly when you put it in the context of the massive tax fraud and money laundering scheme he's part of.
This is -- this isn't norm al to a presidential campaign. Anyone could ever get that close to a presidential candidate.
BURNETT: And I want to ask you about that in a moment, but, Gloria, first of all, the word extraordinary, it seems fair. We just at this point, we don't know the motive, right? Was it as John says, to hide from someone? Just hide income so the IRS would never see it?
I mean, we simply have no idea. We do know that no normal person would have cell phones registered under fake names -- multiple passport, maybe. But not a fake name.
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, and you know, the question that John raises I think is the right one, which is how did the Trump campaign bring him in. And the answer to that I think is that they didn't know, that there was not extreme vetting to use the president's terminology, of a lot of the people who were coming into the campaign. And the reason they brought Manafort into this campaign is because he had a skill or they thought he had a skill, which was they thought they were going to face a contested convention and Paul Manafort had helped Gerald Ford in 1976 on that very same issue.
And so, he had been recommended as someone, you know, he knows how to deal with delegates, he knows how to count these delegates and he'll make sure that Donald Trump gets over that hump. I don't think they were thinking so much about this other part of his life.
BURNETT: But there were people, Gloria, close to the president, the then-candidate, who did know Manafort very well --
BURNETT: -- who did know that he was shady.
BORGER: Well, I'm not quite -- I don't know, I think that what they were focused on, to be honest, was what he could do for Donald Trump. Look --
BURNETT: Right, so cares about all that? We need him to do this. Let's focus on this.
BROGER: And I will tell you this, and I've been told this by a couple of sources, Donald Trump wasn't particularly close to Paul Manafort. He brought him in because he felt he needed him. He didn't want a political operator. And Manafort was known as an operator. So, at first, I'm told the president was kind of, was kind of skeptical about Manafort. Corey Lewandowski, as you know, did not like Manafort, but he brought him in because good friends said, you know, you need this guy because he's going to help you.
BURNETT: Right. I mean, this is the question, of course, John, that they did not there was a dark side. They decided they need his skill more than that. And that was what was more important.
You know, when you talk about Manafort and what he could do, obviously, the only person above him that he could give information on at this point would be the president, John, and the president today called "The New York Times" today to talk about Manafort's indictment, calling Maggie, Maggie Haberman.
[19:45:02] He said, quote, I'm not under investigation as you know. And even if you look at that, there's not even a mention of Trump in there.
John, what do you say? The president is insisting he is not under investigation at this point.
DEAN: Well, I think he's living in an unreal world. He doesn't really read "The New York Times" apparently. He doesn't want to look at any mainstream media. He is so out of touch with reality. It's frightening.
The fact that he is out of touch is the fact that he has no real establishment people that are close to him that could have warned him about somebody like a Manafort. That's well-known. Those were not secrets. They were apparently to him.
But Manafort had a reputation and his firm was known for some shady business before he joined the campaign. So, you know, while he didn't, he needed the expertise, he was high risk in taking it.
And how many people walk into a campaign with real skills and are volunteering those skills and taking no salary and running a campaign? That's extraordinary in itself.
BURNETT: Right and, of course, Manafort like others, volunteer, if you want to use those words, which the campaign used to disparage Papadopoulos. But, Gloria, you were also reporting about a major clash here on how Trump is going to handle Robert Mueller, right?
BORGER: Well --
BURNETT: We know Trump has listened to his lawyers. They have told him, do not argue with this, do not fight this. Provide the information requested.
But you're learning that Steve Bannon has been talking to Trump in recent days, saying, no, don't provide this. Cut the funding. Fight Mueller.
BORGER: Right. Steve Bannon wants him to fight Mueller. I think he feels that the president's legal team is being outgunned.
And that the president told Bannon, look, for now, I'm going to stick with the playbook that we've got, which is we're going to cooperate with Mueller. We're going to hand over all the documents, which they've done and I'm not going to do anything to antagonize him.
I mean, you know, remember, in July, he was tweeting about Mueller. You haven't seen him do that lately. How long this will last, Erin, is really a big question here because as Mueller starts circling around more and more people who work for the president, we'll see if the president changes his mind.
BURNETT: All right. Thanks so much to both of you. And next, George Papadopoulos, the White House says he was a big player, a volunteer. Well, we've just got some new information. He may be a lot more than they are making him out to be.
And also, the victims of the terror attack in New York, include a young man from New Jersey. Somebody described by so many as a man with a huge heart.
[19:51:40] BURNETT: New tonight, former Trump campaign adviser, George Papadopoulos was more involved in the campaign than everyone wants to believe. Trump in the warehouse both say he was a coffee boy in their words who only attended one meeting.
Here's Sarah Sanders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SARAH SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: It was a brief meeting that took place quite sometime ago. It was the one time that group ever met.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: There was though, of course we now know at least one other meeting that Papadopoulos attended and he also appeared in an American Jewish committee in July of '15 where he admitted to working in the campaign. And, of course, there's a lot of email traffic between him and others, including Paul Manafort, Corey Lewandowski and others.
Manu Raju is OUTFRONT.
And, Manu, clearly more questions about how involved Papadopoulos was.
MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER: Yes, no question about it. For about four months after joining the campaign in March of 2016, he continued to appear at events, including that one around the Republican National Convention. But a lot of questions about the first meeting he did attend with then candidate Trump, in March of 2016. At that meeting, according to court documents, he did suggest setting up a meeting with President Putin of Russia and then candidate Trump, saying he could use his connections to set up that meeting.
Now, Trump did not dismiss the idea, Erin, in fact, left the option open. But the person who did dismiss the idea is Senator Jeff Sessions, then-senator from Alabama, the current attorney general. He said we should not move forward with this idea.
Now, this is raising a lot of questions on Capitol Hill, Erin, because Sessions did not disclose that during the time of multiple hearings when he was asked about Russia. Tonight, Democrats are asking questions.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL (D), CONNECTICUT: Jeff Sessions concealed his meetings with Russians and he had an obligation to be more forthcoming about the meeting that involved Papadopoulos as well. And in fact, one of the points of question is whether Papadopoulos in that charging document where there's a reference to a campaign supervisor was in fact talking to Jeff Session.
RAJU: What kind of concerns do you have?
SEN. MARTIN HEINRICH (D), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: About whether he is being honest and forthright with the committee and what does that mean for the highest law enforcement officer in the country?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: And, Erin, tonight, no comment yet from the Justice Department about what Jeff Sessions actually said at that meeting with George Papadopoulos. And when the White House, Press Secretary Sarah Sanders was asked whether the president remembers that meeting that occurred when George Papadopoulos proposed that Putin meeting, she said that the president does not recall -- Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Manu.
And OUTFRONT next, eight people were killed in the terror attack in New York. A mother of two young children among them.
We'll be back.
BURNETT: We now know the names of the eight people who were killed in Tuesday's terror attack in New York.
Ann-Laure Decadt being mourned in two nations tonight. She was a Belgian citizen and she was visiting New York with her mother and two sisters. She was a mother of a 3-year-old and a baby born just three months. Her husband says she was a fantastic wife and a beautiful mother.
A group of friends from Argentina, you see them all there. They were together in New York to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their high school graduation, that was the group that was here and those you see lit up are not alive tonight. Hernan Mendoza, Diego Angelini, Alejandro Pagnucco, Ariel Erlij, and Hernan Ferrucci did not survive.
The president of Argentina says he is deeply moved by their tragic deaths. And then there's Darren Drake, he's from New Milford New Jersey, 32 years old. His dad told NorthJersey.com, quote: He was the most incident delicate kid in the world, the perfect son and their only child.
And Nicolas Cleves was 23 years old, a software engineer. A local shop owner told "The New York Post" he was, quote, absolutely lovely, he was a sweetheart, warm and friendly. And he was the only New Yorker killed in this attack. Our great sympathy goes to those families who are mourning tonight.
And thank you for joining us.
Anderson is next.