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Moore Accuser Gives Public Statement; Moore Won't Back Down; New Accusation against Franken; State Sponsor Of Terror; UCLA Players; Trump Criticizes Flake; Tax Cut For Christmas. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired November 20, 2017 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, I'm Jim Sciutto in today for Wolf Blitzer. It is 1:00 p.m. here in Washington. Wherever you are watching from around the world, thanks very much for joining us.

A new tactic in the nuclear standoff with North Korea, President Trump designating the rogue nation as a state sponsor of terror, as the world waits to see how Kim Jong Un reacts.

Plus, a stunning remark from a U.S. president, saying that he should have left three American citizens inside a Chinese jail after feeling insulted by one of their fathers.

And the pressure builds on senators still undecided in the GOP tax bill. President Trump decides to attack one of them, calling his career toast.

We start, though, with President Donald Trump making a major announcement on North Korea. Less than a week after returning for his long Asia trip, the president made the comment, a short time ago during in a cabinet meeting at the White House.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We will be instituting a very critical step and that'll start right now. Today, the United States is designating North Korea as a state sponsor of terrorism. Should have happened a long time ago. Should have happened years ago.

In addition, threatening the world by devastation, North Korea has repeatedly supported acts of international terrorism, including assassinations on foreign soil.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Let me bring in Bruce Klingner. He's from the Heritage Foundation. He's a former chief of the CIA's Korea branch.

So, Bruce, North Korea already one of the most sanctioned countries in the world. The U.S. doesn't do a lot of trade. It doesn't really do any trade with North Korea. What difference does this designation make?

BRUCE KLINGNER, FORMER CHIEF OF CIA'S KOREA BRANCH: Well, it actually has several important factors. First of all, North Korea is not the most heavily sanctioned country, as President Obama said. For the U.S., three other countries more heavily. And the U.N. and the U.S. and the E.U. did things far stronger in sanctions to Iran which is what brought them back to the table.

But we should not hesitate to enforce our laws. The resignation is consistent with U.S. laws, including 18 U.S. code section 2331 which indicates that any hostile act intended to intimidate, coerce or influence a government or its population qualifies as international terrorism.

So, it will have an impact on further weaning away business partners away from engaging with the regime.

SCIUTTO: So, that's the key there, right? In that this designation is almost less about North Korea than about punishing, to some degree, or as you say, weaning away, maybe even scaring North Korea's trading partners away from trading with North Korea.

KLINGNER: Right. Well, if there are three lanes in the road in increasing pressure in North Korea, one is more fully enforcing required U.N. sanctions under the resolutions. The second is more fully enforcing U.S. laws.

And we're still pulling our punches, especially against secondary sanctions against Chinese violators of U.S. law.

And then, the third is even influencing legitimate business partners by pointing out North Korea is a state sponsor of terrorism. It's committing crimes against humanity. And it's repeatedly violating not only U.N. resolutions, but international law.

And, really, in the last two years, we've seen a growing list of countries and banks and businesses which no longer want to have their reputations linked to the regime.

SCIUTTO: Bruce Klingner, of course, China, a chief trading partner, have to see this as a message to them as well.

Thanks very much.

President Donald Trump is venting his anger and, once again, for a familiar reason. A perceived lack of credit. The president is tweeting criticism at three UCLA basketball players who were arrested for shoplifting in China and then released by Beijing, the president says at his request.

But after the father of one of the plays says that he isn't sure the president actually did anything, Mr. Trump fired back that he, the president, should have left them there. To be clear, left the U.S. citizens jailed by an un-Democratic U.S. rival.

Here are those tweets, in case you missed them. Quote, "Now that the three basketball players are out of China and saved from years in jail, LaVar Ball, the father of LiAngelo, is unaccepting of what I did for his son and that shoplifting is no big deal. I should have left them in jail." Exclamation point.

"Shoplifting is a very big deal in China, as it should be. Five to 10 years in jail. But not to the father LaVar. Should've gotten his son out during my next trip to China. He said why they were released. Very ungrateful." Exclamation point, once again.

[13:05:20] With me now, Mike Wise, a Senior Writer and Columnist for ESPN's "The Undefeated;" Jackie Kucinich, CNN Political Analyst, and Washington bureau chief for "The Daily Beast;" Mark Preston, CNN Political Analyst; and April Ryan, she's CNN Political Analyst as well as the White House correspondent for American Urban Radio Networks.

So, April, the president here saying he should have left three teens in China. It's not the first time the president has expressed anger, shall we say, or disappointment via Twitter. This is a U.S. president, though, saying, I should have left U.S. citizens in a -- what is an un-Democratic U.S. rival.

APRIL RYAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: We have not heard this publicly before. This is a president -- or any president is a fixer in chief. Not a problem maker but a fixer in chief. And politics may have played into the father saying what he said.

SCIUTTO: His own politics, that is, right?

RYAN: Yes, his own politics. But at issue for the president, who sits at this unique, lofty and great perch, to say this. And then, to drill down. Yes, these were young, African-American men. Shoplifting in any country is wrong. Any crime is wrong in any country because the penalties are much stiffer.

SCIUTTO: Sure.

RYAN: But to say you're going to leave an American. You don't -- the military does not leave a soldier on the field.

The president or any president who tries to bring someone home and to say that there's been a shift. There has been some kind of a moral, ethical shift that we saw over the weekend.

The president is the president of the United States. LiAngelo was released. But guess what? The dad said what he said. But he's still the president.

He doesn't -- it's, like -- and I've used this before. You are the president. It's like I -- it's an analogy of the dog barking at the moon. The president is the moon and I guess we would say we are the dogs. The moon doesn't bark back at the dog. And that's what happened.

SCIUTTO: What -- Mike, at the news conference last week, all the players who were released, they all thanked the president. LaVar Ball was unique in questioning whether the president had anything to do with it.

MIKE WISE, SENIOR WRITER AND COLUMNIST, ESPN: There's two things. One, I think it's almost -- anybody who knows about LaVar Ball, he has become the Marine One of helicopter parents in America.

And it's, sort of, like, the greatest troll of all time that the helicopter parent happened to run into, the greatest troll in American political life. It was almost like a predestined battle.

But second --

JACKIE KUCINICH, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Clash of the titans.

WISE: Class of the titans. Clash of the Twitter titans, I guess. All this keyboard courage.

But, secondly, and I think April hit it on the head. That -- the elephant in the room is race. And this is about the second or third time that the president has, essentially, used black athletes as a proxy for patriotism.

He's done it in the NFL. He's got this battle going with the Golden State Warriors and some members of the NBA. And it's amazing how that sports is now part of the culture wars in America. And how Donald Trump either brilliantly unconsciously or consciously has inserted himself in there.

SCIUTTO: And think of the sports' voices who have been critical of Donald Trump. Greg Popovich, from the very next day after the election, and since then, Steve Kerr, they're white. They have not, to this point, been the target of the president's eye or via Twitter.

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, there is one thing, though -- you are absolutely right about. I do want to go back to LaVar Ball, though, engaging right now with Donald Trump. And I think Mike hit it right on the nail.

The guy is a marketer. He's a salesman.

KUCINICH: He's a fake (ph) dad.

SCIUTTO: He's trying to sell his product. And guess what we're doing right now? He knew what he was doing when he engaged with -- you know, with Donald Trump.

Now, Donald Trump, what he did was outrageous. It was disgusting. As the president of the United States, it should have never happened.

But guess what? LaVar Ball is engaging in something right now that is not only trying to reach out, perhaps, to folks who is would be interested in buying his product, but we're talking about him now and that's what he wanted.

SCIUTTO: Jackie, we've -- it's not the first time we've heard of the president's need for public affirmation, you might say. And his own peak when he doesn't get that, when he perceived he's not getting the credit he deserves.

Now, what's interesting, though, I thought I would ask is that when I speak to folks out there, right, about this, Trump supporters, they'll often say the same thing.

That that perception is shared by them. They'll say, well, you guys don't give him a fair shake, right? You're not giving him credit for what -- and you guys being however you define that.

KUCINICH: Right.

SCIUTTO: But does that -- does that presidential, kind of, peak, does it have an audience?

KUCINICH: Presidential doesn't mean the same thing as it used to.

SCIUTTO: Sure.

KUCINICH: I mean, right now, we're seeing him punch down at, you know, someone who was basically a stage dad.

[13:10:00] And -- but -- I'll -- but when you look at Trump's base, they're saying, yes, he's telling it like it is. He's just saying what I'm thinking when I'm watching this story.

And for that, Trump -- President Trump doesn't really pick fights that make him look bad among those people. He's never really seen that he needs to -- he doesn't really feel like he needs to expand that. He feel like -- he feels like as long as he has the back of the people.

I mean, even the -- your favorite president in one of those tweets. He's not talking to America at large, he's talking to his folks.

RYAN: Right.

SCIUTTO: Do you think people actually --

RYAN: And who are these folks? Who are these folks?

SCIUTTO: And he called out Marshawn Lynch, again, as well. Because Lynch (INAUDIBLE) the anthem.

WISE: When we think -- when we say that he's mirroring what American people in his base think, do they really want to keep three young black men, who happen to be college admittance people and basketball players, in China?

KUCINICH: No, but I think it's a -- it's the, well, maybe I shouldn't have done that. It's like -- it's like something -- it's not even that deep. And I'm not trying to Trump-explain here, but I'm saying that I --

SCIUTTO: That's good to confirm.

KUCINICH: But it doesn't seem like it's as -- he thinks of it as vast as it is, leaving Americans in China. It's, you know, these people were ungrateful.

SCIUTTO: Well, one thing that does resonate, right, with his base is accomplishments. And the president is staking a lot on this tax reform bill which is running into some challenges, shall we say.

But here's what the president said a short time ago at his cabinet meeting, regarding tax reform.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESUIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: With the Democrats giving us no votes for tax cuts for purely political reasons, obstructionists, it will be up to the Republicans to come through for America. I think they will. I hope they will. It's up to the Senate.

And if they approve it, the House and the Senate will get together. I'll be there right in the middle of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Now, the president there directing his fire at Democrats. But let's show up the list of the eight Republicans that could very well vote no on this. You see quite a variety.

There's some of the president's more frequent critics, of course McCain and Corker, more recently Johnson. But Ron Johnson, I mean, he's a big fan, Mark Preston, of tax reform.

This bill has some issues.

PRESTON: It has a lot of issues, right. So, when you're looking at that right now, you're not talking about squishy Republicans that we're showing there right now. Maybe Lisa Murkowski, maybe Susan Collins when we say squishy, more centrist.

Here's the problem right now. The likes of Jeff Flake and Bob Corker are afraid of exploding the deficit right now and putting us more in debt of $21 trillion.

Susan Collins is worried about the individual mandate on there which would strip health insurance from people.

Other folks that are on there are concerned about the tax deductions, when it comes to the SALT taxes which is your state and local taxes that are primarily in the New York, California, New Jersey areas, where there's higher income.

But here's the problem. He thinks he can get it done. He says he's going to be in the middle of it. Well, then, you know, let's put him on that. Let's put him on the clock and see if he (INAUDIBLE.)

KUCINICH: This is why relationships matter so much. And this is why him picking fights with Corker, with Flake, with Murkowski, that's why they matter. That's why it's not intelligent for him to keep doing this --

SCIUTTO: Take these shots.

KUCINICH: -- and to keep taking these shots. And Ron Johnson, for that matter, is another interesting player in this because McConnell left him for dead during his -- during his race last year. He doesn't have a lot of loyalty as well. So, --

SCIUTTO: April, I want to ask you because a key number here really is who wins out from this current tax reform plan? And we're going to put up on the screen what is a nonpartisan assessment on this bill. And that is that all tax brackets, by 2027, increases under 70 -- all tax brackets, I should say, all earners under 75,000, they're going to have greater income taxes by 2027.

And then, by 2021, income tax increases between 20 -- 10 to $30,000 a year, that's if the Obama mandate is in there.

But even if the mandate is not in there, there are a whole host of Americans who are going to pay higher taxes because of this.

RYAN: Yes. And that's a good point. The question is, who wins?

And, in the short-term, you may get a piece of money, a piece I'll say, a piece of money for a moment. But then, at the end, the deficit explodes. How are you going to pay for it? And that's the question.

And, Mark, you're absolutely right. The fiscal conservatives are not happy. Some of them have not come out as of yet but they are grumbling because this is more government, more money-funding things that should not be at this time when --

SCIUTTO: (INAUDIBLE.)

RYAN: And then -- and then, let's go to the average American and let's go to the teacher who actually goes into the school room and puts her money on the table for supplies. They are getting that cut out. You cannot -- they cannot get that tax write-off back.

SCIUTTO: But you can for the private jet, right? That was one of the criticisms.

KLINGER: Well, I mean, I don't have the political savvy of this esteemed panel, Jim, April, everybody, but I can say, just by looking at the details of the bill myself, the meek is not going to inherit the earth for a while if this thing passes. It's not going to inherit the earth. I mean, it's geared toward a certain set.

RYAN: (INAUDIBLE) not with a -- not with a crutch.

[13:15:00] KLINGER: Yes.

SCIUTTO: OK, folks, we covered a lot there. Thanks very much, April, Jackie, Mark, Mike.

The first of Roy Moore's accusers is breaking her silence now. This morning, she gave an emotional account of her experience as the 14- year-old target of the GOP Senate candidate's sexual advances.

Plus, Jared Kushner's lawyer accusing senators of playing, quote, gotcha games, and claiming that his client is actually the hero when it comes to alleged Russian meddling. Details on that ahead.

And breaking news, a major development in the search for a missing submarine with 44 sailors on board. Sources telling CNN the search crews are hearing what could be the sound of crew members banging the hull of the sub with tools, a known method to send an SOS in the sunken sub. Stay with us. We'll have the details.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:20:04] SCIUTTO: A Roy Moore accuser has now spoken out in public as the embattled Senate candidate from Alabama continues to dig in. The Trump administration's focus remains on keeping that Senate seat in Republican hands. White House adviser Kellyanne Conway says that electing the Democratic candidate puts the Republican tax reform plan in jeopardy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KELLYANNE CONWAY, WHITE HOUSE COUNSELOR: Doug Jones in Alabama, folks, don't be fooled, he'll be a vote against tax cuts.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So vote Roy Moore?

CONWAY: I'm telling you that we want the votes in the Senate to get this tax bill through.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: They want the votes. Moore, remember, is accused of pursuing teenage girls when he was in his 30s. A woman who says that Moore molested her when she was just 14 years old speaking out. Leigh Corfman detailed the alleged encounter in a "Today" show interview this morning.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEIGH CORFMAN, ACCUSED ROY MOORE OF SEXUAL ASSAULT: On the second occasion that I went with him, he basically laid out some blankets on the floor of his living room and proceeded to seduce me I guess you would say. And during the course of that, he removed my clothing. He left the room and came back in wearing his white underwear. And he touched me over my clothing, what was left of it. And he tried to get me to touch him, as well.

And at that point, I pulled back and said that I was not comfortable, and I got dressed, and he took me home. But I was a 14-year-old child trying to play in an adult's world. And he was 32 years old.

It took years for me to regain a sense of confidence in myself. And I felt guilty. You know, I felt like I was the one that was to blame. And it was decades before I was able to let that go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: CNN White House reporter Kaitlan Collins joins us now from Gladden, Alabama. Kaitlan, I know that some Republican groups, the Young Republicans

Federation, for instance, is now refusing to endorse him, but Roy Moore himself continues to deny all the accusations against him. What's the latest we've heard from him today?

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, Jim, he's continued to deny these allegations. There's no sign from him or from his campaign that he has any intention of dropping out of this race, despite the fact that people like House Speaker Paul Ryan and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell have called for him to step aside and exit the race. But he's still denying that.

We just heard from Leigh Corfman this morning, the first time that she did a TV interview. And we know that he's denying another specific allegation from Beverly Nelson, who says she met Moore when she was just 16 years old at a restaurant.

Now, part of her proof of her allegation was a signature in her yearbook from Roy Moore, but he said that it's just a forgery.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROY MOORE (R), ALABAMA U.S. SENATE CANDIDATE: They forged the name on to this annual. They also included the initials of my receptionist, and secretary, which was D.A -- Deborah Adams. And certainly they forged it. And this is a complete fabrication. I did not know Nelson, and had never met her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COLLINS: So Moore says he's never met Nelson and that they want a handwriting expert to determine if his signature in that yearbook is real. But in the meantime, Jim, he's maintaining that it's not.

But we're continuing to hear from these accusers very personal stories, including Leigh Corfman's from this morning where she says she met Roy Moore when she was just 14-years-old at this courthouse behind me here in Gadsden, Alabama. So it's likely we'll continue to hear more from these accusers leading up into this race on December the 12th, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Yes, the D.A. detail, interesting. He was the district attorney at the time, but he's saying that the D.A. were the initials of his receptionist.

Kaitlan Collins, thanks very much.

New today, another woman is coming forward accusing Senator Al Franken of groping her. Hear her account and how Franken is now responding.

And a top U.S. general says that he would resist any illegal order by President Trump for a nuclear strike. Hear his explanation.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:29:02] SCIUTTO: New now, a second woman said that Senator Al Franken touched her inappropriately. This time while he was already in office. Thirty-three-year-old Lindsay Menz told CNN that Franken pulled her in really close and grabbed her rear end while her husband took this photo at the two of them at the Minnesota State Fair. This in the year 2010. She told CNN that his behavior made her feel, quote, gross and disrespected. In a statement to CNN, Franken said he did not remember taking that particular photo with Menz, but that he felt badly that she felt disrespected. The accusation comes days after the -- a California radio anchor, Leeann Tweeden, said that Franken forcibly kiss and groped her in 2006 while he was still a comedian.

Joining me now to talk about this and other issues is Democratic Congressman Hakeem Jeffries of the great state of New York. He's a member of the Senate -- of the House Judiciary Committee.

Congressman, thanks very much for joining us.

In light of these accusations against Senator Franken, he's a member of your own party, but do you believe that he should resign?

[13:30:03] REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D), NEW YORK: No, I think we have to let the process play itself out in terms of the Senate Ethics investigation that obviously has to proceed full steam ahead.