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CONNECT THE WORLD
2 Dead, 70 Injured In U.S. Train Collision; CNN Uncovers Sanctions Violations In Mozambique; African Immigrants Face Uncertain Future In Israel; Experts Protect Elaborate Art At Sistine Chapel
Aired February 4, 2018 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LYNDA KINKADE, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to CONNECT THE WORLD, I'm Lynda Kinkade in Atlanta. This hour we have a special look at the people
fleeing war, persecution, and poverty. First though, to our breaking news, authorities on the scene of deadly train collision near Columbia, South
Carolina. An Amtrak passenger train traveling from New York to Miami crashed into a freight train overnight. The passenger train had eight crew
members and around 139 passengers on board. Now the Amtrak engine derailed along with several passenger cars. Two people have been killed, around 70
have been transported to hospitals with injuries ranging from scratches to broken bones. Now, this is the third deadly Amtrak crash in less than two
months. Mary Schiavo, CNN Transportation Analyst and former Inspector General for the U.S. Department of Transportation is with us via Skype from
Charlotte, North Carolina. It's good to have you with us, Mary.
MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST: Thank you. Good to be with you.
KINKADE: This deadly collision happened in the middle of the night, what do we know about how it came to be that a passenger train struck a freight
SCHIAVO: Well, that is going to be the question that the National Transportation Safety Board Investigators will be asking. In the United
States, passenger trains share rails with freight trains. They do not have separate dedicated tracks like in many other countries. For example in
Japan, the Shinkansen bullet train doesn't share tracks with any other kind of train and it never meets with surface traffic on the road. In the
United States, they do and the section of tracks that this Amtrak train was traveling over belong to CSX, the freight train company of the freight
train hit. So it shouldn't have been on the track. They should be on the same track a the same time, but it was raining, it was in the middle of the
night, and this track was not equipped with something called positive train control which is computerized sensors on the track in the train that lets
you know that there's an obstruction on the track.
KINKADE: So you're saying that this Amtrak train would typically be traveling on the train lines?
SCHIAVO: Yes. The United States Amtrak actually owns very little track that it travels on. It owns some of the track that it travels on for
example in the northeast corridor, the trains in New York, Washington D.C. and those areas, but for the rest of the nation, other some track on the
West Coast, in Washington, Portland, Oregon, and California areas, it travels on freight train tracks. In can't possibly be it to own the track
that it travels over because there's just so much track in the United States, so it, if you will, borrows track.
KINKADE: Right. So, when we're looking at Amtrak's safety records, this is now the third -- this is the third deadly collision since December. We
have the one last weekend in Virginia which left one person dead, one in December which left five people -- 33 people dead. What can you tell us
about Amtrak's safety record?
SCHIAVO: Well, that's a great question because each of those three crash that you mentioned had three different causes, but in all cases, they could
have been aided by either positive train control, more alert conductors or better gates to keep vehicles off the tracks. The one in Washington was an
over speed situation. They were doing a 60 or 70 miles an hour in a 35- mile an hour zone. The one with the congresspeople was a garbage truck, who went into the track and didn't clear off in time, and then this one is
a collision on the track with another train. And this is -- you know, Amtrak has a worse safety record in terms of deaths in the last year than
aviation, and in commercial aviation in United States for example. So it's going to be a big question that the investigators need to find out what's
KINKADE: Wow, that is unbelievable, the worse safety record for death than aviation. All right Mary Schiavo, good to have you with us and great to
get your perspective as always. Thank you.
SCHIAVO: Thank you.
KINKADE: We're turning now to a conflict which is often called a civil war but many years into it, it's involved in array of world palace. Syria's
war has proved deadly against two of those palace this weekend, Russia and Turkey. It was Turkey's deadliest days since the ground offensive around
the Syrian town of Afrin began in late January with seven deaths including five soldiers killed when the tank was destroyed by a missile, that's
according to states media. The Kurdish YPG later released what they say is a video of that attack you're looking at now. Meanwhile, in the Idlib
Province, Russian state media reported that one of their warplane was shot down in an area controlled by al-Qaeda affiliated rebels. Now the pilot is
said to have ejected but has later killed on the ground. CNN's International Correspondent Frederik Pleitgen is joining us now from
Moscow. First, let's talk about that Russian plane. So the pilot managed to eject was then killed on the ground, and from what I understand, Russia
is now retaliating?
[10:05:52] FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Russia has been retaliating, Lynda, over the past couple of hours. It really
started very shortly after the crash and the killing of the pilot took place that the Russian Ministry of Defense actually came out and said yes
that they had retaliated, they'd launched a couple of cruise missiles towards that area but were also stepping up air strikes as well. Now, the
Russians have not offered an update on the stay on Sunday a day later, however, we are hear from groups who are on the ground that there had been
further air strikes in that area as well. Now, we have to keep in mind, on the one hand, of course, you had that crash of the Russian jet being shot
down but you also currently have an offensive by Syrian government forces in that area as well which is a very fierce one and of course is supported
by Russian aviation. That seems to be what this jet was doing as well, Lynda. The jet in question is an SU-25 Frogfoot. That is what is known as
of the NATO designation of that jet. That is what's known as a close support combat aircraft. That means it flies very slow, it flies very low
as an agile aircraft that's heavily armed, but of course, also when that's susceptible to ground fire. One of the things that many people are trying
to find out right now is whether or not this jet was shot down by gunfire from the ground or possibly a shoulder-launched surface to air missile.
That would certainly be something that would be very interesting to hear for the U.S. and for other powers operating there because it wasn't clear
up until now which rebel groups actually had such weapons. Lynda?
KINKADE: And of course, Fred, a lot of people, when it comes to those particular weapons used to bring down that jet, a lot of questions as to
which country may have provided those weapons.
PLEITGEN: Yes. Yes, you're absolutely right. And that would certainly be one of the big questions. The Russians have sort of hinted that the rebel
groups that are on the ground are some that were formerly in alliance with the United States. Of course, alliances in that area, especially in the
north of Syria tend to change all the time. But that's one of the things that the Russia sort of been hinting at. But really, at this point in
time, it's absolutely unclear if such a weapon was used, where such a weapon would come from. Certainly, we do know that the U.S. are for the
shoulder-launched surface to air missiles that they used and that they manufacture, they keep very tight leads on those. However, of course, in
that region, it is possible to get such weapon. There's all stockpiled from the army of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad. There have been raided
in the past by rebel groups. There's also some of this weapons, for instance, coming from Libya into this region as well. So certainly, it is
something that the international community will want to find out. There is going to be some veiled and less veiled finger pointing going on as well,
but it certainly going to be something that the U.S., the Turks, the Russians and some other group as well, some other countries as well who
really want to know if such weapons were used, where they came from and who might have fired them, Lynda,.
KINKADE: All right, Frederik Pleitgen for us in Moscow, good to have you with us on that story. Thank you. Well, we've also seen some daring
escapes from North Korea recently. Citizens taking freedom from leader Kim Jong-un's brutal regime. We're now learning that North Korea is making
millions of dollars illegally by defying international sanctions. A new U.N. reports says Pyongyang poured in nearly $200 million last year by
exporting coal and other goods banned under the sanctions. That means the hermit kingdom has willing partners in this illicit trade. And in a CNN
exclusive, our David McKenzie covers a lucrative relationship between North Korea and Mozambique.
DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Tracking the illicit funding of a rogue nuclear state, a months-long investigation leads us to a fishing boat in
Hello. (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
Can we talk to someone?
We uncover sanctions busting. Caught in the act.
So there's two North Korean fishermen here in the boat. They don't want us to talk to them. And they have stuck this boat between two others. It's
pretty well hidden.
The captain locks himself away, with good reason. Illegal fishing operations generate significant cash for Pyongyang's nuclear missile
program, say U.S. officials. Yes, the crew are all Korean, this Mozambican crewman tells us.
[10:10:13] (SPEAKING FOREIGN LANGUAGE)
Hi! Can we come up?
So the captain of the ship is on the phone with someone. I think it's wise we get out of here, actually.
Kim Jong-un's ultimate aim is to develop a viable nuclear-tipped missile threatening to strike cities across the United States. But the sanctions
are biting and the Trump administration is taking a tougher stance. They're scouring the globe to generate cash. Seven-and-a-half thousand
miles away from Pyongyang, they found a willing partner, one of 11 African countries United Nations is investigating for sanctions violations. From
the channel, we can easily spot the rusting boats. So that's the Susan One and that's the Susan Two. Our investigations show that these shrimping
trawlers are part of a lucrative joint venture between the Mozambicans and the North Koreans.
Illegal as of last August, and there are more sinister links than just a few fishing boats. Investigators are tracking it all.
HUGH GRIFFITHS, U.N. PANEL OF EXPERTS: Surface to air missiles, man- portable surface to air missiles, military radar, air defense systems, the refurbishment of tanks. It's a long list.
MCKENZIE: Pyongyang exporting its deadly expertise for hard cash, even to Mozambique's remote exterior. Fostering military installations like this,
the U.N. says, training elite forces for at least two years military sources tell us. All of it under sanctions for more than a decade. So how
do they keep the operation secret? The trail leads us to one of Maputo's busiest avenues.
So according to documents, this is the headquarters of the North Korean trade emissary here in Maputo.
Reviewed by CNN, the document's name a shadowing front company. In 2017, the U.N. revealed that it helped funnel at least $6 million in military
contracts to Pyongyang.
Hi, how are you, sir? "
Some Asians were living here. They left three or four months ago" says the property agent. Nobody could tell us where they went.
Are there still North Koreans in Mozambique?
"Yes, we have some here cooperating in social and technical fields," he says, "which is not against sanctions that were declared by the United
Nations." He says they are implementing sanctions, we saw clear violations.
Defense Ministry officials refused to be interviewed by CNN or answer our questions.
Has Mozambique been complying with U.N. sanctions?
"I cannot say at this moment," he says. "I don't have detailed information on the question you're asking."
The U.N. is waiting for answers from Mozambique, a country risking hundreds of millions in U.S. aid to help Kim Jong-un find ways to fund his nuclear
ambitions. David McKenzie, CNN Maputo, Mozambique.
KINKADE: The Winter Olympics are just a few days away and North and South Korea are competing under one flag in this year's games. The unified women
ice hockey team just wrapped up a friendly match against Sweden losing three to one. Not bad for a team that's only been practicing together a
week. The 2018 Winter Olympics kicks off with the opening ceremony this Friday in Pyeongchang and CNN is covering it all. You can also check out
all the latest Olympic news at cnn.com. Still to come, in Washington, a controversial memo is the talk of the town. What it means, what it proves
and what it doesn't. That's next. And Israel under fire for plans to deport thousands of African immigrants. A look at the controversy later on
the show with a live interview.
[10:15:00] KINKADE: Welcome back. Well, in Washington, the Russia investigation is in focus. You might have heard about a formally
classified Republican memo released Friday which alleges the FBI abuse its surveillance authority. The debate over what that memo means, what it
proves and what it doesn't is still very much ongoing. And the answers to those questions really depends on who you ask. According to the top
Democrat on the House Judiciary Committee, Congressman Jerry Nadler, this memo is an attempt to obstruct the Russian probe. President Donald Trump
who approved making it public Friday has a different view. He says it totally vindicates him. Many of his Republican colleagues see it
differently. CNN's Jeremy Diamond has the latest now from the White House.
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, Lynda, it's been two days since Republicans on the House Intelligence Committee released this highly
controversial memo alleging abuses by FBI and Justice Department officials that were already seeing the beginnings of how Republicans and the
President are going to cease on this memo to try and discredit the Special Counsel's investigation which is, of course, looking into questions of
collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia, as well as questions of obstruction of justice particularly as it relates to the President. The
President in a series of tweets has already ceasing on this memo saying that it "totally vindicated him." He also quoted from a Wall Street
Journal editorial which sided with the memo's authors raising questions about the FBI's motives in obtaining the surveillance warrants against
Carter Page who of course is a former Trump Campaign adviser. The President tweeting, "this memo totally vindicates Trump in probe but the
Russia witch hunt goes on and on. There was no collusion and there was no obstruction." He says this is an American disgrace. Of course, the memo
does not clear the President of either collusion or these questions of obstruction of justice. Instead, the memos appears to suggest that the
Steele Dossier, the dossier compiled by a former MI6 agent with Russian intelligence knowledge, that it suggest that this dossier was the sole
basis for this secret FISA court warrant that was obtained to surveil Carter Page, this former Trump campaign adviser, but in fact that's not the
case according to law enforcement officials familiar with the matter, as well as the top Democrat on the House Judiciary Committee who release this
response effectively to this Nunes memo, this House Intelligence Committee memo. And he says that it is deliberately misleading and deeply wrong on
the law. So this debate, of course, is going to continue this week, but clearly, we are seeing the beginnings of how the President intends to use
this memo to claim some kind of vindication and to continue to try and discredit the Special Counsel investigation. Lynda?
[10:20:02] KINKADE: Our thanks to Jeremy Diamond. Well, the view from the White House there, my next guest, thinks Mr. Trump might be in a process of
mounting a political comeback. Julian Zelizer is a CNN Political Analyst, Historian, and Professor at Princeton University. He joins me now from New
York. It's always good to have you with us, Julian.
JULIAN ZELIZER, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Thanks for having me.
KINKADE: Firstly, you take on President Trump's tweet saying that this memo vindicates him, that it demonstrates that there's no collusion. What
do you make of that?
ZELIZER: Yes, the memo doesn't vindicate anything. It doesn't demonstrate that somehow the investigation is illegitimate but it does offer exactly
what he wants. It offers material for the partisan universe of Republicans and conservative media outlets to make the argument that this is all been
illegitimate. And in the end, that's what matters and this is his version of a Saturday Night Massacre. It's to make the investigation look
illegitimate regardless of the contents of the memo.
KINKADE: I want to (INAUDIBLE) Julian, to an article you write on cnn.com where you said that Donald Trump is making a potential comeback and you
point out that he's polling numbers. His approval rating is up 10 points in January compared to December. What do you put that down to?
ZELIZER: Well, I think the tax cut that passed Congress in December was a very big victory for the GOP and it energizes Republicans to stand by this
President regardless of what he's doing. I think the effort to discredit the entire investigation among Republicans is working. And so, this is
just now becoming more partisan noise rather than for many Americans an investigation that akin to Watergate. And I think he has Democrats in the
box on the immigration deal that he's going to try to push where Democrats now either have to say they support the legislative extension of the
DREAMer program or they will let it die. And so, you put this together, I think he's positioned himself in much better place than he was a few months
KINKADE: And just on that point regarding the Democrats and where they're placed, we just brought up a graphic before which I just want to read to
our viewers. This is what you wrote in the article. You wrote the President's opponents should not get too giddy even when the chaos and the
stock market turbulence. There are some strong signs that President Trump is in the process of mounting a political comeback." If this is the start
of a political comeback if President Trump has stored enough doubt in the Russia investigation, and obviously consume a confidence is up at a record
high, 17-year high, what do the Democrats need to do to then going into the midterm elections?
ZELIZER: Well, I think they have to highlight one or two issues that the President is uninterested in and make them their own. They have to
distinguish themselves from the President and they do have to make themselves more than simply about the investigations. At the same time,
they really need to work hard and they have to be as tough as he is in portraying why they believe this president is a danger to the value and
institutions of the country. But they can't start entering into deals and to negotiations. If they start to do that and hand him victories on
several bills, they will not do well in the midterms. They need to be tough opponents just as Republicans were with Barack Obama.
KINKADE: To a little bit a light of -- a light on the take on this, I just going to show our viewers a clip from the SNL show. Alec Baldwin, of
course, has returned to Saturday Night Live to give his impression of U.S. President Donald Trump. And the comedy show made fun of Mr. Trump's
favorite morning show Fox And Friends portraying the President in his pajamas calling into the show's host. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: President Trump.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you for taking time of your busy schedule.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I'm so busy. And if you wonder why I'm so out of breath is because I'm doing my P90X morning exercises right now. But I'm
saving the economy and destroying ISIS and right now I'm getting my daily intelligence briefing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, from who?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: From you guys. Thanks so much. Your show is great. Huge ratings, of course, that is big as the ratings from my State of the
Union speech which was watched by 10 billion people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KINKADE: Mr. Trump, of course, known to watch Fox And Friends daily, often tweeting about what sees in that show, and the sketch ends with the fake
host calling the fake president, the most innocent guy in the whole world. And we certainly -- his Twitter accounts certainly gives us a lot of --
it's quite transparent when it comes to understanding what the President thinks and what he's watching.
[10:25:01] ZELIZER: That's true. And I think the joke, the comedy points to something pretty serious that combined the Twitter account and the
conservative media outlets like Fox News offer the President a bit of protection that someone like Richard Nixon didn't have. And that's part of
how his arguments about the investigation, about the economy will continue to gain hold in parts of the electorate. And that's been an important part
I think of his survival and potentially his success.
KINKADE: Such a story. You make you a good point. Julian Zelizer, CNN Political Analyst, it's great to have you with us. Thank you.
ZELIZER: Thank you.
KINKADE: Well, before we move on we all know how much Donald Trump-like to get on Twitter. The Speaker of the House, maybe not so much. Paul Ryan
was singing the praises of the benefits of the recent tax cut mentioning a school secretary who's weekly paycheck went up by one dollar and fifty
cents. Well, as you can imagine, the Twitter backlash was brutal. And not surprisingly, Paul Ryan deleted that tweet. Well, just ahead, as a boy he
had to flee his home, as a teenager, he had to flee his country and he found safety in Israel. But now, it could force him out along with
thousands of others. We're going to speak to him when we come back. Stay with us.
[10:30:07] KINKADE: Welcome back. I'm Lynda Kinkade. You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD. Well, all this hour we're looking at the hardships of
migration. Israel is once again increased impression African asylum seekers to leave the country.
Today, authorities begin handing out letters telling them they have 60 days to voluntarily leave the country before deportations begin. Now, it's part
of a growing crackdown on nearly 40,000 African migrants in the country. Israel h rejected 14,000 asylum requests over the last decade, while only
accepting 33. That's according to the government.
Tens of thousands of requests have not even been answered.in all of this, as a group of Israeli law experts sent a letter to the attorney general
saying, Israel's deportation policy violates international norms. CNN's Oren Lieberman takes us into the very public battle to Israel's streets.
OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The map of Johnny Goitom's journey is drawn in scars. The marks when he left Eritrea, the beatings in Sinai, and
the wounds when he crossed into Israel where he's lived since 2009.
JOHNNY GOITOM, ASYLUM SEEKER (through translator): I feel like I belong here because this is where I am. I placed my foot here, I am here.
LIEBERMANN: Goitom has built a life here, but his family like thousands of others here face deportation. He speaks to me in fluent Hebrew.
GOITOM (through translator): They don't want refugees here, they tell you, you're not a refugee, you just came for work. They just don't believe you.
LIEBERMANN: Israel has bound to remove some 38,000 illegal immigrants within months offering to pay them to leave. Most of from Eritrea and
Sudan, two of the biggest sources of refugees in the world. Fleeing war and poverty and traveled north through Egypt, turning east to pass through
Sinai. More than a thousand crossed the border into Israel each month until the Israeli army sealed the route with a fence in 2013.
The immigration authority here says it received more than 50,000 asylum requests in the last decade. Some 3,600 from Eritrea have been rejected,
just eight have been accepted. Less than one percent among the lowest rates in the western world. Israel calls them infiltrators.
BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, PRIME MINISTER OF ISRAEL (through translator): We are not acting against refugees, we're acting against illegal migrants who come
here not as refugees, but for work needs. Israel will continue to offer asylum for genuine refugees and will remove illegal migrants from its
LIEBERMANN: South Tel Aviv is ground zero for this fight and Sheffi Paz, a grassroots activist is on the front line.
SHEFFI PAZ, FORMER LEFT-WING ACTIVIST, TEL AVIV ISRAEL: We feel here completely, completely is dangerous, and it began of lack -- kind of
occupation or invasion or --
LIEBERMANN: We stroll around her neighborhood at night. The polished shine of the tech hub glimmers in the distance. She says, this no longer
feels like Israel and wants to see these recent arrivals returned to their countries, the vast majority from country's the U.S. label's human rights
PAZ I really need a Jewish country, and I am a -- I am a -- my parents were holocaust survivors, that's my conclusion for the holocaust. Know that
they have to get -- to give their own for the world but did they need to fight for my country.
LIEBERMANN: Others draw a different lesson from the holocaust. Reut Michaeli works to help Africans apply for asylum. Her parents and British
mandate Palestine in 1941 illegally. She says a nation built by Jewish refugees cannot turn away others.
REUT MICHAELI, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, HOTLINE FOR REFUGEES AND MIGRANTS, ISRAEL: Israel was one of the initiators of the refugee convention. And
the fact that Israel will deport people to a third country without taking even a little, little piece of responsibility is not moral. Not to mention
that it's against our Jewish values as a refugee nation.
LIEBERMANN: The nearby, Levinsky Park, I meet Awat Asheber from Eritrea. This is where Israel first brought many of those fleeing Eritrea and Sudan.
Even after ten years in Israel, Asheber's goal has never changed.
AWAT ASHEBER, ASYLUM SEEKER (through translator): Tomorrow, the next day, it doesn't matter when, the day our country has peace, we will go back.
That's what we're waiting for, but no one is going to bring us peace.
LIEBERMANN: As Israel is pressured these families to leave, peace has been hard to find here, the Promised Land. It just wasn't promised until then.
Oren Liebermann, CNN, Tel Aviv.
[10:34:53] KINKADE: Well, there is deportation letters being sent today telling migrants that Israel has signed agreements allowing them to leave
for an unnamed country, which Israel has already received thousands of people from. And they said, and I quote, "In recent years that has been
showing some of the highest economic growth figures in Africa, thanks to exports to Europe and the United States, as well as to the flourishing
tourism industry. This country enjoys stability in its regime, which has contributed to developments in many fields including education, medicine,
Well, let's bring in Monim Haroon, an asylum seeker from Sudan, he fled there for as a boy, then, he have to leave Sudan altogether as a young man
and since he was a student activist protesting against the Sudanese government, well, he joins me now live from Jerusalem.
Really good to have you with us. I understand you were a refugee from Darfur, you've been living in Israel for six years. Just explain how you
feel facing a government who wants to deport you.
MONIM HAROON, ASYLUM SEEKER, SUDANESE: Hi, thank you for having me. I guess, is really deserving and disappointing to flee such a deserving
condition in Darfur or in Sudan in general. And come to the country that claims as a Democratic country, and is denying you to get your -- a basic
rights of human being, to be protected from a regime such as Sudanese regime.
It is really hard to be a refugee in Israel even though we are just asking for a temporary protection until we will be able to go back to our country,
to back then, in Sudan or Eritrea.
KINKADE: And I understand that you applied for asylum years ago and you never even got a response. The government in Israel calls you an
infiltrator, is that dehumanizing?
HAROON: Yes, actually that's really devastating. I ask for asylum five years ago and up until now, I didn't get a respond. The government are not
willing to respond to my quest or to my asylum request. I understand that they call me infiltrator. Yes, actually that is dehumanize my -- me as a
human being because, for me, it's just ignorance of the situation that I fled because if we ask the question, is the situation in Darfur, or Nuba
Mountain, or Brunei is normal? Is the general side of the government of Sudan is committing is normal? So, I fled such a condition and situation
in order to save my life and here they are calling men infiltrator. Yes, actually, that just -- that's really disturbing.
KINKADE: And not only calling you an infiltrator but I understand at one point you were jailed for being an illegal immigrant. Just give us a sense
of what it's like living in Israel, what are the biggest challenges you face since arriving?
HAROON: Yes, when I just arrived to Israel, they told me that this -- I should be in jailed for three years, then, I should be deported back to my
country, the place -- the place that I fled. So, I told them my life is in danger there, and they will probably kill me if he will deport me back to
my country. So, I can't go back.
I understand they put me in jail, in close jail for 18 months. And it was really challenging and very hard term to be there because it's just
ignorance, knowing that you fled in order to save your life and here they don't recognize that. So, it was the lack of recognition, the lack of
solidarity, and at the same time when I was in jail, I lost my mom because of the war there in Darfur. It was really challenging to be -- to be in
jail and also to be asylum seeker in Israel.
KINKADE: I'm so sorry to hear that. You've been through such heartache. What is your future hold? Have you received the deportation letter? And
if so, what will happen? Where will you go?
[10:39:37] HAROON: Not yet, I did not receive the deportation letter. But there's others from my community who received the deportation letter. And,
again, it's really shameful on Israel to do this on refugees. And for me is like -- is meaning that Israeli is denying the history of Jewish like --
because if we will said that we fled such a difficult condition. And here we cannot get protection from Israeli, from the Israeli government or
Israeli country, so, that's mean, Israel is denying their own history as a Jewish being suffered for like everywhere in the world, and being refugees
everywhere in the world.
And again, it's really disturbing because sending back to our served the country, that's mean to be deported to Uganda or Rwanda, this is the
country that the Israeli government deported many of asylum seekers to there. But the problem is that these countries are denying to have
agreement with Israel. They said they have no such agreement with Israel to receive asylum seekers from Israel. So, that's mean we are not going to
get protection there even in those countries.
KINKADE: And as I understand that Israel introduced a law mid last year saying they would take 20 percent of your pay packet and only give it back
to you once you left the country. Will you take that money? Will you leave? Is there a place that you would go?
HAROON: Actually, this is not the issue of the money. Yes, Israel did that, they took 20 percent of asylum seekers -- of African asylum seekers
salaries. And this is the law in Israel, but the issue is that you are comparing between your life and the money. So, for sure you will choose to
stay alive, and even though the alternative if here in Israel is to be in jail forever. So, we have only two choices of being deported to a certain
country that we could face death or another journey of being refugee or being in jail in Israel.
So, I don't think the people will choose to leave Israel because they -- we already know the consequences of the deportation. Because we have many of
our friends who have been deported to a third country, they had to flee again to Europe, and some of them, unfortunately, will be in slavery in
Libya and some of them were killed by ISIS in Libya as well.
KINKADE: Yes, no amount of money is worth more than your life as you put it so well. Monim Haroon, we really appreciate your time today, and we
wish you all the best.
HAROON: Thank you so much for having me and I just want to -- like a small sentence that I really -- when I was an activist in Sudan, I was calling
for a Democratic liberal country, the country that treats all its citizens equally. But now I have a wider perspective of human rights. So, really I
wanted to be able to go back to my country and be able to build a Democratic country, a liberal kind country that respect human rights and
serve the human dignity.
KINKADE: Monim Haroon, great to have you with us, and thank you very much.
HAROON: Thank you.
KINKADE: And still to come on CONNECT THE WORLD, it's not just way Israel -- it's not just Israel where African migrants face persecution. One quiet
Italian town is shaken after a violent rampage. We'll have that story next.
[10:45:54] KINKADE: Well, this was the scene in Italy on Saturday after a shooting rampage that police say targeted African migrants. Six people
were wounded, and a far-right supporter has been arrested. The city's mayor tells CNN, the shootings were racially motivated. The suspect made a
fascist salute before police arrested him.
He was a candidate for the anti-immigration Northern League Party in local elections last year and lost. Authorities believe his rampage is connected
to the recent murder of an Italian woman for which a Nigerian man was charged. Saturday's shootings underscore racial tensions in Italy, just
one month before national elections.
Well, Barbie joins me now live from Rome, and Barbie, just talk to us about the bigger picture as we have seen, so many thousands of migrants coming to
Europe, coming to Italy. How is this story playing within that wider narrative with the national election happening next month?
BARBIE NADEAU, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, there's really in a lot of concern that this is not going to be an isolated incident that somehow this is
going to inspire other people who have similar sentiments to act the same. The interior minister today, warned extra vigilance, and also cautioned
those running in the elections to sort of tone down this anti-immigration, anti-migrant sentiment and the rhetoric that we've heard so much over the
course of the last few weeks since we had into this election.
You know, at play here, there was the fact that there are still have been 600,000 migrants seeking asylum that have crossed the Mediterranean Sea and
arrived in Italy in the last four years. An Italian are fed up, quite frankly, and the politicians are playing on that sentiment, and it's just
really become a very poisonous environment as we get into this election, Lynda.
KINKADE: All right, Barbie Nadeau, we'll have to leave it there. For now, that good to have you with us on this story, thank you.
Well, coming up, we're staying in the region where experts are preserving Michael Angelo's masterpiece. We're going to go to the Vatican for a look
at what it takes to protect the Sistine Chapel's priceless painting, next. Stay with us.
[10:50:50]KINKADE: Welcome back. Well, the Sistine Chapel is high in the list of must-see attractions in Rome. And though those visitors can't
actually touch Michael Angelo's masterpiece, they are damaging it. That's why the experts come in. CNN's Delia Gallagher, went inside the chapel to
see what it takes to protect its precious paintings.
DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: The Sistine Chapel is getting a checkup. For a whole month each year from 5:30 p.m. to midnight, when
all the tourists are gone, a team from the Vatican comes in to clean it, check for damage, and report on the health of some of the world's most
Its painstaking process, scaffolding must be erected and taken down each night and cannot be attached to the walls to avoid damaging the painting.
One of the biggest problems of the Sistine Chapel is humidity, 25,000 visitors a day pose a risk for the paintings.
FRANCESCA PERSEGATI, CHIEF RESTORER, VATICAN MUSEUMS: You know, our bodies are made of water. So, when we visit the Sistine Chapel, we bring in
humidity, and we heat, everybody heats the environment like a bulb, you say, 80-watt bulb.
GALLAGHER: Humidity causes condensation and a veil of salt forms on the famous frescoes painted in the 14th and 1500, which damages the color and
the plaster it's painted on.
A laborious technique brushing distilled water onto thin Japanese paper removes the salt layer. To combat humidity, there are 30 hidden sensors
measuring temperature, air circulation and number of visitors in the chapel. Dr.Vittoria Cimino, the Vatican's conservationist, monitors the
air quality in the chapel
VITTORIA CIMINO, CHIEF CONSERVATIONIST, VATICAN MUSEUMS (through translator): The temperature must be between 22 to 24 degrees Celsius.
Humidity must be medium-high, there are very precise markers and we have to verify that the system respects them.
GALLAGHER: The frescoes in this chapel are over 500 years old. Now, back then, there was no artificial lighting. The only light that came in was
daylight through these upper windows. And of course, being the Pope's private chapel, far fewer people came through here as well. So, and
restoration wasn't really a priority then.
Today, with new technology and lighting, not only is there better cleaning, but it has revealed to restores the original colors used by Michael Angelo.
The world was shocked after a cleaning and restoration in the '90s to discover that Michael Angelo, actually used vivid greens, purples, and
reds. Because for centuries, it was assumed that he painted in dark, subdued tones. But that was only the accumulation dirt and grime.
The next time you're in the Sistine Chapel, look out for this, little black marks, squares, and triangles on some of the paintings. They are called
witnesses, deliberately left as evidence for future restores, to give an idea of just how dark the paintings were before.
To make sure the colors stay vibrant, a color team measures any changes to tone by taking pictures of the frescoes with a multi-wavelength camera,
which is then analyzed by a computer. Dr. Fabio Morresi is in charge of color analysis.
FABIO MORRESI, ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, VATICAN SCIENTIFIC LABORATORY (through translator): We can see the color of every single pixel and compare it
throughout the years. It's important because we can detect any changes even before they are visible to the human eye.
GALLAGHER: A behind the scenes labor of love, so that the past may continue to brighten our future. Delia Gallagher, CNN, Rome.
KINKADE: Well, for your parting shots, it's not the wonder of a painter, but the wonder of nature itself. That's what we end on. Have a look at
this stunning landscape, impressive, right? But, all the more once you know that it was taken on Mars. NASA got this photos from its Curiosity
Rover that taken on a clear day just before the Martian Winter. Scientists are excited because it gives them a map-like view of the key spots the
Curiosity has hit during its five-year journey on the red planet.
[10:55:04] KINKADE: Absolutely incredible, where you can always follow the story's the team is working on by going to Facebook.com/CNNConnect. And
you can find all the best bits from our show up there. You can also tweet me by going to Twitter @LyndaKinkade. Well, that's CONNECT THE WORLD, I'm
Lynda Kinkade. I will be back tomorrow, from all of us here in Atlanta, (INAUDIBLE), in Abu Dhabi, and in London. We hope you in joining us again
tomorrow, thank you so much four watching.
KINKADE: Hello, I'm Lynda Kinkade and this is CNN NEWS NOW.