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Senator Elizabeth Warren Visits Border Migrant Center; Government Reveals Plan to Eventually Reunite Families; Migrant Boy Walked Out of Border Childcare Center; Glenn Beck Walks Off Live Interview; Fox Commentator Apologizes for Racist Remark; Tech Stocks Hit Record High Despite Trade War Fears; Chefs Reflect on Anthony Bourdain's Death; Canadians Weigh In On Life Below Their Southern Border. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired June 24, 2018 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:04] ANA CABRERA, CNN ANCHOR: You are in the CNN NEWSROOM. Thank you for staying with me. I'm Ana Cabrera in New York. And on the U.S. border with Mexico this weekend little boys and girls, many of them without their parents, are behind locked doors on concrete floors sleeping in what amounts to cages.
That is how U.S. Senator Elizabeth Warren describes the conditions inside a migrant children and family shelter in south Texas. She visited this center a short time ago and calls what she saw inside disturbing.
CNN's Polo Sandoval is in McAllen, Texas.
And Polo, this was Senator Warren's first time inside one of these sprawling migrant centers on the border. Why was it important to her to see it firsthand and what did she tell reporters when she came out?
POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Ana, the senator has certainly added her voice to the chorus of Democratic critics who have been speaking out against President Trump's zero tolerance policy. Many of those lawmakers have been traveling to those facilities that process some of these families that are detained along that southwest border. The facility you see behind me is the one that she got an inside look of.
This is a facility that we have seen through handout images that were provided by the U.S. government just last week alone, and you see those people being housed behind that chain link fencing. And also covering themselves with that mylar, that aluminum-like-looking material as well.
This is also happening at the same time as we are learning that a child at a separate facility, one that is privately owned, privately operated and contracted by the U.S. government to care for some of these children, we now know that a 15-year-old child walked off one of those locations in Brownsville, Texas, not far from where we are. Only about 50 miles or so from our location here in McAllen, Texas.
What we know at this point is that this is a very important distinction to point out here, Ana. This child was not one of those recently separated from their parents so that their parents could be prosecuted but instead this 15-year-old Honduran boy crossed the border illegally unaccompanied and undocumented. It was part of the trend that we've followed for many, many years.
Of course in recent weeks, though, there is -- this is renewed attention on these locations that care for these children to make sure that these locations are caring for these children properly. Southwest Key, who owns and operates this facility, made -- in a statement points out that they are not a detention center, they are simply a childcare facility. So when one of these children wants to leave the facility, there's not a whole lot they can do except accompany or at least walk with that child to the perimeter and ask them to remain on premises once they cross that line, then authorities have to be called.
And that's exactly what took place yesterday afternoon. The Brownsville Police Department confirming for me that yes, they searched for this child in and around the center in Brownsville, Texas. But now sources familiar with this investigation and with that transpired now telling us that that child made it to Mexico and is in contact with their parents or at least relatives, rather, in the United States and is in the process of trying to make it back to his native Honduras -- Ana.
CABRERA: Polo Sandoval in McAllen, Texas. Thank you again.
Senator Warren there earlier likely responding to President Trump calling for deportations without judges or court cases. The Trump administration today also revealed its plan to reunify immigrant families separated near the U.S.-Mexico border.
Still there is confusion and lots of questions lingering on about the current status of hundreds of children who had already been separated from their parents. Though the Homeland Security Department insists it knows the location of every single child in question.
I want to go now to CNN White House correspondent Boris Sanchez.
Boris, what are we learning today about the president's evolving policies on immigration?
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, Ana. Yes. President Trump today took a step in a direction that he had not before. In a tweet this morning he essentially called for these immigrants to not be afforded due process, to not have a typical legal procedure or a case completed before they're deported.
Here's what the president tweeted. He writes, quote, "We cannot allow all of these people to invade our country. When somebody comes in, we must immediately with no judges or court cases bring them back from where they came. Our system is a mockery to good immigration policy and law and order. Most children come without parents. Our immigration policy is laughed at all over the world."
The president then went on to make a case for merit-based immigration. Notable that President Trump is calling these people who are fleeing political oppression, violence, economic despair, invaders essentially.
You did note that DHS in conjunction with the Department of Health and Human Services put out more details on their plan to try to reunify some of these families, acknowledging that there are still some 2,000 children that have been separated from their parents in the custody of Health and Human Services.
Effectively here's how it's going to work. They will remain under HHS custody until their parents' deportation proceedings are completed. Then at that point if a judge or legal proceedings determine that their family -- their parents should be deported they'll be reunified before deportation.
[18:05:08] If a judge ultimately grants a stay to their parents, their parent can then apply to become a sponsor of the child, and they can be reunified and remain within the United States. Both agencies are acknowledging that there is some work to do when it comes to collecting information from these families. They want to beef up data bases that contain personal details about them, in part to help facilitate communication between these families.
Further, there are still some unanswered questions because it's still unclear who logistically will be responsible for the physical reunification of these families. And the one thing that really stands out about these details coming from these agencies is the fact that there is no timetable for reunification. The process of determining someone's standing legally, whether they'll be deported or not, can take a significant amount of time, Ana.
CABRERA: Sometimes six to nine months is what I've read.
Thank you, Boris Sanchez, at the White House.
Let's talk about all this with David Gergen, CNN's senior political analyst and a former White House adviser to four past presidents.
David, this is now week two. The White House has gotten incredibly bad headlines. Lawmakers on both sides of the aisle have come out condemning this policy that's leading to the deportation and the separation of parents and children, some saying they're appalled by what they are saying. The president had to cave. He signed that executive order.
What did Trump gain from all of this?
DAVID GERGEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think had he not signed the executive order and this weekend we were still talking about children being separated out. I think he would have had a very, very heavy blow to -- not only to his presidency but to prospects for the midterm, which he clearly has very much in his mind as he goes through this, what's now becoming an ordeal.
Having acted, I think he lightened the load some, Ana, but overall the confusion that has surrounded the aftermath of signing that executive order, the sheer incompetence the government has had so far in telling us exactly where these kids are, where the parents are, how they -- you know, they say they have track of all of them. Well, let's prove it. They've only reunited 500. There's a lot more to go. And we know parents are being sent back now without children.
GERGEN: Sent back to Central America. So the government doesn't yet have this in hand. As long as that's the case, Ana, and it's at the top of news programs, as it should be right now, it is -- it is a continuing negative for the president. And I think it leaves an indelible stain upon his presidency.
You know, people are not going to forget this quickly. It's one of those kind of searing moments when you see a reality you just can't stand to look at and you realize your government is responsible for this. As we saw with Katrina and we've seen in other instances in recent years, a president pays a heavy price for that.
CABRERA: And yet this president has been very proud of his hard line immigration stands, and he credits that in part for motivating his base to turn out to the polls.
GERGEN: Yes, he has.
CABRERA: Ultimately getting him elected. And now add this to the mix today, David. The president writing this in a tweet. "We cannot allow all of these people to invade our country. When somebody comes in we must immediately with no judges or court cases bring them back from where they came."
I mean, the ACLU says this is completely unconstitutional. I'm curious what you think about it.
GERGEN: I don't know why he insists on doing these impulsive things. This is very much like the travel ban. You know, the law here is quite clear that whoever is in the United States, under Article 5 of the Bill of Rights said no person, not no citizen, but no person inside the United States can be deprived of due process of law. And that's what we thought we have, even Republicans have been talking about the rule of law and process and that sort of thing.
So I think he's prolonged this controversy unnecessarily. I just can't imagine we're going to strip these people of all their rights when they arrive here. I cannot imagine this inhumanity is going to go on much longer. But I must say, he's got to show some executive skill here now. He's got to clean this thing up real fast because the longer it goes on the longer we are making people suffer. That's the most important thing. People who are suffering.
Secondly, it is not -- we are not the laughingstock of the world. People around the world are crying now, looking for American leadership, feeling somewhat abandoned by the Americans. We have to step up on these issues.
CABRERA: This immigration issue cannot be done or solved by American -- America alone either. I mean, former Homeland Security secretary Jeh Johnson told me last week that the U.S. isn't going to stop the flow of migrants coming across the border until their home situation improves.
[18:10:03] David, has this administration done enough to address the root of the problem in these countries south of the border?
GERGEN: I'm so glad you brought that up. It is the un-discussed issue here. And this became apparent, you know, when children started arriving here in big waves a couple of years ago. And it looked like we were going to turn people back. And it has become so obvious that if you really want to stop the flow you have to go to the source and we have to help people in Honduras and Guatemala and some of these other countries in Central America establish order and get their countries back on track to, you know, some degree of prosperity or certainly getting rid of the violence, which is prompting so many people to leave.
We have done this before. We worked very closely with Colombia on the drug issues. And look how much Colombia has turned around now. The Medellin. It's a very, very different country. We have the capacity to do this working with partners to be sure including some South American partners, including Canada. We really ought to go down there and try to help them get back on their feet.
We have learned, Ana, also from Mexico, you know, the whole -- we used to have tons and tons of Mexicans crossing the border because conditions in Mexico were adverse, there were no jobs, they didn't have opportunity, all sorts of things were setting them back. There was a lot of corruption. The flow from Mexico is significantly reduced now. Why is that? Because it's better to live in Mexico than it used to be. And that's what we have to do in Central America.
CABRERA: David Gergen, always good to have you with us. Thank you.
GERGEN: Thank you, Ana. Thank you.
CABRERA: A 15-year-old walks out of a facility holding migrant children. But how could this happen? It's much easier than you think. We'll take you live to Brownsville, Texas, just ahead in the CNN NEWSROOM.
[18:15:54] CABRERA: If the situation on the southern border was not chaotic enough, we learned something surprising just a short time ago. That a massive children's shelter in south Texas housing undocumented kids as young as 10 years old is not allowed to stop those kids from just walking out the door. It happened this weekend in Brownsville, Texas. A teenage boy left the migrant children's center for several hours, was missing and unaccounted for. And thankfully has now been located.
With us now is the mayor of Brownsville, Tony Martinez, and the city's chief of police, Orlando Rodriguez.
So, Mr. Mayor, were you aware that this enormous children's shelter was powerless to stop kids from just walking out the door? Can you guys hear me? MAYOR TONY MARTINEZ, BROWNSVILLE, TEXAS: I can hear you.
CABRERA: OK, so, Chief, let me ask you that same question. Did you know that essentially kids were allowed to just leave if they chose to do so?
ORLANDO RODRIGUEZ, BROWNSVILLE, TEXAS CHIEF OF POLICE: Actually no. This is kind of a surprise to me and to my department. That's not the information that we had. But we have it now, which was -- we found it to be a little bit interesting because we just -- we got a call yesterday and that of course started things in motion. But now we do know that that is the policy.
CABRERA: What can you tell us about this boy who went missing from the shelter?
RODRIGUEZ: Well, we do know that he was a 15-year-old boy that was actually placed here pending establishing of relatives here in north Texas which apparently he was being held here in this holding facility. It's more -- we see it now as a placement facility that -- where he was awaiting the outcome of his petition to be placed here. When that didn't work out, we understand that he just left on his own volition yesterday by jumping a fence and going into the Brownsville area yesterday afternoon.
CABRERA: Chief, what kind of regulation or oversight does your city have when it comes to these private facilities?
RODRIGUEZ: Well, actually, we don't have any control, don't have a lot of insight, a lot of information on this. This is something that is a learning experience to us. Not a lot of communication, which is something we want to be working on. And as we were looking at the situation yesterday, basically we were confronted with the situation where a 15-year-old went into the Brownsville area, and we didn't know his status, and of course our concern was for the safety of the individual. And then we now learned that what the policy is and it kind of changes things for us.
CABRERA: What has been the impact of having this shelter housing hundreds, not thousands of undocumented immigrants?
RODRIGUEZ: I'm sorry. Can you repeat that?
CABRERA: What has been the impact on your community having this shelter right there in your backyard, housing all these children, some of them separated from their parents there in the shelter in Brownsville?
You know what? I'm so sorry to all of our viewers and to our guests for the technical difficulties we're having in this segment. We'll see if we can get them back and continue. We'll be right back.
[18:23:48] CABRERA: Welcome back. Right now government officials say there are a little over 11,000 children under the age of 18 being held in detention facilities across the U.S. We can show you the outside of these immigration facilities. Some nothing more than tent cities in the desert in the middle of the summer. We can even take you above them. This is from footage from our drones. But the government will not let us take you inside of them. It will not allow the media or anyone to film. We can't show you the living conditions of the roughly 2,000 children separated from their parents at the border and taken into federal custody.
What do we know? The only recording we have from inside these centers is one piece of audio obtained by the investigative journalists at ProPublica. Now this is what it sounds like inside the facility. Children crying. A 6-year-old girl named Alisson already separated from her mother and begging to be able to call her aunt.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where are you from?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: El Salvador.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Guatemala.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Don't cry.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I want to go with my aunt.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You're going to get there. Look, she will explain it and help you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At least can I go with my aunt? I want her to come. I want my aunt to come so she can take me to her house.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[18:25:13] CABRERA: It's not just the media that's being kept in the dark. Even lawmakers have had trouble getting access to these government-funded facilities to check on these small children.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, we do. We have permission to do this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Congressmen titled to do this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is America. This isn't Moscow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: When lawmakers have gotten inside, many are appalled by what they witnessed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. KAMALA HARRIS (D), CALIFORNIA: I am a career prosecutor. I have visited many prisons and jails. That is a prison. You walk through the halls and the doors clink shut, and there are bars on the windows.
REP. PETER WELCH (D), VERMONT: Three boys, and I assume they were brothers, and they're on these thin mats that are provided. And like spoon style they're holding on to each other for dear life with no idea where their parents were.
REP. LOIS FRANKEL (D), FLORIDA: What I saw in these cages was a sea of humanity, little girls, little boys, fathers holding their daughters, mothers holding their daughters who have fled horrible conditions in other countries.
REP. ELIZABETH ESTY (D), CONNECTICUT: We saw a 15-year-old young woman with her child. We couldn't talk to her because she was too young. And you think of how afraid you must be to risk your life and your 6-month-old child to make a month-long journey to come to this country, and then you find yourself on a concrete floor covered with mylar.
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO (D), NEW YORK: There's a young boy, a 9-year-old boy from Honduras named Eddie. He was taken from his mom at Eagle Pass, Texas, put on a bus with a federal escort to go 2,000 miles to New York City. Has no idea when he's going to see his mom again. I mean, think about the trauma. What's happening to these kids.
REP. EARL BLUMENAUER (D), OREGON: I just kept thinking about my grandkids, under 6, and what would happen to them if their parents' life were at risk to take a journey of hundreds and in some cases thousands of miles and to have them subjected to that. It's incomprehensible to me.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: These lawmakers' descriptions match pictures the government has released. They show children sleeping on mats locked inside chain link fencing. And again, these are photos the government has released. Photos they're OK with you seeing.
The question, if this is what they're willing to show, what aren't they willing to show? Why not let us in to film?
While we wait for access, at least one other lawmaker was allowed into a facility a few hours ago. Here's Senator Elizabeth Warren describing what she witnessed.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ELIZABETH WARREN (D), MASSACHUSETTS: It's a disturbing picture. There are children by themselves. I saw a 6-month-old baby. Little girls, little boys. There are mothers with their babies and with small children. Family units are together if it's a very small child. But little girls who are 12 years old are taken away from the rest of their families and held separately or little boys. And they're all on the concrete floors in cages.
There's just no other way to describe it. They're big chain link cages on cold concrete floors and metal blankets handed out to people. People who are all just waiting and frightened.
We are people who believe in the worth of every human being. And we do have a system of laws in this country. And when a woman comes here with her 4-year-old son and says I am asking for amnesty, I have been threatened by gangs in my home country, we should at least give her a hearing. And that is the least that is required of us as a country and as human beings.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: As of today Customs and Border Patrol says it has reunited at least 522 children with their parents. It's unclear how many if any of the more than 2,000 children in HHS custody have been reunited. But we will not stop asking questions and trying to get the answers.
Just ahead, a simply bizarre moment here on CNN.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GLENN BECK, CEO, THEBLAZE: No, it's been happening. We want to stop it, and you want to play those games? Have a nice day.
BRIAN STELTER, CNN HOST, RELIABLE SOURCES: What game did I just play?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: What caused that contentious exchange? Next, live on CNN NEWSROOM.
CABRERA: News just in to CNN, Stormy Daniels will be interviewed by federal prosecutors in New York tomorrow. This is part of their investigation into President Trump's former personal attorney, Michael Cohen, according to a source.
One focus of the questioning for Daniels is expected to be that $130,000 hush money payment she received from Cohen in 2016. Her lawyer, Michael Avenatti, declined to comment.
[18:35:07] The "Washington Post" first reported this news.
A stunning moment playing out live on CNN this morning is just the latest example of the sheer divisiveness in our society right now.
Conservative commentator Glenn Beck walked away in the middle of an interview with our Brian Stelter when he was asked about reporter troubles at his media company. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STELTER: I do have to ask you, there's this new headline in "The Daily Beast" saying that your company's in trouble, that you were trying to find a buyer. Is this related to the -- BECK: No.
STELTER: -- point about people not talking to each other? That if you want to create that media company, there's not interest. What's going on with that?
BECK: Wow. Brian, thanks a lot. I think that's the most ridiculous question I've ever heard.
I'm sitting here ready to talk to you about the detaining of children and parents and trying to break families apart, something that has been happening with Janet Reno. That's why it went to the Supreme Court in the first place, with Janet Reno.
It's been happening. We want to stop it, and you want to play those games? Have a nice day.
STELTER: What game did I just play?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: With us now, CNN media analyst Bill Carter.
Bill, I had to do a double take. I was like checking my ear because I was listening to that interview when it was happening live.
BILL CARTER, CNN MEDIA ANALYST: Right.
CABRERA: What just happened there? What do you make of Glenn Beck walking away during a live interview?
CABRERA: Well, there's a couple of things. He talked about the game, and Brian said, what game am I playing?
The game he is playing is called journalism. And he was asking a completely legitimate question, which happens to be in the news, related to this guest.
We don't set up interviews -- no serious journalist sets up interviews and says, I will ask you about this topic and nothing else no matter what is going on with you. That is never agreed to.
And, of course, it just underscores, again, the fact that there are people who think they can control things and will only go on media that's favorable to them. You know, so they go in their separate little corners, and they only give answers to the questions they want to give.
And I think it's -- you know, Ana, I was thinking about comparison. And suppose you were interviewing, let's say, the mayor of New York about the immigrant children brought to New York, and today there was a major subway derailment in New York.
Of course, you'd ask him about that, too. That's in the news. That's perfectly legitimate. So Glenn Beck's company is imploding, which is what the report said, and you have to ask him about it, too. Brian's doing his job.
CABRERA: So you think it was a fair question?
CARTER: Completely fair question. And not in any way posed even hostilely. It was like, saying, you know, this --
CARTER: There was this news report and, you know, what do you have to say about it? It wasn't a hostile question. And, you know, Glenn Beck was so defensive about it and obviously felt -- you know, he couldn't deal with the question. He literally walks off, which is, you know, a statement of sorts that he can't answer the question.
CABRERA: And leading up to that, I was listening to that interview and, really, Brian was trying to have this discourse to try to see the other side when so often, as you point out, people stay in their own echo chambers.
And now, we have Glenn Beck walking off that interview. We've had White House staffers being booted from restaurants. Do you think we'll see more moments like these?
CARTER: Well, I think that, you know, that's a sign that the ugliness that really has started at the top and really was initiated, you know, during the campaign is filtering over into every kind of discourse in the country.
You know, I think the incident at the restaurant did not sound like it was hostile or, you know, angry. It sounded like someone is saying I don't want to serve you because I feel like what you're doing is offensive to my employees. The employees said they didn't want her there.
It's really not much different from the Supreme Court decision about the baker saying he had the right to not bake a cake.
I do think, though, that the general tone is incredibly ugly. I mean, you know, at the same time, you have people complaining about this incident in the restaurant, you have, you know, Sarah Sanders' father tweeting a tweet that looks openly racist. You know, a crazily racist tweet.
And you have the President going on a rant about, you know, John McCain who is terminally ill, you know, like using his Pocahontas racist taunt again.
This is ugliness and it is seeping out. And I don't know that you can control it. I mean, people are very angry and very upset, and they're reacting. Their reaction is getting to the point where it's not really, you know, controllable in a usual civil way because those norms have been blown up.
CABRERA: Yes. I want to play another exchange that happened this weekend. This one on Fox News just today.
CABRERA: This is David Bossie, Trump's former senior campaign aide. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[18:39:59] DAVID BOSSIE, FORMER DEPUTY CAMPAIGN MANAGER TO THE DONALD TRUMP: Michael Hayden posted a picture of Auschwitz.
JOEL PAYNE, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Yes, that liberal --
BOSSIE: Donny Deutsch is talking --
PAYNE: Yes, that liberal Michael Hayden.
BOSSIE: Look -- look, you're out of --
PAYNE: Yes, that screaming liberal Michael Hayden.
BOSSIE: You're out of your cotton-picking mind. Listen --
PAYNE: Cotton-picking mind?
BOSSIE: Listen, you guys are --
PAYNE: Brother, let me tell you something.
BOSSIE: You guys are --
PAYNE: Let me tell you something. I've got some --
BOSSIE: You guys are out of your mind.
PAYNE: I've got some --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: Well, Bossie did take to Twitter a little later saying -- during a heated segment on "Fox & Friends" today, I should have chosen my words more carefully and never used the offensive phrase that I did. I apologize to Joel Payne, Fox News, and its viewers.
Bill, was that a dog whistle or did Bossie not even realize the racial undertones of what he had said?
CARTER: Well, you know, I've seen people trying to defend it by saying well, you know, that's a common phrase in the south. David Bossie is from Boston. I don't think he grew up saying that phrase.
I think it's kind of extraordinary that he couldn't hear that if he was saying it to a Black commentator. It's just so over the top and outrageous. And unfortunately, it's emblematic of what's going on.
People are saying things in the past 10 years, 20 years, we thought we'd gotten away from. I mean, I think it's kind of extraordinary.
And, you know, what is Fox going to do about it? Will they have that guy back on? Is an apology enough?
I mean, we've seen other people apologize. And obviously, MSNBC had an issue with Joy Reid, and that's sort of been acceptable. So I don't know that it's necessarily going to mean the end of this guy's, you know, career as a commentator, but it was clearly a really offensive thing to say.
CABRERA: Bill Carter, as always, thank you very much for your perspective. We appreciate it.
CARTER: Sure thing, Ana.
CABRERA: All right. Let's get a quick check of what you can expect from your stocks this week, especially after the Dow took a hit on Friday over fears of a trade war. Here's CNN's Alison Kosik with this week's "Before the Bell."
ALISON KOSIK, CNN GENERAL ASSIGNMENT CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Ana. What trade war? Yes, the Dow has been whacked by trade fears, but tech stocks are on fire. The NASDAQ hit a record high on Wednesday. So did Facebook, Amazon, Netflix, and Google parent Alphabet.
So what's going on? Many investors see big tech as a safe place to park their money, unlike big multinationals that do a lot of business in China. Names like 3M and Caterpillar have been whipsawed by the headlines on trade.
Looking ahead, this week marks the end of an era for the first time in 110 years. General Electric won't be in the Dow Jones Industrial Average. On Tuesday, it will be replaced by Walgreens.
G.E. is dealing with a serious cash crisis. Shares lost half their value last year and are down another 25 percent this year. The company is selling off businesses to try to pay down debt.
In New York, I'm Alison Kosik.
CABRERA: Our thanks to Alison.
The death of CNN's Anthony Bourdain is causing people to step back, to have some difficult conversations. Just ahead, we'll show you how his fellow chefs are now taking the opportunity to talk about suicide within their own profession. You're live in the CNN NEWSROOM.
[18:47:36] CABRERA: More than two weeks after he tragically took his own life in a French hotel room, the death of our CNN colleague Anthony Bourdain is still sending shock waves throughout the culinary world and beyond.
His loss loomed large as chefs, writers, and food critics gathered at the Food & Wine Classic in Aspen. They and many other groups are now determined to have difficult conversations about suicide.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) CABRERA (voice-over): Two weeks after Anthony Bourdain's death, chefs throughout the culinary community are still feeling his loss.
ANDREW ZIMMERN, TRAVEL CHANNEL HOST: I'm still in shock and surprise. I get very, very sad. I'm still sad thinking of someone who is in so much pain that that was the choice and the solution.
ASHLEY CHRISTENSEN, OWNER, RALEIGH CHEF: It's warming to hear all these stories about what Anthony Bourdain meant to people and how they're living their lives, I think, to make sure that for every one of those great stories we tell, we remember to bring light to the issue of mental health.
ANTHONY BOURDAIN, FORMER CNN HOST: Suddenly, I look at the hamburger and I find myself in a spiral of depression.
CHRISTENSEN: He was fairly on the sleeve about things that he had dealt with that felt like he had overcome them, and I think that should be a great lesson to us.
CABRERA (voice-over): "Food & Wine" contributor Kat Kinsman created the website, Chefs with Issues, to open dialogue about depression and other mental health issues among the culinary community.
KAT KINSMAN, SENIOR FOOD AND DRINKS EDITOR, EXTRA CRISPY: The thing that most people don't know is the ripple effect that happens from this. Since his death, I have found out about four different suicides in the industry. This is happening. This is going to be an ongoing problem. We have to talk about it.
RENEE ERICKSON, 2016 JAMES BEARD AWARD FOR BEST CHEF: NORTHWEST: It's all of our jobs to be as good of a friend as we can be and trying to like help people when they can but also just really paying attention.
CABRERA (voice-over): Kinsman says there's a simple way to honor Bourdain every time you go out to eat.
KINSMAN: If people really want to pay tribute to Tony and his legacy and everything he taught us about food and life, you have to think about the people who bring you that food and bring you those experiences.
Go to your local restaurants. Get to know those people. Respect them.
CABRERA: The conversation continues here on CNN with "FINDING HOPE: BATTLING AMERICA'S SUICIDE CRISIS," hosted by Anderson Cooper. That is coming up in just a few moments at 7:00 Eastern.
[18:50:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CABRERA: In this week's episode of "UNITED SHADES OF AMERICA," W. Kamau Bell take the trip up north to Canada to see if it's the progressive paradise a lot of Americans think it is. And, of course, he asked Canadians what they think of life below their southern border.
Take a listen to some of the responses he got.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
W. KAMAU BELL, CNN HOST: What would you say is the biggest difference between Canada and the United States of America?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In Canada, no matter where I go, people are really informed about what's going on in Canada and what's going on in the world. And some of the places I saw in the U.S. really don't know a whole lot. And I'm sorry.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I really have been cautious with what I say.
BELL: Oh, it's OK. I can't act like that's not true.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: But it's not like what's happening in the U.S. There's a lot more --
[18:55:02] BELL: No, let's --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- more understanding.
BELL: Let's talk about this. What do you mean about this?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well --
BELL: What does that -- what do you mean by what's happening in the --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, south of the border type situation.
BELL: I don't think, in my perspective, with maybe, like --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
BELL: -- south of the border?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
BELL: But in this case, I do. From your perspective, what's going on south of the border?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You know, people are staying in their section, whether they're White, Black, Asian. I think that, in Canada, there is a lot of that understanding.
You know, there's a lot of Americans, when they come up here, they go, oh, it's really like that up here? You know, I can walk safely, I can do this. And it -- it is always like this? I say, yes, this is Canada.
BELL: Yes, yes. (END VIDEO CLIP)
CABRERA: W. Kamau Bell joins us live from Oakland, California.
Kamau, in those discussions with Canadians, did you get the sense that their perception of Americans has actually changed because of or during the Trump presidency?
BELL: Yes. I mean, there is a clear idea that when Obama was president, they felt differently about us than they felt when we elected President Trump.
There is -- you know, the way that we sort of, many of us in America, condescend and criticize Mexico, it's the same exact thing that's happening from Canada to us right now because of the Trump administration.
CABRERA: There were people, I recall, who threatened to leave the U.S. if Trump got elected, and you actually talked to one guy who did. Why did he leave and how are things working out for him?
BELL: I mean, the funny thing about this guy is -- his name's Mark Nykanen, he used to be a journalist at NBC News -- he left twice.
He left during the Bush administration. And then when we elected Obama, he's like, OK, I think it's safe to come back. And then the night that Trump was elected, him and his wife decided to go back.
And it's going great from up there. He feels like he shouldn't have left to come back during the Obama administration because of the fact of Canada, at its core, has an idea -- and it's not perfect. We also talked to an activist about murdered and missing indigenous women. But there's an idea of inclusion and taking care of your people that we don't have in this country.
CABRERA: And one way they are taking care of their people is through their health care system, which is often idealized by people on the American left. Are there lessons we can learn from the Canadian way?
BELL: Yes. Canada has a lot of criticisms of its own health care system, but the minute they hear about our system, they go, oh, yes, this is way better up here. They understand -- they put resources into taking care of their people in ways that we don't put those resources in taking care of the people.
We take it into -- we put it into other areas that we don't -- that we frankly don't need it and don't help society. So they understand about the importance of the government to provide a healthier lifestyle for its people than we do.
CABRERA: Is it more expensive?
BELL: I mean, I'll take higher taxes over Affordable Health Care any day. So, yes, obviously, those -- the prices come someplace, but nothing's perfect. Canada's not perfect, but I do think that the direction that they're leaning into is the direction that we should be pursuing.
CABRERA: Americans often view Canada as maybe a milder, more polite version of the U.S. What did you learn about Canadian culture that makes it distinctive from American culture?
BELL: I think that they are more conscious of themselves as an international place and the place where more diversity and more -- and new people sort of help strengthen the society in a way that, in America, we pay a lot of lip service to that but it's not actually how -- it's not embedded into our policies.
I mean, a lot of people who are pursuing refugee status in this country have actually moved up to Canada. And they actually are overwhelming Canada's refugee system because they think Canada is the thing they thought America was.
So I think that it's certainly -- we think of it as America Junior, but I think of it as hopefully America's future.
CABRERA: Well, that's interesting. I know you also had some fun, got an up-close look at one of Canada's favorite sports, curling. What was it like to play?
BELL: I mean, I'm not on the ice often. Ice sports are not most Black Americans' number one thing to do, so --
BELL: But I know some of us do play hockey but, you know, I found out, I actually -- I'm actually pretty good at curling.
BELL: You'll find out tonight. I do fall a few times, but maybe that's what I should've been doing instead of television. Maybe I should be a curler.
CABRERA: Do you think you found a new calling?
BELL: You know, I'm always looking for more jobs. I just had a third child so I'm always looking for new jobs.
CABRERA: Well, tell us a little bit about the sport. Because a lot of us became just a little bit familiar during the Olympics, but it's still a little foreign to a lot of Americans.
BELL: Yes. The thing about curling is that it's a sport that anybody can do of any size or health level. I mean, it's really -- like we saw giant, like six-foot-five, athletic-looking men there, and then there was a tiny woman there who was -- a tiny, older woman there who was doing the sport too.
So it's actually -- it's sort of a very Canadian thing that everybody can play and everybody can be good at it, no matter what their size or health level is. Or ages.
CABRERA: I look to -- I look forward to seeing you in action tonight.
W. Kamau Bell, thank you for joining us.
BELL: Thank you.
CABRERA: As always, tune in for his all-new episode of "UNITED SHADES OF AMERICA" tonight at 10:00 Eastern and Pacific, only on CNN.
[19:00:00] I'm Ana Cabrera in New York. Thank you for spending part of your Sunday afternoon with me. It's great to have you with me. Have a great night.