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Report: Roger Stone Aid Who Was Wikileaks Back-Channel Defies Mueller Grand Jury Subpoena; Mueller Increases Focus on Roger Stone With New Moves; Second Manafort Trial Begins in September So Labor Day Deadline Not Possible for Mueller; Fox Host Expresses Views on Illegal and Legal Immigration Shockingly; Charlottesville and State Of Emergency As Neo-Nazis Say They Will Celebrate The Anniversary; Trump Renews Attacks on NFL Players Who Are Protesting; Questions Grow About A Mysterious Recess at The First Manafort Trial; Furious Judge Orders Playing with Departed Immigrants to Return. Aired 2-2:30p ET
Aired August 10, 2018 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00] BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: Hi there, you are watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for being with me.
We start with just the latest twist in this Russia investigation as the investigative walls appear to be closing in on long time Trump friend and adviser Roger Stone. Special Counsel Robert Mueller has his sights set straight on Stones' inner circle and one of the witnesses is defying him by refusing to appear. This guy's not showing up for his grand jury testimony that was set to happen for today.
Andrew Miller is a Stone associate who tried to fight Mueller's subpoena by arguing that Mueller's appointment was unconstitutional, but the judge handed down a 93-page opinion, essentially saying that Mueller's appointment is valid. Miller and his lawyer are now gearing up for another round of legal battles hoping to appeal to the grand jury order once again.
All of this is happening as Robert Mueller just subpoenaed the man who Stone said was his Wikileaks back channel and another layer to this today, another close Stone friend the woman known as the Manhattan Madam, Kristin Davis, is taking the stand before the grand jury in the investigation. So, let's talk this all out with Dana Bash, she's our CNN chief political correspondent and CNN legal analyst and Robert Mueller's former special assistance at the DOJ, Michael Zeldin, so good to see both of you and Dana, bottom line, the walls seem to be closing in on Roger Stone.
DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Ever since we saw the most recent indictment that Robert Mueller put out there, it was pretty clear that there was a description of an unnamed person who was Roger Stone. That was a giant red blinking light that Roger Stone is in trouble and this is another. It's actually just a reminder that there is understandably a lot of focus on the Manafort trial. There is a lot of focus on whether or not the president will ever sit down for an interview with Robert Mueller. There's a focus on what really happened in that Trump tower meeting, but then there are characters like Roger Stone who have said publicly often that he had a direct line to the president. Now that might not need anything in terms of presidential culpability but it has a reminder that he is somebody that admitted to having contacts with the Guccifer pseudonym who was effectively a Russian spy, so there are connections and that's just the tip of an iceberg that Robert Mueller has seen the bottom of and all the underneath of and we haven't.
BALDWIN: When you look at, you know, Michael, Andrew Miller, Kristin Davis, this Wikileaks back channel, what does it say when all of these people, your aides are being subpoenaed and you haven't at all, as of today, been contacted by investigators. That cannot be a good sign.
MICHAEL ZELDIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST AND ROBERT MUELLER'S FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANCE AT THE DOJ: No. It could indicate that Roger Stone is, in fact, a target of the grand jury and normally targets of the grand jury are not brought into the grand jury unless they're notified that they are a target and given the opportunity to try to convince the grand jury not to indict them. There are a lot of blinking red lights around here. We're not sure exactly what it is that's under investigation. We've heard that Roger Stone may be under investigation for some of his private financial dealings but more likely with these witnesses, this relation to information that he's alleged to have received from Wikileaks which was then further distributed, potentially, a violation of the computer fraud and abuse act.
So, there's a lot for Roger Stone to be concerned about with these three witnesses, but one of them just -- sort of didn't appear in court today so that he could appeal the decision of that judge that you referenced that said that the special counsel was appointed lawfully and had subpoena power. They're gearing up for an appellate fight here and that will drag this thing out for a long time.
BALDWIN: Let me keep the two of you around. Michael, on this Andrew Miller who's refusing to comply, Jessica Schneider's the reporter that's been covering this story for us today and tell me more about him and why he's not showing up.
JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So, he refused to go to court today to appear before the grand jury, Brooke, so he's got the legal side of this, the legal fight. His lawyers say they plan to continue to fight the special counsel's authority. They say its unconstitutional. They did that in court today. Andrew Miller was found in contempt but what's interesting here the judge put the contempt charge on hold while miller's lawyers appeal.
[14:05:00] That's the legal wrangling here but who is Andrew Miller. He's yet another associate of Roger Stone who's of interest to the special counsel. He worked for Roger Stone maintaining emails, but his lawyer has made clear he's only had limited contact with Roger Stone since 2014. Stone has said previously that Andrew Miller played a limited role in the 2016 campaign, but Stone released a statement today saying that miller had no knowledge of any Russian collusion, knew nothing about Wikileaks, so Roger Stone really there saying, you know, why does the special counsel want to talk to this guy, he shouldn't really be of interest to them in this broad Russian collusion probe. The key here is that, you know, Mueller's team they're keying in on
Roger Stone, his interactions with Wikileaks and now they want to talk to everyone in Stone's orbit who is in touch with him around that time and really get what they know. Andrew Miller, he's defying this. We're seeing the Manhattan Madam in court today. We know another associate of Roger Stone has now agreed to comply with the subpoena and, Brooke, the key to that is in September 7th, that's six days past the September 1st deadline that Rudy Giuliani had sort of arbitrarily set earlier this week, so we know that the Mueller investigation is going full steam ahead and its going to continue into September, Brooke?
BALDWIN: Speaking of that deadline, Jessica, thank you. Michael over to you. We keep seeing Rudy Giuliani come on TV and radio shows and say September 1 this thing is going to be wrapped. Really?
ZELDIN: When Rudy Giuliani first entered the world of Trump and this case, he said it would be wrapped up in two weeks. That was a couple of months ago. Any one who relies on Rudy Giuliani for information about timelines that are outside of his control I think is making a mistake. Mueller will set the timeline and he'll determine when its ready to go. Obviously, Manafort is going to trial in late September so Mueller is not shutting down on September 1st. Rudy's comments were investigations of this sort cannot continue 60 days up until an election which is just made up. We're all better off not listening with, you know -- sort of to what Giuliani says about dates. They're made up.
BASH: If I just might add, Michael, knows this --
BASH: Michael knows this far better than I, but when it comes to that 60-day window that Michael just referred to, there are no rules or regulations --
BALDWIN: That's not a thing.
BASH: -- even customs that say there can't be any action. What the tradition is, is that there are no overt actions dealing with a candidate for office between Labor Day and election day. Now, the president is not on the ballot, but the theory behind pushing the September 1st date is that he's not officially on the ballot but he is metaphorically and politically on the ballot very much in these midterm elections.
BALDWIN: Dana Bash and Michael Zeldin, thank you so much.
Coming up next, it only took one game of the NFL preseason and President Trump's already engaged in a feud with players over, you guess it, the national anthem. How much of this, though, is political strategy on Trump's part? And what is the NFL's next move?
Also, her anti-immigration rant was beyond dog whistle. Criticizing massive demographic changes in America, does Fox News have a white anxiety problem and can comments like these ever be walked back? Also, Kanye West at a rare loss for words when pushed over his support
for President Trump, wait until you see this moment. You're watching CNN. I'm Brooke Baldwin.
[14:10:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: Welcome back. I'm Brooke Baldwin. This weekend marks one year since a group of racists marched through the streets of Charlottesville, Virginia. One year since one of them ran over a young woman bravely speaking out against them and killed her. One year since the president of the United States said that there were fine people on both sides. He said that not just once, by the way, he said it again even after all of the backlash. Here we are one year later, we're discussing race and once again the most heated of ways of the president today renewing his attacks on these football players after several of them took a knee or raised a fist. He says that they're unable to define they're outrage.
And he says NFL games which are played on American soil, by the way, are not the places to protest. On top of all of this, you have this Fox News host blatant citing illegal and legal immigration that the America she loves doesn't exist any more as demographic changes.
[14:15:00] she unapologetically and so blatantly cites race the America she sees and last night when Spike Lee whose new movie profiles a real-life confrontation with the KKK was asked about Charlottesville and how the racists weren't even wearing masks, this is what Spike Lee had to say about racists in America and who is speaking to them.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SPIKE LEE, DIRECTOR: Since this guy's got in the White House it's not even a dog whistle. It's a bullhorn, and then also, we've seen a rise on the right, it's not just Americans, it's worldwide.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: Kanye West has a different take speaking out in support of the president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KANYE WEST, ENTERTAINER: Everyone around me tried to pick my candidate for me and then told me every time I said I liked Trump that I couldn't say it out loud or my career would be over, I get kicked out the black community, because blacks can only be Democrats.
JIMMY KIMMEL, TALK SHOW HOST: You so famously and powerful said George Bush doesn't care about black people it makes me wonder what makes you think that Donald Trump does or any people at all?
Why don't we take a break? We'll come back and Kanye West is here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BALDWIN: I have with me Joe Madison, civil rights activists and Sirius X host of the "Black Eagle" on the urban view channel, Joe, it is always a pleasure. Thank you so much for coming on.
JOE MADISON, CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIVISTS, RADIO HOST: Any time.
BALDWIN: So, let's start with the NFL. I want to run through some of what we just talked about. Trump is tweeting that these players are unable to define their outrage. We know that many of them are calling on criminal justice reform which the president just held meetings on yesterday, so he knows full well, Joe, why they're protesting. He knows.
MADISON: And if he doesn't know, then what he should do is go meet with them and invite them, if they would show up, and listen to what they had to say. You bring them in, hear what they have to say. First of all, let's be honest. These are intelligent young men and what he said is what I used to hear and many of us heard who remember 50 years ago in October, there were two young men, John Carlos and Tommy Smith who stood in Mexico City with their fists in a salute and barefoot and the reason they did it as John Carlos told me was because they want to use that platform to draw attention.
What we have to do is to make sure that President Trump and others and particularly on the right do not rewrite the narrative. It was about police brutality, it was about what randy moss did when he listed I think 17 names of people who had been killed by police and so they know. These are intelligent young men and he's just rewriting it.
BALDWIN: They can define it and he knows it but to your point on have them over if they'd come, have a conversation, I don't know if the president wants to. Let me read you something from Jerry Jones, the Dallas Cowboys owner, this is what he said in a sworn deposition that Donald Trump said to him about this. "This is a very winning, strong issue for me. Tell everybody. You can't win this one. This one lifts me."
So, my take away, Joe, it seems to me that the president eats this up.
MADISON: Oh, he loves it and, by the way, it's a distraction. It is absolutely a distraction. You would think the president of the United States with Mueller breathing down his neck and down the necks of a lot of associates would be far more concerned about his upcoming interview, testimony, whatever he's going to have with the special prosecutor. The reality is, this just simply is a distraction and he's not going to stop these young men from protesting. The reality is, it's a political move. That's all it is.
[14:20:00] BALDWIN: How about -- so Charlottesville, one year ago, happening -- I know.
MADISON: We don't --
BALDWIN: One year ago, happening this weekend. Go ahead, joe. MADISON: What I was going to say, what bothers me the most is you now
have an alt-right group, a group of Neo-Nazi, a group of white supremacists that are coming to have an anniversary. You don't celebrate what happened a year ago in Charlottesville. If anything, they should be a memorial for the young lady that lost her life, but I will say this. I believe they're going to come, there's going to be a handful of them. They were probably more ant-protesters than there will be those that will be there for an anniversary. Who celebrates white supremacy but a white supremacist? Who celebrates Nazism but a Neo-Nazi?
The reality is, I'm more pleased with the pastor of First Baptist Church, a predominantly white church and the pastor of the 19th Street. Guess what they're doing on Sunday at 2:00 pm, they're having communion together at the foot of the Martin Luther King Memorial. That's what America really is about.
BALDWIN: Joe Madison, thank you for coming on. We played the clip just quickly, spike lee, I want to tell everyone to stick around because his film is out today. We're talking to the man that plays the role of David Duke and what that was like for this actor to put on this white robe and the research he did and the things he found. We'll have a fascinating conversation next hour. Thank you.
MADISON: Any time. Thank you.
BALDWIN: Coming up next, turn that plane around. Those words from a federal judge erupting on the Trump administration over their decision to deport two asylum seekers. That judge even threatening to hold Attorney General Jeff Sessions in contempt. Those details are next.
[14:25:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BALDWIN: We have been following the trial of former Trump campaign Paul Manafort, the prosecution was supposed to wrap up today but there's been this long mysterious recess and lawyers are still not back in court. Shimon Prokupecz is standing by -- I know they were talking with white noise machines. What is going on today in this federal courthouse?
SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: We're just getting an update now. Everyone is back in court now. The judge did take the bench and the prosecution is calling its witness, its first witness for the day. There's been a mystery surrounding this, the entire day, the judge took the bench this morning, called both parties to the bench and they've been in this indefinite recess until just moments ago where all the sides have now back in court, the judge is taken the bench and he's told the prosecutors to call their witness.
We don't know what the recess was about. We don't know what the issue was about that caused this long delay. It may have been a juror issue or something else, but certainly for this judge who likes to move things along, who has been keeping things at a pretty steady pace, to have this kind of delay, it had to be something significant, something that concerned him but that seems to have been resolved as the trial is now back under way and its unlikely now that the prosecution will rest their case today. They had hoped to end their case and let the defense start their case, perhaps this afternoon or Monday now.
BALDWIN: OK. Stay close. Let us know when you have more, thank you so much.
BALDWIN: Let's move on to this next one, here's a quote, turn that plane around. That is the urgent command from a federal judge who was in the middle of an asylum hearing concerning a mother and her daughter. Judge Sullivan erupted when had he learned that the government had already put the two asylum seekers on a plane deporting them back to El Salvador. So, through his anger, this judge, even threatened to hold Attorney General Jeff Sessions in contempt. We only have court transcripts but the fury in his words leapt from the page so I want to you hear these words. Let me quote this judge for you right now. This is what he says.
He said, "This is pretty outrageous. Somebody in pursuit of justice who has alleged a credible fear in her mind and is seeking justice in the United States court is just -- is spirited away, while her attorneys are arguing for justice for her. It is outrageous. I'm also directing the government to turn that plane around either now or when it lands. Turn that plane around and bring those people back to the United States. It's outrageous. What else can I do? I'm really upset about that. I really am. I'm sorry to keep going back to it. When you think about it, these people are seeking justice in a United States court."
The words from this judge. Alan Gomez is a lawyer what did you make of what he said?
[14:30:00] ALAN GOMEZ, IMMIGRATION REPORTER, "USA Today": My favorite part of the transcript is when the judge apologized for raising his voice as he was doing. This is clearly an incredibly remarkable case. We've seen a lot of President Trump's immigration policies in court over the past year and a half and I've been covering a lot of them and I have not heard one like this and what upset him so much is that the government had assured the judge that none of the plaintiffs in this case would be deported before Thursday night.
They wanted to give him time to hear the case and to make his -- and to make his ruling and right in the middle of the court hearing, they had taken a break and they found out these people were on the plane back to El Salvador so that's what led to the eruption but more broadly speaking, this is a very important case because it deals with the ability of the U.S. government to limit people who are applying for asylum in this country, the reason Jeff Sessions was personally named in this because it was his decision recently to forbid people claiming domestic and gang violence as reasons to get asylum in the United States to get asylum in the United States. So that's what this judge is hearing and that's why he was so infuriated by what happened yesterday.
BALDWIN: Let me ask you about Melania Trump's parents because we know that this president has repeatedly denounced what he refers to as chain migration. Where adult U.S. citizens can obtain residency for their own families. His mother and father-in-law became citizens by taking advantage of that same program.