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CNN NEWSROOM

CFO of Trump Organization Granted Immunity; Pope Francis Heads to Ireland amid Sexual Abuse Scandals; John McCain Stopping Brain Cancer Treatment; Trump Cancels Pompeo's Visit to Pyongyang; War in Yemen; Trump Lashes Out at Attorney General Jeff Sessions; Tropical Storm Lane; Protecting the Isolated People of the Brazilian Rain Forest. Aired 4-5a ET

Aired August 25, 2018 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


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GEORGE HOWELL, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): The U.S. president's inner circle showing some signs of stress fractures. The man who knows Donald Trump's financial secrets has been granted immunity.

Pope Francis headed to Ireland amid the church's sex abuse crisis. And he is set to meet with some survivors in the coming hours. We'll follow that story.

And tropical storm Lane, it is weakening. But flooding in Hawaii is a major concern as rain there continues to pummel the islands.

Live from CNN World Headquarters in Atlanta, we want to welcome our viewers here in the United States and all around the world. I'm George Howell. The CNN NEWSROOM starts right now.

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HOWELL: At the 4:00 am here on the U.S. East Coast, more cracks in the foundation, people once loyal to the U.S. president, people in his inner circle possibly turning against him.

Here is the latest. We've now learned Mr. Trump's top accountant has been granted immunity by federal prosecutors, the man you see here, Allen Weisselberg, the chief financial officer of the Trump Organization. He's handled all of Mr. Trump's money for many years. This follows the immunity deal given to long-time Trump associate, David Pecker, who runs the "National Enquirer."

A former editor at the tabloid says Pecker used his position to kill negative stories about Mr. Trump and knows all of the worst secrets about the president's life. CNN's Jim Acosta kicks off our coverage.

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JIM ACOSTA, CNN SR. WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): President Trump remained silent as he left with the first lady for a speech in Ohio with a growing list of legal worries hot on his tail. DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: He's my chief financial officer, Allen Weisselberg.

ACOSTA: The latest concern, federal prosecutors have granted immunity to Allen Weisselberg, who once appeared on Mr. Trump's TV show, "The Apprentice."

But, more critically, he's the longtime chief financial officer of the Trump Organization, the president's private company whose finances are cloaked in secrecy. A source on the president's legal team downplayed Weisselberg's cooperation, which could be crucial as prosecutors unravel the plot held by Mr. Trump's former personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, to funnel hush money to women alleging affairs with the president.

The attorney for one of those women, porn star Stormy Daniels, Michael Avenatti, believes more may be at stake.

MICHAEL AVENATTI, ATTORNEY FOR STORMY DANIELS: The only reason then that they would give up immunity to Mr. Weisselberg is if they were looking beyond Michael Cohen. They would need essentially his testimony and cooperation to look at someone else higher up the food chain, if you will.

There's only one person that that is likely to be. And that is Donald Trump.

QUESTION: Are you a hero? Do you think you're a hero now?

MICHAEL COHEN, FORMER ATTORNEY/FIXER FOR DONALD TRUMP: I will leave that up to you.

ACOSTA: Cohen can be heard on an audiotape obtained by CNN talking to Mr. Trump about Weisselberg. The apparent subject? Making payments to cover up the president's past behavior.

And I've spoken to Allen Weisselberg about how to set the whole thing up with...

TRUMP: So, what do we got to pay for this? One-fifty?

COHEN: ... funding. Yes. And it's all the stuff.

ACOSTA: A big question is how the president decides to respond. He once told "The New York Times" an investigation that crept into his family's finances would cross a red line.

QUESTION: Mueller is looking at your finances, your family's finances unrelated to Russia. Is that a red line?

TRUMP: I would say yes. I would say yes.

ACOSTA: Sources tell CNN the president has fumed for months and even in the last several weeks that he would like to fire Attorney General Jeff Sessions One day after Sessions insisted the Justice Department would remain independent, Mr. Trump appeared to mock that notion, tweeting: "Department of Justice will not be improperly influenced by political considerations.

"Jeff, this is great. What everyone wants. So look into all the corruption on the other side," adding, "Come on, Jeff, you can do it. The country is waiting."

ALBERTO GONZALES, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY GENERAL: The president is head of the executive branch. And he decides who serves in his Cabinet. And to continue to criticize the attorney general, I think, makes the president appear weak.

ACOSTA: One person keeping a safe distance from all the drama, Vice President Pence, who steered clear of Mr. Trump's legal turmoil at a speech in Washington. instead, Pence advised the crowd to get their news from word of mouth, not the media.

MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hold the view that the most powerful media in America is not television news, it's not the Internet or social media. I have always believed and still believe the most powerful media in America has always been and will always be word of mouth.

ACOSTA: The president declined to speak to reporters before leaving for Ohio but the image did speak volumes. Even amid all the questions about porn star payoffs, the first lady was by the president's side -- Jim Acosta, CNN, the White House.

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HOWELL: To talk more about this, let's bring in --

[04:05:00]

HOWELL: -- former assistant U.S. attorney David Katz, joining us from Los Angeles.

David, let's talk more about Allen Weisselberg. This is the man who knows where every dollar goes within Mr. Trump's business world.

How significant is it now that he has been granted immunity?

DAVID KATZ, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Well, in week of shocking developments, this is yet another stunner because here is someone who knows where all the bodies are buried, financially speaking, and has worked for the Trump Organization for, I think, at least two decades.

So it is a very significant development. And the fact that he was given immunity meant that he had to talk. And he probably gave a lot of information and also a lot of documents to back them up and the testimony to make it clear how that all fits together regarding Trump and the organization.

HOWELL: We don't know the extent of how far this goes beyond the Cohen investigation.

But the bigger question, how might this fit within the broader investigation?

KATZ: Well, right, once he has immunity, he has to talk. His only peril at that point is to lie. So it makes no sense and I'm sure he has very good counsel, which has told him that you can't lie; you have to come clean. You have to think about your family and about think the truth.

And my point is that he probably knows an awful lot of helpful things about the Trump Organization, in addition to the payment to the actress and Stormy Daniels and how that was all treated and also the former "Playboy" model.

So it is pretty devastating. He also has got the financial records. And you add that to Mr. Pecker from the "National Enquirer," and one of his aides, who were also given immunity. It's a very significant development.

HOWELL: It's also the man who did prepare the taxes, did the taxes and knows where the checks were going. So certainly significant to say the least.

But look, this was a week that began with bad news and ended with worse news for President Trump. Let's take a look at all of the Trump loyalists that have really been front and center these past few days.

Paul Manafort, the former Trump campaign chairman, convicted; Mr. Trump's former attorney, Michael Cohen, his guilty plea that left shock waves. We've learned the CEO of American Media Inc., David Pecker, has been granted immunity and Allen Weisselberg, Mr. Trump's long-time and trusted CFO.

Is this a sign that Mr. Trump's grip on loyalty, which he holds in high, high regard, that it is weakening under the pressure of these investigations?

KATZ: Well, I think his grip has clearly loosened. He has all of these people who have cooperated now. It is reminiscent of what happened to Nixon, when Nixon's campaign manager and also Nixon's Mr. Fix-it had both pleaded guilty and of course we all know the denouement; we know how that one came out. Nixon had to resign the presidency.

HOWELL: All of these men work with Mr. Trump in some form or fashion.

How great of an extent do you feel President Trump is in legal jeopardy?

KATZ: I think his assessment and his advisers' assessment is that he has been in considerable legal jeopardy. I think that is one reason why Giuliani has spent a lot of time appealing to a base and to a public opinion, which is really not legal public opinion.

If you talk to a lot of lawyers, this is not the legal strategy that they would have embarked on. But now Trump has gone down this road with Giuliani. And he's kind of in it to the bitter end.

HOWELL: David Katz, we appreciate your time and legal perspective on this. We'll keep in touch with you.

KATZ: Thank you.

HOWELL: CNN has exclusively obtained a copy of an agreement signed between American Media Incorporated, which is the parent company of the "National Enquirer," and the former doorman, who told CNN he has knowledge of an alleged relationship between president Donald Trump that he had with a former housekeeper.

He claims that relationship resulted in a child. An attorney for Dino Sajudin says that his client was released from the contract that prohibited him from discussing the matter with anyone. But he is now free to talk about the agreement.

The contract, which appears to have been signed in November of 2015, states that AMI had exclusive rights to Sajudin's story but does not mention the details of the story itself beyond saying this, quote, "source shall provide AMI with information regarding Donald Trump's illegitimate child," end quote.

In April, when the former Trump World Tower doorman told CNN he had knowledge of the alleged relationship, AMI called Sajudin's story, quote, "not credible." It also denied any connection between the story, Donald Trump and his then personal attorney, Michael Cohen.

The White House did not respond in April to CNN's request for comment. Sajudin's allegation that Trump fathered a child out of wedlock has not been independently confirmed by any of the outlets that have investigated that story.

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HOWELL: Now to Ireland, where Pope Francis is set to arrive in an hour and a half and where plenty of people will come out to celebrate his visit. He will also likely feel the anger from many others.

The pope is set to speak at the World Meeting of Families in Dublin but what will he say in response to growing anger in the latest scandal of sex abuse and coverup at the hands of Catholic priests and church leaders?

It is the same pain that rocked families in Ireland decades ago and many now want to know what will the pope do to stop this from happening again. Let's go live to Dublin. CNN's senior Vatican analyst, John Allen, is standing by live this hour. John is also the editor of the independent Catholic news site, "Crux."

John, thank you for your time.

Of course, a lot of people will be waiting to see the pope but ahead of this visit, what is the mood there in Dublin?

JOHN ALLEN, CNN SR. VATICAN ANALYST: Well, if I had to pick one word to describe the mood, it would be anger. As you mentioned, Ireland is arguably the single country in the world most scarred by the Catholic Church's clerical sexual abuse scandals.

The Catholic Church here historically has run every school, every hospital, every orphanage, every institution in the country. Parishes have been the center of community life. So the sex abuse scandals here have had a reach that is deep and profound.

And as you say, that legacy is now decades old. I think people believed initially reassurances they were given that the church was going to get this right. They are now angry that, decades later, that does not appear to have been the case.

So there is a real expectation here that Pope Francis will have to address this issue. We know the Vatican has confirmed that he will be meeting with survivors of sexual abuse when he is here.

We also expect him to address this publicly, probably in a speech he is slated to give at around noon local time, that is 6:00 am on the East Coast, when he addresses politicians, diplomats, other civil authorities here in the country.

And I think that it will require more than just apologies and reassurances. People here want to know concretely what is going to be done and not simply to deal with the crime of sexual abuse but also to deal with the coverup by church officials. I think that is the gap, if you like, in the church's response they are waiting to see filled.

HOWELL: Let's put this pope in context with the role that he holds over the time that he has held it. Again, this pope has been outspoken, quite frankly, on issues of the poor, on issues of bringing younger people back into the church, in fact, in filling the churches once more.

So given the context of how he started that role and what he is dealing with now, how difficult will it be for this pope to square the circle and really provide concrete answers that satisfy people who want -- who demand -- accountability?

ALLEN: Well, look, I think that you are absolutely right. Pope Francis is a missionary pope. He wants to revitalize the faith, bring those who have lapsed back into it and attract new people into it.

And I think there is an understanding on the part of Pope Francis and his team that the clerical sexual abuse scandals are the major obstacle to achieving that objective.

Quite honestly, it is very difficult for many people to take the church's moral message seriously when they perceive that the church is not practicing that in the way it responds to its own clerical sexual abuse scandals.

Now you ask, you know, how difficult is it going to be for Pope Francis to take the needed steps. There is a piece in one of the Irish papers today, by the head of the theology faculty at the national seminary here in Ireland, (INAUDIBLE), in which I think he puts his finger on the issue.

He says what needs to happen is that the church needs to impose the same accountability for the crime of abuse that it imposes on the cover-up; that is, on the failure to deal with it. And however difficult that may be, I think most people would say that is the step that needs to be taken.

HOWELL: There is a piece coming up here in this newscast by our Phil Black that really tells the story, shows the pain that many there in Ireland faced decades ago and still, quite frankly, face.

And you do understand why, now that they are hearing this same scandal again, many people are demanding accountability and demanding answers here. Our senior Vatican analyst, John Allen, thank you so much for your time and perspective. We'll stay in touch with you there.

Around the world and here in the United States --

[04:15:00]

HOWELL: -- you're watching NEWSROOM. A powerful U.S. senator makes a very tough decision. Senator John McCain faces death on his own terms. We'll tell you details on that story.

Also ahead, the recent era of diplomacy between the United States and North Korea could be cooling down. Details of Donald Trump's latest decision and how it will affect the Korean Peninsula. Stay with us.

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HOWELL: An American hero better known as the Maverick, Senator John McCain's family has announced he is discontinuing treatment for brain cancer. The six-term senator was diagnosed with an aggressive form of brain cancer just last year. He has not been to Washington, D.C., since December.

On Twitter, his wife, Cindy, wrote this, "I love my husband with all of my heart. God bless everyone who has cared for my husband along this journey."

CNN's Dana Bash now with a closer look.

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DANA BASH, CNN SR. U.S. CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: John McCain's trademark is relentlessly fighting, not giving up or giving in to any adversary. More than that, it is his essence, it's his core. So the fact that his family says he has decided to --

[04:20:00] BASH: -- stop treatment against his current adversary, brain cancer, is actually a bit shocking to friends and family I've spoken to, despite the fact that everyone knows and knew for a long time in their heart that this day would come.

Now McCain has always been really prolific in writing and speaking about how his family's long history in the military made him respect and even revere America's institutions and how he spent his whole adult life trying to do his part in service. Take a listen.

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SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZ.: It has not been perfect service to be sure, and there were probably times when the country might have benefited a little less of my help. But I tried to deserve the privilege as best I can.

And I've been repaid a thousand times over with adventures, with good company and with the satisfaction of serving something more are important than myself, of being a bit player in the extraordinary story of America. And I am so grateful.

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BASH: Now the senator has been at his home in Arizona all year long, weighing in on the turbulent events from afar instead of the way he normally would, jumping in on the front lines, being front and center in the most important and biggest issues of his time. But he has finally had to face his own mortality.

And McCain quoted in his last book, "The Restless Wave," one of his many larger than life heroes, the fictitious Robert Jordan, from Ernest Hemingway's "For Whom the Bell Tolls."

He said, "The world is a fine place and worth fighting for and I hate very much to leave it."

But then McCain said, "I don't have a complaint. Not one. It has been quite a ride." -- Dana Bash, CNN, Washington.

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HOWELL: Dana, thank you.

Following now relations between North Korea and the United States, a new era of diplomacy appears to have hit a speed bump. On Friday, the U.S. president postponed secretary of state Mike Pompeo's trip to North Korea one day after it was announced.

Mr. Trump blames North Korea's slow progress on denuclearization but the door is not all together shut. Mr. Trump tweeted his warmest regards and respect to Chairman Kim, saying he looked forward to seeing him soon.

Following the story, CNN's Paula Hancocks is live in Seoul, South Korea. Paula, the president keeping a crack in the door here but it does put

new pressure on the upcoming meeting between North and South Korea.

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, that's right, George. And the secretary of state Mike Pompeo did speak to the South Korean foreign minister earlier this Saturday. And the foreign secretary here said that it was regrettable, that was the word she used, saying this was a highly anticipated meeting for Pompeo to go to North Korea.

But from the U.S. point of view, they feel that simply not enough has been achieved to make this trip worthwhile. We know Pompeo went just last month to North Korea. He did not meet Kim Jong-un, the North Korean leader. It was seen by many observers as a snub and sources afterwards said that that meeting went really as badly as it could have gone.

And we're hearing many reports; most notably, most recently from the IAEA, the nuclear watchdog, saying that there are areas of grave concern, looking at the activities that are ongoing at certain nuclear sites in North Korea.

So I think it has not really come as much of a surprise that the U.S. is pulling back somewhat and hoping for more signs of denuclearization. I think what was a bit of a surprise is that the U.S. president added in that tweet that he did send his "warmest regards and respects" to Kim Jong-un and says he looks forward to seeing him soon.

But, of course, from the South Korean point of view, the South Korean president Moon Jae-in is heading to Pyongyang next month. We don't have an exact date. But certainly from the South Korean point of view it does put more pressure on that meeting. They would like to see the dual track process.

They would like to see the North Korean-South Korean relations improve at the same time that the American and North Korean relations improve.

HOWELL: A lot of moving parts here for sure. Paula Hancocks, live for us in Seoul, South Korea, thank you for following the story for us.

In the continuing conflict between Saudi Arabia and Yemen, Houthi sources say that the Saudi-led airstrikes killed 22 children in Yemen on Thursday. And if that is not bad enough, they were reportedly escaping a round of airstrikes from the day before. CNN's Nima Elbagir picks up this report and, we warn you, this report contains graphic scenes.

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NIMA ELBAGIR, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Bundled in these sheets are what remains of a family. This man is gathering up the remains of his son and grandson children.

He tries to show the cameraman but it's --

[04:25:00]

ELBAGIR (voice-over): -- too upsetting. This footage was sent to CNN by Houthi officials. It shows the aftermath of yet another airstrike in Yemen, claiming the lives of dozens of children and their parents as they fled to safety, this time in the beleaguered port city of Hudaydah.

One of the pickup trucks miraculously survived the hit and was used to ferry back the dead and dying. He pulls back the sheets to show us the little feet sticking out.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: These are all corpses. Some body parts were so charred we couldn't pick them up, so disintegrated.

ELBAGIR: In the hospital, these images of the few remaining survivors were broadcast on Houthi-backed TV. This man lost everyone in his family, six children, he says. Still in shock, his words are almost unintelligible. This morning on a TV they cast this the images of airstrikes continuing.

CNN can't independently verify the images, supposedly of Saudi-led coalition planes. But eyewitnesses describe shouting and fear as strikes above the sky intensified. Hudaydah is a strategic port and for weeks has been the site of fierce fighting between the U.S.-backed Saudi coalition and Iranian-backed Houthi militias, fighting that shows no signs of cooling down.

Ali wants to find as much of his family as he can to give them a burial they deserve. It is the only dignity, he says, that he has left -- Nima Elbagir, CNN, London.

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HOWELL: Nima, thank you.

CNN has asked the Saudi government for comment but have not heard back yet.

The bitter feud between the U.S. president and his attorney general: now Jeff Sessions is pushing back and Donald Trump not amused by it.

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HOWELL: Live coast to coast, you are watching CNN NEWSROOM from Atlanta. I'm George Howell with the headlines we're following for you this hour.

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HOWELL: And as President Trump's problems deepen, he is again lashing out at the man he believes to be responsible, the man you see right here, the attorney general of the United States, Jeff Sessions.

On Thursday, Sessions forcefully stated that he will not allow the Justice Department to be politicized. Mr. Trump perceived that as disloyalty and then went on the attack. One tweet from the president took issue with the sentencing of a former intelligence contractor.

It says, quote, "Gee, this is small potatoes compared to what Hillary Clinton did. So unfair. Jeff, double standard." he said.

Let's talk about it all with the chief diplomatic correspondent for "The New York Times," Steven Erlanger, joining us from Brussels, Belgium.

Always a pleasure to have you here on the show. What was surprising the other day was Jeff Sessions firing back at the U.S. president for criticizing him for recusing himself. But now President Trump doubling down, even suggesting that Sessions pursue the White House's political opponents. This is a very public tug of war.

What do you make of it?

STEVEN ERLANGER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Well, what I make of it is Trump is getting ready to fire Jeff Sessions. It will probably happen after the midterm elections in November but it is very, very difficult.

I mean after all Trump named him; Jeff Sessions, who was a senator and very loyal to Trump, one of his early supporters inside the Republican Party, but he is a lawyer and he cares deeply about the justice system.

And the one thing he does know is that the Justice Department is, in general, not going to allow itself to be politicized. So if Trump keeps going with this, he opens himself more to charges of obstruction of justice.

What I think people fear actually is a looming Saturday night massacre, which is Trump will, at some point, fire Sessions and try to get an attorney general who will then fire Rod Rosenstein, who is the deputy, and then fire Robert Mueller.

And if that happens, though a lot of Republicans in the Congress are warning against it, we will have another constitutional confrontation. Now you know, I'm not predicting it but I worry about it. You can see it coming.

HOWELL: One person who does seem open to new leadership at the attorney general level, U.S. senator Lindsey Graham, suggesting there could be a changing of the guard. A year ago he had a very different take. Listen to that, his thoughts then, to what he said just the other day, this sound bite back to back.

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SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R), S.C.: If Jeff Sessions is fired, there will be holy hell to pay. Any effort to go after Mueller could be the beginning of the end at the Trump presidency unless Mueller did something wrong.

Clearly Attorney General Sessions doesn't have the confidence of the president, that is an important office in the country. And there -- after the election, I think there will be some serious discussions about a new attorney general.

[04:35:00]

HOWELL: What a difference a year makes, yes?

So there appears to be a softening of position by Republicans, the prospect of replacing Sessions.

ERLANGER: Well, it is not an issue so much of replacing Sessions. The president, you know, he is in his cabinet; he can get rid of the attorney general. It is what happens to Mueller that I think matters more than anything else because the point that annoys Trump about Sessions is Sessions recused himself from the Russia investigation because, at the very beginning of the presidency, Sessions admitted he'd had conversations with the Russian ambassador to the United States, Kislyak, who is now gone.

And for those reasons, Sessions decided he wouldn't get involved. So that meant his deputy, Rod Rosenstein, is in charge. And it was Rosenstein, after Comey was fired, who appointed Robert Mueller, so that this is a chain.

I mean it is much like what happened with Nixon when he wanted to fire the special prosecutor, Archibald Cox, who was looking into Watergate and, in the end, had to fire both the attorney general and the deputy attorney general before Robert Bork, who was third in line, agreed to fire Archibald Cox.

But that was the beginning of the end. So one has to be careful, if you are Donald Trump. He has the right to have the attorney general that he likes. But at the moment, the current attorney general is not involved with the Russian investigation, so he is not subject to Trump's pushing around on this topic. And I think that drives Trump rather crazy.

HOWELL: Steven Erlanger, live for us in Brussels, Belgium, with perspective. We'll keep in touch with you as we follow the trail here.

ERLANGER: Thanks, George.

HOWELL: We've been following the story of Pope Francis, scheduled to land in Ireland in the next hour. And at some point in his two-day trip, he will meet with a number of victims, people sexually abused at the hands of predator priests.

Ireland is like too many other countries around the world with a horrid history of abuse. Our Phil Black spoke with some of those who were abused -- and we do warn you, some of the descriptions you'll hear in this report are disturbing and graphic.

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PHIL BLACK, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There is no polite easy way to explain what happened to Darren McGavin on the grounds of this church when he was a child.

DARREN MCGAVIN, CLERGY ABUSE SURVIVOR: He put me over the table. And he had the vestments, the robes from the vestments. And he -- he tied me hands to me legs over the table. And began to rape me.

BLACK (voice-over): From the age of 7, Darren was abused several times a week for more than four years by Tony Welsh one of Ireland's most notorious pedophile priests.

MCGAVIN: On one occasion I was raped with a crucifix.

BLACK (voice-over): Welsh destroyed his life. The years have been consumed by trauma and mental illness.

BLACK: How old are you now?

MCGAVIN: I'm 46 years of age and I've been medicated since I was 12, 12 years of age.

So -- like when is it going to stop?

Like when is it going to stop?

I don't know.

BLACK: This is just one victim's story in a country deeply wounded by the horrific legacy of priests abusing vast numbers of children and often getting away with it. It will be the defining issue for Pope Francis during his visit to once proudly Catholic Ireland...

MCGAVIN: Do this in memory of me.

BLACK: -- where many churches are now largely empty, where the institution is struggling for purpose and credibility.

MARY COLLINS, CLERGY ABUSE SURVIVOR: I went to the hospital when I was 12, just turned 13, and I was sexually assaulted by the Catholic chaplain.

BLACK (voice-over): After decades recovering, Mary Collins has become a powerful voice for reforming the church culture. Last year, she walked away from a Vatican

panel advising Pope Francis because nothing changed. And she wasn't satisfied with his recent written apology.

COLLINS: We have the pope the other day in a strong letter. A lot it is good. But unfortunately, he says we are working on a way to find to hold people accountable.

We're decades on. You can't still be working on it. BLACK (voice-over): Darren McGavin wanted to show us another painful location. In Phoenix Park, where Pope Francis will say mass, he takes us to a dark gully...

MCGAVIN: And then he lay me down on the mattress.

BLACK (voice-over): -- another place where he was raped by the priest he once trusted.

MCGAVIN: Didn't even get sorry --

[04:40:00]

MCGAVIN: -- didn't even say sorry like -- I --

BLACK (voice-over): Darren and other victims say apologies are important. But from the pope they also want firm policies to ensure no one suffers like this again -- Phil Black, CNN, Dublin.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HOWELL: Phil, thank you.

Following the story in Hawaii, police in parts of that state are telling people to stay off the roads and for good reason. The latest on tropical storm Lane's very dangerous path there, as CNN NEWSROOM live continues.

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HOWELL: These are scenes from the U.S. state of Hawaii. It isn't out of the woods yet. Hurricane Lane has been downgraded to a tropical storm but it is still hammering the islands.

This was the scene on the big island Friday and there is more to come. Lane is set to bring as much as a meter of rain in some areas. And it has already triggered floods and landslides. Storm surge is also expected through the weekend.

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HOWELL: We can talk more about this now with Chevy Chevalier in Honolulu. Chevy is the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration official there in Hawaii.

Thank you for your time.

Given what you have seen and our Ivan Cabrera just explained and we saw some of the images of what is happening in that state, how bad is it and what is expected here in the next several hours? EDWARD "CHEVY" CHEVALIER, NOAA: We anticipated flooding would be a problem. This is a tropical system with a lot of moisture in the air and that is exactly what has happened on the big island. As you were mentioning, records amount of rainfall there. And it is not over yet.

The worst thing that could happen with the rainfall, especially for the big island, is for the storm to become stationary. So on between 5:00 pm and our last update at 8:00 pm, it was stationary.

So what we're hoping for now is movement, is any kind of movement to the northwest and especially to the west, as we get into tomorrow, to pull this system out of our area. It has been disorganized since earlier today. It was a category 2 earlier today and the shear just ripped it apart and now it's a tropical storm.

So we want to see some motion as soon as possible, hopefully in our next update at 11:00 pm Hawaii Standard Time, we'll see that.

The rain will spread, of course, to Maui as well. And as the storm moves a little to the north and northwest, it will also bring rain to Oahu. Nothing near what the big island has seen but if the system stalls, we could have some problems with flooding in Honolulu and on the island of Oahu as we go through the weekend this weekend.

HOWELL: All right, substantial rainfall and flooding and then the possibility of landslides, are people being urged to stay close to safer areas, to stay in shelters until the storm passes on through?

CHEVALIER: Absolutely. They are seeing landslides, they have seen those throughout the day today and tonight, just about an hour ago, we received some messages that some roads were impassable on the big island. And crews are not able to get to them yet to clear them out.

So some residents are stranded because, on the big island, there are some areas where there is only one road in and out. So they have to stay at home until these roads are clear. And that is going to take some time, especially since the rain is not letting up and it will continue to rain tonight and into Saturday on the big island.

HOWELL: And then the other question that many people are wondering, tourism certainly a big deal but that will have to remain on hold for a bit, obviously, as this storm passes through, for people who may have plans or looking to visit your fine state.

CHEVALIER: Yes, and I've had a lot of calls here over the last week or so since we've been tracking Hurricane Lane, asking, should I come, should I come. And it all depends on what your definition of bad weather is and what island you're going to.

If you are going to Kauai, it is as if nothing happened. If Kauai were shut off to the world, they probably wouldn't know that there is a tropical storm down to the south of them. So some islands are OK. Even Oahu isn't that bad. It's been cloudy and it's been raining and they're going to --

[04:50:00] CHEVALIER: -- get some rain more this weekend but it is not -- Maui County, that's another story; they are getting more rain and the big island.

So, yes, some people will probably have to postpone their plans for a couple of days. At least the airlines didn't cancel any flights that I know of.

HOWELL: Mr. Chevalier, we appreciate your time and the update on what is happening in your fine state. We'll deep in touch with you, of course.

Up next, a rare glimpse into another world.

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HOWELL (voice-over): What you're seeing is more than just a shadow in the Brazilian rainforest. You see here, this man is part of an isolated culture, still trying to survive. Stay with us.

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HOWELL: They have never had a cellphone, no televisions and, no, they are not ordering things on Amazon. Instead, the indigenous people of the Amazon prefer isolation from the outside world.

But they are threatened. And because of that, Brazil is scrambling to save not only the rainforest but the last remaining tribes who call that rainforest home. Our Cyril Vanier picks up on that story.

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CYRIL VANIER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): Look closely at this video shot by a drone. You can see a figure moving through a clearing. The person is a member of an isolated tribe in Brazil's Amazonas state. And a short while later, you can see other tribe members on the other side of the clearing.

These people have had no known contact with the outside world. According to the government's National Indian Foundation or Funai, they are one of at least 11 similar indigenous groups in the region.

Funai also released still photos from their expedition, this one showing a hut, called a maloka; this one showing an ax tied with vegetable fiber; a horn made of bark and wooden canoes made from palm trees. Funai says its team traveled 180 kilometers in boats, trucks and motorcycles and another 120 kilometers on foot to reach the isolated tribe. Their mission is to protect indigenous tribes by keeping hunters,

miners and farmers from encroaching on the group's territory. Some indigenous groups have been decimated by outsiders.

Funai released this video from a different part of the Amazon, of a man believed to be the sole remaining member of his tribe, swinging an ax at a tree. He has been living on his own for more than two decades after the rest of his tribe was killed by farmers -- Cyril Vanier, CNN.

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HOWELL: That is NEWSROOM for this hour. I'm George Howell at the CNN Center in Atlanta. Let's do it again, another hour of news right after the break. Stay with us.