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Wolf

Questions Raised over Latest FBI Investigation of Kavanaugh; Collins, Flake, Murkowski 3 Key Votes in Kavanaugh Confirmation; Moscow Fights Back After Accused by Dutch & British Governments of Malicious Cyberattaks Around the World. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired October 04, 2018 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00] WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: Questions today over just how thorough the FBI's latest investigation of Supreme Court Nominee Brett Kavanaugh actually was.

Several key Republicans say the FBI did its job completely.

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SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM, (R), SOUTH CAROLINA: They're followed leads from interviews that made sense to me. It's a complete report. It's a background check. I'm confident the FBI did a good job. They were not hindered in any way.

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BLITZER: But Democrats call the investigation incomplete.

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SEN. DIANNE FEINSTEIN, (D), CALIFORNIA: The most notable part of this report is what's not in it. It looks to be a product of an incomplete investigation that was limited, perhaps by the White House, I don't know.

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BLITZER: Joining us now, S.E. Cupp, the host of CNN's "S.E. CUPP UNFILTERED," airs Saturday night, 6:00 p.m. Eastern. Also with us, former prosecutor, Laura Coates, White House reporter for the "New York Times," Julia Hirschfeld Davis, and White House correspondent for American Radio Urban Networks, April Ryan, who is the author of a new book, "Under Fire: Reporting from the Frontlines of the Trump White House."

Guys, thanks very much for joining us.

S.E., this report -- and there may be 1,000 pages that the Senators have a chance to go through. This report is not public. There's no sign it will ever be made public in a redacted form. Who are people supposed to believe? You hear one thing from Republicans and a totally different thing from Democrats.

S.E. CUPP, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & CNN HOST, "S.E. CUPP UNFILTERED": As a member of the public, as a member of the media and a conservative, I am not satisfied by this investigation. As a member of the public, have very few answers. As a member of the media, we are more curious for more answers. And as a conservative, I'm not sure that culling for an investigation and putting a time limit on it helps Judge Kavanaugh. But this order was not ordered to satisfy us. It was ordered to satisfy a few very particular members of the Senate Judiciary Committee. We will all have to sort of satiate our curiosity and desire for justice of some kind or some kind of conclusivity in other ways. I will say, though, to Democrats who are accusing the FBI of a cover up, that's really dangerous. Be critical of the White House for limiting the scope, but we would trust that the FBI did their job and did it to the best of their abilities.

BLITZER: As instructed. That's a good point.

Laura, nine people were interviewed in the course of these few days' supplemental investigation. Two people were not interviewed. Judge Kavanaugh and Professor Christine Blasey Ford was not interviewed. Does that make a difference/ They did spend hours answering questions under oath before the Senate Judiciary Committee?

LAURA COATES, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: It makes a huge difference. You think about the questions that were not asked during the time limits. Five minutes at a time. The person, who was the hired gun, Ms. Mitchell, the prosecutor, who came in, did not ask questions to move the needle in the direction either undermining or bolstering the credibility. It seemed her objective was to make the needle in the center. At the end, it was a wash. There were a number of questions they could have investigated, the FBI. Questions like, you both have said you are 100 percent certain that the other person is not telling the truth. Your truth is the truth. How about testing Dr. Christine Blasey Ford's own 100 percent statement as far as how many times did you see him before. Why were you certain it was Brett Kavanaugh? How did you know Mark Judge or a man named P.J., and Leland was there? You test the answer to that to either bolster or undermined her statement. With Judge Kavanaugh, questions could have been asked that were beyond what was in front of the actual committee. It seemed as though they are all fearful that one question too many. If you want to have a complete investigation, you have to also ask questions that may undermine the narrative or conclusion you would like to draw. If you're staying away from that, even asking the husband of Christine Blasey Ford, who they say it came out in a couples' therapy session, or was she coached through the polygraph or even more than two dozen people whose names were derived, you want to ask the questions unless you have no intention of moving the needle.

BLITZER: Julie, in the last 24 hours or so, at least three people have come forward saying they were more than happy and wanted to testify and wanted to be interviewed by the FBI, including Jamie Roche, who was Brett Kavanaugh's freshman roommate at Yale. He spoke to our John Berman earlier today on "NEW DAY." Listen to this.

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JAMIE ROCHE, FORMER YALE ROOMATE TO BRETT KAVANAUGH: I saw him coming home from parties unable to speak coherently. I saw him when he was vomiting in the bedroom and in the bathroom in the suite. I saw him the next morning when he couldn't get himself out of bed.

I'm not a doctor and I don't know how you define blacking out. But like other people, I had beer in college as well. Those things are consistent with blackout.

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[13:35:25] BLITZER: How are Republicans going to deal with this statement and a bunch of other statements from individuals who wanted to be questioned but weren't.

JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: What you have the top was a few Senators for whom this is going to matter a lot. Jeff Flake and Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowski have been focused on the allegations at hand that Christine Blasey Ford made and whether it was possible to get more clarity about the allegations. It seems like from what we are hearing, they haven't gotten that clarity. They say there's no corroboration and the Democrats said there's no "there" there. And they haven't questioned the people who could put meat on those bones. I'm not sure Jamie Roche or some of the other people coming forward in the last several days to make public statements about how Brett Kavanaugh has mischaracterized how he behaved and what happened to him when he was drunk would add to that. But there are more and more of these people speaking up.

The question is what matters for the vote. Jeff Flake made it clear he wanted to know about the specific allegations. And if he didn't see anything that satisfied him, that they had merit, he wanted to vote yes. That seems to be the track they are headed down, notwithstanding all the other questions that have come up that cast doubt on how Judge Kavanaugh testified originally and last Thursday.

BLITZER: I will be anxious to get your thoughts, April.

APRIL RYAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I hear everything that is being laid out, but what my thought is that this is straight down party lines. I talked to Steve Bannon and this is beyond we the people. They were seen marching in the streets and very upset. You are hearing women relating to Dr. Ford tryout about past instances and Senators are still talking about moving this forward. Just before we came on the air, I heard from a Republican source saying they have got the votes. This is going to happen no matter what. This is overwhelmingly about the president of the United States. It's not about Kavanaugh. It's about going into the mid-terms and going into the next presidential election. How can he solidify? This is beyond Kavanaugh. This is one of the reasons why it is as it is. There was a limited FBI investigation and they're not listening and taking in what we the people are saying in the streets.

BLITZER: S.E., the bottom line right now, how does it look, the confirmation?

CUPP: I think odds makers would say it's going to go through. April is right to a certain degree, that this is a lot about Trump and Republicans. And in a way, Kavanaugh will mobilize Republicans in terms of the elections in ways that I don't think a lot of Democrats anticipated. Kavanaugh and SCOTUS in general unites diverse factions from Never Trumpers and pro-Trumpers all together. This, I think, will have a huge impact on November.

As for we the people, there are plenty of people who think Brett Kavanaugh has been a victim in this. Whether they are right or wrong, they think that. That might have a big impact in November.

BLITZER: S.E., thank you very much.

April and Julie and Laura, thanks as well.

An important note. Make sure to catch S.E.'s program Saturday night at 6:00 p.m. Eastern here on CNN, "S.E. CUPP UNFILTERED."

[13:39:02] Protesters are marching in the streets of Washington, D.C., right now against the confirmation of the Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh. We'll update you on that and more right after this.

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BLITZER: Protesters in Washington right now. They're making their way to the U.S. Supreme Court protesting the nomination of Brett Kavanaugh to be a Supreme Court justice. Very peaceful demonstration, but a lot of them are pretty angry, especially as it looks like he may have the upper hand in getting confirmed, at least right now. A procedural vote scheduled for tomorrow.

Three voices may ring loudest when all is said and done on the Kavanaugh nomination. We are talking about Jeff Flake, of Arizona, Susan Collis, of Maine, and Lisa Murkowski, of Alaska. All Republicans, all said they wanted to see the FBI report before making up their minds. Senator Flake said there was no additional corroborating information that he's seen. Senator Collins said the investigation appears very thorough. Senator Murkowski said she is still reviewing the report.

Our national correspondent, Gary Tuchman, is in Senator Murkowski's state of Alaska. Our CNN correspondent, Polo Sandoval, is in Collins' home state of Maine.

Gary, what kind of pressure has Lisa Murkowski been getting from her Alaska constituents?

[13:45:00] GARY TUCHMAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The pressure is intense. How will she vote? Figuring out the answer is a popular parlor game here in Alaska. It's a popular parlor game in the other 49 states. If anyone knows the answer, they are lying. She is very popular because she has bipartisan support. She had her own "Me Too" moment. More than 100 women from Alaska are in Washington, D.C., going to

Capitol Hill. They have a scheduled meeting and have been invited to meet with her about an hour from now and it will be a significant meeting because Senator Murkowski is reviewing the FBI report.

These women are mostly Democrats and Independents, but everyone say they voted for Senator Murkowski and support her. They also say they are going to implore her not to vote for Brett Kavanaugh. The women we talk to say if she supports Brett Kavanaugh -- everyone says they like her, but would never support her again -- Wolf?

BLITZER: Polo, what kind of pressure is Senator Collins under in Maine?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The constituents of Susan Collins are watching her very closely. Here in Portland, Maine, we heard from the Democrats who voted for the Republican Senator in the past, who say, if she votes yes, come the midterms and come 2020, they will vote no. That's what we are seeing here on the ground. We just spent time in her office. She is in Washington right now trying to decide what she will do.

Spending time in her district office, this flow remains constant of constituents and other folks coming in and urging that she vote no, but her office told us there are a few people who do call and are hoping that she will vote for Kavanaugh.

BLITZER: We will see how they vote tomorrow.

Polo Sandoval, thank you.

Gary, thanks to you as well.

Coming up, Moscow fighting back after the Dutch and British governments accuse Russia of malicious cyberattaks around the world. We will have details.

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[13:51:48] BLITZER: The Justice Department today filing criminal charges against seven Russian intelligence officers. The sprawling indictment includes everything from hacking the Democratic compassion Committee during the 2016 election to wire fraud.

It comes after Dutch officials publicly identified four Russian intelligence agents accused of planning a cyberattack against the world's chemical weapons watch dog. Moscow denied all allegations.

Joining us, Greg Miller, the national security correspondent for the "Washington Post," and the author of an important brand-new book just out this week entitled "The Apprentice: Trump, Russia and the Subversion of American Democracy."

Greg, thanks for coming and writing this book as well.

How worried are you -- and you've done an enormous amount of investigation preparing this book -- about what Russian intelligence services are now doing?

GREG MILLER, NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT, WASHINGTON POST & AUTHOR: These revelations today from the Justice Department are really markable. These are brazen activities by Russian intelligence. They speak to a Kremlin that is pushing the boundary of what we thought of as traditional espionage in almost reckless ways, sending operatives across Europe. We know from Mueller they sent operatives into the United States to gather intelligence on our own political climate before cyberattaks and disinformation.

BLITZER: What are their objectives?

MILLER: There objectives are manifold, to undermine democracy, to give the West a black eye, to take it down a notch in the world's estimation so they can't lord it over or lecture Vladimir Putin. They have more specific targets, including electing President Trump in 2016.

BLITZER: You take a deep dive in this book on what the Russians were doing in the 2016 election. I take it Putin, a former KGB operative, was personally involved.

MILLER: He -- this was one of the big breakthroughs I write about in the book -- for the CIA. In the late July time frame, this prompted John Brennan to run over to the White House, new intelligence the agency had gathered from inside the Kremlin that showed that Putin had authorized, specifically authorized this operation to target the 2016 campaign but also to back Donald Trump.

BLITZER: The vice president, Mike Pence, today delivered a major speech saying the Chinese were engaged in all these kinds of activities, maybe even worse than the Russians.

MILLER: It's just astonishing the language they use against China. It's such a contrast with how they describe or fail to describe what Russia has done. I think that most experts believe that there are many, many actors who are probing and penetrating American systems. But in a White House that refuses to point a finger at China --

BLITZER: Why?

MILLER: -- I mean Russia, I should say.

BLITZER: That's the key question.

MILLER: Why? Part of it comes down to Trump's world view and what he thinks a leader should be, the leader he aspires to be. It looks a lot more like Vladimir Putin than a democratic ideal. And there's the huge unanswered question that we're waiting for Robert Mueller to help us sort out, are there other deep financial connections, is there a compromise, is there something else that ties this together.

BLITZER: And you anticipate we'll get answers once the Mueller investigation is over?

MILLER: I really would be -- I don't know if we're ever going to see a smoking gun, you know, proof, a secret memo between Putin and President Trump. But I would be astonished if we don't learn a great deal when Robert Mueller is finished with his work, because we've already learned so much from all of these indictments and charges.

[13:55:05] BLITZER: An important book "The Apprentice: Trump, Russia, and the Subversion of American Democracy," just out this week.

Thanks so much, Greg, for writing it.

MILLER: Thank you.

BLITZER: Appreciate it.

Up next, the fate of Brett Kavanaugh hangs in the balance as Senators comb through the FBI's latest findings. This as protesters -- you can see live pictures coming out from just outside the Supreme Court. Protesters, lots and lots of them, are marching in opposition to the confirmation.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And we -- when we think --

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