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Hours Away From Final Vote on Kavanaugh; Officer Found Guilty in 2014 Murder of Black Teen; Protesters March, Chant Before Kavanaugh Vote; Dead Toll Rising After Earthquake and Tsunami. Aired 12n-1p ET
Aired October 06, 2018 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[12:00:00]
SAM KILEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: But she is on the verge of release we understand following demands for back taxes of a hundred and thirty million dollars, Ryan.
RYAN NOBLES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT, WASHINGTON: Sam, fascinating story. Thank you for staying on top of it for us and we'll check back with you with any new developments.
Live from Hong Kong, Sam Kiley, thank you.
RYAN NOBLES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT, WASHINGTON: And we have much more, just ahead in the "NEWSROOM," it all starts right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
RYAN NOBLES, CNN ANCHOR, NEWSROOM: Hello. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Ryan Nobles, in today for Fredricka Whitfield.
Right now, protests in Washington ahead of a historic moment. Supreme Court Nominee Brett Kavanaugh expected to be confirmed to the nation's highest court in a matter of hours. Senators believe they have the votes to push him through after weeks of tense debate and heightened emotions.
Let's check in on Capitol Hill now with CNN's Senior Congressional Correspondent, Manu Raju. Manu, it seems as though finally we have an idea of where this thing is headed and we expect Judge Kavanaugh to be confirmed later this afternoon, correct?
MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. No question about it. We do expect that to happen by a very narrow margin, by the narrow -- one of the narrowest margins in this history of any Supreme Court nominee, a fifty to forty-eight vote, we are expecting later today.
We have heard all night, Democrats in particular take the floor, raised their concerns about this nomination, about the process, about these allegations that came out of sexual misconduct and also some Democrats resigned to the fact that there's nothing they can do to stop this.
Now I have had a chance to talk to some members too about the -- some of the events that transpired as well as a third allegation that came out late in the process from a client of the lawyer Michael Avenatti, a woman Julie Swetnick who alleged that Brett Kavanaugh attended parties in the early '80s where women were drugged, girls were gang raped something that Republicans tried to confuse as a way -- the showcase what they said was a Democratic smear campaign. Well some Democrats said perhaps a better approach would've been to focus on what they believe were more credible allegations.
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MANU RAJU, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Do you think that the allegation that came forward from Michael Avenatti was -- that one that's alleging that he may have been involved or was aware of gang rape, was that something that was credible in your views?
SEN. GARY PETERS (D), MICHIGAN: Well you know, at some point there were a lot of folks coming forward making all sorts of accusations, then you be you -- turns it into a circus atmosphere and certainly that's not where we should be. These are very serious allegations, certainly people believe that those allegations should be investigated, they should be done in a fair and impartial way but we understand -- I understand that there's is a lot of noise but our job is to cut through the noise and get to the substance of what we're really dealing with.
RAJU: Did you think that Avenatti was helpful in this process?
PETERS: Well, I think we should have focused -- we should've focused on the serious allegations that were -- certainly appeared very credible to me, that's -- would be our best course of action.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: So I've heard other criticism from Democrats and I just actually spoke to Michael Avenatti himself. He pushed back and said that, look, these were serious allegations. He said he finds it disgusting that some Democrats would dispute the fact that these were serious allegations brought forward by his client which were never -- which were never investigated by the FBI or by the Senate Judiciary Committee.
But nevertheless, Democrats know that the outcome is all but certain later this afternoon after a grueling and one of those bitter confirmation fights in a generation, Brett Kavanaugh, just a matter of hours will get that lifetime seat on the Supreme Court, Ryan.
NOBLES: All right Manu Raju, continuing his tireless reporting on Capitol Hill. Manu, thank you so much.
And when Kavanaugh is confirmed later today, it will certainly be a big moment for President Trump. After less than just two years in office he will have successfully placed two justices on the highest court.
CNN Senior Washington Correspondent Joe Johns joins us now. Joe, the White House has to be happy that they are finally going to get Kavanaugh over the finish line this afternoon?
JOE JOHNS, CNN SENIOR WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: They are happy and they have expressed that. We were even told the president just yesterday was very glad and in a very good mood because it was clear that Senator Collins of Maine was going to vote in favor of this nomination.
We did also get a tweet today from the president of the United States and I'll just read it, it's about the Kavanaugh nominations, it says, "women for Kavanaugh and many others who support this very good man are gathering all over Capitol Hill in preparation for a 3:00 to 5:00 p.m. vote, it's a beautiful thing to see," the president writes, "and they are not paid professional protesters who are handed expensive signs. Big day for America." This is at least the second tweet by the president, referring to paid professional protesters or words to that effect.
And having been out with the protesters over the last week or so, I have talked to lawyers for some of the groups opposed to Kavanaugh and they make the case that protesters have to post bail if they get arrested
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If they get taken away by the police for blocking access to a road, for example, and a lot of times the organizations will front the money for that bail because the bail is forfeited of course, about $50. So there's been some conservative media reporting about people getting money out in the marches and they say that's what the issue is.
We are expecting to see the president today. He is expected to leave in a couple of hours or so, maybe three, to head out to Topeka, Kansas, that's where he's going to be -- do a big mega rally if you will, that's expected after the vote. The president is leaving before the vote so hopefully we'll have at least two opportunities to get a question to him or two.
Even staff here cannot predict whether the president will leave and talk about this but it's very likely that we'll hear from him at the rally tonight about the Kavanaugh expected nomination and confirmation.
Back to you?
NOBLES: All right, Joe Johns from the White House. Thank you for that report Joe.
And when Brett Kavanaugh is officially confirmed in the Supreme Court, the president will be living up to a major campaign promise.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: We are going to appoint justices of the United States Supreme Court who will uphold our laws and our Constitution.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Even if you don't -- and you do like me, I hope but I said, even if you can't stand Donald Trump, you think Donald Trump is the worst, you're going to vote for me, you know, why? Justices of the Supreme Court.
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NOBLES: Joining me now to discuss this, an all-star panel, CNN Political Commentator, Alice Stewart a former Communications Director for Ted Cruz; CNN Political Commentator and Republican Strategist, Ana Navarro; and CNN Supreme Court Analyst, Joan Biskupic who is the author of an upcoming biography on Chief Justice John Roberts which we've been talking about off camera, which I'm very excited about Joan, congratulations on that.
Let's start with you Joan, Kavanaugh's confirmation is not just going to be a big one for the president but also his party. I mean just talk about how this is going to in many ways reshape the Supreme Court?
JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN SUPREME COURT ANALYST, JOAN BISKUPIC & AUTHOR, UPCOMING BIOGRAPHY ON CHIEF JUSTICE JOHN ROBERTS: This fully delivers the Supreme Court for conservatives. This has been an agenda item back to the late '70s. You know, Ronald Reagan ran on the Supreme Court; George HW Bush ran on the Supreme Court; George W. Bush ran on the Supreme Court; and that Donald Trump won on the Supreme Court.
And in addition to the vows you just heard him say in that clip, is also promised to appoint justices who would reverse Roe v. Wade and that has energized the Republican Party, the far right of the Republican Party for decades.tape And you've already seen states try to pass more restrictive abortion regulations that are slowly working their way to the Supreme Court so we will -- we will see, I believe more restrictions allowed by the Supreme Court.
We're likely also to see a roll back of Campus Affirmative Action and I don't believe this court would revert gay marriage but it's likely that this court will make it harder for people to challenge businesses that discriminate based on sexual orientation or sexual identity.
So this really is culminating and delivering to Donald Trump exactly what he had vowed to people who would vote for him in 2016.
NOBLES: And perhaps the most raw evidence of elections having consequences and honor, a poll taken in late September shows that there is a pretty big gender divide when it comes to Brett Kavanaugh's confirmation, 55 percent of women say no, he shouldn't be confirmed but more men think he should be confirmed than not, 49 to 40 percent so if you're a conservative woman which you are, I mean how do you perceive how this entire process has played out?
BISKUPIC: I think the process has been terrible. I think it's been destructive, divisive; it's been ugly, it's been painful for the country.
I've you know, yesterday when I was hearing those speeches when I was hearing Mitch McConnell, when I was seen some tweets from Republicans, I really found their use of the word, the term mob, to describe the people against Kavanaugh as offensive.
NOBLES: Yes.
BISKUPIC: Look, Christine Blasey Ford whether you agree with or not gave voice to hundreds of thousands if not millions of victims across the country who have carried the silence and weight and shame and burden of sexual assault for years, for decades.
We have seen that the calls into rape centers have increased, upwards of 300 percent. We have seen on social media women and some men come out and tell their stories. We've seen people like Connie Chung who held it...
NOBLES: Yes.
BISKUPIC: ... for 50 years, the journalist, share her story and so to call everyone who opposes Kavanaugh a mob is you know, taking away their pain, it's telling them you know, you are part of this mob mentality, it's not about this issue.
I think this is a you know, in a large part a Mars versus Venus debate.
NOBLES: Right.
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BISKUPIC: I think that a lot of women when they see and hear Christine Blasey Ford, they see themselves and hear themselves in her and I think a lot of you know, I think some men you know, kept thinking to themselves, do I want to be judged by something that I may have done that I now regret when I was you know, 17-years-old.
NOBLES: Well you know, I want to get back to the fact that, it was a woman that is going to be the ultimate decider here in Susan Collins and she did go point by point her reasons for backing Judge Kavanaugh.
Alice, I want you to respond to this but let's take a listen to what Susan Collins had to say yesterday on the Senate floor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (D), MAINE: The facts presented do not mean that president -- that Professor Ford was not sexually assaulted that night or at some other time but they do lead me to conclude that the allegations failed to meet the "more likely than not" standard.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NOBLES: What's interesting about this, I think Alice, is that she believes both Dr. Ford and Judge Kavanaugh and what's interesting is when you look at polls most Americans actually say, they believe both of them are -- at least believe their versions of the stories but when this is actually brought in front of voters can Republicans have it both ways?
ALICE STEWART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & FORMER COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR FOR TED CRUZ: Yes. Both can be believable. I think she laid out a very, very compelling case. In reality looking at what she said and the demeanor that Senator Collins has, I think she certainly gave Dr. Ford more of the benefit of the doubt than all the Democrats in that entire room gave Judge Kavanaugh through this entire process.
And she clearly thought about this and she looked at both sides and heard both of the -- both of the stories and testimony and made a -- an important decision based on her gut-level feeling.
And she to -- to Anna -- Ana's point, this has turned a solemn occasion into got gutter-level politics that shouldn't be that way.
Here's the bottom line, Donald Trump as we played those clips campaigned on this. I work for candidates in '08 and '12 and this cycle, this was a big issue for Republican voters. "Washington Post" poll shows that 25 -- 26 percent of Republican voters, the number one issue, for voting for Donald Trump, myself included, was the Supreme Court, it's a...
NOBLES: Yes.
STEWART: ... huge issue, 18 percent for Hillary Clinton so he knows that this was critical for him to...
NOBLES: Right.
STEWART: ... stand behind and make sure that these people that he campaigned on got on the Supreme Court and this is going to be a huge burst, a wind in the sail of Republicans.
ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: That's -- that's right. I can't tell you how many Republican friends I have who held their nose and...
NOBLES: Right.
NAVARRO: ... voted for Donald Trump precisely because of that list of...
NOBLES: Right.
NAVARRO: ... preapproved jurists that he had put out. It was probably one of the smartest things that he did during that campaign.
NOBLES: Ana, I just quickly want you to respond to something that the Senate Judiciary Chairman, Chuck Grassley, said about why there are not more Republican women on his committee which oversees the confirmation process for Supreme Court nominees. This is what he said, quote, "Well, it's a lot of work. Don't forget compared to a lot of committee meetings, we have an executive every Thursday so it's a lot of work. Maybe they don't want to do it."
Grassley later went on to say that it's hard to get men on the committee too but again right now it's only men that make up the Republican side of this committee (inaudible)...
NAVARRO: I'm not sure I can answer this question without my eyes rolling into the back of my head. I mean...
NOBLES: ... What...
NAVARRO: ... first of all, he sounds like such a dinosaur really, he should be extinct at those moments so what does that mean, that Republican women are afraid to work but Democrat women aren't afraid to work?
Because you've got a ranking member, you've got Diane Feinstein, not only is she a woman, she's an 80-year-old woman and she's not afraid to work. You've got Kamala Harris, you've got women who listen, come on...
NOBLES: ... (inaudible), yes...
NAVARRO: ... I mean...
NOBLES: ... (inaudible).
NAVARRO: ... that's you know, that's -- that's -- really that so stupid that I -- that so stupid I don't even want to talk about it because I'm not sure that I can do what I'm telling you without my eyes rolling to the back of my head.
I mean, Chuck Grassley, give me a damn break. Women give birth at work and put money -- you know, food on the table, just go mow your lawn.
NOBLES: All right, then, let's -- let's Joan wrap it up. I don't know if you want to follow that Joan but let's just -- I mean, talk about this, I mean what's the next step here, how quickly could Judge Kavanaugh be on the Supreme Court?
BISKUPIC: Tonight. Tonight, seriously.
NOBLES: Yes.
BISKUPIC: Just for example, Sam Alito, the Senate vote was on June -- January 30 -- 31st of 2006, he was sworn in that night so he could be sworn in tonight by the Chief Justice of the United States, John Roberts; maybe tomorrow but I have a feeling, they're going to do this very fast and he will be at work right away, by the end of this weekend.
The court isn't sitting on Labor Day, but they'll be...
NOBLES: Yes.
BISKUPIC: ... back in hearing cases and I bet you walk into the Supreme Court on Tuesday morning and look to your far right, a new Justice Kavanaugh would be there in that empty -- that seat has been empty, for a week and a half.
STEWART: Literally and figuratively.
NOBLES: Yes. I was going to say, symbolically...
BISKUPIC: Yes.
NOBLES: ... and literally...
BISKUPIC: Yes.
NOBLES: ... all right.
Alice, Ana, Joan, thank you all for joining...
STEWART: Sure.
Nobles: ... I appreciate you being here.
[12:15:00]
Senator Susan Collins will join Dana Bash tomorrow on "State of the Union," that's 9:00 a.m. Eastern right here on CNN.
And happening now protesters in multiple cities in the run up to the final vote on Brett Kavanaugh. We will take you there live.
Plus, the state of play for midterms could Republicans have enough momentum now to stump the so-called "Blue Wave" or could this be a rallying cry for Democrats.
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NOBLES: And you are looking live at pictures of protesters outside the Supreme Court. This of course ahead of today's Senate vote on Brett Kavanaugh.
This follows days of protests at Capitol Hill, 400 people arrested over the last two days.
CNN's Tom Foreman is live in Washington. Tom tell us what the scene is like there now?
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well Ryan, what you hear a lot of here is a lot of anger, a lot of disappointment, a lot of people still hoping for some sort of last-minute reprieve that some vote might not go the way it is.
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They don't really expect it but they'd like to see that so there's also a sense of resignation about the vote today.
But take a look at some of the signs that are around here and they are everywhere among the voters here. There is a very strong pledge, many voters here to say the fight is about more than just this. It is about the election coming up, the midterm elections, they're pledging that they're going to take the heat to the Senators and the various members of Congress for whatever has happened in this case because they believe that if they can simply put some more electoral pressure on some of these people they may be able to get a different result the next time around so it's a combination here of disappointment over what has happened but hope and a lot of energy over what they think they can make happen.
Ryan?
NOBLES: All right, Tom Foreman live outside the Supreme Court.
Tom, thank you for that report.
In a matter of hours Senator Susan Collins will vote to confirm Judge Brett Kavanaugh to the Supreme Court pushing the number of votes needed over top. The reaction has been swift, there were protesters that were showing up in throngs at her offices in D.C. and in Maine.
Things have reached a fever pitch there when she revealed her position in a long-awaited speech yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. SUSAN COLLINS (D), MAINE: Mr. President, we've heard a lot of charges and counter charges about Judge Kavanaugh but as those who have known him best have attested, he has been an exemplary public servant, judge, teacher, coach, husband, and father.
Despite the turbulent, bitter fight surrounding his nomination, my fervent hope is that Brett Kavanaugh will work to lessen the divisions in the Supreme Court so that we have far fewer 5:4 decisions and so that public confidence in our Judiciary and our highest court is restored.
Mr. President, I will vote to confirm Judge Kavanaugh.
NOBLES: CNN's Polo Sandoval is in Portland. And Polo you were there with some of Senator Collins' constituents when she made that announcement. Just tell us what the last few days have been like there in Maine?
POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What you're referring to there, Ryan, a truly remarkable moment yesterday as we were with several of the protesters who were very vocal just before the senator made her -- or delivered her remarks there on the Senate floor and then things went dead silent for those 45 minutes, as the senator was delivering her speech.
Her constituents here in Portland Maine when quiet watching and waiting for that announcement. Of course, we now now that she is expected to vote yes later today but what we expect will be a few more of these opponents to show up, these people who are opposed to the nomination and will likely be the confirmation of Judge Kavanaugh as they make that final push not only just outside but possibly inside as well of Senator Collins office here in Portland, Maine.
Now we have seen of course, these voters many of them Democrats who have voted for in the past because of her position in women's issues, her healthcare as well, however what we have heard is also a direct threat, that if she votes yesterday as we expect her to do, then some of that bipartisan support will not be waiting for her when she returns back home.
Add to that also that some of these donors, some of her credit donors have straightened with cutting off some of that financial support of those donations as well so that is a real political price Ryan that Senator Collins will potentially have to pay if she votes as we expected her to do later today.
On the other side of things her office did tell me that she -- they received phone calls, received some visitors, urging the senator to vote yes for Kavanaugh so just because we have those who are supporting the nominee, we haven't necessarily heard from them here on the streets, that doesn't mean that they're not around.
Ryan?
NOBLES: Yes. Right and certainly a sizable part of her constituency has happy with her vote today as well.
Polo thank you for providing both perspectives. We appreciated.
Well how does the pending vote in the Senate on Brett Kavanaugh resonate with voters on both side of the political aisle, we will discuss when we come back.
[12:25:00]
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NOBLES: We are 31 days out from the midterm so what does the confirmation bottle means for the elections. Enthusiasm has surged for both Republicans and Democrats but what will that translate as in terms of voter turnout.
Joining me now to discuss this, Alice Stewart, a CNN political Commentator and Republican Strategist; CNN Political Commentator Ana Navarro; and Democratic Strategist and Political Commentator, Maria Cardona.
Well there's no doubt that the confirmation process is going to be a deciding factor in some of these polls.
Alice, I'm going to start with you and you know, I was in Florida during the week. I went to a rally for Ron DeSantis who is the Republican nominee for governor there. One of the biggest cheers he got in the rally that I was in attendance at, was when he talked about the Kavanaugh confirmation hearing, which coincidentally has nothing to do with.
I mean is this a sign that there is -- this is you know, encouraging Republicans to get out to the polls in November?
ALICE STEWART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR & REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Absolutely. This is something that Republicans voted, not just for Donald Trump on, but a lot of their down-ballot candidates because they said we're going to work to get Scalia-like justices on the Supreme Court and it's a huge victory.
And you look at the
[12:30:00]
CNN's headline lead story just a few moments ago. Trump is on a winning streak and he is. And nothing energizes the base more than a winning streak.
While back a few days ago when there were doubts about whether or not Kavanaugh would be confirmed, people were concerned about what is this going to mean for midterms? But now that he is going to be confirmed, it's helpful not just to senators who have been embracing Donald Trump throughout the campaign trail but many of those running for Congress who have kept arms length with Donald Trump. They're going to be able to use this as a way to energize their base and even some independents that weren't certain how they were going to view this are going to come on board.
RYAN NOBLES, CNN WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT: Ana, do you think, had this fallen short that there would have been some Republicans that turned in the midterms, upset, maybe stayed home, because the president couldn't push this over the finish line? As you said in our last segment this was, for many, the motivating factor for them supporting Republicans in the --
ANA NAVARRO, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: But first, I'm trying to get over the fact that you were in Florida and didn't call to like --
NOBLES: To have dinner, right? Yes.
NAVARRO: So I could test you, you know, tolerance to Cuban coffee. But where were you in Florida?
NOBLES: Tampa.
NAVARRO: OK. That's actually, you know, (INAUDIBLE) in Florida which is the key area.
Look, I think this is yet to see. We're going to spend the next 30 days talking about what the Kavanaugh effect is going to be in the elections. I think it energizes both bases. There is no doubt that it energizes the Republican base. And there's no doubt that it energizes the Democrat base.
So, the question is going to be, and to all my Floridians watching, you got three more days to register to vote. Because all of this anger and all of this frustration and all of this angst is for naught if you don't get yourself registered by deadline.
Texas, you too. And if you're not in one of those two states, go check when your deadline is.
So I think this could end up being a washout. Because I think, you know, it energizes both bases.
NOBLES: You tell me from your perspective as a Democrat, Maria, are you seeing Democrats excited now? I mean, there was probably already a lot of enthusiasm. Does that add to it?
MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Absolutely, Ryan. There's no doubt. That I have never seen motivation, energy and just the kind of ganas as we say in Spanish of wanting to go vote.
Frankly, not just for somebody who will be a check on this president, because what they have seen from Republicans both in the House and the Senate is that they have been a blank check for this president. And you have seen Republican candidates across the country in House races and in Senate races wrap themselves so tight around this president that you don't know where they end. And Donald Trump begins.
And so I think that this specific issue certainly it's a motivating factor for Republicans. But we've also seen that contentment is not as strong as an energizing force as anger. And boy, is there anger out there and not just from Democrats. It's from women. It's from independents. It's from moderate Republican women who I have heard from to say this is not who we are as a country.
What we have seen from this nomination process is additional disgust. Not just at the political process but at a Republican Party who the perception is that they have just completely treated women with disdain, disrespect. You saw it with the testimony of Brett Kavanaugh himself. The kind of white male privilege entitlement that he showed. The kind of just raw mean partisanship.
And the perception is that this is a Republican Party and especially a president who's the head of that party who has pushed a process forward that has been a slap in the face of sexual assault survivors, of women, and, frankly, a hand over the mouth, literally if you believe Dr. Ford, and the majority of American women do believe Dr. Ford, a hand over the mouth of women who have come out to painfully and tragically talk about what they have survived.
NOBLES: Right. Now, obviously, women across the board are upset in many instances. But there are red state Democrats who had to take a tough vote this time around. We saw Senator Joe Manchin broke with his party.
I want to show you this poll of the race that's happening in Missouri. That's where Claire McCaskill, she's the incumbent, Josh Hawley is the one who is challenging her there. This is deadlocked now 43 and 43 apiece. And Claire McCaskill is going to vote no later this afternoon.
Indiana's Joe Donnelly, he is in another tight race. He's got a tight lead over Mike Braun. Donnelly also going to vote no.
But in North Dakota, it's a double-digit lead for Representative Kevin Kramer who's challenging Heidi Heitkamp. She's also going to vote no.
Ana, I mean, how should these senators react to what's happening here? Are you surprised that so many of these red state Democrats chose to stick with their party, despite the fact that these polls are either tight or in some cases they're losing?
[12:35:04] NAVARRO: You know, call me an idealist, I'd like to think that they stuck with their convictions and their principles. And I'd like to think that they stuck with their heart and with what they saw.
One of the problems with these Supreme Court confirmations has become that it's so much about ideology, right? And so, in some aspects, Democrats, you know, the arguments that came after the ideological hearings, the arguments that came after Roe v. Wade and gun rights were not as heard by Republicans because everybody assumed they were going to vote no anyways.
And on the other side, you could say exactly the same thing. All of the stuff that came out on Kavanaugh. And, you know, to me if you cast ideology aside, because a U.S. president has got his, you know, the right to choose whomever he wants in terms of ideology, gender, race.
But there are things like fitness of character. There are things morals. There are things like credibility and like judicial independent that should not be up to a president. That should be required. That should not be optional.
And Republicans didn't look at it because of ideology. So, you know, I think ideology tainted both sides.
STEWART: I think it's really disingenuous to only say that people who are voting no on Kavanaugh are doing so based on principle. All of the people that are voting for Judge Kavanaugh are doing so based on listening to both sides, taking in the evidence, and knowing Judge Kavanaugh's record. Not just on the bench but as a person of character and integrity.
George H.W. Bush -- George W. Bush actually made phone calls for him, vouching for his character, saying he's the man that should be on the bench based on his character and his integrity. So these are things that both sides are taking into consideration. I think it's important that we look at not just -- certainly Dr. Ford went through something and she is someone that has conviction and someone that is credible. But also at the same time, we have to give the benefit of the doubt --
NAVARRO: -- if you had been in that hearing crying with quivering chin being flippant and disrespectful to senators and had told senators of the other side what goes around comes around.
I mean, you think your judicial independence would not have been questioned? You think you could have gotten away with that without being called a hysterical woman?
STEWART: I think clearly her testimony was extremely compelling. And the way she talked -- what stood out to me more than anything was her talking about laughter --
NAVARRO: That's not what I asked you. What I asked you is, had you acted -- and we acted, how do you acted, the way that Brett Kavanaugh did, quivering chin, screaming, mad, calling senators --
STEWART: No way.
NAVARRO: -- you know, into question, telling them what goes around comes around. You know, pointing fingers at them. Could you have gotten away with it?
STEWART: No.
NAVARRO: Yes. Yes, I could.
STEWART: Here's the reason -- the difference in that is --
NAVARRO: Although you would have never done it, but go ahead.
STEWART: No, exactly. But here's the thing.
NAVARRO: Listen, I miss the days when the biggest controversy facing a nominee was being a white Latina.
CARDONA: Exactly.
STEWART: -- to their policy or for judicial decisions he made or something he did on the court. But when you are attacked personally, you and your family and your wife's life is threatened. I understand --
NAVARRO: What about Dr. Ford?
STEWART: I understand completely --
NAVARRO: What about Dr. Ford though?
STEWART: I understand completely why he was so emotional. If he had gone out and acted like a wallflower, they would have --
CARDONA: I'm sorry, the emotional stakes were absolutely high but guess what. The Supreme Court stakes are high and so I don't care what kind of issue you are going through. If you're going to get up there and act like a petulant white male who is deserving of this and who is pissed off because people are questioning his entitlement to this position, you're going to get the kind of reaction you got especially from women.
NAVARRO: Well, here's the bottom line though, he's going to be on the Supreme Court. And I think he's got a lot of work to do for the rest of the time he's going to be there which could be decades and decades to prove that he does have the judicial temperament. Let us hope that he does.
NOBLES: All right, we have to leave it there. I'm sorry, I really do have this. The worst part about this is we didn't get to talk about Sarah Palin which you guys are probably all really excited to do. That's not going to happen.
NAVARRO: She's getting nominated too?
NOBLES: Well, she's a part of the story.
NAVARRO: She can see the Supreme Court from her backyard.
NOBLES: All right, still ahead, a Chicago police officer is convicted in the shooting death of a teenager. The Fraternal Order of Police says the fight isn't over. Details on their appeal, next.
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[12:43:47] NOBLES: The Chicago cop convicted of murdering a black teen plans to appeal. Yesterday, a jury found Officer Jason Van Dyke guilty of the 2014 killing of 17-year-old Laquan McDonald. The lift into the national spotlight after this shocking dash cam video was released. We won't show you the actual shooting but the camera captures McDonald being shot 16 times.
Nearly four years after the shooting, Van Dyke is now convicted of second-degree murder and 16 counts of aggravated battery.
CNN Legal Analyst Areva Martin joins us now to discuss this. Areva, the Fraternal Order of Police says that the conviction will be appealed. Explain to us how this process might play out.
AREVA MARTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, we already know that Van Dyke was escorted from that courthouse and was taken to jail. So he will await this appeals process while he is in jail. From all accounts, there aren't any credible grounds upon which he can succeed on an appeal. He has a right as a defendant that's been convicted to file an appeal. But the evidence is pretty clear, that videotape that you just showed, Ryan, establishes that there was no basis, no ground for the 16 shots that he fired at Laquan McDonald.
NOBLES: So he initially was charged with first degree murder.
[12:45:00] So how did we get to the second-degree murder conviction?
MARTIN: The judge allowed a jury instruction to be read so the jurists could consider second-degree murder. And in the state of Illinois, second-degree murder is essentially first degree murder but with some mitigating factors.
Now, we don't know what those mitigating factors are. We know that Van Dyke in his testimony talked about the knife and the fact that he thought Laquan McDonald was charging at him with a knife. That may have been one of the factors that the jurists considered in reaching a second-degree murder verdict rather than convicting him on first degree.
NOBLES: He was also convicted on 16 counts of aggravated battery. This was -- one for each time that McDonald was shot. The sentence on that could actually lead to more time in prison than the murder conviction. Why does it work out like that? MARTIN: Yes, absolutely. Again, under the state laws of Illinois, that aggravated battery charge that he's been convicted of, the 16 counts carries up to 30 years in prison. The second-degree murder conviction carries up to 20 years. So Van Dyke is facing a really serious jail time with respect to this conviction.
And we should note, this is the first time in 40 years in the state of Illinois that a cop has been charged with first degree murder.
NOBLES: And while he was on duty, for sure. Do you think that could change the scope of how cases like this are handled in the future in Chicago?
MARTIN: I think that's the hope. That's the hope of social justice and civil rights activists around the country that this case not only will change the landscape of policing in Chicago, but also around the country because we know historically it's been very difficult for a prosecutor to get a conviction when a cop has been charged with an unlawful shooting.
So this case has national implications given that not only the second- degree conviction, but also those 16 aggravated battery charges for which he was convicted.
NOBLES: All right, great information as always. Areva Martin, thank you so much for joining us.
MARTIN: Thanks, Ryan.
NOBLES: And we'll be right back.
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[12:51:24] NOBLES: We want to take you live now to Washington, D.C. where the protests are starting to pick up ahead of the expected confirmation of Brett Kavanaugh to the United States Supreme Court. Let's listen in a little bit to these protesters.
CROWD: We believe survivors! We believe survivors! We believe survivors! We believe survivors!
NOBLES: So you can hear them shouting "we believe survivors." We also heard them shouting "whose court, our court." We expect these protests to continue ahead of Kavanaugh's confirmation was -- which is expected later this afternoon.
Meanwhile, the death toll is still rising one week after a deadly earthquake and tsunami left parts of Indonesia in ruins. These are just some of the 62,000 people still without a home following the devastation. So far, more than 1,600 people have died, thousands are hurt and hundreds are still missing.
Rescuers are working tirelessly in Palu where the epicenter of the earthquake hit. You can see crews working to pull bodies from the rubble of a collapsed mosque. Imagine this, you spend more than $1 million on a famous painting. Then moments later, it self-destructs right before your eyes. That happened last night. This painting from the legendary graffiti artist Banksy auctioned off -- forget this, $1.4 million at Sotheby's Auction House in London. But after the gavel fell, shocked as a shredder hidden inside the frame of the artwork shredded it to pieces.
An auction house official described it best when he said it appears we just got Banksy'd.
What happened to the $1.4 million? That's what I'm wondering.
And be sure to join us tomorrow for an all new episode of "This is Life with Lisa Ling." Ling explores the fact that more teenagers are rejecting boy or girl gender identities. Turning instead to non- traditional labels. This according the journal Pediatrics.
Here's a preview.
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LISA LING, HOST, "THIS IS LIFE WITH LISA LING": All grown up, this is EJ (ph) now. Twenty-five and blazing a path of his own. He's taking the Johnson name in a different direction.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I love (INAUDIBLE). Oh, thank you. Yes.
LISA: One of EJ's first steps towards independence is developing a fashion line built around his own gender bending style.
It excites me to create new looks. Something that somebody else might never put together and it's very EJ.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This jacket, I'm obsessed with. This could be, like, everything I ever wanted in a jacket actually. Obsession.
LING: EJ wants to design clothes that empower everyone, no matter their gender, to feel great about how they look.
So what is it about this that you love?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's honestly just a combination of both of my styles. Like something really very cool and urban and then like all of a sudden very, very (INAUDIBLE) and, like, uptown.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NOBLES: The all-new episode of "This is Life With Lisa Ling" airs tomorrow at 10:00 Eastern only on CNN.
And still to come, all eyes are on D.C. but protests are expected against the soon to be Supreme Court Justice Brett Kavanaugh, and they are mobilizing in every corner of the country.
[12:55:02] But first, this week's CNN hero. After being tortured as a child and coming to the U.S. nearly penniless, she's tackling the rampant homelessness problem in her own backyard. Meet Betty Chinn.
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BETTY CHINN: In China, my family's a target for the government. I separated from my family and I lived on the street by myself. This all happened really young age. I had nothing to eat.
Inside my heart, I don't want anybody to suffer what I suffered. I don't sleep a lot. I get up at 2:07, not 2:08, not 2:06. I tell myself, time to go. Somebody needs your help.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
NOBLES: To see Betty in action and all of the services she provides, go to cnnheroes.com.
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