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Washington Post: Turks Claim Audio and Video Recordings Prove Jamal Khashoggi Murdered in Saudi Consulate; Source: Turkey Could Soon Release Detained U.S. Pastor; Mexico Beach, Florida, Ground Zero for Disaster; Trump Team to Answer Mueller's Questions; Dow Suffers Second Day of Triple-Digit Losses; Three Newspaper Journalists in Custody in Myanmar; Kanye West Rambles at Oval Office Meeting with Trump. Aired 12m-1a ET
Aired October 12, 2018 - 00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
CYRIL VANIER, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): A bombshell report: according to "The Washington Post," Turkey has recordings that purport to prove journalist Jamal Khashoggi was murdered inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul.
Getting some answers: Donald Trump's lawyers prepare to respond to the special counsel's written questions in the Russia investigation but not everything is on the table.
And a generation lost: I'll be talking to the president and CEO of Save the Children. What they are doing to help hundreds of thousands of Rohingya refugees in Bangladesh.
Live from the CNN Center here in Atlanta, I'm Cyril Vanier. It's great to have you with us.
VANIER: An explosive report in "The Washington Post" purports to detail exactly what happened to Saudi journalist Jamal Khashoggi. He disappeared 10 days ago after entering the Saudi consulate in Istanbul, Turkey, right here.
According to "The Post," Turkey has informed the U.S. it has both audio and video recordings from inside the consulate that prove that Khashoggi was indeed murdered. Both Turkish and U.S. officials told the newspaper the recordings show a Saudi security team detained Khashoggi in the consulate after he walked in on October 2nd to obtain an official document before his upcoming wedding, then killed him and dismembered his body, the official said.
One person familiar with the recordings tells "The Post" that Khashoggi can be heard conversing in Arabic with others and then the sound of him being interrogated, tortured and finally murdered.
The Saudis vehemently deny any role in Khashoggi's disappearance; also we don't know if U.S. officials have actually seen or heard the recordings mentioned in "The Washington Post" article.
Jomana Karadsheh joins us now from Istanbul. She's been covering the story for us.
Jomana, so if these recordings exist -- and I have to stress, we don't know -- this might help explain why Turkey was so quick to call this a murder.
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know Cyril, this has been a very, very strange story to cover over the past nine days or so. Information has been very slow to come out from the Turkish government. We've not had any real official statement, the government not really coming out with these conclusions officially on the record, saying that they believe he was murdered.
This was all leaked, coming out of the investigation, anonymous sources, anonymous officials speaking out. So there were lots of questions about why that was going on. And one of the theories was perhaps they were trying to buy time, hoping to get more support from the international community before they go head-to-head with Saudi Arabia on this.
But now that we're seeing these reports, Cyril, perhaps they were also finding it very difficult to explain how the Turkish government may have obtained audio recordings from inside the diplomatic mission here.
And the question now is where do we go from here?
What's going to happen next?
You know the Turkey has announced yesterday at the request of Saudi Arabia a joint working group has been established to look into the disappearance of Khashoggi so a lot of questions about what happens next.
Are we going to have -- is this going to be made public, the results of the investigation?
Or is some sort of deal going to be worked out in the background?
VANIER: Now according to the article, is Turkey sharing information with the U.S.?
Do we know if the U.S. is doing its own investigating?
KARADSHEH: We heard from President Trump at one point yesterday, saying that U.S. investigators are on the ground. We've heard from Vice President Pence, saying that they stand ready to assist with this. But Turkey has denied that there are any U.S. investigators here.
But we know in recent days and we've seen from all the reports that we are hearing and our own reporting out of Washington, D.C., is that Turkish authorities are sharing a lot of what they are gathering in their investigation with the United States. And you know this past week Turkish officials and we've spoken to
colleagues of Jamal Khashoggi here on the ground in Istanbul, who we have spoken to have been waiting for this.
They've been waiting to see this kind of U.S. involvement, not necessarily when it comes to the actual investigation but more supporting Turkey in this because the feeling is that the United States is the only country that would make a difference because of its close ties to Saudi Arabia, especially President Trump's close ties to King Salman and his son, the crown prince, Mohammed bin Salman.
So the feeling was once the United States steps in, perhaps we would start getting more answers out of Saudi Arabia.
VANIER: Jomana Karadsheh, reporting live from Istanbul in Turkey, thank you very much, of course, we will continue to follow the story. Thanks.
VANIER: And we do so with CNN U.S. security analyst Juliette Kayyem --
VANIER: -- she joins me now from West Newton, Massachusetts.
Juliette, is there any explanation other than foul play by the Saudis that can explain away the sudden and unexplained disappearance of Jamal Khashoggi?
JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN U.S. SECURITY ANALYST: There's certainly not a close second to the explanation that we know now and that we've come to understand the combination of these intelligence leaks and the cameras and the videos, plus his own -- you know his own concerns about going back to the embassy that were related, his own knowledge of the threats against us and of course the U.S. intelligence community's knowledge of potential harms that might be done to him, all lead in one direction is that the Saudis, in fact, did kill him in Turkey as we suspect.
VANIER: Jared Kushner, the president's son-in-law Emily has a good relationship and a direct line to the Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman who is accused by some of being behind this.
So if the U.S. really wants answers, can't he just pick up the phone and ask -- put those questions directly to the Saudi crown prince?
KAYYEM: He certainly could if he wanted to. But you know the Saudi Crown Prince has an agenda of his own which is of course to retain power. So while he's wined and dined in charmed many Western leaders and intellectuals, he has great press here in the U.S. often, the national security establishment had all -- had been mourning that that this was more for public consumption, his you know the idea that he was a progressive and that he, in fact, was dangerous. And so I think the best we can say right now are two things. One is that you know possibly, Jared Kushner got played that he -- that the Saudis knew exactly who to play, right?
We don't have an ambassador there. Jared Kushner has taken over the Saudi docket and they basically are better at this game than he is.
I think the second thing was just has to be said is certainly the Trump administration's attitude towards these autocrats, right?
Whether it's Putin or in North Korea or certainly in China and now here in -- and Saudi Arabia has empowered the palace to do what it did. You know this hasn't happened before and there's a reason because previous leaders of Saudi Arabia were at least checked by previous presidents whether they were Republican or Democrat.
So you know there's a lot of questions to be asked about the Kushner relationship including of course what we know now is the strong financial ties between the Kushner, a debt-ridden a family business as well as the Trump family business and the Saudis.
VANIER: Certainly a feature of this administration is the Donald Trump went to Saudi Arabia to his very first foreign trip and he said I'm not going to lecture anybody about human rights, so we know that's not one of his priorities.
Why -- and perhaps this answer is my next question.
Why is Donald Trump being so cautious about this even when top Republican senators are saying look, everything points of Saudis, you have the U.S. president who presumably is the person who has accessed the most intelligence on this if he wants it, saying well, it looks like it but we're not sure yet so let's wait and see.
KAYYEM: So there's a couple of explanations. None of them are particularly good. One is just as a foreign policy or you know in to the extent that you know Trump, you know has a Trump doctrine.
It is that these human rights concerns will be relegated to essentially the financial interest of each country so that there's no notion at least in the Trump doctrine of American exceptionalism in terms of what we stand for more than the money that we have, right?
That we stand for a certain amount of values.
I think the second explanation is, of course, they're being cautious because of you know something that's concerned all of us which is that the ties between the Trump family and the Trump money -- "The Post" is, for example, reporting tonight that there's been an uptick in Saudi spending in the in the Trump Hotels and Trump Towers, that that sort of looseness of relationships, makes it difficult for the president to separate U.S. interests from Trump interests.
And so these autocrats are taking advantage of that doctrine of those financial ties and it's not of course as we've seen not just in Saudi Arabia. You know the failure to really condemn Putin after he killed former intelligence agents in our greatest ally, Great Britain, was shocking to many of us.
And even you know the failure of the president to stand up for Interpol, an international law enforcement agency after the Chinese at least the best we think have detained its president who is Chinese just means that --
KAYYEM: -- the silence is being taken advantage of. And that is -- that is something now that many of us are very, very concerned about because if there's no check today, it means that the envelope is being pushed each day and we find ourselves --
VANIER: Well, there is a possible check and you're right that there are concerns including on Capitol Hill, a bipartisan group of lawmakers has written to the president and they want to start -- they have asked for a human rights investigation to be carried out.
Can they compel the president, A, to do that, to carry out that investigation and, B, to impose sanctions on Saudi Arabia in the event that Riyadh is indeed implicated in this?
KAYYEM: So they can. They can certainly pass the laws and then the question would be would he veto it.
And I think that -- I think -- I personally think that his statements today in the Oval Office sort of placing this in pure economic terms in terms of the military deals we have with Saudi Arabia suggested that he would veto any statutory sanctions that were passed by you know bipartisan leaders in the Senate.
So there are things that the Senate can do and they certainly could override a veto by the president but that is a -- that's a long fight.
And in the absence of the president really coming out strongly condemning or at least expressing you know immense concern for what happened to someone who has ties to the United States, who wrote for "The Washington Post," of all places, that vacuum is -- does not leave me optimistic that the Riyadh will suffer.
VANIER: Yes. And on Thursday, the U.S. president was asked whether he would consider canceling arms deals, arms sales to Saudi Arabia and he said no because if they don't spend that money in the U.S., they would spend it in Russia or in China. Juliette Kayyem, thank you so much for joining us. Thanks.
KAYYEM: Thank you.
VANIER: U.S. officials believe Turkey could soon release American pastor Andrew Brunson. That is according to a source familiar with the matter, who also warns that U.S. officials are trusting Turkey to follow through on their end of the agreement.
Brunson is accused of helping a failed coup attempt. He's been held in Turkish custody for two years now since October 2016. He is now under house arrest.
VANIER: At least six people were killed in one of the most powerful hurricanes to hit the U.S. mainland in decades and it still packing a punch as a tropical storm, moving across the southeast coast toward the Atlantic Ocean now.
We've been getting just shocking images of some of the destruction that the storm has left behind. Look at this. This is Mexico Beach in Florida, an area described as ground zero for this disaster. Our Brooke Baldwin has the details on this.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): From the air, it is clear, much of Mexico Beach is gone. From the ground, we see up close the devastation to the seaside city. Home after home on the stretch of beach destroyed.
While most of the 1,200 residents evacuated, a small number stayed behind. We don't know yet how many survived the near direct hit from Hurricane Michael. Scott Boutwell didn't make it out in time. The bridge is closed and he was stuck.
BALDWIN: How does it make you feel to look around at everything just leveled?
SCOTT BOUTWELL, HURRICANE MICHAEL SURVIVOR: The thing is, you know this is a small little town. It's our little town. And so every restaurant is gone. Every store is gone. And then all my neighbors, everybody's home is gone.
And so when you think about it, you know all of this -- their lives are gone. So how do you -- how do you -- what do you do? The water...
BALDWIN (voice-over): Scott said he lost most of his possessions but he will stay and rebuild.
BOUTWELL: So the stuff I thought I had, everything of value gone here. It is hard to talk about it.
BALDWIN: All over the area, we heard this constant high-pitched beeping. They are fire alarms buried in the rubble. Warnings that perhaps came too late. Again and again, I heard from survivors here who told me they are simply grateful to be alive. These three friends were searching for one of their homes. It was hard for them to even recognize the street.
There are just no -- there are no words.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No, there's not. There are so many memories here.
BALDWIN: This woman named Sherry (ph) says she didn't have time to grab anything but some clothes and her jewelry box.
And to see this feels like what?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I can't describe it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is just terrible. It is -- it is -- I just can't describe the feeling. I know I'm not the only one here that feels the same. They lost everything.
BALDWIN: Mexico Beach is virtually cut off from the rest of the state. The emergency crews are working throughout the area. Roads are still blocked, power is out and cell service is nonexistent.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hello, it's Mama. I'm OK. I'm OK. It is a lot rougher than we thought. How are you, guys?
BALDWIN: Our satellite phone was the only way for these women to contact their loved ones.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I love you too. 'Bye.
BALDWIN: Your daughter?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're OK.
VANIER: If you want to help these victims, we've set up links to charities providing relief on our website. Just go to cnn.com/impact.
A possible sign the Russia investigation could be coming closer to an end. Sources tell CNN Donald Trump's legal team is preparing answers to written questions from special counsel Robert Mueller.
They're said to focused on possible collusion between Trump campaign officials and Russians trying to interfere in the 2016 election. Now it is still not clear if the president, the U.S. president will ever agree to a face-to-face interview with Mueller. But he says he'd be open to it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well, it seems ridiculous that I'd have to do it when everybody says there is no collusion. But I'll do what is necessary to get it over with.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VANIER: Joseph Moreno is with me now. He's a former prosecutor at the Justice Department.
So Joseph, Donald Trump's lawyers get to address the special counsel's questions in writing. This feels like a win for Team Trump.
Would you agree with that?
JOSEPH MORENO, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR, JUSTICE DEPARTMENT: I have to say yes, Cyril. I mean, it seems like a small win. But possibly a significant one down the line. I mean, look, the worst case for the president would have been to walk into a grand jury, subpoena, or some other kind of interview where he's put on the spot.
Here, he would not know what the questions would be in advance, he may or may not be able to turn to a lawyer and get advice, so this is obviously, a much better way to give answers to the questions in a thoughtful, calm, relaxed atmosphere where he gets to write out, think it through, have his lawyers review it and then submit it.
VANIER: We're not 100 percent sure that that's not going to happen at some point down the line, though. There is still a possibility, I mean, correct me if I'm wrong that Donald Trump may go in and answer questions face to face, right?
MORENO: Well, certainly, it could have in a couple of different ways. One is that we're told by reporting that these written questions only relate to the Russia collusion, portion of the investigation.
Now we know that the special counsels also looking into potential obstruction of justice. Now there must be a reason why these questions do not address those, that area of the investigation. So that certainly could be the topic of a future subpoena or other instance to get live testimony from the president. The other possibility is --
VANIER: Hold on. So let me -- let me get you to pause right there. Let's just -- let's just break that down for a second. What does that tell you? The president's lawyers are OK to answer questions about possible collusion and what happened during the campaign. They are not OK, they have not reached an agreement with the Special Counsel to address any question of anything to do with possible obstruction of justice.
MORENO: It could be a couple of different things. One is that the president's lawyers are aggressive and that they are -- they feeling good about the obstruction case and feel like they can push back and they're not too afraid of the consequences. That's one possibility.
Another possibility is that they're very sensitive about that area of the investigation. And therefore, they're doing everything they can to push back and not answer questions in any forum, whether it's live testimony or written Q&A.
VANIER: So how does this move forward from here? There is a first round of questions that are being addressed in writing now by the president's lawyers, then what?
MORENO: Well, a couple possibilities, right? So we were saying earlier that one possibility is that the president could still get a subpoena in the other portion of the investigation which is the obstruction area. Another possibility is that the president provides these written answers to the questions and the special counsel says, you know what, I'm not satisfied with these answers.
Either they are too short, or they are not detailed enough, or you're sort of playing around with your answer and not being direct. So I'm not satisfied. And either I want to revisit them, infuse your written questions and answers. Or you know what, nothing short of verbal testimony is really going to satisfy me.
So really could still go down that road. And if it does, we're looking at a potential battle in the courts.
VANIER: Does the Special Counsel currently have this right to respond to these answers and to demand more answers to pursue the conversation in writing? Or is that something that's going to have to be established and negotiated with Donald Trump's lawyers again?
MORENO: It's really a negotiation. I mean, you hit the nail on the head because a lot of what we're doing here. There's no written laws or rules that dictate how you investigate or question a sitting president. So a lot of this is really hashed out between the lawyers. And they're very good lawyers on both sides. So you have some very talented prosecutors working for the special counsel and he has some very good lawyers working for the president.
VANIER: You would think so.
MORENO: Yes. You can imagine, these are very, very detailed negotiations that have been going on for quite some time.
VANIER: If you take a step back big picture, does this mean the Special Counsel is moving toward the end of his investigation? I mean, the fact that he's now asking questions of the president directly?
MORENO: Most likely it means we are closer to the end than we are to the beginning. You know in any significant financial or white-collar investigation, you're going to start with the smaller players and work your way closer to the focus of the investigation. And here, that's President Trump.
So it would seem like if the special counsel, perhaps has exhausted the documents and the e-mails and the smaller players in this matter and he's working his way toward the president, hopefully, that means he is getting to some conclusion, at least, on the Russia collusion portion of his investigation.
VANIER: All right. Well, it makes more sense. It is clearer now that was the point of this conversation. Joseph Moreno, it's all thanks to you. Thanks for coming on the show.
MORENO: Happy to do it, thanks.
VANIER: Global financial markets are bracing for a potentially wild ride after Wall Street chalked up a second day of triple digit losses. When we return, who President Trump blames for the dip.
VANIER: Turbulence on Wall Street sent U.S. stocks into a tailspin on Thursday and now we're keeping a close eye on the Asian markets, which are now open.
So what is it? Mixed results, let's take a look. The Nikkei and Shanghai are down slightly, you see that, while the Hang Seng is up over 1 percent. On Thursday the Dow fell 545 points, resulting in a 1,300 point loss in just two days.
President Trump responded by criticizing the Federal Reserve for interest rate hikes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think the Fed is far too stringent and they're making a mistake. And it's not right. And it's -- despite that, we're doing very well but it's not necessary in my opinion and I think I know about it better than they do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VANIER: All right, let's try and get some perspective on this. Joining me, Jeff Rosensweig, an international business and finance professor at Emory University.
Jeff, thank you very much for coming back on the show. Donald Trump seems to be blaming a lot of the dip in the market -- dip or plunge, you'll tell me later how you want to quantify this -- but on the Federal Reserve, right. He had some choice words for the Fed, saying they were crazy, they were loco, they made a big mistake, they've been too aggressive in raising interest rates.
VANIER: Have they been?
Is this their fault?
JEFF ROSENSWEIG, EMORY UNIVERSITY: They haven't been too aggressive so far. But they have announced that they plan to raise interest rates four times in the next year. That would be too much.
With the markets so volatile, we really don't need the Federal Reserve to hit the brake that strongly. On the other hand, the Federal Reserve is an intelligent institution.
I used to work there. They have a lot of the world's best economists there. They won't raise interest rates four times if the economy slows down or if the market keeps falling.
It is important that the central banks remain independent. It's very important that the president doesn't intervene. I think maybe one reason the market went down is Bank of England, Bank of Japan, we can think of all the people watching here on CNN International around the world.
Their central banks are staying independent and the president has to keep his hands off.
VANIER: So how would those words come across then in those walls?
Since you've been there, you were senior international economist at the Fed, how -- when they listen to this criticism from the president, how do you think they take it?
ROSENSWEIG: I think they get their back up a little bit. I think they're mature enough that they wouldn't do something just to show the president that they're independent. For instance, if he says don't raise interest rates they won't raise them just to show their independence.
VANIER: He's got no leverage over the Fed, to be clear.
ROSENSWEIG: He doesn't except once in a while he gets to appoint someone if someone comes up. They have fixed terms. So for instance he didn't reappoint Janet Yellen when he was in charge.
ROSENSWEIG: Yes, and now he's angry at him. We'll see what happens with the Supreme Court.
VANIER: How big is this?
You told me maybe it's not a plunge; it's more of a dip. You seem to want to not minimize but put this, keep this in perspective in terms of how big the market -- how much the market has dropped.
ROSENSWEIG: That's right. People are losing money; I've lost money. On the other hand, if people would make a graph, go back 10 years after the crash and make a graph, this is what it would look like. The value of the stock market, it would go up so much.
And then just a dip in there. Over time stock markets do go up and they usually outperform other places to put your money, like in the bank. So people have to sit tight. And it's hard there's a lot of fear out there. But that's the best advice.
VANIER: But there is one medium- to long-term factor here, which is the trade tensions between the U.S. and China. That doesn't look like it's going away anytime soon. ROSENSWEIG: And Cyril, you're right and it's a -- it's something that is, along with the Federal Reserve and maybe even it's the primary factor, the trade tension right now with China.
And Cyril, I want to say it's much more than when we saw the president with Mexico or Canada, let's renegotiate NAFTA. At the time that seemed important but that was really just about tariffs, should we have a little bit of a tax on dairy or not.
This goes much deeper. First of all the U.S. has a huge trade deficit with China, almost $400 billion and getting bigger. So that is -- it's a world record but beyond that there are serious questions about intellectual property, about industrial espionage.
And as I speak to people in the U.S., business leaders and Democrats and Republicans, there is a greater and greater feeling, strong feeling that China does not play fair.
VANIER: -- norms and international trade --
ROSENSWEIG: -- free trade were only advocates if it's fair. So I like what you said, Cyril. This could be a medium-term, this could be long-term. And that's I think what's got the stock market more worried, just more volatile, not just that it's going down but it's more volatile.
VANIER: Yes, there is, as you say, bipartisan consensus, certainly in this country and it's shared, as you mentioned by European leaders, whether China has been playing fair.
Jeff Rosensweig, thank you so much for joining us.
ROSENSWEIG: Thank you, Cyril.
VANIER: My pleasure.
Hundreds of thousands of Rohingya children are living in refugee camps. How one aid agency is trying to keep from becoming a lost generation. Stay with us.
[00:30:00] CYRIL VANIER, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Welcome back. I'm Cyril Vanier. Let's look at those headlines. The Washington Post reports that Turkey claims to have audio and video recordings from inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul that prove missing journalist Jamal Khashoggi was murdered. The source says, Khashoggi can be heard being interrogated, tortured, and finally killed.
U.S. officials believe Turkey could soon release Pastor Andrew Brunson, that's according to a source familiar with the matter, who also warns that U.S. officials are trusting Turkey to follow through on their end of an agreement. The American is accused of helping a failed coup attempt. He's been in Turkish custody since 2016.
Three journalists working for Myanmar's largest private newspaper are in police custody in Yangon, after local officials complained about an article that questioned the public's spending. Yangon's regional government claims the journalist caused fear or alarm, but the journalists say they simply published a true story.
A U.N. human rights envoy says Myanmar is unable and unwilling to investigate abuses in the country, particularly against the Rohingya. In 2017, Rohingya Muslims suffered under a brutal military crackdown. Hundreds were killed and hundreds of thousands fled their homes to neighboring Bangladesh.
Now, the U.N. envoy says the cycle of violence, injustice and impunity in Myanmar, will end only if there is genuine accountability. But so far, that has not happened. Myanmar's civilian leader, Aung San Suu Kyi, says outsiders are expecting too much too soon.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AUNG SAN SUU KYI, STATE COUNSELLOR OF MYANMAR: There are many people who do not even realize what the situation in the Rakhine State alone is like, let alone in the whole of Myanmar. These days, it's always quick fixes and instant gratification. Everything has to be done immediately and quickly. But we can't afford to do that because we have to cope with the consequences in the long run.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
VANIER: Well, hundreds of thousands of Rohingya children living in squalid refugee camps, in Bangladesh, can't wait for government ministers to focus on the long run. They need help and they need it now, in order to avoid becoming a lost generation, if that's even possible at this stage. Carolyn Miles is President and CEO of Save the Children. She joins me from Los Angeles.
Carolyn, I know you've been working with Save the Children for 20 years, so I'm interested in your perspective here. In terms of scale and suffering that you've seen, can you describe for us what you're dealing with?
CAROLYN MILES, PRESIDENT AND CEO OF SAVE THE CHILDREN: Well, I think the scale is massive in Bangladesh. As you said, there is now 725,000 Myanmarese, who are in Bangladesh, and half of them are children, under the age of 18.
And those kids obviously need lots of support right now. And one of the most important things is trying to get some kind of education going for those children. And that's one of the most important part.
VANIER: Are they getting an education now?
MILES: Well, what we're doing is running 100 learning centers across this huge sprawling camp, and only about half of the kids between the ages of 4 and 14 are actually able to get any education. And for teenagers, it's even fewer, so this risk of a lost generation is really huge.
VANIER: I want to get back to that in just a second, but I think we have to detour by how the kids are doing, and including mentally, because these are kids who are borne witness to war, to rape, who have feared for their own lives, who have sometimes seen their parents being killed and raped, as I mentioned, who have fled their country, their homes, everything.
I mean, that leaves scars. How are they doing?
MILES: It does leave scars. And I think this mental trauma that these kids have experienced, I certainly in speaking to the children when I was there, you could see the fear in their eyes. You could hear the stories of terror that they experienced. And so, one of the things that we do is, we do try to actually provide psychological help.
[00:35:12] We actually have 35 psychologists now, who are working in the camps, in our health centers, and trying to provide that support. But it's obviously not enough. This is --
MILES: You know, thousands and thousands of children.
VANIER: Well, you mentioned 300 to 400,000 children, 35 psychologists, I mean, that's not a knock on you, but it just shows the size, the magnitude of the problem. I know you were on the ground. Can you share any stories with us, give us a sense of what it's like to talk to these kids?
MILES: Sure. While I was there, as I said, and first of all, it's this sprawling camp, one of the most important things is to try to keep kids safe because they are at risk of abduction. They're at risk of abuse.
So these learning centers are also a safe place to be. But, you know, they also are like kids anywhere. They try to -- you know, they try to find things to do and try to keep themselves busy, but I think we are really at risk of losing these kids, both because of lack of education, but also because of the disease that travels through these camps, again, 300,000 children is many, many children.
So, trying to keep them healthy and safe is critical right now.
VANIER: Let's be honest. Tell me about your challenge. You want to -- you want to save this generation. But I can't think of a group of children that has been set -- dealt a worse set of cards to begin their lives. What are their prospects now?
MILES: Well, I think the prospects now, and as you said, these are persecuted people who have been persecuted for a long time. Certainly, having some kind of safe return is one of the options. Being able to be in a safer place than this particular camp, which, you know, if a typhoon hits this area, which it often does, we fear for the lives, the very lives of these children. So, it is a very, very tough situation, and we are working with many others to try to figure out what the alternatives are. And if there was some safe return, but that does not look like right now that that's an option that's going to happen any time soon.
VANIER: No, sadly by our own reporting and all the stories we've been doing on this story, I agree with you. It doesn't look like it's going to happen. Carolyn Miles, thank you so much, Carolyn Miles from Save the Children. Thanks for speaking to us.
MILES: Thank you.
VANIER: A bizarre scene at the White House. U.S. President Donald Trump is speechless as rapper Kanye West goes on a 10-minute rant in the Oval Office. We'll have all of the details when we come back.
VANIER: Not many people can upstage U.S. President Donald Trump, but rap artist Kanye West may have, when he held court in the Oval Office on Thursday. You want to see this. Athena Jones reports on the, frankly, rambling and surreal scene.
KANYE WEST, RAP ARTIST: Trump is on his hero's journey right now. And he might not have expected to have a crazy like Kanye West run up.
[00:40:15] ATHENA JONES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: A remarkable display in the Oval Office Thursday afternoon, cameras, capturing controversial rapper Kanye West, delivering a lengthy profanity-laced soliloquy, praising President Trump and his Make America Great Again message.
WEST: It was something about when I put this hat on, it made me feel like superman.
JONES: West, pontificating on a wide range of topics, including his own mental health and his appointment with a doctor.
WEST: He said that I actually wasn't bipolar. I had sleep deprivation.
JONES: Even weighing in on what type of plane he believes the president should be flying in.
WEST: I brought a gift with me right here. This, right here, is the iPlane 1. It's a hydrogen-powered airplane. And this is what our president should be flying in, look at this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And get rid of Air Force 1. Can we get rid of Air Force 1?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No? You don't like that. JONES: The White House billed the meeting as a discussion about urban revitalization, workforce training, African-American unemployment and criminal justice issues.
But it was West's stream of consciousness speech that drew attention, with people on social media and elsewhere questioning the President's decision to have this meeting, in the aftermath of a natural disaster, and others expressing concern.
WEST: I love this guy right here. Let me give this guy a hug right here. I love this guy right here. Come here!
TRUMP: That's really nice.
JONES: It wasn't the first time West made headlines with the MAGA hat and a pro-Trump message.
TRUMP: Just friends.
JONES: There was this post-election visit to Trump Tower.
TRUMP: We've been friends for a long time.
JONES: And after West performed on Saturday Night Live, last month, these remarks were captured by former SNL cast member, Chris Rock, as the credits rolled.
WEST: You know, it's like the plan to take the fathers out of the home and promote welfare. Does anybody know that? That's the Democratic plan.
JONES: The Grammy-winning rapper has been featuring Trump's image and dropping Trump's name, for years.
WEST: I know Obama was heaven sent, but ever since Trump won, it proved that I could be president.
JONES: And Trump clearly appreciates the praise.
TRUMP: Kanye West must have some power, because as you probably saw, I doubled my African-American poll numbers. We went from 11 to 22, in one week. Thank you, Kanye.
JONES: His friendship with number 45 is a far cry from his relations with past presidents. After Hurricane Katrina, he slammed President George W. Bush.
WEST: George Bush doesn't care about black people.
I'm really happy for you. I'm going to let you finish.
JONES: And he earned this criticism from President Obama after stealing the spotlight from Taylor Swift at an award show.
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: She was getting her award. What is he doing? UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why would he do that?
OBAMA: He is a jackass.
JONES: Athena Jones, CNN, New York.
VANIER: All right. That's it from us this hour. Thank you for watching CNN NEWSROOM. I'm Cyril Vanier. We are back in 15 -- 18 minutes with more world news, stay with us.
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