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New Day

Trump Doubles Down on Caravan, Tax Cut Claims Despite Lack of Evidence; Trump: I Am Absolutely a 'Nationalist'. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired October 24, 2018 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The president talking about taxes and border security are issues that continue to keep that enthusiasm up among the base.

[07:00:09] JOE BIDEN (D), FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Democrats have to choose hope over fear. We have to choose truth over lies.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Alisyn Camerota and John Berman.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: OK, good morning, everyone. Welcome to your NEW DAY. I have an update on the Mega Millions. Yes, we did win, John. I promised everybody I would get an update. And the office pool that we did with the whole crew did win. I heard 8 bucks, but you say 6?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's right.

CAMEROTA: I think it's going down.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: It's either 6 or 8 bucks? You can't even --

CAMEROTA: Yes. Let me tell you something, John. First of all, for the pleasure of dreaming. That's, I think, worth the price of admission. No. 2, we're going to reinvest it and then win the millions.

BERMAN: You keep getting the same return on the investment. You keep getting the same return on the ten bucks you put in. Twenty-two cents back.

CAMEROTA: That isn't my thing, but we did win. OK?

BERMAN: Somebody actually won, we should not. Someone in South Carolina bought the winning ticket, $1.6 billion that they don't have to split, you know, 30 ways.

CAMEROTA: We don't know. We don't know if that was an office pool. It was one ticket, but that -- that's a good morning for them that they're waking up with.

BERMAN: And you. CAMEROTA: OK. Meanwhile, let's get to the news, if we can.

There is no proof of anything. We're quoting President Trump there. That's as he frames his mid-term strategy of misinformation and fearmongering, he had to admit yesterday, two weeks before voters head to the polls, that there's no proof of what he was saying about the caravan.

He, as you know, was claiming that there were criminals and, quote, "unknown Middle Easterners" in the caravan of Central Americans that are in Mexico right now. And then when pressed in this extraordinary Oval Office Q&A, the president had to admit, quote, "there was no proof" of that claim. Now, that didn't stop government officials from having to scramble to try to substantiate it.

Mr. Trump also doubling down on wanting to be called a nationalist. He insists he's never heard the term associated with white nationalism.

So Anthony Scaramucci's going to join us in just minutes.

BERMAN: All right. So it doesn't end there. The president also promised a new tax break. He did that to the surprise of Republicans in Congress and White House officials, who will actually have to come up with said tax break. He's calling for a 10 percent cut, mostly for middle-class workers, if the Republicans keep the House and Senate.

The issue here and the reason this is interesting is because this falls into the category of his claim about the caravan. The president is just saying stuff out loud before the election, and his staff is having to backfill, is having to reverse engineer some of the claims he's making on the stump.

We're less than two weeks away now before voters go to the polls on election day. Early voting has already started in a number of states.

Joining us now, Bill Richardson, former governor of New Mexico, ambassador to the United Nations, secretary of everything. Also joining us, senator and CNN senior political commentator Rick Santorum; and Rachael Bade, congressional reporter for Politico and a CNN political analyst.

Rachael, I'm going to go to you, because you've never been an elected official; and we know there's anti-Washington bias here. Look, I heard from two Republican strategists yesterday on the issue of the caravan. They say Republicans, we still have less than a 50 percent chance of taking the House, unless -- unless pictures of the caravan keep getting placed on the news for the next two weeks. Is it that simple?

RACHAEL BADE, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, Republicans think that they sort of have the benefit on this issue, or that they have the leg up on immigration. So right now, they're really trying to latch onto the caravan issue and put that front and center and say, "Listen, if you want the country to be secure, if you want crime to be low, you've got to vote Republican." This is sort of part of a strategy to try to continue this enthusiasm

boost that Republicans saw a couple weeks ago, when Brett Kavanaugh was confirmed. And that's why they're sort of talking about immigration right now.

I think we have to look at whether or not this is working. To be sure, the president's approval rating is at the highest point it's been since his inauguration, and they have actually seen this work in some districts.

But I am hearing right now the Republicans are getting a rescue mission ready right now for four GOP incumbents who were originally considered either likely Republican or lean-Republican districts. These were districts that are sort of that second tier that they weren't thinking were going to be super vulnerable to Democrats. But right now, they're getting their money ready to sort of invest in this -- these districts, which shows that there are limits to this strategy, and it's not working everywhere in terms of Democrats trying to take back the House.

CAMEROTA: So Rick, when you hear the president say that there's no proof of what he claimed about the caravan, that we should let people know is still thousands of miles away. It would take them months, at this pace, to even get to the U.S. border, if that's where they ultimately end up.

And also, Rick, I'm curious what you think. When you hear the president say Middle Easterners, is he using that as synonymous with terrorists? Why is he singling out that ethnicity and region?

RICK SANTORUM, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I -- first, I don't think he has to. I think the scene of that huge caravan of people, you know, coming to the border, basically demanding entrance into the United States, does raise a lot of concerns across America.

[07:05:15] And I think the reason the Republicans are playing this up, yes, it has to do with immigration, but I think it really has more to do with, you know, picking up from where the Kavanaugh hearings left off, which is the mob; which is the left basically going out and, sort of in gangs or mobs, trying to sort of impose its will, irrespective of what the law is. And that's --

CAMEROTA: Hold on one second. Hold on one second. How -- why are you connecting refugees and Democrats?

SANTORUM: It's the idea that, you know, the laws don't matter and that we can basically, you know, do whatever we want to do. Connect it with Democrats, because clearly, this is, you know, the Honduran -- at least the origin of it is from the -- from the left-wing party there. They've admitted to it. Libre Party in Honduras has admitted that they were the ones that originally organized this.

CAMEROTA: Oh, the left wing in Honduras.

SANTORUM: Right.

CAMEROTA: But you're saying left-wing as though it's here.

BERMAN: How many people did the Libre Party have on the ballot here in the United States, Rick?

SANTORUM: The point is that the sympathies -- this is a socialist party and which now the Democratic Party has become, the socialists. They call them progressive but basically socialist party. It's -- it's basically saying, you know, the idea that, you know, that immigration is a right and that -- and that --

CAMEROTA: But there are laws about immigration.

SANTORUM: -- they will impose themselves.

CAMEROTA: Rick, hold on. There are laws about immigration. The 1980 Refugee Act. Let me just read it to everybody. "The Congress declares that it is the history -- it is the historic policy of the United States to respond to the urgent needs of persons subject to persecution in their homelands, including where appropriate, humanitarian assistance for their care and maintenance in asylum areas." This is the law.

SANTORUM: Yes, well, this is not what we're talking about here, though. What we're talking about, the vast majority of people interviewed -- I've watching literally hundreds of interviews of folks that are being interviewed in these caravans, and they're all saying, almost all of them are saying is that they want a better job. They're looking for -- they're looking for better economic opportunities. That's not what asylum is for. So this is a very different story.

BERMAN: All right. Let's just rewind, Ambassador, if we can, and talk about what Rick Santorum, who was a successful politician for many years, just did there. And I think it's illustrative of where the situation is.

He tied Democrats running for office to a mob and said they are trying to break laws, when what is happening here is that there are those thousands of migrants who are 1,000 miles away plus from the United States. They're not demanding to be let in. They're coming to apply for asylum. So that aside there. But that tie is so clearly what Republicans want to achieve before the election, as described, I think, really well by Senator Santorum there.

So what's the Democratic argument? What's the right way for Democrats to address this issue, if at all?

BILL RICHARDSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, follow the law, I think, as Alisyn mentioned. There are asylum laws, and these individuals 1,000 miles away, there's no Middle Easterners there. They are fleeing injustice, repression, poverty, gangs from Honduras, El Salvador, the entire Central America region. And they are coming in, applying in a situation where there's -- according to the Border Patrol, there's been the fewest arrests of Border Patrol individuals coming into the United States.

So what is the proper response? We need comprehensive immigration laws. We need to deal with the issue beyond the children, the DACA. We need to find ways to address these issues in a humanitarian way.

CAMEROTA: But none of that's going to happen before the midterms. So are Democrats going to lose this one?

RICHARDSON: Well, no. I think the Republicans are in the trouble. They're in deep trouble. You see the president out campaigning for House members. Maybe he's doing national races.

But what Republicans are doing is recognizing that the health care issue, pre-existing conditions, they've been hurt badly by being associated with wanting to get rid of that. They're trying to shift to immigration, which has been a winning issue for the president. Instead of the president talking about the job situation, which he has a decent record, he's talking about immigration. He's issuing distortions. He's saying the Democrats are in charge of the -- of the caravans. I mean, this is ridiculous.

CAMEROTA: Can I --

RICHARDSON: And so what is happening right now, I think, is suburban voters are fleeing the Republican Party. Independent voters are fleeing the Republican Party. The president is generating support only within his base in the hope that that's going to get a high vote out that will save the Republicans from losing the House, which I think they're going to lose.

BERMAN: Rachael.

[07:10:02] BADE: I just want to jump back in on the fact that, you know, Republicans are saying that Democrats are behind this caravan.

You know, I was talking to a more moderate Republican in a swing district that had a large Hispanic population. And this Republican was saying the same thing and blaming, you know, Democrats for being behind this caravan.

But politically, it's just ridiculous, because Democrats know that immigration is not the winning issue for them. They want to talk about health care. They want to talk about the Republican repeal bill that passed the House that got rid of these protections for preexisting conditions, that are very popular not just among Democrats but also Republicans. This is not something they want to talk about. So the idea that they would try to rev this up and try to get this caravan to the U.S. border to somehow change the topic to immigration is just absolutely ridiculous. They have nothing to do with this.

BERMAN: Hey, Senator Santorum, on the issue of truth and facts here, when the president said, you know, there's no proof of the Middle Easterners there; the president, you know, with the Saudi jobs claims over the last few days; the president's claims on the tax cuts that he wants, and maybe he wants a 10 percent tax cut, but the idea that, you know, it existed before, there was a grand plan before the House bill, you know, as someone who has worked in politics and tried to get yourself and others elected, is it helpful when someone is making claims like this that are provably false? SANTORUM: No. You know, but it's sort of the president's shtick,

that he -- he sort of uses hyperbole a lot and exaggerates things and tries to -- tries to, you know, take credit for things that aren't necessarily, you know, going to happen. For example, this tax cut he says is going to -- at one time he said it was going to happen before the election.

I mean, I don't understand why the president injects those things. He's got a great record to run on on the economy. He doesn't have to talk about tax cuts that he's going to do. He can talk about the impact, the positive impact that the tax cuts that he actually did pass are having. So I don't understand why the president does that. But he -- you know, again, I -- there's a good record there, and I hope he continues to run on it.

And look, I think the Republicans are in trouble, but I do believe that this unsettling caravan and the unsettling mobs around -- around Kavanaugh have really stoked a chord with moderates and independents about whether the Democratic Party is the party that isn't just going to be a real disruption and not really be a positive force in Washington.

CAMEROTA: I mean, Ambassador, you can hear -- you hear what Senator Santorum is saying, bringing up the term "mobs" a lot. That's obviously a talking point that people have -- we've heard the president say. He's tweeted about it.

So do you think that, in the last stretches, that fearmongering works? I mean, the caravan is not in our country. The caravan is thousands of miles --

SANTORUM: But it's coming to our country, Alisyn. It's not going -- they're not -- they're not going to Costa Rica. I mean, they're coming to the United States.

CAMEROTA: Are you concerned about all of the internal problems in Mexico right now, because they have a lot. This is a Mexican problem right now. So months away, they may be on our shores and could be a problem, but are we, before the midterms, is that our No. 1 priority, the internal problem months away in Mexico?

SANTORUM: I think it's indicative of a larger problem of illegal immigration and the Democratic response to it, which is to be very, very soft on that. And in fact, I've debated on -- on the airways here on CNN. You know, a call for open borders. They don't say "open borders," but what they say is that everybody should have an opportunity to come into this country.

RICHARDSON: The problem --

SANTORUM: We need to take our poor.

RICHARDSON: The problem is Mexico is not helping us detain some of these immigrants, because they're mad at us on trade. They're made at us on the wall issue.

CAMEROTA: That's why they're not helping?

RICHARDSON: Of course.

SANTORUM: They never -- they did some interdiction --

RICHARDSON: No, they're not helping.

SANTORUM: -- even when we were in a good relationship with them.

RICHARDSON: And so -- and so what I think is happening now is the president knows that the party's in trouble, the Republicans, so you increase your base --

CAMEROTA: You fortify it.

RICHARDSON: Yes, like in New Mexico. The governor candidate is staying totally away from the president, as are the congressional candidates. And what the president is trying to do is get that base revved up so that there's more turnout by his base --

CAMEROTA: Sure.

RICHARDSON: -- knowing that he's losing women voters on the Kavanaugh issue, suburban voters --

CAMEROTA: Yes. Understood. I mean, we'll see -- look, we'll see what happens. But at the moment the poll numbers seem to be showing that it's working.

But thank you very much, Rachael, Rick Santorum, Ambassador Richardson. Thank you very much for all that.

BERMAN: Another big issue. President Trump has declared now repeatedly that he is a proud nationalist, even though it is a word that he admits we are, quote, "not supposed to use."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: It's called a nationalist. I say, really, we're not supposed to use that word. You know what I am? I'm a nationalist. OK?

Call me a nationalist if you'd like.

In that sense, I am absolutely a nationalist, and I'm proud of it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Joining us now, former White House communications director, Anthony Scaramucci. His new book is titled "Trump: The Blue-Collar President." I'm holding it right here in my hands.

[07:15:04] Anthony, thank you so much for being here. We're so glad that you can make it.

ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I was thinking of the way he decorates his apartment at Trump Tower when I titled the book.

BERMAN: Yes, blue-collar.

SCARAMUCCI: I thought you guys would like that.

BERMAN: And gold lame president, maybe, instead of blue-collar president.

SCARAMUCCI: It's less about how he grew up, and it's more about why the people I grew up with happen to like him.

BERMAN: All right. Anthony Scaramucci, are you a nationalist?

SCARAMUCCI: No, I'm not a nationalist. Np, he's not a nationalist. I mean, he's saying that he's a nationalist, because he wants you to be upset about it. But he's really not a nationalist.

I mean, if you really understand the historical word "nationalism" and you know what it really means over the last 150 years, and we're about to go into a Veterans' Day, which is the 100th year since the end of the second -- the First World War. I mean, it's just ridiculous. He's not a nationalist.

And if he wants to keep saying it to upset people, and what he'll probably do is double or triple down on it, that's fine. but somebody should go and knock on the door of the Oval Office door and say, "Hey, you're really not a nationalist. And when you say that you're a nationalist, what ends up happening is you're going to tune out some of the people that you really need." And he doesn't need to do that.

And so he's got a -- he's got a great base of people. He's got a great economic track record to run on. He's done some very interesting things on the national security side as it relates to our footprint.

I understand that he wants to put American working-class families first and he wants to put middle-class families first, and so he's conflating the word "nationalism" for that and for those principles and policies.

But if you really understand the historical context of what it means to call yourself a nationalist, you're actually not a nationalist. So stop saying it.

BERMAN: You don't think he understands the historical context of it?

SCARAMUCCI: No, I think he does. I think what he's -- one of the strategies that the president has had that's worked very effectively is to literally push people in the intellectual elite category of our society, who have really read a lot of history about the word "nationalism" and would caution people that are internationals. Woodrow Wilson Center would caution people. The Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy would caution people in using that word. And so he likes riling up intellectual elites who use the word.

BERMAN: You're a self-proclaimed blue-collar kid from Long Island, right? And it bugs you. So let's leave Fletcher and Woodrow Wilson out of this --

SCARAMUCCI: Not really self-proclaimed. Again, my life just happened to happen to me, right? I was born in a --

BERMAN: But my point is -- my point is this isn't an elite thing. This isn't he's upsetting the elite thing. It's upsetting you, Anthony Scaramucci. You don't like it. Admit that you don't like that he uses the word.

SCARAMUCCI: It's like I've had this weird, very improbable life. Like, the neighborhood I grew up in, nobody went to college, right? And so I ended up going to Tofts (ph) and Harvard Law School; ended up doing probably a lot more reading than the average person in my neighborhood. The average people in my neighborhood actually like it. OK? So like --

BERMAN: They like that he says he's a nationalist?

SCARAMUCCI: Yes, because like -- what they hear it the way he's saying it to them. What he's saying is, "I'm here for you. I'm here to try to help you get your wages up. I'm here for your family. I'm here to right-size these trade deals. You got a raw deal from the intellectual elites that don't like the word 'nationalism.' You got a raw deal from them. And so I'm here for you, and I'm going to raise your wages, and I'm going to right-size the situation for your family." And so they love him.

And he can tell 4,000 lies, or I don't know. What is he up to? Ten thousand lies. I don't know what. It doesn't matter to those people.

BERMAN: Does it matter to you?

SCARAMUCCI: Absolutely. It absolutely matters to me. But see, I'm a little bit different. I thought -- the reason why I wrote that book is I think I have an interesting voice here, is that I grew up in a blue-collar neighborhood, and a lot of my cousins didn't go to college. And then I went on to do some reasonably successful but very successful things. And I hang out with a lot of elitists. And so I'm able to look at both sides of the spectrum --

BERMAN: It sounds as --

SCARAMUCCI: -- and try to analyze it from each angle.

BERMAN: There are those who suggest, though, that it sounds like you're talking down to people who didn't go to the elite schools that you went to.

SCARAMUCCI: No, I'm not talking about --

BERMAN: You said in the book -- let me finish. Let me finish. Let me finish.

SCARAMUCCI: I think those people -- I think those people are smarter than the other people to be honest. BERMAN: You're talking down to them when you say, "These people don't care about lies." I know a lot of people from a lot of different socioeconomic backgrounds that care a lot about lying.

SCARAMUCCI: OK, so let me rephrase it. They would probably, if they got an opportunity to talk to the president, they would say, "Hey, look, we're with you. You don't need to do the lying. You could just say what the facts are. We're with you."

Some of the people, you know, are probably upset with the exaggerations and the stuff that Rick was just talking about, so he don't really need to do it. Why is he doing it? I don't know. You'd have to ask him why he's doing it.

But I'm making a different point. I'm not saying they don't care about the lies. I'm saying that the preponderance of the policies are super, super important to them. The aspects related to his personality, if you had a scale, they would take the policies, John, over the personality.

BERMAN: OK. That I get.

SCARAMUCCI: Some of the people in, like, the salons that I've lived in since I left my home on 72 Webster Avenue, they don't like the personality, right? Even though they look at some of the policies and say, OK, those are really smart, common sense policies. The delayering of the administrative state, the deregulation, the tax policies for the United States are leading to great economic growth.

[07:20:07] BERMAN: Do you think he knows he's lying?

SCARAMUCCI: Yes, I think he does. Yes.

BERMAN: So the reason I ask --

SCARAMUCCI: I think he likes it, actually.

BERMAN: He likes lying?

SCARAMUCCI: Yes. He likes it, because I think he likes the fact that people are talking about it, and he likes that fact that it's like taking my finger and, like, putting it in one of the two eyes that you like on your face.

BERMAN: Whose -- whose finger -- whose eyes is he putting the finger in? Because that's the part of it that I don't get. If he likes lying -- what would you call someone that likes lying?

SCARAMUCCI: You know, like a rascal, like a scoundrel. You know, like a --

BERMAN: The president's a scoundrel?

SCARAMUCCI: Yes, it's -- there's a smirk on his face when he's doing it. I mean, there's a -- there's also an entertainment aspect to it. You know, he -- when he goes to a rally like that, you know, there's a level of embellishment there, because he's playing to the crowd. He's playing for the laughs. And he -- you know, I mean, that's -- that's been his perfect persona. It's been his style. By the way, you can't really argue with the success of it. You have to look at what he's done in his life.

BERMAN: Success is a different story.

SCARAMUCCI: And it's basically successful.

BERMAN: Again, I asked you what do you call someone who likes to lie, and you say a scoundrel. Another thing you could call someone who likes to lie is a liar. Is he a liar?

SCARAMUCCI: OK. Well, we both -- we both know that he's telling lies, OK? So if you want me to say he's a liar, I'm happy to say he's a liar, but I'm -- I'm telling you that those people that I wrote about in that book --

BERMAN: Yes.

SCARAMUCCI: -- and the research that I did on it, on the levels of the weighted average of what they really care about, they care way less about that, John. And they care way more about, OK, we finally have a president that's going to be my advocate. And so all of that other nonsense that he does, that existential nonsense, is less important to them.

BERMAN: That may be. I just don't like, and I think you and I agree. And I don't like when people say, "Oh, because somebody didn't go to college they don't care about lying," because I know for a fact that people do care about lying. Your book, "The Blue-Collar President" -- the blue-collar -- I know you --

SCARAMUCCI: Let me rephrase. OK, OK, let me rephrase it, because I think it's super important for everybody to understand. Nobody should lie. I'm not a big believer in lying, but politicians have to lie.

BERMAN: You want to say that to the camera, to the president?

SCARAMUCCI: Nobody should lie.

BERMAN: Mr. President --

SCARAMUCCI: And you know, but you're a politician now, so politicians lie when their lips are moving. And so all these people lie. But you should probably dial down the lying, because you don't need to. You're doing a great job for the country. So dial that down, and you'll be doing a lot better. You don't want to be stuck in the mid- 40s going into the 2020 re-election.

BERMAN: One of the things, the reasons that I'm glad you wrote this book the way you did. I do think that one of the things that's fascinating is that Donald J. Trump, who was given $440 million by his father, has managed to make a connection --

SCARAMUCCI: Yes. BERMAN: -- with many blue-collar voters and make himself relatable --

SCARAMUCCI: Yes.

BERMAN: -- to these voters. And you can love the president or hate him but I don't think you can deny that fact. So the question is how?

SCARAMUCCI: So a number of different ingredients there, but the main one is because he hung out with a lot of construction people over the course of his life, and he lived in Queens. He adopted a certain blue-collar culture.

Second reason is, I think it has a lot to do with his father. I did a lot of research on his father in the book. I tell stories about Fred Trump in the book, where he was a very compassionate guy. And, you know, I have friends of mine that are in their 70s now that will tell me that they saw Mr. Trump, meaning President Trump, drive up in his old Cadillac and collect coins out of laundry vending machines and washing machines in his dad's apartment complexes, and he was very gregarious back then and talking to those people.

I think the president admires hard work. And I think he looks at a person like my dad as an example. He says, "Wow, that guy worked, you know, very, very hard; and he put Anthony and his brother and his sister in a position to really live the arc of the American dream." And so he really likes people like that. And I think they relate to him, because it's like, "Whoa, these other elitists for whatever reason have decided to neglect us."

And then I think -- and by the way, I will say this for the Democrats, because I want the country to do better. I want people to come together. I would say you probably should stop talking about the lying and being a proctor in the high school, and should probably start focusing more on middle-class and lower-middle-class people and what your package of policies are to help them.

Because I think what happened here -- and I write about it in the book -- is the establishment Republicans don't like the president. He went and got the nomination from them. And then he took the base from a Democrat. So this is an unbelievably historic victory. And he moved that base over to his ledger.

BERMAN: Let me just say, we can do both things. We can cover the problems of the middle-class people and fact check the president of the United States. I think if you don't -- if you're not questioning the facts --

SCARAMUCCI: You're a journalist, John. I'm talking about the politicians.

BERMAN: If you're not questioning the facts of the president of the United States, you're not doing your job.

Can I ask you one more thing?

SCARAMUCCI: You certainly should be. I'm talking about the product design of the Democrats, they should really think about these people that I'm writing about. They should read the book --

BERMAN: You've spoken a lot about -- about your brief time in the White House, and I think you're very honest about your successes and failures; and that's great.

I want to show you some video that you filmed in the last few days, doing interpretive dance and ask you if you now regret this?

SCARAMUCCI: The interpretive dance or the White House?

BERMAN: The regret of the interpretative dance. I'm just talking about the --

SCARAMUCCI: It's a little bit of a wild -- look, I'm dancing there with a little bit of a white overbite, but I mean, actually -- you know.

BERMAN: But you're going to stand by this? I'm going to give you one chance to stand by this or not.

SCARAMUCCI: I'm not going to -- I'm going to -- I'm going to triple down on that. OK? You see that? That's exactly what goes on in Washington. Did you see that?

BERMAN: All right. All right. Anthony Scaramucci tripling down.

SCARAMUCCI: That's what goes down in Washington.

BERMAN: Tripling down.

SCARAMUCCI: And I would encourage my other -- my other former White House colleagues to do interpretive dance. You probably lasted in your jobs longer. So just pick one or two days.

BERMAN: General McMaster is joining us tomorrow for his version. Anthony Scaramucci --

SCARAMUCCI: If General McMaster does the interpretive dance, just tell him, I'll give $10,000 to any charity of his choice. OK?

CAMEROTA: Done.

BERMAN: Done.

CAMEROTA: It's on.

SCARAMUCCI: But you've got to be very expressive. And you need a full white overbite.

BERMAN: You don't need to be good, as we just saw.

SCARAMUCCI: You don't need to be good.

BERMAN: The book --

SCARAMUCCI: I'm writing a -- I'm writing a $10,000 check to the charity of your choice, but you've got to do it on a stage, you know, move a little bit. Move.

CAMEROTA: Anthony, you're Italian. You can dance better than that.

SCARAMUCCI: No, but you're not supposed to really dance that well when you're in a situation like me at this point in your life.

BERMAN: You pulled it off great, not dancing well.

SCARAMUCCI: I did grow up in that Tony Manero culture.

CAMEROTA: I know that.

SCARAMUCCI: Out here on Long Island. A lot of gold chains, Alisyn.

BERMAN: Anthony Scaramucci.

CAMEROTA: I can see you in them now, Anthony. Thank you for being here.

BERMAN: Thanks for being with us.

SCARAMUCCI: Did you like the book?

BERMAN: I think it's a fascinating, important look, like I said.

CAMEROTA: Anthony, we have other news. OK?

SCARAMUCCI: Sorry.

CAMEROTA: You're not the winner. There's a -- we have mega breaking news now. One winning ticket sold somewhere in South Carolina, not to the Mooch, in the massive and historic Mega Millions jackpot of more than $1.5 billion. They've adjusted it down. Hardly makes it worth it.

BERMAN: See?

CAMEROTA: CNN's Dianne Gallagher is live in South Carolina with more. Who won?

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, well, I can tell you, Alisyn, it was not me. The dream was fun while it lasted.

Mega Millions did go ahead and adjust that jackpot. It's now the second largest jackpot in history, $1,547,000,000. And it all goes to one ticket that was bought here in the state of South Carolina.

Now, we don't know where in the state at this point. We do expect Mega Millions to announce that a little bit later this morning so we can figure out what city, what store. We may never know who bought that ticket, and that's because the state of South Carolina is one of six that actually allows you to remain anonymous the entire time.

Officials may not know for some time, as well. They have 180 days to come forward. Now, that $1.537 billion prize there, aif you take the cash sum, I'm

going to tell you something, Alisyn and John, South Carolina is going to welcome that, as well. They'll take their state taxes out. They will still go home with over $500 million if they take that cash lump sum. Not too shabby.

CAMEROTA: No, it's not. But Dianne, they don't have to come forward. They can stay anonymous, which kind of ruins the fun for the rest of us, quite frankly. But if they --

GALLAGHER: Probably good for them.

CAMEROTA: That is good for them. That is what they should do.

All right, Dianne. Thank you very much.

BERMAN: You would never know that I am, in fact, the winning holder.

CAMEROTA: Because you were really faking not winning well.

BERMAN: My diamond studs will give it away. But that's it.

All right. We're talking politics. Big races we're watching very closely across the country, including one race for governor that got very, very heated overnight. A live report next.

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