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George P. Bush Remembers his Grandfather; Influential Tech CEO Talks Regulation; NFL Botched Assault Investigation. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired December 04, 2018 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Eldest grandchild, George P. Bush. He is now the Texas land commissioner and he will eulogize his grandfather on Thursday before the burial in Texas.

George, great to have you here. We're so sorry for your loss.

What is it like for your family today to, of course, watch all this play out internationally and for your own personal emotions?

GEORGE P. BUSH, GRANDSON OF PRESIDENT GEORGE H.W. BUSH: Well, it's been an emotional three days for us. But coming together, you know, we've recounted so many great stories and funny anecdotes and experiences with our grandparents. And also my grandmother. This is a time when we reflect on both of them and their incredible marriage and their incredible service to our country. So it's good that we're -- we have this chance to come together to share our grandfather with the public here in the Capitol, but in short time bring him back to Texas where he'll be buried.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: That's so interesting because you are, to an extent, sharing this with the entire country and the entire world, who had its own relationship with your grandfather. But it's -- still, he's the patriarch of your family. And I saw the pictures of you getting off of the plane yesterday leading the grandchildren and I just kept thinking, gosh, I wonder what that trip was like from Texas. And you just told us, you're all staying in Blair House. I mean a whole bunch of Bushs in one place. It is just a nonstop story about your -- gampy (ph), as you all called him?

BUSH: It is. It's been wonderfully playful at times. I think that helps to kind of alleviate the situation, the emotion, the raw emotion of sharing him and his life with the country because we did share him with this country for so long. He devoted his entire life to public service. But to find that balance between a private grievance and a public ceremony is -- it's tough. But if there's a family that can do it, it's ours.

But we're looking forward to getting back to Texas and sharing for stories in St. Martin's Episcopal in Houston. And then one of his dying wishes is to be transported back via train from Houston back to College Station, where he'll be buried on the grounds of his library.

CAMEROTA: We've been reporting this morning that one of your grandfather's wishes was for President Trump to be at the funeral. And that, in fact, your family reached out to the White House months ago knowing that that day may come. So can you tell us the back story about why that truce, as it's been called, was important?

BUSH: Well, you know, I think if there's anybody that spoke to bipartisanship and rising above the politics of today, that would be my grandfather. And whether it's him or his staff, I know and my grandmother, they all wanted all current occupants to be a part of this process and to take advantage of this time where we can put politics aside and focus on the greatness of our country and devotion to causes greater than ourselves. And my grandfather reflected that in his service. And I think, you know, with President Trump's devotion of time to my grandfather's legacy, I hope reflects that. And Congress did yesterday. So it's important for the country to take this time and to reflect on the commonalities that we have rather than the differences.

BERMAN: And your whole family is on board with us. Obviously your father ran against him for president in 2016 and was on the receiving end of a lot of from then candidate Trump.

BUSH: Totally. I happened to be part of that team.

BERMAN: Yes.

BUSH: And it was tough. But, you know, if my grandfather here -- were here, he'd say, during his many campaigns where he had tough campaigns against Lloyd Benson and other famous Democrats, fellow Republicans, Ronald Reagan and others have said, you know, there's a time for politics and there's a time for governing, but there's also a time for reflection. And this is a time for reflection for our country to think about the values that make our country great.

CAMEROTA: Do you forgive President Trump for those attacks on your father?

BUSH: You know, I'm not going to lie that, you know, it hurts. It stings. But, you know, my grandfather, my uncle and my dad, if they taught me anything on politics, you get back up and you fight again. And so, you know, I'm focused on my job in Texas. I know my dad is enjoying private life. But there's other ways to serve. And that's what my grandfather is all about is that, you don't have to be in elected politics to make a change. You can be in a nonprofit organization. You can serve your fellow man in a variety of other ways. You don't necessarily have to win politics office.

BERMAN: You can be a point of light, thousand points of light.

So you were the dean of the delegation. The dean of the grandchildren delegation, 17 strong. And I feel like -- and I'm not that much older than you, but we saw you grow up. You were everywhere from the beginning. And it seems like each one of you had a unique relationship or had a unique relationship with your grandfather. Just tell us about yours.

BUSH: Well, he's -- I just remember him being the most avid sportsman I know. He has such a competitive spirit, from tiddlywinks, you know, horseshoes.

CAMEROTA: (INAUDIBLE) tiddlywinks.

BUSH: Yes. To horseshoes.

BERMAN: There you are throwing out a pitch there, yes?

BUSH: There you go. We -- well, he taught me how to hit lefty and how to throw a high and inside fastball. Just an incredible and avid sportsman. You'd always catch him at an Astros game or a Rangers game. And we're going to miss that. We're going to miss him fly fishing off the rocks in Maine and taking all of his grandchildren and his friends out in Fidelity (ph) in Maine and just having a good time in the outdoors. He would always want us to get out of bed early and do something with ourselves.

[08:35:17] CAMEROTA: So how are you going to eulogize him? Can you share with us what you plan to say?

BUSH: Well, I will -- you know, so many others are going to speak about his public service and what he's given to this country. I just want to talk a little bit about the man. And, you know, many have written about his familiar penmanship. And I will leverage a few examples of that to express the kind of man that he is on a personal level. And so it's going to be emotional. It will be raw. That was -- that was the church that I was baptized. That's the church that they attended for so long and that many Bushs did in Houston. And I'll try my best to keep it together.

BERMAN: I saw your uncle, former President George W. Bush, all day yesterday really trying to keep it together. I know it's very emotional for all of you to be here and to do it on public display. So we feel for you. It's not easy to eulogize anybody. You've got a big moment on Thursday. And know that we're behind you.

You talked about your grandfather's letter and the book where he compiled all of this remarkable -- and every time we see a new letter I'm just blown away by it.

How often would he write you? And was it always good times or was it good times and bad times? Was it just because he missed you at times?

BUSH: Well, for me and the grandkids, it was always during tough time. Whether it was a tough time in school or discipline issues or, in some instances, getting in my grandmother's crosshairs, which is always a big no-no in the family. But he was -- he would -- any time I interacted with him at his office, he was always writing letters.

In fact, one story I think back to is in 1992 when he lost. And it was early afternoon in the Houston. And he asked for me to come and visit him. And it was like 3:00 in the afternoon. And he was writing letters to all of his supporters knowing that he was going to lose that night. And he told me, George P., it looks like it's not going to come together. And, to me, that spoke to the character of the man, that he was taking his time to thank all the people that supported him throughout his public life. BERMAN: When he was writing you and you were in trouble, whose side

did he take? Did he take your grandmother's side or your side? Let us know.

BUSH: He was always the good cop. My grandmother was the bad cop. Let me just put it that way. She -- she'd be the -- that's why she was known as the enforcer in the family or aka the silver fox. But my grandfather would, you know, be the one that would come in the back end, take the high road and give the final advice for us to move forward.

CAMEROTA: Well, thanks so much for sharing your personal reflections with us. Obviously, our condolences and we're thinking of you.

BUSH: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: George P. Bush, thanks so much for being here.

BUSH: Thank you.

BERMAN: Thank you.

CAMEROTA: OK, he says FaceBook is like cigarettes and Silicon Valley needs to be regulated. Laurie Segall sits down with the CEO of Salesforce to find out why he does not believe big tech can manage itself.

BERMAN: But first, it is that time of year when we honor some of the best humanity has to offer. CNN Heroes. They are ten extraordinary people who are doing extraordinary things around the world. Join Anderson Cooper and Kelly Ripa as they announce the 2018 CNN Hero of the Year. That is live this Sunday at 8:00 p.m. right here on CNN.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're humans helping humans, and they need our help.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are truly giving the gift of mobility.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're the best the world has to offer.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're building something that matters a lot more than we do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're heroes today and every day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is nice. (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) skills how to program. It's all about solving problems.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We serve anybody who has ever raised their hand to defend our Constitution.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: My vision was to have a home where women could find safety and find themselves.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Our first goal was just to create this hospital- based intervention.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I wart each and every one of them to feel special.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Join Anderson Cooper and Kelly Ripa live as they name the 2018 CNN Hero of the Year.

ANDERSON COOPER, HOST, "CNN HEROES: AN ALL-STAR TRIBUTE": Here once again celebrating the best of humanity.

KELLY RIPA, HOST, "CNN HEROES: AN ALL-STAR TRIBUTE": Don't we need this tonight more than ever?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "CNN Heroes: An All-Star Tribute," Sunday at 8:00 Eastern.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:43:10] CAMEROTA: OK, now to "The Human Code." That's our new series tackling ethics in tech. Today our Laurie Segall interview the Salesforce CEO. The influential billionaire has called out tech giants like FaceBook and Twitter. He compares them to cigarettes and he says it's time for the government to step in.

So Laurie joins us now with more.

Laurie, tell us everything.

LAURIE SEGALL, CNN SENIOR TECHNOLOGY CORRESPONDENT: You know, Marc Benioff is really interesting. He's not exactly making friends in Silicon Valley because he is calling out other tech companies left and right and he's talking about this idea of what he's saying is the next industrial revolution, the fourth industrial revolution, where he says we're all just so connected. And he said along with that connectivity there have come a lot of ethical implications.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARC BENIOFF, CEO, SALESFORCE: When everyone and everything is connected, OK, you're going to have to really think about, do you trust what is happening? Do you trust these companies and these products that are in your home and in your car and what's going on?

SEGALL: I mean, I got to tell you, Marc, I don't 100 percent. Look at what's happened in the last couple years. How can we put all our faith in big tech when, in the last years, it doesn't even seem like some of these companies know the impact of their own algorithms?

BENIOFF: And I think it's kind of the metaphor of the social networks. It's great actually. When they started, they're talking about, it's nirvana, everything is wonderful, we're going to connect everybody together. Now we find out they're not uniting us, they're dividing us, you know? That they're not maintaining our data. That they're selling it. You know, that there isn't privacy. You know, that there's a -- basically a huge ecosystem of people who are harvesting the data for personal gain.

SEGALL: Do you trust this industry to self-regulate?

BENIOFF: I don't trust the industry to self-regulate. I already said, FaceBook is the new cigarettes. It's not good for you. It's addictive. You don't know who's trying to convince you to use it or misuse it. The government has to step in and regulate it. And FaceBook has proven that to us over and over and over again that they need to be regulated because they're not self-regulating.

[08:45:01] And that's true of a lot of technology companies. Look, we have those examples in every industry. Why is technology going to be the only industry that the government isn't going to step in to make sure that there's fair practice and truth and trust with consumers or businesses?

SEGALL: Do you think that we fundamentally have to reshape our view of privacy?

BENIOFF: I think we have to fundamentally reshape our view of business. The business of business is not business, but the business of business is improving the state of the world. If you start from there, then you can answer your question, which is, of course we have to go much deeper on privacy. We have to have phenomenal privacy regulations. Look at -- I'm a huge advocate and I'm supported, what just happened here in this great state of California where we have the best privacy law in the country. But why does Europe have a better privacy law with something that that have called GDPR than we do here? I've called for a national privacy law in the United States. We need a national privacy law. We can't just have it in California. Every company needs to be held to a new level of capability in privacy. This is -- we're in this new world. Why is our government not moving fast enough into that world?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SEGALL: You know, I think it's also important to mention that there are real questions about the business models in Silicon Valley. Look at FaceBook. A lot of folks saying, is that business model fundamentally broken. Can they connect the world, which they've been promising to do, and, you know, and also make money? And we've seen them doing so, you know, the product is free except our data is what goes. So I think there are real questions around this at a time when the world is dividing and we have -- these tech leaders have extraordinary power when it comes to the future of work, when it comes to -- you know, when it comes to the future in general. So these are things we want them to be thinking about.

John.

BERMAN: Laurie Segall, fascinating to have that perspective. Thank you so much for all the work you're doing here. It really is a unique perspective.

So it happened again. And once again the NFL does not seem to have the answers. Why does the league have so much trouble dealing with players accused of violence against women? A former spokesman for the NFL joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:51:116] BERMAN: Former star Kansas City Chiefs running back Kareem Hunt is without a team today. The Chiefs cut ties with him after this video surfaced showing Hunt shoving and kicking a woman inside a Cleveland hotel earlier this year. The NFL knew about the incident for yearly a year, but didn't really do anything.

Joining us now is Joe Lockhart. He's the NFL's former executive vice president of communications and public affairs and former Clinton White House press secretary.

Joe, we're lucky to have you here to help us understand what went on here.

JOE LOCKHART, FORMER EXECUTIVE VP OF COMMUNICATIONS AND PUBLIC AFFAIRS, NFL: Sure.

BERMAN: Let me read the NFL statement about this. The NFL's investigation began immediately following the incident in February, consistent with standard investigatory practices. The NFL continues to pursue a complete understanding of the facts. The NFL's ongoing investigation will include further attempts to speak to the complainants involved in the incident and will include a review of the new information that was made public on Friday, which was not available to the NFL previously, as well as further conversations with all parties involved in the incident.

The question, though, is, this happened in February. They were told about it way back then. How come they didn't know more over the last 11 months, Joe?

LOCKHART: Well, for a couple of reasons. One is, and people have talked about, why does TMZ get this stuff and the NFL doesn't? Well, TMZ pays for it. They go in and they find someone who works at the hotel, give them $5,000, $10,000, $15,000 and they get it. The NFL, you know, as an organization, like CNN or "The New York Times" or ESPN, you know, doesn't -- you know, doesn't condone that kind of practice.

The second thing is, the NFL's in a unique position. They have no subpoena power. They can't compel anyone to talk. I think in this particular case, and I only know what I've read, is no one wanted to talk. The person, the victims didn't want to, none of the witnesses. So they have to rely a lot on local law enforcement. And in this particular case, local law enforcement didn't know most of the story. I think they charged him with a misdemeanor.

So it's a very awkward place. But I think what the NFL tries to do is pick up where, you know, and apply a different standard than local law enforcement where many of these people that the NFL has disciplined were not charged, but they were suspended from the NFL because it -- you know, they didn't meet the standards.

BERMAN: But in this case, he played 11 games.

LOCKHART: HHGHHHH e did.

BERMAN: He played 11 games. And it wasn't until the video surfaced that there was action taken. You know, should it have taken until you actually saw the pictures to take action, Joe?

LOCKHART: Well, the problem was the player wasn't honest with the team or with the league office. And there was -- it was very difficult for the NFL -- I think if you -- you know, you can imagine the outcry if someone was falsely accused. So, again, it's a difficult situation, but the league has taken the position that, you know, they're going to be put in this situation where people say, why didn't he move quicker? They could very easily say, we're just going to rely on local law enforcement. If the police and the district attorney doesn't charge them, then we're not going to do anything. They're not taking that position. They're saying that we're going to hold our players to a higher standard.

And if you look at what's happened since Ray Rice, which I think the NFL will admit they screwed up, you know, from beginning to end, this -- the discipline and the -- in fact, a lot of these players are out of the game now because it's just not good for the NFL for them to be there.

BERMAN: So Ray Rice is out of the game.

LOCKHART: Yes.

BERMAN: We don't know what happened to Kareem Hunt. He's a free agent. But then there's Reuben Foster --

LOCKHART: Sure.

BERMAN: Who faced accusations and he was cut by his team. He's still not allowed to play. There's an investigation going on. But he was signed by the Redskins --

LOCKHART: Yes.

BERMAN: Pending the outcome of the investigation. What message does that send, that a team signed him before all the facts are even out there?

LOCKHART: Well, you know, I think it sends out the wrong message, and I think the Redskins are wrong. And I think it's one of the reasons why you need a league-wide effort here. You've got 32 owners, each with their own standards, and there's clearly some owners who will put winning in front of ethical behavior. And I think that's the case with the Redskins.

[08:55:16] But what the league tries to do, and I think they get it right most of the time, is say there's a standard for all 32. You can't keep a team from signing a guy. The league can keep Reuben Foster from playing for quite a long time --

BERMAN: Right.

LOCKHART: Depending on what they find in the investigation.

BERMAN: Joe Lockhart, thanks for coming in. Appreciate you talking about this.

LOCKHART: Sure thing.

BERMAN: All right, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: OK, John, you and I will be back, of course, tomorrow. And CNN's coverage for the final farewell of President George H.W. Bush continues after this quick break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Very good Tuesday morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Poppy Harlow. We're glad you're with us.

[08:59:40] Anytime now one of the biggest mysteries of the Mueller probe is due to be revealed. Michael Flynn, the retired Army general, Trump campaign surrogate, and briefly national security adviser, has been under wraps for a year now, well, since pleading guilty to lying to the FBI about his contacts with the Russian ambassador. He's been cooperating with the special counsel on matters entirely unknown to the public, that is until today, because today, exactly two weeks ahead of his sentencing, the Mueller team is due to tell a court just