Return to Transcripts main page

Early Start with John Berman and Zoraida Sambolin

Accused American Spy Paul Whelan Denied Bail In Moscow Courtroom; Senate To Introduce Trump Shutdown Proposal Today; Rudy Giuliani Clarifies Comments On Trump Moscow Project Saying Remarks Were Hypothetical; Senator Kamala Harris Enters 2020 Presidential Race; NFL Discussing Replay For Pass Interference Plays. Aired 5:30- 6a ET

Aired January 22, 2019 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[05:30:00] LAURA JARRETT, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news out of Moscow. Bailed denied for a U.S. citizen accused of spying on Russia.

DAVE BRIGGS, CNN ANCHOR: Deadlocked on day 32 of the government shutdown. Democrats already rejecting the deal that Republicans plan to offer today.

JARRETT: And a new interview with Rudy Giuliani released overnight. The president's lawyer in damage control, seeming to contradict himself once again.

BRIGGS: Former Trump aide Anthony Scaramucci telling all on a new T.V. reality show. Will he last longer in the Big Brother house than he did in the White House?

I'll tell you what. If we got Trump, Pelosi, and Schumer on "CELEBRITY BIG BROTHER" -- lock them in and make them get a deal, maybe we'd get some movement. Just a theory.

JARRETT: Eleven days -- you can get a lot done in 11 days.

BRIGGS: Just a theory.

Welcome back to EARLY START. I'm Dave Briggs.

JARRETT: I'm Laura Jarrett in for Christine Romans. Thirty past the hour.

And we've got breaking news right now. Paul Whelan denied bail in Moscow in a courtroom. Here's a picture just released of Whelan, the first since his arrest. He faces up to 20 years in a Russian prison on espionage charges.

CNN's Fred Pleitgen joining us by phone outside the courtroom in Moscow. Fred, update our viewers on what's the latest.

FREDERICK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (via telephone): Hi, Laura.

Yes, it's quite an interesting development. I just peeled away from a press statement that Whelan's lawyer was giving after he had just come out of the courtroom. And one of the interesting things that we've learned just a couple of seconds ago -- first of all, he said he believed that it's going to be a fair trial. Obviously, some of them believing that maybe he was framed in all this.

Interesting thing though that the lawyer said. He said apparently, in the hotel that Paul Whelan was staying in, he was given a flash drive by someone which contained state secrets of Russia. But the lawyer says that Paul Whelan was not aware that state secrets were on that flash drive. He thought that it would be information about tourism and cultural information as well.

Of course, we know that Paul Whelan is someone who likes to visit Russia and would like to go on holiday in Russia as well. So, an interesting nugget that we just got from that press statement.

In all, I was in the courtroom when Paul Whelan received that verdict. He seemed to be in a very strong mood. He seemed to be in fairly good spirits and smiling every once in a while, but certainly very much aware of the gravity of the situation that he is currently in.

The judge then came in only for a couple of minutes under very high security. We weren't even allowed to film the judge during his statement even though it was an open courtroom.

Paul Whelan behind bulletproof glass then received that quick verdict saying that he was not going to let out on bail. It was interesting when even before this bail hearing started that told us he didn't believe that bail would be possible simply because that he's such a high-profile case also, of course, involving espionage charges as well.

So, a setback for Paul Whelan, not one that was necessarily unexpected. But he certainly is in for a tough time as now the real trial begins. That is one that could certainly take months, Laura.

JARRETT: Interesting development there on the flash drive. And again, you're seeing there the first pictures we have of Paul Whelan behind bulletproof glass there in the courtroom as bail was just denied.

Thank you so much, Fred.

BRIGGS: All right, good stuff there.

President Trump hoping to put the squeeze on Democrats to end the longest government shutdown in our nation's history by offering a plan they won't accept. That's your state of play on day 32 of the government shutdown as over 800,000 federal workers prepare to miss a second paycheck on Friday if a deal is not struck by tonight at midnight.

Also, 10 percent of the nation's TSA agents are now calling out sick.

The president's new proposal, part of a larger package that Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell is expected to introduce today. That could set up a vote on Thursday but a Senate Democratic aide tells CNN the measure does not have the 60 votes it needs to advance. McConnell moving ahead anyway, hoping to shift the blame for the shutdown onto Democrats.

Here's Phil Mattingly with the latest from Capitol Hill.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Laura and Dave, there will be competing proposals. There will be competing votes. What there won't be is, at least at this point in time, any resolution to a shutdown that dragged on now more than 30 days.

As it stands right now, Senate Republicans will introduce as soon as today a proposal that mirrors what the president outlined on Saturday -- a proposal that would have $5.7 billion for the wall in a tradeoff from the immigration perspective of a 3-year temporary reprieve for DACA recipients and a 3-year temporary reprieve for those with temporary protected status.

Here's the issue right now for both Democrats and Republicans. Democrats have rejected that proposal out of hand. They have said they are more than willing to have discussions about border security -- negotiations about border security -- but they will not do so until the government is open.

In other words, something clean on the funding side of things needs to be passed before any conversations about the wall, about DACA, about TPS or anything else comes to the table.

Right now, it appears Senate Republicans will fall short of the votes to move forward on the president's proposal -- a vote that could occur likely on Thursday.

Over on the House side of things, House Democrats will continue doing what they've been doing now for weeks, passing proposal after proposal to open up the government without any funding for the wall -- proposals that have largely fallen flat because the president opposes them and Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell has made clear he won't bring any of them up so long as the president opposes them.

[05:35:15] So where does that leave things? Well, right now, it appears still very much at an impasse. The big question going into this week is given the Senate is finally taking up some kind of legislation, will it start to jar some type of bipartisan talks to reach a resolution?

Again, the biggest challenge at this moment, guys, is the baselines. Democrats have made clear they won't do anything on border security until the government is reopened, and the president has made clear he won't reopen the government until he gets money for his wall. Until that changes, right now, everybody seems diametrically opposed to anything that would lead to a resolution -- guys.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BRIGGS: Yes, no end in sight. Thanks, Phil. Nearly 300 furloughed workers from the Department of Homeland Security are being called back to work with pay, all of them from the E-Verify division of U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services. But they won't be performing their regular jobs. Instead, they'll be asked to take on other responsibilities that are fee-funded at the same pay rate they had before the shutdown.

JARRETT: Rudy Giuliani walking back comments and changing his stories at lightning speed, seemingly every day now. The president's attorney giving a new interview to "The New Yorker" magazine.

He now denies telling the "The New York Times" the president admitted having discussions about the Trump Tower Moscow project all the way through the 2016 election. Giuliani claiming he was speaking in the hypothetical and he says it wouldn't be a crime even if the president did.

BRIGGS: Hmm -- OK, I'm not a lawyer. Fortunately, you are with a Harvard degree. Is he right about that? Is that the one thing that is clear -- not a crime?

JARRETT: The one thing that is clear is no, that would not be a crime. Just having the discussions, not a crime. But that's the only thing --

BRIGGS: Right.

JARRETT: -- in this entire story that's clear.

BRIGGS: The rest of it is a hot mess.

Let's go live to Washington and bring in CNN reporter Marshall Cohen.

Marshall, have at it. What is the strategy here or can you derive any from what Rudy Giuliani is trying to do right now?

MARSHALL COHEN, CNN REPORTER: Good morning.

Well, you know --

BRIGGS: Good morning.

COHEN: -- it's not that clear that there is a strategy. Sometimes it seems like the president and his legal team are just trying to win the day or get through the day.

At this point, Giuliani said something over the weekend. He's said it before. It wasn't actually the first time that he said it. But, some serious backpedaling yesterday and I guess we'll see where it goes today.

But to call it some sort of brilliant mastermind strategy doesn't -- that doesn't seem to be what's going on here. It's one thing today, another thing tomorrow, and frankly, a lot of contradictions.

BRIGGS: Yes. Typically, a lawyer is trying to clean up his client's statements, not his own. And that's what happens day after day with Rudy.

JARRETT: So, Marshall, you hit on I think something really important -- and, of course, you live this day in and day out -- but you said he has said this before.

And I just want to play for our viewers exactly what Giuliani actually told ABC last year in an interview with George Stephanopoulos about these conversations through 2016, if we have it there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, CHIEF ANCHOR AND CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, ABC NEWS, ANCHOR, ABC "GOOD MORNING AMERICA," HOST, ABC "THIS WEEK WITH GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS": Did the president -- did Donald Trump know that Michael Cohen was pursuing the Trump Tower in Moscow into the summer of 2016?

RUDY GIULIANI, ATTORNEY FOR PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: According to the answer that he gave it would have covered all the way up to November of -- covered to November 2016. He said he had conversations with him about it. The president didn't hide this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JARRETT: OK, now then, compare that with what Giuliani is saying to "The New Yorker" last night that the president had no conversations. "Well, I shouldn't say he had no conversations. He had a few conversations about this early-stage proposal that ended somewhere in early 2016."

Marshall, explain why the timing here matters and especially, with what he said to the special counsel's office meetings right there.

COHEN: Right. Well, yes, go back in time for a moment to 2016, right. The Russians were interfering in the U.S. election through a very aggressive campaign of hacking, social media trolls, meetings with Trump associates. And at the same time, now we know two years later that there were these negotiations over a Trump Tower Moscow deal.

The special counsel has actually said in some of their filings -- they haven't necessarily said that this stuff is all connected, but they've laid a lot of the groundwork. They said that this deal would have brought hundreds of millions of dollars to The Trump Organization and it couldn't have been done without help from the Russian government at a time when the Russians were influencing the election.

Sort of trying to connect some of the dots. We'll see how much it really means in the future. But the fact that these talks continued longer into the year and Giuliani now is trying to push it back to the beginning of the year --

[05:40:04] BRIGGS: Right.

COHEN: But the fact that they were even going on at that time was very serious overlap there. BRIGGS: Yes. Given everything else we know, it doesn't even almost matter, to Laura's point, that it wasn't illegal.

But there's a lot to digest from this "New Yorker" interview. In particular, one exchange with the reporter about the fact that Giuliani reached out to the special counsel after hearing this BuzzFeed story to try and get it knocked down, which they eventually did.

And, Giuliani says something certainly eyebrow-raising for this reporter, saying, "I have been through all the tapes. I have been through the texts, I have been through all the e-mails. I know none existed." So, the reporter was clearly stunned -- and said, "I shouldn't have said tapes." That was from Giuliani.

Do we know of any tapes, and what could he have been referring to there?

COHEN: So, Dave, we actually do know about some tapes. And if you remember last year after the Feds raided Michael Cohen's home, and office, and apartment, they seized a lot of stuff and including some of it were tapes. And that's according to a few different sources, but one of them being Giuliani himself who said, last year, that there were tapes.

Now, how would Giuliani know anything about that? Well, the president was, after all, a client of Michael Cohen and they fought tooth and nail to go through all of those things to see what was covered by privilege and what wasn't.

So, it would make sense to me that Giuliani -- if I had to guess here -- is probably referring to some of the tapes that were swept up in the Cohen raid. Although, as we said earlier, it's really quite hard to tell exactly what Giuliani is thinking at all times.

JARRETT: But you can see he feels almost like he stepped in it, saying wait, wait, wait, I didn't mean to say tapes --

BRIGGS: Yes.

JARRETT: -- knowing that, of course, the reporter's antennae is going to go up and say wait, what tapes? What are you talking about?

I mean --

BRIGGS: Yes.

JARRETT: -- anyone of us would have been harping on that and trying to deal down on it.

BRIGGS: He's been stepping in an awful lot the last couple of days.

Marshall Cohen, thank you for being here trying to figure out what's happening with Rudy --

JARRETT: Thanks so much, Marshall. BRIGGS: -- and the strategy. Appreciate it.

COHEN: Thanks, guys.

JARRETT: Well, now that Sen. Kamala Harris is formally in the race for president, who's next? Another Democrat drops a hint, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:46:37] JARRETT: A third woman in the U.S. Senate announcing she intends to run for president in 2020. California Sen. Kamala Harris choosing the Martin Luther King holiday to make it official. The first-term Democrat touting her experience as a prosecutor and drawing a clear contrast with President Trump.

We get more from CNN's Kyung Lah.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

KYUNG LAH, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Dave and Laura, Sen. Kamala Harris jumps into the 2020 race. She says she's uniquely poised to take on Trump. She is the daughter of immigrants. She is a woman of color -- a former prosecutor who is trained to fight.

SEN. KAMALA HARRIS (D-CA), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We are a diverse country, yes, and some people would suggest that in diversity -- when there is a diverse population one cannot achieve unity.

I reject that notion because this is my belief. Yes, we are diverse and we have so much more in common than what separates us. And when we emphasize that commonality, when we recognize that commonality, we will achieve greater unity.

LAH: That prosecutorial pass does open up Sen. Harris to potential attacks -- attacks and questions that she's already had to answer.

The left saying that she is not progressive enough because of her time as attorney general. But, Sen. Harris has addressed it, especially during her book tour, saying it is quote "a false choice to have to pick one over the other."

Dave, Laura --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JARRETT: Kyung, thanks for that report.

And, Sen. Kamala Harris will join Jake Tapper for a CNN town hall live from Iowa, Monday night, 10:00 p.m. eastern only on CNN.

And, who could be the next Democrat to join the 2020 race? Well, New Jersey Sen. Cory Booker, on Twitter last night saying, "Just between you and me, I will let you know soon." We can only guess what his answer will be there.

And, Anthony Scaramucci -- we haven't heard from him in a while. President Trump's communications director, for a hot minute, is trying to survive longer in the Big Brother house than he did in the White House.

Monday, on the season premiere of CBS's "CELEBRITY BIG BROTHER," the Mooch spilled the details of his short stint.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTHONY SCARAMUCCI, CONTESTANT, CBS "CELEBRITY BIG BROTHER," FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: I was fighting with Steve Bannon and Reince Priebus. The shootout at the OK corral started, you know. Priebus and Bannon did not want me in that job so then, they started making up stories.

But I get my ego involved, right, and I'm a competitive guy. And so, I trusted a reporter. I said something inappropriate to a reporter.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And went after those two guys.

SCARAMUCCI: He ran to CNN with it. And so, when the new chief of staff came in he fired me.

KATO KAELIN, CONTESTANT, CBS "CELEBRITY BIG BROTHER": And who was that?

SCARAMUCCI: That was John Kelly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JARRETT: Still bruising there from his interactions with John Kelly.

Well, the Mooch channeling President Truman, telling his housemates if you want a friend in Washington, buy a dog.

BRIGGS: All right, I'm intrigued.

Let's get a check on "CNN Business" this morning at 5:49 eastern time.

Global markets are down amid concerns about the global economic outlook. In Asia, stock closed lower and European markets opened lower as trading begins there. On Wall Street, stocks pointing lower as well.

Google has been fined nearly $57 million by French regulators for violating Europe's tough new data privacy rules. According to a statement, the French National Data Protection Commission fined Google for lack of transparency, inadequate information, and lack of valid consent regarding the ads personalization.

[05:50:00] The fine was imposed after the commission observed two types of breaches. One of those violations relates to information about personal data usage not being easily accessible to users.

Google has not responded to CNN's request for comment.

Could Starbucks former CEO be throwing his hat in the ring for 2020? Howard Schultz exploring running for president as an Independent. A person close to Schultz's adviser says he's thinking deeply about his future and how he can best serve the country.

Schultz stepped down from his position at Starbucks last year and at the same time said he may consider a White House bid.

It's going to be a wide field and may now include some Independents, which would be, I think, good for the conversation in the country.

JARRETT: Yes. Schultz and Bloomberg could be an interesting match-up -- we'll see.

BRIGGS: Yes. Being able to sell finance, in particular.

JARRETT: Yes, or if they cancel each other out.

BRIGGS: Yes, sure.

JARRETT: Well, too late for Saints fans but about time, says Dave Briggs. The NFL could change the rules after a blown call during Sunday's big game. More, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:55:21] JARRETT: The NFL plans to talk about video replay for pass interference plays after Sunday's now infamous no-call that likely deprived the New Orleans Saints of a trip to the Super Bowl.

Team owner Gayle Benson ripping officiating on the Saints official Web site, calling the loss in the NFC title game "difficult to accept." She went on to say, quote, "No team should ever be denied the opportunity to reach the title game (or simply win a game) based on the actions or inactions of those charged with creating a fair and equitable playing field."

Hear, hear, says Dave Briggs.

BRIGGS: Indeed, it's about time. Good job, NFL.

OK, popstar Bebe Rexha calling out fashion designers who say she's too big to dress.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEBE REXHA, SINGER, SONGWRITER, RECORD PRODUCER: Singing "Meant to Be."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRIGGS: The 29-year-old nominated for Best New Artist at next month's Grammys, but she's having a hard time finding an outfit for the show and took to Instagram to vet her frustrations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REXHA: If a size 6-8 is too big, then I don't know what to tell you. Then I don't want to wear your (bleep) dresses.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BRIGGS: Bebe Rexha urging designers to empower women to love their bodies.

JARRETT: Well, nominations for the 91st Academy Awards will be announced in just a couple of hours.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LADY GAGA, SINGER-ACTRESS, "A STAR IS BORN": Singing "Shallow."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JARRETT: "Shallow," the smash hit song from the film "A Star Is Born," is sure to be among the nominees.

The musical drama could end up with the most Oscar nominations. Lady Gaga is expected to be nominated for Best Actress. Best Actor could be one of four nominations for Bradley Cooper who produced, directed, and co-wrote the film.

BRIGGS: It's a great song. Great movie.

The feel-good movie -- road movie "Green Book" is also a likely nominee for Best Picture. Stars Viggo Mortensen and Mahershala Ali expect to be nominated for Best Actor and Best Supporting Actor, respectively.

Alfonso Cuaron's "Roma" poised to become Netflix's first Best Picture nominee. "Roma" also a favorite in the foreign language category. Cuaron could hear his name called as many as six times this morning.

Also, Spike Lee could land his very first directing nomination for "BlacKkKlansman."

The Academy Awards will take place without a host, February 24th on ABC.

JARRETT: And finally, Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez responding to critics who say she needs to sit still or wait her turn.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, CBS "THE LATE SHOW WITH STEPHEN COLBERT": You're getting a fair amount of pushback, privately and publicly, from more established members of even your own party, saying wait your turn.

You know, go slow. Don't ask for so much so fast right now. You're new -- wait your turn for everything and don't make waves.

Now, I want to ask this question in a respectful manner, knowing also that you're from Queens, so you'll understand --

REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D), NEW YORK: And the (INAUDIBLE).

COLBERT: -- this question.

OCASIO-CORTEZ: And the (INAUDIBLE).

COLBERT: On a scale of zero to some, how many f**** do you give?

OCASIO-CORTEZ: I think it's zero.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JARRETT: It feels more like minus 20.

BRIGGS: Yes, not at all. And then, that is the refreshing sign. But she says a lot of things that you just wonder if they help or hurt the overall discussion happening in the party. I don't know, I'm just asking.

She said another thing that's raising a few eyebrows -- that it's quote "immoral" -- "an economic system that is immoral that allows billionaires to exist." That is getting a lot of steam on the Internet as well.

But she sure is doing well --

JARRETT: Something her supporters definitely agree with.

BRIGGS: -- with her supporters, no doubt.

JARRETT: Yes, absolutely.

Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Laura Jarrett in for Christine Romans.

BRIGGS: Great to have you here.

JARRETT: Thanks so much.

BRIGGS: Christine back tomorrow.

I'm Dave Briggs. "NEW DAY" starts right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's very important that we're making this offer and saying come on, now -- let's negotiate a solution.

MATTINGLY: Democrats have made clear they are opposed. The hope from McConnell's side is this at least gets Democrats to the table.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: Let's reopen the government. Mitch, do your job.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Giuliani just throws so much B.S. out there nobody knows what to believe.

REP. GERRY CONNOLLY (D), VIRGINIA: He sounds like a crazy old uncle, admitting things the White House have steadfastly, absolutely denied.

DONALD TRUMP, JR., SON OF PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: Ultimately, it was Michael Cohen trying to get a deal done. I don't think anyone took it all that seriously.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Alisyn Camerota and John Berman.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: We want to welcome our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is NEW DAY. It is Tuesday, January 22nd, 6:00 here in New York.