Return to Transcripts main page

New Day

Another Government Shutdown Looms as Border Talks Break Down; Leaked Schedules Show Extent of Trump's 'Executive Time'; Virginia Officials Refusing to Resign Despite Scandals; Top Generals: 'Tens of Thousands' of ISIS Fighters Remain in Syria & Iraq. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired February 11, 2019 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Called to stall. We've got some problems with the Democrats dealing with ICE.

[05:59:00] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We don't want to shut down. There's a very, very clear path to get this done.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We'll take as much money as you can give us. The president is going to build the wall.

GOV. RALPH NORTHAM (D), VIRGINIA: I'm not going anywhere. I have learned from this. We're in a unique opportunity now.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You have now more than one credible allegation. He has to resign.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I hope that the legislature starts impeachment for all three of these folks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANNOUNCER: This is NEW DAY with Alisyn Camerota and John Berman.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everybody. Welcome to our viewers in the United States and around the world. This is NEW DAY. It is Monday, February 11, 6 a.m. here in New York.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: It's you!

CAMEROTA: I'm back.

BERMAN: Hi.

CAMEROTA: Hi, how are you?

BERMAN: I'm so much better now. All the plants were dying. I didn't know how to behave anymore.

CAMEROTA: Wow. Well, I'm back, and I have forgotten now how to behave, so this is going to be an interesting show.

BERMAN: Fantastic.

CAMEROTA: All right. So the possibility of a second government shutdown on Friday is starting to feel very real after bipartisan border talks broke down.

Negotiators on both sides thought they were on a path to resolving their outstanding issues, but sources tell CNN there is now a growing concern that lawmakers may not be able to make a deal.

The talks have stalled over Democratic demands to limit the number of undocumented immigrants who can be detained. President Trump is laying the blame for this impasse on Democrats.

BERMAN: Tonight, the president travels to El Paso, Texas, to make his case where, in a sense, he's going to share the border spotlight with a potential 2020 challenger, Beto O'Rourke. They will hold dueling rallies there.

The president has said wildly inaccurate things about El Paso, a relatively safe city before and after a wall was built there. The president falsely claimed that before a wall was built there, crime was rampant. It wasn't.

Also new this morning, a fresh leak of the president's private schedules, this time schedules from just last week. And these schedules show that nearly half of his hours were spent in executive time, unstructured stretches where we really don't know what he does.

There is now a hunt for the leaker of these schedules, and the White House chief of staff claims they're closing in.

CAMEROTA: All right. So joining us now to talk about all this, we have our panel here to discuss this David Gregory, CNN political analyst. We have Margaret Talev, senior White House correspondent at Bloomberg News; and Seung Min Kim, White House reporter at "The Washington Post." Great to have all of you. happy Monday.

Seung Min, so tell us what -- what happened over the weekend? There was a feeling that things were going to work, and then on Sunday morning, things broke down.

SEUNG MIN KIM, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, all through the last couple of weeks since this 17-member conference committee began negotiating. There was a lot a optimism that these people could get it done. These are appropriators. They are naturally deal makers.

But what sources tell us is that around Saturday evening, the staff members of the top appropriators were talking, and talks really broke down. And they began to go out on Sunday and tell the public what the problem was.

And that problem is over the number of people that ICE, Immigration and Customs Enforcement can detain. Democrats want to cap a daily number of the people that can be detained at 16,500. Now for context purposes, the daily rate right now is about 40,000 people. And Democrats say this is a way of reining in what they call

aggressive enforcement tactics by the Trump administration. But Republicans say this is an absolute deal breaker, because by setting the cap so low, they're effectively eliminating ICE's ability to do their job and effectively abolishing ICE

BERMAN: Yes, and it's interesting. Because there's a technical distinction. Democrats want to cap the number of beds used to detain people caught in the interior.

This isn't people crossing the border. This is people that ICE goes and gets who are already here. And the Democrats say by capping the number, it will force ICE to go after people who have committed crimes here, violent crimes and whatnot, not just border crossings.

But that's a complicated argument to make, David, at this point, and it's distinctly, for people who haven't been paying close attention, not about a border wall.

DAVID GREGORY, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: It's not about a border wall, but that's also a problem, right, is how much money, ultimately, Democrats are willing to foot for the bill for a border wall.

I've talked to top Democrats who thought they were closer to a deal who want to respond to what the demands are by border agents for more reinforcements. And we should remember, there's lots of border barriers in different spots. Now the Democrats have paid for it.

But this ICE issue is something else. Let's remember the context in which this is happening. The whole question of abolishing ICE has become a huge argument point for Democrats who think that they've gone out of control, that the administration is so overly broad in their sweep of illegal immigrants in the U.S. That they want it to be more focused for those in violent records.

And for Trump, every day there's a new 2020 candidate opposing him. So he's digging in. They're digging in. It's so easy for ICE to become a central pillar of a presidential argument.

And you know, in these negotiations, you always have to wonder. Do they want a deal more than they want the issue? Or do they want the issue more than a deal? And that's what could ultimately destroy this.

CAMEROTA: Well, there you go, Margaret. I mean, this is a new variable, right, being introduced by the Democrats. This isn't something that back during the last shutdown, two weeks ago, whenever that was, that we had heard that was an impasse that they were stuck on.

And so, you know, in order to avoid whatever might happen this Friday, why introduce this new variable?

TALEV: Well, it's new in the context of the last, you know, since the last 35-day shutdown, but it's certainly not new in the context of the overall debate that has been swirling for the last two years since President Trump took office.

And, you know, we haven't talked, Alisyn, about the one other thing that, I think, is on everyone's mind, which is whether the president's going to declare a national emergency.

BERMAN: Yes.

TALEV: Or an executive action of some kind. That is all wrapped up in the same thing.

So in the first kind of shutdown, the 35-day shutdown, these two things got interlinked. Right? The continuing operations of the government and the wall debate. These things are probably about to be separated. It's entirely possible -- possible that Republicans and Democrats will agree to just continue spending through the end of the fall and let the president decide whether or not to put trigger on this emergency.

BERMAN: And Seung Min, you can help fill in the blanks here, because there is something else happening here; and this time it is from the president's side, where he is sending more troops to the border or near the border.

And also, as Margaret was just pointing out, sending all kinds of signals that, no matter what is agreed to by this conference, if in fact, they do reach an agreement, he may still take emergency action that he feels he can take to spend money above that for the border wall.

So there are sort of forces on both sides here that are drawing questions about this whole process.

MIN: Exactly. I mean, the president hasn't shown that much public faith, or any public faith at all, in the work of this conference committee. I think he signaled, ever since he set out in the Rose Garden a couple weeks ago, and said he would -- he would sign a bill to reopen the government that this was -- this wall is going to get built, one way or the other.

And now, with the national emergency declaration very fresh in our minds or potential other executive action, the president really has to be looking at the backlash that a potential national emergency declaration could cause. I mean, certainly among Democrats, who have already said they will explore legal challenges, should he do so, but also among Republicans. I mean, just the way that the procedure is structured in Congress. A resolution of disapproval that can basically negate the emergency declaration could easily pass the Senate, because there's that much Republican opposition to it.

Now the president will almost certainly veto that, but it would be a very sharp rebuke of the administration and of the president, should it come to that point.

CAMEROTA: I mean, and also, David --

GREGORY: Yes. CAMEROTA: -- just the backlash of another government shutdown on Friday.

GREGORY: Right.

CAMEROTA: After all the -- we've had -- we had so many federal workers on here who talked about the impact on their lives and the pain that it was causing them; and the idea that they are on the cusp of this again.

GREGORY: Yes. Look, a government shutdown is just stupid. And I think everybody knows that. And I think Trump got spooked by what happened, not only the potential impact on economic growth, flights being delayed in LaGuardia, but I think Democrats are worried about this, too. I mean, if it happens again, they're going to start to feel some of that weight, as well.

So I keep coming back to who, ultimately, wants a deal on this? Because you do have some appropriators who know how to make a deal on these issues. But what's fighting them are their respective bases, who want to fight on this issue, you know? And that's what gets in the way.

So we had this -- all this movement toward getting close on a deal, getting close. And this could just be a lot of screaming and yelling before they arrive at some deal, or not. I mean, it's very hard to know with this administration, since we've gotten close to the line before. Maybe we just have to hold out hope for infrastructure week again.

BERMAN: Margaret, you wanted to jump in?

TALEV: I think -- I think David's exactly right. I think we'll know more in the next couple of days, but if President Trump really wants to have either the emergency declaration that he's been contemplating or some kind of executive action to show that he's the president, he's in charge, he doesn't have to get jammed by Congress, if that's going to happen anyway, there's not that much insensitive for Democrats to go along with concessions they don't want. There's more incentive for them to fight back if the whole thing's going to get blown up anyway. So I think we do see a lot of posturing.

And the imagery that we're going to see tonight of these two dueling rallies at the border just increases kind of the argument for how much politics has injected itself in this debate with 800,000 people's jobs on the line and a lot of real-world implications for -- for families and children at the border.

BERMAN: It's a great point. More politics will be injected into this over the next 24 hours rather than less, given that there are rallies tonight at the border.

And what David was saying, you know, shutdowns are stupid. You sit here being, like, "There's no way they could shut down the government again," but then you remember who we're dealing with here, Democrats and Republicans and members of Congress and politicians, and sure, it could happen again. We shouldn't rule it out.

Axios publishing new schedules from last week over four days. Four days' worth of schedules from last week. This is after their giant month of months' worth, year's worth of schedules showing just how much executive time the president has on his daily calendar.

The four days last week, 50 percent of his time spent in executive time. Seung Min, what's the issue here? Is it, again, that people are still leaking these schedules? Or is it that the president uses so much executive time or that we don't understand what he's doing during those hours?

KIM: There's a couple of issues here. I mean, first of all, the -- how easily these are being leaked to the press should definitely concern White House officials. And senior White House officials, including the acting chief of staff, Mick Mulvaney, have indicated they are on the hunt for leakers, that they feel that they are close to finding the perpetrator in this case.

But also, it really does give a window to how this president operates. And, you know, these large stretches of executive time with a lot of senators, especially Republican senators I've talked to, they tell me all the time just how frequently he is calling them and how much he is gauging their feedback, their advice on what he should do about this nominee or on this policy.

[06:10:09] There are meetings that he has held that we have found out after the fact that doesn't ever get advised on his public schedule.

So he is doing something here in this, what is structured as executive time. But I also think that, particularly with important meetings, there's an issue of transparency here. I mean, if you look on his public schedule that gets sent out to the press, they can be sparse. But oftentimes, they are -- he's holding meetings with people as powerful as Mitch McConnell.

He held a meeting with the Senate majority leader a couple of weeks ago where the leader warned him about the perils of taking steps to declare a national emergency that we did not find out about until three days later. So there's a leak issue, and there's also a transparency issue on the part of the White House.

CAMEROTA: We have to wrap, but I'll just read his side. Here's what the president tweeted about it. "The media was able to get my work schedule, something very easy to do. But it should have been reported as a positive not negative. When the term Executive Time is used, I am generally working --"

BERMAN: Generally.

CAMEROTA: Generally. "Not relaxing," John Berman.

BERMAN: Generally.

CAMEROTA: "In fact, I probably work more hours than any past president." BERMAN: Generally.

CAMEROTA: All right. Thank you all very much. Great to talk to you.

So listen to this story. Virginia's top Democrats, as you know, are embroiled in scandals, but can they weather these controversies; and will they remain in office despite them?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:15:13] BERMAN: All right. New this morning, we are hearing from Virginia Governor Ralph Northam in ways we have not before. A new interview. He's vowing to stay on the job, despite the racist pictures that are on his yearbook page, while the lieutenant governor of Virginia, Justin Fairfax, also refuses to step down. He is ignoring calls from top Democrats to resign after a second woman has accused him of sexual assault.

Joining us now, former mayor of Tallahassee, Andrew Gillum. He was the 2018 Democratic nominee for governor of Florida, now a CNN political commentator. And Joe Lockhart, former Clinton White House press secretary, also a CNN commentator and a legend in his own time.

I want to play you some of this interview we're hearing from Ralph Northam, the governor of Virginia, new this morning. Let's play that sound.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NORTHAM: Right now, Virginia needs someone that can heal. There's no better person to do that than a doctor. Virginia also needs someone who is strong, who has empathy, who has courage, and who has a moral compass. And that's why I'm not going anywhere.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: It's now ten days, two weeks, since we saw the yearbook page where people appear in blackface and a Klan costume from his medical school yearbook.

Mayor, did you ever think that Ralph Northam was still going to be governor today?

ANDREW GILLUM, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, I didn't, obviously. You know, the interesting thing about this process that we see the governor going through right now is I'm not actually sure what he is atoning for.

He started by saying it was him. Then it said it wasn't. Then it was, "I didn't select these pages to go in my yearbook." And we're actually not sure where the truth is there.

And I just think I do believe people ought to be given grace. I do believe that people ought to have an opportunity to make amends for what they've said and what they've done. But we're still unclear. The people of Virginia have to still be unclear about what exactly he stands for.

CAMEROTA: But if, in fact, it is him, should he stay in office?

GILLUM: Well, I mean, I've called for his resignation, largely because I feel like I think it's extremely difficult for him to be able to continue to lead the state with the full confidence of the people that he's elected to serve.

Now, we did see some polling come out this weekend that shows that he's got, I think, some majority popularity there, but his support amongst voters of color has gone down to about half of the folks there, a little more than half believe that he ought to keep his job. So there's something there.

I will tell you, I am a little bit conflicted in this whole situation in the sense that I went around the state for two years in Florida, saying that people shouldn't be judged forever by their worst day. That all of us ought to have the opportunity to reconcile and get our act together.

I feel that the governor is best suited to do that as a private citizen; but if he's vowing to stay in the office of governor, we're going to have to hear something better than what we heard in this interview over the weekend. A path forward that I think does some of the policy work necessary, not just the reading list, but the policy work necessary to move the state forward.

BERMAN: Are we in a new day, though, Joe? What does it tell you that he is still in office? And I don't think, despite what we all predicted, is going anywhere.

JOE LOCKHART, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. I would not have predicted that he would have lasted that weekend. The -- his answers were unintelligible. And I think I agree with Andrew that the teachable moment here is for him to resign.

But, we're now in the era of Trump, where you -- as he said, "I could go down Fifth Avenue and shoot people. And if I just dig in and deny and, you know, say that my people are going to keep me here and create this sort of alternative reality." It has worked for him and people in politics model success.

It's all wrong. He should resign. If he wants to make improving race relations in Virginia, around the country, then he ought to do it as a private citizen. Politicians do need to live to a higher standard, and we can't.

And I think as Democrats, the reason this is a problem for Democrats is we are different than Republicans. And, you know, you saw Al Franken get run out of the Senate, you know, with Kirsten Gillibrand leading the charge. We are different, I think, when people say things that are racist. And leaving Northam there for the party is problematic.

And then finally, it's problematic, because it goes to who elects Democrats. Democrats are elected by people of color and women. And with Fairfax and with Northam, this is a problem.

CAMEROTA: Do you think this is a byproduct of President Trump? So he has weathered so many storms. You know, there's -- just to remind people, there are 15 women who have come forward and said that they witnessed or were at the receiving end of assault or harassment from President Trump. He mocked a disabled reporter. There were so many things. He has employed, as we know now, dozens and dozens of undocumented workers.

[06:20:04] So many things that scuttled other people's bids or campaigns didn't for his, and so now is this officially a new day?

GILLUM: Yes, I mean, there's not only a new day, this may be a new normal in politics. The president obviously has set a different tone.

I agree with -- I mean, what we are trying to say on our side is that we are party of values, of morals; of racial justice and equity; of women's rights and obviously standing side by side in the #MeToo movement. You've heard every major presidential candidate on the Democratic side speak up on this issue and demand better, demand greater.

We're, unfortunately, in a really conflicting place, I think, in the state of Virginia. I'm hopeful that all three leaders will take real stock of what their responsibility is, not just to themselves, but more importantly, to the people who elected them and how we move that state forward.

BERMAN: And it's all getting thrown into the same bucket now, with the three office holders: the governor, lieutenant governor --

LOCKHART: They're all different.

BERMAN: -- and the attorney general.

LOCKHART: They're all different.

BERMAN: Justin Fairfax now accused on the record by two women of rape in 2000 and 2004. He now wants an FBI investigation, but every national Democrat that I -- I mean, I can't think of a national Democrat who hasn't called on him to resign at this point.

There's something else that developed overnight, Joe, and it is worth noting. A tweet -- we're talking about tweets a lot here -- from Representative Ilhan Omar of Minnesota who -- it was about Israel.

And let's just put it up there. She retweeted with comment someone who said, "Would love to know who Iliana (ph) from Minnesota thinks is paying American politicians to be pro-Israel, although I think I can guess. Bad form, Congresswoman, the second anti-Semitic quote you've tweeted.

It goes on, and she retweets with this, if we can put it up. We can't put it up. She retweeted it with the word "AIPAC." There it is. AIPAC there, which is the American Israel Political Action Committee, which is not a PAC, actually. It's a lobbying group. And then she put in another retweet of one, again, talking about support of Israel where she says, "It's all about the Benjamins, baby."

And there will be people who look at this and say what she is doing is perpetuating this myth, this notion that Jewish money is somehow controlling things in this country.

LOCKHART: Yes, listen, I understand on one level what she's saying, which is AIPAC is a very powerful lobby that has a lot of influence. No one disagrees with that.

CAMEROTA: And they do spend a lot of money.

LOCKHART: And they do spend a lot of money. And in fact, it's one of the more polarizing institutions within the Jewish community. You have the Jewish community is split on AIPAC. Many Jews, American Jews believe that they are way too pro-Netanyahu and, you know, they have a -- you know, there's a different point of view.

You know, I think several of the freshman Congresspeople are on a learning curve. And this just walks into, I don't -- I don't believe that it's anti-Semitic. But you are opening yourself up to those charges, and there's a better way to do it.

BERMAN: Well, look, the "it's all about the Benjamins, baby" is going even further than just putting the word "AIPAC" there. And what you have seen before is there have been all kinds of people who have criticized Republicans for bringing up George Soros, for instance, or Michael Bloomberg, for instance. And they will note that that seems to be some kind of illusion to anti-Semitism here. It's the same thing.

LOCKHART: Yes, I'm not sure it's the same thing, but she shouldn't have done it. And she's got to be clearer on these things. And it goes to when you communicate by tweet, everyone can interpret it anyway they want.

CAMEROTA: Very quickly, what are your thoughts on this?

GILLUM: Well, I mean, I'll tell you. I got accused of being anti- Semitic in my run for governor of the state of Florida. And I will tell you, I visited Israel three times, presided as a mayor of a sister city relationship with Ramah Shiron (ph). I never traveled to Israel in any of those times funded by AIPAC, but I'm completely aware of the power of the organization.

I don't say that as a pejorative. I will tell you, I think we have to be able to criticize certain pieces of foreign policy. I don't think this was a respectful way to do it, but I think we ought to give the congresswoman some room. She has on the record said that she supports the state of Israel. Those were her words.

And I think in certain places we can be critical; at the same time restate our unapologetic support for the state of Israel.

BERMAN: Sure. And being pro- or anti-Israel is very different than suggesting that somehow, Jewish money is controlling things or actions in the United States. GILLUM: Well, my read of it was that she was acknowledging that

powerful lobbying influences, absolutely does have significant power in the state of -- in the nation's capital.

LOCKHART: And I think it's akin to people who criticize the NRA for having power. But I understand how making these sorts of statements.

GILLUM: Although we're not equating, obviously.

LOCKHART: No, no, no. But I understand how these sorts of things of doing it in the way she did opens herself to criticism, and there's just a better way to do it.

BERMAN: All right. Joe, Mayor, thank you very, very much.

[06:25:04] CAMEROTA: Thank you both.

BERMAN: The top U.S. commander in the war against ISIS is speaking out and now contradicting the president. We'll tell you what he said overnight. We have a live report next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAMEROTA: The commander of the U.S. Central Command is in the Middle East this week as part his farewell tour before stepping down. General Joseph Votel says tens of thousands of ISIS fighters remain spread across Syria and Iraq, directly contradicting President Trump's claims of them having been destroyed.

CNN's Barbara Starr is the only TV correspondent accompanying the general on the trip, and she joins us live from Cairo -- Barbara.

BARBARA STARR, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Good morning.

We have landed overnight after overnight flying from Cairo. And this is the week that President Trump wants very much to announce that 100 percent of the physical caliphate, the land that ISIS once controlled in Syria, is now out of their hands.

END