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2022 Challenges Assumptions on Women Candidates; Lufthansa Airlines Sues Passenger Who Missed His Flight; Michael Cohen Once Again Does Not Show Up for Court; Bill Cosby Calls Prison an Amazing Experience. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired February 12, 2019 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN HOST: You've been watching the Presidential election landscape has shifted dramatically when it comes from gender to one woman running in 2016 to this for the race for 2020 as far as Democrats are concerned. There's just as many women running for President as men and that is putting researchers of women and politics into this whole new world.

[15:35:00] Hopefully it'll mean a better one because right now they find it's not great for women on the trail citing the "New York Times" here, quote: "Reluctance to support female candidates is apparent in the language that voters frequently use to describe men and women running for office in the qualities that voters say they seek and in the perceived flaws that voters say they are willing or unwilling to overlook in candidates."

Joining me, the woman who penned that piece there from "The New York Times," Maggie Astor, nice to have you on.

MAGGIE ASTOR, WRITER, "HOW SEXISM PLAYS OUT ON THE TRAIL": Thank you for having me.

BALDWIN: So, lay it on me. In 2019 are American ready to have a woman President?

ASTOR: Well, I think we'll have to see the answer to that question, but what my reporting showed was that there are really a whole slew of ways in which women running for President are judged differently than men running for President. There is a heavier focus on likability, there is a lot of focus on appearance, both physical appearance and even the tone of women's voice and some of the characteristics that we tend to expect from our leaders like toughness or, you know, strong strength, those are stereotypically associated with men whereas women have to actively prove that they also have those qualities and --

BALDWIN: If I may, if I may, let me just jump in. You're running through these and I want to home in on the likability trap you talk about sexism rears its ugly head on the trail like the likability trap, man, woman, everyone wants to be liked, so what's different for women? ASTOR: Well, voters do want to like candidates regardless of gender

and likability has certainly been brought up in conversations about male candidates as well. The difference is that research shows that it's a nonnegotiable quality when women are running and when men are running it's more negotiable. What I mean by that, is that if voters think that a male candidate isn't likeable, that may be a negative, but they will still vote for that man if they otherwise think that he's qualified and like his policies, but if they think a woman is unlikable, that's -- there's no getting over that. They won't vote for her regardless of the other factors.

BALDWIN: Interesting.

ASTOR: The difference is not so much in the fact that likability comes up but in how important voters consider it in making their decisions.

BALDWIN: To your point, it's not just about who voters want to have a beer with, it's what you call superficial judgments from everything to what they're wearing and their voice and this was Hillary Clinton in 2015.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know, I've been told to stop and I quote, shouting about gun violence. First of all, I'm not shouting. It's just when women talk some people think we're shouting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: To her point about shouting, to your point about shouting, you say, when a man gets loud, why is that different?

ASTOR: Well, when a man gets loud that can be perceived as -- you know, him being opinionated or passionate or strong or forceful, but when a woman raises her voice it is often perceived as shrill or as yelling or even as her lecturing voters. That was another word that came up a lot in the 2016 race, and so the exact same behaviors in female candidates can actually be judged very differently than in male candidates.

BALDWIN: At least in the end -- I want to end on a positive. You did talk about the women running in 2019 aren't apologizing for who they are. You're writing that these women are running unabashedly as themselves. Maggie Astor, thank you very much.

ASTOR: Thank you.

BALDWIN: A major airline is suing one of its passengers who used a loophole to score a cheaper flight. What that passenger did though is now prompting this crackdown?

President Trump's former personal attorney Michael Cohen has managed to postpone his highly anticipated testimony before lawmakers, so why does he keep putting it off? We'll be right back. [15:40:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Lufthansa Airlines is suing a passenger for missing the flight. The airline accuses the traveler of using this popular money- saving tactic called the hidden city hack that some savvy travelers use to avoid higher costs nonstop flights by simply getting often layover cities. According to this lawsuit, this passenger booked a flight from Seattle to Oslo with a layover in Frankfurt, Germany. The passenger hopped off the plane in Frankfurt and instead flew on a separate reservation from Frankfurt to Berlin saving hundreds of dollars.

[15:45:00] Lufthansa claims the bargain-hunting scheme is a violation of their terms and conditions and sued the passenger for more than $2,000. A Berlin court dismissed the suit but the airline has filed an appeal in hopes of deterring this growing practice. Justin Green is a CNN attorney and aviation analyst. I've heard of points runs, you know, but this whole notion of hidden city ticketing, maybe it's a real thing among a lot of people.

JUSTIN GREEN, CNN ATTORNEY AND AVIATION ANALYST: One thing I'm happy to be here when there hasn't been a plane crash.

BALDWIN: Thank goodness.

GREEN: This is a really interesting thing that people don't realize when they buy a ticket, what they're actually doing is signing a contract with the airline and the conditions of the contract --

BALDWIN: You're getting on the plane.

GREEN: There're 18 articles in the Lufthansa contract, one of the articles say if you don't show up for the flight they can charge you a service fee and I'm quite sure this is the basis on which they sued this person. One of the things that you just said off-camera is suing them, they give more -- they let more and more people know that this might be a good way to save money on tickets. I'm not sure about their legal strategy, the case has been dismissed but their PR strategy I'm not so sure if this --

BALDWIN: So, they could be, though -- I mean, it's one thing to say, all right, this guy didn't take the ticket and move along but obviously, they are trying to send a message, so on the one hand they're sending a message, but on the other hand they're educating a lot of people. This thing is called hidden city ticketing and it's a way to buy a cheaper flight.

GREEN: My guess is that this guy did something to let them know it happened and I have some sympathy for the airline. If you think about it, the person buys this ticket. They're expecting him to get on the second flight. He's probably booked all the way through so now they're at the gate wondering where this guy went maybe even holding the plane and then they take off with an empty seat which they could've sold to another passenger, and there's this whole -- environmental issue you got a plane going with one less passenger. It's probably not a great way -- it's probably better to do points runs or to save money in other ways. But this is something that's been going on. A guy in 2014 put a website that taught you how to do that. He was sued by United. That lawsuit was dismissed on jurisdictional grounds. This is something that people do and people can save quite a bit of money by doing it. Until that ends, they'll keep doing it.

BALDWIN: People find a way to --

GREEN: Game the system.

BALDWIN: Justin Green, thank you very much.

President Trump's former attorney is postponing his testimony now for the third time this month. Michael Cohen did not show up for today's scheduled appearance before the Senate Intelligence Committee because of a medical issue we're told but lawmakers may be running out of time. Cohen is supposed to report to prison March 6th for a three year sentence for tax crimes, campaign finance violations and lying to Congress in 2017.

CNN crime and justice reporter Shimon Prokupecz is on this and we know he first postponed citing fears of safety for his family. What's going on with Michael Cohen?

SHIMON PROKUPESZ, CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: It was postponed. You're supposed to appear before the House intelligence committee. They said they were postponing it because of the Mueller investigation. Now Michael Cohen who recently had surgery on his shoulder, he had shoulder surgery claims he can't come in because of a medical issue and so we don't know. We really don't know if we'll ever see Michael Cohen again whether or not he's going to appear before members of Congress, whether or not he'll appear before the Senate. They certainly want him to appear. Today, the ranking member of the Senate Intelligence Committee Richard Burr said they really want to talk to him and they're hoping they could talk to him before he goes to jail which as you said is March 6th. But that may not happen. Who knows what's going on?

BALDWIN: Can't he go to prison and then be in front of this committee? That's what a lawyer told me.

PROKUPESZ: It could happen. It could happen certainly. It would be something that's very unlikely but it could happen. Who knows when's the last time someone who's actually in prison has appeared before members of Congress. It could happen. There's no reason why. I'm sure the marshals could set something up. They could send people, the committee members could go to the federal prison and interview him there, so that could happen. Maybe there's a video conference that they could do eventually as well. Nonetheless, I think they do want to talk to him. Michael Cohen had promised to come in and tell his side of the story publicly. There was all this arrangement and certainly a lot of attention and everyone was expecting that he was going to come in and say a lot and little by little things started changing, certainly he was afraid he said for his safety and his family's safety, but who knows? Now we may never hear from him again.

BALDWIN: I have a feeling you might, Shimon Prokupecz.

[14:20:00] PROKUPESZ: I'm just saying.

BALDWIN: I know. I got you. Thank you very much for the update, the latest cancelation there.

[15:50:00] We are getting our first insight into Bill Cosby's first five months in prison. A spokesman for the comedian is saying he's having an amazing experience.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BALDWIN: Today, we are learning for the first-time what life is like for Bill Cosby inside side a maximum security prison.

[15:55:00] Cosby is serving at least three years for drugging and sexually assaulting former Temple University women's basketball coach, Andrea Constand. He is entered the general population last month and now Cosby spokesman, Andrew Wyatt, is talking to Philadelphia TV station WCAU about how the aging actor is doing. Wyatt says Cosby quote, looks amazing and mentally strong but there is one person he won't allow to visit.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW WYATT, SPOKESPERSON FOR BILL COSBY: Mr. Cosby had prepared himself. He prepared all of us probably three or four months before sentencing. He said this guy has a vendetta against me. He will throw the book at me. He said so I'm ready. I'm prepared. I'm ready to go in. Don't worry about me. He said wake me up at 3:30 a.m. they wake him up and he exercises. He is in his cell. He does leg lifts. He pushes up against the bed and does pushups. He showers and he waits for breakfast. He puts it in a little cup, walks over to a sink and runs water over the food and shakes it up and drains it. He eats the food. Right now, I'm the only visitors outside of his attorneys. That is the way he wants it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So, Camille Cosby has not visited him?

WYATT: She has not visited.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you hear him describe how he's surviving, but you think?

WYATT: He is mentally strong. He is just a strong man. He said despite the circumstances he said this is an amazing experience.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did you really use the term amazing experience?

WYATT: Yes. He used the term amazing experience.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BALDWIN: Wyatt tells CNN that Cosby only speaks to his wife three times a day for three minutes but he has been getting thousands of letters. Strangers are even putting thousands of dollars on Cosby's prison account. The Philadelphia affiliate also quotes Wyatt as saying that Cosby has been assigned cell mates to get around. He is 81 and legally blind.

CNN's Jean Casarez extensively covered that trial in his transition to prison. My goodness. Amazing experience.

JEAN CASAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I know. That's what you're left with, amazing experience saying he got down to 195 pounds, that he's not eating bread or desert, really focused on healthfulness in his life. You know, I guess that, you know, he became a super star for American television, right through the per sis tans and attitude and everything else.

BALDWIN: Sure.

CASAREZ: So, he would take those qualities to make the most of this term. I'm sure what a lot of people want to here is how he feels about the crime he was convicted of.

BALDWIN: Right.

CASAREZ: You're not hearing that. Let's look at the other side. He was convicted of a felony, three felonies, indecent sexual assault. He was and must be a registered sex offender also determined to be a sexually violent predator. He has to take at least one in prison because of that title he has. There is another side to all of this. It is tarnishing to him.

BALDWIN: Sure.

CASAREZ: This is very uplifting for what he believes are the people.

BALDWIN: So, he is in general population. They are reporting that he is getting all of these letters. I can only imagine what people may be writing to him and what they are saying. The fact that people are putting money on his prison account, does that surprise you?

CASAREZ: Yes. You have a commissary account and you can't have thousands of dollars in it. It is to someone who should have a lot of money. Right? And another thing. O.J. Simpson became a mentor. We learned this at his parole hearing that he would lead the prison church service. That he would help and mentor the young men in prison to lead a life that was straight and narrow and not go to other way. He focused on helping others. Now, it has only been almost a year for Bill Cosby. But he always wanted to help the youth, right? But we are hearing solely about him right now.

BALDWIN: He is doing pushups and --

CASAREZ: And no deserts and no bread.

[16:00:00] BALDWIN: He wakes up. These are the details. He wakes up at 3:30 in the morning to exercise in the cell he is mentally strong.

CASAREZ: A sexually violent predator. BALDWIN: All right. Thank you very much. Appreciate that update.

Just a reminder to everyone tonight the big town hall with Howard Schultz, that is happening in Houston this evening. Make sure to tune in. Questions from voters as he ponders this 2020 run. So again, moderating that from Houston. Tune in tonight at 8:00 p.m. eastern.

I'm Brooke Baldwin. Thank you for being with me. "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.