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Interview with Rep. James Clyburn (D-SC); Parkland Remembers One Year Ago; Shine's False Claims. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired February 14, 2019 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:30:03] ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Fired FBI Deputy Director Andrew McCabe speaking for the first time about why he ordered an obstruction of justice investigation of President Trump. Here's what he told "60 Minutes."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANDREW MCCABE, FORMER FBI DEPUTY DIRECTOR: I was speaking to the man who had just run for the presidency and won the election for the presidency and who might have done so with the aid of the government of Russia, our most formidable adversary on the world stage. And that was something that troubled me greatly.

I think the next day I met with the team investigating the Russia cases and I asked the team to go back and conduct an assessment to determine, where are we with these efforts and what steps do we need to take going forward?

I was very concerned that I was able to put the Russia case on absolutely solid ground, in an indelible fashion, that were I removed quickly, or reassigned, or fired that the case could not be closed or vanish in the night without a trace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: Joining me now is Democratic House Majority Whip James Clyburn.

Sir, good to have you with us this morning.

As you hear those words from Andrew McCabe in that interview talking about his concerns that the Russia case be on solid ground and that it not be closed or vanish in the night, what are your thoughts?

REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D), SOUTH CAROLINA: Well, a little bit chilling. You know, we started noticing a couple of years ago, or a couple of years before this incident, that there was something going on with our voting systems throughout the country. Many of us saw some results, especially down in South Carolina, where we saw someone win at the Democratic primary for the United States Senate nobody ever heard of, nobody knew, and all of the sudden he won the Democratic nomination. A lot of us back then said, something is amiss in this process. And that was happening in little places all around the country. So after 2016, a lot of us said, wait a minute, there must have been

some trials being run in some states before this. And so we were not surprised. Hurt, disappointed, but not surprised that something was amiss.

So I think that we really need to get to the bottom of what is happening in this country when it comes to our elections and making sure that people are not predetermining who wins these elections and making sure that the process is something that is transparent and fair and, hopefully, I guess safe from hacking and other kinds of technology that could ruin an election.

HILL: I want to get your take, too. You talk about the process here. One of the other things that we learned from Scott Pelley, who conducted that interview with Andrew McCabe, is he talks about how McCabe spoke with him about meetings that happened at the Justice Department, saying it was discussed whether the vice president and a majority of the cabinet could be brought together to remove the president of the United States under the 25th Amendment. Again, this is how Scott Pelley characterizes it, and goes on to say they were speculating about who would be with us, who wouldn't be. They didn't actually take a vote here. They didn't ask people their opinions, but said they were counting noses, in Scott Pelley's words. That's what Andrew McCabe told him.

Is that surprising at all to you? I'm just curious your reaction to that revelation.

CLYBURN: No, I'm not surprised at that at all. I think that those of us who were around during the Nixon investigations into Nixon, those of us who looked in on Spiro Agnew and what was going on with him, we aren't surprised of this at all. And so I just think that what we need to do is really marshal the resources that we have here in Washington, coordinate with the states all around the country, and make sure that we have machines and other processes in place that will protect this all important vote that makes this country what it is today.

HILL: There's a lot of focus on what is happening in the House in terms of oversight, as you know, especially with Democrats taking control of the House and a number of investigations that are being launched, including focus on who has been hired to help in some of these instances.

Is there anything that folks should read into that, especially given that recent hires include Norm Eisen, who's had some very specific comments about this president, about obstruction of justice?

[08:35:09] CLYBURN: I don't think there is a reason to be concerned about that. You know, the facts are what they are. And I don't think that anybody will be brought into this process with any predetermined notions. People will like to just get to the bottom of what took place in 2016 and make sure that when we have our next election, it will not be repeated.

So I know there are a lot of thoughts about who may or may not be hired to carry out these investigations. But, really, I'm not concerned that people will approach this with preconceived notions. They'll do their work. They'll get to the bottom of it. And we'll be better off as a result.

HILL: A couple of topics for you quickly here because I don't want to run out of time but do want to get your thoughts.

When it comes to Representative Omar, have you spoken with her directly?

CLYBURN: Yes, I did. I've had a very long talk with her. I like her a whole lot. I think she was very sincere in her apology. And I wish we would just go on and stop beating up on people when they make a mistake. All of us have misspoken at one time or another. All of us have to learn the processes up here. I think she's an incredible young lady who has a tremendous future in politics. And I'm going to be as supportive as I possibly can of her. And I wish we would just go on and put this behind us.

HILL: And before we let you go, legislation which you co-sponsored with Pete King, we know, to expand federal background checks.

CLYBURN: Yes.

HILL: I'm wondering now, after what happened in the House, what is your message to your colleagues in the Senate in terms of that legislation?

CLYBURN: Well, I'm hopeful that they will follow through. Of course we still haven't finished in the House. Last night it came out of committee. And I'm grateful that the committee reported it out. I think we'll pass it on the floor of the House. And I am sure that Senators Graham and Scott will get together to marshal the votes through the Senate. In fact, Senator Scott is from Charleston. And all of this grew out of that horrible experience at Emanuel AME Church. And so I'm sure that the rest of the Senate will go along with this.

This is simply a way of moving from three days to ten days and allowing people who are eligible and qualified to own a gun. They can still own a gun. But this is to make sure that we have enough time to check into the backgrounds of those who may not be eligible to have a gun.

HILL: Representative James Clyburn, always appreciate your time, sir. Thank you.

CLYBURN: Thank you.

BERMAN: One year ago today a gunman stormed into a Florida high school and killed 17 students and teachers. Now survivors of the Parkland massacre continue to demand change. We have a live report, next.

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[08:42:09] BERMAN: Seventeen students and teachers were murdered one year ago today when a gunman opened fire inside the Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School in Parkland, Florida. Survivors of that attack immediately began a crusade to end gun violence.

CNN's Dianne Gallagher live in Parkland with more.

Dianne.

DIANNE GALLAGHER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, John, and, of course, this is never going to be a normal day again for people here in the Parkland community. They have a half day of service today, so there are some students who are here. They fed first responders this morning. There are some other service projects scheduled.

But there's going to be a lot of something we haven't seen over the past 365 days, and that is silence. There are three different moments of silence and the kids from March For Our Lives, who have spent the past year trying to make sure this will never happen again, are going dark for the next three days so they can reflect.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JACLYN CORIN, PARKLAND ACTIVIST: This is our generation's Vietnam War except the war is in our country.

GALLAGHER (voice over): In the one year since a former student shot and killed 17 of their friends, teachers and coaches, the students from Marjory Stoneman Douglas High School have become the faces of America's war on gun violence.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Fight for your lives before it's someone else's job.

GALLAGHER: Becoming a political and cultural force.

ALEX WIND, PARKLAND ACTIVIST: We traded in talk for action.

We were the only people that could have made this movement possible.

GALLAGHER: Marching on Washington, lobbying lawmakers, racking up awards, magazine covers, quickly gaining influence among celebrities and politicians, using old and new methods.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And we definitely wouldn't have had an international movement had it not been for social media.

GALLAGHER: And using it this summer on their cross-nation tour of gun violence prevention rallies, where the main goal was to register and inspire people to vote. Turnout in the 2018 election surged.

JAMMAL LEMY, PARKLAND ACTIVIST: We've had the highest youth voter turnout in, what, almost 25 years.

GALLAGHER: They aggressively pressured candidates to campaign on stricter gun laws.

WIND: There are people that got elected because they said I'm going to make it my priority to prevent gun violence. GALLAGHER: And though gun control measures are now being discussed in

the U.S. House, when it comes to federal legislation, it's unlikely much of what these young activists want to see happen will get past the current Republican-controlled Senate.

CORIN: We are actively creating a grassroots army of young people that are focused not only on Congress but on their state legislature, on their city councils and school boards.

GALLAGHER: Since the Parkland massacre, 26 state legislatures, plus Washington, D.C., have passed 69 different gun control measures, more than any year since the 2012 Sandy Hook shooting. Now, that's according to Giffords Law Center. It's a group that favors stronger gun laws. Most states adopted individual changes, though three, including Florida, did pass major overhaul legislation.

[08:45:03] CORIN: I think we moved the needle. Not enough, but we did.

GALLAGHER: But the March For Our Lives kids aren't the only Parkland activists making an impact. Andrew Pollack's daughter, Meadow, was one of the 17 murdered. Since that day, he's worked closely with politicians, including in the White House, and was recently appointed to the Florida State School Board. He says his mission is not about guns. Instead, it's the broader issue of school safety.

ANDREW POLLACK, DAUGHTER KILLED IN PARKLAND: All the states are going to look at what we're doing in Florida and they're going to replicate it.

GALLAGHER: Their methods may be different, but they all agree, real change may be slow, but it is definitely happening.

CORIN: You've just got to keep pushing and keep advocating because one day we're going to achieve what we set out to do.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The job of an activist is to put themselves out of a job.

CROWD: Never again. Never again. Never again. Never again.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GALLAGHER: And that is a refrain that we have heard from the parents of victims, the Olivers, the Guttenbergs, the Pettys, that they want to just make sure that this doesn't happen to anyone else.

Now, I know that those children from March For Our Lives, as well as many here in the community, were happy to see their representative when he called for that moment of silence, Erica, yesterday in the House, just before the Judiciary did that vote to send the universal background checks legislation to the floor. It was a momentous occasion for them.

But I can tell you that people here in Parkland, the wounds were still very open and very raw, Erica.

HILL: Understandable.

Dianne, thank you.

We'll be right back.

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[08:50:51] BERMAN: An outbreak of the measles has sparked a state of emergency in Clark County, Washington. Now, we covered this story on NEW DAY yesterday. And it appears Darla Shine (ph), the wife of White House Communications Chief Bill Shine, was watching. She unleashed a tweet storm peddling anti-vaccination conspiracy theories.

Before I read her tweet, I just want to tell you, measles is serious. It can lead to hospitalizations. It can lead to encephalitis. It can lead to death.

This is what Darla Shine wrote. The entire baby boom population alive today had the measles as kids. Bring back our childhood diseases. They keep you healthy and fight cancer.

Here to discuss is Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN chief medical correspondent, and Brian Stelter, CNN's chief media correspondent.

And, Sanjay, I just want to start with you on the facts about measles. Measles is serious.

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: No question. And I want to give -- it's serious and I want to make this point about what life was like before the vaccine and what life is like after the vaccine. Show these numbers if we can. Measles in the United States before the vaccine was introduced, 3 to 4 million people infected every year, 48,000 hospitalized. John, you mentioned 4,000 people have encephalitis. Four hundred to 500 people died.

This was a disease that was essentially eradicated -- eliminated, I should say, in 2000. The worst year was 2014, 600 cases, last death, 2015. I mean the numbers really do speak for themselves. It is a very significant, public health triumph.

What Darla Shine said about having natural immunity for her, if she had the measles, although she was born after the vaccine was introduced, so I'm not sure if she had the shot or not. But if she -- if she had the measles, she does have life-long immunity. That is true. If you get the vaccine, the CDC says you're protected for life as well.

Which would you rather have, the risk of death, the risk of encephalitis, the risk of hospitalization, millions of cases or the two shots?

BERMAN: And it's not just a risk to you, Sanjay, correct?

GUPTA: Correct. Right. And this is an important point. You say, look, I'm making an individual choice for me and an individual choice for my family. We're not going to do it. There are babies -- right, you don't get this shot until you're 12 -- 12 months old. So babies are not protected because they don't have the vaccine. If you don't sort of build a wall or what is called herd immunity around them, you are then putting other people at risk. Babies, people who can't get the shot, people who have weakened immune systems. So you do it not just because you love your kids, but you do it because you love other -- other people's kids as well, as I've written.

BERMAN: And, again, and I don't want to give it too much credence by repeating it, but what about her claim that measles cures cancer?

GUPTA: This was a specific -- the story that she was referencing was a story that we actually did here at CNN about a particular trial where they took a genetically engineered measles virus -- so it's not the wild type of the measles virus that we're talking about here, they genetically engineered it to basically go fight a particular type of cancer. So the virus oftentimes can transport through the body pretty well. It went to this particular tumor and was able to make some damage into the tumor. That's totally different than the measles that is circulating. That was just a vehicle, essentially, a genetically engineered vehicle to try and kill a tumor.

BERMAN: More like, my understanding is, the measles vaccine, ironically, to what Darla Shine is saying than the actual measles outbreak disease.

GUPTA: Exactly.

BERMAN: All right.

GUPTA: More like a medicine, yes.

BERMAN: All right.

Now, Brian, you're here, our chief media correspondent, to help us understand who exactly is Darla Shine?

BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: Yes, she's the wife of Bill Shine, who was the co-president of Fox News. Bill Shine was a huge player at Fox for decades. Now he's the head of communications for the Trump White House. And, remember, he was hired last year. He was brought in to be the deputy chief of staff for communication.

And, look, I'm not here to judge anyone's marriage, but I'm glad that we can see, through Twitter, what the wife of the White House chief of staff for communications is saying and thinking about these issues. I think this is one of these cases that shows how the Internet can radicalize people and how it can -- how the Internet can introduce people to really extreme and dangerous views.

We talk about in the context of terrorism and violence, but it can also happen in the context of public health. We know that folks go down rabbit holes on YouTube and on social media and end up believing some of this crazy stuff. And I think that is the broader concern.

[08:55:06] And there's a lot of other things she's said over the years on Twitter, on her radio show that are also disturbing. Racially charged comments about black boys, comments about Islamic insanity. She suggested women who join the military should expect to be sexual harassed. She suggested the flu pandemic was made up to help the drug companies. There's been a lot of that kind of conspiratorial and racially charged language in -- on her Twitter account over the years. And, frankly, it didn't matter that much until her husband became a top Trump aide.

BERMAN: Sanjay, I want to give you the last word here. What is the danger -- and, again, you're sitting here as a doctor, our chief medical correspondent. What's the danger to someone who has a platform like this spreading this kind of misinformation about measles?

GUPTA: There's a -- this is a totally preventable disease. I mean, you know, there are so many diseases out there that we're still trying to grapple with. This one we put into the win column, eliminated in 2000. Anybody who gets the measles now, really, most anybody who gets the measles now doesn't need to get it, doesn't need to put themselves at this risk of death and all these illness.

BERMAN: Dr. Sanjay Gupta with the facts.

Brian Stelter, thank you so much for joining us as well. I really appreciate it.

There is breaking news this morning. The fired deputy FBI director with a new interview -- new, remarkable, eye-opening information about what happened in the days after James Comey was fired. That's next.

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[09:00:09] POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: All right, good morning, everyone.

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