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Deadly Shooting Rampage in Aurora, Illinois; Biden Flexes Foreign Policy Credentials as He Mulls White House Run; Pence Calls on European Allies to Pull Out of Iran Nuke Deal; Interview with New Jersey Democrat Senator Bob Menendez; Prosecutors Have Evidence Roger Stone Communicated Directly with WikiLeaks; Vatican Defrocks Top Ex- U.S. Cardinal over Sex Abuse Claims; Police Update on Workplace Violence. Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired February 16, 2019 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:00:07] FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, everyone. Good morning.

I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

We begin this Saturday morning with new information in that deadly shooting rampage in Aurora, Illinois which left five people dead. At any moment now we are expecting an update from police. And we'll bring that to you live as it begins.

Police say 45-year-old Gary Martin, was being fired that day from his job at the Henry Pratt Manufacturing Company when he opened fire on his co-workers. He shot and killed five employees and injured five police officers before dying in an exchange of gunfire with police.

CNN correspondent Scott McLean is in Aurora. So Scott -- what more do we know?

SCOTT MCLEAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Fredricka. Well, we are hoping to get more information on the shooter and the time line of events at a press conference that is now expected to start in about 30 minutes from now.

But last night we did get a better sense of the time line and what exactly happened. We know that the first 911 calls came from inside of the Henry Pratt Company -- this manufacturing complex in Aurora, Illinois reporting shots fired.

When police first arrived, they immediately took gunfire. Two officers were shot. When more officers arrived, three more were shot.

And the initial reports were that Gary Martin, the 45-year-old suspect here, was shooting out of a window. But then police believe that he retreated further inside of that building.

Again, it's a manufacturing site. They make industrial valves. So you can imagine there's likely a lot of machinery in there, perhaps some industrial shelving, a lot of places for him to hide in this massive 29,000 square foot complex.

At one point, the police chief last night said that there were some 13 different teams of law enforcement who were going in either to get Martin or to get victims out of there and transported to the hospital.

Ultimately, it took an hour and a half though for them to locate him. As you said, he died in the exchange of gunfire.

The big question here is why. People want to know, you know, what he was thinking and why he did this. Police don't have an exact sense of his mindset, but they do say one likely contributing factor, he had just fired. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF KRISTEN ZIMAN, AURORA POLICE: We know he was a 15-year veteran and information that we have indicates that he was being terminated today.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you talk a bit --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Did he bring a gun to the termination meeting?

ZIMAN: We don't know that. We don't know whether he had the gun on him at the time or if he went to retrieve it. We don't have that information yet.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCLEAN: And what we do know about that gun is that it was a Smith and Wesson handgun. We are hoping to get more information about that. How many rounds he had on him, maybe giving us a sense of whether this was premeditated or something that was more spur of the moment.

We're also hoping to get more clarification on the time line here and, of course, the names of the actual victims. All we know about them thus far is that they are all male.

As for the company, Henry Pratt Company, its parent company put out a statement saying that they were shocked and saddened, but they provided no additional information on the actual event. We did see office workers coming in to the office this morning but beyond that, we have not heard from the company -- Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: All right. Scott McLean -- perhaps that will happen during that press conference where the police will be leading and, of course, we'll take all of that live. Scott -- thank you so much.

Retired FBI supervisory special agent and CNN law enforcement analyst James Gagliano joining us right now. So James -- what are you hoping to hear? You know, what blanks do you want filled in potentially from this press conference.

JAMES GAGLIANO, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Fredricka -- first of all, sobering news story. Happened almost on the one year anniversary of the Parkland shooting. What would I be looking for here? Well, law enforcement, as well as the public writ large, we're interested in finding out what was the motivation. This appears to be workplace violence.

But as we've learned in the past, in recent incidents in the past, we've got to be very careful and slow walk this to find out there wasn't something more to this. It does highlight the difficulty law enforcement has when they arrive on scene.

And the police there in Illinois did an amazing job. Four minutes after the 911 call, they were already making entry. And we learned that post-Columbine 20 years ago, you have to go to the sound of the guns.

WHITFIELD: And a big place like this -- we're talking about a plant. And you know, Scott was underscoring the kind of machinery there. This -- this creates some real obstacles for police who are arriving. And they're not perhaps -- we don't even know if they had detail about what portion of this plant in which the shooting was taking place, where the activity was.

GAGLIANO: Absolutely. So let's quickly unpack that.

WHITFIELD: Yes.

GAGLIANO: When officers arrive on the scene, they arrive in an information vacuum. All they know is that somebody is exchanging gunfire, shooting at people.

They don't know if there's accomplices, if this is a single shooter. They don't know if this is religious zealotry, a hate crime, a domestic dispute, workplace violence, a mentally-disturbed person -- all of those things.

So what we've learned, again post-Columbine, go to sound of the guns, interdict just quickly as possible. Now, in a situation like this also, there could have been a barricaded situation which is what we learned.

[11:05:00] The furious exchange of gunfire took place within the first five to seven minutes. And that's standard in these types of things.

But then it took law enforcement about 90 minutes to reach him. We don't know yet if he killed himself or if he was killed by police. But that's what took so long -- huge venue and you had to clear every inch of that place.

WHITFIELD: And learning whether Gary Martin came in with a weapon anticipating he was going to be fired or whether he was fired and then left just like the police officer said, you know, at that time, we didn't really know, left and then came back. That will also help determine what kind of security measures potentially that this huge plant may have to consider for the future.

GAGLIANO: Very difficult. 21st century technology. We live in a country where we treasure our civil liberties. And unless we turn it into a police state where you are literally screening people going from room to room, it's going to be very difficult.

I'm sure there's going to be some lessons learned. I'm anxious to see what the police determine after this was involved and how we can get out in front of the next one and try to keep America safer.

WHITFIELD: All right. James Gagliano -- always good to see you. Thanks so much.

GAGLIANO: Thanks -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right. Still ahead, vice president Biden showing off his foreign policy skills on the world stage as questions linger about whether he will join the 2020 presidential race.

[11:06:12] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: Former vice president, Joe Biden has not said if he will seek the Democratic presidential nomination but today he showed off some of his foreign policy credentials. Biden told a major global security conference in Munich he does not have any hesitations when it comes to European security.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I strongly support NATO. I believe it's the single most significant military alliance in the history of the world. And I think it's been the basis upon which we've been able to keep peace and stability for the past 70 years.

And it is the heart of our collective security. It is the basis upon which the United States is able to exercise its responsibilities in other parts of the world as well.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: CNN's Arlette Saenz is in Munich. So how was Biden's message received especially by European allies?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, the former vice president came here to Munich to stress the importance of the U.S. relationship with European allies, as you heard in that sound bite.

He talked about the importance of NATO, also working to strengthen it. But also said that it is very important that the U.S. continue to build these relationships with allies saying that the President at times, not specifically mentioning him by name, but he did point out that there are a lot of times that you hear these fights playing out between the U.S. and other countries, and that that's something that should not happen.

That they should work together behind closed doors to hammer out some of these differences and rely on the important relationship between the U.S. and European allies.

And just a short while ago, the former vice president held a panel relating to election integrity. And I had the chance to ask him about 2020 and where he is in his decision-making process.

And he told me that he has not made a decision on 2020 just yet. That's not entirely surprising that he wouldn't announce that here in Munich, but he did say that there is sufficient time for him to come to this decision and that he will be making it in the near future.

He did also add that he feels that the political process is playing out a little bit early back in the United States. So for now Biden is keeping not just people back at home but also here in Europe waiting -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: So Arlette -- what kind of reception did he get? Did it seem like he, you know, was like the man of the hour?

SAENZ: I mean at times during his speech he did seem like it sounded like he was a presidential candidate. And a lot of people who were in that hall for the conference for his speech -- there was a big U.S. delegation. We actually had Cindy McCain who was attending, the former vice president gave a little shout out to her, as well as remembering the memory of Senator John McCain. You also Nancy Pelosi, John Kerry.

So it really was a very welcoming crowd to the former vice president. He has participated in this conference multiple times over the years, including last year when he had already left office.

So this is a familiar place for him to kind of reconnect with some of those world leaders that he has known for a long time, as well as global security experts. And for Biden, this really was opportunity also to showcase his own foreign policy credentials as he's weighing that 2020 run -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: And then Arlette -- you know, you mentioned that Cindy McCain is there, you know. Did she have any response to the references the Vice President Mike Pence made, you know, in honor of John McCain. I mean mentioning him and at the same time drawing comparisons to the current administration?

SAENZ: We haven't heard from Cindy McCain specifically about that statement that Vice President Mike Pence had made last night. But she has been a regular figure along with her husband here at these conferences. John McCain used to lead the American delegation here for years.

So there's a lot of warm feelings towards him from those who attended this regularly. But it's unclear how exactly she felt about that comment from Mike Pence, kind of comparing him to President Trump and his leadership today.

WHITFIELD: All right. Arlette Saenz -- thank you so much from Munich. Appreciate it.

SAENZ: Thank you.

WHITFIELD: So Vice President Mike Pence is at the Munich security conference calling on U.S. allies to show more support for the U.S. against Iran.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The time has come for our European partners to stop undermining U.S. sanctions against this murderous revolutionary regime. The time has come for our European partners to stand with us and with the Iranian people -- our allies and friends in the region.

[11:14:57] The time has come for our European partners to withdraw from the Iran nuclear deal and join us as we bring the economic and diplomatic pressure necessary to give the Iranian people, the region and the world the peace, security and freedom they deserve.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Senator Bob Menendez also at the conference. He is a New Jersey Democrat and on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Good to see you -- Senator.

So what are your thoughts about what the Vice President said, urging others to join in the withdrawal of the Iran nuclear deal?

SENATOR BOB MENENDEZ (D-NJ), SENATE FOREIGN RELATIONS COMMITTEE: Well, I think we need to understand that if we lecture less and lead more, we'll get a lot further in terms of our goals. I really do believe that getting European allies to join us in all the other elements of Iran's nefarious activities -- its intercontinental ballistic missile development, it's still the single largest sponsor of state terrorism in the world, its destabilization of the region in Syria, Yemen, its violation on the arms embargo. If we start there and we get common ground with the Europeans and can multi-lateralize our efforts against Iran in that regard then I think the rest of it will come as it relates to the nuclear agreement, and we'll be in a better perfect position because we'll start from a common ground.

The Europeans have their views that the agreement they entered into with Iran and the United States at that time is the best way to deter Iran from its nuclear ambitions. I disagree but I think we should find common ground on that which we do agree.

And they do agree about Iran's other nefarious activities. They just haven't acted on them. We need them to get to act on them.

WHITFIELD: Then do you agree with Europeans and experts who have said that Iran has been in compliance with that or do you disagree that they were in compliance?

MENENDEZ: Well, those wo administer the agreement called the JCPOA say that as it relates to the agreement, Iran is in compliance. The problem with the agreement is that there's a sunset clause, it will end in a few years.

At the end of that period of time if there is no follow-on to that agreement then Iran has a pathway to nuclear power that can be used for nuclear weapons. And that's the fundamental problem with the agreement.

So it delayed Iran's process towards a nuclear weapon. It did not end Iran's ability to end up with a nuclear weapon.

WHITFIELD: The Vice President also addressed the U.S. troop pull-out in Syria. This is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PENCE: This is a change in tactics, not a change in mission. The United States will keep a strong presence in the region. We recognize it will not be enough to simply reclaim the territory of the caliphate.

As we enter this new phase, the United States will continue to work with all our allies to hunt down the remnants of ISIS wherever and whenever they rear their ugly head.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: So the Vice President said this is a change in tactics, not a change in mission. Is it clear to you the direction the White House wants to go on Syria?

MENENDEZ: No. And as a matter of fact at this conference there's the largest congressional delegation in the history of the Munich security conference. it is a bipartisan delegation, and it is almost a unanimous vote of the voices here and from Congress and the United States that a precipitous withdrawal from Syria without an engagement with our allies, without what is the follow on, how do you -- ending the physical elements of the caliphate is not the end of ISIS at the end of the day.

And to the extent that we want allies to be on the ground in Syria, are leaving absolutely by April, which is what the administration is saying, just will not work. And after so many lives and national treasure that had been spent in the fight against terrorism, it would be a shame to ultimately leave a vacuum that will cause a whole host of problems, including the Kurds that have fought for us and fought alongside of us.

At the end of the day if we leave them on the battlefield, they may be very well in for a slaughter. And if that's the case, then the global message we send is that don't fight for and with the United States, because when they're finished using you, they'll leave you to die on the battlefield. That's a horrible message.

So the bipartisan comments that have been made here, including to the secretary -- the acting secretary of Defense who was here, is to tell the administration this precipitous withdrawal doesn't work. It is not in our national interest, and to try to convince the President to change course.

WHITFIELD: All right. I want to shift gears a little bit.

Reuters is reporting now that, you know, North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un will arrive early in Vietnam, you know, ahead of the summit with President Trump in a few weeks.

[11:20:01] The President has said he's you know, made great progress with North Korea. Do you see evidence of that? Do you see their meeting, a second one, as hopeful?

MENENDEZ: Look, I'm always hopeful but I have to be honest with you, the first summit did not produce anything. But again, not letting our allies -- South Korea and Japan know that we were stopping military exercises. The first meeting did not even produce an agreement upon a definition of what does it mean to denuclearize the Korean Peninsula. So we walked away with nothing virtually.

The President likes to say there are no more missile tests. There are no more other elements. Well, the reason that Kim Jong-un isn't doing those missile tests is because he has done all the testing he needs to test the efficiency of his missiles and his weaponry. And so he has given up nothing in that regard.

So I worry that the President is now going into another summit where we still don't have a definition that the United States and the western world has about what does it mean to denuclearize the Korean Peninsula. That means a total verifiable ending of all of the weaponry that North Korea has in this regard and its nuclear capability in this regard.

I don't think that Kim Jong-un has signed on to that definition, and if he's not, what are we negotiating over? So I really worry that the President for the success of the victory will accept far less than what is in the national interest and security of the United States. And so I'm hopeful that maybe something good can come out of it.

But when you start off in a negotiation when you don't even agree on the definition as to what you're trying to achieve, I think that's a problem.

WHITFIELD: And there at the global summit, you know, so for so many years Senator John McCain actually led the U.S. delegation to this conference. And the Vice President paid tribute to him. Have a listen to the way in which he did it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PENCE: I think John McCain was a man who was strong-willed and hard- headed. He believed in freedom. He believed in fighting for it. He believed in speaking truth to friends and challenging friends to step up for our ideals. And I'm pleased to say America has this leadership today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: So what was your interpretation of what he was saying and any comparisons or parallels he was making with John McCain's style of leadership and that of the current administration?

MENENDEZ: Well, I had the privilege of working with Senator McCain when he was on the Foreign Relations Committee with me on national security questions, on a whole host of things.

John McCain believed strongly in the transatlantic alliance. He believed that NATO was an essential security element of the United States as well as Europe.

Yes, he would challenge our allies but at the same token there was no doubt in NATO's allies and in our western allies that the United States was going to be a constant partner, that we may disagree, for example, about how much you should be putting towards the success of NATO in terms of your contributions, but that NATO itself is a rock solid foundation.

And I think that spending time here for the last two days is that many are concerned about the commitment of the United States under President Trump to our collective alliance. The President has consistently, you know, berated NATO. Has said it's anachronistic.

The reality is that this is the security architecture that we helped create that has given us peace and prosperity for the better part of three quarters of a century. We need to strengthen it. We need to deal with the new challenges like cyberattacks, Russian irregular forces, and other challenges that we have.

That doesn't make NATO obsolete. It makes NATO evolve into the new challenges of this 21st century.

And so I think people miss John McCain here. I certainly do. I certainly miss his voice in our U.S. foreign policy debate because he was a voice of reason and someone who always pursued the national interest and security of the United States, but understood that it needed alliances in order to be able to do that.

WHITFIELD: Senator Bob Menendez in Munich. And when you are stateside again, we would love to have you back especially as we get closer to that North Korea summit.

MENENDEZ: Absolutely. Thank you.

WHITFIELD: All right. Senator -- thank you so much.

[11:25:01] All right. Still ahead, prosecutors are saying for the first time they have the evidence of Roger Stone communicating with WikiLeaks. We'll talk about what it means next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right. Live pictures right now of the location where we're awaiting a police update on that workplace shooting in Illinois where police say a disgruntled worker opened fire killing five people -- five of his co-workers the day that he was to be fired.

We'll bring you the latest on that update as soon as it happens.

[11:30:00] Meantime special counsel prosecutors now say for the first time they have evidence of Roger Stone communicating with WikiLeaks. A new court filing from the prosecutors say the evidence relates to the release of Democratic e-mails hacked and released during the 2016 presidential campaign. The full extent of the that communication has not been revealed.

CNN correspondent Shimon Prokupecz has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHIMON PROKUPECZ: Prosecutors said for the first time that they have evidence of Roger Stone communicating with WikiLeaks, according to this new court filing from the special counsel office.

Now it was during this investigation of the Russian hacks -- this is the Clinton e-mails and the Podesta e-mails -- that the government obtained and executed dozens of search warrants on various accounts used to facilitate the transfer of Stone documents for release as well as to discuss timing and promotion of their release.

This is what the special counsel's office said in their filing that they were able to learn that from these searches. Several of those search warrants were executed on accounts that contained Roger Stone's communications with Guccifer 2.0, which was a Russian intelligence agency, and with Organization One which is WikiLeaks.

Now, previously prosecutors had only out outlined how Stone attempted to get in touch with WikiLeaks' Julian Assange through intermediaries, and that Stone sought to learn about what the hackers had stolen from the Democratic Party and how he hoped for its release so it could help Donald Trump's campaign, prosecutors have said.

Now the new filing providing no further details on what was contained in the communications between Roger Stone and WikiLeaks. There is though one known exchange of messages between WikiLeaks and Stone. And that was in February, 2018. "The Atlantic" reported Stone obtained direct messages via Twitter with WikiLeaks' in which Stone was asked to stop associating himself with the site.

Both WikiLeaks and Roger Stone have denied that they were in contact about release of Clinton e-mails.

And prosecutors have not yet explained in full the extent of what Stone actually reached out to WikiLeaks, making it very much apparent that this court filing, that this part of the investigation may not be over.

Shimon Prokupecz, CNN -- Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: All right. With me now to talk further, Michael Zeldin. He is a former federal prosecutor and Robert Mueller's former special assistant at the Department of Justice. Also joining me Paul Callan, a former prosecutor -- both CNN legal analysts.

Thanks so much. And apologies up front. We may get interrupted because I may have to go to that police update out of Aurora, Illinois as it happens just minutes away. So Michael -- you first. You know, Robert Mueller says he has proof that Roger Stone communicated directly with WikiLeaks. How potentially pivotal is that?

MICHAEL ZELDIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: It depends on one's view of WikiLeaks. I have maintained, and maybe I'm an outlier on this, that I believe that WikiLeaks has a First Amendment free press status. That is that they exist in the world in the same way as the "Washington Post" and "New York Times" when they distributed the Pentagon papers and the Panama papers, et cetera.

And so that Roger Stone's communication with WikiLeaks itself I don't think is actionable criminally because of this First Amendment point of view. If, however, the communications are between Stone and Guccifer 2.0, the hackers, the ones who committed the crimes, then I think the criminal conspiracy could lie in that.

And so what we need to see is what is in the communications between Stone and Guccifer before we know whether or not a criminal conspiracy could be put forward.

WHITFIELD: All right. So it's your opinion that Michael -- that WikiLeaks has the same kind of protections as a news organization, even though as far as we know they don't provide news content but they DO provide information.

ZELDIN: That's right. Again, there are good minds that disagree with me on this, maybe better minds that disagree with me on this, but I believe that when they are a distributor of news like the Snowden stuff or Chelsea Manning that they fall within the First Amendment protections.

I know that CIA director Pompeo thinks they're non-state hostile intelligence service. If that's Mueller's view then a conspiracy with lie with WikiLeaks based on its status, not as a media organization but as an intelligence service. I just don't buy it.

WHITFIELD: Ok. So Paul, how do you see it. You know, Roger Stone has been, you know, downplaying the development. You know, he has already admitted to brief exchanges of messages with WikiLeaks and, you know, the hacker known as Guccifer 2.0, but says it is really not a big deal. Is it?

PAUL CALLAN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Well, you know, Fred -- I would hesitate to disagree with my friend Michael now that he's been named as a faculty member at Harvard.

[11:35:02] However, I agree on the issue that WikiLeaks might in fact have First Amendment protection. And I don't disagree with Michael at all about that.

As a matter of fact, I think what really this is about is the fact that remember, Roger Stone has been charged with lying to Congress about the nature of his contacts with WikiLeaks.

So I think the focus will not be so much on the issue of whether it was legal for WikiLeaks to provide information. I think it is more Roger Stone lied about it. And that's a material part of the congressional investigation.

(CROSSTALKING)

WHITFIELD: Yes. And the why -- why the lying?

CALLAN: Well -- they don't even have to prove why he is lying, as long as it is material to an investigation and he lies under oath, that's a form of perjury.

Obviously, I think we all know why he would be lying about it, if WikiLeaks is providing information from Russian intelligence which through this Guccifer 2.0 contact we know happens to be true. Then this starts to prove a collusion case against the President.

So it is very, very important in that respect. But I think that the focus on it is probably going to have to do more with the lying to Congress charge against Roger Stone.

WHITFIELD: So Michael -- we also learned that the President's press secretary, Sarah Sanders was interviewed by the special counsel last year. You know, she has been, you know, distributing a certain narrative of the White House. Would her narrative be further examined, you know, by the special counsel or is it her testimony or interview that weighs more heavily?

ZELDIN: So I think, Fred, that what's going on here with Mueller is he is exploring a theory of obstruction of justice that includes the possibility that the President through his communications director, whether it's Hope Hicks or Sean Spicer or Sarah Sanders, was misleading the public in a way to throw off investigators from their case.

We know that Mueller believes that that's an actionable case because he's brought one of those cases already against another.

So it makes sense to me that he would want to speak to Sanders to, you know, play out that thread. But ultimately I think here what's at play is the prize of keeping the President out of an oral testimony situation. And in order to do that he's got to provide Mueller with all the information that he otherwise couldn't get from another witness.

And therefore, if Sarah Sanders and everybody gives him the information that he would get from the President, he, therefore, Mueller, has a chance of not being given the right to subpoena the President.

I think that's what this is all about is keeping the President out of an oral interview.

WHITFIELD: Paul?

CALLAN: Yes, I agree with Michael on that. I think it sort of emphasizes the sad fact as well that the press secretary doesn't maybe get all of the inside scoop on what's going on in the Oval Office. She's tormented, of course, when she has to answer questions before the press but presidents have traditionally kept press secretaries, I think on a tight rein with respect to inside information.

Obviously when that information is publicly disclosed by a press secretary, you waive executive privilege because you publicly revealed a conversation. So I think in the end her contacts with the press will as Michael said, that might be a reason that the President could be subpoenaed to testify himself, but I think that's the significance of it and the importance of it.

WHITFIELD: All right. Paul Callan, Michael Zeldin -- always good to see you. Thanks so much.

CALLAN: Thank you -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: All right. Still ahead, questions swirl around the alleged attack of "Empire" star Jussie Smollett. Why police released and did not charge the two people they had in custody.

[11:39:02] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right. Welcome back.

A once powerful former U.S. cardinal is the latest to fall from grace over the Catholic Church's sex abuse scandal. Theodore McCarrick once led the archdiocese of Washington and today becomes the highest ranking Catholic figure expelled from the priesthood after a Vatican trial found him guilty of sexually abusing minors.

CNN's Delia Gallagher looks back at the career that had McCarrick moving in very powerful circles.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

THEODORE MCCARRICK, FORMER WASHINGTON D.C. CARDINAL: He is the one who has saved us.

DELIA GALLAGHER, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: He was once a prince of the church and a friend of presidents. Former Washington, D.C. Cardinal Theodore McCarrick enjoyed a spectacular career at the heart of power in Washington and in Rome.

When the U.S. Cardinals were summoned to the Vatican by John Paul II in 2002 at the beginning of the sex abuse scandal, Cardinal McCarrick was the reassuring face of that crisis, advocating zero tolerance for abusers, even as there were unrevealed allegations against him.

MCCARRICK: I can't see how anyone in the United States today would cover up something like that.

GALLAGHER: Theodore McCarrick was created a cardinal in 2001 by John Paul II. Around that time an American priest wrote to the Vatican to warn them of rumors that the cardinal was sexually abusing seminarians. But no action was taken for years until, according to the Vatican, under Benedict XVI, McCarrick was quietly advised not to travel --

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: We apologize for having to interrupt that report. Let's go now to Aurora, Illinois for this update on that workplace shooting yesterday.

(LIVE EVENT)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- brief overview of yesterday's time line by deputy chief Keefe. Some brief remarks by the chief of police Kristen Ziman in the end followed by some information from the assistant special agent in charge Brendan Iber from the ATF Chicago field office.

[11:45:08] And we're going to follow that with a brief overview of yesterday's time line by deputy chief Keefe Jackson. Then following that we're going to return to Chief Ziman for some brief questions. Ok?

Chief Ziman.

CHIEF KRISTEN ZIMAN, AURORA, ILLINOIS POLICE: Good morning, everyone. My name is Kristen Ziman. I am the chief of police for the Aurora Police Department.

Before I begin with an update, I want to give a heartfelt thanks to our citizens and business owners in Aurora who have delivered food, gifts and well wishes for our officers in recovery. Gratitude also to our law enforcement brothers and sisters from across the nation and beyond who have reached out to us. It means so much to all of us to know that you're sending positive energy for our officers who were injured, the responding officers and the victims' families.

As we relentlessly pursue answers to questions on why a person could do such a thing, we feel the support from all of you and my cup runneth over.

I would like to begin this morning by providing an update on the condition of our officers who are still being treated for their injuries related to yesterday's shooting incident. All five of our officers are recovering and under the care of physicians in the Chicago metro area.

Officer one is a male, 39 years of age with 13 years of service here at the Aurora Police Department. This officer suffered a gunshot wound to his lower extremities and is in stable condition at a local hospital.

Officer two is a male, 52 years of age, with 25 years of service at the Aurora Police Department. This officer suffered a gunshot wound to his upper extremity. He was treated and will be released from the hospital later this morning.

Officer three is a male, 52 years old, with 24 years of service here at the Aurora Police Department. He suffered a gunshot wound to the lower extremity. He was treated and released from the hospital yesterday.

Officer four -- a male, 53 years of age with 30 years of service. This officer also suffered a gunshot wound to the lower extremity and was treated in an area hospital.

Officer five, a male, 24 years of age, with just under four years of service. This officer suffered a series of shrapnel wounds to the upper extremity. He is currently being treated and is in stable condition at a local hospital.

Officer six, a male, 23 years of age with two years of experience is here at the Aurora Police Department. He suffered a minor injury while responding to the incident. The injury was not related to gunfire.

All of the officers' injuries are considered nonlife-threatening.

We would also like to provide limited information on the employees of Henry Pratt who were victims of yesterday's shooting.

Clayton Parks of Elgin, Illinois. Mr. Parks was the human resource manager at Henry Pratt.

Trevor Wehner of Dekalb, Illinois. Mr. Wehner was a human resource intern at Henry Pratt and a student at Northern Illinois University.

Russell Beyer of Yorkville, Illinois. Mr. Beyer was a mold operator at Henry Pratt.

Vicente Juarez of Oswego, Illinois. Mr. Juarez was a stock room attendant and forklift operator at Henry Pratt.

Josh Pinkard of Oswego, Illinois. Mr. Pinkard was the plant manager for Henry Pratt.

Another shooting victim, a male employee of Henry Pratt was treated at an area hospital for nonlife-threatening gunshot wounds sustained during the shooting incident.

Preliminary investigation indicates that the deceased victims were located in the same general area of the Henry Pratt facility. While this investigation is ongoing, we believe that there was only one assailant.

Here's what we know so far about the shooter. 45 years of age. He lived in the 1900 block of Selmarten Road in Aurora. Six prior arrests by the Aurora Police Department, including arrests for traffic and domestic battery-related issues.

Last arrest in Aurora was in 2008 for violating an order of protection. His last arrest was in 2017 by the Oswego, Illinois Police Department for disorderly conduct and criminal damage to property.

Regarding the weapon used in the shooting incident. In January of 2014 the shooter was issued a firearms owner's identification card or a FOID card. On March 6, 2014, the shooter applied to purchase a hand gun from a local gun dealer in Aurora.

On March 11 the shooter took possession of a Smith and Wesson 40- caliber handgun from that same gun dealer. On March 16, 2014, the shooter applied for a conceal carry permit at an unknown location.

[11:50:02] During the fingerprinting and background process, it was discovered that he had a felony conviction for aggravated assault out of Mississippi. The date of that conviction was august 3, 1995. It should be noted that this conviction would not necessarily have shown up on a criminal background check conducted for a FOID card.

Once this felony conviction was discovered, the offenders concealing carry permit was rejected and his FOID card was revoked by the Illinois State Police. Assistant special agent in charge Brendan Iber of the ATF Chicago field position is here and able to describe how a firearm is traced.

BRENDAN IBER, ASSISTANT SPECIAL AGENT IN CHARGE, ATF CHICAGO: Thank you -- chief.

Good morning. When ATF initiates a trace of a firearm, we start with the manufacturer of that firearm. From the manufacturer we follow that firearm down to the distributor. From the distributor down to the local federal firearms licensee and ultimately to the first initial purchaser of the firearm.

If we need to, we will follow that firearm from the first initial purchaser and ultimately into the hands of the final possessor of the firearm.

Once we get all this information, we actively and proactively share it with our state and local counterparts who have a vested interest in the investigation and in this case with the Aurora Police Department.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ok. Thank you.

Deputy Chief.

DEPUTY CHIEF KEEFE JACKSON, AURORA POLICE: First, I'd like to give you a rundown of some of the resources that were used yesterday. We used approximately eight SWAT teams from the federal all the way to the local level. Approximately 25 to 35 agencies responded consisting of approximately 200 to 300 officers.

And as I go through the timeline, there will be a reference made to contact teams and to rescue task force teams. We used approximately eight contact teams throughout the initial search to look for the offender. Those contact teams were made up of approximately six to eight officer.

We also formed approximately 13 rescue task force teams which consisted of approximately eight officers and three medics, or personnel from the fire department.

To start with the time line. The original call came in at 13:24 hours. Officers were dispatched to 641 Archer Avenue, active shooter in the plant. Second call, 13:24 hours -- caller stating shots fired.

WHITFIELD: You're hearing the update from out of Aurora, Illinois and the resources used yesterday during that workplace shooting and an update on this six officers who are all being hospitalized with nonlife threatening injuries.

But their ages and their years of experience are notable. Officers ranging from age 23 to 54, spanning experience from two years to 30 years.

CNN law enforcement analyst James Gagliano is here with me right now. Also we got a synopsis of the suspect who was killed in this confrontation with police, Gary Martin, 45 years old, and how he was able to obtain this handgun really not long prior to the shooting that did take place at this Pratt warehouse.

So what did you gather from what we learned here. We still don't know the sequence of events, what took place in that warehouse. But we do know the consequence -- the consequence being very grave. Five employees, co-workers, Gary Martin killed and these six officers injured.

GAGLIANO: Police have not yet gone into the details of exactly what happened regarding the chronology or the time line. But interesting to note, two of the people that were slain inside the factory were HR employees -- human resources. That's where the gunman had gone to basically air his grievances and to commit harm. And then three other workers there.

In the second piece --

WHITFIELD: And all happening in the same general facility. We did hear from the police chief that the area, you know, contained of people who were killed, injured, also in the same, you know, geographical location of that building.

GAGLIANO: Plant workers, shop foremen and two HR workers.

And then regarding the police -- Fred, we've got it. We've got to make this note. It's 2019. In the last month and a half, of this year, 16 police officers killed in the line of duty, seven by assailant gun fire.

In this instance, thank God, none of them were killed but five officers wounded. Three of them my age in their early 50s; two of them younger folks that have only been in the force for a couple of years.

[11:55:06] WHITFIELD: Well, what do you still want to hear to help kind of, you know, connect the dots of what happened? What happened prior to the shooting. What kind of interactions there may have been, you know, with the suspect and all those involved and, you know, the consequence?

GAGLIANO: Kudos to the police department there in Aurora. They're working with their federal state and local partners which is the way we do things in law enforcement now. It's a collaborative effort. They did the right thing yesterday immediately alert to public that the scene is stabilized, avoid the area but we have the gunman in custody or the gunman, in this case was deceased. And then we'll get you further details.

Now they're giving those further details. What would I want to know. A couple of things that were alluded to in regarding to the gun laws here. Now, we know that states have varying gun laws dependent upon if you are a convicted felon.

Now, if this individual hadn't gotten that conviction expunged, look Illinois is --

WHITFIELD: You're talking about the Mississippi case -- the felony.

GAGLIANO: Yes. In 1995. And in some cases, especially Illinois, they've got very strict gun laws. How was he able to purchase a gun and then how is he able to get a conceal permit to carry that?

Now, we know that that was revoked. But that obviously didn't cause him to turn the weapon in and you know, went in and caused all this havoc.

WHITFIELD: How do you suppose this incident might precipitate any changes, whether it be at that factory or even workplaces on how workplaces can protect themselves?

GAGLIANO: So we know from the Homeland Security perspective, there are 16 pieces of critical infrastructure and manufacturing in factories -- that is one of those. How do we keep those safe? We constantly talk about soft target, right. And I hate that term "soft" but that essentially means it's not something that we would presume to put up, you know, barricades or put, you know, TSA there to screen people.

I think most businesses now are taking a hard look at this and making the determination of whether or not you have to do what we're doing in the school systems. Single point entry. School resource officers on the school center on the education sense (ph).

But you know, is this going to mean that in the future we're going to have to have armed guards at places of business? Because in an instance like this workplace violence -- Fred, that can happen anywhere.

WHITFIELD: Yes. Sadly this is the latest example that indeed that's the case.

James Gagliano -- always good to see you. Thanks so much.

GAGLIANO: Thank you -- Fred.

WHITFIELD: Appreciate it.

All right, much more straight ahead in the next hour of the NEWSROOM right after this. [11:57:31] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)