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Rosenstein Blames Obama for Burying Attack on 2016 Vote; Coast Guard Officer Accused of Terror Plot Will Be Released; Wray: Russia Poses A "Very Significant Counterintelligence Threat"; Groundbreaking Journey for Drone Carrying Human Organ. Aired 12-1p ET

Aired April 27, 2019 - 12:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[12:00:00] SAMANTHA VINOGRAD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: -- as well Xi Jinping's, is ensuring that the United States does not get more influence on the Korean Peninsula, which is so close to both of their borders.

MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR: Right. Of course, they're both looking out for the interest of their nations as well. Samantha Vinograd, always good to see you. Thank you.

VINOGRAD: Thank you.

SAVIDGE: Hello, thanks for joining me. I'm Martin Savidge in for Fredricka Whitfield. We're following breaking news, a shake-up at one of the country's most powerful lobbying groups. I'm talking about the National Rifle Association.

Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North is leaving as the organization's president after serving less than a year. North was reportedly locked in a power struggle with the long-time CEO, Wayne LaPierre.

Polo Sandoval joins me now from New York. And, Polo, what more have we heard on this division?

POLO SANDOVAL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Martin, this certainly speaks to a high level of tension and turmoil at high levels of one of the most powerful gun lobby groups in the United States, of course, referring to the NRA.

I'm going to refer to some of our reporting that was just -- that just came out a few moments ago here, Oliver North announcing that he has been informed that he will not be renominated to serve as president of the NRA. That announcement made as one of his letters was read out loud at the group's annual convention in Indianapolis this morning.

This comes as the leadership has been embroiled in controversy and a dispute here, particularly Oliver North and Wayne LaPierre, the chief executive of the NRA here. LaPierre telling the NRA's board that he had been pressured to resign by Oliver North here just not too long ago, according to reporting from "The Wall Street Journal."

And according to that reporting, LaPierre wrote that North demanded he resign or claims would be brought to light against him, including, quote, a devastating accounts of the finances of the NRA as well as sexual harassment charges against a staff member. Again, that this would be brought to light if Wayne LaPierre did not step down.

North, in a letter of his own, also explaining to the board that he felt that he was acting, essentially, in the group's best interest and promised to even put together a crisis committee to look into these kinds of allegations. Obviously, we know that that likely will not happen now that he will be stepping out of the picture here.

A quick background on what has potentially led to this. According to more of that reporting from the "Journal" here, this dispute between these two high-ranking NRA executives or officials here stems from a lawsuit between the NRA and Ackerman McQueen, Inc. This is one of the most -- one of the most influential vendors that works with the NRA.

And according to that lawsuit, the NRA claimed that that firm did not justify various expenses here and various business records. And those are allegations that that firm says are frivolous and, quote, inaccurate, according to "The Wall Street Journal."

So, again, this really does speak, Martin, to this ongoing turmoil and conflict at those high levels of the NRA. But we can confirm now that Oliver will be, essentially, stepping down or at least should not be seeking a second term as NRA president, and Wayne LaPierre will remain at his post, at least for now.

SAVIDGE: Oliver North has fought a lot of battles in his day.

SANDOVAL: Right.

SAVIDGE: But this is clearly one he did not win. Polo Sandoval, thanks very much.

SANDOVAL: Thanks, Martin.

SAVIDGE: There are new polling numbers out that are showing how the American public views President Trump following the Mueller report.

"The Washington Post"/ABC News poll reveals that 47 percent of Americans believe the President did try to interfere on the Russia investigation and that he obstructed justice. But in the same poll, a majority also said they don't believe Congress should start impeachment proceedings.

Right now, the President is golfing with the Japanese Prime Minister, as we pointed out, before heading to the Midwest to hold a campaign rally to celebrate the latest blockbuster numbers on the economy. This as the President is, once again, defending himself against criticism of his Charlottesville remarks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And if you look at what I said, you will see that that question was answered perfectly, and I was talking about people that went because they felt very strongly about the monument to Robert E. Lee, a great general. Whether you like it or not --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: Joining us now, CNN White House correspondent Boris Sanchez with more on the poll numbers and also what the President has planned for the remainder of the day. Boris?

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hey, Martin. Yes, President Trump hitting the links this morning with Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe. The President should be heading back here to the White House shortly. Unclear if he's going to give any remarks to reporters, but we will certainly hear from the President later tonight.

[12:04:59] For the third year in a row, the President is skipping the White House Correspondents' Dinner. Tonight, he's going to be providing some counter-programming with a rally in Green Bay, Wisconsin. There, we'll likely hear the President talk about the economy and, as you noted, some great economy numbers.

The GDP for the United States growing at 3.2 percent in the first quarter over the last year, something the President touted over Twitter. Despite those strong numbers, the President's approval rating continues to hover essentially over the same place, in the mid- 30s to the low 40s. And according to a recent number, it's now at 39 percent.

In that "Washington Post" poll that you mentioned previously, the President not really making headway into convincing the majority of Americans that he is a great president, apparently.

We will likely also hear the President mention the Mueller report at this rally. In that same poll, some 58 percent of those asked said that they believe that the President lied about the Mueller probe.

And we will potentially also hear the President talk about some of his 2020 rivals. He mentioned Joe Biden there. Yesterday, he remarked to reporters that, despite Joe Biden being only four years his senior, the former Vice President makes the President feel like a vibrant young man -- Martin.

SAVIDGE: I do remember those comments, yes. Boris Sanchez, thanks very much. Good to see you.

SANCHEZ: Thanks.

SAVIDGE: With me now is a Karoun Demirjian who is a congressional reporter for "The Washington Post" and a CNN political analyst.

Also joining me is Julian Zelizer. He's a historian and professor at Princeton University and a CNN political analyst.

Julian, let me start with you and these poll numbers. Most Americans, as you heard, don't believe the President should be impeached. The President has not yet seen a jump in his approval ratings since the release of the Mueller report. So, Julian, why hasn't Special -- the Special Counsel's report given the President's approval ratings a boost as many might have expected? JULIAN ZELIZER, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: Well, there are two things to

remember. First, overall, the consequences of the report are negative. And I think the fallout has been not that the President was exonerated but just the opposite.

There isn't political support for impeachment yet. That said, we have to remember, in March of 1974, a few months before Nixon resigned, support for impeachment was at about 37 or 38 percent. So these numbers are, in some ways, exactly what you might expect.

SAVIDGE: All right. Karoun, let me ask you this. The President, as you know, is going to hold a rally in Green Bay tonight. He's got some good economic news. He certainly can tout how the GDP shattered expectations in the first quarter. So is it his opportunity here to now focus on good things, the economy, or do you think he is still going to look back on the Mueller investigation?

KAROUN DEMIRJIAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: The President has had opportunities, countless opportunities, to just focus on good economic numbers, the economy, on pushing the things that many of his advisers wish that he would focus on.

And every single time, he just takes the opportunity to pivot and start talking about things that nobody is quite sure why he wants to talk, whether it's the Russia probe, whether it's his political opponents, or it's issues that have to do -- that he -- immigration and things like that that he thinks play well to his base, but they kind of leave everybody else gripping their hands and wondering why he's going down these paths that are not certain in terms of what their political outcome is.

But the President likes to fight. The President likes to talk about the things that he thinks that his supporters will rally more tightly around him when the addresses. And there's plenty of stuff out there right now, whether you're talking about Charlottesville, Virginia or you're talking about the Russia probe. Plenty to distract the President's attention and make him go off on those tangents that he seems to so typically choose to go down.

SAVIDGE: Yes, he seems to enjoy it greatly.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes.

SAVIDGE: Julian, the President is, once again, defending his Charlottesville remarks. Charlottesville, of course, should never be forgotten, but I thought the President's words had sort of been. Yet it's all been brought back again, how the President handled that.

And now, Joe Biden has used that as sort of part of his kick off to his campaign here. So what is President Trump now saying about his comments on Charlottesville? Do you think he's clarified what were atrocious remarks at the time?

ZELIZER: He has clarified why many people thought they were atrocious remarks. That's what he's ended up doing. He has kind of doubled down on what he said. He's defending himself. He's making the argument this was all about Robert Lee statues rather than a rally organized by White nationalists.

And so I think, as he responds, he brings back the very memories that Biden's video evoked. And it's part of the reason all the economic news is not enough to overwhelm the rest of his record.

SAVIDGE: Why do you think Biden brought that up? I mean, he talked about many things, but it's interesting, that specific point. What was he intending to show?

[12:09:54] ZELIZER: It's a defining moment in the presidency. I think, for everyone who has watched this, the place where President Trump fell after that rally really captured a lot of how he sees the country and where he decides to define what the nation is about, so it was smart for Biden to do that.

And he defined himself that way as the anti-Trump candidate, which is probably his best argument, given he carries a lot of other baggage.

SAVIDGE: You know what, let's just listen to that bite while we are here.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: And if you look at what I said, you will see that that question was answered perfectly, and I was talking about people that went because they felt very strongly about the monument to Robert E. Lee, a great general. Whether you like it or not, he was one of the great generals.

I have spoken to many generals here, right at the White House. And many people thought -- of the generals, they think that he was maybe their favorite general. People were there protesting the taking down of the monument of Robert E. Lee. Everybody knows that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: Karoun, so now the President is saying this is really only about the monument of Robert E. Lee. Does this explanation really settle the dust?

DEMIRJIAN: No, we've all seen the videos from that day. They were not chanting about keep Robert E. Lee's statues up. There were chanting very racist tropes against Jews, against minorities. I mean, this was standard fare neo-Nazi terminology and tropes that were being spoken about there. So to say that it was just about Robert E. Lee statues is kind of ignoring what we've all seen.

Also, it just -- it's interesting that the President -- look, the President does not like to apologize for his comments even when they offend a lot of people. And the fact that he is doubling down and saying I did perfectly, you're just not understanding what I meant, and then saying something else that many people could find offensive is not that surprising, given the President's own, you know, discomfort with correcting and editing his remarks.

And also, again, this is something that he has chosen -- there have been several instances in which the President has had opportunity to distance himself from things that he's been criticized for saying because they seem like dog whistles to certain parts of the country that may or may not be part of his base, and he's never taken that bait.

So the fact that he's doing this now and doubling down is basically giving Biden a gift at this point. It's not terribly surprising given where the President has been, but it's re-raising what is a fairly dark chapter for him that you would think that maybe he would want to correct right now.

And he's not going to. And that's a sign for, you know, how Trump is maybe going to head into the rest of this pre-election season, which is that you know what the -- Trump is what you -- what he has been, and he is going to keep being that. And as many people have criticized him from the other side of the aisle, he is not going to change based on that criticism.

The one thing that maybe Biden did that others have not done in that is that he made Trump respond to what he said, which usually it's Trump that's, you know, doing the name-calling or putting the --

SAVIDGE: Right.

DEMIRJIAN: And people have to respond to him. So the fact that Biden could do that is significant. But it's also significant that Trump is saying, yes, well, it's what I said and it's what I'm going to say again and over and over again.

SAVIDGE: It could be a portrayal of what is to come.

DEMIRJIAN: Yes.

SAVIDGE: Karoun Demirjian and Julian Zelizer, thanks very much.

ZELIZER: Thank you.

DEMIRJIAN: Thank you.

SAVIDGE: Still ahead, the driver of a car that plowed into a group of people in California could be charged with a hate crime. Why police say he targeted those pedestrians.

And then later, Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein taking jabs at his former boss. Why he believes the Obama administration should be blamed for Russia's influence in the 2016 election.

[12:13:32] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SAVIDGE: We continue to follow another story that is developing out of Northern California. Police now say the man who plowed his car into a group of people did it because he thought they were Muslims.

The chaotic scene unfolded earlier this week in the town of Sunnyvale just outside of San Jose. Now, a 34-year-old man, Isaiah Joel Peoples, is in jail. He's charged with eight counts of attempted murder.

CNN national correspondent Sara Sidner joins me now. And, Sara, what are we learning about the suspect and maybe his motives here?

Apparently, Sara can't hear me. We'll get back to her as soon as we make that fix. Coming up next, new reporting on Rob Rosenstein, how he scrambled to protect the Mueller report and his job and how he tried to ensure President Trump by telling him, quote, I can land the plane, unquote.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:21:55] SAVIDGE: Just before the break, we were talking about the story of the car that went into a crowd in California earlier in the week. Now, authorities are saying it was no accident. Sara Sidner joins me with more on the latest on that.

What are we learning about the suspect in custody, Sara?

SARA SIDNER, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Look, we've heard from the police saying that the suspect, Isaiah Peoples, not only intentionally ran into a group of people in Sunnyvale, California, which is about 10 miles from San Jose, California, but he did so believing that they were Muslims.

In other words, that he was trying to attack Muslims, he was trying to attack people because of their religion and because of their race. And that is why he ended up doing this act where he is now charged with eight counts of attempted murder. That is new information coming from police who say they have some evidence that points to that very detail.

Now, we have also heard from his attorney. Peoples was arraigned in -- Friday in court. He did not enter a plea. His attorney has said that it was not intentional and that he says his client did this because he suffers from a mental disorder. He also says that his client has been saying that he was praying for the victims.

We did hear that, on the scene, there was a witness who said after that this happened, after all of these people were struck by a vehicle, one of them a 13-year-old girl who is in very bad condition -- she has an injury to her brain -- said that when the suspect came out of the car, he was saying, thank you, Jesus, thank you, Jesus.

And so that is one bit of detail that the police have, but they say they have more evidence that indicates that he actually did this in an attempt to hurt or kill people of the Muslim faith.

We have also heard from the police chief who said that -- in the court, he said that Peoples was simply not remorseful in any way, shape, or form. Although we did hear from People's attorney who has a very different side of the story saying that, yes, indeed, he is remorseful and that he has this mental disorder.

We have also heard from his mother through some reporting by some of the local newspapers there like the San Jose "Mercury News." They have said that she says that he is, indeed, a veteran. He was in the Iraq War and that he suffers from PTSD, that he was in the Army at the time. And she has pointed to that as a potential reason for what happened here.

What we do know is that he is charged with those eight counts of attempted murder and that he will have more court dates.

Of course, the entire city of Sunnyvale has come together to try and make sure that these victims know that they are supported and that they absolutely decry anything like this, number one, an intentional act of hurting anyone and, number two, that they support everyone in the community, including, of course, the Muslim members of their community -- Martin.

SAVIDGE: Yes, it is a disturbing development. Sara Sidner, thank you for bringing it to us.

New developments out of Sri Lanka where 10 civilians, including six children, are now dead following a police raid and shootout on a suspected terrorist hideout. Now, police are searching for two possible terrorists on the run.

[12:25:01] Police took down a suspected safe house on Friday. It may be connected to the Easter Sunday suicide bombings that killed more than 250 people. CNN's senior international correspondent Sam Kiley is in eastern Sri Lanka with the very latest for us.

SAM KILEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Martin, this has been a very dramatic 24 hours in the continuing operations to try to round up all of those extra terrorist elements that the Sri Lankans fear and believe were involved in the Easter Day massacre of over 250 people.

So in the last 18 hours, there's been a raid on what they believe is a weapons factory and storage facility with an astronomical amount of gelignite, of the precursor materials for the manufacture of bombs, a hundred thousand ball bearings to make those bombs that much more lethal.

Information from there backed up by the community, Muslim community, coming to the police and saying they identified a suspicious group, led to a raid on a house. That raid resulted in short gun battling, which one terrorist was killed. And then three large explosions destroyed that house, burning to death inside it the five other alleged terrorists but also nine civilians -- three women and six children.

Now, CNN has spoken very recently to the sister of the spiritual leader of this terrorist group who, himself, died as a suicide bomber on Sunday. And she said that she feared that seven members, young members of her family -- extended family, were missing.

So, Martin, seven members of the alleged terrorist family are missing. Six children were killed in that building, and one escaped alive but with severe burns, Martin.

SAVIDGE: Clearly, the terror is not over in Sri Lanka. Sam Kiley, thank you very much. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:30:33] MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN ANCHOR: Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein firing back against his critics over the handling of the Mueller report. Rosenstein said Russia's attempt to undermine the 2016 elections were, quote, only the tip of the iceberg. He also places blame on the Obama administration for burying concerns over Russian interference. Here is what he said about that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ROD ROSENSTEIN, FORMER DEPUTY ATTORNEY GENERAL: The previous administration chose not to publicize the full story about Russian hackers and social media trolls and how they relate to Russia's broader strategy to undermine America. The FBI disclosed classified information about that investigation to selected lawmakers and staffers. Someone selectively leaked information to the news media.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: With me now is Susan Hennessey, she's a former attorney in the Office of General Council and the National Security Agency during the Obama administration. Thanks for being with us.

SUSAN HENNESSEY, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Thanks for having me.

SAVIDGE: So let's start with where the deputy attorney general sort of leaves off there. Should the Obama White House have done more?

So there's certainly fair criticisms to level at the Obama administration about their response. But one thing that is clear is that, if there is a single individual who has the blame for not warning the American public, it really is Mitch McConnell. During the 2016 election, the Obama team reached out, they understood that they couldn't tell the American people about what was going on without having bipartisan buy-in, that it would look like just an effort to hurt Trump. They went to Mitch McConnell and asked him to present this information to the American people together in a bipartisan political way. Mitch McConnell outright refused. He made it clear that he would consider this essentially a political attack and that that was what inhibited the Obama administration from responding.

The other thing that is important to keep in mind is that the Mueller report makes quite clear that then candidate, now President Trump was largely aware of the Russian efforts if not the particulars. The fact that they were engaged in a criminal conspiracy to interfere on the election, that they were doing so in order to help him. Rather than himself warning the American people, he instead sought to capitalize on that assistance, welcomed that assistance, and proceeded to rather brazenly lie to the public about it.

SAVIDGE: Well, maybe despite (INAUDIBLE) by Mitch McConnell to blunt any information coming out, the report does now clarify the 2016 hacking by Russia and in fact, the deputy attorney general says it's just a tip of the iceberg. And I'm wondering, is this warning now being heeded by the national security community?

HENNESSEY: All right. So this really is the concern not just what happened in the past, but what we're going to see in the future. This lays out the degree of risk and it's one reason why it's really alarming to not see more focus by the administration at the most senior levels. So the president has only convened a single national security meeting on the topic, it reportedly only lasted for a very brief period of time.

Former DHS Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen was apparently warned to not bring up the subject of election interference with the president even though she is the cabinet member who is responsible for protecting election systems. And so, this does appear to be a case in which essentially the president's team is (INAUDIBLE) sort of his ego and then his fragile ego on this subject over really basic national security considerations.

SAVIDGE: And the Mueller report does sort of define that the Russians hacked one county in Florida. That was ahead of the 2016 election but they didn't name that county. Here's what a senior elections official told me.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL LUX, PRESIDENT, FLORIDA STATE ASSOCIATION OF SUPERVISORS OF ELECTIONS: If you look at the actual wording in the Mueller report, and of course I haven't seen whatever FBI report it's based on, but it says they, the authors of the Mueller report understand that the FBI believes that a county government was accessed, which is slightly different, in my opinion, than being actually hacked and penetrated.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: So, I guess my question to you, is he splitting hairs about how an attack might have taken place?

HENNESSEY: Well, so I think this goes to the really, really delicate line that the government has to walk in talking about the risk to election infrastructure systems. The goal of the adversary here is not necessarily to change votes, but instead to undermine broader confidence in election integrity on the part of the American public. And so whenever officials are talking about this, they have to be candid and transparent about the risk which is very real, without inadvertently actually helping to achieve Russia or other adversaries' goals by themselves creating confusion or concern in the American public about whether or not votes had been changed.

[12:35:07] There's no evidence of that having happened in this instance, but certainly this is a very real risk and something we need to be concerned about moving forward.

SAVIDGE: All right, Susan Hennessey, thanks very much for the breakdown. We appreciate it.

And still, ahead, a suspected domestic terrorist accused of having a hit list and stockpiling guns is set to go free. Why a judge is allowing the Coast Guard lieutenant to walk out of jail. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SAVIDGE: A Coast Guard lieutenant who is accused of plotting a domestic terror attack is set to be released from detention. Christopher Hasson was indicted on weapons charges and drug charges but not charged with terrorism or attempted murder. And a federal judge says because of that, he's got no choice but to order him released.

CNN's Jessica Schneider has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): FBI Director Christopher Wray seeming to cast doubt on a federal judge's plan to release Coast Guard Lieutenant Christopher Hasson from detention who prosecutors say intends to murder innocent civilians on a scale rarely seen in this country.

CHRISTOPHER WRAY, FBI DIRECTOR: We had an individual Coast Guard lieutenant who wanted to commit an attack right here. Well, I hope the judge does the right thing.

SCHNEIDER (voice-over): Federal Judge Charles Day told prosecutors, Thursday that despite his concerns, his hands are tied since the government has only charged Hasson with weapons and drug charges, the alleged crimes don't meet the standard for continued detention. Judge Day stress he still had grave concerns about Hasson's plot but emphasized his upcoming release would be accompanied by strict conditions. He's got to have a whole lot of supervision, somebody who's got eyes and ears on him like nobody's business.

The 49-year-old Coast Guard lieutenant is alleged to be a white supremacist who compiled a hit list naming several prominent Democratic politicians, as well as journalists from CNN and MSNBC. In a draft email obtained by prosecutors, Hasson allegedly wrote, I am dreaming of a way to kill almost every last person on the earth.

Hasson also searched for the home addresses of two unnamed Supreme Court justices and sought out the best gun to kill African-Americans. Investigators took photos of the 15 firearms inside Hasson's Silver Spring, Maryland apartment where they also found more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition. But Hasson's public defender says the charges are overblown, disputing Hasson had a hit list and saying the compilation of Democratic and media targets looks like the sort of list that our commander-and-chief might have compiled while watching Fox News in the morning. Adding the racial slurs Hasson wrote are now part of the national vocabulary. Donald Trump uses similar epithets in his everyday language and tweets.

Prosecutors though insists Hasson is a real threat telling the judge, this is combat gear. There is no reason to have this. The defendant intended to take his weapons and go. But with no more than plans on a page and a stockpile of weapons, prosecutors are stuck. There are no domestic terrorism statutes in the U.S. so prosecutors are forced to use other violations like hate crimes or on this case, weapons charges to stop people who appear to only be in the planning stages of plotting domestic attacks.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCHNEIDER: The FBI Agents Association has called on Congress to pass a specific domestic terrorism bill. And because no federal statute exists, Hasson's release isn't really surprising. In fact, just last week, a Florida man was arrested for contacting three members of Congress and threatening to kill them. That man allegedly had a gun when officers showed up to arrest him. But he was released from custody three days later with a litany of restrictions on his travel despite his charge of interstate transmission of threats.

Jessica Schneider, CNN, Washington.

SAVIDGE: The 2020 election is just 18 months away. But, is Russia already trying to affect it? Is the U.S. doing anything to try to prevent it? And how should the White House respond?

All of that coming up next.

But first, join us for W. Kamau Bell for an all-new season of the CNN Original Series, "United Shades of America". It starts tomorrow night, 10 Eastern. Here is a sneak peek.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

W. KAMAU BELL, HOST, UNITES SHADES OF AMERICA: Your Christianity.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why not have some kind of influence that is righteous.

BELL: His ability to protest.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a never-ending process.

BELL: Does it got to be never-ending?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm afraid so.

BELL: Her voice to the voiceless.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Whoever voice I have to be, I will be that voice.

BELL: Their courage to fight.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We would tell you not to be angry. You see this (INAUDIBLE) and we better be angry.

BELL: My mission. This season on "United Shades of America", it all comes down to us.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Get off my ass and do something.

BELL: You don't look like a Nazi fighter.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, Kamau, you're so funny.

BELL: Thanks.

When was the time you said I got to get involved?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My children and every other child who is (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you ask questions, sometimes it effectuate change.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's no point of hating people. We should all just get along.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: United Shades of America with W. Kamau Bell returns tomorrow night at 10 on CNN.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[12:47:54] SAVIDGE: FBI Director Christopher Wray believes the Russia or Russia rather poses a very significant counterintelligence threat. Responding to a question about Special Counsel Robert Mueller's investigation into Russian interference in the 2016 election, Wray responded saying that although everybody has their own adjectives, the threat is serious.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WRAY: I do think that Russia poses a very significant counterintelligence threat, certainly in the cyber arena, certainly what we call the malign foreign influence territory, certainly under the presence of intelligence officers in this country. So in a lot of ways, yes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAVIDGE: Jonathan Wackrow is a former Secret Service agent under President Obama, he joins me now. Thanks for being here.

JONATHAN WACKROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Thanks, Martin.

SAVIDGE: So, based on your experience, what are the inherent risks to national security when the president and his senior advisers seem to fail to address the identified risk of foreign interference?

WACKROW: Well, listen, right there in the question that, you know, we fail to elevate this and have a conversation around election security as being a fundamental key national security risk. You know, in the wake of the Mueller report, you know, some of the things and the criticism that's been logged back to the Obama administration was their failure to recognize this threat in advance of the 2016 -- we're -- 2016 election. We're almost in the same position right now. The White House, you know, the Oval Office is not, you know, taking this as a serious threat. And then, you know, they're unable to govern correctly across all resources of the government's ability to respond to the threat.

SAVIDGE: I think everybody knows by now that Russia did this in 2016 and, clearly, they are likely to do it again in 2020.

WACKROW: Correct.

SAVIDGE: The lack of attention by the White House, how does that impact though getting ready for that potential influence?

WACKROW: Listen, we already know that they have attacked us once. The problem is, they're not going to follow the exact same pathway and the same methodology. So right now, the risk to -- you know, the government right now is that we are not developing a near term and long term strategy on how to mitigate this threat.

[12:50:11] Listen, we know it's coming. We're, you know, 500-plus days away from the 2020 election. We need to be, you know, digging in and developing a very comprehensive strategy to address, you know, election interference whether it's from a cyber attack or from a disinformation campaign that we saw in the run-up to the 2016 election.

SAVIDGE: So that said, if the White House chooses to sort of overlook this, can the intelligence community work independent of the White House to protect us?

WACKROW: Yes. Thankfully they are. And I think if you look at statements that have been made by, you know, the FBI director just a moment ago, and then statements that have been made by Dan Coats the director of National Intelligence, they are worried about this. They have seen this as a significant threat, you know, coming from China, from Russia. And they have identified that there is a significant risk to election interference.

However, they only have a certain bandwidth to mitigate this. It goes back to a, we need a strategy that's coming out of the White House, out of the National Security Council that's comprehensive that looks beyond just the intelligence community that we're able to take resources across the entire spectrum of the government to mitigate this threat.

SAVIDGE: I think the classic view that many Americans might have is that the Russians would try to get into the computer systems of the states' voting and change the vote tallies. That's not what they would do, right?

WACKROW: Well, listen, Russia is going to take the path of least resistance. And without a national, you know, strategy that's going to mitigate, you know, future vulnerabilities to our electoral system, the onus falls back to a state by state, you know, strategy. And I think that's inherently a risk because all of a sudden, states, you know, bear the responsibility of protecting the electoral process but they only have a limited resource, they have a limited resource to protect their own states. And all of a sudden, we have 50 plans nationwide to mitigate a threat?

That inherently is a -- is the wrong strategy to put forth. We need to rely on the White House to set the proper strategy on go for basis to, you know, protect our electorate.

SAVIDGE: Jonathan Wackrow, we appreciate you coming on the show today. Thank you.

WACKROW: OK, thanks a lot, Martin.

SAVIDGE: Coming up, how about this, using drones to deliver items. Not that new, we've heard of it. But now drones could be used to save lives, delivering organs for transplant operations. The first of its kind flight coming up next.

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[12:56:16] SAVIDGE: Many of us may think of drones as just an annoyance but actually, they can be lifesavers. See that drone taking off? For the first time ever, it's delivering a human organ for transplant. Sounds incredible, right?

The drone delivered a kidney to a 44-year-old woman who had spent eight years on dialysis. It took 10 minutes for that drone to travel 2.6 miles from one hospital to another.

Joining me now is Dr. Joseph Scalea, he performed the transplant. I got to ask you, how did this flight come about?

DR. JOSEPH SCALEA, ASST. PROFESSOR OF SURGERY, UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND SCHOOL OF MEDICINE: Hi, Martin, first of all, thank you for having me. It's an incredibly exciting day and incredibly exciting month. It came about after really three years of in-depth research. Nothing like this happens overnight. My team has been working with partners in Baltimore City Police Fire and Rescue and of course the University of Maryland undergraduate campus engineers, drone pilots, to build some devices, test devices and understand how to potentially implement a technology like this to save lives. So, I would say about three years.

SAVIDGE: So why is it needed? In other words, you know, you could have transported it on the ground or you could have, I guess, put it in a helicopter. Why the drone?

SCALEA: You have to forgive me if I become impassioned here. I mean, there are some major problems in transportation right now. Transportation is a hot topic. You know, right now, organ shipment is, in addition to being fairly unsafe, it's incredibly expensive. And every minute that goes by, Martin, every hour that goes by, that organ deteriorates while it sits on ice. We need to move organs faster.

And as allocation systems for organs in the United States are changing and appropriately so, many times, a donor will be a thousand miles from its recipient. And in that situation, we are under the gun to move that organ as quickly as we can to get that implanted into a recipient. And so there are some real challenges. I see drone technologies a natural evolution for on-demand organ shipment to increase quality, decrease cost and certainly to save lives.

SAVIDGE: How fast does this drone go?

SCALEA: This drone went 10 meters a second. A lot of drones in this category would -- drones that we call vertical take-off and landing or VTOL, they go about 40 or 50 miles an hour at maximum speeds. In my opinion, we need to begin partnering with groups around the country to build bigger, faster, stronger drones that can really go a hundred miles or 200 miles and potentially goes faster a hundred or 200 miles in an hour.

SAVIDGE: And again, because speed is critical to the viability of the organ and, I guess for the survival rate of the patient receiving it, right?

SCALEA: Yes, you nailed it. That's exactly right. I mean, you want to get the organ out and you want to get it in as fast as possible, and as safely as possible. And so time is really of the essence.

SAVIDGE: OK, how do you avoid, I don't know, the risk? What if it goes off track, what if it goes somewhere else or crashes?

SCALEA: Yes, it's a common question. And the reality is we face those risks every day. You know, without getting into all the details, in 2007, we lost an organ recovery team. The field of transportation lost transplant surgeons and nurses who were part of, you know, a small aircraft. I mean, there are risks with transportation of even commercial and traditions aircraft as well.

There will be risks here, too, but now we're just moving the organ. And we won't be losing provider lives, you know, if there's a risk to the drone itself. You know, we have perceived those risks as potentially less than what are available with traditional aircraft.

SAVIDGE: Yes, it's a very good point. How is the patient doing, by the way?

SCALEA: She's doing wonderful, thank you for asking. She's -- you know, her creatinine which is our measurement of kidney function has come down day by day, she has not required any dialysis since the transplant. It's really been a wonderful ride for her. She's recovering, right, she had an organ transplant so she's got to get through that but we're quite pleased with her recovery so far.

SAVIDGE: Good to hear, and good for drones.

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