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Pence and Pompeo to Meet with Mexican Officials Over Tariffs Today; Republican Revolt Brews Over Trump's Mexico Tariffs; Trump Says Mexico Tariffs is Likely to Take Effect Monday. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired June 5, 2019 - 09:00   ET


[09:00:00] ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Visit to Britain and he's heading to Ireland later today so our coverage picks up right now.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: It's Wednesday. A very good morning to you. I'm Jim Sciutto.


Well, President Trump is wrapping up his state visit to Britain this hour with D-Day observances that will carry over tomorrow, the actual 75th anniversary in France. In the presence again of the Queen and several other world leaders the president read the prayer that FDR read to Americans the night that allied troops descended on Normandy.

A dignified end to a visit steeped in ceremony and stage craft and almost devoid of outbursts, festering, grudges and name-calling. Almost.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Not if you were checking his Twitter feed. Overnight the president indulged in a memorable, long, some might say inevitable social media tirade. Half a dozen pent-up attacks on, and we're quoting here, "Sleepy Joe Biden," "Crying Chuck Schumer," and this one, "Washed-up, psycho Bette Midler," the actress.

After that Britain woke up to the president's climate change skepticism reframed by the president as a branding issue. Here is a snippet from his interview on "Good Morning Britain."


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I believe that there is a change in weather and I think it changes both ways. Don't forget, it used to be called global warming, that wasn't working. Then it was called climate change, now it's actually called extreme weather.


SCIUTTO: Well, it's not really changing both ways. The data is there through the years, the decades.

CNN's Abby Phillip joins us from Portsmouth, England.

So where does the president go from there, Abby, next stop here on his visit, but also politically?

ABBY PHILLIP, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Jim, next stop is Ireland for President Trump before he heads to -- to France for another D-Day commemoration, but as you were just pointing out, it has been a bit of a whiplash week for President Trump going from, you know, social media insults to an incredible amount of ceremony and glitz and glamour here as he has been vetted by the British royals and by Theresa May on his visit, his first official state visit.

But the president has been spending his downtime between these major events, going after a whole host of people, Bette Midler, Chuck Schumer, Joe Biden. And I think it's just a window into his mood as he has been kind of on both ends of the time zone here, staying up pretty late into the morning and waking up early and on both sides of the time zone tweeting the night and the morning away.

So it's been interesting, but I think for the president this day has been an important commemoration of that important and -- 75th anniversary of the D-Day battle.


SCIUTTO: He made a lot of news in this interview with Piers Morgan on "Good Morning Britain," including on Iran, talking about military options still in place. What did you hear that was most newsworthy?

PHILLIP: Well, this interview is yet another sit-down that he has done with the British outlet while he's been here or just before he got here, and he had a discussion with Piers Morgan about Iran. And now there's been a lot of talk about whether the administration is spoiling for a fight with this regime, even after they pulled out of the Iranian nuclear deal, but listen to President Trump talking about the possibility of military action.


PIERS MORGAN, HOST, "GOOD MORNING BRITAIN": Do you think you will need to take military action?

TRUMP: There's always a chance. Do I want to? No, I'd rather not, but there's always a chance.


PHILLIP: So he also went on to say that he would like to sit down with Iran's President Rouhani which he said before, but he's saying this again really to emphasize that he would like this all to end with a sit-down with another negotiation face-to-face.

The Iranians have made it clear they are not particularly interested in that, but this is the president really trying to pull back it seems a little on that rhetoric, saying that everything is possible, but that is not his first priority. A bit of a push back also on his National Security adviser John Bolton who has been with him this week in the United Kingdom. HARLOW: Yes, that's a good point, Abby. Thank you so much for being

there. You've done a great job covering this official state visit of the president.

Let's talk about all of it and the headlines back here at home. Errol Louis is with us, Kimberly Dozier and Matt Viser.

Good morning one and all. So, Errol, I mean, things have gone pretty well for the president over there, I think. The very warm, you know, press conference with Theresa May yesterday, et cetera. Back here at home, though, he is facing a major potential revolt from the Republican Party and if enough of the Republicans actually act on what they're saying and going against the president on these tariffs that are supposed to be imposed in Mexico on Monday, it will be a first. What is he coming home to?

ERROL LOUIS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Yes. Well, he's coming home to a bit of a revolt, although you never know with the Republican leadership the number of times that they have kowtowed and rolled over for the president, is an indication that they may not stand firm on this.

[09:05:10] But this is a little bit different, Poppy, I think you're exactly right. When you're talking about imposing tariffs on Mexico, as we now know that's really a tax on the end user, meaning the American consumer and so much of American automobiles, parts, all kinds of stuff that we all rely on comes out of Mexico that boosting the price throughout that supply chain is going to result in a higher cost here at home.

The manufacturers, the parts distributors, they are all going to howl, they're going to complain to their often Republican representatives in Congress. And I think that's what we're starting to hear is that they're going to feed those complaints and concerns directly back to the White House. So he's going to have to fight really hard, I think, to sort of impose the kind of tariffs that he's talking about on Mexico.

SCIUTTO: Kimberly Dozier, you've spent a lot of time in the Middle East, recently returned from a trip to Iraq tracking ISIS. The president there saying that military options are still on the table for Iran even while he has very publicly said he does not want to go to war with Iran. He's talking about speaking to Iranian leaders. Is that a substantive threat or is it a classic kind of all options on the table comment which you often hear from presidents that, you know, in the case of President Trump would contradict his other public statements?

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Yes, I think it is the classic category. He understands from conversations with Ambassador Bolton and H.R. McMaster that in order to get Iran to the negotiating table you've got to use the threat of force. The preference is that they use the continuing sanctions to -- like a wrestler in a choke hold to starve Iran out and get them to the negotiating table.

From Trump's point of view pulling off a better deal than JCPOA would be the crowning glory of his presidency. And what advisers have convinced him that he can do if they do this two-pronged tough strategy. But advisers do tell me that he understands that he's got to threaten force and threaten a large use of force, like massive troops, to get Iran to take them seriously.

HARLOW: Except here's the thing, Matt Viser, I mean, to get a better deal than JCPOA he's going to need to convince all the other signatories, our allies like the U.K., for example, Theresa May made the point of pointing out yesterday they are still a party to this, that he's not just going to walk away from it again. I mean, that's the thing. How can they trust him if he were to somehow be able to get Iran on board with something different, how does he get everybody one else on board?

MATT VISER, NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, WASHINGTON POST: Well, and that fact alone I think gives the Iranians a leverage in these discussions. I think President Trump seems to be handling Iran similarly to how he's handled South Korea where you'll remember sort of the fire and fury, you know, sort of arguments that then led to some sort of discussions which I think President Trump views as successful, that he's built a relationship with Kim Jong-un, but we should point out that that has not led to anything.

And I think he seems to have a similar obsession with developing some sort of dialogue with President Rouhani, even earlier this month sort of criticizing John Kerry for being the one to not allow him to talk to the Iranians like John Kerry is somehow involved, which Kerry has denied.

And as you point out, I mean, I think that he is also sort of set on changing the terms of the Iran nuclear deal and sort of -- after leaving it and sort of moving past something that Obama did and trying to do something different, even if it ends up looking like the same thing.

SCIUTTO: Yes, I mean, it's a strategy with Mexico, it's a strategy with China, North Korea, but as you say, Matt, what you haven't seen are hard results from that strategy.

I want, Errol Louis, to talk about climate change because I know that we've heard this before and we have a tendency to get numbed to these kinds of statements. But here's a sitting American president denying climate science, claiming somehow that the data is going back and forth when it is not. It's consistent, global temperatures are rising, they have for decades.

HARLOW: And it's not weather, by the way.

SCIUTTO: And it's not weather.

HARLOW: Right.

SCIUTTO: It's just different, you know, kids in grade school know that. They're taught that, the difference between climate change and weather. But the significance of a U.S. president denying the science once again. LOUIS: It would be even more significant, Jim, if he at least sort of

in a coherent way said, I've looked at the data and I simply don't believe it. What you get instead is this kind of muddle, this kind of incoherent almost babble, from the president about, well, it could be this, it could be this, it used to be this, it used to be that. And the only point of that, which is what the fossil fuel industry has sort of relied on for a long time, is to just kind of create a muddle, just to create confusion in the minds of the public.

[09:10:07] Most of the public as you suggest is no longer confused about this. We've seen enough hurricanes, super storms, tornadoes and other devastating floods that we know that this has got to get dealt with. The president simply in my opinion abdicated leadership on this very important global issue. Others will step in and fulfill that leadership role that the president seems for domestic political reasons unwilling to accept.

HARLOW: Kimberly Dozier, how would you assess how the president did on this trip overseas when it comes to such a critical ally in Europe in the midst of this Brexit fight? How would you rate his trip overall?

DOZIER: Well, I've got to say I think from the British official standpoint there were far fewer gaffes than they feared there might be and they had a chance to cement this relationship at a time when they really need an ally. So the chance to convince President Trump that he is part of this larger history, to show him through pageantry that he is part of a line of leaders that have been taking the center on the global stage. Hopefully for them when things get stuff and they are trying to negotiate that trade deal down the line they will have this foundation.

But in terms of substance, this was never going to produce a lot of substance. In terms of decorum, they always knew -- British officials we spoke to beforehand knew he might reach out to some of the Brexiteers. They won't be surprised that he snubbed Jeremy Corbin. So all in all this was a win.

HARLOW: All right.

SCIUTTO: Kimberly Dozier, Errol Louis, Matt Viser, thanks very much to all of you.

Today the U.S. and Mexico are holding high stakes meetings as new tariffs loom, but will it be the president's own party that puts a stop to them? We're going to have more on that brewing internal party revolt.

HARLOW: And Joe versus foes, the former vice president has a message for his Democratic critics.

Plus a former school resource officer criticized for not confronting the gunman at Stoneman Douglas High in Parkland, Florida, has been arrested and could face the rest of his life in prison. We will explain.


[09:15:00] HARLOW: All right, so two crucial meetings today between U.S. and Mexican officials. This as the president's new tariffs on all goods imported from Mexico are set to kick in on Monday. Vice President Pence and Secretary of State Mike Pompeo will host separate meetings as both try to hammer out an immigration deal last minute here.

The real push-back is coming from members of the president's own party, Republicans are now signaling an all-out tariff revolt could be in the works. Let's go to Lauren Fox on Capitol Hill. I mean, Lauren, you name it, Ted Cruz, Ron Johnson, John Thune, Rob Portman, are they going to act on their words of warning here?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER: Well, you can add Mitch McConnell; the Majority leader --

HARLOW: Sure --

FOX: To that list, Poppy. I mean, the list was very long and Republican members and aides that I spoke to out of that meeting were furious about the president's tariffs, and also the fact that those White House and Justice officials who they sent yesterday couldn't really answer basic questions about how the president's tariff policy would actually be implemented by Monday.

Whether or not the president would issue a new national emergency on the border to create those tariffs, what exactly their path was. And that makes it very hard for Republican senators to decide how and whether they are going to act. At this point, Republican senators' message to the White House is just don't do it.

Their message yesterday in that lunch was hold off until we have a chance to actually be briefed by the president of the United States. You know, he's overseas right now, a lot of members are going to be going to Europe for the D-Day anniversary. So you know, there's a lot of fear that this is not being fully thought out before the president moves forward on Monday.

Now, if Republicans are forced to have a vote on this and they may be if the president issues a national emergency, there could then be a vote on a resolution of disapproval, it would likely start in the House of Representatives, it would be privileged, move over to the Senate where then Republican senators would have to decide whether they're going to stand with the president or whether or not they are going to vote their conscience on an issue that really matters to constituents back home.

You're talking about a lot of members who have farmers back home, who have industry workers back home, and there's a lot of fear that these tariffs could have a big effect on their re-elections. Poppy?

HARLOW: OK, we'll watch, Lauren Fox, keep us posted, thanks so much.

SCIUTTO: I'd like to discuss now with Peter Navarro; he's a senior Trump policy adviser, focusing on trade. Peter, thanks for taking the time this morning.


SCIUTTO: So, let's begin there on Capitol Hill, you heard our colleague talking about Republican senators furious at the tariff plan to be implemented on Monday by the president. I wonder, should Americans expect the president to relent on this or will he go forward?

NAVARRO: Jim, I think the starting point for the conversation has to be the conveyor belt that we now have in Mexico running from the southern border with Guatemala up to El Paso and San Diego. We've got over a 100,000 illegal immigrants at any given day now moving up on that conveyor belt.

In April, we apprehended 109,000 illegal entries coming across the border. Now, this illegal immigration imposes billions of dollars of costs on the American economy and society. These immigrants come up across the border and those costs are -- and our schools and our hospitals --

[09:20:00] SCIUTTO: OK --

NAVARRO: They take away jobs. So this is -- every -- I think every American understands that this is an emergency and a surge. And the question is, what do we do about it? Congress has not acted --

SCIUTTO: Well --

NAVARRO: And Mexico has not acted. So the president is now acting. The question is will the --

SCIUTTO: That will --

NAVARRO: American people support him and --

SCIUTTO: That --

NAVARRO: Let's talk about what we want.

SCIUTTO: To be fair, not every American because of course a majority of the Senate even with many Republicans rejected the national emergency declaration. But I want to get to the costs here because I get that there is -- there is an issue, a major issue at the border, but let's talk about the cost.

Ted Cruz who supported the president on the wall according to "New York Times", he called the proposal -- proposed tariffs a $30 billion tax increase on Texans. The Koch Brothers, conservative group of course, they are calling the tariffs the largest tax hike in modern history.

As you know, the president often claims that Mexico will be paying these tariffs when you and I know and Republicans know that, in fact, American consumers and businesses --

NAVARRO: So hang on, let me stop you right there --

SCIUTTO: Pay those. Does the president -- but let me ask the question --

NAVARRO: When you say -- hang on, hang on --

SCIUTTO: Does the president know who pays the tariffs?

NAVARRO: Hang on, when you --

SCIUTTO: Does he know?

NAVARRO: When you say you and I know, I don't know that at all. Here is what I know. When we had the same discussion -- hang on, hang on --

SCIUTTO: Ted Cruz and the Koch Brothers say it's a tax on Americans businesses.

NAVARRO: The Koch Brothers? Come on now. Let's talk about this discussion and who bears the burden of these tariffs. We had the same discussion with the China tariffs. Everybody is trying to claim that somehow American consumers bear that burden, that's exactly wrong. China --

SCIUTTO: How is -- how is that wrong?

NAVARRO: Hang on --

SCIUTTO: American companies --


SCIUTTO: Have to pay --


SCIUTTO: The tariffs --


SCIUTTO: On the goods they import --

NAVARRO: Let me explain --

SCIUTTO: And they pass those costs on the consumers --

NAVARRO: Let me explain, you want a --

SCIUTTO: It's not a discussion.

NAVARRO: You want to let me explain this?

SCIUTTO: Absolutely, but the facts are facts --

NAVARRO: All right, give me a minute here without interrupting me, Jim, OK? Here's the way this works. China bears most of the burden of the tariffs. What happens when we put the tariffs on is China is forced to lower their prices, they have fewer exports, lower profits.

The Chinese government itself experiences lower tax revenues, a slower rate of growth, a higher unemployment rate and foreign direct investment flows out of China. Now, we have seen virtually zero impact on price inflation after putting $250 billion worth of tariffs on China. So this whole idea that somehow the American consumer is bearing that is nonsense. What the American public --

SCIUTTO: Well, but Peter --

NAVARRO: Hang on, Jim --

SCIUTTO: I get the --

NAVARRO: What the American public is bearing -- but the cost --

SCIUTTO: I've let you make your point. I do, I let you make your point, but I have to challenge -- I have to challenge you calling it nonsense --

NAVARRO: Sure --

SCIUTTO: Because, yes, and I will brief you that it has --

NAVARRO: It is nonsense --

SCIUTTO: It has costs on China because of course China doesn't like having tariffs, mix their product -- makes their products more expensive, they have to adjust if they want to keep sales at the same level.

NAVARRO: Exactly.

SCIUTTO: But it's not nonsense to say that importers pay tariffs. We've been interviewing them every day, they say they're paying them. We had -- we had an importer from Texas yesterday talking about 50 percent, 60 percent increases on his prices because the products move back and forth across the border multiple times, and you have to pay tariffs multiple times.

So it may be true that producers have not yet passed those costs on to consumers, but it is American producers who are paying the tariffs and at some point --

NAVARRO: So Jim --

SCIUTTO: They've got to do it. So how is that nonsense?

NAVARRO: You're filibustering here. The fact is, you said American consumers are bearing the burden, that's just -- it's just wrong. China has borne the vast majority of this burden. If -- look, if they could just pass the tariffs on to America, they wouldn't protest. And if Mexico could just pass the tariffs on, they wouldn't protest them. Here is the reality, America is really bearing the costs of both the

China economic aggression that is -- that is stealing our intellectual property to the tune of several hundred billion dollars a year. And in the Mexican case, look, Jim, we have a crisis here, a national emergency of unprecedented proportions. You cannot have 100,000 people on any given day moving on a conveyor belt driven by narco traffickers and human traffickers, making billions of dollars off the American public.

They come across the border, they crowd our schools, they crowd our hospitals, the crime rate goes up, they drive the wages down of people in our cities and yet, they tend to be African-American and Hispanics at the lower end of the income stream. It's simply not fair.

So what this president --


NAVARRO: Is doing is taking a stand on this, he wants the Mexican --

SCIUTTO: Well --

NAVARRO: Government to respond. We should talk to them --

SCIUTTO: I get it --

NAVARRO: About what we want from the Mexicans. Do you want to know that?

SCIUTTO: The president agreed -- the president clearly taking a stand here. I'm just going to -- I've got to ask you because it's not nonsense. We've had -- we've had the producers --

NAVARRO: It is nonsense --

SCIUTTO: Come on the air --

NAVARRO: It's a simple problem --

SCIUTTO: Are they lying when they say --

NAVARRO: It's a simple problem --

SCIUTTO: Are American producers lying when they say they're paying for the tariffs. Are they lying?

NAVARRO: It's a simple problem in what's called tax instance analysis in economics. The question of who bears --


NAVARRO: The burden of a tariff or a tax? And what I'm telling you, Jim, is that --

[09:25:00] SCIUTTO: Are these American producers in Texas lying when they say they're paying the tariffs? NAVARRO: American consumers are not bearing the burden of the China

tariffs for example. We're seeing -- look, we had this same conversation a year ago when everybody's hair was on fire, saying that consumer prices were going to go up because we were putting a tariff on China. Didn't happen. China bore the burden of that. Devalued their currency, they lowered their prices and --

SCIUTTO: What are you doing when you're relying on American companies not to pass those costs on?

NAVARRO: Pardon me?

SCIUTTO: You're relying on American companies not to pass the costs on to consumers. American companies --


SCIUTTO: They're paying the tariffs or their profit margins are smaller --

NAVARRO: This is determined -- it's determined by market conditions. If you want to get technical, the elasticity of supply and demand --

SCIUTTO: Last thing, technical.

NAVARRO: But here's the point, Jim --

SCIUTTO: It's pretty straightforward.

NAVARRO: Look, this is not an argument that we should be having. The real argument should be about the costs that illegal immigration imposes upon the United States of America, and the fact that neither Congress or the Mexican government had lifted a finger to do anything about it.

And that the president has a very few options because Congress refuses to act. This -- in my judgment, this is a brilliant strategic move to get the Mexicans to internalize some of the costs. Right now --


NAVARRO: The Mexican government makes money off illegal immigration. After the tariffs are put in place, the Mexican government will bear a cost of that. We believe that these tariffs may not have to go into effect precisely because we have the Mexicans' attention, Vice President Pence will be meeting with them today --

SCIUTTO: Fair enough --

NAVARRO: Secretary of State Pompeo and Ambassador Robert Lighthizer. So, I think --

SCIUTTO: Let's set aside the facts for a moment --

NAVARRO: Let's stay calm and look at the chess board here. We have to solve this crisis, do we agree on that, Jim? Do we agree on that? SCIUTTO: Listen, I --

NAVARRO: Is this a crisis?

SCIUTTO: Well, maybe, you have --

NAVARRO: If we can't agree on that --

SCIUTTO: Lawmakers who don't agree it's a national emergency --

NAVARRO: Then it's difficult --

SCIUTTO: Issue now, the question -- we've interviewed -- I've interviewed the chief of the Customs and Border Patrol many times who describes it as crisis.

NAVARRO: But Jim --

SCIUTTO: But I believe it -- I believe it when she says that --

NAVARRO: Do you believe that this is a crisis? Do you believe that there are a 100,000 illegal immigrants trying to get into the United States moving through Mexico right now, is that a fact or a factor?

SCIUTTO: Listen, the numbers speak for themselves. And if we can agree on --


SCIUTTO: First principles --


NAVARRO: That's unacceptable. I don't care whether you're on the left --

SCIUTTO: Will you grant --

NAVARRO: On the right or in the middle, that's not acceptable --

SCIUTTO: Will you grant the fact --

NAVARRO: To the American people and this president is going to do something about it, full stop.

SCIUTTO: I actually grant the numbers, we report the increasing numbers of illegal --

NAVARRO: How to control --

SCIUTTO: Undocumented asylum seekers --

NAVARRO: Last week on a Wednesday --

SCIUTTO: Coming across the border. Will you grant the fact --

NAVARRO: A thousand people walked over from Juarez, Mexico --

SCIUTTO: That tariffs are not paid by foreigners --

NAVARRO: To El Paso --

SCIUTTO: But they're paid by -- will you grant that fact? I mean, listen to the Koch Brothers, listen to Ted Cruz, will you grant that it's a fact that that's where --


SCIUTTO: The tariffs are paid.

NAVARRO: Jim, I'm just astonished that CNN would quote the Koch Brothers as a reliable source for any --

SCIUTTO: Not just the Koch Brothers --

NAVARRO: Koch Brothers have fought --

SCIUTTO: Ted Cruz --

NAVARRO: Everything that the left stands for --

SCIUTTO: A dozen manufacturers we're had on our air --

NAVARRO: And they've fought this president on trade ever since --

SCIUTTO: Economists --

NAVARRO: He declared for president --

SCIUTTO: Importers, business people in border states --

NAVARRO: Now, the Koch Brothers? Is this CNN source? Come on, Jim. Come on --

SCIUTTO: You watched CNN, Peter, we've had dozens --

NAVARRO: No, I'm just saying --

SCIUTTO: Of producers come on the air and say we pay the tariffs.

NAVARRO: Let's not bring the Koch Brothers into this. Let's not bring the Koch Brothers into this.

SCIUTTO: Listen, you're meeting -- the White House is meeting with Mexican officials today. Is there something that Mexico could do between now and Monday that will prevent the president from imposing 5 percent tariffs.

NAVARRO: Absolutely. They can commit to taking all the asylum seekers and then applying Mexican laws which are much stronger than ours. Look, here is the thing. If the people who are moving up with scripts to claim asylum from their narco traffickers, human trafficker, handlers simply understood that, that script ain't going to work anymore getting into America, they're going to be in Mexico instead.

That 100,000 will go to a trickle in the 21 days it takes --

SCIUTTO: So there's a concession --

NAVARRO: For that message to get back.

SCIUTTO: Mexico can make today --

NAVARRO: If you think --

SCIUTTO: To prevent tariffs on Monday?

NAVARRO: Absolutely, that's the number one on my list. The other two things are, we have a 2,000-mile-plus border with Mexico, very hard to police. The southern border, however, Mexico has with Guatemala is only a 150 miles and better yet, it has --


NAVARRO: Both natural and artificial choke points where it is really easy to police. So a strong commitment from the Mexican government to put resources down there and I'm sure this government will help them in any way possible, that's number two.

And number three, look, there's a bunch of check points that go from the southern to the northern border. Those check points are designed to stop the flood, but instead it's the (INAUDIBLE), the bite, the corruption, the government officials who make money off this --


NAVARRO: Human trafficking, that has to stop. So the point here is prior to President Trump announcing the possible imposition of these tariffs, Mexico profited from illegal immigration --


NAVARRO: Both in the private sector --

SCIUTTO: So those three things --

NAVARRO: And in the public, yes sir --

SCIUTTO: If you see progress on that today, will we watch for it, Peter?

NAVARRO: That's it, that's what we're looking for, Jim, that's what we're looking for --

SCIUTTO: Let's keep up the conversation --

NAVARRO: The acting Department of Homeland Security Secretary made that very clear the first day these were announced, and this is not unreasonable --

SCIUTTO: Right --

NAVARRO: Jim, we're asking Mexico to put in --