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President Xi Meets Kim Jong-un in North Korea; Iran Shoots Down U.S. Drone; U.N. Report Points Fingers to Saudi Crown Prince Over Khashoggi's Death; U.S., Iran Shot Down American Drone With A Missile; Chinese President Arrive In North Korea On Rare Visit; Saudi Crown Prince Should Be Investigated; World Refugee Day; Former Interpol Chief Admitted His Crimes; Turmoil In Sudan; Sex Cult Trial; India's Crippling Water Shortage; Hope Hicks Testify. Aired 3-4a ET
Aired June 20, 2019 - 03:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[03:00:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROSEMARY CHURCH, CNN ANCHOR: The Chinese president arrives in North Korea for his first state visit. We will look at the message this sends to the United States.
Plus, a new report reveals the shocking and deeply disturbing things Saudi agent said on tape during the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi.
And later, the numbers are staggering. More than 70 million people are displaced. Many considered refugees. We mark World Refugee Day by looking at the crisis our world faces.
Hello, and welcome to our viewers joining us from all around the world, I'm Rosemary Church. And this is CNN newsroom.
As talks with the United States toll and international sanctions started by North Korea's Kim Jong-un is looking for help. And like a good neighbor, China is there.
Chinese President Xi Jinping arrived in Pyongyang just a few hours ago for a two-day visit that could bring new legitimacy and a new bargaining chip to the Kim government.
CNN's Paula Hancocks joins us this hour from Seoul, South Korea to talk more about this. So, Paula, what is the significance of the timing of President Xi Jinping's visit to North Korea and what's in it for China, what's in it for North Korea?
PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Rosemary, the first thing for both sides that they can benefit from is the pomp and ceremony that you have from this kind of state visit.
We are just getting some information from a Chinese newspaper People's Daily. They are giving some details of what the reception and welcome ceremony was like at the airport. Now we understand from People's Daily that Kim Jong-un, the North Korean leader and his wife, Ri Sol- ju went to the airport to meet with Xi Jinping and his wife. There were 10,000 people, approximately at the airport, according to
People's Daily there were flags and flowers banners saying unbreakable friendship pointing out just how close China and North Korea are. That is a message obviously that they want to show Washington, they want to show the world.
And there was also a 21-gun salute, a military band playing according to People's Daily and they then went to an open top car through the streets of Pyongyang to Xi Jinping's hotel. Now that particular part is very reminiscent of what we saw from the South Korean President Moon Jae-in up in Pyongyang just recently.
And certainly, we are expecting to see that pomp and ceremony through the images that will come through at some point we expect today. But the message and the timing is key.
It comes just a week before Xi Jinping is expected to meet with the U.S. President Donald Trump at that G20 meeting in Japan, it is on the backdrop of this bitter trade dispute between the two superpowers. But the fact is that it is also a way of China showing that it is pivotal, it is central to the North Korean issue.
And from Kim Jong-un's point of view, obviously these images being shown to his own people can only elevate him showing the domestic audience that the first Chinese leader in 14 years has come to visit him. Rosemary?
CHURCH: Indeed. And of course, China's president will be there in North Korea for two days which is quite a visit. What all will he likely be doing in that time and when might we expect to see this video evidence of their meetings?
HANCOCKS: As to when we will see the video, we simply don't know at this point. China and North Korea, neither of them is a transparent country, so clearly there's no official schedule of what we can expect.
But the speculation is that there will be some kind of a big show. We know that the mass games, it was on recently, it was postponed for several days or weeks as Kim Jong-un said that he was unhappy with the final product.
But there is speculation that that will be open and started once again for the Chinese president. It has been something the Chinese president has seen in the past when they have come to visit North Korea, and then of course there will be an official summit, as an official state visit so there will be sitting down and talking face to face with these two leaders, clearly showing that they are very close at this point.
It's very similar to what we saw an op-ed that Xi Jinping wrote on the front page of Rodong Sinmun, the newspaper as well, showing that he supports Kim Jong-un's North Korea. Rosemary?
CHURCH: All right, many thanks to our Paula Hancocks joining us there live from Seoul in South Korea just after four in the afternoon. Well, a U.N. investigator's report concludes the killing of Jamal Khashoggi was a deliberate, premeditated execution and Saudi Arabia's crown prince should be investigated for it.
[03:05:04] The six-month probe into the journalist killing reveals grizzly new details.
And our Nic Robertson has more now on the report.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: A special rapporteur's report brings a new level of clarity, a new expansion, if you will, of the timeline of the things that were happening before Jamal Khashoggi was murdered that sort of give credence to the premeditation that she says was involved in this extrajudicial killing.
And she goes on to say that she believes that Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman does bear responsibility and under international law it is her assessment that he, you know, should be investigated for these crimes. That these actions were carried out by state officials and therefore, the members, the leading members of the state have a legal responsibility here.
But she said the most moving part or the most chilling part, if you will, was the fear that she felt was communicated in some of the conversations that she was hearing about Jamal Khashoggi as part of the investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AGNES CALLAMARD, U.S. SPECIAL RAPPORTEUR ON EXTRAJUDICIAL EXECUTIONS: So, I was able to listen to some 45 minutes of tape, not all of which about the execution of Mr. Khashoggi. What those 7, 10 minutes highlight are first the increasing fear explains by Mr. Khashoggi from the moment he enters and start realizing that something very bad is going to happen to the end.
So, the fear is something that stays with me. Second is the fact that there is no attempt on the part of the individuals in the room to either resuscitate him or to do anything that will be, that could demonstrate that his killing was accidental.
As you know the authorities, the Saudi authorities have said no, they didn't intend, it was an accident. There is nothing in the recordings that indicate an accident. If there was an accident, an accidental killing you would expect people to, you know, to say, my gosh something is happening, what do we do, trying to resuscitate, try to do this, try to do that. There is nothing of that nature.
So, what the recording indicates is rather, something fairly planned. Not easy. But something that goes as probably it was planned and prepared.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERTSON: Well, the Saudi Minister of State for Foreign Affairs, Adel al-Jubeir has come back at this report very hard. It's very clear that Saudi Arabia believes that its position is strong on this, that they are pushing back, he says to the special rapporteur likes credibility and that they push back on this notion that the crown prince, that the leadership in Saudi Arabia should somehow be investigated for this.
And he goes on to say that this is an effort to try to take the jurisdiction away from Saudi Arabia. This is something they have been very clear about that they believe they have jurisdiction to try the people that they say are responsible.
Eleven people have been put on trial so far under the special rapporteur now names them, we know that two of those who face the death penalty are the man who became known as Dr. bone saw, Dr. Tubaigy, the forensic doctor but also the leader of the team, the so- called hit team that went to Istanbul and went to the consulate there and led the group that killed Jamal Khashoggi, those two both facing the death penalty.
What appears to be the case, however the reality is that this report, while it gives a comprehensive assessment, it doesn't appear to be set to move the dial despite the fact that it calls for the trial in Saudi Arabia to be ended, despite the fact that it calls for the investigation of the Crown Prince Mohammad bin Salman, despite the fact that it calls for sanctions to be placed on the crown prince, it doesn't seem to be moving the dial in terms of changing the current situation in bringing about an international prosecution of those she feels are responsible.
Nic Robertson, CNN, London.
CHURCH: Joining us now to discuss this is CNN intelligence and security analyst Robert Baer. Always good to have you with us
ROBERT BAER, CNN INTELLIGENCE AND SECURITY ANALYST: Thanks, Rosemary.
CHURCH: Bob, this U.N. investigation uncovers credible evidence that Saudi Crown Prince Mohammad bin Salman was responsible for the killing of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, which is exactly what many people already believed, of course but what's your reaction to the report's findings?
BAER: Well, it's confirmation. The Central Intelligence Agency came out in so many words and said that Mohammad bin Salman was behind this. They base this on intercepts of e-mails and the rest of it and WhatsApp, and the rest of it.
[03:10:06] And now they've got the tapes from the consulate in Istanbul which confirms that. And I think, you know, you look at this as an independent organization, you look at the CIA and it's pretty certain that Mohammad bin Salman ordered the murder and dismemberment of Khashoggi.
CHURCH: And Khashoggi's fiance, Hatice Cengiz says that Washington hasn't done enough to bring Khashoggi's killers to justice and adds that they are still roaming free. She wrote this in a powerful op-ed.
"Washington has chosen not to use its strong ties and leverage with Riyadh to get the Saudis to reveal the truth about Jamal's murder and to ensure those responsible are held accountable. If people of virtue don't stand up today for a man who defended such values and fought to advance them in his country then who else is going to do it?"
So, Bob, why hasn't Washington done more to get the Saudis to reveal the truth about Khashoggi's murder and those behind it and hold them accountable?
BAER: Well, Rosemary, there's a couple reasons. Frankly, Mohammad bin Salman is not fit for that job but we are not in a position to force him out if we wanted to. But more to the point, this president want Saudi Arabia to buy arms, depend on Saudi oil and more than anything we need Saudi Arabia if we go into a conflict with Iran.
And he has just decided to turn a blind eye to this. And she's absolutely right, the Saudis there's no transparency in the trials. A lot of these people that cut off his head are wandering free. And frankly, it's disturbing because it's a green light for anybody who wants to, to go after journalists.
CHURCH: And you think that's why President Trump has chosen to ignore all of the information that he has been given that pretty much points to the Saudi crown prince being behind this?
BAER: Rosemary, what I've seen what's been leaked out it's almost a smoking gun. It is a smoking gun. I mean, the way Saudi Arabia works is the only person that gives orders in that country is Mohammad bin Salman. He is the de facto king, he is in charge of the security services. He is in charge of the whole country and nobody in that country would dare carry out a rogue operation like this without his approval. The country doesn't work that way.
So, this president has decided to turn a blind eye and he just doesn't care, you know. It doesn't concern him. He looks at Mohammad bin Salman as a good ally. He's close to Jared Kushner. They think they have a deal on Palestine. They think, you know, that Saudi Arabia is going to march into a war with us against Iran.
CHURCH: Right.
BAER: And he just decided it doesn't matter. The human rights are not part of American foreign policy anymore.
CHURCH: Interesting. And Khashoggi, of course it's worth pointing out was a critic of Saudi Arabia and the royal family and his murder was a clear message to those who dared criticize. Will we see further investigation of the evidence by an independent and impartial international inquiry as the author of the report, Agnes Callamard house called for?
BAER: I don't think so. I think if we look at the way this administration operates, they'll just try to crush this report, stop it, not carry it on. But of course, the real pressure would have to be put on Riyadh to come clean on this and up until now they have no intention of doing that and there's nobody that's going to tell them to do it except the United States. And the White House isn't interested.
CHURCH: What about the international community? What should they be doing?
BAER: They can't really do much. I mean, I think they have done what they could. I mean, they've taken the Turkish transcript from the consulate, from listening devices and it's very clear this was premeditated murder. And if no one is going to do anything about it, it's sort of like the Russians shooting down an airliner, you know. You can name the culprits but who is going to force these countries, the international court of justice, it's not going to happen.
CHURCH: So, of course, Saudi agents killed Khashoggi inside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul back in October but Saudi authorities insist those agents were not acting on the Saudi prince's orders and they reject this latest report.
Instead, the Saudis have put 11 unidentified suspects on trial for his murder and they are seeking the death penalty for five of them. So, what's your response to that effort to look like they are doing something about this.
BAER: It's a complete cover-up, that's all it is. I mean there's absolutely -- the judiciary there is no independent judiciary of Saudi Arabia. Mohammad bin Salman controls that and he'll -- if he has to, he'll execute some scapegoat.
[03:15:03] That's the way the country works. They have a clear pattern of this, and you know, we -- I know right now I do not see Saudi Arabia ever coming to terms with this in explaining what happened.
And clearly, those people in the deewan that went out there -- Rosemary, we got pictures of them. We know who they are. We know what position they hold in the royal deewan. It's -- I mean, it is a smoking gun, in fact.
CHURCH: It's all very disturbing. Robert Baer, thank you very much for shedding more light on this as we take a look at this U.N. investigation and what they found. We appreciate talking with you.
BAER: Thank you, Rosemary.
CHURCH: And we will get some more reaction from Saudi Arabia. We are joined by Jomana Karadsheh who is outside the Saudi consulate in Istanbul where Jamal Khashoggi was murdered.
So, Jomana, the Saudis are calling this U.N. report baseless. What are they specifically saying about the evidence that confirms the Saudi crown prince was behind Khashoggi's murder?
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Look, Rosemary, the Saudis have not changed their position. They are dismissing this report completely. And, you know, if you look closely at what Agnes Callamard and her team said in that report, she said she's not making any conclusions on whether the crown prince is guilty or not, she says there's credible evidence that merits further investigation by a proper independent authority to determine whether, you know, there is enough to go ahead, that whether the criminal responsibility here has been met.
And you know, she makes it clear that whatever investigations are going on in Saudi Arabia are not credible. It is not enough. That is why, again, one of her main recommendations is that there should be an international inquiry into the killing of Jamal Khashoggi.
And when it comes specifically to the crown prince, she says people are focusing too much on this idea of a smoking gun where there might be, there may not be a smoking gun or who was holding that smoking gun. She says this is really about criminal responsibility. It's about state responsibility and it's about who Mohammad bin Salman is as the crown prince.
As Bob Baer was saying there earlier, he is the de facto leader in that country. To think that such an operation so well-planned like this that involves state resources, state financing, state officials could have taken place without his knowledge is very unlikely and that is why she says there needs to be further investigation of this.
And also, the fact that Mohammad bin Salman is believed to have been overseeing this crackdown that has been taking place over the past couple of years on dissident and opponents of the Saudi state.
And until it is proven that he is not guilty, he should be slapped with sanctions, according to Callamard. Again, renewing a call for international inquiry and saying that that trial that's taking place in Saudi Arabia will not deliver credible justice and she is recommending it should be suspended, Rosemary.
CHURCH: All right. Jomana Karadsheh, joining us there live from Istanbul outside the front of the Saudi consulate with the Saudi reaction there. I appreciate it.
We turn to breaking news now. And a U.S. official tells CNN Iran used a surface-to-air missile to shoot down an American military drone in international airspace over the Strait of Hormuz. Iran had earlier claimed it shot down a U.S. made global hawk surveillance drone in the southern part of the country, also near the Strait of Hormuz.
State-run press TV says the drone violated Iranian airspace. So far, we have not been able to verify Iran's claim, but we will go live to Iran in just a moment as tensions rise between Washington and Tehran over the tanker ship attacks in the Gulf of Oman and we'll also get more details on this breaking news.
Back in just a moment.
[03:20:00] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
CHURCH: All right. a breaking news now. A U.S. official tells CNN Iran used a surface to air missile to shoot down an American military drone in international airspace over the Strait of Hormuz.
So, let's bring in our Frederik Pleitgen who is monitoring the story from Tehran. What are you learning about this, Fred?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, Rosemary. The Iranians actually came up with a statement fairly early in the morning today and they claim this drone was shot down as it was in Iranian airspace. So, they say that it violated Iranian airspace and that's why their air defenses were triggered and that's how they shot down this drone.
Now they say that this happened in the southern part of Iran. Indeed, also where the strait -- or just south of the Strait of Hormuz, and they say that this happened in the early morning hours of today.
Now, of course, Rosemary, all this of course, coming as these tensions between the United States and the Iranians continue to flare up after that tanker incident that took place in the Gulf of Oman last week with the U.S. blaming the Iranians, the Iranians saying that it was not them.
I've been looking back at some of the things that Iranian officials have been saying over the past couple of days, and it was quite interesting because the head of Iran's national security council came out on Monday and he said that a violation of Iranian airspace would be a red line for the Iranians.
So, there has been some rhetoric on this kind of topic over the past couple of days. Whether or not that fed in to what happened today is obviously not clear, but certainly the rhetoric has been growing more bellicose.
I also yesterday, Rosemary, managed to speak to one of Iran's top admirals and he said that the Iranians were not afraid to confront the United States here in this territory. Here is what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HABIBOLLAH SAYYARI, DEPUTY COORDINATOR, IRANIAN ARMED FORCES (through translator): If we would be afraid of their military equipment, we would not be here anymore. All the greatness they ascribed to themselves is worth nothing to us because a nation that believes in martyrdom cannot be enslaved.
We don't want war with anyone but this is our region and others should not be in it. This region's natural resources and all its benefits are ours. What are others doing in this region?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PLEITGEN: So, there you have it, Rosemary. The Iranians essentially saying this is their region, they have a right to defend themselves in their region that they are not afraid to take on the U.S. military in this region.
Of course, all this as we keep saying as the rhetoric between these two sides grows more bellicose almost with every day. Another interesting thing that happened on June 9th, Rosemary, is that the Iranians unveiled a new, as they call it high tech surface to air missile system.
Now it's unclear whether or not the system is already operational, whether it was used in what went down earlier this morning. They're in the Strait of Hormuz or near the Strait of Hormuz, but however this is also something where the Iranians clearly have been showcasing what they say are there more advanced surface to air capability.
So essentially, what we know about the incidents today, though, Rosemary, is that we know that an American drone has been shot down. We know that it's a derivative, at least, of the RQ-4 Sentinel which is known as -- not the Sentinel, sorry, it's the global hawk, which is a drone that flies at a very high altitude, it's normally used as a surveillance drone. It's not clear whether it's a navy drone or whether it's an air force drone.
[03:24:59] The U.S. saying it was shot down over international airspace, the Iranian saying that it violated their airspace. The U.S. saying in the Strait of Hormuz and the Iranian saying just south of the Strait of Hormuz, but it is clear that a U.S. drone has been downed by the Iranians, Rosemary.
CHURCH: Yes. And of course, as we watch this increased tension, is there any sort of back channel is being worked upon to sort of, try to take some of the heat out of this?
PLEITGEN: Well, I'm not sure that there is any back channel going on, but I do think that both sides are sending each other pretty clear messages. We heard, I think it was yesterday that the last time that Secretary of State Mike Pompeo was in Iraq, that he delivered some back channel messages, what we hope would be back channel messages to the Iranians.
And the Iranians for their part I think are making pretty clear right now that they are taking a fairly hardline on the U.S.' policy of maximum pressure. They say they are not going to negotiate under this policy of maximum pressure, and clearly, they are not afraid to also take on the U.S. military as they've shown today.
So, the Iranians clearly displaying that they are going to take a stand, clearly displaying that under the current circumstances they are not willing to talk to the Trump administration.
I think right now what both sides are waiting for is were waiting for one side to make the first move to try to get some sort of de- escalation going. I mean, we always have to keep in mind, Rosemary, that both sides are saying they do not want this to escalate, they do not want this to turn into a shooting war between these two sides.
But it seems very, very difficult for either side to try and find what you just -- what you were just saying, some sort of off ramp to get out of this spiral of escalation that seems to be going on and has been going on since those two tankers were attacked, and then of course also since that tanker incident that happened in early May as well, Rosemary.
CHURCH: Yes. And of course, as you and I have always talked about, the big concern too is any miscalculation in the midst of all of this rising tension.
PLEITGEN: Yes.
CHURCH: Our Fred Pleitgen bringing us the very latest from Tehran. Many thanks to you.
Well, it's down to four now. And the race to replace Theresa May as U.K. prime minister. Tory M.P.s gave frontrunner Boris Johnson another victory in the third ballot. Jeremy Hunt, Michael Gove, and Sajid Javid also made it through, while Rory Stewart was knocked out. The field will be whittled down to two on Thursday. Then conservative members will have the final say with the result declared by the end of July.
Well, the numbers are staggering. The stories are heartbreaking, the reflection of humanity atrocious, the plight of millions forced to flee, when we come back.
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[03:30:01]
CHURCH: Welcome back everyone. I'm Rosemary Church. I want to update you now on the main stories we've been following this hour. A U.S. official told CNN Iran used a surface to air missile to shoot down an American MQ4C military drone in International airspace over the Strait of Hormuz. Iran had earlier claimed that shot down a different kind of U.S. made drone, a global hoax surveillance drone in the southern part of the country, also near the Strait of Hormuz. State run press TV says the U.S. drone violated Iranian airspace. So far we have not been able to verify Iran's claim.
Xi Jinping has arrived in North Korea for talks with Kim Jong-un, he is the first Chinese president to visit the country in 14 years. China hopes sanctions on its neighbor can be ease and analysts say Mr. Xi is sending a signal to Washington about Beijing's long standing ties to Pyongyang.
U.N. investigator reports there is sufficient credible evidence that Saudi Crown Prince Mohammed Bin Salman bears responsibility for Jamal Khashoggi's murder and should be investigated for it. The report does not draw any conclusions about the prince's guilt or innocence. A Saudi official dismissed the report as nothing new.
Well, more than 70 million people in the world have left everything behind to escape war, persecution or terror. More than half of them, children. And that is one in every 108 people on this planet forcibly displaced. Thursday is world refugee day, a time to focus on a global problem that is sadly growing worse. Here is Arwa Damon.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) ARWA DAMON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Whether we label
them as refugees, the internally displaced, asylum seekers or migrants, the number of people on the move is at a tragic new all-time high. The world forcibly displaced population, people torn from their homes has doubled in the last 20 years.
There are those whose homelands have betrayed them, whether it's war, violence, hunger or overwhelming poverty. The bitter and forceful emotions are shared. So it is the desperation and determination united by a common goal, to get anywhere safer, anywhere better, no matter the cost, to just simply be able to live.
From Syria, which has the highest number of displaced to newer conflicts like Venezuela, the flood of despondent source has touched in some way just about every continent. And yet in this twisted world, more borders are closing. Wealthy nations are shirking their moral and financial responsibilities. It is local host communities who are often showing the most generosity. According to UNHCR, 85 percent of the world's displaced people are being hosted in developing countries.
In other, words not wealthy, not economically stable, not equip. Rich countries has significantly drop resettlement places in the last few years according to amnesty international, and in the words of the U.N. high commissioner Filippo Grandi quote, the institution of asylum, one of the most ancient and shared gestures of solidarity in the history of humankind has been compromised and the language of politics is increasingly ruthless, but that has not quelled the floods of people literally walking, crossing seas and deserts.
Even as the numbers of those who need to be shown compassion, not cruelty are at record highs, the money just isn't there. The U.N. and its humanitarian partners emergency appeal is barely half funded. Across continents, people are pent-up like animals, humiliated, abandoned. Others turned into political pawns. This will not end until the injustices that force them to flee are resolved. It will not end until we reclaim our collective humanity, and those who have the power to heed others pain find the morality to do it. Arwa Damon, CNN, Istanbul.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
CHURCH: Adrian Edwards is chief spokesperson for the United Nations High Commission of Refugees and he joins me now from Geneva. Thank you so much for being with us.
ADRIAN EDWARDS, CHIEF SPOKESPERSON, UNITED NATIONS HIGH COMMISSION OF REFUGEES: Pleasure.
CHURCH: Well as we marked world refugee day and the numbers are simply shocking. More than 70 million people across the globe, half of them children are displaced due to war, hunger, violence and poverty. How should the international community be responding and dealing with this crisis?
[03:35:05] EDWARDS: Well, I think the first point I want to make and this relates to that excellent report there. Is that these are not just numbers, these are 70.8 million individuals who personally paying the price of so much conflict in today's world. And I think there's two things going on here that we need to focus on.
One is that, in this post-cold war era, still we increasingly pour at stopping and resolving conflicts. And that relates to the other point which is that, this is becoming entrenched, high levels of force displacement have been around for 20 years now. They're not going away although they stem from a handful of countries only. We are not seeing sufficient progress to resolve those situations.
CHURCH: And you know, I want to look at some of those numbers that Arwa had in her report, because what was astounding, 85 percent of those 70 plus million displaced people are being hosted by developing nations. Not by wealthy countries that is staggering on its own isn't? Why do you think we are seeing that trend? And what does it tell you about those wealthy nations?
EDWARDS: It's absolutely correct. This is not primarily a problem of the rich world it's mainly affecting region in which conflicts exists. What happens often when you are a refugee is usually a short notice you tried to reach safety in the nearest place that you can. And if that is across the border, frequently you'll want to stay in touch with those back at home. You may have left family members behind. You may have be worried about your property and other things.
So most refugees, they don't want to travel far, they want to travel to the nearest place of safety and to be able to return as soon as they can. Sadly, people just simply aren't able to return. One, in five refugees remains a refugee today for at least 20 years.
CHURCH: That is a very long time. And of course we all want to get to a solution here. Should we be focusing on what's causing the displacement of these refugees and trying to stop that from happening? Or do we focus on helping those refugees most in need and trying to get wealthy nations more involved. Or do we try to do both and how massive a task is all of this?
EDWARDS: It is a bit of both. And I think there are two things here in a way on today's world. Refugee day, this is an appeal for more effort on peace which is a fundamental factor that's driving this. We are a very conflicted world today. But the second part of it and this has been some an area where we started to see better progress in recent years. Is that country, nations, the private sector? I was realizing these situations, these humanitarian crises. These are not short term phenomenon.
They require long-term thinking, they require developments thinking. You need all kinds of things. You need schooling, you need livelihoods for people, you need health systems. You have to think of these things long term and we are starting to see more progress in that direction including the new global compact on refugees. But that progress really needs to accelerate, because this trend of the moment it's not going anywhere else, it's going to remain high.
CHURCH: Right. And I do want to get your projection on this. How many refugees and displaced people would you expect in the world by the end of the year and of course beyond and what trends are you seeing that we have to look out for?
EDWARDS: Well, looking at these numbers, there are -- so they double where they were in the late 90s. They are driven by a handful of conflicts. And that I suppose a scenario where there's hope that if you were to resolve one of the world's big conflicts, Syria or Venezuela today for example. Then we could see a change, but we don't see at least a presence in the near term of likelihood or returning to the levels that we had in the 90s. We have to I think start to address this today as something that is here to stay. It's the 21st century phenomenon. It looks like it's here to say.
CHURCH: And what would you say to those wealthy nations that are turning their backs on these millions of displaced people?
EDWARDS: Well, I think we need countries to work together. There are similarities in many ways to issues like climate change. These issues are so large that you can't deal with them by one country trying to address this alone. It does require countries to come together and recognize that you need the coherence response between countries. Which countries are important to? They are very important donors to the work on this done for refugees worldwide.
But they also need to, I think do more on several levels. We would like to see countries worldwide offering more resettlement places for example. That helped, that is a lifeline for the refugees who are most at risk.
[03:40:08] And also that help that has to happen in situations where refugees are present. That has to be real and has to be serious and it has to be long term in its thinking.
CHURCH: Adrian Edwards, thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate it.
EDWARDS: Thank you.
CHURCH: Well, Sudan's transitional military counsel continues its crackdown on protestors. We will see firsthand how the spirit of defiance shines on even in the darkest hours. Plus, a so called guru is found guilty on all counts for a lured series of crimes. The disturbing details when we come back.
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CHURCH: A former chief of Interpol has admitted his crime. The Chinese state media says Meng Hongwei was accused of accepting more than $2 million from businesses and individuals from 2005 to 2017. Meng disappeared in late September of last year when he traveled from Interpol headquarters in France to China. The Chinese government later acknowledged that Meng had been detained for alleged corruption. Meng had also been vice minister of public security in China.
Well, Sudan has been plagued by widespread violence since the ousting of longtime dictator President Omar al-Bashir. The country is now run by the transitional military council and protests against it are growing, even in the face of a violent crackdown. CNN's senior international correspondent Ben Wedeman is there. And this warning, his report contains some graphic images.
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BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Chanting civilian, civilian the protestors come out at night, demanding an end to rule by the transitional military council which on the 3rd of June dispatch soldiers to break up a long running city outside army headquarters (inaudible). This noisy march through the dusty streets of (Inaudible) Khartoum's sister city is an act of courage and defiance.
[03:45:00] The people who brought down the old dictator Omar al-Bashir are not about to go silently into the night. But there is a new would be dictator line and wait for them. Much has changed in Sudan since al-Bashir stepped down, but much is the same.
In Khartoum the government organize rally of village leaders, musicians were the warm up act with the main attraction. General Mohamed Hamdan Dagalo known here simply as Hemedti, is number two in the ruling military council. He commands the rapid support forces, the men who broke up the city. Hemedti rose to prominence as a leader of the ganja weed regime back tribal fighters during the war the international criminal court describing it as genocide in Darfur more than a decade ago.
On this occasion however, speaking to a receptive audience, he stressed security and stability, favored themes in the Arab world by the guardians of the old order. Mu'mun Ahamd is trying to overthrow that order. I saw more than 60 people either injured or killed he recalls from the day that these troops attack the city. Video he shot on his phone that day shows just how intense (inaudible) was. A bullet hit the hand holding his phone and another smashed into his leg. Doctor Sulima Sharif (inaudible) runs a trauma center, and says she knows at least seven women raped by soldiers on June 3rd. Other women protestors were abused as they fled.
DR. SULIMA SHARIF, AHFAD TRAUMA CENTER: They had been beaten, been raped, been called sluts, this is too much.
WEDEMAN: The military council denies any rapes took place. Ja'afar Hassan is the leader of the forces for freedom and change. The coalition fighting for civilian rule.
The military council is trying to abort the revolution he warns. We won't allow that to happen because this is revolution of the people.
The people who against the odds refused to be silenced. Ben Wedeman, CNN, Khartoum.
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CHURCH: Well, the head of the so help company NXIVM has been found guilty of sex trafficking, racketeering and a host of other crimes, prosecutors say Ken (inaudible) pressured women to have sex with him, blackmailed them and branded his initials into their skin. CNN's Jean Casarez has more.
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JEAN CASAREZ, CNN PRIMETIME JUSTICE SHOW GUEST HOST: For six weeks, jurors have been given a glimpse into the world of a cold like group NXIVM, hearing graphic testimony from women who say they were manipulated and coerced into sex with a man now on trial in New York federal court. NXIVM founder, 58 year old Keith Raniere was the lone defendant on trial after his codefendants engaged in plea deals. He was charged with seven counts, including racketeering and sex trafficking. He pleaded not guilty to all counts and did not testify in his own defense. His attorney says he denies any wrongdoing and argued his relationships were consensual.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm an interesting person, I'm a controversial person --
CASAREZ: NXIVM wasn't Albany, New York based company that sold pricey classes claiming to help students improve their lives and achieved success. Students in the classes were encouraged to move to the Albany area. They formed a community around Raniere who was known as Vanguard and pretended to live a monk like existence. Prosecutors said only a small group within the community knew that Raniere was allegedly having sex with dozens of women, some of whom were coerced into having sexual relationships with him.
In 2015, Raniere formed a secret group within NXIVM called DOS. DOS was pitched as being a woman's mentorship group, but in reality, Raniere was not mentoring anyone, prosecutors said. The group was made up of women who were masters and slaves. Testimony in court revealed they were sworn to secrecy about the group by giving what they called collateral. Damaging pictures and information about their lives that could be released publicly if they spoke out against NXIVM.
[03:50:00] The women were coerced into being branded by their masters, prosecutors said, but they had no idea they were actually being scarred with Raniere's own initials. Raniere was heard discussing the branding ceremonies in audio played in court.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And a person should ask to be branded, should say please brand me, it would be an honor. And they should probably say that before they are held down, so it doesn't seem like they are being coerced.
CASAREZ: Raniere was originally charged with five other woman, all high-ranking members of NXIVM, but each of the women entered guilty pleas before the trial started. Codefendants include Smallville actress Allison Mack who pleaded guilty to racketeering and racketeering conspiracy charges and Seagram's liquor heiress Clare Bronfman who pleaded guilty to fraudulent use of identification, visa fraud and harboring an undocumented immigrant. Jean Casarez, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE) CHURCH: Well, one of the biggest cities in India is running out of
water. Just ahead, we will see when the drought stricken country can expect some rain and cooler temperatures. Back with that in just a moment.
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CHURCH: India is enduring one of its longest heat waves ever and along with the searing temperatures, a severe drought with a parched landscape, 126 people have died across the country. Let's turn to our meteorologist Pedram Javaheri, who joins us from the International Weather Center with more on this. And of course, what they need is water, but it's not coming anytime soon, is it?
PEDRAM JAVAHERI, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes. Unfortunately it's been delayed for more than a week. Of course, the heat has been excessive across this region, as you mentioned for so long now and you take a look, it's beginning to take its toll of course when you take a look at the wells, they are running dry, the reservoir is among their lowest we have seen on record going back to some seven decades across the Indian subcontinent.
So, you take a look at why things are playing out as such and we are seeing the water levels, the rainfall themselves, the amount of rainy days and also the amount of rainfall that is coming down in the past several decades, we have seen that diminish in the summer season which is by far the wettest time of year, but even in the drier winter season the rainfall that they get that minimal amount has already shrunk down as well in recent decades.
So, of course, not a good trend to see take place across this region, the number of rainy days decreasing, the number of dry days even in the monsoon season beginning to increase and we have seen the groundwater supply had diminish significantly in the past one and a half decades dropping a new order of say, 10 to 25 millimeters per year from 2002 towards closer to present day.
Of course, all of this going hand in hand with what's happening in study after study coming out that is showcasing that by 2020 we can see, gradually, some of these major cities, whether it would be New Delhi to the north or farther towards the south in (inaudible) were we are seeing the drought situation right now, a lot of these cities are beginning to run out of the groundwater supply that is already diminishing at a rapid rate, and we know the population has increased and will continue to increase in India dramatically.
In fact, the estimates put that 40 percent of India's population by the year 2030 would not have access to clean drinking water within the next decade. And of course, the population sets at 1.3 billion right now, we expect that to rise by 15 percent in the next 10 years. So more people less water supply and of course a shorter wet season. All of them to blame in what's happening across this region. And Rosemary, the monsoon trough essentially where the rainfall is right now, well to the south for this time of year, we should have been covering almost the entire subcontinent. So, it is a very, very dire situation right now. [03:55:05] CHURCH: It certainly is. And a real concern, Pedram
thank, you so much for that I appreciate it.
For a former communications, Director Hope Hicks did not have much to say. The longtime aide and confidant who Donald Trump spent the day testifying on Capitol Hill, but when it came to her tenure with the Trump administration, White House lawyers did most of the talking. Here's our Jeanne Moos.
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JEANNE MOOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Getting Hope Hicks to talk is getting hopeless.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you spoken to the president at all about this testimony?
MOOS: Like a beautiful but expression of a model she used to occasionally be. Hope walked the runway of Congress silently.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We often seen, but rarely heard.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Closed doors and tightlipped.
MOOS: Lip so tight that Democrats couldn't get answers to the most basic question about her time in the White House.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Where is your office located? Objection. It was ridiculous.
MOOS: Inside the hearing, outside the hearing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What was the last time you spoke to the president?
MOOS: But the guide to whom Hope spoke the most, didn't even ask a question. She suddenly made a beeline to one of the still photographers chasing her, asked if he was all right. Moments earlier, yet run into a water fountain as the press scrum backpedaled. And when Hope approached him, he was so surprise he forgot to get the close-up.
GQ once named her number one on its list of 50 most powerful people in Trump's Washington. You couldn't get much closer to the president, Trump made Hope Hicks steam his pants while he was wearing them. She's always have the aura of the sphinx.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The White House Communications Director and wax figure of Nancy Kerrigan, Hope Hicks.
MOOS: When her boss wants coached her onstage to say a few words. She said exactly nine.
And four words expressing gratitude.
HOPE HICKS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Thank you Donald Trump. MOOS: And now she has Donald Trump on the Democrats to thank for
dragging her to this hearing, where she had behind sunglasses and escaped into an elevator, but Hope springs eternal, and she finally uttered a single solitary word out loud to the press as they followed her blindly to the ladies room?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sorry.
MOOS: Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.
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CHURCH: And thanks for your company this hour, I'm Rosemary Church remember to connect with me any time on Twitter. We would love to hear from you and the news continues with our Max Foster in London. You're watching CNN, have yourself a great day.
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