Return to Transcripts main page


Supreme Court Blocks Citizenship Question From 2020 Census for Now; Supreme Court Says Constitution Does Not Allow Courts to Weigh in on Gerrymandering; A Look at Some Famous Moments of Joe Biden's Past Debates; Concern Grows Over Wellbeing of Angela Merkel Seen Shaking for 2nd Time in Weeks; Rep. Katie Hill (D-CA) Discusses the Emergency Border Funding Bill, Trump Blaming Democrats for Death of Immigrant Man & Child While Crossing Rio Grande. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired June 27, 2019 - 13:30   ET


[13:30:00] ELLIOT WILLIAMS, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL: Yes, it could. It would be pretty remarkable because it's now July, in effect, and you would have to get everything drafted by -- October is the date that we've seen that, if there's an emergency, they can still put the forms out after October. It seems unlikely.

Again, three federal judges have ruled against the Commerce secretary, saying they believed that he was untruthful. And even John Roberts said -- suggested that the rationale was contrived. He used that word in the decision today.

It's hard to see how this proceeds and wins.

But again, we should just remember this decision isn't about the census. It's not about just counting noses. It's about representation and government and how people are counted and who has a voice in our democracy.

So it's a much bigger broader case. And we need to keep thinking and talking about it in those terms.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And, Ariane, the justices also ruled that severe gerrymandering can continue. Tell us about this one.

ARIANE DE VOGUE, CNN SUPREME COURT REPORTER: This one's totally different, Brianna. Here again, Chief Justice John Roberts, he's writing for a 5-4 majority, but he's siding with the conservatives.

At issue here is when politicians go too far in drawing state lines for partisan gain. Critics wanted the courts to step in and say when things went too far.

But John Roberts said today that the courts cannot look at such issues, that they have to be left for the political branches.

He slammed the courthouse doors on this. He said, "The fact that such partisan gerrymander claims are incompatible with democratic principle does not mean the solution lies with the federal courts." But in court today, Justice Elena Kagan, writing for the liberals,

wrote a biting dissent. She was angry. At times at the very end, I even thought I heard her voice crack. She said, "Of all the times to abandon the court's duty to declare the law, this was not the one. The practices challenged in these cases imperil our system of government."

She said, at the end, that she and the other liberals were deeply saddened by the court's decision -- Brianna?

KEILAR: OK. Let's -- you're going to have people who like the first ruling, do not like the second ruling for sure.

So alternate universe time. Let's say Merrick Garland, who was Obama's Supreme Court nominee, who Senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, blocked, let's say he made it through. What would be the effect be on this decision?

WILLIAMS: It's hard to see how a Justice Garland would have ruled because frankly it's hard to see -- this is --


KEILAR: He would have ruled for gerrymandering?

WILLIAMS: In the same way that Justice Roberts -- or Justice -- the justice who replaced -- who filled the seat. I can't remember --


KEILAR: Gorsuch.

WILLIAMS: Gorsuch. This is a pretty remarkable decision. And it's pretty expansive in its breadth.

What's fascinating is Chief Justice Roberts ultimately says, look, I know this is going to be a problem but I think this is beyond the court's review. That's a shockingly broad decision and a shockingly narrow view of what courts can do.

And what you see from the court is, we're willing to be judicial activists when it suits the aims of a conservative majority.

It is impossible to see how justice -- a Justice Garland would have ruled in the same way on this decision. And it would have, frankly, put more power back in the hands of the people and not allowed, you know, unreasonable stuff.

KEILAR: Pop quiz. Name all the justices fast. Just kidding.



KEILAR: I know you could. I know you could.

Elliot Williams, thank you so much.

WILLIAMS: Thank you.

KEILAR: Ariane De Vogue, thank you.

So as Joe Biden gets ready for the spotlight tonight, we look at some of the most famous moments of his past debates.

Also, the one man who loomed large over the first Democratic debate wasn't even there. And he wasn't President Trump.

And a new twist in the public feud between the U.S. women's soccer team and the president just a day before their next World Cup match.


[13:38:09] KEILAR: It's round two tonight for another set of Democrats on the debate stage. And this time, the line-up will include presidential candidate, Joe Biden. And if you feel like you've heard that line before it's probably because you have, more than once.

So what can we expect from the former vice president?

CNN's Arlette Saenz takes a look back at Joe Biden the debater.



ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER (voice-over): Joe Biden is no stranger to the presidential debate stage.



SAENZ: But tonight marks the first time he's center stage as the front-runner.

UNIDENTIFIED DEBATE MODERATOR: Starting on my immediate right, Senator Joseph R. Biden Jr, of Delaware.

SAENZ: His first presidential debate came in the 1988 campaign.

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As we debate these issues, let's put them in concrete terms and understand that when we talk about these statistics we're talking about people.

SAENZ: During the 2008 campaign, Biden debated candidates like Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton. And he unleashed this zinger about an opponent not even on the stage.

BIDEN: Rudy Giuliani, there's only three things he mentioned in the sentence, a noun, and a verb, and 9/11. I mean, there's nothing else.


There's nothing else.

SAENZ: But tonight's Democratic primary debate in Miami marks Biden's first debate in seven years after he tangled with Republican vice presidential nominee, Paul Ryan, in 2012.

BIDEN: With all due respect, that's a bunch of malarkey.

SAENZ: Before that, he faced off against the 2008 GOP vice presidential nominee, Sarah Palin.


SAENZ: And showed his emotional side.

BIDEN: The notion that somehow, because I'm a man, I don't know what it's like to raise two kids alone. I don't know what it's like to have a child I'm not sure is going to make it -- I understand.

SAENZ: Tonight, Biden finds himself bracing for possible attacks from his Democratic rivals. The former vice president one of 10 candidates on the debate stage.

Bernie Sanders, standing to his left, could paint Biden as a middle- ground candidate.

[13:40:11] SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): We have got to make it clear that when the future of the planet is at stake, there is no middle ground!

SAENZ: While Pete Buttigieg, on his right, could make a generational argument.

PETE BUTTIGIEG, (D), SOUTH BEND MAYOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Democrats can no more turn the clock to the 1990s than Republicans can return us to the 1950s, and we should not try.


SAENZ: Biden readying for the possible friendly fire.

BIDEN: My guess is it's going to be an inclination, instead of talking about the future, it's going to be talking about the past. And I'm about the future, not the past.

SAENZ: And for the sometimes verbose and gaffe-prone Biden, brevity might be key.

BRIAN WILLIAMS, MSNBC HOST & DEBATE MODERATOR: Can you reassure voters in this country that you would have the discipline you would need on the world stage, Senator?



SAENZ: Arlette Saenz, CNN, Miami.


KEILAR: There are many who are voicing concern over Angela Merkel after the German chancellor has been seen shaking for the second time recently. And her office just responded.

Plus, as the situation on the border grows more dire, we're getting some news about the fate of the border bill being tossed around in Congress. A compromise could be in serious jeopardy.


[13:46:23] KEILAR: President Trump is in Japan for the G-20 summit, where he must get ready for an important lineup of meetings with world leaders over the next two days.

Friday, he'll be speaking with the Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, and Russian President Vladimir Putin. Then on Saturday, he'll meet with the Saudi crown prince, Mohammad bin Salman, Chinese President Xi Jinping, and the Turkish President Erdogan.

Meanwhile, concern is growing about the wellbeing of German Chancellor Angela Merkel. This is the video that has caught people's attention. You can see her here visibly shaking. And then she actually clutches her arms as if to try to still her arms from shaking.

And they're looking at this because it's the second time here recently that we've seen her shake like this during a public event.

I want to check in now with CNN correspondent, Isa Soares.

What is her team saying about this, Isa?

ISA SOARES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It seems, Brianna, the team, the spokesperson really trying to sweep this under the carpet, telling CNN that the chancellor's fine, everything is taking place as planned in terms of her schedule.

She has a very grueling schedule. She's got an incredible work ethic. You mentioned that she was -- she'll be meeting with the president. We know she's on her way to Osaka. She comes back on Sunday. And then she'll be meeting with E.U. leaders.

This is a woman, Brianna, who works 18 hours a day, for 14 years. She's been chancellor for the fourth time now, fourth term since 2005.

As you stated, this is the second time we've seen -- the video you're looking at on your screen, this is from June 18th. This was a hot day. She was outside standing alongside the Ukrainian president, and she started shaking.

Now, when CNN asked the spokesperson what exactly had happened, she said, look, it was a hot day and she was dehydrated but after three glasses of water she felt much better.

This time it seems the media not turning a blind eye because today she was indoors. Although there's a heat wave in Europe, she was indoors. She was offered a glass of water but she rejected it.

And we went further back, in fact, back to 2017, in Mexico, where we saw video of her shaking, mostly her legs shaking. We called back the press secretary. They are not commenting any further.

Germany goes into recess parliament this summer. They're clearly trying to turn a blind eye.

But this is a woman who is known as Iron Chancellor, a woman who was very highly respected for work ethic, and for the job, the fantastic job she has done as German chancellor here in Europe -- Brianna?

KEILAR: All right. A lot of questions.

Isa Soares, thank you so much for that report.

And we do have more now on our breaking news. Moderate Democrats are threatening to kill the border bill in the House.

Joining me now is Democratic Congresswoman Katie Hill, of California.

Congresswoman, you have actually been in some of these talks. So tell us where things stand.

REP. KATIE HILL (D-CA): So right now, we're really working. We know we need to pass something ASAP. The kids at the border cannot wait. We have to get the aid out. At this point, we're going to make sure we get the best possible deal.

Clearly, this is divided government in action. We have a House that's controlled by the Democrats, the Senate that's controlled by the Republicans.

And we've been sending -- from the House side, we've been sending over improvements to the Senate bill that we think will actually make a difference in terms of the lives of the people at the border, in terms of the resources that are actually going to be going to the faith- based groups and organizations that are providing that aid.

And we need to make sure -- right now, Mitch McConnell is unmovable. So --


KEILAR: But in the House -- let's focus on the House. What is your preference to take up the House bill, to deal with just the House bill or the Senate?

[13:50:07] HILL: No, I mean --

KEILAR: What's your personal preference? HILL: My personal preference is that we take up the House bill and at

least say to the Senate, look, this is what we need. Hopefully, we get a response. But either way, I know we can't go home without passing something.

KEILAR: OK, but you have issues with people in your own caucus. There's moderate Democrats, according to our Manu Raju, who are trying to force the speakers hand, they're threatening to revolt and kill this bill. Where do you go from there?

HILL: I think there's a few things. First of all, the discussions are moving as we speak. I mean, this is -- I literally stepped out of the room to come and do this talk.

But I think there's -- what really the moderate Democrats want is to go home and say, we did something.

The concern that I think some people are having right now is that the Senate bill stopped some funding for ICE. That's what makes it tough for people within our caucus. People who are coming from more moderate districts don't want to be seen as potentially cutting funding for ICE.

But the reality is we already passed this bill. We already passed this bill. Everyone voted for this bill already, except for four Democrats. And it's not cutting any funding for ICE. It's just giving as much as the Senate wanted.

So we've got to negotiate this. We've got to continue to figure this out. This is a caucus. We want to be as united as we possibly can be. We're working on it. I would say this is going to continue to develop over the next couple hours.

And either way, I can say with pretty much full confidence there's no way we're going to be leaving until we get this taken care of.

KEILAR: It's hard to imagine uncoupling these things, right, helping migrants, improving conditions, and then the stuff that you don't want, right, more beds, more funds for deportations, more wall.

Would you walk away from a deal with all of these things, even if it meant nothing for what you want to deliver?

HILL: First of all, the Senate version doesn't even have more wall and it doesn't have more beds. It has -- yes, there's a bit more funding for ICE, but even that is -- I think the real issue we have with it, is that it's not restrictive enough in terms of it making sure it's going to the right places.

There's certainly people within the caucus that have issues with different parts of the Senate version of the bill. For example, there's Department of Defense funding within it that's concerning.

But either way there are -- I would say that a lot of the Senate bill is palatable to the majority of the caucus. But we do need to make sure that we are -- we are in the majority in

the House. And we have to use that majority. We have to fight with everything we've got for what reflects the majority of our caucus. And what reflects what we believe is the majority of the American people's values and beliefs. Ultimately, that's what we're going to do.

Either way, no matter what happens, I can assure you we're going to have -- we're going to pass something that has immediate relief to the people at the border by the time we leave here.

KEILAR: Even if you have to swallow a bitter pill of ICE funding?

HILL: I mean, it's -- I don't want to speak for anybody else. I think that -- these are the details we have to work out.

KEILAR: OK, so President Trump is blaming your party. He's blaming your party for this photo that we have seen, two migrants who drowned crossing -- part of a migrant family, Oscar Alberto Martinez and his daughter, Angie Valeria, when they were crossing the river.

Let's listen to what President Trump said.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I hate it. And I know it could stop immediately, if the Democrats change the law. They have to change the laws. And then that father, who probably was this wonderful guy, with this daughter, things like that wouldn't happen. Because that journey across that river, that journey across that river is a very dangerous journey.


KEILAR: What's your response to that, Congresswoman?

HILL: My response is the reason that people are crossing the river where they are, is because he, the Trump administration, has made a policy of stopping the number of people who can come in at ports of entry who are seeking asylum.

So instead, they're going through parts of the border that they -- where they can't get help, where they can't do so legally. They're trying to find Border Patrol agents to get that help. And it's incredibly dangerous. That's why we need to have the ports of entry that accommodate this, that can allow people to come through legally.

We need the border security that's going to make sure that it's safe and protected for both our side and for people who would be making those dangerous crossings.

But it's a Trump administration decision to try to create these roadblocks at the legal ports of entry. That's first and foremost.

The second is that he's also cut off aid to the countries that need it, the aid to the countries in Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador where, if we were truly trying to get to the root cause of the problem of why these people are fleeing those countries in the first place, you don't start by cutting aide.

You start by figuring out how we, as Americans, can assist in making those living conditions better so people aren't constantly trying to flee and come here.

[13:55:08] KEILAR: Congresswoman Katie Hill, thank you for joining us.

HILL: Thank you.

KEILAR: Any moment, we are about to -- here we have some live pictures. We're going to get a look here soon at the president's former campaign chairman, as Paul Manafort is appearing in court. We're keeping an eye on that.

Plus, the big takeaways from the first Democratic presidential debate. Who shined, who stumbled, and which issues took center stage?