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Joe Biden Apologizes for Comments on Working with Segregations in Congress; Senator Kamala Harris Comments on Joe Biden's Apology; Iran Announces Increases in Uranium Enrichment; Iran Demands Return of Oil Tanker. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired July 8, 2019 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.


[08:00:00] JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Yes, I was. I regret. And I'm sorry for any of the pain or misconception I may have caused anybody.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: I want to bring in our CNN political analyst Joshua Green, national coordinator for "Bloomberg Business Week," Julie Hirschfeld Davis, congressional coordinator for "The New York Times," and Jonathan Martin, national political coordinator for "The New York Times."

Josh, I want to start with you, because you say this shows, in part, how Joe Biden is living within two worlds. This apology that we saw in South Carolina seems to be addressing directly one of those worlds.

JOSHUA GREEN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: It was. In a Democratic primary context, Joe Biden is the wounded frontrunner who has been dogged by the scandal of race busing and segregation, and I think that's what prompted his apology.

But on the other hand, in a general election context, if you look at the recent round of polls, Biden is still the strongest general election candidate against President Trump, which is one reason I think why he's gotten inside Trump's head and Trump unleashed this flurry of Biden-focused tweets. I think Biden is trying to solve a problem and get back to a point where he can be strong in both of those worlds, the Democratic primary and a general election matchup.

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Julie, we're looking at some of the polling right now. There are many Democrats, I think, at the moment that show them beating President Trump.

BERMAN: But none as much as Joe Biden. Joe Biden really is the one who is outside the margin of errors if you're talking about registered voters if you're applying that bigger screen. He's got a 10-point lead. Everyone else within the margin of error.

CAMEROTA: And Julie, also we should say that President Trump is hitting a high watermark I believe in his own approval rating. It's still I think 44 percent, which of course is less than 50. However, from the people that we've spoken to here on our NEW DAY voter panels, they love the economy, and the economy is going gangbusters. And his poll numbers reflect it.

JULIE HIRSCHFELD DAVIS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Absolutely. The economy is always a huge factor for an incumbent president running for reelection. And so that's a good thing for him. It appears to have compensated for the fact in the same poll a lot of people -- the vast majority of people actually said that he was not presidential. But as long as the economy is good, that seems to buoying him.

But I do think that Josh is right that the fact that in the head to head, Biden continues to be the biggest threat to him is the reason you see him going after Biden intensely. It also is something that bolsters the case that Joe Biden is trying to make in this race, which is that he is the person that is best able to take it to President Trump. And I think that also explains why it took him so long to make this apology, not actually for having worked with those senators back in the 70s, but for having talked about them in a way that sounded like he was praising people that were pro segregation.

BERMAN: And he didn't just apologize over the weekend. He also sat down for the interview with Chris, Chris Cuomo, which was a different thing than we have seen from Biden and the Biden campaign to date. So clearly, he thinks he needs to do something differently. And Jonathan Martin, it might get you what you have been writing about over the last several days, which is the rise of two other candidates, Senator Kamala Harris and Senator Elizabeth Warren. Let me play for you how Senator Harris responded to the Biden apology.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. KAMALA HARRIS, (D-CA) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, he says he's sorry. I'm going to take him at his word. But again, that doesn't address the issue of busing in America and the fact that he still -- we cannot rewrite history about what segregationists were doing at that time on a number of issues, including opposing busing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: That's not exactly apology accepted, Jonathan. And it makes me wonder, and you get to this in your piece a little bit, does the Harris campaign think it needs, for lack of a better word, a second act? What's next after the debate performance?

JONATHAN MARTIN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: That's a great question. We have a story today about the post-debate rise of Kamala Harris and Elizabeth Warren, and really Kamala Harris because Warren was moving before the debate. And that's the question now. Obviously, Kamala Harris going into the debate, she had raised less than $10 million, not very impressive at all for somebody who had a great launch. She had to put the ball in the air in this debate, she had to do something to change the equation. And she did it effectively, and has now dominated the conversation for the last week. Her poll numbers jumped. Her fundraising in the last few days of the quarter we know jumped.

And now the question is can she sustain a sort of better campaign than she ran the first six months of the year. When she was in Iowa last week, I was there. She came out there with a new line about Trump, called him a predator in the White House, which is a sort of great applause line, obviously, for Democratic activists. And that said two things to me. A, she wanted to train her focus on Trump, which plays well with Democrats, and B, she wanted to sort of keep Biden on the defensive, but also start to move away from this busing debate somewhat, because obviously it's a better conversation if it's about Joe Biden in the 70s than if it's about the view of busing in 2019, which is where the conversation, John, was going.

[08:05:09] CAMEROTA: I don't know, Josh, I think it's hard for any candidate to sustain anything for 500 days. This is the challenge, right? So you don't want to come out of the gate too fast, but you don't want to be at the back of the pack. These are critical days, even though we're so far away, these are critical days. As we've talked about, the CNN debate is next, it's July 30th and 31st. And we still don't know exactly which candidates are going to make that all important stage.

GREEN: That's right. And I think what you allude to there, the size of the field, is another reason why Kamala Harris is intent on maybe not letting this Biden thing go so quickly. She didn't say apology accepted, let's move on. She said I take him at his word that he wasn't a racist, keep this going a couple more days.

I think the challenge for all candidates but especially one like Harris who has risen, is how do you maintain the spotlight, who do you stay there and be the focal point of the conversation, because that's what you need in order to generate fundraising dollars, media attention, and to keep your buoyed status as one of the frontrunner intact moving forward.

BERMAN: If you see those poll numbers, though, Julie, with Joe Biden, again, having the most success against President Trump and Biden still doing well in other polling -- ABC News, the poll that came out before this weekend, had Joe Biden well ahead, might it be that he has weathered this storm? Is this a sign going into the all important CNN debate that perhaps he has already seen the worst of it?

DAVIS: I think it could be. But I think the Biden campaign would be foolish to think that he's not fog to be faced with this kind of issue and potentially this kind of pretty sharp, I won't say attack, but pretty sharp pressure from the other candidates in the field, who as Josh just said, are trying to break out and sustain what could be a little bit of the momentum that they have built up in the last debates.

I think it's helpful for him obviously to be in the position he's in, but what we've seen is that the former vice president is very reluctant to sort of change his ways, change what he's saying, even when there's evidence that the Democratic base may not be that happy with what he's saying. And what you don't see, these are general election matchups that you're looking at. We're not seeing as much as whether -- as Jonathan wrote in his story today, whether there is a quiet rise that's happening that's been driven by grassroots who are really not that satisfied with what they are seeing with Biden. And I think it's going to take a couple more debates, a couple more confrontations among the candidates to see whether that actually bears out.

MARTIN: And real fast, John, these are early days, no doubt, many debates to go, but I would say the Biden campaign would not have put him with Chris Cuomo for that interview, they certainly would have him give that prepared speech reading from a prompter on Saturday in South Carolina if they didn't see some bleeding. Clearly, it was an attempt to stop this conversation, try to move on, otherwise they wouldn't have done those two things.

CAMEROTA: V.P. Biden also seems to have a favorite catchphrase, or some might say verbal particular, or some might say mantra. Here it is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Come on, man. Come on, man. Come on. Oh, come on, man.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(LAUGHTER)

CAMEROTA: Josh, that is his favorite.

GREEN: Yes. Look, all politicians have these verbal ticks. Remember Trump in the last campaign, everything was bigly, I'm going to do it bigly, I'm going to do that bigly. It just so happens that Biden has more of these ticks than any politician.

BERMAN: Literally. Literally.

GREEN: Literally.

CAMEROTA: That's one of them.

BERMAN: I'm not kidding, exactly.

GREEN: It's just the way he speaks, that kind of slightly forced casual idiom that tries to make him seem like everyman. It's the heart of his political persona. Does he abuse it? Yes, maybe. But that's who Joe Biden is after 50 years as a politician.

BERMAN: We just learned this morning Tom Steyer, the billionaire investor, may actually be considering getting into the race. He had said that he wasn't going to do it or he wasn't making the announcement before. I guess he never officially 100 percent ruled it out. But now Robert Costa over at "The Washington Post" and CNN has confirmed he's having second thoughts about getting in, and it could happen. So what happens, Julie, if this billionaire, who has shown willingness to spend a lot of money on TV, all of a sudden jumps in. DAVIS: I think one of the things that happens is something we haven't

seen happen too much particularly in the last -- in the debates, which is that impeachment becomes really a centerpiece of the race. Tom Steyer has been spending his money and his time and his energy with this need to impeach push.

[08:10:00] It's very divisive among Democrats. The party can't figure out necessarily -- at least members of Congress are having a hard time figuring out whether they should go that route or not. But I think there's in doubt that he would make that a centerpiece of his campaign, and that would be a pretty big change, a pretty big shift from what we're seeing, which is candidates trying to stick to talking about health care and the economy and all sort of other issues that polls show voters are actually more focused on.

CAMEROTA: J. Mart, one thing who did not want to talk about anything that has cropped up on campaign trail, at least not between Kamala Harris and Joe Biden, is Michelle Obama. Over the weekend, she studiously avoided direct questions about how they saw this flap over busing, et cetera. So here is a moment with Michelle Obama.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What, if anything, would you like to say about the Kamala Harris-Biden dust-up. He apologized today. You've been following that. Do you have any thoughts about that?

MICHELLE OBAMA, FORMER FIRST LADY: I do not.

(APPLAUSE)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: OK. Let me ask this -- moving on.

MICHELLE OBAMA: I've been doing this rodeo far too long.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Moving on. Moving on.

MICHELLE OBAMA: No comment.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAMEROTA: You can understand, whose side would she be on, Joe Biden, her husband's vice president, or Kamala Harris, who she shares some pieces of history with? That would a tough one.

MARTIN: Yes. And I think even if you offer the slightest defense of Biden, which maybe she would have been tempted to do given their relationship, then you're going to be seen as putting a thumb on the scale for Biden and that becomes the story the next day. And obviously she wants to avoid that, which is why she says nothing at all like that.

But there is no question, guys, this is one of the hottest conversations in Democratic politics right now, which is how much does Joe Biden have to get beaten up by his rivals, scrutinized by the press, before President Obama says something about his vice president and friend. You hear it all the time.

And it's a little different for Michelle Obama, but certainly I think for Barack Obama there is this question of, OK, he's not going to endorse his vice president at least until deep in the primary, if it comes to that point, but will he at least say something at all about his character? He put out a statement on day one testifying to his character, but does he do something like that down the road I think is going to be a key question, especially as Biden gets hit harder and harder.

BERMAN: That's a really good point, because if he's out there speaking to groups, he's going to be asked the question. And it's not about necessarily endorsing, Josh. It about just answering a question about saying something nice about Joe Biden. And that in and of itself could give Biden something to run with.

GREEN: Yes, it could, and this is why it's such a fraught subject for both of the Obamas. They, on the one hand, I think believe Biden is a genuinely decent person, who obviously isn't racist and some of the accusations he's gotten from the left. But on the other hand, they emphatically don't want to endorse -- they don't want to seem as though they are putting their thumb on the scale for Biden and inject themselves into the Democratic primary process. So I'm sure wherever Barack Obama's next appearance is, he has carefully been prepared and thought about what he will say if that sort of question is directed toward him. NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: ... say is their

tanker is filled with their oil. They're demanding that the British government and the Gibraltar authorities here release it immediately. They're calling it piracy.

But the Gibraltar authorities here say, not so fast. This was a ship, they believe, full of crude oil on its way to Syria. And they say that was breaking E.U. sanctions, which is why they detained it and why it's still here.

There are British Naval vessels patrolling this area, keeping it secure. But Iran is now saying that if the British don't release this, then potentially they could capture a British vessel in the Strait of Hormuz, and we know how tense things are there right now.

The Iranian shot down a U.S. drone there recently, as well as attacking a number of oil tankers. So all of this, the nuclear deal, this oil tanker -- it's all fueling tensions with Iran. And this situation is a standoff and it's not going away soon -- John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Every move precarious here these next few days. Nic Robertson for us in Gibraltar. Thank you so much, Nic.

So now, World Cup champions, the U.S. soccer team may face an even greater challenge off the field. One of the games all-time greats joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:20:17] BERMAN: This morning, they're not done yet. The U.S. Soccer team won the World Cup but that might be just the beginning. Their next battle, it is already on.

Joining us now, one of the all-time greats, two-time World Cup champion Michelle Akers. She was on the 1991 and 1999 World Cup championship teams, also one of my personal favorite soccer players ever. So it's an honor to get to speak with you.

I'm sure you were as overjoyed as the rest of us when you watched the U.S. team win yesterday, but perhaps for you, even more meaning because these women, they grew up idolizing you.

MICHELLE AKERS, TWO-TIME WORLD CUP CHAMPION: Thanks, John, you're one of my favorites, too. And now, I feel even older than I am. Because so many of them, the parents talked to some of my teammates that were there and friends and at the game and the parents were saying thank you to my teammates, because the team inspired their daughters and so like hearing that just made me cry even more.

I was crying all day yesterday. So God, it was such a great tournament for our stars and it's not just about only winning the World Cup, there's so much more about this tournament and this USA team and that's what makes it more exciting for me, too.

BERMAN: They set the bar so high for themselves on and off the field, and they met that bar and to prove your point that it was more than just about a game. At the end of the game in France, no less just listen what they were chanting in the stands. I want to play this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: (Chanting "Equal Pay.")

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: "Equal pay," they were chanting in France in the stands for the U.S. team. What does that tell you, Michelle about how broad and how far their message is going?

AKERS: It means you know more change is coming and that we're not going to be ignored, you know, daughters and moms and sisters. Everybody wants equality and now the entire world is kind of understanding what's at stake and soccer being the world sport is the perfect venue.

And this team, the way the USA played and won and persevered and handled so much pressure and other issues and drama going on around the World Cup. It just really held their message true. Equal pay equal opportunity.

And yes, it's about playing you know, football, soccer, and equal opportunity to develop as players and as teams around the world, but it's more equality off the field as well. And from the chant, you can see, it as a powerful message.

BERMAN: What's the problem? Why has this taken so long? Why is this even difficult for U.S. soccer, do you think to make this happen? AKERS: I know. I was going to ask you the same thing. And it's not

just U.S. soccer, it's prevalent in -- you know, it's prevalent in the U.S. It's prevalent in other sports and in business, you know, every walk of life.

I don't know. I talk about it with my son all the time. And what do you think? It's a no brainer to me why wouldn't it all be the same across the board.

BERMAN: Let me play what Megan Rapinoe thinks about it, since I think her opinion over these last few days has perhaps been more important than anyone else's. Let's listen to what she said after the win.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MEGAN RAPINOE, U.S. WOMEN'S NATIONAL SOCCER TEAM PLAYER: I think everyone is ready for this conversation to move to the next step. I think we're done with, are we worth it? Should we have equal pay? Is it you know -- is the markets the same? Yes, yes, everyone is done with that.

I mean, we put on as all players, I'm saying every player at this World Cup put on the most incredible show that you could ever ask for. We can't do anything more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: We're done making the case. Megan Rapinoe says we made the case. We need to move forward beyond that. And to me, one of the most iconic images of this entire World Cup was in the semis after she scored that PK, actually it wasn't in the semis, it would have been the quarterfinals, you know, playing semis, this image right there of Megan Rapinoe just saying, "Here I am, world. Look at what we're doing. Look at what we're saying."

And I wonder if we're going to start seeing some silhouette of this the way we've seen the Michael Jordan dunk over the years if this is an image that will last forever.

AKERS: Yes, that -- I mean, she and she's a controversial figure, right? She is -- gosh, social media is blowing up. Trump, you know, tweeted out at her.

[08:25:08] AKERS: And, you know, people kind of get ticked off about some of the things she says but -- and I don't necessarily agree with everything she says, however, I love the fact that she is speaking out and she is going for more.

It's not necessarily only about Megan Rapinoe, it's about her team. It's about the state of soccer. It's about our country and the culture around the world. And she is totally right.

It's done, right? Like they've shown, they've proved -- we've proven. So let's get on about talking about this conversation and how are we going to make the changes and when. I love that. I love how she has been speaking. BERMAN: You went to the White House twice in 1991 and 1999, I

believe, with the World Cup champion teams. Megan Rapinoe says she won't go if she's invited. Would you go if you were part of this team, and the President invited you?

AKERS: Actually I've been to the White House in 1991 and 1999. I was so beat up after that World Cup, I was having surgery. I didn't, I didn't get to go to the White House.

But you know, I would. I would, because I'd want to be with my team. So that for me would be my choice. But you know, people do different things and it changes. It changes regardless of I think the personal way you choose to do things.

It creates the conversation and I think that's what so -- what I love so much about how she is doing this is she is creating a conversation and that's important.

BERMAN: One of the things we often ask after an athlete wins something like a World Cup or two, in your case is what do you do next? And whenever we talk to you, we see this beautiful horse barn behind you here and you have chosen to take care of these beautiful animals. Explain to us what you're doing.

AKERS: Yes, well, I mean, winning a World Cup or two, or now for, for USA, right? A lot of celebrating afterwards. And then you know what? Life goes on. You kind of, you know, step on the next step. And for me, I have a son and I'm a mom and I love animals and had the opportunity to have horses which was my dream as a kid.

And so now, I'm rescuing them and helping other rescues and sanctuaries take care of these horses who have a lot of needs. So yes, this is my place and it's my heart and it's the best ever and I got to sit here on my farm and watch the team win the World Cup yesterday and then come out and, and clean horse poop after. It was the best ever.

BERMAN: It sounds like a great day, at least the first half. It sounds like a great day. Michelle Akers.

AKERS: Yes.

BERMAN: Thank you so much for being with us this morning. An honor again to speak with you.

AKERS: Thanks, John.

BERMAN: Alisyn?

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: She said you were one of her favorites. That's what I heard that all time.

BERMAN: I have such vivid memories. She was so good. She was so good. If no one has seen it, check out YouTube. Watch Michelle Akers dominate the game in the air and on the ground scoring goals. One of the all-time leading U.S. goal scorers. She is amazing. CAMEROTA: That's awesome. I'm so glad you got a chance to speak to

her. Okay, President Trump now says he wants to show the migrant detention centers to the press to counter these reports of dirty conditions and overcrowding.

We will talk to a chief patrol agent for the U.S. Border Patrol about exactly what's happening there, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:30:00]

CAMEROTA: Well, it is not stopping Joe Biden from talking about Barack Obama. Even if it's a one-way street, that seems to be something that Joe Biden likes to talk a lot about in the campaign trail. Guys, thank you very much for all the analysis.

BERMAN: And you can see Chris Cuomo's full interview for former Vice President Joe Biden tonight on "Cuomo Prime Time." That's at 9:00 p.m. eastern.

CAMEROTA: We do have breaking news because Iran announcing that it is enriching uranium at a higher level than the one set by the 2015 nuclear deal. Tehran is also releasing of an Iranian oil tanker seized by Royal Marines. CNN's Nic Robertson is live in Gibraltar with the latest. Nic?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Alisyn, what the Iranians have announced today is a double whammy, if you will. They have now gone above the agreed threshold, the level of enrichment that they could do to uranium. It was set at 3.67 percent. They have now announced they have gone above 4.5 percent.

But why do I say this is a double whammy? Because not only have they gone above the enrichment that the nuclear deal allowed them to do, they are also stockpiling more of the enriched uranium. Why is that important? Because the greater the enrichment you have, the greater amount of enriched uranium you have, then the closer you are to making a bomb. They are still a longways away from that. They would have to have 90 percent enriched uranium with which to make that weapon, but they are raising the stakes. And they say in 60 more days they may raise them more.

The tanker we're talking about is this here, the Grace 1. The Iranians say it's their tanker, it's filled with their oil. They're demanding that the British government and the Gibraltar authorities here release it immediately. They're calling it piracy.

But the Gibraltar authorities here say, not so fast. This was a ship, they believe, full of crude oil on its way to Syria. And they say that was breaking E.U. sanctions, which is why they detained it and why it's still here.

There are British Naval vessels patrolling this area, keeping it secure. But Iran is now saying that if the British don't release this, then potentially they could capture a British vessel in the Strait of Hormuz, and we know how tense things are there right now.

The Iranian shot down a U.S. drone there recently, as well as attacking a number of oil tankers. So all of this, the nuclear deal, this oil tanker -- it's all fueling tensions with Iran. And this situation is a standoff and it's not going away soon -- John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Every move precarious here these next few days. Nic Robertson for us in Gibraltar. Thank you so much, Nic.

So now, World Cup champions, the U.S. soccer team may face an even greater challenge off the field. One of the games all-time greats joins us next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:20:17] BERMAN: This morning, they're not done yet. The U.S. Soccer team won the World Cup but that might be just the beginning. Their next battle, it is already on.

Joining us now, one of the all-time greats, two-time World Cup champion Michelle Akers. She was on the 1991 and 1999 World Cup championship teams, also one of my personal favorite soccer players ever. So it's an honor to get to speak with you.

I'm sure you were as overjoyed as the rest of us when you watched the U.S. team win yesterday, but perhaps for you, even more meaning because these women, they grew up idolizing you.

MICHELLE AKERS, TWO-TIME WORLD CUP CHAMPION: Thanks, John, you're one of my favorites, too. And now, I feel even older than I am. Because so many of them, the parents talked to some of my teammates that were there and friends and at the game and the parents were saying thank you to my teammates, because the team inspired their daughters and so like hearing that just made me cry even more.

I was crying all day yesterday. So God, it was such a great tournament for our stars and it's not just about only winning the World Cup, there's so much more about this tournament and this USA team and that's what makes it more exciting for me, too.

BERMAN: They set the bar so high for themselves on and off the field, and they met that bar and to prove your point that it was more than just about a game. At the end of the game in France, no less just listen what they were chanting in the stands. I want to play this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: (Chanting "Equal Pay.")

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: "Equal pay," they were chanting in France in the stands for the U.S. team. What does that tell you, Michelle about how broad and how far their message is going?

AKERS: It means you know more change is coming and that we're not going to be ignored, you know, daughters and moms and sisters. Everybody wants equality and now the entire world is kind of understanding what's at stake and soccer being the world sport is the perfect venue.

And this team, the way the USA played and won and persevered and handled so much pressure and other issues and drama going on around the World Cup. It just really held their message true. Equal pay equal opportunity.

And yes, it's about playing you know, football, soccer, and equal opportunity to develop as players and as teams around the world, but it's more equality off the field as well. And from the chant, you can see, it as a powerful message.

BERMAN: What's the problem? Why has this taken so long? Why is this even difficult for U.S. soccer, do you think to make this happen?

AKERS: I know. I was going to ask you the same thing. And it's not just U.S. soccer, it's prevalent in -- you know, it's prevalent in the U.S. It's prevalent in other sports and in business, you know, every walk of life.

I don't know. I talk about it with my son all the time. And what do you think? It's a no brainer to me why wouldn't it all be the same across the board.

BERMAN: Let me play what Megan Rapinoe thinks about it, since I think her opinion over these last few days has perhaps been more important than anyone else's. Let's listen to what she said after the win.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MEGAN RAPINOE, U.S. WOMEN'S NATIONAL SOCCER TEAM PLAYER: I think everyone is ready for this conversation to move to the next step. I think we're done with, are we worth it? Should we have equal pay? Is it you know -- is the markets the same? Yes, yes, everyone is done with that.

I mean, we put on as all players, I'm saying every player at this World Cup put on the most incredible show that you could ever ask for. We can't do anything more.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: We're done making the case. Megan Rapinoe says we made the case. We need to move forward beyond that. And to me, one of the most iconic images of this entire World Cup was in the semis after she scored that PK, actually it wasn't in the semis, it would have been the quarterfinals, you know, playing semis, this image right there of Megan Rapinoe just saying, "Here I am, world. Look at what we're doing. Look at what we're saying."

And I wonder if we're going to start seeing some silhouette of this the way we've seen the Michael Jordan dunk over the years if this is an image that will last forever. AKERS: Yes, that -- I mean, she and she's a controversial figure,

right? She is -- gosh, social media is blowing up. Trump, you know, tweeted out at her.

[08:25:08] AKERS: And, you know, people kind of get ticked off about some of the things she says but -- and I don't necessarily agree with everything she says, however, I love the fact that she is speaking out and she is going for more.

It's not necessarily only about Megan Rapinoe, it's about her team. It's about the state of soccer. It's about our country and the culture around the world. And she is totally right.

It's done, right? Like they've shown, they've proved -- we've proven. So let's get on about talking about this conversation and how are we going to make the changes and when. I love that. I love how she has been speaking.

BERMAN: You went to the White House twice in 1991 and 1999, I believe, with the World Cup champion teams. Megan Rapinoe says she won't go if she's invited. Would you go if you were part of this team, and the President invited you?

AKERS: Actually I've been to the White House in 1991 and 1999. I was so beat up after that World Cup, I was having surgery. I didn't, I didn't get to go to the White House.

But you know, I would. I would, because I'd want to be with my team. So that for me would be my choice. But you know, people do different things and it changes. It changes regardless of I think the personal way you choose to do things.

It creates the conversation and I think that's what so -- what I love so much about how she is doing this is she is creating a conversation and that's important.

BERMAN: One of the things we often ask after an athlete wins something like a World Cup or two, in your case is what do you do next? And whenever we talk to you, we see this beautiful horse barn behind you here and you have chosen to take care of these beautiful animals. Explain to us what you're doing.

AKERS: Yes, well, I mean, winning a World Cup or two, or now for, for USA, right? A lot of celebrating afterwards. And then you know what? Life goes on. You kind of, you know, step on the next step. And for me, I have a son and I'm a mom and I love animals and had the opportunity to have horses which was my dream as a kid.

And so now, I'm rescuing them and helping other rescues and sanctuaries take care of these horses who have a lot of needs. So yes, this is my place and it's my heart and it's the best ever and I got to sit here on my farm and watch the team win the World Cup yesterday and then come out and, and clean horse poop after. It was the best ever.

BERMAN: It sounds like a great day, at least the first half. It sounds like a great day. Michelle Akers.

AKERS: Yes.

BERMAN: Thank you so much for being with us this morning. An honor again to speak with you.

AKERS: Thanks, John.

BERMAN: Alisyn?

ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: She said you were one of her favorites. That's what I heard that all time.

BERMAN: I have such vivid memories. She was so good. She was so good. If no one has seen it, check out YouTube. Watch Michelle Akers dominate the game in the air and on the ground scoring goals. One of the all-time leading U.S. goal scorers. She is amazing.

CAMEROTA: That's awesome. I'm so glad you got a chance to speak to her. Okay, President Trump now says he wants to show the migrant detention centers to the press to counter these reports of dirty conditions and overcrowding.

We will talk to a chief patrol agent for the U.S. Border Patrol about exactly what's happening there, next.

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