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HALA GORANI TONIGHT
Second Democratic 2020 Debate Preview; Live Coverage Of Trump Press Conference; Two Americans Imprisoned Following Police Stabbing; Democrats Battle To Win Back Michigan From Trump; Trump Stokes Racial Divisions Ahead Of CNN Debates; 100-Plus Million People Impacted By Capital One Data Breach; Palestinian Brewery Shows Cracks In Trump's Peace Plan. Aired 2-3p ET
Aired July 30, 2019 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:22] HALA GORANI, CNN INTERNATIONAL HOST: Hello, everyone. Live from CNN London, I'm Hala Gorani.
Tonight, the stage is set. The Democratic presidential hopefuls will face off in a CNN debate within a few hours. Several of them are arriving this
hour. We'll show you which ones took a tour of the stage.
And the alleged murder weapon and new footage of the suspects, the latest details from an Italian murder investigation that has captured the world's
And later, Donald Trump sends his special envoy for hostage affairs to Sweden to get A$AP Rocky back as soon as possible.
Just hours from now, it is showtime and the stakes couldn't be higher for the presidential candidates. They are fighting for their political
survival, some of them. We're counting down to the second Democratic debate. It is in Detroit, Michigan, and will be seen around the world on
There are so many candidates that we've broken it up into two rounds. These contenders will take the stage tonight -- you see them there -- there
are 10 of them.
TEXT: CNN "DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL DEBATES," Tonight, 8:00 p.m. Eastern, Life from Detroit: Marianne Williamson; Tim Ryan; Amy Klobuchar; Pete
Buttigieg; Bernie Sanders; Elizabeth Warren; Beto O'Rourke; John Hickenlooper; John Delaney; Steve Bullock
GORANI: The big match-up could be between Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren, though others will be closely watched as well, including Pete
Buttigieg and Beto O'Rourke.
Now, with a field this crowded, it is critical to have a standout moment. So what should we expect? And what will the big topics and themes be?
Let's take you right to Arlette Saenz at the debate venue, where candidates are now doing their walk-throughs on stage. And we're also joined by
Jeremy Diamond at the White House.
So, Arlette, what should we expect tonight? What will the big themes and topics be for the candidates?
ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Well, Hala, we've had a few of the candidates already do their walk-throughs through this debate stage,
getting a lay of the land for how things are going to look tonight. You have Marianne Williamson, Elizabeth Warren, and Bernie Sanders, all doing
their walk-throughs with the stage.
But as you mentioned, there are going to be some major face-offs and match- ups in this -- on this debate stage. Not just between personalities, but also based on policy.
Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, being one of those match-ups, the two have talked about how they are good friends and their teams say not to
expect any fireworks between the two of them, but they both appeal to that progressive voter. And you're going to hear them make -- while they agree
on many things ideologically, you're going to hear them start to make some of those small differences clear between each other.
Now, on the policy front, this is shaping up to be a moderate versus progressive night. So you're going to have Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth
Warren, right there in the middle. And there other candidates like Amy Klobuchar, John Hickenlooper, John Delaney, really trying to make that more
of a moderate appeal on one issue relating to health care.
So you should expect, there's going to be a vibrant debate over Medicare for all, which Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren back, and you're going
to hear some push-back from moderates, trying to make their case on that.
But as you mentioned, it's also a critical moment for so many on that stage who, a lot of Americans may not know who these candidates are --
SAENZ: -- if you look at the outskirts of that stage. You have Marianne Williamson, Tim Ryan, Governor Steve Bullock, who's making his first
appearance on the debate stage. These moments, these candidates really trying to find these breakout moments so that they are relevant in the
debate. So much at stake for these candidates, and we'll find out how this all plays out in just a few hours.
GORANI: Thanks very much, Arlette.
And, Jeremy, we heard from the president about whether or not he'd be watching this debate. This is what he told reporters.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think right now, it will be Sleepy Joe. I think. I feel he'll limp across the line.
I think he's off his game by a lot. But I think -- personally, I think it's going to be Sleepy Joe.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: So, Jeremy, clearly he still sees Biden as the main competition here.
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, be absolutely does. And we know that many of the president's advisors are also concerned about the
prospect of Joe Biden becoming the Democratic nominee, particularly because they see him as the biggest threat to the president in three of the key
states in the industrial Midwest, where the president, you know, was re- elected in -- was elected in 2016, off of those states: Michigan, Pennsylvania, Wisconsin.
Those are the states where you have those blue-collar votes that Joe Biden would be much more able to appeal to than perhaps a more progressive
But at the same time, the president is keeping an eye on the rest of the field. You know, some advisors recently told me that during a recent
meeting he went around the room, asking who his advisors thought would come out of the Democratic primary, and different names were thrown around
beyond Joe Biden. Also Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris was mentioned by the chairwoman of the Republican National Committee.
TEXT: July 25-28, Quinnipiac University Poll Choice for Nominee, Dems/Dem- Leaning Voters: Biden, July 29, 34 percent, July 2, 22 percent; Warren, July 29, 15 percent, July 2, 14 percent; Harris, July 29, 12 percent, July
2, 20 percent; Sanders, July 29, 11 percent, July 2, 13 percent; Buttigieg, July 29, 6 percent, July 2, 4 percent; O'Rourke, July 29, 2 percent, July
2, 1 percent; Yang, July 29, 2 percent, July 2, 1 percent
[14:05:05] DIAMOND: But the president won't be the only one paying attention. His campaign apparatus and the Republican Party will also be
paying mind to the debate. I mean, really trying to pick out some of those key moments from the debate that they think they can use against whoever
the Democratic nominee eventually is.
And that is with the aim of painting all these Democratic candidates, ultimately, as too progressive, socialist, if -- in the words of the
president. Whether those charges actually stick or not remains to be seen.
But certainly, this is a Democratic primary where you have seen several candidates move to the left, and the president and his allies believe that
they can use that to their advantage.
GORANI: Jeremy Diamond at the White House, thanks very much.
Now, the candidates have to walk a fine line. They need to appeal to their party's base to win the nomination of the Democratic Party, but also they
can't lose sight of the broader group of Americans who will vote in the general election. Let's bring in Jen Psaki to talk more about what the
candidates need to accomplish tonight. She served as deputy press secretary in Barack Obama's White House.
Thanks for being with us. What do candidates at this stage --
JENNIFER PSAKI, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thanks, Hala.
GORANI: -- because there are still 20 candidates, what do they need to do to stand out?
PSAKI: Well, I think, Hala, for any of the candidates, they should take a page out of Kamala Harris' playbook from the first debate. And I don't
mean going after Joe Biden necessarily. What I mean is finding a way to introduce your biography, your background, the reason you're fighting --
how and why you'd fight for the American people, into our answers.
You know, after that debate, people went and they googled "Kamala Harris" because they wanted to know more. That's what a number of these candidates
who have issues with name recognition, who may have their last shot on a national stage tonight, need to do tonight. They need to answer the
question for people watching at home, "Why are you running? Why are you better than the opponent -- your opponents on the stage? And why should I
want to know more about you?"
GORANI: Should they focus -- or will they focus -- on Trump? Because we know that if you're a Democrat, 2016 was a huge shock to the system. And a
lot of Democrats are going to want to pick the candidate they believe will beat Donald Trump. Or should they focus more on the issues that are
important to their base voters?
PSAKI: You know, I think at this stage in the game, they're going to have to focus more on the issues than Donald Trump. It is ultimately about
picking the best candidate to run against Donald Trump. But there are some important debates about issues like Medicare for all, about issues like
education, about the economy that these candidates need to and will have on stage. And there are some real differences between them.
Now, I do think there are moments where they can take a unifying approach to an answer. They have lots of contrasts. But if they're asked about
race and the last couple of days of race-baiting that President Trump has done, if I were advising a candidate, I would say they should use that as a
moment of unity. To say, "Anyone on this stage would help unite the country and help bring an end to this racist rhetoric coming from the White
So they have to look for their moments, but I expect all of them will focus more on drawing contrasts with each other, on policy issues than they will
on completely going after Donald Trump. Because a lot of them need to survive past today and past the September debate.
GORANI: And I noticed last debate, foreign policy didn't really make it into the debate, which I found interesting because there are huge foreign
policy challenges for America, North Korea, Iran, Brexit, the E.U., trade deals, China. And yet that didn't make it. Why not? And will it, this
PSAKI: You know, Hala, that's so true. And I think there is a place for foreign policy as an important issue for these candidates to discuss. I
mean, there's almost no area of policy focus where the commander in chief has more control without Congress than foreign policy.
And on issues like North Korea and China and trade, there are differences among the candidates but there are certainly differenced with Donald Trump,
and I think the American people need to be able to decide if somebody's ready to be commander in chief.
So will it come up? I think there are candidates who are on the stage, like Tulsi Gabbard, who had the moment in the first debate where she kind
of had the back-and-forth and got the better of Tim Ryan on Afghanistan.
I've watched Mayor Pete Buttigieg this week introduce more and really focus on his military background. He's someone who I think would be eager to
talk about some foreign policy issues. So we'll see how the candidates introduce it themselves, as issues that they would be better on than their
opponents. I think some of them, it would be wise to do that.
GORANI: Right. Although Tulsi Gabbard has been quite criticized for her, certainly, charitable judgment or assessment of the Assad regime.
At what point do candidates drop out after this? Is this, for some candidates, the last kind of chance before they have to accept the reality
that they won't move forward?
PSAKI: For some of them, yes. I mean, my view is that if you don't make the September debate -- and a number of them are not currently on track to
do that, which is getting 2 percent in four polls and doubling the number of low-dollar grassroots donors you need -- and if you're a serious person
and a serious candidate, then you shouldn't continue in the race. I would advise them not to.
[14:10:12] There are some candidates that are not in elective office, and have nothing to really lose, like an Andrew Yang or a Marianne Williamson.
If they don't make the debate stage -- and Andrew Yang very much is on track to, in all likelihood -- then they may stay in the debate. But I
still expect we'll see a number of candidates potentially drop out between now and September, if they don't make the September debate stage.
GORANI: All right, we'll be watching. Thanks so much, Jen Psaki.
And we'll have more on the Democratic debates, coming up in Detroit this hour, including a member of President Trump's Hispanic Advisory Council.
Find out what the Trump 2020 camp is watching for in these debates.
And I also urge you to head to CNN.com/Politics. We have a guide to where each of the Democratic candidates stands on the issues. If you're
interested in just a few candidates, you can click on them or you can see where all the candidates fall on gun control for instance, health care,
immigration, all of the key issues.
There are 20 of them. Some of them are not household names, so it could be interesting to go on .com and check that out.
Now, this story that has captivated the world, as I was saying at the top of the hour. Prosecutors in Italy are moving forward with their
investigation of two very young American young men, teens, in fact, accused of killing, repeatedly stabbing an Italian police officer. Authorities are
releasing new details about the incident, which they say started over a botched drug deal.
CNN's Isa Soares has more.
ISA SOARES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These are CCTV pictures obtained by the Italian media, showing the two Americans running
through the streets of Rome in the early hours of Friday morning.
Finnegan Elder and Natale-Hjorth, running with a knapsack they allegedly had just stolen after a botched drug deal. And they were headed to their
FRANCESCO GARGANO, CHIEF OF ROME CARABINIERI (through translator): We examined the CCTV footage of both Trastevere and the road the fugitives
took to the Hotel Meridien. And by comparing them, we managed to identify these two Americans.
SOARES (voice-over): The case has sparked outrage in Italy, the killing of a police officer, a rare event.
Italian authorities, now giving their first public statement on the circumstances that led to the stabbing of Officer Mario Cerciello Rega, and
how they're confident about the circumstances of the crime and the motives of the suspects.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): They were after money and drugs. We have clear elements indicating that.
SOARES (voice-over): The head of the Carabinieri in Rome explained how Elder and Hjorth arranged to immediately meet the owner of the knapsack,
who had called his own phone that was in the bag. They would return the knapsack, they said, for a gram of cocaine and a hundred euros. But the
owner also called the police.
Cerciello and his partner were already in the area, working undercover in plainclothes, and were sent to the meeting place.
GARGANO (through translator): And as soon as they identified themselves as Carabinieri, they were unexpectedly and immediately --
GORANI: All right. We'll have more on this story later. Donald Trump is speaking at the White House. He's addressing a range of issues. Let's
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: -- very important moment, 400 years. So I appreciate very much, the Democrats. We had great
I guess I saw you. You only covered the protest, the one protest. But Jamestown, I thought, was fantastic. And it was treated, really, I think -
- and I have to, I -- obviously thank the Republicans, but I also thank the Democrats. We had one person and other than that, it was really fantastic,
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What do you think about the Brazilian president (ph) appointing (ph) his son to be the ambassador in the U.S.?
TRUMP: Well, I know his son. I find his son to be outstanding. He's a brilliant, wonderful young man. I'm very happy, he appointed him. I think
it's a great appointment. I know his son, and that's probably why they did it. He's outstanding. I'm very happy with that appointment.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't you think (INAUDIBLE) nepotism (ph)?
TRUMP: No, I don't think it's nepotism because his son helped him very much in the campaign. His son is outstanding, he really is. So I think
it's a great appointment. I didn't know that.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: (INAUDIBLE) the White House?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do (ph) you (ph) (INAUDIBLE) reaching out to the White House to --
TRUMP: A lot of people. Many, many people. And you see it also in the press, and you see it on -- watching television, just coming back. People
living in Baltimore are very happy that I'm bringing out the fact that it's like living in hell.
What do you want, John (ph)?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President, the protestor (ph) difficult (ph) (INAUDIBLE), standing (ph) in front (ph) of (ph) (INAUDIBLE). My question
TRUMP: No, no. The only problem, John (ph). You gave the protestor a hundred percent of the time. And it's -- I don't care about coverage. The
last thing I need is coverage.
[14:15:04] UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) won't (ph) stop (ph).
TRUMP: But, listen, hey, John (ph). A hundred percent, not one word of the speech. And, you know, we were there about the speech. The protestor
didn't look so good to me. I'm going to be very nice. But you have him a hundred percent. But you know what, that's OK. You often do that, that's
OK. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President, the question I wanted to ask was, what would the political strategy (ph) (INAUDIBLE), a lot of debate --
TRUMP: What are you talking about, by political strategy? Are you talking with respect to Elijah Cummings?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm talking about your (ph) attacks (ph) against (ph) Elijah (ph) Cummings (ph), (INAUDIBLE) --
TRUMP: There's no strategy. I have no strategy. There's zero strategy. All it is is, I'm pointing out facts. The most unsafe city in the country,
in our country is Baltimore. It's received as much money, it's -- it receives top of the line, billions of dollars. Somebody said, $15 billion
over a short period of time. All of this money goes there, and take a look at it. I don't have to describe it, take a look at it.
So there's no strategy. It's very simple. And Elijah Cummings is in charge of it. And he ought to take his Oversight Committee, and he ought
to park them in Baltimore and find out what happened to the $15 billion. And a lot of other money.
GORANI: All right. President Donald Trump, there on the South Lawn, just returning from a trip to Virginia, saying that people in Baltimore are very
happy about his comments, when he tweeted out that no human would want to live in Baltimore. I'm sure that people in Baltimore would beg to differ.
Also, saying -- and doubling, tripling, quadrupling down on his initial comments, saying that living in Baltimore is like living in hell. We'll
have more on that -- in fact, as I told you earlier, we have a Donald Trump supporter and a member of his re-election committee, joining us on the
program in about 15 minutes.
Let's get back to that story in Italy with those two American teens accused of repeatedly stabbing an unarmed police officer over, we believe
potentially, a botched drug deal. Isa Soares has been following this story and she joins me now with more.
And I saw the picture today, which was released by authorities, of the knife --
GORANI: -- that the -- the alleged murder weapon.
SOARES: And it's a seven-inch knife --
SOARES: -- which Finnegan Elder, who is the 19-year-old, admitted to killing the police officer, stabbing him 11 times: colon, stomach
intestine, piercing all those, all the way to the spine, this is what we heard from the prosecutor.
This weapon, he said, came from the United States. He brought it from the United States, on his way. This is what Elder, Finnegan Elder actually
We don't know how he did it, but what he did say is, he killed him in self- defense. He said the police officer approached him, put his hands around his neck, almost trying to suffocate him, and then he acted in self-
The prosecutor spraying cold water on this was a "Stabbing him 11 times, that is not self-defense." Adding, in addition, that there were no marks
around his neck to suggest that.
Now, both Finnegan Elder as well as Natale, the 18-year-old, both have said that two police officers who approached them did not say they were
Carabinieri, did not say they were police officers. They were in plainclothes, did not say that.
Police, prosecutors saying a very -- telling us a very different story, Hala. So -- and what we've seen and what we've heard from prosecutors,
these two individuals who were friends from high school, being kept in a prison in Rome, notorious prison in Rome, in separate cells. And what
we've heard is that they're turning on each other --
SOARES: Natale's saying that he had no idea that Elder actually was carrying the knife. What we do know is that they ran, then, to the hotel
room and they hid the knife under the ceiling tile.
SOARES: And at that point, it had been cleaned.
GORANI: And there was some CCTV footage, as well, released --
GORANI: -- of them running away?
SOARES: And that -- what we saw -- what we've seen that today, police, prosecutors saying that they used that CCTV image to prove, to show,
connect the dots that they were involved. But they ran with the rucksack to the hotel. The hotel, from the scene where the police stopped them, it
was something like 80 (ph) meters so it was very, very close.
But lots of questions. One was, why exactly was a Carabinieri, the one who was stabbed 11 times, why was he not carrying his gun? He was off-duty.
If he was off-duty -- his (ph) day had just finished --
GORANI: Yes, yes.
SOARES: -- why wasn't he carrying his gun? Why did he get sent to the area --
SOARES: -- when we were told the four other patrol teams were there? So I think this is the beginning. But we know that they could be held up to a
year if no charges are put (ph). So six months, or a year.
GORANI: My question is, where are the parents? So we'll see if we hear from them.
GORANI: Isa, thanks very much.
[14:19:56] Isa Soares. Still to come tonight, another legal case involving an American abroad. It's the court case in Sweden that has grabbed
attention internationally, and all the way up to the Oval Office. The first day of rap star A$AP Rocky's trial is coming up. We'll be right
GORANI: The trial of A$AP Rocky got under way today in Sweden with a "Not guilty" plea from the rapper. The case has gotten international attention,
with U.S. President Donald Trump voicing support for the rap star.
A$AP Rocky is accused of assault in a June street brawl. Nina dos Santos is following that trial. And similarly to the case of Italy, we also have
footage, street footage of at least part of what happened involving the rapper.
NINA DOS SANTOS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Pretty alarming things here, I have to say. No knives involved. In fact, the supposed weapon, according
to the prosecution here, was a broken glass bottle.
But let's go back to the events that this case is centered on. So we saw A$AP Rocky and two members of his five-strong entourage, who were walking
down the streets in Stockholm on June the 30th, appear in court today. They've been in custody since July the 3rd.
They pled not guilty to charges of serious assault. This involves a street brawl that took place when allegedly, according to Swedish prosecutors,
they attacked a 19-year-old Afghan man who'd recently moved to Sweden.
Now, the reason why A$AP Rocky and his defense team claim that they deny any wrongdoing here is, they say that they -- yes, they did throw him to
the ground and they did stand on his arm -- A$AP Rocky did -- but that was to try and restrain this individual, and to keep him away from their
entourage because he had already allegedly attacked their security guard.
The prosecutors showed CCTV evidence that seemed to paint a slightly different picture, but let's just have a quick listen to the lawyer of A$AP
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SIOBODAN JOVICIC, LAWYER FOR A$AP ROCKY: He is living under dark cloud of this trial. And like always, like every trial, I can have my opinion. But
in the end, it's the court who will decide. So the future is -- I mean, very unknown to him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
DOS SANTOS: So that's A$AP Rocky's defense lawyer there, talking about his state of mind. He's been in Sweden, in custody since July the 3rd.
A$AP Rocky's mother was also in court today. A$AP Rocky himself was wearing a standard-issue prison jumpsuit, a green top and trousers. He
appeared quite calm, according to court reporters.
But his mother appeared really distressed --
DOS SANTOS: -- she said that she was living a nightmare as a result of this case.
GORANI: And the Trump administration has sent a hostage negotiator?
DOS SANTOS: This was the strangest bit about what we saw. In fact, reporters and, indeed, our person inside the courtroom, noticed early on
the presence of a U.S. lawyer, but couldn't really figure out who they were.
Upon approaching him later on, it emerged that a certain Robert C. O'Brien was actually the U.S. president, Donald Trump's, hostage negotiator who's
been attending these trials. And his word to CNN was that he was there to support the members of the family and the American citizens. But he'd been
told to -- that the U.S. president wants A$AP Rocky and the two codefendants back in the United States.
[14:25:12] Now, the president has made no secret of the fact that he believes that they should be released. He's taken to Twitter to campaign
for this message. He's also made telephone calls to the prime minister of Sweden, Stefan Lofven, vouching for them if they were to go on bail.
Sweden doesn't actually have a bail system, so they can't release him and they deemed them a flight risk. The trial will continue --
GORANI: Y es.
DOS SANTOS: -- over Thursday and Friday --
GORANI: So we should get a verdict at that point?
DOS SANTOS: We should. And they could be facing two years in jail.
GORANI: All right. Thanks so much, Nina.
Here in London, the Dubai ruler's estranged wife has been to a court in the United Kingdom. Princess Haya is applying for child custody and a forced
marriage protection order, according to Britain's press association.
She is the daughter of the late King Hussein of Jordan. She was educated in England, and she is involved in this dispute with the ruler of Dubai.
This is an image from her -- of her earlier today.
The pound is taking a tumble amid renewed fears that Britain will crash out of the E.U. without a deal. It's hovering around 1.21 against the U.S.
dollar after sliding to a new two-year low. The British government's talk of turbo-charging plans for a no-deal Brexit is not helping matters.
Richard Quest joins me now from New York with more.
How concerned are traders that the U.K. is serious about leaving the E.U. without a deal, something, really, a vast majority of economists, industry
and business leaders agree would be a disaster?
RICHARD QUEST, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: They simply don't know. And that's the reason why you're seeing this uncertainty.
With the Theresa May government, there had always been the view that most people said it was never going to happen. Yes, Brexit meant Brexit, but
the clear distinction was, she probably would not leave without a deal.
Boris Johnson's entire philosophy is, "I'd like a deal. But if I can't get one, we're going anyway." And that seriousness of purpose, that single-
mindedness of purpose has now set into the market.
Remember, all the indications, Hala, are that if the U.K. were to leave the E.U. without a deal, the pound could drop to 1.10, to 1.05 against the
dollar. We're some way off that at the moment, but that's the measure of risk that currently exists.
GORANI: So where will the pound go? I mean, if this is prolonged, we could be looking at, against the euro, for instance, parity here. We're at
QUEST: You're de facto parity anyway. I assure you --
QUEST: -- holiday makers, holiday makers going to the south of France and to Spain and to Greece are paying -- are getting less than (INAUDIBLE)
parity (ph) and beyond.
I think you're right. Look, we've got three months. October, the end of October the 31st is when the whole thing is supposed to come to an end. I
think as the negotiations get -- there's not much time here, Hala. Think about the European mentality --
GORANI: Yes, no.
QUEST: -- of summer vacations. Now, you add in the number of legislative days for parliament to effect a no-deal, the things that they would have to
do. And you add in the frenetic, fevered negotiating that would have to take place.
And you -- just to sprinkle on top of that noxious mixture, you add in the bellicose phrases from both sides, Boris saying the withdrawal agreement
has to go, the backstop can't survive. Even Leo Varadkar, the Taoiseach, today, saying there's no way we're getting rid of that. You can see why
this fervored atmosphere is causing such distress.
GORANI: Right. And Boris Johnson has decided that it's a better idea to tour the U.K. than speak with his interlocutors in the E.U. We saw him in
Scotland, we've seen him in Wales. So that's what he's doing, at least these last few days.
QUEST: I think that's probably right --
GORANI: Richard --
QUEST: -- hang (ph) on (ph), Hala --
GORANI: -- yes? Yes, yes.
QUEST: I think that's probably right. He's the new prime minister --
GORANI: With chickens.
QUEST: -- he's the new prime minister of the United Kingdom, probably his first duty is to visit the country he now rules.
GORANI: All right. Well, he's promising also to negotiate with the E.U., so at some point he's going to have to sit across the table from them.
Thank you and we'll see you at the top of the hour on "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS."
[14:29:29] Still to come tonight, all eyes are on Detroit tonight as the Democratic candidates get ready to debate. One man sure to watch is the
president. I'll speak to someone who knows Donald Trump well, a member of his 2020 re-election committee. We'll be right back.
[14:30:09] GORANI: More now on the second round of democratic presidential debate starting just hours from now and broadcast over two nights here on
It's no accident the debates are being held in Michigan, a state Donald Trump barely won in 2016. As Jeff Zeleny tells us, Democrats there have
varying ideas on how, just how to win it back.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The great state of Michigan.
JEFF ZELENY, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): There's a reason President Trump speaks so fondly of Michigan. He's the first
Republican presidential candidate to carry this date since 1988 and he's gunning for a repeat.
TRUMP: We're very tough to take out, are we? Very, very --
ZELENY: As Democratic hopefuls gather in Detroit for their second debate this week, there's little appetite for re-litigating Hillary Clinton's loss
in 2016, but the collapse of the blue wall of Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania, is a driving undercurrent of the 2020 race.
Here in Michigan, one number still seared into the minds of many Democrats, is 10,704. That's how many votes Trump defeated Clinton by.
GOV. GRETCHEN WHITMER (D-MI): We were all, kind of, in disbelief. And as we parse through what the numbers were, it was very clear that people
didn't turn out to vote. But that 10,000-plus votes that was the difference here in Michigan, was a very low turnout.
ZELENY: Gretchen Whitmer is the state's new Democratic governor, winning office last fall, as the party roared back in the midterm elections, she's
closely watching the party's crowded primary, saying the outcome will play a critical role in determining whether Michigan is still Trump country.
WHITMER: Between 2016 and 2018, we had a massive change in who showed up at the polls and the results speak for themselves. When the candidate
shows up and listens to people and stays focused on the dinner table issues, that's how you persuade people that you're worthy of their vote.
ZELENY (on-camera): Do you think any Trump voters from 2016 can be persuaded to vote Democratic in 2020 or are things so entrenched that it's
more about turning out the Democratic debates?
WHITMER: No, I think people can definitely be persuaded.
ZELENY (voice-over): But that is one of the essential questions framing the Democratic fight. Should the party choose a nominee acceptable to more
moderate Trump voters, by winning over those who supported Barack Obama but rejected Clinton, or should they find a candidate who electrifies the
That dynamic comes alive in Macomb County, just outside Detroit, one of the most carefully watched Obama to Trump battlegrounds. Ed Bruley is the
county's Democratic chairman who believes the answer is motivating voters who stayed away from the polls in 2016.
ED BRULEY, DEMOCRATIC CHAIRMAN, MACOMB COUNTY: I think there's too much fixation on this hybrid voter. And I think you need to really look at
those who went out to vote and chose not to vote for either candidate.
[14:35:02] ZELENY: In Macomb County, alone, Clinton received about 31,000 fewer votes than Obama. In neighboring Wayne County, which includes
Detroit, she received about 76,000 fewer votes than Obama.
GARLIN GILCHRIST, LIEUTENANT GOVERNOR OF MICHIGAN: I think it was a matter of turnout --
ZLENEY: Garlin Gilchrist, the state's new lieutenant governor, agrees that inspiring Democratic voters is key, but he also warns against complacency
and thinking Trump can't win again.
ZELENY (on-camera): Should Democrats take seriously the prospect of his re-election?
GILCHRIST: Absolutely, that's why he's president now, because his prospect of being elected the first time, was not taken seriously enough.
GORANI: That was Jeff Zeleny reporting.
President Trump spoke at an event today marking 400 years since the founding of a General Assembly in Jamestown, Virginia, the first colony in
what would become eventually the United States.
Virginia's black legislative caucus boycotted the appearance after the president's repeated criticism of the majority black city of Baltimore and
Congressman Elijah Cummings. Before leaving for Virginia, the president defended his stance.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: They are so happy at what I've been able to do in Baltimore and other democratic-run corrupt city, the money has been stolen. What they've
done -- it's been wasted and it's been stolen. Billions and billions of dollars and the African-American community is so thankful, they called me
and they said, finally, somebody is telling the truth.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Well, let's dig deeper into these president's latest offensive comments and the upcoming debates. Steve Cortes is a CNN political
commentator and he's a member of the Trump 2020 reelection committee and he joins me now live from Chicago.
Steve, how is it OK that the president is still saying things four days later like living in Baltimore is living in hell when he's become very
obvious he's offending millions of Americans with these tweets and comments?
STEVE CORTES, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, Hala, I think what he's actually doing is providing an important contrast and the contrast is the
indignation on the left, both by politicians of the Democratic Party and by most of the mainstream media in America. Their indignation when they look
at conditions on the border. Because they don't like the way in which United States is carrying for illegal migrant trespassers who came into our
country uninvited and un-vetted. When we contrast that --
GORANI: If you don't mind, they're not all illegal. Some of them are asylum seekers and you know this. I want to ask you about the tweets
themselves. These tweets have been called racists by people --
CORTES: OK. No, no, hold on. Hold on. They are illegal. They are illegal.
GORANI: But no, you're muddying the debates right out of the gate, and you know it.
CORTES: It's not legal to cross -- it's not legal - it's not legal to cross -- no, it's I'm not. It's not legal to cross at a non-port of entry
to seek asylum. So that's not true, they are illegal trespassers --
GORANI: I want to talk about the tweets now. I want to talk about the tweets.
CORTES: Right. And the tweets started with --
GORANI: So many has called them racists --
CORTES: -- and the tweets were a contrast --
GORANI: Why do you disagree?
CORTES: Because the tweets, what they did was highlighted the incredible contrast between the left that wants to care for non-Americans, illegal
trespassers across our border, and yet does not seem to prioritize American citizens who live an incredibly poor conditions, who lack hope, how lack
education. And in some cases who lack --
GORANI: Steve, those are not what the tweets said.
CORTES: Yes, it is. And in some cases they lack even --
GORANI: He was attacking Elijah Cummings.
CORTES: -- first-world standards of living. But he was attacking the conditions in Baltimore --
GORANI: He was attacking Elijah Cummings and he was calling people who live in Baltimore subhuman, by saying no human people would want --
CORTES: No, he was not, that's wrong. And by the way, no human does want to live in a ghetto, no human wants to live in a place that is infested
with rats. That is correct and true. And certainly no Americans should --
GORANI: Baltimore has a higher median household income than some Republican controlled districts. So I'm not sure where you get the entire
city is infested with rats.
CORTES: Sure. But as you well know -- I've never said that. Again, you're trying to create a strawman here saying the entire city is infested.
I didn't say that. Donald Trump didn't say that. That's not -- it's not a fair tactic.
However, there are parts of the city, which according to Bernie Sanders, not according to me, there are parts of the city which resembled the third-
world. It's interesting that we didn't see outrage when Bernie Sanders said that. And by the way, it was accurate when he said it.
We didn't see outrage then why? Because it came from the left. Now that it comes from Donald Trump, there's outrage among Democratic politicians
and their allies in the mainstream media, why? Because Donald Trump says it and suddenly it becomes racist even though he never mentioned race.
What I think is racist is consigning American citizens, particularly American children to live lives that are without hope, to live in dangerous
neighborhoods to go to failing schools as they do in Baltimore, as they do here in my city of Chicago, places that are completely controlled by the
I think they need to be called out, the Democrats, on their exploitation of minority communities in in this country. They want their votes, but they
don't want to help their communities.
GORANI: I think, Steve, if the president focused on poverty or focused on crime, equally. I think people might have a different opinion of these
tweets. But there are Republican controlled districts in America that are much poorer.
[14:40:01] St. Louis is a more violent city. One of the Congress people representing St. Louis is a Republican. Why is the president focusing time
and time again on district cities that are controlled or led by African- Americans or minorities, why?
CORTES: No, it's not about being African-American minority. BY the way, St. Louis is overwhelmingly democratic. Yes, there is a one Republican
representatives but when you talk about --
GORANI: Two Congress people represent St. Louis, one of them is a Republican. So that's a fact.
CORTES: When you talk about there being lower income in some Republican areas, yes, that is of course, true. But we also know that you have to
adjust for costs and costs are far higher in major cities and they are, for instance, in rural areas.
But the point here isn't that he's trying to pick on places that are black and brown. Quite the opposite. And I as Hispanic, I appreciate him doing
this. What he's saying is to a lot of minority American citizens, you've been exploited by the Democratic Party. They want your votes, but they
really frankly don't care what kind of conditions you live in.
And despite decades of failures, and cities of Baltimore and Chicago, they're unwilling to change. I think that's part of the key ingredient
here too. Is he's pointing out that these policies are not working. Policies of high taxation and big government and a government monopoly on
schools, a lack of school choice.
These policies are not working for black and brown citizens of America. And by shining a light on these failures, he is intrinsically hoping and
asking for solutions.
GORANI: Steve, let me share with you, you may have seen it, it's a Fox News poll on whether Americans believe Trump, the president respects racial
So a majority of whites and non-whites believe the president of the United States does not respect racial minorities. Even among whites, 52 percent
believe he is not respectful. Why do you think that is?
CORTES: Right. Well, listen, first of all, I'll be the first to say, we have work to do here. You know, I personally have work to do as a minority
who very much believes in his vision. I think the president has work to do here, because he does have to be president for all Americans.
But I will also say this that I think part of the reason for that, that poll is the fact that the mainstream media has repeated the smear, the
false narrative, the president is a narrative -- excuse me, the president is a racist. And even further that narrative to say all of his supporters
are racist which is something we're hearing far more often now regularly on newscasts and in prints.
So I think that there has been, unfortunately, some success by the mainstream media in pushing that smear.
GORANI: I'm not sure -- I have never heard anyone on the mainstream media as you call it, call all of Donald Trump's supporters racist. I don't know
where you heard that. I personally have not --
CORTES: OK. Well, I'll give you two -- I'll give you two examples. Joe Lockhart who's one of our colleagues, who works for this network, CNN, he
tweeted it out, I believe over the weekend, I retweeted it. And he said, "If you vote for Trump, you are a racist."
I'll give you another example. Donald Deutsch, who is a host on MSNBC, he would even further than racist. He said if you vote for Trump, you are a
Nazi. So actually, you're wrong on this mainstream media is right --
GORANI: Those are two commentators, by the way. They're not journalists working for news organizations. They're commentators and --
CORTES: Donald Deutsch is a host. No, you're wrong. Donald Deutsch is a host on MSNBC.
Look, I'm not wrong. My point is, you hear that he's a racist 24/7, nonstop, it's a fake news, false narrative. Unfortunately though, if you
repeat a lie often enough, sometimes it has an effect. And I do think it's had an effect.
Certainly that Fox News poll that is shows that it has, I hope that we can persuade minorities that that is not remotely the truth. I know the
president. I know it's not the truth.
And by the way, if he is a racist, as I often say, he's the worst racist in history because minorities are thriving in this country under the policies
of President Trump, and that's what I'm most concerned about, not polls, but things like wages, security, opportunity, all of that is expanding
massively for black and brown Americans under this president's leadership.
GORANI: And, Steve, I think it's the tweets go back to where you came from to those congresswomen. But we don't need to revisit that. They were
called racist and rightfully so, because I believe people who read that --
CORTES: I disagree with those too --
GORANI: -- who are first generation immigrants -- yes, who are immigrants, who are first generation or even second generation immigrants. It hurt
them to their core. This is the president of the United States, not the president of the party --
CORTES: I agree those words --
GORANI: -- and I think that for that reason, they felt extremely wounded and these are Americans.
CORTES: I agree that those were illogical. You don't tell Americans to go back. They're Americans, so I agree.
GORANI: Great. One quick last one. When you look at Donald Trump's Twitter feed and you see that he's tweeted 15 times about Baltimore but say
zero times about what's happened in Moscow with the potential poisoning of a Kremlin critic. Do you think that his priorities are correct here?
CORTES: Absolutely. Look, he's not the president of Russia. He's the president of the United States of America.
[14:45:02] GORANI: Yes.
CORTES: And he is not obliged to comment on atrocities all over the world. There's also, by the way, oppression and atrocities going on right now in
Hong Kong. I don't believe he's commented on that either. And I don't fault him for that.
You know, he is the president of the United States. As he often says, he's the president of Pittsburgh, not Paris. So I do not expect him to condemn
every offensive action by every government in the world.
I do expect him and I think it's wonderful that he's shining a light on problems here. And again, too, not just shining a light on the problem but
what is the solution, what are the next steps, how can we make life better for the children of Baltimore, for the children of Chicago.
And again, these are people who lived in democratic districts and democratic states who are unlikely to help him politically, but he's their
president, nonetheless. And so I think that it's important that he message to them and about them that we have solutions.
And by the way, here's the great news, things are getting better. Hispanic wages right now are rising massively faster than white wages for the first
time in a decade in this country. That's great news. I believe it's because of the benefits of the Trump boom of tax and regulatory relief. So
help isn't just on the way, help is here but we need more help.
GORANI: Yes. There is the huge economic expansion. Nobody is going to disagree with you on that.
Steve Cortes, thanks so much for joining us. Appreciate your time on the program this evening.
CORTES: Thank you.
GORANI: The banking giant, Capital One, is in damage control mode, following the revelation that it fell victim to a hacker. The massive data
breach exposed the personal information of more than 100 million people across the U.S. and Canada.
Now, it came to light Monday after the FBI arrested a 33-year-old woman.
Donie O'Sullivan joins me now from Washington with more.
Are Capital One users, should they be concerned that their information is out there somewhere?
DONIE O'SULLIVAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Hala, it's a huge breach, actually one of the biggest breaches in history, and Capital One is going to begin
informing its customers and also people who apply for credit cards with them in the coming weeks, whether they were affected. It's 100 million
Americans and six million people living in Canada.
Now, this all started back in March, and normally where we see hackers go through extraordinary lengths to hide their tracks and to conceal their
identities, not Paige Thompson, that's the suspect in this case. Who the FBI says was boasting on social media about being able to break in to
Capital One. She allegedly posted the information up on a data-sharing website, then went to Twitter and to other message forums which you can see
here where she's boasting about the information she had access to.
Somebody, eventually, saw that and alerted Capital One by e-mail earlier this month. Capital One started an investigation, and within 48 hours,
they alerted the FBI.
Now, one other interesting wrinkle to this is that the suspect in this case is a former Amazon employee. Now, most of us know Amazon for its online
shopping sites. But Amazon also has a massive business and cloud computing. Capital One was using Amazon's cloud. But Amazon says that
that has -- they are not to blame or not at fault here.
It does look like that the exploit that this suspect took advantage of was a misconfiguration of Capital One's own firewall. So Amazon not to blame,
but interesting wrinkle in that story.
GORANI: All right, Donie O'Sullivan, thanks very much.
Still to come tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MADEES KHOURY, GENERAL MANAGER, TAYBEH BREWING COMPANY: We need to resolve the political issue. We need to go back to negotiating and resolving the
political problems and then talk about the economy and economic solutions.
MICHAEL HOLMES, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: So when you heard that plan, what did you think?
KHOURY: I just brushed it off.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GORANI: Peace in the Middle East. President Trump thinks he has a plan to achieve it. He and his son-in-law think money holds the answer. The
Palestinian business owners say, not so fast.
[14:50:12] GORANI: The Trump administration is trying to bring peace to the Middle East with a financial plan. But our Michael Holmes travel to a
successful brewery where he learned that you can't run a business in the West Bank without coming up with against -- coming up against many
HOLMES (voice-over): The Taybeh Brewery in the West Bank is a Palestinian success story producing 600,000 liters a year shipped locally to Israel and
15 countries from Morocco to the U.S.
It's a family-owned enterprise started 25 years ago and now run by a second generation of Khoury family brewers. For all of those 25 years, the family
has negotiated myriad obstacles, just getting their brew to markets abroad.
HOLMES (on-camera): It's a windy day here in the West Bank, but we wanted to come up here to show you the water tank. Because one thing you cannot
make beer without is water. And water is always been a big issue in the West Bank. Israel controls the water supply. Taybeh Beer, like all
Palestinians, they get an allowance. Once that allowance runs out, that's it. You want more? You have to pay for a tank to ship it in.
KHOURY: At the moment in the summer time, that's when we feel the water shortage, that's when you want to brew more beer and that's when we have
water coming once a week.
HOLMES (voice-over): Under the 1995 Oslo II agreement, Israel retained ultimate control over water resources. But COGAT, the Israeli military
authority responsible for civilians in the West Bank, says the brewery is in a Palestinian controlled area and the Palestinian authorities are
responsible. In essence, when it comes to water issues, both sides blame the other.
The latest attempt to untangle the Israeli-Palestinian conflict took place in Bahrain a few weeks ago. The U.S. president's son-in-law, Jared
Kushner, unveiling an economic plan for Palestinians. One criticized by many for rehashing old ideas being vague about implementation and putting
off political solutions for later.
Madees Khoury and her family say, economic dreams are pointless without a political settlement first.
KHOURY: We need to resolve the political issue. We need to go back to negotiating and resolving the political problems and then talk about the
economy and economic solutions.
HOLMES: So when you heard that plan, what did you think?
KHOURY: I just brushed it off.
HOLMES: Instead of aid or vague investment promises, Madees Khoury says much could be achieved by the easing of Israeli restrictions, taxes, red
tape, rules and regulations, she says, are for Palestinians only.
The first roadblock, a literal one. The Israeli checkpoint between the West Bank and Israel.
KHOURY: If you would look at the map, you would see the distance between our town, Taybeh, to Haifa Port, which we used to export. On the map, it's
an hour and a half drive. In reality, it actually takes three days if everything moves smoothly which it never does.
HOLMES: Israel's COGAT says those claims are, "not consistent with reality." The checkpoint transit times for goods are down to an average 90
minutes and further improvements of plan.
The Khourys disagreed. But back in Taybeh, the family will continue to brew and wait. Their business, a microcosm of the broader economic hurdles
that confront the Palestinian economy. Hurdles that Khoury family say won't be cleared without there being that political settlement. Something
that looks more remote now than ever before. Although Madees' father, Nadim, is the eternal optimist.
NADIM KHOURY, OWNER, TAYBEH BREWING COMPANY: Someday, we will be free. We have high hope in the future. Nothing left for us except the high hope.
HOLMES: Michael Holmes, CNN, Taybeh in the West Bank.
[14:55:02] GORANI: And we will be right back.
GORANI: Well, the debates in Detroit are bringing renewed attention to the water crisis in Flint. This is the stage in Detroit, Michigan where 10
candidates will be making an appearance tonight, 10 more tomorrow.
But Flint is an hour's drive north of Detroit. And five years now after it started, many Flint residents don't believe the government's promise that
their drinking water is safe. So they are still lining up to get bottled water.
This has not gone unnoticed by the candidates. A few already have made stops in Flint including Beto O'Rourke who called the possibility of led
tainted water a life or death issue.
Once again, don't miss those debates. They'll be live on CNN. Coverage begins at 8:00 P.M. Eastern in the United States. And you can see encore
presentations at 7:00 A.M. in London, 2:00 P.M. in Hong Kong. That's for Wednesday and Thursday on CNN.
And finally, we are so much about a wall along America's border with Mexico. And we're likely to hear more about it and the barrier in those
debates. But on Monday, two college professors from the U.S. decided to turn the fence on that border into something fun and kind of sad to -- they
installed a series of seesaw or teeter-totters so children from one side could play with children on the other.
The professors first came up with the idea a decade ago and wanted to show that actions on one side of border have consequences on the other.
Thanks you for watching tonight. I'm Hala Gorani, "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is next.