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ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT
New Video Shows Dayton Gunman As He Launches Attack; Death Toll Rises To 31 In El Paso, Dayton Mass Shootings; Police: Shooter Took Up To 11 Hours To Travel To El Paso; Got Lost, Found Wal-Mart Because "He Was Hungry". Aired 7-8p ET
Aired August 5, 2019 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN HOST: ... once again to mourn the victims and honor their legacy. May they rest in peace and may their memories be a blessing. Erin Burnett OUTFRONT starts right now.
ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: OUTFRONT next, the breaking news, new surveillance video tonight of the seconds just before a heavily armed gunman open fire killing nine people. Also breaking, police just holding a press conference on the mass shootings in El Paso, Texas. New details about why the gunman may have picked Wal-Mart as the target. And lifelong Republican lawmakers slamming his own party tonight saying Republicans are enabling white supremacy in America. Why is he speaking out now. He is my guest. Let's go out front.
And good evening. I'm Erin Burnett. OUTFRONT tonight, the breaking news, we have new surveillance video tonight from one of the two mass shootings. This from Dayton, Ohio, where a gunman killed nine people including his own sister. This is the death toll rises today, 31 people now confirmed dead in the mass shootings in El Paso, Texas and in Dayton, Ohio happening within hours of each other.
So what you see at the top of your screen is the gunman dressed in black with a bulletproof vest, emerging from an alley just as he was about to open fire. And then within a second, we'll show you this next part, complete chaos as people start running for cover, ducking under those tables you can see. Police say they found as many as 41 shell casings from the gunman's weapon.
Now, this surveillance video showing the gunman then as he was being shot by police. They responded within 20 seconds of his first shot. Tonight, police chasing down one lead after another. Right now desperately looking for a motive to understand what happened in Dayton, Ohio or whether this was also a domestic terror and a hate crime. We have a lot of questions as we are starting to get some more information on this at this hour.
We are also learning there were warning signs, one classmate telling CNN that the gunman had a hit list of people that he wanted to kill or hurt and a rape list for girls. Another telling CNN that he reported that list to law enforcement. We're going to go on the ground to Dayton in just a couple of moments. A porter are breaking some new details on this, as we await that I want to go straight to Juliette Kayyem who was Assistant Secretary for the Department of Homeland Security under President Obama and Jonathan Wachrow, CNN Law Enforcement Analyst.
We're going to go to the ground in just a moment, Jonathan, but let me just play this exclusive new video. It's grainy, but you see Betts at the top of the screen. He's hunched over. He's moving. We have him sort of highlighted there between those two umbrellas. It's a packed area. He only had one minute to shoot in that time. He also murdered his own sister. What does that tell you about how important she may be in all of this?
JONATHAN WACHROW, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Well, listen, again we don't know what the motive is. We don't know if this is an active targeted violence targeting her, her friends, is this something that the individual felt marginalized, potentially. I mean, they were together just prior to this.
So figuring out what the motive was is unclear. The intent is very clear. He had the clear intent by his action to cause as much harm and destruction. There absolutely was some level of pre planning. How long that took? Just by the weapons platform, the amount of ammunition that he had on him, wearing a ballistic vest shows a level of pre planning and that is really disturbing for law enforcement.
BURNETT: Extremely disturbing because it happened without anyone knowing about it, whether they could have or not, I mean there's more to be learned. Phil Mudd is also with us, former FBI Senior Intelligence Advisor. Juliette, let me ask you though, about the sister, could this end up being very significant, her role in this?
JULIETTE KAYYEM, FORMER ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY: Oh, absolutely. I mean, it's just not a coincidence. I think it sort of defies logic to believe that one of the 10 dead would happened to be his sister. So something happened, there was some triggering event, but I just want to make it clear that he had a choice if he wanted to kill his sister, if this was an issue of family violence or sexism or rage against women and he could have done it at home, presumably, he knew where she worked.
This was a choice to make a public statement and so as someone who's been through these cases before, what I'm looking for in terms of motivation is what was that public statement and then that's when it becomes relevant. Who is the boyfriend? What kind of club was this? Why the eight of the 10 other victims were African-American.
So I've got lots of questions around his motivation and the sister, so this was not just family violence. He wanted to make a point very, very quickly.
BURNETT: Right, he certainly did and, obviously, as you point out there is a lot that can indicate that this was a hate crime and domestic terror much like we saw in El Paso. There's a lot of questions about that now. Phil, we are learning tonight the police knew about an alleged kill list that the Dayton shooter had in high school.
[19:05:05] Two of the classmates on that list called police, one of them saw him being detained by police at school the next day. Kellyanne Conway, obviously, Advisor to the President said this information should have been visible on his background check and she says that it wasn't, because it was protected by the HIPAA medical law.
Now, obviously, not sure about all of that but the question to you is would putting all mental health records in background checks make a difference?
KAYYEM: To me ...
BURNETT: I'm sorry, to Phil.
PHIL MUDD, FORMER CIA COUNTERTERRORISM OFFICIAL: I think it absolutely would. I mean, I could even make this question simpler. If someone gets a prescription for an antidepressant, should that individual either be able to acquire weapons or should the federal government take weapons away? Highly controversial in this country, but the flip side would be, do you want people who have mental health problems to have weapons?
The President raised the fundamental issue today about red flags. We saw it in Broward County in the school shooting there, multiple red flags. We saw this today. The problem you're going to get, Erin, the problem you're going to get is as soon as you do that, somebody is going to say why you're taking away somebody's constitutional rights when that person didn't commit a crime. I think the conversation has to be had, but it's going to be controversial.
BURNETT: It certainly is. All right. I want to go to the ground as I said, our Ryan young is there. He's been working on this as we have, Ryan, this breaking new video. And also some new developments that you've been working on. What can you tell us, Ryan?
RYAN YOUNG, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, a lot of tough questions here, because obviously this community is trying to figure out the motive when you talk about someone who was able to open fire within 24 seconds, injuring dozens of people plus killing nine folks. Look, there are a lot of people in this community who are hurting. We were here yesterday during an emotional memorial here and people really wanted to get to the center of this in terms of why would he train his gun on the bar behind us.
I was talking to some folks in the black community, they were worried because they believe that look there was a reason why he targeted this bar. But as you walk down the street here, you can see where he started firing and then where the bullets went down the street here. So it gave police a chance to response.
And when you watch the video, police responding, they did not waste any time in trying to take this man down. And in fact, they were able to surround him and open fire and take him out within 30 seconds. But then we hear today that he was able to fire over 41 rounds in the street and when you watch the terror in the people's faces, as they try to get back in this bar for security, the police chief made a really great point here, if he was able to enter that bar with more than 200 rounds, this story could have been completely different.
But I can tell you for the folks who live in this community, this is no longer about a story because they want to know the motive. They want to know what exactly was going on, because there's a lot of rumors going on here and I can tell you after talking to a family member of one of the lost people today, they are just trying to close their eyes to a certain extent and try to figure out what happened in this young man's life that wasn't highlighted earlier, especially when you talk about the idea there's people in high school who made that call the police at one point about the kill list and the rape list that he had as well.
There are so many questions surrounding this. That's what they're concerned about now. Now, there's another point that we should bring up here. There was a person in that car who was injured who's still in the hospital who's been talking to police, they are still talking to him as they try to develop this motive.
BURNETT: All right. And obviously that could be very important that we know that the shooter was in the car with his sister and this other individual as you point out, Ryan, who's still alive. So Jonathan, let me ask you this.
BURNETT: As he's pointing out the breaking news that we have now, the 41 shell casings that they found and that he had 250 rounds in his possession. We know that his weapon is purchased legally. We're also finding out that the El Paso, this is just coming in now, the El Paso gun, we're just finding out, was also legally purchased. An assault weapon, obviously, 7.62 caliber, what does that tell you?
WACHROW: So 7.62 caliber weapon, a highly destructive round. Again, it goes to that that is a weapon of war, mass casualties as we saw. But I think I just want to take a step back to what we're talking about with the response by the police. Training, tactics and experience won the day in Ohio.
The law enforcement officers went into that situation, heavily armed individual, the amount of rounds that they had, they put that threat down immediately and I think that is what we're seeing time and time again. Same thing with the response in El Paso. Law enforcement is training time and time again for these active shooter situations regardless of the weapon system that they have.
Law enforcement now has to overcome that. They have to plan for the worst and hope for the best once they get there. Again, it's a change in tactics that we've seen over the last few years. It's addressing the threat right away to put it down.
BURNETT: Right, which they were able to do in Dayton. Obviously, not at the Wal-Mart. I mean, you can't do what you do, Juliette, in a place like Israel and the United States, it's too big. KAYYEM: Right.
BURNETT: But nonetheless, we're finding out 7.62 caliber. I mean, it is safe to say that - it's hard to explain how anybody would have the need or there would be any way to legally purchase such a gun, because you would only have such a gun to murder people.
[19:10:04] KAYYEM: It's like all of this other stuff, whether it's the video games, but even honestly, Erin, the background checks, the red flags, it's bread crumbs. It is bread crumbs to what we are seeing right now, which is the capacity of people or of a murderer to kill lots of civilians armed or unarmed as we know because in Wal-Mart there is an open carry, to kill lots of civilians quickly, 10 seconds, 20 seconds, 90 seconds. That is the issue.
Everything else is just sort of feeding just sort of these side stories. We in this country used to have an assault rifle ban and at that time we did not have the nature of these mass killings that we're seeing again. It defies the imagination at this stage to think that all of these other regulations around gun ownership are actually going to be able to protect the most likely and most lethal aspect of act of these shooting cases which is the capacity of someone to kill 10 other people at this stage in 20 seconds, just imagine that.
So I'm all for these regulations, don't get me wrong. But I've been in Homeland Security long enough to know, I want to focus on the high probability, high consequence events. That's what we do in Homeland Security. You protect communities from those and that's what we need to do with the guns.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you all very much. And as I said we also have breaking news coming out of El Paso, a press conference happening just there revealing new details about the moments of exactly what led up to the deadly mass shooting, why he ended up in that Wal-Mart and why at that moment, we now know 22 people have died. That number has gone up by two in the past hours.
Plus, President Obama breaking his silence on the mass shootings. He's taking a very clear swipe at President Trump. And it's the hate- filled website linked to three mass shootings, including the one in El Paso and the man who created it is out front. So what does he have to say?
[19:15:31] BURNETT: Breaking news, President Trump will visit El Paso, Texas on Wednesday. Four days after the shooting massacre at a Wal-Mart there. We now know 22 people have died. That number increasing today by two who died in hospital. The mayor of El Paso confirming the visit moments ago amid growing calls for Trump to stay away.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR DEE MARGO (R-TX): This is not a political visit as he had before. The President is coming out and I will meet with the President and I guess for people who have lots of time on their hands, I'll be with their emails and their phone calls.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Ed Lavandera is out front. He is in El Paso tonight. And Ed, police are now revealing, you've got new information on why this gunman drove, what, 10, 11 hours to the Wal-Mart.
ED LAVANDERA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Erin, it really is the question that is haunting many residents of El Paso, how this gunman could drive to 10 to 11 hours. We understand now from police that he drove that straight so he drove through the overnight hours to make it to this Walmart and police say he actually got lost in a nearby neighborhood before coming to this Wal-Mart because he was hungry.
LAVANDERA(voice-over): Police say the El Paso Wal-Mart shooter, 21- year-old Patrick Crusius is cooperating with investigators but showing no signs of remorse.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MARGO: I don't know how we deal with evil. I don't have a textbook for dealing with evil other than the Bible. I'm sorry.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA(voice-over): The death toll for the El Paso Wal-Mart Massacre jumped to 22. Officials announced two more victims could not overcome their horrific wounds and died in the hospital.
Gospel music filled this hospital waiting room as family and friends of 33-year-old Michelle Grady waited for her to come out of her second surgery. Grady's family tells CNN, Michelle was struck by gunfire three times. Suffered a shattered pelvis as well as serious intestinal and stomach injuries.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL GRADY, FATHER OF SHOOTING VICTIM: Michelle had the presence of mind to get shot three times and yet pick up the phone and called her mom and said - and that's when she said, "Mom, I've been shot." Of course, my wife became frantic.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA(voice-over): Her father, pastor Michael Grady says he raced to the scene and was heartbroken by what he saw.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRADY: Then I finally saw my wife bringing Michelle on this cart and pushing her towards the ambulance and it was at that moment that I realized that this was not just something unbelievable that this was real. LAVANDERA(voice-over): You get emotional thinking of that image of
your wife pushing your daughter. What is it about that moment that just hits you so hard?
GRADY: That I couldn't get there quick enough to help.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA(voice-over): At that moment, these victims and the city of El Paso did not know about an online posting ranting about Hispanic invasion of Texas. Court documents show the gunman has no income, has been out of work for five months and lived with his grandparents in Allen, Texas for two years.
Across the city, there is an outpouring of grief, the question many in El Paso can't answer is how the gunman could drive more than 600 miles for 10 hours from Allen, Texas and never feel a sense of doubt. But families like the Grady family are focused on healing the wounds. Michele Grady hasn't spoken since arriving at the hospital, but they've received a sign of hope Michele opened her eyes and gently squeezed her family's hand.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRADY: It was an amazing moment because that meant that she could hear us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LAVANDERA: And Erin, the site here at the Wal-Mart in El Paso has really become a place of therapy as people have come here to gather together the flowers as the Mexican flag, an American flag and the Texas flag are flying together. So all of this poignancy here of these people coming together, but underlying all of that as we've heard repeatedly from residents around here is a real anger about the possibility of President Trump coming to visit here in El Paso. This is a visit that will only continue to create more anger here over the next couple of days, Erin.
BURNETT: All right. Thank you very much, Ed. This comes as President Trump has blamed everything but his own rhetoric following the mass shootings in El Paso and Dayton.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We must recognize that the internet has provided a dangerous avenue to radicalize disturbed minds and perform demented acts.
[19:20:01] We must stop the glorification of violence in our society. This includes the gruesome and grisly video games that are now commonplace. We must reform our mental health laws to better identify mentally disturbed individuals, who may commit acts of violence.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: He stuck with this prompter this time and before the remarks he tweeted in part, quote, the Media has a big responsibility to life and safety in our Country. News coverage has got to start being fair, balanced and unbiased or these terrible problems will only get worse.
Out front now former Clinton White House aide Keith Boykin and Scott Jennings who was a Special Assistant to President George W. Bush. So Keith, President Trump blames the internet, video games, mental health laws and the media but nothing about his own rhetoric as he does call this a racist act. Your reaction?
KEITH BOYKIN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE AIDE UNDER PRESIDENT BILL CLINTON: He's wrong. He's inconsistent. When President Trump took office, he said that this American carnage stops right here and stops right now. Since that time, we've had Las Vegas, we had Sutherland Springs, we had Gilroy, we had Mississippi, we had Parkland, we had Virginia Beach, we had Dayton, we had El Paso.
This is out of control and Donald Trump is indirectly responsible for this. He's inciting the rhetoric that's encouraging this and instead of doing something about guns, he's blaming the wrong people. He's blaming the wrong things. Every country people with mental health issues.
BOYKIN: Every country has people who had access to social media. Every country has people who have access to the internet. Every country has access to video games, but not every country has access to guns the way they do in this country and not every country has a racist xenophobic president as we do.
BURNETT: Scott, what do you say about that, the President's rhetoric matters. I mean to this, I guess, let me just play because obviously as we know that on this website, the alleged shooter in Texas got posted a manifesto which warned that he was going to commit a massacre because of a Hispanic invasion. I mean it was a very specific word and it's a specific word which echoes this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: This is an invasion. When you see these caravans starting out with 20,000 people, that's an invasion.
We're on track for a million illegal aliens to rush our borders. People hate the word invasion, but that's what it is.
We're stopping people at the border. This is an invasion and nobody is even questioning that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: Scott, it's impossible to not hear that when you hear this person post the word invasion online, isn't it? SCOTT JENNINGS, FORMER SPECIAL ASSISTANT TO PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH:
Well, I think that the first question you asked is does the president's rhetoric matter, of course, it does. All political rhetoric matters. I'm glad the President gave the speech that he gave today. I wish he'd given it two years ago, frankly. I mean this is part of the job of the president is to be our consoler and chief to comfort the nation in times of tragedy and to try to ratchet down tensions.
Now, I think today a lot of people have rushed to score political points and try to dunk on the President. And I don't hear a lot of people like Keith pointing out that the shooter in Ohio apparently was a leftist who had commented online about all of the left-wing, Elizabeth Warren type stuff, that he was interested in.
And guess what, it wouldn't be appropriate to do that either. You can't go around blaming every politicians for every crazy person (inaudible) --
BURNETT: Yes. I will say, Scott, there's a lot of reporting coming in on the motive, I'm sorry, on the motive in Dayton and I don't know, certainly I'm not comfortable, CNN wouldn't be comfortable going with what you just said. Things may change dramatically just to put that out there.
BOYKIN: And 70 percent of all - 70 percent of the --
JENNINGS: OK. OK, but here's my point. Here's my point. Here's my point.
BURNETT: Let Scott finish. Go ahead.
JENNINGS: Here's my point, it is not going to get you a policy outcome to spend the next month or six weeks or whatever trying to make this about dunking on Donald Trump. Here's what I think we ought to do. I think Lindsey Graham and Senator Blumenthal of Connecticut apparently tonight have almost or have hammered out some agreement on red flag laws. I think that's good.
JENNINGS: I think we ought to have a bipartisan show of antiviolence, anti-white supremacy and anti white nationalism resolution passed unanimously in the United States Congress. There ought not be any daylight on the parties. I think background checks ought to be opened up and done. I think they ought to look at the high-capacity magazines.
JENNINGS: I think all of these things ought to be on the table, but here's what I would say, it's going to be hard to get to any of it if one side wants to spend all month dunking on the other side, it's just not going to help.
BOYKIN: Scott, just take the responsibility for what your guys are doing, what your president is doing. He's calling people - he's calling countries shit holes, he's telling people they're invaders, he told people - he said that people from Mexico are rapists and drug dealers and criminals. This guy is inciting the rhetoric that's encouraging people to engage in violent behavior.
Just today we saw Cesar Sayoc was sentenced to 20 years in prison. The guy who sent bombs, pipe bombs to CNN and other places because of Donald Trump's rhetoric.
BURNETT: So, OK --
BOYKIN: Donald Trump's rhetoric is responsible for encouraging and inciting violence. But unfortunately the Republicans are complicit in this because the Democrats passed in February a background check bill and Mitch McConnell, the Republicans refusing to act on it in the Senate.
[19:25:04] BURNETT: Well, Mitch McConnell is refusing to comment tonight. I mean, let me ask you, Scott, about that but also Cesar Sayoc ...
JENNINGS: I'm sorry, what did you just say about Senator McConnell? I want to make sure I heard it correctly.
BOYKIN: Mitch McConnell refused to act on the Democratic-controlled passed bill ...
BURNETT: He hasn't brought it to a vote in the Senate.
BOYKIN: ... that was passed in February for background checks. And if that's such an important issue, why won't the Senate act on it?
JENNINGS: Yes, I see. I've been following your newsfeed tonight. So tonight Senator McConnell has asked the committee chairs of the three relevant committees to come together on a bipartisan plan from the Senate that might include what has come over from the House for action when they back in September, that's what been prompted Senator Graham to say that he and Senator Blumenthal on red flags.
BOYKIN: That might include after six months, that's the best you can come up with? Come on. Six month later ...
JENNINGS: So I think, look, I think --
BOYKIN: ... six months later, you're finally going to say that you might include something that has to do with a red flag law. We've been talking about background checks for years and the NRA has forced Republicans not to address the issue and now under pressure because there were two shootings in one weekend, you say that they might do something. I'm supposed to be happy about it. The 21 people who were shot and killed are supposed to be happy about the fact that Senator Mitch McConnell might do something. That's not acceptable.
BURNETT: Scott, I want to give you a chance to response to Cesar Sayoc.
JENNINGS: They're in recess. They come back in --
BURNETT: Well, they could come back off recess.
BURNETT: I think most of them would be willing to do that. If they wanted to do it, they could do it. It's hard to justify why. If they really have a plan, they won't just come back and vote on it. I think everybody would agree with that. But Scott, I want to ask you about Cesar Sayoc, because I want to give you a chance to respond to it.
He's the man who pleaded guilty to sending pipe bombs to numerous Democrats, also to CNN. His lawyers have said he found light in Donald J Trump, his lawyers. Today they said, quote, we believe that the President's rhetoric contributed to Mr. Sayoc's actions in this offense. So his own lawyers are admitting he was motivated by the President.
JENNINGS: Yes. Look, I think this is a terrible human being. I don't like Sayoc. I don't like the rhetoric about the press being the enemy of the people. I've never liked it. I don't like it yesterday, today or tomorrow. I think we ought to not have it and my advice to the President would be don't do it and I think that in times of tragedy, in times of crisis and in times when the American people are looking for something, somebody to ratchet down. it is the president's responsibility to do that. This is a time for that.
It's never the wrong day to do the right thing and the right thing here is to cease with the attacks on the press, work with the Congress in a bipartisan fashion and to put something on the table that's politically palatable. I hope they're doing it all.
BURNETT: All right. I appreciate both of you taking the time. Of course, the President did denounce the act. He did also blame the media. Out front next, President Obama not naming names but it is clear, he is going after President Trump. It is loud and clear and it is the first statement from President Obama after these deadly mass shootings going straight at Trump. Plus, an interview you'll see only in OUTFRONT, a Republican lawmaker slamming his own party. He said, "Republican Party is enabling white supremacy." And he says that he must speak out now and he's no longer able to stay silent. That's up next.
[19:32:01] ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Tonight, President Obama issuing a painfully obvious rebuke of President Trump. Obama saying in a statement, in response to the massacres in El Paso and Dayton, quote: We should soundly reject language coming out of the mouths of any of our leaders that feeds a climate of fear and hatred or normalizes racist sentiments; leaders who demonize those who don't like us, or suggest that other people including immigrants threaten our way of life or refer to other people as subhuman or imply that America belongs to just one certain type of people. Pretty stunning and obvious rebuke. Meantime, President Trump also
today rejecting hate speech but failing to acknowledge that his own words could be fanning the flames.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The shooter in El Paso posted a manifesto online consumed by racist hate. In one voice, our nation must condemn racism, bigotry and white supremacy. These sinister ideologies must be defeated. Hate has no place in America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: He read it and stayed with that.
Boris Sanchez is OUTFRONT at the White House.
Boris, any comment yet from President Trump on President Obama's incredibly pointed remarks?
BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: No, Erin. The White House has not put out a response to President Obama's statements. It's unclear if president Trump has seen the statement.
Given the past public remarks that he's made about President Obama, it wouldn't be a surprise to see him insult the president, the former president or leave some kind of stinging rebuke. We don't know how President Trump feels about Barack Obama. This is certainly sort of an unprecedented, uncommon attack. You rarely see a former president criticize a current administration this way.
And as you said, President Obama doesn't mention President Trump by name, but he clearly alludes to President Trump's frequent racist remarks and racist rhetoric. The president, as you heard there, used some of the strongest language to date to condemn white supremacy. There is a long list of things that this president has said that mirrors some of what we saw in the suspected shooter's manifesto in El Paso, things that immigrants are invaders, suggesting that, for example, sanctuary cities are crime infested, breeding concepts, making remarks about not being surprised if George Soros is funding migrant caravans.
That's the language, that's the theory of white supremacy. It's something that the president frequently traffics in. It's something that resonates with racists as we saw in El Paso. It's unclear as we saw if the president is going to stop using that kind of rhetoric -- Erin.
BURNETT: Right, certainly sticking with the prompter. But that does not answer the question Boris poses. Thank you.
BURNETT: OUTFRONT tonight, 2020 Democratic presidential candidate, Senator Amy Klobuchar.
And, Senator, I appreciate your time tonight.
President Trump today said the shooter in El Paso --
KLOBUCHAR: Thank you, Erin.
BURNETT: -- was consumed by racist hate. He said America must condemn white supremacy.
Do you give Trump any credit for saying those things?
SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D-MN), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Here is the problem: every single day, he literally wakes up and tweets something that divides America or says something at a rally.
And it's always good for a president to try to bring people together, but he has tried to tear us apart day after day after day. And my problem here specifically is when he had his moment after Charlottesville, when the Ku Klux Klan was on one side, he said there were two sides. Well, there's not two sides when white supremacists and the Ku Klux Klan on other side. There's only one side, that's the American side.
And when you look at all of the hatred that he has fuelled against immigrants, to the point where in my state, I heard from a family who went out to dinner during the height of his rhetoric and a guy walks by and says to him, you four go home, you go home to where you came from. They were a Somali family.
The little girl looks up at her mom and says, I don't want to eat dinner at home. You said we could eat out tonight.
You think about the words of that innocent child. She only knows one home and that's my state. And one home that's our country. She didn't know what he was talking about.
He has gone after entire cities, the city of Baltimore. He has gone after African-American members of Congress. And so, for him to say this now, yes, it is hypocritical.
But I still move on to what we need to get done, and that is pass gun safety legislation. He -- that is in his power, Erin. He sat across from me at a meeting in the White House and said he wanted to get it done after Parkland. All he has to do is call Mitch McConnell and say I want you to bring this bill up that the House passed and we could get it done. He hasn't done that.
BURNETT: So, let me ask you about, OK, so let me ask you about that, because, you know, today, he said he supports strong background checks. The Democratic leaders obviously in the Senate, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, but also, your minority leader, Chuck Schumer, put out a statement saying, let's come off summer vacation for the Senate. Let's get back in. Let's pass background check legislation.
And yet the person that has been silent is Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. Why do you think he is not speaking out -- not stepping up right now? KLOBUCHAR: Because he and his party have been walking lock step with
the NRA for years. And I was asked this on the CNN debate stage. And I made it clear that we can talk policy all you want, and I think we all know things that would help here, everything from the bill to close the boyfriend loophole to go after domestic abusers, to an assault weapon ban.
But that's not really what this is about. We know we can reduce gun violence, but Mitch McConnell won't let these bills come up for a vote. And the president never pushes them. He just says he's for them and then goes back to his job and goes out to these rallies and foments hate.
So, we know this is not one of these things where Congress is a mess. It is very clear where Democrats are on this. That bill with all those great new members in the Congress and the House of Representatives passed with a strong vote. And now it's sitting on Mitch McConnell's door step. And it's time for him to get it done.
Yes, we should all come back and vote for it. I'd go there tomorrow. I can take a red eye from California.
BURNETT: So, you know, the president today, you know, when he said he supported the background checks, the strong background checks, his words. He also floated the idea of linking any kind of legislation on background checks to immigration legislation. And his comment was, quote, Republicans and Democrats must come together and get strong background checks, perhaps marrying the legislation with immigration reform.
Now, Senator Klobuchar, we know the shooter in El Paso explicitly killed people because of anger in immigration, echoing Trump's language with the word "invasion" in the manifesto that has been attributed to him.
What do you think of President Trump linking immigration reform then to gun control?
KLOBUCHAR: I think he was once again messing up because I think he was once again messing around with people's minds and trying to distract people, because he has stopped us on the path of immigration reform, including simply allowing the Dreamers to stay when members of his own party. I was in that group that worked on that bill wanted to get something done. He gut punched us on that bill.
So, to me, it means he's not serious about wanting to do either of them.
BURNETT: Now, you know, you're pointing out your frustration with that. But I'm wondering how far you feel that we should go right now.
I mean, Beto O'Rourke, your Democratic rival for the nomination is from El Paso obviously. He is saying President Trump should not go there. He should not visit the aggrieved families as the president ordinarily would and as we understand President Trump is planning to do. Do you agree with Mr. O'Rourke? Or is that in and of itself divisive?
[19:40:02] KLOBUCHAR: Well, that is going to be up to those families. And if people in the community do not want him to go there, I think he should listen to them. I think that is very important.
But I think the bigger issue right now for the country is not the optics of what Donald Trump does. We've seen those optics for far too long. It's what we can do as Americans to make a change right now.
This is not just El Paso. Look what happened to Dayton, Ohio, look what happened in California just last week. This is a moment in time where we can push through. And he claims he's for it, even though he said that to me at the White House nine times sitting across from me, and he didn't follow through. Let's call him on it. Let's call Mitch McConnell on it and get it done.
BURNETT: Senator Klobuchar, thank you very much for your time tonight.
KLOBUCHAR: Thank you, Erin. It was great to be on. Thank you.
BURNETT: And OUTFRONT next, the man who created the hate-filled Website that's been linked to three mass shootings, including the attack in El Paso. He is OUTFRONT.
And the Republican lawmaker is calling his own party, saying his colleagues are enabling white supremacist. He's OUTFRONT.
BURNETT: New tonight, stone cold. That's how an El Paso police official described the expression on the face of the man accused of killing 22 people at a Walmart.
Just minutes before the attack, the alleged shooter is believed to have posted a racist message on 8chan, an Internet forum, which has become a haven for white nationalists and the far right.
[19:45:08] Tonight, the man who created the site wants it shut down.
OUTFRONT now, Fred Brennan, a man who created 8chan. He cut ties to the site in December.
Fred, I appreciate your time. Thank you very much.
I mean, for a long time, I know you defended 8chan, the site that you founded. Now, you want to see it shut down.
What made you change your mind?
FREDRICK BRENNAN, CREATOR OF 8CHAN: I changed my mind because of the way that they're administering the site. That's the main reason that I have changed my mind. If they continued to operate it as they are operating it, it is going to cause like effects way beyond 8chan on the Internet, on U.S. law even, because they are so callous and don't seem to care at all.
You know, CloudFlare's Matthew Prince called them lawless. And that's pretty much true. They just seem to not really care about these shootings. They don't even want to do the bare minimum.
And, you know, a lot of people have criticized me for changing this. But if 8chan were to go down, there would be a new -- there would be a new equilibrium that would set itself up. So, there is nothing really to worry about for its users. I'm just glad that it was shut down because they have to pay market rate to do the things that they're doing.
BURNETT: I mean, you have said on Twitter, 8chan is full of incitements to violence. Literal mass murderers are using it, but they don't seem to care.
BRENNAN: Yes, that's --
BURNETT: How could this be?
BURNETT: Yes, go ahead.
BRENNAN: As early as yesterday, you know, the site has been going on and off now that CloudFlare took them down. But even as yesterday, a full 24 hours after the shootings, they still had on the front page the words "embrace infamy". It's like they're laughing about this and they don't really seem to care what's going on.
You know, it's -- those words, if you were a victim of the shooting or the family of a victim or even just a normal person out in the world, you would find that extremely heartless and cold. I'm pretty sure for them to -- the network not even wanting to work with them. And that's not the only thing. You know, they could have done so much to prevent both the shooting being -- the manifesto being uploaded there and CloudFlare taking them, if they had just set up a few simple rules with the users. They decided not to do that.
BURNETT: So let me ask you about the concept here. You have embraced 8chan's role as a venue in the past for ideas and posts that many would see as abhorrent, right? I mean, at 8chan, I know you embraced a group of people kicked off another forum, some threatening violence particularly against women.
So, you know, you have is embraced the concept of providing a forum for people to have a voice. Why did you feel that need originally? And why is this now over the line?
BRENNAN: Well, there was something that you said that was not accurate. I actually resigned from 8chan in April 2016. So that was before like any shooting or anything was related to it or any great big act of violence. I know some people might consider the gamer-gate controversy --
BURNETT: That's what I'm referring to, is gamer-gate, right, which was multiple threats of violence against women.
BRENNAN: As far as I know, there was no actual violence that occurred because of that.
BURNETT: Right. So, what I'm trying to understand is what made you change your mind? Did you at that point, I guess, Fred, now, you look inside yourself. Did you just -- you didn't think it would actually ever become real and then when it did, then you realized the power of those words or was it something else?
BRENNAN: I would just say that I have realized that the current administrators of 8chan don't care that this is happening. They just feel like because of Supreme Court cases or whatever or, you know, whatever their reasoning is that they don't have to do anything. But it's going to affect the world at large in other communities.
I wouldn't be surprised if, you know, the next administration is Democratic if new laws are passed which make it impossible to run not only 8chan but other sites like it. So, the whole community is going to be affected by this.
BURNETT: So, Fred, can I just ask you one question before we go? And this is important because a lot of these things happen out there. And law enforcement can't find it. And a lot of people who work in tech don't want to work in law enforcement because they think government's bad.
Do you think websites have a responsibility or should they be calling the FBI to alert them to these sorts of things?
[19:50:03] BRENNAN: Well, I mean, if it's -- the whole problem, it's like you wouldn't want to have a website where you have to follow the laws of the most strict country, right? That wouldn't be very fun.
Like if you had a social media site that had to follow the laws of most strict country, where everybody, that would not be a fun site, because, you know, Saudi Arabia, countries like that, are included in that.
But at the same time, there is a moral requirement for these kind of admins to work with law enforcement if it's a -- you know, their country or I would even say another country that is mostly free. You know, so maybe they wouldn't have to work with China or Saudis, but they should at least work with, you know, the American government and the Canadian, New Zealand. Those kind of maybe good guys you could call them and maybe the E.U.
BURNETT: Well, I appreciate your time, Fred, and thank you very much for joining me. Thank you.
BRENNAN: All right. No problem. Thank you, too.
BURNETT: All right. And new tonight, a Republican lawmaker calling out his own party for quote enabling white supremacy in our country. Nebraska State Senator John McCollister is a lifelong Republican and
has written in a series of tweets that, quote, the Republican Party is complicit, his all caps, to obvious racist and moral activity inside our party. We have a Republican president who continually stokes racist fears in his base. The time is now for us Republicans to be honest with what is happening inside our party. We are better than this.
And Nebraska State Senator John McCollister joins me now.
Very -- powerfully and politically put, sir. I appreciate your time and thank you for being with me.
Look, I just want our viewers to understand, you're a lifelong Republican. You're from a very red state. Your father was a Republican member of Congress.
JOHN MCCOLLISTER (R), NEBRASKA STATE SENATOR: That's true.
BURNETT: But have felt that now is the time to speak. Why?
MCCOLLISTER: It is time now. It's been far too late, actually. We've seen the Republican Party leave its moorings.
The Republican Party of today is hardly anything like I knew when I was growing up. It's changed substantially and it's time to reestablish our basis and become the party that we should be.
BURNETT: Why do you think other Republican haves been so hesitant to speak out? I mean, frankly, scared. I understand some people may think what you're saying, may think it but not doing what you're doing and speaking about it.
MCCOLLISTER: Well, political speech this country has become so polarized, that people are reluctant to speak out, and I'm particularly disappointed in Republican office-holders for allowing President Trump to say some of the hateful things he's said. And I think it's time for them to stand up for a change and make it known that they don't condone that kind of hateful speech.
BURNETT: I mean, why do you think it is that they always say but he could have meant this or he doesn't -- I mean, when it does, it is clear and it is objectively clear, right, but they add to muddying the water. They add to that by refusing to stand up to him.
Do they realize their role that significance of their decision to not speak?
MCCOLLISTER: I absolutely agree. It's unconscionable they don't become more involved in some of the Republican activities and call out President Trump when he makes so many hateful comments. Ever since Charlottesville, we've seen any number of things that he's said, political rallies, see the four freshman members of the Congress. He has spoken out against them in rather hateful terms for countries that he has talked about and disparaging ways.
Now, we have to stop this, and we are better than that and I think it's time for this party to start making the change.
BURNETT: Al right. Senator McCollister, I appreciate your time. And thank you very much for coming on and speaking to us and speaking out as so many will not do, thank you.
MCCOLLISTER: Thank you, Erin.
BURNETT: And next, the Dow plunging more than 700 points. It is the single worst day of this year. An economist who says President Trump is the threat to the United States. Economy is OUTFRONT next.
[19:57:14] BURNETT: Breaking news, President Trump doing something no United States president has done in 25 years. The Treasury Department tonight announcing it is designating China a currency manipulator after the Chinese government devalued its currency. Basically, that's trying to help them with tariffs.
But here's what's happening. That's a huge escalation of the trade war. The announcement sent the Dow down 767 points. That is nearly 3 percent in just one day. It is the worst single day of the year and it is the sixth worse one-day point drop in American history.
Joining me now, Mark Zandi, the chief economist at Moody's Analytics.
And, Mark, look this is important. There are a lot of things this country is focusing on right now and rightly so. But this is also something that impacts every American. And you have called the president, the biggest existential threat to the economic expansion, why?
MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST, MOODY'S ANALYTICS: His trade war, the higher tariffs that are with China, China's retaliation. The fact that the war seems to be running off the rails and if we have a full blown all out war with each other, the two largest economies on the planet, that threatens to undermine investor sentiment, business sentiment, and it threatens to raise prices for consumers, its attacks on American companies and consumers. It threatens to undermine investment in the United States.
All these things together add up to a potential recession.
BURNETT: And look, last week, Peter Navarro, director of the Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy, was on the show. I was giving examples of certain products, La-Z-Boy, washing machines, where prices have gone up since tariffs. He said that's not the case. Here is how he put it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETER NAVARRO, DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF TRADE AND MANUFACTURING POLICY: I'm telling you, Erin, flat out you will not see significant consumer price hikes from a 10 percent tariff on these remaining $300 billion. The Chinese basically are handling this by lowering their prices and lowering their currency. (END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And it seems as we have round and round of tariffs, Mark, prices are clearly going up on a whole slew of products.
ZANDI: Yes, and they will. So far, the tariffs have been on goods that businesses buy. So that hasn't directly translated into higher prices for the things you and I buy when we go into Walmart but that will change. If the president follows through on his threat of a 10 percent tariff on the remaining $300 billion of imported goods from China, those are goods you and I buy and we'll see prices rise.
That's just a part of the story. I mean, look what happened to the stock market as you pointed out. That's down 6 percent since the last week. That's $2 trillion in wealth that has been wiped out and that has implications. So, this -- the implications go on and on and on, the higher consumer prices matter but this is much more than that.
BURNETT: Yes, thank you very much, Mark Zandi. I think worth pointing out to everybody, as in any war, as in any conflict, you can get to a point where you can't pull back and you could end up with a very big problem.
Thanks so much for joining us. Anderson starts now.